Atheism 2.0 | Alain de Botton

Translator: Matej Divjak Reviewer: Miha Helbl

One of the most common ways of dividing the world

Eden od najbolj običajnih načinov delitve sveta

is into those who believe

je na tiste, ki verjamejo

and those who don't --

in na tiste, ki ne --

into the religious and the atheists.

na vernike in ateiste.

And for the last decade or so,

In zadnje desetletje ali nekaj takega

it's been quite clear

je bilo precej jasno,

what being an atheist means.

kaj pomeni biti ateist.

There have been some very vocal atheists

Nekaj ateistov je bilo precej glasnih

who've pointed out,

in izpostavili so,

not just that religion is wrong,

da religija ni samo napačna,

but that it's ridiculous.

ampak, da je celo smešna.

These people, many of whom have lived in North Oxford,

Ti ljudje, mnogi med njimi so živeli v Severnem Oxfordu,

have argued --

so trdili --

they've argued that believing in God

trdili so, da je vera v boga

is akin to believing in fairies

podobno kot vera v vile

and essentially that the whole thing

in da je vsa zadeva v bistvu

is a childish game.

otroška igra.

Now I think it's too easy.

Meni pa se zdi, da je to prelahko.

I think it's too easy

Mislim, da je prelahko

to dismiss the whole of religion that way.

vso religijo odkloniti na ta način.

And it's as easy as shooting fish in a barrel.

Je lahko kot lovljenje rib v sodu.

And what I'd like to inaugurate today

Danes pa bi rad razkril

is a new way of being an atheist --

nov način, kako biti ateist --

if you like, a new version of atheism

če želite, novo verzijo ateizma,

we could call Atheism 2.0.

ki mu bomo rekli Ateizem 2.0.

Now what is Atheism 2.0?

Kaj je torej Ateizem 2.0?

Well it starts from a very basic premise:

No, začne se s zelo osnovno premiso:

of course, there's no God.

seveda bog ne obstaja.

Of course, there are no deities or supernatural spirits

Seveda ni nobenih božanstev in nadnaravnih duhov

or angels, etc.

ali angelov, ipd.

Now let's move on; that's not the end of the story,

Sedaj pa se pomaknimo naprej; to ni konec zgodbe,

that's the very, very beginning.

to je šele čisti začetek.

I'm interested in the kind of constituency

Zanima me takšna vrsta privržencev,

that thinks something along these lines:

ki misli nekako v tej smeri:

that thinks, "I can't believe in any of this stuff.

mislijo: "Ne morem verjeti v te stvari.

I can't believe in the doctrines.

Ne morem verjeti v doktrine.

I don't think these doctrines are right.

Mislim, da te doktrine nimajo prav.

But," a very important but, "I love Christmas carols.

Ampak," zelo pomemben 'ampak', "obožujem božične pesmi.

I really like the art of Mantegna.

Res so mi všeč Mantegnajeva umetniška dela.

I really like looking at old churches.

Rad si ogledujem stare cerkve.

I really like turning the pages of the Old Testament."

Zelo rad prebiram strani Stare zaveze."

Whatever it may be,

Karkoli že to je,

you know the kind of thing I'm talking about --

veste, o čem govorim --

people who are attracted to the ritualistic side,

ljudje, ki jih privlači obredna stran,

the moralistic, communal side of religion,

moralistična, skupnostna stran religije,

but can't bear the doctrine.

vendar ne prenesejo doktrine.

Until now, these people have faced a rather unpleasant choice.

Do sedaj so bili ti ljudje soočeni s precej neprijetno izbiro.

It's almost as though either you accept the doctrine

Nekako tako, da ali sprejmeš doktrino

and then you can have all the nice stuff,

in potem lahko imaš vse dobre stvari,

or you reject the doctrine and

ali pa doktrino zavrneš in

you're living in some kind of spiritual wasteland

živiš v neke vrste duhovni puščavi

under the guidance of CNN and Walmart.

pod vodstvom POP TV in Mercatorja.

So that's a sort of tough choice.

To je kar težka odločitev.

I don't think we have to make that choice.

Mislim, da ne potrebujemo takšne odločitve.

I think there is an alternative.

Mislim, da obstaja alternativa.

I think there are ways --

Mislim, da obstajajo načini --

and I'm being both very respectful and completely impious --

in pri tem sem oboje, zelo spoštljiv in popolnoma brezbožen --

of stealing from religions.

kako krasti od religije.

If you don't believe in a religion,

Če ne verjamete v religijo,

there's nothing wrong with picking and mixing,

ni nič narobe z izbiranjem in mešanjem,

with taking out the best sides of religion.

z jemanjem najboljših strani religije.

And for me, atheism 2.0

Zame je ateizem 2.0

is about both, as I say,

oboje, kot sem rekel,

a respectful and an impious way

spoštljiv in brezbožen način

of going through religions and saying, "What here could we use?"

pregledovanja religij in spraševanjem: "Kaj od tega lahko uporabimo?"

The secular world is full of holes.

Posvetni svet je poln lukenj.

We have secularized badly, I would argue.

Slabo smo se sekularizirali, se strinjam.

And a thorough study of religion

In natančno preučevanje religije

could give us all sorts of insights

bi nam lahko dalo vsakovrstne vpoglede

into areas of life that are not going too well.

v področja življenja, kjer nam ne gre preveč dobro.

And I'd like to run through a few of these today.

Danes želim preleteti nekaj od teh.

I'd like to kick off by looking at education.

Začel bi rad s pregledom izobraževanja.

Now education is a field

Izobraževanje je področje,

the secular world really believes in.

v katerega sekularen svet resnično verjame.

When we think about how we're going to make the world a better place,

Ko razmišljamo, kako bomo svet naredili boljši,

we think education; that's where we put a lot of money.

pomislimo na izobraževanje; v to vlagamo ogromno denarja.

Education is going to give us, not only commercial skills, industrial skills,

Izobrazba nam ne bo dala samo trgovskih spretnosti, industrijskih spretnosti,

it's also going to make us better people.

iz nas bo naredila tudi boljše ljudi.

You know the kind of thing a commencement address is, and graduation ceremonies,

Saj veste, promocije, slovesnosti ob podeljevanju diplom,

those lyrical claims

te čustvene trditve,

that education, the process of education -- particularly higher education --

da bo izobrazba, proces izobraževanja -- še posebej visoka izobrazba --

will make us into nobler and better human beings.

iz nas naredila plemenitejša in boljša človeška bitja.

That's a lovely idea.

To je ljubka ideja.

Interesting where it came from.

Zanimivo, od kod izvira.

In the early 19th century,

V zgodnjem 19. stoletju

church attendance in Western Europe

je obisk v cerkvah v Zahodni Evropi

started sliding down very, very sharply, and people panicked.

pričel zelo, zelo hitro upadati in ljudi je zagrabila panika.

They asked themselves the following question.

Zastavili so si sledeče vprašanje.

They said, where are people going to find the morality,

Rekli so, kje bodo ljudje našli moralnost,

where are they going to find guidance,

kje bodo našli smernice

and where are they going to find sources of consolation?

in v čem bodo našli tolažbo?

And influential voices came up with one answer.

In vplivni glasovi so našli odgovor.

They said culture.

Rekli so, v kulturi.

It's to culture that we should look

V kulturi moramo iskati

for guidance, for consolation, for morality.

smernice, tolažbo, moralnost.

Let's look to the plays of Shakespeare,

Poglejmo Shakespearjeve igre,

the dialogues of Plato, the novels of Jane Austen.

Platonove dialoge, romane Jane Austen.

In there, we'll find a lot of the truths

V njih bomo našli ogromno resnic,

that we might previously have found in the Gospel of Saint John.

ki smo jih prej mogoče našli v evangeliju svetega Janeza.

Now I think that's a very beautiful idea and a very true idea.

Mislim, da je to lepa ideja in tudi zelo resnična ideja.

They wanted to replace scripture with culture.

Sveto pismo so želeli nadomestiti s kulturo.

And that's a very plausible idea.

In to je zelo verjetna ideja.

It's also an idea that we have forgotten.

Je pa tudi ideja, ki smo jo pozabili.

If you went to a top university --

Če bi šli na vrhunsko univerzo --

let's say you went to Harvard or Oxford or Cambridge --

recimo, da bi šli na Harvard ali v Oxford ali v Cambridge --

and you said, "I've come here

in bi rekli: "Sem sem prišel,

because I'm in search of morality, guidance and consolation;

ker iščem moralnost, smernice in tolažbo;

I want to know how to live,"

želim vedeti, kako živeti,"

they would show you the way to the insane asylum.

bi vam pokazali pot do norišnice.

This is simply not what our grandest and best institutes of higher learning

To preprosto ni to, s čimer se naše največje in najboljše ustanove

are in the business of.

visokega šolstva ukvarjajo.

Why? They don't think we need it.

Zakaj? Mislijo, da tega ne potrebujemo.

They don't think we are in an urgent need of assistance.

Ne zdi se jim, da nujno potrebujemo pomoč.

They see us as adults, rational adults.

Vidijo nas kod odrasle, razumne odrasle.

What we need is information.

Kar potrebujemo so informacije.

We need data, we don't need help.

Potrebujemo podatke, ne potrebujemo pomoči.

Now religions start from a very different place indeed.

Religije pa začenjajo z zares povsem druge točke.

All religions, all major religions,

Vse religije, vse glavne religije

at various points call us children.

nas na različnih točkah imenujejo za otroke.

And like children,

In verjamejo, da kot otroci

they believe that we are in severe need of assistance.

zelo potrebujemo pomoč.

We're only just holding it together.

Komaj se še držimo skupaj.

Perhaps this is just me, maybe you.

Mogoče gre samo zame, mogoče zate.

But anyway, we're only just holding it together.

A kakorkoli, komaj se še držimo skupaj.

And we need help. Of course, we need help.

In potrebujemo pomoč. Seveda potrebujemo pomoč.

And so we need guidance and we need didactic learning.

In potrebujemo tudi smernice in didaktično učenje.

You know, in the 18th century in the U.K.,

Veste, v 18. stoletju je v Združenem kraljestvu

the greatest preacher, greatest religious preacher, was a man called John Wesley,

bil največji pridigar, največji verski pridigar, mož z imenom John Wesley,

who went up and down this country delivering sermons,

ki je potoval gor in dol po tej deželi in pridigal,

advising people how they could live.

s čimer je svetoval ljudem, kako bi lahko živeli.

He delivered sermons on the duties of parents to their children

Pridigal je o dolžnostih staršev do svojih otrok

and children to their parents,

in otrokov do svojih staršev,

the duties of the rich to the poor and the poor to the rich.

o dolžnostih bogatih do revnih in revnih do bogatih.

He was trying to tell people how they should live

Ljudem je poskušal dopovedati, kako naj živijo,

through the medium of sermons,

s pomočjo pridig,

the classic medium of delivery of religions.

klasičnega medija za predavanje religij.

Now we've given up with the idea of sermons.

Ideji pridig smo se odrekli.

If you said to a modern liberal individualist,

Če bi modernemu liberalnemu posamezniku rekli:

"Hey, how about a sermon?"

"Hej, si za pridigo?",

they'd go, "No, no. I don't need one of those.

bi vam rekli: "Ne, ne. Jaz je ne potrebujem.

I'm an independent, individual person."

Sem samostojen posameznik."

What's the difference between a sermon

V čem je razlika med pridigo

and our modern, secular mode of delivery, the lecture?

in sodobnim, sekularnim načinom predavanja?

Well a sermon wants to change your life

No, pridiga vam želi spremeniti življenje,

and a lecture wants to give you a bit of information.

predavanje pa vam želi dati nekaj informacij.

And I think we need to get back to that sermon tradition.

In mislim, da bi se morali vrniti k tradiciji pridig.

The tradition of sermonizing is hugely valuable,

Tradicija pridiganja je zelo dragocena,

because we are in need of guidance,

ker potrebujemo smernice,

morality and consolation --

moralnost in tolažbo --

and religions know that.

in religije to vedo.

Another point about education:

Še ena stvar o izobraževanju:

we tend to believe in the modern secular world

v sodobnem sekularnem svetu radi verjamemo,

that if you tell someone something once, they'll remember it.

da če nekomu nekaj enkrat poveste, da si bo to zapomnil.

Sit them in a classroom, tell them about Plato

Posedite jih v razred, povejte jim o Platonu,

at the age of 20, send them out for a career in management consultancy for 40 years,

ko so stari 20, pošljite jih v kariero svetovanja v managementu za 40 let

and that lesson will stick with them.

in ta lekcija se jih bo držala.

Religions go, "Nonsense.

Religije pa pravijo: "Nesmisel.

You need to keep repeating the lesson 10 times a day.

Lekcijo morate ponavljati 10-krat na dan.

So get on your knees and repeat it."

Torej, pokleknite in jo ponavljajte."

That's what all religions tell us:

To nam govorijo vse religije:

"Get on you knees and repeat it 10 or 20 or 15 times a day."

"Pokleknite in ponavljajte 10- ali 20- ali 15-krat na dan."

Otherwise our minds are like sieves.

Drugače so naše pameti kot rešeta.

So religions are cultures of repetition.

Religije so torej kulture ponavljanja.

They circle the great truths again and again and again.

Z velikimi resnicami krožijo zopet in znova in spet.

We associate repetition with boredom.

Ponavljanje pa povezujemo z dolgčasom.

"Give us the new," we're always saying.

"Dajte nam novo," vedno govorimo.

"The new is better than the old."

"Novo je boljše od starega."

If I said to you, "Okay, we're not going to have new TED.

Če bi vam rekel: "Ok, ne bomo imeli nove TED konference.

We're just going to run through all the old ones

Enostavno bomo ponavljali vse stare

and watch them five times because they're so true.

in jih gledali petkrat, ker so tako resnične.

We're going to watch Elizabeth Gilbert five times

Elizabeth Gilbert bomo gledali petkrat,

because what she says is so clever," you'd feel cheated.

ker je to, kar govori, tako pametno", bi se počutili ogoljufano.

Not so if you're adopting a religious mindset.

Če pa privzamete religijsko miselnost, pa ne.

The other things that religions do

Religije pa urejajo

is to arrange time.

tudi čas.

All the major religions give us calendars.

Vse glavne religije nam dajo koledarje.

What is a calendar?

Kaj je koledar?

A calendar is a way of making sure that across the year

Koledar je način, kako zagotoviti, da boste skozi leto

you will bump into certain very important ideas.

naleteli na določene zelo pomembne ideje.

In the Catholic chronology, Catholic calendar,

V katoliški kronologiji, katoliškem koledarju,

at the end of March you will think about St. Jerome

boste ob koncu marca pomislili na svetega Jeremijo,

and his qualities of humility and goodness

na njegove lastnosti kot so ponižnost in dobrota

and his generosity to the poor.

in njegova velikodušnost do revnih.

You won't do that by accident; you will do that because you are guided to do that.

Tega ne boste naredili po pomoti; to boste naredili, ker vas bodo do tega vodili.

Now we don't think that way.

Mi pa ne mislimo na ta način.

In the secular world we think, "If an idea is important, I'll bump into it.

V sekularnem svetu mislimo: "Če je ideja pomembna, bom nanjo naletel.

I'll just come across it."

Kar srečal jo bom."

Nonsense, says the religious world view.

Nesmisel, pravi religiozni pogled na svet.

Religious view says we need calendars, we need to structure time,

Religiozni pogled pravi, da potrebujemo koledarje, čas moramo strukturirati,

we need to synchronize encounters.

svoja srečanja moramo sinhronizirati.

This comes across also

To se pozna tudi

in the way in which religions set up rituals

v načinu, kako religije pripravijo obrede

around important feelings.

okoli pomembnih občutij.

Take the Moon. It's really important to look at the Moon.

Vzemimo Luno. Zelo pomembno je gledati Luno.

You know, when you look at the Moon,

Veste, ko pogledate Luno,

you think, "I'm really small. What are my problems?"

si mislite: "Res sem majhen. Kaj so moje težave?"

It sets things into perspective, etc., etc.

Stvari postavi v perspektivo, itd., itd.

We should all look at the Moon a bit more often. We don't.

Vsi bi morali bolj pogosto gledati v Luno. Pa ne.

Why don't we? Well there's nothing to tell us, "Look at the Moon."

Zakaj ne? Ker nimamo ničesar, kar bi nam govorilo: "Poglej v Luno."

But if you're a Zen Buddhist in the middle of September,

Če pa ste zen budist sredi septembra,

you will be ordered out of your home, made to stand on a canonical platform

vam bodo ukazali, da greste od doma, vas postavili na predpisano ploščad,

and made to celebrate the festival of Tsukimi,

kjer boste morali proslavljati praznik Tsukimi,

where you will be given poems to read

kjer vam bodo dali pesmi, da jih berete

in honor of the Moon and the passage of time

v čast Lune in minevanja časa

and the frailty of life that it should remind us of.

in krhkosti življenja, na katero bi nas naj spominjalo.

You'll be handed rice cakes.

Dali vam bodo riževo pecivo.

And the Moon and the reflection on the Moon

In Luna in razmišljanje o Luni

will have a secure place in your heart.

bosta imela varno mesto v vašem srcu.

That's very good.

To je zelo dobro.

The other thing that religions are really aware of

Druga stvar, ki se je religije zelo zavedajo,

is: speak well --

je: dobro govori --

I'm not doing a very good job of this here --

jaz tega tu ne počnem prav dobro --

but oratory, oratory is absolutely key to religions.

a govorništvo, govorništvo je absolutno ključno v religijah.

In the secular world, you can come through the university system and be a lousy speaker

V sekularnem svetu lahko pridete skozi univerzitetni sistem kot zanič govorec,

and still have a great career.

a še vedno lahko imate imenitno kariero.

But the religious world doesn't think that way.

Religiozen svet pa ne razmišlja na ta način.

What you're saying needs to be backed up

Kar govorite, mora biti podprto

by a really convincing way of saying it.

z resnično prepričljivim načinom govora.

So if you go to an African-American Pentecostalist church

Če greste v afriško ameriško pentekostalistično cerkev

in the American South

na jugu Amerike

and you listen to how they talk,

in poslušate, kako govorijo,

my goodness, they talk well.

moj bog, kako dobro govorijo.

After every convincing point, people will go, "Amen, amen, amen."

Po vsaki prepričljivi točki, ljudje govorijo: "Amen, amen, amen."

At the end of a really rousing paragraph, they'll all stand up,

Ob koncu zares vzpodbudnega odstavka, bodo vsi vstali

and they'll go, "Thank you Jesus, thank you Christ, thank you Savior."

in govorili: "Hvaljen Jezus, hvaljen Kristus, hvaljen Odrešitelj."

If we were doing it like they do it --

Če bi to počeli kot oni --

let's not do it, but if we were to do it --

raje ne, ampak če bi --

I would tell you something like, "Culture should replace scripture."

bi vam povedal nekako tako: "Kultura mora nadomestiti Sveto pismo."

And you would go, "Amen, amen, amen."

In vi bi pritegnili: "Amen, amen, amen."

And at the end of my talk, you would all stand up

Ob koncu mojega govora pa bi vsi vstali

and you would go, "Thank you Plato, thank you Shakespeare, thank you Jane Austen."

in govorili: "Hvaljen Platon, hvaljen Shakespeare, hvaljena Jane Austen."

And we'd know that we had a real rhythm going.

In vedeli bi, da imamo pravi ritem.

All right, all right. We're getting there. We're getting there.

Prav, prav. Prihajamo tja. Prihajamo tja.

(Applause)

(Aplavz)

The other thing that religions know is we're not just brains,

Še nekaj, kar religije vedo, je, da nismo samo možgani,

we are also bodies.

da smo tudi telesa.

And when they teach us a lesson,

In ko nas nekaj učijo,

they do it via the body.

to počnejo prek telesa.

So for example,

Vzemimo za primer

take the Jewish idea of forgiveness.

judovsko idejo odpuščanja.

Jews are very interested in forgiveness

Jude zelo zanima odpuščanje

and how we should start anew and start afresh.

in kako začeti znova in od začetka.

They don't just deliver us sermons on this.

Ampak oni o tem ne le pridigajo.

They don't just give us books or words about this.

Ne dajo nam samo knjig in besed o tem.

They tell us to have a bath.

Rečejo nam, naj se skopamo.

So in Orthodox Jewish communities, every Friday you go to a Mikveh.

Tako v skupnostih ortodoksnih Judov greste vsak petek v obredno kopališče Mikveh.

You immerse yourself in the water,

Potopite se v vodo

and a physical action backs up a philosophical idea.

in fizično dejanje podkrepi filozofsko idejo.

We don't tend to do that.

Mi nismo nagnjeni k temu.

Our ideas are in one area and our behavior with our bodies is in another.

Naše ideje so na enem območju, naše obnašanje z našimi telesi pa na drugem.

Religions are fascinating in the way they try and combine the two.

Očarljivo je, kako religije poskušajo to dvoje skombinirati.

Let's look at art now.

Zdaj pa poglejmo umetnost.

Now art is something that in the secular world,

Umetnost je nekaj, o čemer imamo v sekularnem svetu

we think very highly of. We think art is really, really important.

zelo visoko mnenje. Mislimo, da je umetnost zelo zelo pomembna.

A lot of our surplus wealth goes to museums, etc.

Veliko presežnega premoženja gre v muzeje, itd.

We sometimes hear it said

Včasih slišimo, da kdo reče,

that museums are our new cathedrals, or our new churches.

da so muzeji naše nove katedrale, naše nove cerkve.

You've heard that saying.

Slišali ste, da to govorijo.

Now I think that the potential is there,

Jaz mislim, da je potencial tu,

but we've completely let ourselves down.

a smo sami sebe popolnoma razočarali.

And the reason we've let ourselves down

Razlog, da smo se razočarali,

is that we're not properly studying

pa je, da ne študiramo na pravi način,

how religions handle art.

kako religije rokujejo z umetnostjo.

The two really bad ideas that are hovering in the modern world

Dve resnično slabi ideji, ki lebdita v sodobnem svetu

that inhibit our capacity to draw strength from art:

in ki ovirata našo sposobnost črpanja moči iz umetnosti:

The first idea is that art should be for art's sake --

Prva ideja je, da je umetnost namenjena sama sebi --

a ridiculous idea --

to je nesmisel --

an idea that art should live in a hermetic bubble

zamisel, da bi umetnost morala živeti v hermetičnem mehurčku

and should not try to do anything with this troubled world.

in ne bi smela poskušati narediti karkoli s tem razburkanim svetom.

I couldn't disagree more.

Ne bi se mogel bolj ne strinjati.

The other thing that we believe is that art shouldn't explain itself,

Druga stvar, ki jo verjamemo, pa je, da se umetnost ne bi smela razlagati,

that artists shouldn't say what they're up to,

da umetniki ne bi smeli povedati, kaj nameravajo,

because if they said it, it might destroy the spell

ker če bi to povedali, bi lahko uničili urok

and we might find it too easy.

in bi se nam zdelo prelahko.

That's why a very common feeling when you're in a museum --

Zato imamo v muzeju zelo pogosto učinek --

let's admit it --

priznajmo --

is, "I don't know what this is about."

"Ne vem, kaj bi to naj predstavljalo."

But if we're serious people, we don't admit to that.

Ampak, če smo resni ljudje, si tega ne priznamo.

But that feeling of puzzlement is structural

A ta občutek zbeganosti je

to contemporary art.

sestavni del sodobne umetnosti.

Now religions have a much saner attitude to art.

Religije pa imajo veliko razumnejši odnos do umetnosti.

They have no trouble telling us what art is about.

Nobenih težav nimajo s tem, da nam povedo, kaj umetnost predstavlja.

Art is about two things in all the major faiths.

Umetnost se v vseh glavnih verstvih vrti okoli dveh stvari.

Firstly, it's trying to remind you

Najprej nas poskušajo spomniti,

of what there is to love.

kaj naj ljubimo.

And secondly, it's trying to remind you

Kot drugo pa nas poskušajo spomniti,

of what there is to fear and to hate.

česa se moramo bati in kaj sovražiti.

And that's what art is.

In to je umetnost.

Art is a visceral encounter with the most important ideas of your faith.

Umetnost je čutno srečanje z najpomembnejšimi idejami vaše vere.

So as you walk around a church,

Ko hodite po cerkvi,

or a mosque or a cathedral,

ali mošeji ali katedrali,

what you're trying to imbibe, what you're imbibing is,

kar poskušate vsrkati, kar vsrkavate

through your eyes, through your senses,

skoz svoje oči, skozi svoje čute,

truths that have otherwise come to you through your mind.

so resnice, ki ste jih sicer spoznali s svojim umom.

Essentially it's propaganda.

V bistvu je propaganda.

Rembrandt is a propagandist

Rembrandt je propagandist

in the Christian view.

z vidika kristjanov.

Now the word "propaganda" sets off alarm bells.

A beseda "propaganda" sproži alarm.

We think of Hitler, we think of Stalin. Don't, necessarily.

Pomislimo na Hitlerja, na Stalina. A to ni nujno.

Propaganda is a manner of being didactic in honor of something.

Propaganda je način, kako poučevati v čast nečemu.

And if that thing is good, there's no problem with it at all.

In če je ta stvar dobra, potem s tem ni nobenega problema.

My view is that museums should take a leaf out of the book of religions.

Po mojem bi muzeji morali posnemati religije.

And they should make sure that when you walk into a museum --

In morali bi poskrbeti za to, da ko vstopite v muzej --

if I was a museum curator,

če bi bil jaz upravitelj muzeja,

I would make a room for love, a room for generosity.

naredil bi sobo za ljubezen, sobo za velikodušnost.

All works of art are talking to us about things.

Vse umetnine nam o nečem govorijo.

And if we were able to arrange spaces

In če bi lahko prostore uredili tako,

where we could come across works

da bi nam ob ogledovanju umetniških del

where we would be told, use these works of art

povedali, te in te umetnine uporabite

to cement these ideas in your mind,

za utrditev teh in teh idej v vašem umu,

we would get a lot more out of art.

bi od umetnosti veliko več odnesli.

Art would pick up the duty that it used to have

Umetnost bi ponovno zasedla mesto, ki ga je že imela

and that we've neglected because of certain mis-founded ideas.

in ki smo ga zanemarili zaradi določenih napačno utemeljenih idej.

Art should be one of the tools

Umetnost bi morala biti eno od orodij,

by which we improve our society.

s katerimi izboljšujemo našo družbo.

Art should be didactic.

Umetnost bi morala biti poučna.

Let's think of something else.

Pomislimo na nekaj drugega.

The people in the modern world, in the secular world,

Ljudje v sodobnem svetu, v sekularnem svetu,

who are interested in matters of the spirit,

ki jih zanimajo stvari o duhu,

in matters of the mind,

stvari o razumu,

in higher soul-like concerns,

višje zadeve o nečem podobnem duši,

tend to be isolated individuals.

so pogosto osamljeni posamezniki.

They're poets, they're philosophers, they're photographers, they're filmmakers.

So poeti, filozofi, fotografi, režiserji.

And they tend to be on their own.

In ponavadi so sami.

They're our cottage industries. They are vulnerable, single people.

So naši obrtniki. So ranljivi, samski ljudje.

And they get depressed and they get sad on their own.

Depresivni in žalostni postanejo sami.

And they don't really change much.

In ne spreminjajo se kaj dosti.

Now think about religions, think about organized religions.

Sedaj pa pomisliti na religije, na organizirane religije.

What do organized religions do?

Kaj organizirane religije počnejo?

They group together, they form institutions.

Zberejo se skupaj, oblikujejo inštitucije.

And that has all sorts of advantages.

In to ima vrsto prednosti.

First of all, scale, might.

V prvi vrsti obseg, moč.

The Catholic Church pulled in 97 billion dollars last year

Katoliška cerkev je lani zbrala 97 milijard dolarjev,

according to the Wall Street Journal.

je pisal Wall Street Journal.

These are massive machines.

To so ogromni mehanizmi.

They're collaborative, they're branded, they're multinational,

So sodelovalni, imajo ime, so multinacionalni

and they're highly disciplined.

in so zelo disciplinirani.

These are all very good qualities.

Vse to so zelo dobre lastnosti.

We recognize them in relation to corporations.

Prepoznamo jih v povezavi s korporacijami.

And corporations are very like religions in many ways,

Korporacije pa so v več pogledih zelo podobne religijam,

except they're right down at the bottom of the pyramid of needs.

le da so na dnu piramide potreb.

They're selling us shoes and cars.

Prodajajo nam čevlje in avtomobile.

Whereas the people who are selling us the higher stuff --

Ljudje, ki nam prodajajo višje stvari --

the therapists, the poets --

terapevti, pesniki --

are on their own and they have no power,

pa so sami in nimajo moči,

they have no might.

nimajo oblasti.

So religions are the foremost example

Religije so torej najodličnejši primer

of an institution that is fighting for the things of the mind.

inštitucije, ki se bori za duhovne stvari.

Now we may not agree with what religions are trying to teach us,

Morda se ne strinjamo s stvarmi, ki jih religije poskušajo učiti,

but we can admire the institutional way

vendar lahko občudujemo način,

in which they're doing it.

kako to počnejo.

Books alone, books written by lone individuals,

Knjige same, knjige, ki so jih napisali osamljeni posamezniki

are not going to change anything.

ne bodo spremenile ničesar.

We need to group together.

Moramo se zbrati skupaj.

If you want to change the world, you have to group together, you have to be collaborative.

Če želite spremeniti svet, se morate zbirati, morate sodelovati.

And that's what religions do.

In to počnejo religije.

They are multinational, as I say,

So multinacionalne, kot sem rekel,

they are branded, they have a clear identity,

imajo svoje ime, imajo jasno identiteto,

so they don't get lost in a busy world.

tako da se ne izgubijo v zaposlenem svetu.

That's something we can learn from.

To je nekaj, od česar se lahko učimo.

I want to conclude.

Rad bi zaključil.

Really what I want to say

Kar bi v resnici rad povedal, je,

is for many of you who are operating in a range of different fields,

da se lahko mnogi od vas, ki delujete na različnih področjih,

there is something to learn from the example of religion --

od religij nekaj naučite --

even if you don't believe any of it.

tudi, če ničesar od tega ne verjamete.

If you're involved in anything that's communal,

Če sodelujete pri čemerkoli, kar je skupno,

that involves lots of people getting together,

kar vključuje mnogo ljudi, ki se zbirajo,

there are things for you in religion.

boste v religiji našli nekaj zase.

If you're involved, say, in a travel industry in any way,

Če ste na kakršenkoli način povezani s potovanji,

look at pilgrimage.

poglejte romanje.

Look very closely at pilgrimage.

Zelo dobro si poglejte romanje.

We haven't begun to scratch the surface

Glede potovanj nismo še niti

of what travel could be

površine spraskali,

because we haven't looked at what religions do with travel.

ker nismo pogledali, kako se religije lotevajo potovanj.

If you're in the art world,

Če ste v svetu umetnosti,

look at the example of what religions are doing with art.

poglejte, kaj religije počnejo z umetnostjo.

And if you're an educator in any way,

In če ste na kakršenkoli način učitelj,

again, look at how religions are spreading ideas.

ponovno, poglejte, kako religije širijo ideje.

You may not agree with the ideas,

Ni se vam treba strinjati z idejami,

but my goodness, they're highly effective mechanisms for doing so.

vendar so zelo učinkovit mehanizem za to.

So really my concluding point

Moj sklep je torej,

is you may not agree with religion,

da se vam ni treba strinjati z religijo,

but at the end of the day,

vendar so na koncu

religions are so subtle, so complicated,

religije tako subtilne, tako zapletene,

so intelligent in many ways

na mnogo načinov tako inteligentne,

that they're not fit to be abandoned to the religious alone;

da jih ne moremo prepustiti samo vernikom;

they're for all of us.

za vse nas so.

Thank you very much.

Najlepša hvala.

(Applause)

(Aplavz)

Chris Anderson: Now this is actually a courageous talk,

Chris Anderson: To je dejansko pogumen govor,

because you're kind of setting up yourself in some ways

ker se na nek način izpostavljaš, da se bodo

to be ridiculed in some quarters.

v določenih krogih norčevali iz tebe.

AB: You can get shot by both sides.

AB: Ustrelijo te lahko z obeh strani.

You can get shot by the hard-headed atheists,

Lahko te ustrelijo trdoglavi ateisti

and you can get shot by those who fully believe.

in lahko te ustrelijo tisti, ki popolnoma verjamejo.

CA: Incoming missiles from North Oxford at any moment.

CA: Vsak čas bodo priletele rakete iz Severnega Oxforda.

AB: Indeed.

AB: Res je.

CA: But you left out one aspect of religion

CA: A izpustil si en vidik religije,

that a lot of people might say

za katerega bi mnogi lahko rekli,

your agenda could borrow from,

da bi si tvoja agenda lahko kaj izposodila od njega,

which is this sense --

in sicer v tem smislu --

that's actually probably the most important thing to anyone who's religious --

to je pravzaprav verjetno najpomembnejša stvar vsakemu verniku --

of spiritual experience,

duhovne izkušnje,

of some kind of connection

neke vrste povezanosti

with something that's bigger than you are.

z nečim, kar je več od nas.

Is there any room for that experience in Atheism 2.0?

Je prostor za takšno izkustvo v Ateizmu 2.0?

AB: Absolutely. I, like many of you, meet people

AB: Absolutno. Kot mnogi od vas, srečujem ljudi,

who say things like, "But isn't there something bigger than us,

ki govorijo: "Ampak, a ne obstaja nekaj več od nas,

something else?"

nekaj drugega?"

And I say, "Of course." And they say, "So aren't you sort of religious?"

In jaz odgovarjam: "Seveda." In potem rečejo: "A nisi torej na nek način religiozen?"

And I go, "No." Why does that sense of mystery,

In odgovorim: "Ne." Zakaj bi moral ta občutek skrivnosti,

that sense of the dizzying scale of the universe,

ta občutek vrtoglavega obsega vesolja

need to be accompanied by a mystical feeling?

spremljati občutek nečesa mističnega?

Science and just observation

Znanost in samo opazovanje

gives us that feeling without it,

nam dajeta ta občutek brez mistike,

so I don't feel the need.

zato ne čutim potrebe.

The universe is large and we are tiny,

Vesolje je ogromno, mi pa smo majčkeni,

without the need for further religious superstructure.

brez potrebe po nadaljnji religiozni nadgradnji.

So one can have so-called spiritual moments

Tako lahko ima nekdo t. i. duhovne trenutke

without belief in the spirit.

brez vere v duha.

CA: Actually, let me just ask a question.

CA: Pravzaprav, naj nekaj vprašam.

How many people here would say

Koliko ljudi tukaj bi reklo,

that religion is important to them?

da jim je religija pomembna?

Is there an equivalent process

A je kak enakovreden proces,

by which there's a sort of bridge

s pomočjo katerega obstaja most

between what you're talking about and what you would say to them?

med tem, o čemer govoriš in tem, kar bi povedal njim?

AB: I would say that there are many, many gaps in secular life

AB: Rekel bi, da je v sekularnem življenju veliko veliko lukenj,

and these can be plugged.

ki se jih da zamašiti.

It's not as though, as I try to suggest,

Ni tako, kot želim pokazati,

it's not as though either you have religion

ni tako, da ali imaš religijo

and then you have to accept all sorts of things,

in moraš zato sprejeti celo vrsto stvari,

or you don't have religion

ali pa nimaš religije

and then you're cut off from all these very good things.

in si zato prikrajšan za vse te zelo dobre stvari.

It's so sad that we constantly say,

Žalostno je, da nenehno govorimo:

"I don't believe so I can't have community,

"Ne verjamem, zato ne morem imeti skupnosti,

so I'm cut off from morality,

zato sem odrezan od moralnosti,

so I can't go on a pilgrimage."

zato ne morem iti na romanje."

One wants to say, "Nonsense. Why not?"

Nekdo bo rekel: "Nesmisel. Zakaj ne?"

And that's really the spirit of my talk.

In to je resnični smisel mojega govora.

There's so much we can absorb.

Toliko vsega lahko vsrkamo.

Atheism shouldn't cut itself off from the rich sources of religion.

Ateizem se ne bi smel odrezati od bogatih virov religije.

CA: It seems to me that there's plenty of people in the TED community

CA: Zdi se mi, da je v skupnosti TED veliko ljudi,

who are atheists.

ki so ateisti.

But probably most people in the community

Vendar verjetno večina v tej skupnosti

certainly don't think that religion is going away any time soon

zagotovo ne misli, da bo religija v bližnji prihodnosti izginila,

and want to find the language

in želijo najti jezik

to have a constructive dialogue

za konstruktivni dialog

and to feel like we can actually talk to each other

in občutek, da se lahko resnično pogovarjamo med sabo

and at least share some things in common.

in delimo vsaj nekaj skupnih stvari.

Are we foolish to be optimistic

Smo nespametni, če smo optimistični

about the possibility of a world

glede možnosti sveta,

where, instead of religion being the great rallying cry

kjer bi namesto, da je religija mogočen zborovalen krik

of divide and war,

delitve in vojne,

that there could be bridging?

lahko bilo premoščanje?

AB: No, we need to be polite about differences.

AB: Ne, o razlikah moramo biti vljudni.

Politeness is a much-overlooked virtue.

Vljudnost je preveč spregledana vrlina.

It's seen as hypocrisy.

Vidimo jo kot hinavščino.

But we need to get to a stage when you're an atheist

A moramo priti do stopnje, kjer ste ateist

and someone says, "Well you know, I did pray the other day,"

in nekdo reče: "Veš, zadnjič sem molil,"

you politely ignore it.

in vi to vljudno ignorirate.

You move on.

Greste naprej.

Because you've agreed on 90 percent of things,

Zato, ker ste se strinjali o 90 odstotkih stvari,

because you have a shared view on so many things,

zato ker ste delili poglede o tolikih stvareh

and you politely differ.

in se vljudno ne strinjate.

And I think that's what the religious wars of late have ignored.

In mislim, da so to nedavne religiozne vojne ignorirale.

They've ignored the possibility of harmonious disagreement.

Ignorirale so možnost složnega nesoglasja.

CA: And finally, does this new thing that you're proposing

CA: In na koncu, ali ta nova stvar, ki jo predlagaš,

that's not a religion but something else,

ki ni religija, ampak nekaj drugega,

does it need a leader,

ali potrebuje vodjo

and are you volunteering to be the pope?

in ali se javljaš za papeža?

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

AB: Well, one thing that we're all very suspicious of

AB: No, nekaj, do česar smo vsi zelo sumničavi,

is individual leaders.

so posamezni vodje.

It doesn't need it.

Ne potrebuje ga.

What I've tried to lay out is a framework

Poskusil sem postaviti ogrodje

and I'm hoping that people can just fill it in.

in upam, da ga bodo ljudje lahko sami zapolnili.

I've sketched a sort of broad framework.

Skiciral sem neke vrste široko ogrodje.

But wherever you are, as I say, if you're in the travel industry, do that travel bit.

A kjerkoli ste, kot sem rekel, če se ukvarjate s potovanji, naredite del o potovanjih.

If you're in the communal industry, look at religion and do the communal bit.

Če delate s skupnostmi, poglejte religijo in naredite del o skupnostih.

So it's a wiki project.

Torej je wiki projekt.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

CA: Alain, thank you for sparking many conversations later.

CA: Alain, hvala da si podžgal številne pogovore, ki bodo sledili.

(Applause)

(Aplavz)