How economic inequality harms societies | Richard Wilkinson

1,126,213 views ・ 2011-10-24

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譯者: Yung Hsiang Tseng 審譯者: Ana Choi
00:15
You all know the truth of what I'm going to say.
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相信各位都知道我接下來要說什麼。
00:18
I think the intuition that inequality is divisive and socially corrosive
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我認為,「不平等」會腐蝕與破壞社會的穩定性,
00:22
has been around since before the French Revolution.
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這種思潮在法國大革命前就已經出現。
00:26
What's changed
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唯一不同的是,
00:28
is we now can look at the evidence,
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現在我們有足夠的資料
00:30
we can compare societies, more and less equal societies,
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來比較各個國家的社會型態,分析誰比較平等或不平等,
00:33
and see what inequality does.
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並看看何謂真正的「不平等」。
00:36
I'm going to take you through that data
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待會我會給各位看各種數據,
00:39
and then explain why
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並且跟各位說明
00:41
the links I'm going to be showing you exist.
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這些數據之間是存在著關聯性的。
00:45
But first, see what a miserable lot we are.
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在這之前,先來看看現代人有多慘。
00:48
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
00:50
I want to start though
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首先讓我們來看看
00:52
with a paradox.
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一個矛盾的現象。
00:55
This shows you life expectancy
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這張圖呈現了平均壽命
00:57
against gross national income --
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與國民總收入(Gross National Income, GNI)
00:59
how rich countries are on average.
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之間的關係。
01:01
And you see the countries on the right,
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各位可以看到在右邊的國家
01:03
like Norway and the USA,
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像是挪威與美國,
01:05
are twice as rich as Israel, Greece, Portugal on the left.
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總收入是左邊國家的兩倍,像是以色列、希臘、葡萄牙。
01:10
And it makes no difference to their life expectancy at all.
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但這五個國家的平均壽命並沒有太大差別。
01:14
There's no suggestion of a relationship there.
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因此它們之間並沒有任何關係存在。
01:16
But if we look within our societies,
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但是,看看我們的社會(譯註:這裡指英國),
01:19
there are extraordinary social gradients in health
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平均壽命與財富之間
01:22
running right across society.
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卻呈現負斜率的關係。
01:24
This, again, is life expectancy.
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縱軸代表平均壽命。
01:26
These are small areas of England and Wales --
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橫軸代表英格蘭與威爾斯地區的人民富裕程度--
01:28
the poorest on the right, the richest on the left.
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愈右邊代表愈窮,愈左邊代表愈富裕。
01:32
A lot of difference between the poor and the rest of us.
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財富與壽命之間存在強烈的關聯性。
01:35
Even the people just below the top
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財富稍微少一點的人
01:37
have less good health
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比起財富稍微多一點的人
01:39
than the people at the top.
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平均壽命便有些微的差距。
01:41
So income means something very important
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所以對現代社會而言
01:43
within our societies,
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收入是非常重要的,
01:45
and nothing between them.
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沒有人可以否定
01:48
The explanation of that paradox
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要解釋這種矛盾的現象
01:51
is that, within our societies,
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必須先檢視一下我們的社會
01:53
we're looking at relative income
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這裡要探討的是「相對收入」
01:55
or social position, social status --
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也可以稱作「社會地位」--
01:58
where we are in relation to each other
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每個人或多或少都會感覺到
02:01
and the size of the gaps between us.
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自己比別人窮或比別人富有。
02:04
And as soon as you've got that idea,
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有了這種想法以後
02:06
you should immediately wonder:
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各位一定會想知道
02:08
what happens if we widen the differences,
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如果我比現在更富有
02:11
or compress them,
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或是更窮的話
02:13
make the income differences bigger or smaller?
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會變成什麼情況呢?
02:15
And that's what I'm going to show you.
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這就是待會兒我要跟各位探討的東西。
02:18
I'm not using any hypothetical data.
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我不會使用假設性的數據。
02:20
I'm taking data from the U.N. --
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以下的數據來自聯合國
02:22
it's the same as the World Bank has --
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跟世界銀行的數據是一樣的--
02:24
on the scale of income differences
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該數據說明一些自由競爭市場的國家,
02:26
in these rich developed market democracies.
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它們國內的貧富差距。
02:29
The measure we've used,
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我們來看看這張圖表,
02:31
because it's easy to understand and you can download it,
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非常簡單易懂,各位也能從網路自行下載,
02:33
is how much richer the top 20 percent
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它呈現出在每個國家裡面
02:35
than the bottom 20 percent in each country.
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前20%富有以及前20%貧窮人口之間的貧富差距。
02:38
And you see in the more equal countries on the left --
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左邊的國家財富分配比較均等
02:41
Japan, Finland, Norway, Sweden --
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像是日本、芬蘭、挪威、瑞典--
02:43
the top 20 percent are about three and a half, four times as rich
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富人與窮人之間的貧富差距
02:45
as the bottom 20 percent.
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相差大約3.5倍到4倍之間。
02:48
But on the more unequal end --
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但是那些財富分配不均的國家--
02:50
U.K., Portugal, USA, Singapore --
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像是英國、葡萄牙、美國、新加坡--
02:52
the differences are twice as big.
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貧富差距比左邊的國家整整多了一倍。
02:55
On that measure, we are twice as unequal
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由此可見,相較於其他自由競爭市場的國家
02:58
as some of the other successful market democracies.
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我們國家的經濟失衡程度整整多了一倍。
03:02
Now I'm going to show you what that does to our societies.
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現在讓我們來看看,這種現象對我們的社會有何影響。
03:06
We collected data on problems with social gradients,
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我蒐集了各種社會現象與問題的數據,
03:09
the kind of problems that are more common
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在社會底層的人民之中
03:11
at the bottom of the social ladder.
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這些問題會更為明顯。
03:13
Internationally comparable data on life expectancy,
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我統計的數據包括平均壽命,
03:16
on kids' maths and literacy scores,
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兒童的數學與識字能力,
03:19
on infant mortality rates, homicide rates,
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嬰兒死亡率、兇殺案發生率,
03:22
proportion of the population in prison, teenage birthrates,
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監獄內的人口與總人口的比例、未成年少女的生育率,
03:25
levels of trust,
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人民之間的信賴程度,
03:27
obesity, mental illness --
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過度肥胖、心理疾病--
03:29
which in standard diagnostic classification
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這裡所謂的心理疾病,依照標準的診斷分類
03:32
includes drug and alcohol addiction --
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也包括毒癮與酒癮--
03:34
and social mobility.
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最後一個項目則是社會流動率。
03:36
We put them all in one index.
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我們將以上數據整合成一個指數。
03:39
They're all weighted equally.
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每筆數據之間都經過均衡的運算。
03:41
Where a country is is a sort of average score on these things.
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圖中這些國家的位置會反映出它們對該指數的平均表現。
03:44
And there, you see it
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現在,各位看到了
03:46
in relation to the measure of inequality I've just shown you,
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這張圖跟上一張圖之間的關係
03:49
which I shall use over and over again in the data.
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這種關係,之後仍會不斷地提到
03:52
The more unequal countries
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經濟失衡愈嚴重的國家,
03:54
are doing worse
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對於上述社會問題與現象的指數
03:56
on all these kinds of social problems.
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平均表現會愈差。
03:58
It's an extraordinarily close correlation.
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兩者之間有著緊密的關聯性。
04:01
But if you look at that same index
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但如果使用相同的指數
04:03
of health and social problems
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也就是上述的各種社會問題與現象
04:05
in relation to GNP per capita,
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與國民生產毛額,
04:07
gross national income,
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或是國民總收入比較的話,
04:09
there's nothing there,
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這兩者之間
04:11
no correlation anymore.
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就不會有任何關聯。
04:14
We were a little bit worried
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我們有點擔心
04:16
that people might think
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或許有人會認為
04:18
we'd been choosing problems to suit our argument
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我們只選了支持我們理論的數據,
04:20
and just manufactured this evidence,
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甚至連數據都是偽造的,
04:23
so we also did a paper in the British Medical Journal
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所以我們也在「英國醫學雜誌」發表了一篇文章
04:26
on the UNICEF index of child well-being.
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採用了聯合國兒童基金會的兒童福利指數。
04:30
It has 40 different components
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該指數由另一個研究團隊所整合
04:32
put together by other people.
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涵蓋了40種不同的變數。
04:34
It contains whether kids can talk to their parents,
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包括兒童是否能跟父母溝通,
04:37
whether they have books at home,
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家裡有沒有書本,
04:39
what immunization rates are like, whether there's bullying at school.
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接種疫苗的比率、有無校園霸凌。
04:42
Everything goes into it.
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可以說包羅萬有。
04:44
Here it is in relation to that same measure of inequality.
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然後我們拿這個指數與先前的資料作比較。
04:48
Kids do worse in the more unequal societies.
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發現經濟失衡愈嚴重,兒童的福利就愈差。
04:51
Highly significant relationship.
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兩者之間依然有強烈的關聯性。
04:54
But once again,
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儘管如此,
04:56
if you look at that measure of child well-being,
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如果我們再把這個兒童福利指數
04:59
in relation to national income per person,
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拿來與國民總收入做比較,
05:01
there's no relationship,
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兩者依然沒有任何關聯,
05:03
no suggestion of a relationship.
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一點邊都沾不上。
05:06
What all the data I've shown you so far says
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從開始演講到現在我說了那麼多
05:09
is the same thing.
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其實都在講同一件事
05:11
The average well-being of our societies
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那就是社會的安樂與穩定
05:13
is not dependent any longer
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與國民收入或是經濟成長之間
05:16
on national income and economic growth.
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是一點關係也沒有。
05:19
That's very important in poorer countries,
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這對於已開發國家而言或許沒什麼,
05:21
but not in the rich developed world.
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但對貧困國家的影響很大。
05:24
But the differences between us
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不過,如果撇開國家的立場不談,
05:26
and where we are in relation to each other
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改以人的立場來觀察的話,
05:28
now matter very much.
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對我們就影響深遠。
05:31
I'm going to show you some of the separate bits of our index.
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現在,我把剛剛提到的各種數據拆開來探討。
05:34
Here, for instance, is trust.
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就拿「信賴程度」來舉例吧。
05:36
It's simply the proportion of the population
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這張圖顯示了一個國家的人與人之間
05:38
who agree most people can be trusted.
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對於彼此的信賴程度。
05:40
It comes from the World Values Survey.
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統計資料來自「世界價值觀調查協會」。
05:42
You see, at the more unequal end,
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在經濟失衡較嚴重的國家,
05:44
it's about 15 percent of the population
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只有15%的人
05:47
who feel they can trust others.
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認為彼此可以信任。
05:49
But in the more equal societies,
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但是在經濟發展均衡的國家,
05:51
it rises to 60 or 65 percent.
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卻有60%~65%的人口可以彼此信任。
05:55
And if you look at measures of involvement in community life
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如果把圖的縱軸改成社會參與度
05:58
or social capital,
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或是社會資本的動用,
06:00
very similar relationships
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得到的結果都非常相似,
06:02
closely related to inequality.
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都跟經濟失衡與否存在強烈的關係。
06:05
I may say, we did all this work twice.
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事實上,這份調查工作我們作了兩次。
06:08
We did it first on these rich, developed countries,
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第一次是以已開發國家為對象,
06:11
and then as a separate test bed,
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並把得到的數據當作實驗平台,
06:13
we repeated it all on the 50 American states --
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然後對全美國的五十個州作相同的調查--
06:16
asking just the same question:
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問他們相同的問題:
06:18
do the more unequal states
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也就是問他們是否認為經濟失衡較嚴重的州
06:20
do worse on all these kinds of measures?
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對於上述各種社會問題的表現比較差?
06:22
So here is trust from a general social survey of the federal government
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這張圖就是針對美國人民所作的調查結果,
06:26
related to inequality.
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同樣是經濟失衡與信賴程度之間的關係。
06:28
Very similar scatter
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最後得到的結果
06:30
over a similar range of levels of trust.
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與前幾張圖極為相似。
06:32
Same thing is going on.
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同一件事在各地都是相同的結果。
06:34
Basically we found
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基本上,我們發現
06:36
that almost anything that's related to trust internationally
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根據我們的實驗平台裡的所有資料
06:39
is related to trust amongst the 50 states
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在國際上跟「信賴程度」有關的調查中
06:41
in that separate test bed.
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其結果跟美國內部的調查結果都極為相似。
06:43
We're not just talking about a fluke.
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這絕對不是歪打正著。
06:45
This is mental illness.
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這張圖的縱軸換成了心理疾病。
06:47
WHO put together figures
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數據來自世界衛生組織,
06:49
using the same diagnostic interviews
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他們隨機挑選各國的人民
06:51
on random samples of the population
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並經由問診而得到這些資料,
06:53
to allow us to compare rates of mental illness
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這些資料讓我們得以分析在各個社會之中
06:56
in each society.
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擁有心理疾病的人口比例。
06:58
This is the percent of the population
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縱軸代表的就是在前幾年之中
07:00
with any mental illness in the preceding year.
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擁有心理疾病的人口佔總人口的比例。
07:03
And it goes from about eight percent
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比例最低與最高的國家之間
07:06
up to three times that --
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足足差了三倍--
07:08
whole societies
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這代表整個美國社會
07:10
with three times the level of mental illness of others.
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有四分之一的人口患有心理疾病。
07:13
And again, closely related to inequality.
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當然,這與經濟失衡有著高度關聯。
07:17
This is violence.
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這張圖的縱軸是兇殺案發生率。
07:19
These red dots are American states,
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紅點代表美國各州的比率,
07:21
and the blue triangles are Canadian provinces.
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藍色三角形則代表加拿大各省。
07:25
But look at the scale of the differences.
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兩種圖形的分布位置有些許不同。
07:28
It goes from 15 homicides per million
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每一百萬人中,兇殺案的發生數介於15宗
07:31
up to 150.
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到150宗之間。
07:34
This is the proportion of the population in prison.
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這張圖的縱軸則是監獄內人口與總人口的比例。
07:37
There's a about a tenfold difference there,
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不過刻度是採用對數刻度,
07:40
log scale up the side.
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最低與最高比例相差約十倍。
07:42
But it goes from about 40 to 400
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從四十人到四百人都有,
07:44
people in prison.
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相差不小。
07:47
That relationship
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這種現象的產生
07:49
is not mainly driven by more crime.
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並不單純與犯罪率有關。
07:51
In some places, that's part of it.
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犯罪率只是其中一種因素。
07:54
But most of it is about more punitive sentencing,
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主要因素來自於
07:56
harsher sentencing.
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過於嚴厲或粗糙的判決。
07:58
And the more unequal societies
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在經濟失衡較嚴重的國家
08:00
are more likely also to retain the death penalty.
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執行死刑的比率也比較高。
08:04
Here we have children dropping out of high school.
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這張圖的縱軸則換成了中學生的退學率。
08:09
Again, quite big differences.
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最低與最高比率之間依然差異很大。
08:11
Extraordinarily damaging,
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這對於人才的發掘,
08:13
if you're talking about using the talents of the population.
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會造很大的損失。
08:16
This is social mobility.
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這張圖的縱軸代表社會流動率。
08:19
It's actually a measure of mobility
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這裡呈現的是以收入為基準
08:21
based on income.
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來推算出的流動率。
08:23
Basically, it's asking:
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講白話一點,它就是在問:
08:25
do rich fathers have rich sons
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富人的父親也是富人嗎?
08:27
and poor fathers have poor sons,
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窮人的父親也是窮人嗎?
08:29
or is there no relationship between the two?
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或是根本一點關係也沒有?
08:32
And at the more unequal end,
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在經濟失衡較嚴重的國家,
08:34
fathers' income is much more important --
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像是英國跟美國--
08:37
in the U.K., USA.
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你父親的財產就非常重要。
08:40
And in Scandinavian countries,
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相反地,在斯堪地納維亞地區的國家,
08:42
fathers' income is much less important.
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你父親的財產就比較無關緊要了。
08:44
There's more social mobility.
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因為社會流動率很高。
08:47
And as we like to say --
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因此,我給各位一些建議--
08:49
and I know there are a lot of Americans in the audience here --
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我知道在座的觀眾之中有很多是美國人--
08:52
if Americans want to live the American dream,
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如果美國人想完成他們的美國夢的話,
08:55
they should go to Denmark.
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最好是往丹麥發展。
08:57
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
08:59
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
09:03
I've shown you just a few things in italics here.
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斜體字的部分我們剛剛已經討論過了。
09:06
I could have shown a number of other problems.
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現在我們來看看其他的社會問題。
09:08
They're all problems that tend to be more common
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這些問題在下層社會之間
09:10
at the bottom of the social gradient.
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愈來愈普遍。
09:12
But there are endless problems with social gradients
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不過,新的社會問題層出不窮,
09:17
that are worse in more unequal countries --
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經濟失衡愈嚴重的國家受害愈大--
09:19
not just a little bit worse,
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這些損害不是一點點而已,
09:21
but anything from twice as common to 10 times as common.
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甚至還有可能持續不斷地擴大。
09:24
Think of the expense,
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像是物價持續上漲,
09:26
the human cost of that.
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人民終有一天會吃不消。
09:29
I want to go back though to this graph that I showed you earlier
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現在我們回過頭來看看這張圖
09:31
where we put it all together
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綜合所有的資料後,
09:33
to make two points.
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可以得到兩點結論。
09:35
One is that, in graph after graph,
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其一,在這一張張的圖表之中,
09:38
we find the countries that do worse,
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我們可以發現,社會問題愈多的國家,
09:40
whatever the outcome,
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不論它們的現況為何,
09:42
seem to be the more unequal ones,
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愈有可能成為經濟嚴重失衡的國家,
09:44
and the ones that do well
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反之亦然
09:46
seem to be the Nordic countries and Japan.
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看看北歐國家或日本就能了解。
09:49
So what we're looking at
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因此我們可以篤定
09:51
is general social disfunction related to inequality.
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社會的失常與經濟失衡有絕對的關係。
09:54
It's not just one or two things that go wrong,
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並不是只有一兩件事出問題,
09:56
it's most things.
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而是整個社會都有問題。
09:58
The other really important point I want to make on this graph
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其二,也是很重要的一點,
10:01
is that, if you look at the bottom,
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請各位看看這張圖的底部,
10:03
Sweden and Japan,
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也就是瑞典與日本,
10:06
they're very different countries in all sorts of ways.
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就各種面向而言,這是兩個差異極大的國家。
10:09
The position of women,
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像是婦女的社會地位,
10:11
how closely they keep to the nuclear family,
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或是對核能的觀點,
10:13
are on opposite ends of the poles
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都有著天差地別的見解,
10:15
in terms of the rich developed world.
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儘管它們都同樣是高度開發國家。
10:17
But another really important difference
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不過,我們探討的重點在於
10:19
is how they get their greater equality.
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它們是如何做到經濟發展均衡的。
10:22
Sweden has huge differences in earnings,
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在瑞典,各種行業之間的工資差異不小,
10:25
and it narrows the gap through taxation,
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但是政府用稅收來彌補這段差距,
10:27
general welfare state,
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或是提供完善的社會福利,
10:29
generous benefits and so on.
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以及大量的補助津貼。
10:32
Japan is rather different though.
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日本的方法比較不一樣。
10:34
It starts off with much smaller differences in earnings before tax.
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它是以縮小工資差異的方法達成平衡。
10:37
It has lower taxes.
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因此稅賦相對地比較低。
10:39
It has a smaller welfare state.
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當然社會福利就差了一些。
10:41
And in our analysis of the American states,
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我們在分析美國的狀況時,
10:43
we find rather the same contrast.
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發現了一些相似的政策。
10:45
There are some states that do well through redistribution,
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某些州在所得重分配這方面表現不錯,
10:48
some states that do well
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這些州之所以表現不錯
10:50
because they have smaller income differences before tax.
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是因為它們的工資差異比較小。
10:53
So we conclude
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所以結論就是
10:55
that it doesn't much matter how you get your greater equality,
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要讓經濟均衡發展並沒有特定的方法,
10:58
as long as you get there somehow.
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重點是要用對方法。
11:00
I am not talking about perfect equality,
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我並不是在評論誰的做法比較好,
11:02
I'm talking about what exists in rich developed market democracies.
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我只是在闡述某些高度開發的自由競爭市場國家的情況。
11:08
Another really surprising part of this picture
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在下一張圖中,我們會看到另一項驚人的事實,
11:13
is that it's not just the poor
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那就是,不是只有窮人
11:15
who are affected by inequality.
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才會受到經濟失衡影響。
11:18
There seems to be some truth in John Donne's
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就好像約翰‧多恩(譯註:英國詩人)所說的
11:20
"No man is an island."
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「沒有人是一座孤島」。
11:23
And in a number of studies, it's possible to compare
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經由各項研究,我們可以比較
11:26
how people do in more and less equal countries
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各種社會階層的人民
11:29
at each level in the social hierarchy.
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如何受到經濟失衡的影響。
11:32
This is just one example.
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這張圖只是個例子。
11:35
It's infant mortality.
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討論的是嬰兒死亡率。
11:37
Some Swedes very kindly classified a lot of their infant deaths
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有些瑞典學者在統計嬰兒死亡率時
11:40
according to the British register of general socioeconomic classification.
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所採用的分類法,是根據英國社會經濟學的分類法來劃分。
11:45
And so it's anachronistically
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這種分類法有點不符合時代潮流,
11:48
a classification by fathers' occupations,
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因為它把父親的職業分成很多等級,
11:50
so single parents go on their own.
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卻把單親獨立成一個分類。
11:52
But then where it says "low social class,"
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圖中最左邊的「低階職業」
11:55
that's unskilled manual occupations.
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指的是不需要任何技術的勞動業。
11:58
It goes through towards the skilled manual occupations in the middle,
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往右邊指的是需要技術的勞動業,
12:02
then the junior non-manual,
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然後是比較不需要專業技能的非勞動業,
12:04
going up high to the professional occupations --
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最右邊則是需要專業知識的職業--
12:07
doctors, lawyers,
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像是醫生、律師,
12:09
directors of larger companies.
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或是大型公司的主管。
12:11
You see there that Sweden does better than Britain
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不論父親從事哪種等級的職業
12:14
all the way across the social hierarchy.
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瑞典人的嬰兒死亡率都比英國人低。
12:19
The biggest differences are at the bottom of society.
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尤其是社會底層的人民之間差異最大。
12:21
But even at the top,
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即使是上層社會的人民,
12:23
there seems to be a small benefit
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瑞典的表現仍然略勝一籌,
12:25
to being in a more equal society.
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足以證明瑞典的經濟失衡較不明顯。
12:27
We show that on about five different sets of data
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現在,我們已經看過了五種不同的數據,
12:30
covering educational outcomes
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包括教育、健康等問題,
12:32
and health in the United States and internationally.
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不管是美國內部還是國際上的數據都已經看過了。
12:35
And that seems to be the general picture --
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在這之中我們可以找到一個共同點--
12:38
that greater equality makes most difference at the bottom,
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那就是經濟失衡對社會底層的人民影響最大,
12:41
but has some benefits even at the top.
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對上層社會的影響相對較小。
12:44
But I should say a few words about what's going on.
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即使如此,有些事我還是不得不說。
12:48
I think I'm looking and talking
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現在,我們換個觀點來看問題,
12:50
about the psychosocial effects of inequality.
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從經濟失衡對心理層面的影響著手。
12:53
More to do with feelings of superiority and inferiority,
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人們會產生優越感或自卑感,
12:56
of being valued and devalued,
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對別人的褒貶特別在意,
12:58
respected and disrespected.
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也會去注意別人對你的態度。
13:01
And of course, those feelings
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當然,不可諱言地
13:03
of the status competition that comes out of that
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群眾的競爭心態其實來自於
13:06
drives the consumerism in our society.
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現今社會的消費主義(Consumerism)。
13:09
It also leads to status insecurity.
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另外,人們的安全感也會受到影響。
13:12
We worry more about how we're judged and seen by others,
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我們會很在意別人用什麼眼光看我們,
13:16
whether we're regarded as attractive, clever,
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我們的表現是否夠吸引人?夠知性?
13:19
all that kind of thing.
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諸如此類。
13:22
The social-evaluative judgments increase,
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愈在意別人的眼光
13:25
the fear of those social-evaluative judgments.
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就會愈沒有安全感。
13:29
Interestingly,
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有趣的是
13:31
some parallel work going on in social psychology:
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有社會心理學家曾作過以下的實驗:
13:35
some people reviewed 208 different studies
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他們分析了208件不同的案例,
13:38
in which volunteers had been invited
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實驗內容是,先邀請許多自願者
13:41
into a psychological laboratory
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進入心理實驗室,
13:43
and had their stress hormones,
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然後讓他們做一些充滿壓迫感的工作,
13:45
their responses to doing stressful tasks, measured.
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並觀察他們體內分泌的壓力荷爾蒙增加量。
13:49
And in the review,
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實驗結果非常地諷刺,
13:51
what they were interested in seeing
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他們發現有一種工作
13:53
is what kind of stresses
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會大量地增加
13:55
most reliably raise levels of cortisol,
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皮質醇的分泌量
13:58
the central stress hormone.
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也就是最主要的壓力荷爾蒙。
14:00
And the conclusion was
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這種工作就是
14:02
it was tasks that included social-evaluative threat --
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常會被社會大眾品頭論足的工作--
14:05
threats to self-esteem or social status
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人們會感到自尊或社會地位受到威脅
14:08
in which others can negatively judge your performance.
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因為你會害怕得到負面的評價。
14:11
Those kind of stresses
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來自別人眼光的壓力
14:13
have a very particular effect
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對一個人的影響最大,
14:16
on the physiology of stress.
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這是心理學的研究結果。
14:20
Now we have been criticized.
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我們的研究也曾經受到質疑。
14:22
Of course, there are people who dislike this stuff
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當然,有些人不喜歡我們的實驗數據,
14:25
and people who find it very surprising.
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也有些人對這些數據感到不可思議。
14:28
I should tell you though
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我必須在此告訴各位
14:30
that when people criticize us for picking and choosing data,
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某些人質疑我們只選用支持我們理論的數據,
14:33
we never pick and choose data.
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但我們從未這樣做。
14:35
We have an absolute rule
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我們有自己的篩選機制
14:37
that if our data source has data for one of the countries we're looking at,
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只要是跟我們研究的國家有關的數據,
14:40
it goes into the analysis.
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我們就把它加進來分析。
14:42
Our data source decides
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唯一會考慮的
14:44
whether it's reliable data,
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只有資料的可信度
14:46
we don't.
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絕無挑選數據。
14:48
Otherwise that would introduce bias.
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不然這場演講就沒意義了。
14:50
What about other countries?
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至於其他的國家呢?
14:52
There are 200 studies
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其他還有200多項研究
14:55
of health in relation to income and equality
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都證明人的健康與收入、經濟狀況有關,
14:58
in the academic peer-reviewed journals.
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這些研究散見於各種學術期刊。
15:01
This isn't confined to these countries here,
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並不侷限於今天提到的這些國家,
15:04
hiding a very simple demonstration.
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只是這些國家較俱代表性。
15:06
The same countries,
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只要國與國之間的情況相似,
15:08
the same measure of inequality,
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經濟失衡程度差不多,
15:10
one problem after another.
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兩國內部都會產生相同的問題。
15:14
Why don't we control for other factors?
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我們為什麼不用其他的衡量標準分析呢?
15:16
Well we've shown you that GNP per capita
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我已跟各位說明過,如果改用國民生產毛額
15:18
doesn't make any difference.
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作為衡量標準,結果也不會改變的。
15:20
And of course, others using more sophisticated methods in the literature
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當然,在現有文獻中,有其他學者用更精密的方法
15:24
have controlled for poverty and education
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以貧窮、教育等問題做衡量標準,
15:26
and so on.
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這不在話下。
15:30
What about causality?
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至於這些數據間的因果關係呢?
15:32
Correlation in itself doesn't prove causality.
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兩件事之間有關聯性並不能證明它們有因果關係。
15:35
We spend a good bit of time.
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我們為此花了不少時間。
15:37
And indeed, people know the causal links quite well
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當然,大部分的人都能接受
15:39
in some of these outcomes.
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我們研究出的因果關係。
15:41
The big change in our understanding
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我想我們認知上最大的改變
15:43
of drivers of chronic health
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就是在富裕已開發的國家中
15:45
in the rich developed world
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某些慢性病的起因,
15:47
is how important chronic stress from social sources
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像是免疫系統疾病,
15:51
is affecting the immune system,
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或是心血管疾病,
15:53
the cardiovascular system.
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竟是來自社會上的壓力。
15:56
Or for instance, the reason why violence
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在經濟失衡嚴重的國家,
15:58
becomes more common in more unequal societies
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社會上的暴力事件比較頻繁,
16:01
is because people are sensitive to being looked down on.
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也是因為人們對別人的眼光愈來愈敏感。
16:06
I should say that to deal with this,
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我必須說,要解決這些問題,
16:09
we've got to deal with the post-tax things
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就得先確立稅收的標準
16:11
and the pre-tax things.
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以及稅收的運用。
16:13
We've got to constrain income,
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所有人的所得都必須受到限制,
16:16
the bonus culture incomes at the top.
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尤其是上層社會的人。
16:18
I think we must make our bosses accountable to their employees
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我認為,公司老闆應該對員工的薪資負起責任,
16:21
in any way we can.
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非這麼做不可。
16:24
I think the take-home message though
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今天我希望各位都能在心中記住一個想法,
16:27
is that we can improve the real quality of human life
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那就是我們確實能夠藉由縮小收入差距
16:31
by reducing the differences in incomes between us.
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來讓我們的社會更加均衡發展。
16:34
Suddenly we have a handle
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如果有一天,在座各位的其中一人
16:36
on the psychosocial well-being of whole societies,
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成功解決了經濟失衡的問題
16:38
and that's exciting.
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那將會是全人類的福音。
16:40
Thank you.
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謝謝各位
16:42
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
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