Celeste Headlee: 10 ways to have a better conversation | TED

翻译人员: Luyao Zou 校对人员: Xiaoya Song

All right, I want to see a show of hands:

好的，我想让大家举手示意一下，

how many of you have unfriended someone on Facebook

有多少人曾经 在 Facebook 上拉黑过好友，

because they said something offensive about politics or religion,

因为他们发表过关于政治，宗教， 儿童权益，或者食物等

childcare, food?

不恰当的言论？

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And how many of you know at least one person that you avoid

有多少人至少 有一个不想见的人，

because you just don't want to talk to them?

因为你就是不想 和对方说话？

(Laughter)

（笑声）

You know, it used to be that in order to have a polite conversation,

要知道，在过去 想要一段礼貌的交谈，

我们只要遵循亨利·希金斯 在《窈窕淑女》中的忠告：

we just had to follow the advice of Henry Higgins in "My Fair Lady":

只谈论天气和你的健康状况就行了。

Stick to the weather and your health.

但这些年随着气候变化 以及反对疫苗运动的开展 ——

But these days, with climate change and anti-vaxxing, those subjects --

（笑声）

(Laughter)

这招也不怎么管用了。

are not safe either.

So this world that we live in,

因此，在我们生活的这个世界，

this world in which every conversation

这个每一次交谈

has the potential to devolve into an argument,

都有可能发展为争论的世界，

where our politicians can't speak to one another

政客无法彼此交谈，

and where even the most trivial of issues

甚至为那些鸡毛蒜皮的事情

have someone fighting both passionately for it and against it, it's not normal.

都有人群情激昂地赞成或反对， 这太不正常了。

Pew Research did a study of 10,000 American adults,

皮尤研究中心对一万名 美国成年人做了一次调查，

and they found that at this moment, we are more polarized,

发现此刻我们的偏激程度，

we are more divided,

我们立场鲜明的程度，

than we ever have been in history.

比历史上任何时期都要高。

We're less likely to compromise,

我们更不倾向于妥协，

which means we're not listening to each other.

这意味着我们没有倾听彼此。

And we make decisions about where to live,

我们做的各种决定， 选择生活在何处，

who to marry and even who our friends are going to be,

与谁结婚甚至和谁交朋友，

based on what we already believe.

都只基于我们已有的信念。

Again, that means we're not listening to each other.

再重复一遍， 这说明我们没有倾听彼此。

A conversation requires a balance between talking and listening,

交谈需要平衡讲述和倾听，

and somewhere along the way, we lost that balance.

而不知怎么的， 我们却渐渐失掉了这种平衡。

Now, part of that is due to technology.

技术进步是部分原因。

比如智能手机， 现在就在你们手里，

The smartphones that you all either have in your hands

or close enough that you could grab them really quickly.

或者就在旁边，随手就能拿到。

据皮尤的研究称，

According to Pew Research,

大约三分之一的美国青少年 每天发送超过一百条短信。

about a third of American teenagers send more than a hundred texts a day.

And many of them, almost most of them, are more likely to text their friends

而这中间很多人，几乎是所有人， 更倾向于给朋友发短信，

than they are to talk to them face to face.

而不是面对面的交谈。

There's this great piece in The Atlantic.

《大西洋》杂志 登过一篇很棒的文章，

It was written by a high school teacher named Paul Barnwell.

作者是高中教师 保罗·巴恩韦尔。

他给自己的学生一项交流任务，

And he gave his kids a communication project.

希望教会他们如何不借助笔记 针对某一话题发表演讲。

He wanted to teach them how to speak on a specific subject without using notes.

然后他说：“我开始意识到……”

And he said this: "I came to realize..."

(Laughter)

（笑声）

"I came to realize that conversational competence

“我开始意识到交流能力

might be the single most overlooked skill we fail to teach.

可能是最被我们忽视的， 没有好好教授的技能。

Kids spend hours each day engaging with ideas and each other through screens,

孩子每天花费数小时 通过屏幕接触创意和其他伙伴，

but rarely do they have an opportunity

但很少有机会

to hone their interpersonal communications skills.

去发掘自己的人际交往技能。”

It might sound like a funny question, but we have to ask ourselves:

这听起来很好笑， 但我们必须问问自己：

Is there any 21st-century skill

21世纪，有什么技能

more important than being able to sustain coherent, confident conversation?"

会比维持一段连贯、 自信的谈话更为重要？”

Now, I make my living talking to people:

现在，我的职业就是跟别人谈话。

Nobel Prize winners, truck drivers,

诺贝尔奖获得者、卡车司机、

billionaires, kindergarten teachers,

亿万富翁、幼儿园老师，

heads of state, plumbers.

州长、水管工。

I talk to people that I like. I talk to people that I don't like.

我和我喜欢的人交谈， 也和我不喜欢的人交谈。

I talk to some people that I disagree with deeply on a personal level.

我和在个人层面 非常不认同的人交谈。

But I still have a great conversation with them.

但我仍旧和他们有很好的交流。

So I'd like to spend the next 10 minutes or so teaching you how to talk

所以我希望用接下来的10分钟 教你们如何谈话，

and how to listen.

以及如何倾听。

Many of you have already heard a lot of advice on this,

你们中间很多人已经听过无数建议，

things like look the person in the eye,

比如看着对方的眼睛，

think of interesting topics to discuss in advance,

提前想好可以讨论的有趣话题，

look, nod and smile to show that you're paying attention,

注视，点头并且微笑 来表明你的专注，

repeat back what you just heard or summarize it.

重复你刚才听到的，或者做总结。

我想让你们忘掉所有这些，

So I want you to forget all of that.

It is crap.

全都没用。

（笑声）

(Laughter)

There is no reason to learn how to show you're paying attention

根本没必要去学习 如何表现你很专心，

if you are in fact paying attention.

如果你确实很专心。

（笑声）

(Laughter)

(Applause)

（掌声）

Now, I actually use the exact same skills as a professional interviewer

我其实是把作为职业访谈者 一模一样的技巧

that I do in regular life.

用在了日常生活中。

So, I'm going to teach you how to interview people,

好，我要来教你们 如何采访他人，

and that's actually going to help you learn how to be better conversationalists.

这其实会帮助你们学习 如何成为更好的沟通者。

Learn to have a conversation

学习开始一段交谈，

without wasting your time, without getting bored,

不浪费时间，不感到无聊，

and, please God, without offending anybody.

以及，最重要的是，不冒犯任何人。

We've all had really great conversations.

我们都曾有过很棒的交谈。

We've had them before. We know what it's like.

我们都曾有过。 我们知道那是什么感觉。

The kind of conversation where you walk away feeling engaged and inspired,

那种结束之后令你感到 很享受，很受鼓舞的交谈，

或者令你觉得你和别人 建立了真实的连接，

or where you feel like you've made a real connection

or you've been perfectly understood.

或者让你完全得到了他人的理解。

There is no reason

没有理由说

why most of your interactions can't be like that.

你大部分人际互动 不能成为那样。

So I have 10 basic rules. I'm going to walk you through all of them,

我有10条基本规则。 我会一条条给你们解释，

but honestly, if you just choose one of them and master it,

但说真的，如果你 选择一条并且熟练掌握，

you'll already enjoy better conversations.

你就已经可以享受 更愉快的交谈了。

Number one: Don't multitask.

第一条：不要三心二意。

And I don't mean just set down your cell phone

我不是说单纯放下你的手机、

or your tablet or your car keys or whatever is in your hand.

平板电脑、车钥匙， 或者随便什么握在手里的东西。

I mean, be present.

我的意思是，处在当下。

Be in that moment.

进入那个情境中去。

Don't think about your argument you had with your boss.

不要想着你之前和老板的争吵。

Don't think about what you're going to have for dinner.

不要想着你晚饭吃什么。

If you want to get out of the conversation,

如果你想退出交谈，

就退出交谈。

get out of the conversation,

但不要身在曹营心在汉。

but don't be half in it and half out of it.

Number two: Don't pontificate.

第二条：不要好为人师。

If you want to state your opinion

如果你想要表达自己的看法，

without any opportunity for response or argument or pushback or growth,

又不想留下任何机会让人 回应、争论、反驳或阐发，

write a blog.

写博客去。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Now, there's a really good reason why I don't allow pundits on my show:

有个很好的理由来说明 我的谈话里为什么不允许有“专家说教”：

因为真的很无聊。

Because they're really boring.

If they're conservative, they're going to hate Obama and food stamps and abortion.

如果对方是个保守派， 那一定讨厌奥巴马、食品券和堕胎。

If they're liberal, they're going to hate

如果对方是个自由派， 那一定会讨厌

大银行、石油公司和迪克·切尼。

big banks and oil corporations and Dick Cheney.

Totally predictable.

完全可以预测的。

And you don't want to be like that.

你肯定不希望那样。

You need to enter every conversation assuming that you have something to learn.

你需要在进入每一次交流时 都假定自己可以学习到一些东西。

The famed therapist M. Scott Peck said

著名的治疗师 M.斯科特·派克说过，

that true listening requires a setting aside of oneself.

真正的倾听需要把自己放在一边。

And sometimes that means setting aside your personal opinion.

有时候，这意味着 把你的个人观点放在一边。

He said that sensing this acceptance,

他说感受到这种接纳，

the speaker will become less and less vulnerable

说话的人会变得越来越不脆弱敏感，

and more and more likely to open up the inner recesses

因而越来越有可能 打开自己的内心世界，

of his or her mind to the listener.

呈现给倾听者。

Again, assume that you have something to learn.

再强调一遍， 假定你需要学习新东西。

Bill Nye: "Everyone you will ever meet knows something that you don't."

比尔·奈伊说：“每一个你将要 见到的人都有你不知道的东西。”

I put it this way:

我来复述一下：

Everybody is an expert in something.

每个人都是某方面的专家。

Number three: Use open-ended questions.

第三点：使用开放式问题。

关于这一点， 请参考记者采访的提问方式。

In this case, take a cue from journalists.

Start your questions with who, what, when, where, why or how.

以“谁”、“什么”、“何时”、“何地”、 “为什么”或“如何”开始提问。

If you put in a complicated question, you're going to get a simple answer out.

如果你询问一个复杂的问题 将会得到一个简单的回答。

If I ask you, "Were you terrified?"

如果我问你：“你当时恐惧吗？”

you're going to respond to the most powerful word in that sentence,

你会回应那句话中最有力的词，

即“恐惧”，而答案将是 “是的”或者“不是”。

which is "terrified," and the answer is "Yes, I was" or "No, I wasn't."

"Were you angry?" "Yes, I was very angry."

“你当时气愤吗？” “是的，我当时气得很。”

Let them describe it. They're the ones that know.

让对方去描述， 对方才是了解情境的人。

Try asking them things like, "What was that like?"

试着这样问对方： “那是什么样子？”

"How did that feel?"

“你感觉怎么样？”

Because then they might have to stop for a moment and think about it,

因为这样一来，对方可能 需要停下来想一想，

and you're going to get a much more interesting response.

而你会得到更有意思的回答。

Number four: Go with the flow.

第四点：顺其自然。

That means thoughts will come into your mind

也就是说，想法会 自然流入你的头脑，

and you need to let them go out of your mind.

而你需要将它们表达出来。

We've heard interviews often

我们常听到采访中

in which a guest is talking for several minutes

嘉宾说了几分钟,

and then the host comes back in and asks a question

然后主持人回过来问问题,

which seems like it comes out of nowhere, or it's already been answered.

这问题好像不知道从何而来 或者已经被回答过了。

这说明主持人可能 两分钟前就没在听，

That means the host probably stopped listening two minutes ago

because he thought of this really clever question,

因为他想到了 这个非常机智的问题，

and he was just bound and determined to say that.

于是就心心念念 想着问这个问题。

And we do the exact same thing.

我们同样也会这么干。

We're sitting there having a conversation with someone,

当我们和某人坐在一起交谈时，

我们突然想起那次 和休·杰克曼在咖啡店的偶遇。

and then we remember that time that we met Hugh Jackman in a coffee shop.

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And we stop listening.

然后我们就不再听了。

Stories and ideas are going to come to you.

故事和想法总会不断向你涌来，

You need to let them come and let them go.

但即便无法阻止， 也不要让它们过多地在头脑中逗留。

Number five: If you don't know, say that you don't know.

第五点：如果你不知道， 就说你不知道。

Now, people on the radio, especially on NPR,

广播节目里的人，尤其在 全国公共广播电台（NPR）中，

are much more aware that they're going on the record,

非常明白他们的谈话 会被播放出去。

and so they're more careful about what they claim to be an expert in

所以他们对自己声称专业的地方

and what they claim to know for sure.

以及言之凿凿的东西会更加小心。

Do that. Err on the side of caution.

要学着这样做。谨言慎行。

Talk should not be cheap.

谈话应该是负责任的行为。

Number six: Don't equate your experience with theirs.

第六条：不要把自己的 经历和他人比较。

If they're talking about having lost a family member,

如果对方谈论失去了家人，

don't start talking about the time you lost a family member.

不要就势开始说你失去家人的事情。

If they're talking about the trouble they're having at work,

如果对方在说工作上的困扰，

不要告诉他们 你多么讨厌你的工作。

don't tell them about how much you hate your job.

这不一样的， 永远不可能一样。

It's not the same. It is never the same.

All experiences are individual.

任何经历都是独一无二的。

And, more importantly, it is not about you.

而且，更重要的是， 这不是在谈论你的事。

You don't need to take that moment to prove how amazing you are

你不需要在此刻 证明你多么能干，

or how much you've suffered.

或者你经受了多少痛苦。

Somebody asked Stephen Hawking once what his IQ was, and he said,

有人曾问史蒂芬·霍金 他的智商是多少，他回答道：

"I have no idea. People who brag about their IQs are losers."

“我不知道。拿智商 吹牛的人都是屌丝。”

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Conversations are not a promotional opportunity.

交谈不是用来推销自己的。

Number seven:

第七条：

Try not to repeat yourself.

尽量别重复自己的话。

It's condescending, and it's really boring,

这很咄咄逼人，也很无聊。

and we tend to do it a lot.

但我们很容易这样做。

Especially in work conversations or in conversations with our kids,

尤其是在工作交谈中， 或者和孩子的交谈中。

we have a point to make,

我们想声明一个观点，

so we just keep rephrasing it over and over.

于是换着方式不停地说。

Don't do that.

别这样。

Number eight: Stay out of the weeds.

第八条：少说废话。

Frankly, people don't care

说白了，没人在乎

那些年份，名字，

about the years, the names,

the dates, all those details

日期等等这些

你努力试图 在脑中回想的种种细节。

that you're struggling to come up with in your mind.

They don't care. What they care about is you.

别人不在乎。 他们关注的是你。

They care about what you're like,

对方关心你是什么样的人，

what you have in common.

和你有什么共同点。

So forget the details. Leave them out.

所以忘掉细节吧。 别管它们。

Number nine:

第九条：

This is not the last one, but it is the most important one.

这不是最后一条， 但是最重要的一条。

Listen.

认真倾听。

I cannot tell you how many really important people have said

我说不上来到底有多少 重要人士都说过

that listening is perhaps the most, the number one most important skill

倾听可能是最重要的， 第一重要的

that you could develop.

你可以提升的技能。

Buddha said, and I'm paraphrasing,

佛曰——我转述一下，

"If your mouth is open, you're not learning."

“如果你嘴不停， 你就学不到东西。”

And Calvin Coolidge said, "No man ever listened his way out of a job."

卡尔文·柯立芝曾说： “从没有人是因为听太多而被开除的。”

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Why do we not listen to each other?

为什么我们不愿倾听彼此？

Number one, we'd rather talk.

首先，我们更喜欢说。

When I'm talking, I'm in control.

我在说话时 一切在我的掌控之中。

I don't have to hear anything I'm not interested in.

我不用去听任何 我不感兴趣的东西。

I'm the center of attention.

我是焦点。

I can bolster my own identity.

我可以强化自己的认同感。

But there's another reason:

但还有一个原因：

We get distracted.

我们会受到干扰。

人平均每分钟说 大约225个单词，

The average person talks at about 225 word per minute,

but we can listen at up to 500 words per minute.

但我们每分钟可以 听将近500个单词。

So our minds are filling in those other 275 words.

所以我们的脑子 被这另外275个单词占据了。

And look, I know, it takes effort and energy

我知道这很耗费精力

to actually pay attention to someone,

去真正注意听别人讲。

but if you can't do that, you're not in a conversation.

但如果你不这么做， 你们就不是在交谈。

You're just two people shouting out barely related sentences

你们只不过是两个人 在同一个地方

in the same place.

彼此嚷嚷毫不相关的话。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

You have to listen to one another.

你们必须相互倾听。

史蒂芬·柯维对此 有精彩的论述。

Stephen Covey said it very beautifully.

He said, "Most of us don't listen with the intent to understand.

他说：“我们大多数人 都不是为了理解而倾听。

We listen with the intent to reply."

我们为了回应而听。”

One more rule, number 10, and it's this one: Be brief.

最后一条，第十条： 简明扼要。

[A good conversation is like a miniskirt; short enough to retain interest,

“好的交谈就像恰到好处的迷你裙； 足够短，能够吸引人，

but long enough to cover the subject. -- My Sister]

又足够长，能够包纳（盖住）主体 ——我妹妹的比喻”

(Laughter)

（笑声）

（掌声）

(Applause)

All of this boils down to the same basic concept, and it is this one:

所有这些都浓缩成 同一个概念，那就是：

Be interested in other people.

对他人产生兴趣。

You know, I grew up with a very famous grandfather,

我在一个名人外公的身边长大，

and there was kind of a ritual in my home.

我家里宾客络绎不绝。

People would come over to talk to my grandparents,

访客会前来 和我的外祖父母交谈，

and after they would leave, my mother would come over to us,

而那些人离开后， 我母亲会过来

对我们说： “你们知道那是谁吗？

and she'd say, "Do you know who that was?

She was the runner-up to Miss America.

她是美国小姐的亚军。

He was the mayor of Sacramento.

他是萨克拉门托市长。

She won a Pulitzer Prize. He's a Russian ballet dancer."

她拿过普利策奖。 他是俄罗斯芭蕾舞蹈家。”

And I kind of grew up assuming

我在成长中默认了

everyone has some hidden, amazing thing about them.

每个人都有不为人知的精彩。

And honestly, I think it's what makes me a better host.

说真的，我想是这一切 让我成为了更好的主持人。

I keep my mouth shut as often as I possibly can,

我尽量少说话，

I keep my mind open,

但开放自己的思想，

and I'm always prepared to be amazed,

永远准备着大吃一惊，

and I'm never disappointed.

而我从不会感到失望。

You do the same thing.

你们也可以这样。

Go out, talk to people,

走出门去，和别人交谈，

listen to people,

听别人说，

and, most importantly, be prepared to be amazed.

以及最重要的， 准备好大吃一惊。

Thanks.

谢谢。

(Applause)

（掌声）