The Panama Papers exposed a huge global problem. What's next? | Robert Palmer

Translator: Fanny Skriver Reviewer: Anders Finn Jørgensen

[On April 3, 2016 we saw the largest data leak in history.]

[Den 3. april 2016 oplevede vi historiens største læk af data.]

[The Panama Papers exposed rich and powerful people]

[Panama papirerne afslørede rige og magtfulde mennesker,]

[hiding vast amounts of money in offshore accounts.]

[som skjulte store summer af penge i offshore kontoer.]

[What does this mean?]

[Hvad betyder dette?]

[We called Robert Palmer of Global Witness to explain.]

[Vi fik Robert Palmer fra Global Witness til at forklare.]

This week, there have been a whole slew and deluge of stories

I denne uge har der været et stort antal af historier,

coming out from the leak of 11 million documents

der kommer fra lækket af elleve millioner dokumenter

from a Panamanian-based law firm called Mossack Fonseca.

fra et Panama baseret advokatfirma, kaldet Mossack Fonseca.

The release of these papers from Panama lifts the veil on a tiny piece

Afsløringen af disse papirer fra Panama løfter sløret for en lille del

of the secretive offshore world.

af den hemmelighedsfulde offshore verden.

We get an insight into how clients and banks and lawyers

Vi får et indblik i, hvordan klienter, banker og advokater

go to companies like Mossack Fonseca

går til firmaer som Mossack Fonseca

and say, "OK, we want an anonymous company,

og siger, "Ok, vi søger et anonymt firma,

can you give us one?"

kan i skaffe os et?"

So you actually get to see the emails,

Man får lov til at se e-mails,

you get to see the exchanges of messages,

man får lov til at se beskedudvekslinger,

you get to see the mechanics of how this works,

man får lov til at se, hvordan det fungerer,

how this operates.

Now, this has already started to have pretty immediate repercussions.

Det har allerede haft meget umiddelbare følgevirkninger.

The Prime Minister of Iceland has resigned.

Islands premierminister er trådt tilbage.

We've also had news

Vi har også fået af vide,

that an ally of the brutal Syrian dictator Bashar Al-Assad

at en allieret til den syriske diktator Bashar Al-Assad

has also got offshore companies.

har offshore selskaber.

There's been allegations of a $2 billion money trail

Der har været påstande om, at et 2 mia. dollar pengespor

that leads back to President Vladimir Putin of Russia

fører tilbage til præsident Vladimir Putin i Rusland

via his close childhood friend,

via hans tætte barndomsven,

who happens to be a top cellist.

som tilfældigvis er en af de bedste cellospillere.

And there will be a lot of rich individuals out there

Der er en masse rige individer

and others who will be nervous about the next set of stories

og andre, som vil være nervøse for de næste historier

and the next set of leaked documents.

og de næste lækkede dokumenter.

Now, this sounds like the plot of a spy thriller

Det lyder som et plot til en spion thriller

or a John Grisham novel.

eller en John Grisham roman.

It seems very distant from you, me, ordinary people.

Det virker meget distanceret fra dig, mig, normale mennesker.

Why should we care about this?

Hvorfor skal vi bekymre os om dette?

But the truth is that if rich and powerful individuals

Men sandheden er, at hvis rige og magtfulde individer

are able to keep their money offshore

kan holde deres penge offshore

and not pay the taxes that they should,

og undgå at betale skat, som de skulle,

it means that there is less money for vital public services

så er der færre penge til vigtige, offentlige tjenester

like healthcare, education, roads.

såsom sundhedsvæsenet, uddannelse, veje.

And that affects all of us.

Og det påvirker os alle sammen.

Now, for my organization Global Witness,

For min organisation Global Witness

this exposé has been phenomenal.

har disse afsløringer været fænomenale.

We have the world's media and political leaders

Vi har fået verdens medier og politiske ledere

talking about how individuals can use offshore secrecy

til at snakke om, hvordan nogen kan bruge hemmelige offshore selskaber

to hide and disguise their assets --

til at skjule deres aktiver --

something we have been talking about and exposing for a decade.

noget vi har snakket om og afsløret i et årti.

Now, I think a lot of people find this entire world baffling and confusing,

Jeg tror, at en masse mennesker finder hele denne verden forbløffende

and hard to understand how this sort of offshore world works.

og at de synes, at denne form for offshore verden er svær at forstå.

I like to think of it a bit like a Russian doll.

Jeg betragter det lidt som en russisk dukke.

So you can have one company stacked inside another company,

Man kan have et firma inde i et andet firma,

stacked inside another company,

som er inde i et andet firma,

making it almost impossible to really understand

hvilket gør det næsten umuligt at forstå,

who is behind these structures.

hvem der står bag disse strukturer.

It can be very difficult for law enforcement

Det kan være meget svært for dem, der håndhæver loven

or tax authorities, journalists, civil society

eller skattemyndigheder, journalister, civilsamfundet

to really understand what's going on.

virkelig at forstå, hvad der foregår.

I also think it's interesting

Jeg synes også, at det er interessant,

that there's been less coverage of this issue in the United States.

at der har været mindre dækning af emnet i USA.

And that's perhaps because some prominent US people

Og det er måske fordi, nogen fremtrædende folk fra USA

just haven't figured in this exposé, in this scandal.

ikke har optrådt i disse afsløringer, i denne skandale.

Now, that's not because there are no rich Americans

Det er ikke fordi, der ikke er nogen rige amerikanere,

who are stashing their assets offshore.

som gemmer deres værdier offshore.

It's just because of the way in which offshore works,

Det er bare på grund af den måde offshore fungerer på,

Mossack Fonseca has fewer American clients.

Mossack Fonseca har færre amerikanske klienter.

I think if we saw leaks from the Cayman Islands

Jeg tror, at hvis vi så et læk fra Caymanøerne

or even from Delaware or Wyoming or Nevada,

eller endda Delaware, eller Wyoming eller Nevada,

you would see many more cases and examples linking back to Americans.

ville man se flere tilfælde og eksempler, der går tilbage til amerikanere.

In fact, in a number of US states you need less information,

Faktisk skal man i mange amerikanske stater

skaffe færre oplysninger for at starte et firma,

you need to provide less information to get a company

than you do to get a library card.

end du skal for at få et lånerkort til biblioteket.

That sort of secrecy in America has allowed employees of school districts

Den form for hemmeligholdelse har gjort det muligt for ansatte i skoledistrikter

to rip off schoolchildren.

at snyde skolebørn.

It has allowed scammers to rip off vulnerable investors.

Det har tilladt svindlere at snyde sårbare investorer.

This is the sort of behavior that affects all of us.

Dette er den form for adfærd, der påvirker os alle sammen.

Now, at Global Witness,

Hos Global Witness

we wanted to see what this actually looked like in practice.

ville vi se, hvordan dette rent faktisk så ud i praksis

How does this actually work?

Hvordan fungerer det egentlig?

So what we did

Det, vi gjorde var,

is we sent in an undercover investigator to 13 Manhattan law firms.

at vi sendte en undercover efterforsker til tretten advokatfirmaer på Manhattan.

Our investigator posed as an African minister

Vores efterforsker optrådte som en afrikansk minister,

who wanted to move suspect funds into the United States

som ønskede at flytte mistænkelige midler til USA

to buy a house, a yacht, a jet.

for at købe et hus, en yacht, et jetfly.

Now, what was truly shocking was that all but one of those lawyers

Det der var virkelig chokerende var, at alle advokaterne undtagen én

provided our investigator with suggestions

forsynede vores efterforsker med forslag

on how to move those suspect funds.

til hvordan, man kan flytte disse mistænkelige midler.

These were all preliminary meetings,

Det var alle indledende møder,

and none of the lawyers took us on as a client

og ingen af advokaterne valgte at repræsentere os,

and of course no money moved hands,

og selvfølgelig var der ingen penge, der skiftede hænder,

but it really shows the problem with the system.

men det viser virkelig det problem, der er med systemet.

It's also important

Det er også vigtigt

to not just think about this as individual cases.

ikke bare at se dette som en individuel sag.

This is not just about an individual lawyer

Dette handler ikke kun om en enkelt advokat,

who's spoken to our undercover investigator and provided suggestions.

som har snakket med vores undercover efterforsker og kommet med forslag.

It's not just about a particular senior politician

Det handler ikke kun om en enkelt, højtstående politiker,

who's been caught up in a scandal.

som er blevet taget i en skandale.

This is about how a system works,

Det her handler om, hvordan systemet

that entrenches corruption, tax evasion, poverty and instability.

forankrer korruption, skatteunddragelse, fattigdom og ustabilitet.

And in order to tackle this,

For at håndtere dette

we need to change the game.

bliver vi nødt til at ændre spillets regler,

We need to change the rules of the game

to make this sort of behavior harder.

så denne form for adfærd bliver sværere.

This may seem like doom and gloom,

Det virker måske lidt dystert og trist,

like there's nothing we can do about it,

som om vi ikke kan gøre noget ved det,

like nothing has ever changed,

som om der ikke er noget, der har ændret sig,

like there will always be rich and powerful individuals.

som om der altid vil være rige og magtfulde individer.

But as a natural optimist,

Men som en naturlig optimist

I do see that we are starting to get some change.

kan jeg se, at der er noget, der er ved at ændre sig.

Over the last couple of years,

Igennem de sidste par år

we've seen a real push towards greater transparency

har vi set en tendens til større gennemsigtighed,

when it comes to company ownership.

når det kommer til ejerskab af virksomheder.

This issue was put on the political agenda

Dette emne var sat på den politiske dagsorden

by the UK Prime Minister David Cameron

af Storbritanniens premierminister David Cameron

at a big G8 Summit that was held in Northern Ireland in 2013.

ved G8-topmødet, der blev afholdt i Nordirland i 2013.

And since then, the European Union is going to be creating

Og siden da er EU gået i gang med at skabe

central registers at a national level

et nationalt centralregister over hvem,

of who really owns and controls companies across Europe.

der virkelig ejer og styrer virksomheder i Europa.

One of the things that is sad is that, actually, the US is lagging behind.

Det triste er, at USA faktisk sakker bagud.

There's bipartisan legislation that had been introduced

Der findes en tværpolitisk lovgivning, der er blevet introduceret i

in the House and the Senate,

Repræsentanternes hus og Senatet,

but it isn't making as much progress as we'd like to see.

men der er ikke så meget fremgang, som vi gerne ville se.

So we'd really want to see the Panama leaks,

Vi ville gerne se Panama papirerne,

this huge peek into the offshore world,

dette kæmpe indblik ind i offshore verdenen,

be used as a way of opening up in the US and around the world.

blive brugt som en måde at åbne op på i USA og rundt omkring i verden.

For us at Global Witness, this is a moment for change.

For os her hos Global Witness er dette en tid for forandring.

We need ordinary people to get angry

Vi har brug for, at almindelige mennesker bliver sure

at the way in which people can hide their identity

over den måde, man kan skjule sin identitet på

behind secret companies.

ved at gemme sig bag hemmelige selskaber.

We need business leaders to stand up and say,

Vi har brug for at virksomhedsledere rejser sig og siger,

"Secrecy like this is not good for business."

"Hemmeligholdelse på denne måde er ikke godt for erhvervslivet."

We need political leaders to recognize the problem,

Vi har brug for, at politiske ledere anerkender problemet

and to commit to changing the law to open up this sort of secrecy.

og forpligter sig til at ændre lovgivningen for at åbne op for denne hemmeligholdelse.

Together, we can end the secrecy

Sammen kan vi ændre denne hemmeligholdelse,

that is currently allowing tax evasion,

som lige nu tillader skatteunddragelse,

corruption, money laundering to flourish.

korruption og hvidvaskning af penge.