The neurons that shaped civilization | VS Ramachandran

Translator: Tina Posavec Reviewer: Evridika Cuder

I'd like to talk to you today about the human brain,

Govoril bom o človeških možganih,

which is what we do research on at the University of California.

ki jih raziskujemo na Univerzi Kalifornije.

Just think about this problem for a second.

Samo pomislite.

Here is a lump of flesh, about three pounds,

Kos mesa, ki tehta samo okoli 1,5 kg

which you can hold in the palm of your hand.

in ga lahko držite v dlani.

But it can contemplate the vastness of interstellar space.

Lahko razmišlja o prostranosti medzvezdnega prostora.

It can contemplate the meaning of infinity,

Se sprašuje o pomenu neskončnosti,

ask questions about the meaning of its own existence,

o pomenu lastnega obstoja

about the nature of God.

in o obstoju Boga.

And this is truly the most amazing thing in the world.

To je najbolj osupljiva stvar na svetu.

It's the greatest mystery confronting human beings:

To je največja skrivnost človeka.

How does this all come about?

Kako je prišlo do tega?

Well, the brain, as you know, is made up of neurons.

Možgani so sestavljeni iz nevronov.

We're looking at neurons here.

Zdaj govorimo o nevronih.

There are 100 billion neurons in the adult human brain.

V možganih odraslega človeka je 100 milijard nevronov.

And each neuron makes something like 1,000 to 10,000 contacts

Vsak nevron je povezan s 1000 do 10.000

with other neurons in the brain.

izmed ostalih nevronov v možganih.

And based on this, people have calculated

Ljudje so izračunali,

that the number of permutations and combinations of brain activity

da število permutacij in kombinacij v možganih

exceeds the number of elementary particles in the universe.

presega število osnovnih delcev v vesolju.

So, how do you go about studying the brain?

Kako se lotimo preučevanja možganov?

One approach is to look at patients who had lesions

Lahko se posvetimo pacientom s poškodbami

in different part of the brain, and study changes in their behavior.

v različnih delih možganov in preučimo spremembe v obnašanju.

This is what I spoke about in the last TED.

O tem sem govoril zadnjič.

Today I'll talk about a different approach,

Danes bom govoril o drugačnem pristopu.

which is to put electrodes in different parts of the brain,

Elektrode namestimo v različne dele možganov

and actually record the activity of individual nerve cells in the brain.

in posnamemo dejavnost posameznih živčnih celic v možganih.

Sort of eavesdrop on the activity of nerve cells in the brain.

Kot da bi prisluškovali dejavnosti živčnih celic.

Now, one recent discovery that has been made

Nedavno odkritje

by researchers in Italy, in Parma,

raziskovalcev iz Parme v Italiji,

by Giacomo Rizzolatti and his colleagues,

Giacome Rizzolattija in njegovih sodelavcev,

is a group of neurons called mirror neurons,

je skupina zrcalnih nevronov,

which are on the front of the brain in the frontal lobes.

ki se nahajajo v frontalnem režnju možganov.

Now, it turns out there are neurons

Izkazalo se je, da obstajajo

which are called ordinary motor command neurons in the front of the brain,

motorični nevroni v sprednjem delu možganov,

which have been known for over 50 years.

ki so znani že več kot 50 let.

These neurons will fire when a person performs a specific action.

Ti nevroni začnejo delovati, ko človek izvaja določeno dejanje.

For example, if I do that, and reach and grab an apple,

Če primem jabolko,

a motor command neuron in the front of my brain will fire.

bo začel delovati motorični nevron v sprednjem delu možganov.

If I reach out and pull an object, another neuron will fire,

Če povlečem predmet, se sproži delovanje drugega nevrona,

commanding me to pull that object.

ki mi je ukazal, naj predmet povlečem.

These are called motor command neurons that have been known for a long time.

Ti nevroni so znani že dolgo časa.

But what Rizzolatti found was

Rizzolatti je odkril,

a subset of these neurons,

da del teh nevronov,

maybe about 20 percent of them, will also fire

približno 20 odstotkov, deluje tudi,

when I'm looking at somebody else performing the same action.

ko opazujemo druge, kako izvajajo enako dejanje.

So, here is a neuron that fires when I reach and grab something,

Delovanje nevrona se sproži, ko stvar primem

but it also fires when I watch Joe reaching and grabbing something.

in tudi ko opazujem Joeja, kako prime enako stvar.

And this is truly astonishing.

To je resnično neverjetno.

Because it's as though this neuron is adopting

Kot da bi nevron prevzel

the other person's point of view.

vidik drugega človeka.

It's almost as though it's performing a virtual reality simulation

Kot da bi izvajal virtualno simulacijo

of the other person's action.

dejanj drugega človeka.

Now, what is the significance of these mirror neurons?

Kakšen je pomen zrcalnih nevronov?

For one thing they must be involved in things like imitation and emulation.

Sodelujejo pri posnemanju in tekmovanju.

Because to imitate a complex act

Za posnemanje kompleksnega dejanja

requires my brain to adopt the other person's point of view.

morajo možgani prevzeti vidik drugega človeka.

So, this is important for imitation and emulation.

To je pomembno pri posnemanju in tekmovanju.

Well, why is that important?

Zakaj?

Well, let's take a look at the next slide.

Poglejmo si naslednjo prosojnico.

So, how do you do imitation? Why is imitation important?

Kako posnemamo? Zakaj je posnemanje pomembno?

Mirror neurons and imitation, emulation.

Zrcalni nevroni in posnemanje.

Now, let's look at culture, the phenomenon of human culture.

Poglejmo si kulturo, čudež človeštva.

If you go back in time about [75,000] to 100,000 years ago,

Če se vrnemo 75.000 do 100.000 let nazaj

let's look at human evolution, it turns out

v evolucijo človeka, vidimo,

that something very important happened around 75,000 years ago.

da se je takrat zgodilo nekaj zelo pomembnega.

And that is, there is a sudden emergence and rapid spread

Nenadoma so se pojavile in hitro širile

of a number of skills that are unique to human beings

številne spretnosti, ki so značilne samo za ljudi,

like tool use,

kot so uporaba orodja,

the use of fire, the use of shelters, and, of course, language,

ognja, zavetišč in seveda jezika

and the ability to read somebody else's mind

ter sposobnost, da

and interpret that person's behavior.

analiziramo vedenje drugih ljudi.

All of that happened relatively quickly.

Vse se je zgodilo dokaj hitro.

Even though the human brain had achieved its present size

Čeprav so človeški možgani današnjo velikost dosegli

almost three or four hundred thousand years ago,

skoraj 300.000 ali 400.000 let nazaj,

100,000 years ago all of this happened very, very quickly.

se je pred 100.000 leti vse zgodilo izjemno hitro.

And I claim that what happened was

Trdim, da so se

the sudden emergence of a sophisticated mirror neuron system,

nenadoma pojavili visoko razviti zrcalni nevroni,

which allowed you to emulate and imitate other people's actions.

ki so nam omogočili, da smo posnemali dejanja drugih.

So that when there was a sudden accidental discovery

Ko je nekdo v skupini naključno odkril

by one member of the group, say the use of fire,

npr. ogenj

or a particular type of tool, instead of dying out,

ali določeno orodje, se je to

this spread rapidly, horizontally across the population,

hitro razširilo med populacijo

or was transmitted vertically, down the generations.

ali pa se je preneslo na naslednje generacije.

So, this made evolution suddenly Lamarckian,

Gre za Lamarckovo teorijo evolucije

instead of Darwinian.

in ne več darvinistično.

Darwinian evolution is slow; it takes hundreds of thousands of years.

Darvinistična evolucija poteka na stotine ali tisoče let.

A polar bear, to evolve a coat,

Polarni medved bo za razvoj kožuha

will take thousands of generations, maybe 100,000 years.

potreboval na tisoče generacij, mogoče 100.000 let.

A human being, a child, can just watch its parent

Otrok lahko opazuje svojega starša,

kill another polar bear,

kako ubije polarnega medveda,

and skin it and put the skin on its body, fur on the body,

ga odre in se obleče v njegovo krzno

and learn it in one step. What the polar bear

ter se tega nauči v enem koraku. Kar se je polarni medved

took 100,000 years to learn,

učil 100.000 let,

it can learn in five minutes, maybe 10 minutes.

se lahko otrok nauči v 5 ali 10 minutah.

And then once it's learned this it spreads

Ko se stvari enkrat naučimo,

in geometric proportion across a population.

se znanje sorazmerno širi med populacijo.

This is the basis. The imitation of complex skills

To je osnova. Posnemanje kompleksnih spretnosti

is what we call culture and is the basis of civilization.

je kultura in osnova civilizacije.

Now there is another kind of mirror neuron,

Obstaja pa tudi drugačna vrsta zrcalnih nevronov,

which is involved in something quite different.

ki sodeluje pri nečem popolnoma drugačnem.

And that is, there are mirror neurons,

Tako kot obstajajo zrcalni nevroni za dejanja,

just as there are mirror neurons for action, there are mirror neurons for touch.

obstajajo tudi zrcalni nevroni za dotik.

In other words, if somebody touches me,

Če se nekdo dotakne moje roke,

my hand, neuron in the somatosensory cortex

se sproži delovanje nevrona v somatosenzoričnem

in the sensory region of the brain fires.

predelu v možganski skorji.

But the same neuron, in some cases, will fire

Isti nevron lahko deluje tudi,

when I simply watch another person being touched.

ko samo opazujem, kako se nekdo dotakne druge osebe.

So, it's empathizing the other person being touched.

Vživim se v to, da se je nekdo dotaknil druge osebe.

So, most of them will fire when I'm touched

Večina nevronov se bo sprožila, ko se me nekdo dotakne

in different locations. Different neurons for different locations.

na različnih delih. Različni nevroni za različne dele telesa.

But a subset of them will fire even when I watch somebody else

Del nevronov pa se bo sprožil tudi takrat, ko gledam,

being touched in the same location.

kako se nekdo dotika nekoga drugega na istem delu.

So, here again you have neurons

Spet gre za nevrone,

which are enrolled in empathy.

ki se vživijo v situacijo druge osebe.

Now, the question then arises: If I simply watch another person being touched,

Pojavi se vprašanje: Ko gledam, kako se nekdo dotika druge osebe,

why do I not get confused and literally feel that touch sensation

zakaj dejansko ne čutim dotika

merely by watching somebody being touched?

med opazovanjem?

I mean, I empathize with that person but I don't literally feel the touch.

Vživim se v vlogo osebe, dotika pa ne čutim.

Well, that's because you've got receptors in your skin,

V koži imamo receptorje

touch and pain receptors, going back into your brain

za dotik in bolečino, ki pošiljajo dražljaje v možgane

and saying "Don't worry, you're not being touched.

in nam sporočajo:˝Nihče se te ne dotika.

So, empathize, by all means, with the other person,

Vživi se v vlogo drugega,

but do not actually experience the touch,

ampak ne čuti dotika,

otherwise you'll get confused and muddled."

drugače boš zmeden.˝

Okay, so there is a feedback signal

To je povratna informacija,

that vetoes the signal of the mirror neuron

ki izniči signal zrcalnega nevrona

preventing you from consciously experiencing that touch.

in nam prepreči, da bi zavestno občutili dotik.

But if you remove the arm, you simply anesthetize my arm,

Če pa oseba umakne roko, preprosto omrtviči mojo roko,

so you put an injection into my arm,

kot da bi dobil injekcijo.

anesthetize the brachial plexus, so the arm is numb,

To omrtviči brahialni pleksus, zato roka odreveni

and there is no sensations coming in,

in ne zazna vznemirjenja.

if I now watch you being touched,

Če zdaj gledam, kako se nekdo dotika drugega,

I literally feel it in my hand.

to dejansko čutim v svoji roki.

In other words, you have dissolved the barrier

Tako smo odstranili oviro

between you and other human beings.

med mano in ostalimi ljudmi.

So, I call them Gandhi neurons, or empathy neurons.

Zato te nevrone imenujem Gandhijevi nevroni ali nevroni vživetja.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

And this is not in some abstract metaphorical sense.

To ni mišljeno v abstraktnem ali metaforičnem smislu,

All that's separating you from him,

vse, kar nas ločuje od druge osebe,

from the other person, is your skin.

je naša koža.

Remove the skin, you experience that person's touch in your mind.

Če odstranimo kožo, bomo dotik občutili v naših mislih.

You've dissolved the barrier between you and other human beings.

Odstranili smo oviro med nami in drugimi ljudmi.

And this, of course, is the basis of much of Eastern philosophy,

To je osnova vzhodnjaške filozofije.

and that is there is no real independent self,

Ne obstaja samostojna oseba,

aloof from other human beings, inspecting the world,

ki neodvisno od drugih raziskuje svet

inspecting other people.

in druge ljudi.

You are, in fact, connected not just via Facebook and Internet,

Povezani nismo samo prek Facebooka in interneta,

you're actually quite literally connected by your neurons.

ampak smo skoraj dobesedno povezani z nevroni.

And there is whole chains of neurons around this room, talking to each other.

V tej sobi je cela mreža nevronov, ki se pogovarjajo med sabo.

And there is no real distinctiveness

Vaša zavest

of your consciousness from somebody else's consciousness.

se dejansko ne razlikuje od zavesti drugih.

And this is not mumbo-jumbo philosophy.

To ni praznoverna filozofija.

It emerges from our understanding of basic neuroscience.

Izhaja iz našega razumevanja osnovne nevroznanosti.

So, you have a patient with a phantom limb. If the arm has been removed

Imate pacienta s fantomskim udom. Če so vam odstranili roko

and you have a phantom, and you watch somebody else

in imate fantomski občutek bolečine, boste medtem, ko se bo nekdo

being touched, you feel it in your phantom.

dotikal druge osebe, to čutili v svojem fantomskem udu.

Now the astonishing thing is,

Osupljivo je,

if you have pain in your phantom limb, you squeeze the other person's hand,

da ljudje pri občutenju fantomske bolečine stiskajo roko druge osebe,

massage the other person's hand,

masirajo roko druge osebe,

that relieves the pain in your phantom hand,

kar olajša bolečino v fantomski roki.

almost as though the neuron

Kot da bi nevron

were obtaining relief from merely

doživel olajšanje samo

watching somebody else being massaged.

z opazovanjem tega, kako masiramo drugo osebo.

So, here you have my last slide.

Še moja zadnja prosojnica.

For the longest time people have regarded science

Dolgo časa so ljudje obravnavali znanost

and humanities as being distinct.

in humanistiko izrazito ločeno.

C.P. Snow spoke of the two cultures:

C.P. Snow je govoril o dveh kulturah:

science on the one hand, humanities on the other;

o znanosti na eni in humanistiki na drugi strani,

never the twain shall meet.

ki se ne moreta združiti.

So, I'm saying the mirror neuron system underlies the interface

Po mojem mnenju zrcalni nevroni predstavljajo vmesni člen,

allowing you to rethink about issues like consciousness,

ki nam omogoča, da premislimo o zavesti,

representation of self,

o svoji identiteti,

what separates you from other human beings,

o tem kaj nas ločuje od drugih ljudi,

what allows you to empathize with other human beings,

kaj nam omogoča, da se vživimo v vlogo drugih

and also even things like the emergence of culture and civilization,

in celo o pojavu kulture in civilizacije,

which is unique to human beings. Thank you.

ki sta značilni samo za ljudi. Hvala.

(Applause)

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