The Panama Papers exposed a huge global problem. What's next? | Robert Palmer

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2016-05-02 ・ TED


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The Panama Papers exposed a huge global problem. What's next? | Robert Palmer

136,353 views ・ 2016-05-02

TED


Dvaput kliknite na engleske titlove ispod za reprodukciju videozapisa.

Prevoditelj: Dario Lecic Recezent: Ivan Stamenković
00:13
[On April 3, 2016 we saw the largest data leak in history.]
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[3. travnja 2016. svjedočili smo najvećem curenju podataka u povijesti.]
00:18
[The Panama Papers exposed rich and powerful people]
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[Panamski papiri otkrili su da mnogi bogati i utjecajni ljudi]
00:20
[hiding vast amounts of money in offshore accounts.]
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[skrivaju ogromne količine novca na tzv. "offshore" računima.]
00:23
[What does this mean?]
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[Što to znači?]
00:27
[We called Robert Palmer of Global Witness to explain.]
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[Pozvali smo Roberta Palmera iz agencije Global Witness da objasni.]
00:32
This week, there have been a whole slew and deluge of stories
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Ovog tjedna mogli smo čuti ogromnu količinu priča
00:37
coming out from the leak of 11 million documents
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proizašlih iz curenja 11 milijuna dokumenata
00:41
from a Panamanian-based law firm called Mossack Fonseca.
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iz panamske odvjetničke tvrtke Mossack Fonseca.
00:45
The release of these papers from Panama lifts the veil on a tiny piece
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Puštanje ovih "panamskih papira" u javnost podiže veo tajne
00:51
of the secretive offshore world.
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kojim je obavijen offshore svijet.
00:53
We get an insight into how clients and banks and lawyers
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Dobivamo uvid u to kako klijenti i banke i odvjetnici
00:58
go to companies like Mossack Fonseca
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prilaze tvrtkama kao što je Mossack Fonseca
01:01
and say, "OK, we want an anonymous company,
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i kažu: "OK, želimo anonimnu tvrtku,
01:03
can you give us one?"
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možete li nam je napraviti?"
01:04
So you actually get to see the emails,
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Možete vidjeti e-mailove,
01:06
you get to see the exchanges of messages,
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možete vidjeti razmijenjene poruke,
01:08
you get to see the mechanics of how this works,
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možete zaviriti iza kulisa i vidjeti kako to funkcionira,
01:11
how this operates.
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kako to rade.
01:13
Now, this has already started to have pretty immediate repercussions.
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Neposredni odjeci ove situacije već su vidljivi.
01:17
The Prime Minister of Iceland has resigned.
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Islandski premijer dao je ostavku.
01:20
We've also had news
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Također dobivamo informacije
01:21
that an ally of the brutal Syrian dictator Bashar Al-Assad
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da saveznik brutalnog sirijskog diktatora Bashara Al-Assada
01:26
has also got offshore companies.
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01:28
There's been allegations of a $2 billion money trail
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Postoje naznake o 2 milijarde američkih dolara
01:34
that leads back to President Vladimir Putin of Russia
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koje vuku porijeklo od ruskog predsjednika Vladimira Putina
01:38
via his close childhood friend,
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preko njegovog prijatelja iz djetinjstva,
01:40
who happens to be a top cellist.
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danas vrhunskog čelista.
01:42
And there will be a lot of rich individuals out there
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Još će mnogo bogatih pojedinaca
01:45
and others who will be nervous about the next set of stories
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nemirno spavati do objave sljedećeg kompleta članaka
01:49
and the next set of leaked documents.
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i sljedećeg kompleta dokumenata.
01:52
Now, this sounds like the plot of a spy thriller
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Sve ovo zvuči kao radnja nekog špijunskog romana
01:56
or a John Grisham novel.
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proizašlog iz pera Johna Grishama.
01:58
It seems very distant from you, me, ordinary people.
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Čini se da nema previše veze s vama, sa mnom, s običnim ljudima.
02:02
Why should we care about this?
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Zašto bi to trebalo zanimati nas?
02:04
But the truth is that if rich and powerful individuals
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Međutim, realnost je ta da ako su bogati i utjecajni pojedinci
02:09
are able to keep their money offshore
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u mogućnosti držati svoj novac "offshore"
02:11
and not pay the taxes that they should,
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i ne plaćati poreze koje bi trebali,
02:14
it means that there is less money for vital public services
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to znači da ostaje manje novca za ključne javne službe
02:18
like healthcare, education, roads.
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poput zdravstva, obrazovanja ili cesta.
02:21
And that affects all of us.
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I to onda utječe na sve nas.
02:24
Now, for my organization Global Witness,
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Za moju organizaciju Global Witness,
02:26
this exposé has been phenomenal.
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ovo otkriće bilo je senzacionalno.
02:30
We have the world's media and political leaders
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Napokon možemo čuti svjetske medije i političke vođe
02:35
talking about how individuals can use offshore secrecy
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kako raspravljaju o načinima na koje pojedinci mogu upotrijebiti
02:40
to hide and disguise their assets --
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offshore tajnost za prikrivanje stvarne vrijednosti svoje imovine
02:42
something we have been talking about and exposing for a decade.
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I to je ono o čemu mi govorimo i što otkrivamo već desetljećima.
02:47
Now, I think a lot of people find this entire world baffling and confusing,
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Čini mi se da većina ljudi smatra sav taj svijet zapanjujućim i zbunjujućim
02:52
and hard to understand how this sort of offshore world works.
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i ne razumiju u potpunosti kako cijeli "offshore" svijet funkcionira.
02:56
I like to think of it a bit like a Russian doll.
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Ja ga često zamišljam kao rusku lutku babušku.
02:59
So you can have one company stacked inside another company,
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Znači, možete imati jednu tvrtku unutar druge tvrtke
03:02
stacked inside another company,
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koja je pak dio treće tvrtke
03:05
making it almost impossible to really understand
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da na kraju postaje nemoguće razumjeti
03:09
who is behind these structures.
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tko stoji iza svih tih struktura.
03:11
It can be very difficult for law enforcement
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Organima vlasti, poreznicima, novinarima pa i javnosti
03:14
or tax authorities, journalists, civil society
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postaje vrlo teško razumjeti
03:17
to really understand what's going on.
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što se zapravo događa.
03:20
I also think it's interesting
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Također je vrlo zanimljivo
03:21
that there's been less coverage of this issue in the United States.
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da ova situacija nije toliko jako popraćena u SAD-u.
03:25
And that's perhaps because some prominent US people
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I to je vjerojatno zato što američki moćnici
03:28
just haven't figured in this exposé, in this scandal.
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nisu spominjani u ovom posljednjem skandalu.
03:33
Now, that's not because there are no rich Americans
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Naravno, to nije zbog toga što ne postoje bogati Amerikanci
03:37
who are stashing their assets offshore.
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koji spremaju svoj novac offshore,
03:40
It's just because of the way in which offshore works,
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već jednostavno, zbog načina na koji offshore funkcionira,
03:43
Mossack Fonseca has fewer American clients.
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Mossack Fonseca ima nešto manje američkih klijenata.
03:47
I think if we saw leaks from the Cayman Islands
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U slučaju da se dogodi curenje informacija s Kajmanskih otoka
03:50
or even from Delaware or Wyoming or Nevada,
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ili čak iz Delawarea, Wyominga ili Nevade,
03:54
you would see many more cases and examples linking back to Americans.
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vidjeli biste mnogo više primjera koji vode do nekog Amerikanca.
04:00
In fact, in a number of US states you need less information,
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Štoviše, u nekim američkim saveznim državama
04:06
you need to provide less information to get a company
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za osnivanje neke tvrtke potrebno je dati manje podataka
04:10
than you do to get a library card.
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nego što je potrebno za dobivanje iskaznice u knjižnici.
04:13
That sort of secrecy in America has allowed employees of school districts
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Ovakva vrsta tajnosti podataka u Americi omogućila je zaposlenicima školskih okruga
04:19
to rip off schoolchildren.
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da varaju školarce.
04:20
It has allowed scammers to rip off vulnerable investors.
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Omogućila je prevarantima da pokrada ranjive investitore.
04:26
This is the sort of behavior that affects all of us.
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Ovakav tip ponašanja utječe na sve nas.
04:30
Now, at Global Witness,
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Ovdje u Global Witnessu
04:32
we wanted to see what this actually looked like in practice.
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željeli smo provjeriti kako sve ovo izgleda u praksi.
04:35
How does this actually work?
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Kako to zapravo funkcionira?
04:37
So what we did
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Stoga smo poslali tajnog istražitelja
04:38
is we sent in an undercover investigator to 13 Manhattan law firms.
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na adrese 13 odvjetničkih firmi na Manhattanu.
04:45
Our investigator posed as an African minister
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Predstavio im se kao afrički ministar
04:49
who wanted to move suspect funds into the United States
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koji želi prebaciti nezakonito stečena sredstva u SAD
04:53
to buy a house, a yacht, a jet.
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kako bi kupio kuću, ili jahtu, ili avion.
04:57
Now, what was truly shocking was that all but one of those lawyers
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Ono što nas je šokiralo je da su svi osim jednog odvjetnika
05:02
provided our investigator with suggestions
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našem istražitelju dali prijedloge
05:06
on how to move those suspect funds.
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na koji način može prebaciti ta sredstva.
05:08
These were all preliminary meetings,
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To su sve bili pripremni razgovori
05:10
and none of the lawyers took us on as a client
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te nas nijedan odvjetnik nije primio za klijente
05:13
and of course no money moved hands,
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i naravno, nikakav novac nije promijenio vlasnika,
05:15
but it really shows the problem with the system.
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ali već i ovo pokazuje probleme u sustavu.
05:18
It's also important
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Također je vrlo važno
05:20
to not just think about this as individual cases.
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da se na ovo ne gleda kao na pojedinačne slučajeve.
05:24
This is not just about an individual lawyer
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Ovdje nije riječ o pojedinom odvjetniku
05:26
who's spoken to our undercover investigator and provided suggestions.
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koji je razgovarao s našim istražiteljem i dao mu par prijedloga.
05:30
It's not just about a particular senior politician
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Nije ni riječ o pojedinom političaru
05:33
who's been caught up in a scandal.
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koji je uhvaćen u skandalu.
05:34
This is about how a system works,
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Ovdje je riječ o tome kako funkcionira sustav,
05:37
that entrenches corruption, tax evasion, poverty and instability.
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sustav koji omogućava korupciju, neplaćanje poreza, siromaštvo i nestabilnost.
05:43
And in order to tackle this,
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Kako bismo se suočili s tim problemom,
05:45
we need to change the game.
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moramo promijeniti igru.
05:47
We need to change the rules of the game
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Moramo promijeniti pravila igre
05:50
to make this sort of behavior harder.
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kako bismo otežali ovakav tip ponašanja.
05:52
This may seem like doom and gloom,
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Možda izgleda tmurno,
05:54
like there's nothing we can do about it,
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možda izgleda da ne možemo učiniti ništa,
05:56
like nothing has ever changed,
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da se nikad ništa nije promijenilo,
05:58
like there will always be rich and powerful individuals.
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da će uvijek postojati bogati i moćni pojedinci.
06:01
But as a natural optimist,
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Ali kao optimistu po prirodi,
06:04
I do see that we are starting to get some change.
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izgleda mi da se neke promjene događaju.
06:07
Over the last couple of years,
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U posljednjih nekoliko godina
06:09
we've seen a real push towards greater transparency
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bili smo svjedoci stvarnom nastojanju da se uvede transparentnost
06:13
when it comes to company ownership.
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po pitanju vlasništva tvrtki.
06:15
This issue was put on the political agenda
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Ovu temu je na dnevni red stavio
06:18
by the UK Prime Minister David Cameron
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britanski premijer David Cameron
06:20
at a big G8 Summit that was held in Northern Ireland in 2013.
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na velikom skupu G8 održanom 2013. u Sjevernoj Irskoj.
06:25
And since then, the European Union is going to be creating
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Nakon toga, Europska unija odlučila je stvoriti
06:30
central registers at a national level
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središnje državne registre koji će pratiti
06:32
of who really owns and controls companies across Europe.
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tko zapravo posjeduje i kontrolira tvrtke diljem Europe.
06:35
One of the things that is sad is that, actually, the US is lagging behind.
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Ono što je razočaravajuće je da SAD zaostaje po tom pitanju.
06:40
There's bipartisan legislation that had been introduced
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Zakoni o ovome već su na dnevnom redu
06:43
in the House and the Senate,
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Kongresa i Senata,
06:45
but it isn't making as much progress as we'd like to see.
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ali ne napreduju tako brzo kao što bismo željeli.
06:48
So we'd really want to see the Panama leaks,
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Stoga bismo zaista željeli da "panamski papiri",
06:51
this huge peek into the offshore world,
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taj značajan pogled u offshore svijet,
06:55
be used as a way of opening up in the US and around the world.
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posluže kao način otvaranja, kako u SAD-u tako i u svijetu.
07:00
For us at Global Witness, this is a moment for change.
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Za nas u Global Witnessu, ovo je trenutak promjena.
07:05
We need ordinary people to get angry
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Potrebni su nam obični pojedinci
07:09
at the way in which people can hide their identity
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koji su ljutiti zbog načina na koji pojedinci
07:12
behind secret companies.
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mogu sakriti svoje identitete iza tajnih kompanija.
07:14
We need business leaders to stand up and say,
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Potrebni su nam poslovni vođe koji će se ustati i reći:
07:18
"Secrecy like this is not good for business."
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"Ovakva vrsta tajnosti nije dobra za poslovanje."
07:21
We need political leaders to recognize the problem,
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Potrebni su nam politčki vođe koji će prepoznati problem
07:26
and to commit to changing the law to open up this sort of secrecy.
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i usredotočiti se na mijenjanje zakona koji bi razotkrili takvu tajnovitost.
07:31
Together, we can end the secrecy
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Zajedno možemo stati na kraj ovoj tajnosti
07:34
that is currently allowing tax evasion,
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koja trenutno dopušta cvjetanje izbjegavanja plaćanja poreza,
07:38
corruption, money laundering to flourish.
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korupcije i pranja novca.
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