Ernesto Sirolli: Want to help someone? Shut up and listen!

Translator: Joseph Geni Reviewer: Morton Bast

翻译人员: Claire Wang 校对人员: Renji Yu

Everything I do, and everything I do professionally --

我所做的一切，不论是生活上还是工作上

my life -- has been shaped

我的整个人生--深深受到

by seven years of work as a young man in Africa.

年轻时在非洲工作的那七年的影响，

From 1971 to 1977 --

从1971年到1977年。

I look young, but I'm not — (Laughter) --

我看起来很年轻，但其实我老了--（笑声）

I worked in Zambia, Kenya, Ivory Coast, Algeria, Somalia,

我曾在赞比亚，肯尼亚，象牙海岸，阿尔及利亚，索马里

in projects of technical cooperation with African countries.

参与过不少与非洲各国的技术合作项目。

I worked for an Italian NGO,

当时我在一家意大利非政府组织工作。

and every single project that we set up in Africa

我们在非洲建立的每一个项目，

failed.

都失败了。

And I was distraught.

我都快抓狂了。

I thought, age 21, that we Italians were good people

那时21岁的我觉得我们意大利人是大好人，

and we were doing good work in Africa.

我们在为非洲做好事谋福利。

Instead, everything we touched we killed.

然而，我们干什么赔什么。

Our first project, the one that has inspired my first book,

我们第一个项目给了我写第一本书的灵感，

"Ripples from the Zambezi,"

书名叫《赞比西河的涟漪》。

was a project where we Italians

在这个项目中，我们意大利人

decided to teach Zambian people how to grow food.

决定教赞比亚人种粮食。

So we arrived there with Italian seeds in southern Zambia

所以，我们带着意大利的种子来到了赞比亚南部，

in this absolutely magnificent valley

一个壮丽迷人的山谷，

going down to the Zambezi River,

通向赞比西河。

and we taught the local people how to grow Italian tomatoes

我们教当地人种植意大利西红柿

and zucchini and ...

和西葫芦等等。

And of course the local people had absolutely no interest

当然，当地人对此表示毫无兴趣，

in doing that, so we paid them to come and work,

所以我们付工资请他们来劳作，

and sometimes they would show up. (Laughter)

他们也是一会儿来一会儿不来的。（笑声）

And we were amazed that the local people,

有着如此肥沃的山谷，当地人居然不耕种，

in such a fertile valley, would not have any agriculture.

我们对此感到十分惊奇。

But instead of asking them how come they were not

但我们并没有问他们原因，

growing anything, we simply said, "Thank God we're here." (Laughter)

而仅仅是感叹道：“幸亏我们来了。”（笑声）

"Just in the nick of time to save the Zambian people from starvation."

“在饥饿的赞比亚人民命悬一线时伸出了援手。”

And of course, everything in Africa grew beautifully.

当然，在非洲种的东西都长得很好。

We had these magnificent tomatoes. In Italy, a tomato

我们种的西红柿漂亮极了。在意大利，一个西红柿

would grow to this size. In Zambia, to this size.

长这么大。在赞比亚，能长这么大。

And we could not believe, and we were telling the Zambians,

这真是难以置信。我们跟赞比亚人说：

"Look how easy agriculture is."

“看，耕种多容易啊。”

When the tomatoes were nice and ripe and red,

当西红柿成熟了，红彤彤的好看极了，

overnight, some 200 hippos came out from the river

一夜之间，从赞比西河跑来两百多头河马

and they ate everything. (Laughter)

把所有西红柿都啃光了。（笑声）

And we said to the Zambians, "My God, the hippos!"

我们跟赞比亚人说：“天呐，这些该死的河马！”

And the Zambians said, "Yes, that's why we have no agriculture here." (Laughter)

赞比亚人说：“没错，这就是我们不在这里耕种的原因。”（笑声）

"Why didn't you tell us?""You never asked."

“你们为什么不早说？” “你又没问过。”

I thought it was only us Italians blundering around Africa,

我本以为只有我们意大利人在非洲栽了跟头，

but then I saw what the Americans were doing,

但当我知道美国人的情况，

what the English were doing, what the French were doing,

英国人的情况，法国人的情况，

and after seeing what they were doing,

当看了他们的所作所为之后，

I became quite proud of our project in Zambia.

我为我们在赞比亚的项目感到非常自豪。

Because, you see, at least we fed the hippos.

因为，我们至少喂饱了河马。

You should see the rubbish — (Applause) --

你们应该看看这些垃圾--（掌声）--

You should see the rubbish that we have bestowed

你们应该看看我们塞了多少垃圾给

on unsuspecting African people.

这些满怀信任的非洲人民。

You want to read the book,

你们可以读读这本书，

read "Dead Aid," by Dambisa Moyo,

叫《致命援助》，作者是丹比萨·莫约，

Zambian woman economist.

一位赞比亚女经济学家。

The book was published in 2009.

这本书出版于2009年。

We Western donor countries have given the African continent

我们这些西方援助国在过去50年里

two trillion American dollars in the last 50 years.

向非洲大陆投入了两万亿美元。

I'm not going to tell you the damage that that money has done.

我不打算跟你们细说这笔钱所造成的损害。

Just go and read her book.

你们自己去读读看。

Read it from an African woman, the damage that we have done.

看看以一位非洲女性的眼光，我们所带来的损害有多大。

We Western people are imperialist, colonialist missionaries,

我们西方人是帝国主义者，殖民主义者，以及传教士，

and there are only two ways we deal with people:

我们跟人们打交道的方式只有两种：

We either patronize them, or we are paternalistic.

一是居高临下（patronize），二是家长做派（paternalistic）。

The two words come from the Latin root "pater,"

这两个词来自于拉丁词根“pater”，

which means "father."

意即“父亲”。

But they mean two different things.

但两个词的意思不同。

Paternalistic, I treat anybody from a different culture

家长做派意味着我把不同文化背景的人

as if they were my children. "I love you so much."

当成我的孩子对待。“我爱你孩子。”

Patronizing, I treat everybody from another culture

居高临下意味着我把另一文化背景的人

as if they were my servants.

当做我的仆人对待。

That's why the white people in Africa are called "bwana," boss.

这也就是为什么在非洲白人被称作“老爷”，也就是老板。

I was given a slap in the face reading a book,

我在读一本书时，如遭当头棒喝，

"Small is Beautiful," written by Schumacher, who said,

这本书叫《小即是美》，作者是舒马赫（英国经济学家），

above all in economic development, if people

他说，经济发展最重要的一点是，如果人们

do not wish to be helped, leave them alone.

不想让别人帮忙，就随他们去。

This should be the first principle of aid.

这应该是援助的首要原则。

The first principle of aid is respect.

援助的首要原则就是尊重。

This morning, the gentleman who opened this conference

今天早上，给这次大会致开幕词的先生

lay a stick on the floor, and said,

在地上放了一根棍子，说道，

"Can we -- can you imagine a city

“我们能不能--你们能不能想象一座城市

that is not neocolonial?"

没被新殖民主义侵略吗？”

I decided when I was 27 years old

27岁时，我做出一个决定，

to only respond to people,

只基于人们的需求提供援助。

and I invented a system called Enterprise Facilitation,

我创立了一套工作系统，叫“企业梦工厂”。

where you never initiate anything,

我们不做创始人，

you never motivate anybody, but you become a servant

也不激励任何人，而是为当地人们的

of the local passion, the servant of local people

创业热情而服务，为当地人们

who have a dream to become a better person.

找到更好的人生定位。

So what you do -- you shut up.

所以我们要做的--就是闭嘴。

You never arrive in a community with any ideas,

我们走进一个社区时不会将任何想法强加于对方，

and you sit with the local people.

而是与当地人坐在一起交流。

We don't work from offices.

我们的工作地点不在办公室。

We meet at the cafe. We meet at the pub.

我们与客户在餐馆和酒吧见面。

We have zero infrastructure.

我们没有任何基础设施的建设。

And what we do, we become friends,

我们所做的，是跟他们交朋友，

and we find out what that person wants to do.

并发现他们的兴趣和意向。

The most important thing is passion.

最重要的是热情。

You can give somebody an idea.

你可以向客户提出你的点子，

If that person doesn't want to do it,

但如果对方不感兴趣，

what are you going to do?

你又有什么办法？

The passion that the person has for her own growth

客户热衷于自我提升的这份热情

is the most important thing.

才是最重要的。

The passion that that man has for his own personal growth

对方的热情是建立在自我提升的基础上，

is the most important thing.

这才是最重要的

And then we help them to go and find the knowledge,

然后我们帮助他们搜集相关知识和信息，

because nobody in the world can succeed alone.

因为这世上，单丝不成线，独木不成林。

The person with the idea may not have the knowledge,

有点子的人未必懂得相关知识，

but the knowledge is available.

但我们可以提供支持。

So years and years ago, I had this idea:

所以很多年前，我有个想法，

Why don't we, for once, instead of arriving in the community

我们为何不能至少有一次做到聆听他们的想法，

to tell people what to do, why don't, for once,

而不是把我们的想法强加于他们？

listen to them? But not in community meetings.

但这不能以社区会议的形式进行。

Let me tell you a secret.

我告诉你们一个秘密。

There is a problem with community meetings.

社区会议存在一个问题。

Entrepreneurs never come,

企业家们从不出席，

and they never tell you, in a public meeting,

他们绝不会在公众集会上告诉你，

what they want to do with their own money,

他们打算把钱用在哪儿，

what opportunity they have identified.

他们窥测到了什么商机。

So planning has this blind spot.

所以做计划有一个盲区，

The smartest people in your community you don't even know,

你甚至都无从结识社区里最聪明的那些人

because they don't come to your public meetings.

因为他们根本不参与你们的公众集会。

What we do, we work one-on-one,

我们的做法是，与客户一对一，

and to work one-on-one, you have to create

为了能一对一，我们必须建设

a social infrastructure that doesn't exist.

一套前所未有的社会基础设施。

You have to create a new profession.

我们必须创造一个全新的职业。

The profession is the family doctor of enterprise,

这种职业相当于企业的家庭医生，

the family doctor of business, who sits with you

这位企业家庭医生，会与你面对面

in your house, at your kitchen table, at the cafe,

在你的家里，你的厨房餐桌旁，或是咖啡馆，

and helps you find the resources to transform your passion

帮助你集结资源来将你的创业热情

into a way to make a living.

转换为谋生技能。

I started this as a tryout in Esperance, in Western Australia.

我在西澳大利亚州的埃斯佩兰斯进行了试验。

I was a doing a Ph.D. at the time,

那时我在读博士，

trying to go away from this patronizing bullshit

努力摒弃那种居高临下的狗屁做法

that we arrive and tell you what to do.

到了之后只会颐指气使指手划脚。

And so what I did in Esperance that first year

我在埃斯佩兰斯的第一年

was to just walk the streets, and in three days

只是出去遛街，在那些日子里，

I had my first client, and I helped this first guy

我有了第一位客户，我帮助了这第一个人。

who was smoking fish from a garage, was a Maori guy,

他是毛利人，在一家车库里做熏鱼。

and I helped him to sell to the restaurant in Perth,

我教他把鱼卖给珀斯的餐馆，

to get organized, and then the fishermen came to me to say,

帮他进行了筹划。然后当地的渔民们跑来跟我说，

"You the guy who helped Maori? Can you help us?"

“你就是那个帮毛利佬卖鱼的人？你能帮帮我们吗？”

And I helped these five fishermen to work together

我让这五个渔民合伙运作，

and get this beautiful tuna not to the cannery in Albany

不是把美味的金枪鱼以60美分一公斤的低价

for 60 cents a kilo, but we found a way

卖给奥尔巴尼（美国）的罐头工厂，

to take the fish for sushi to Japan for 15 dollars a kilo,

而是以15美元一公斤的高价卖给日本做寿司。

and the farmers came to talk to me, said,

接着又有农民跑来跟我说，

"Hey, you helped them. Can you help us?"

“嘿，你帮助了他们，能帮帮我们吗？”

In a year, I had 27 projects going on,

一年之内，我做了27个项目，

and the government came to see me to say,

政府的人跑来问我，

"How can you do that?

“你是怎么办到的？

How can you do — ?" And I said, "I do something very, very, very difficult.

你怎么能--？”我答道：“我做了一件很困难的事，

I shut up, and listen to them." (Laughter)

那就是闭上嘴，听他们说。”（笑声）

So — (Applause) —

所以--（掌声）--

So the government says, "Do it again." (Laughter)

所以政府的人说：“那接着做。”（笑声）

We've done it in 300 communities around the world.

我们在世界上300个社区开展了这个项目。

We have helped to start 40,000 businesses.

我们已帮助建立了40,000家企业。

There is a new generation of entrepreneurs

新一代的创业者们

who are dying of solitude.

皆因闭门造车而一事无成。

Peter Drucker, one of the greatest management consultants in history,

彼得·德鲁克，史上最伟大的管理咨询师之一，

died age 96, a few years ago.

几年前去世了，享年96岁，

Peter Drucker was a professor of philosophy

彼得·德鲁克在涉足商界之前

before becoming involved in business,

是一位哲学教授，

and this is what Peter Drucker says:

彼得·德鲁克曾说过：

"Planning is actually incompatible

“计划其实是与创业型社会

with an entrepreneurial society and economy."

及创业型经济不相容的。”

Planning is the kiss of death of entrepreneurship.

计划是给创业帮了倒忙。

So now you're rebuilding Christchurch

现在，我们重建基督城（新西兰），

without knowing what the smartest people in Christchurch

却不知道基督城最聪明的那群人

want to do with their own money and their own energy.

想如何运用他们自己的钱财和精力。

You have to learn how to get these people

我们必须学会如何让这些人

to come and talk to you.

给出他们的意见。

You have to offer them confidentiality, privacy,

我们必须给予他们保密的承诺，并尊重他们的隐私，

you have to be fantastic at helping them,

我们要擅长为他们提供帮助，

and then they will come, and they will come in droves.

这样他们才会上门，才会纷至沓来。

In a community of 10,000 people, we get 200 clients.

在一个10,000人的社区里，我们有200个客户。

Can you imagine a community of 400,000 people,

你能想象一个400,000人的社区，

the intelligence and the passion?

凝聚了多少智力和热情吗？

Which presentation have you applauded the most this morning?

今天上午你们鼓掌最多的演讲来自谁？

Local, passionate people. That's who you have applauded.

是充满创业热情的当地人。你们为他们鼓掌。

So what I'm saying is that

所以我想说的是，

entrepreneurship is where it's at.

创业精神是当今社会的潮流。

We are at the end of the first industrial revolution --

当我们处于第一次工业革命的末期时--

nonrenewable fossil fuels, manufacturing --

我们使用不可再生矿物燃料，发展制造业--

and all of a sudden, we have systems which are not sustainable.

但我们忽然意识到这种发展是不可持续的。

The internal combustion engine is not sustainable.

内燃机的燃料总有耗尽的一天。

Freon way of maintaining things is not sustainable.

用氟利昂冷藏食物也非长久之计。

What we have to look at is at how we

我们现在要关心的是我们如何

feed, cure, educate, transport, communicate

以一种可持续的发展方式来满足70亿人的

for seven billion people in a sustainable way.

食物、医疗、教育、运输及通信需求。

The technologies do not exist to do that.

现有的科技水平尚做不到这一点。

Who is going to invent the technology

谁能发明这种科技来

for the green revolution? Universities? Forget about it!

实现绿色革命？大学吗？别想了！

Government? Forget about it!

政府吗？别想了！

It will be entrepreneurs, and they're doing it now.

是创业者们，是他们正在为之奋斗。

There's a lovely story that I read in a futurist magazine

许多年前，我在一本未来主义杂志上

many, many years ago.

看过一篇有趣的文章。

There was a group of experts who were invited

1860年，有一批专家受到邀请

to discuss the future of the city of New York in 1860.

去讨论纽约市的未来是怎样。

And in 1860, this group of people came together,

那是1860年，这批人聚到一起，

and they all speculated about what would happen

他们都对100年后的纽约市

to the city of New York in 100 years,

作出了推断。

and the conclusion was unanimous:

他们的结论众口一词：

The city of New York would not exist in 100 years.

100年后，纽约市将不复存在。

Why? Because they looked at the curve and said,

为什么？因为他们看着图表上的曲线说，

if the population keeps growing at this rate,

如果人口继续以这种速度增长，

to move the population of New York around,

纽约的人们出行

they would have needed six million horses,

将需要六百万匹马，

and the manure created by six million horses

而六百万匹马所排泄的粪便

would be impossible to deal with.

将无法处理。

They were already drowning in manure. (Laughter)

到时人们将会被马粪淹没。（笑声）

So 1860, they are seeing this dirty technology

所以1860年，他们认为，这种肮脏的科技

that is going to choke the life out of New York.

将扼杀纽约的生命。

So what happens? In 40 years' time, in the year 1900,

那么结果呢？40年之后，1900年，

in the United States of America, there were 1,001

美利坚合众国有了1,001家

car manufacturing companies -- 1,001.

汽车制造商--有1,001家之多。

The idea of finding a different technology

找到一种新科技取而代之

had absolutely taken over,

才是发展的王道，

and there were tiny, tiny little factories in backwaters.

而停滞不前的小工厂还有很多。

Dearborn, Michigan. Henry Ford.

例如密歇根州迪尔伯恩市的福特汽车公司。

However, there is a secret to work with entrepreneurs.

然而，与创业者打交道有个秘诀。

First, you have to offer them confidentiality.

第一，你要给予他们保密的承诺。

Otherwise they don't come and talk to you.

不然他们不会来找你谈的。

Then you have to offer them absolute, dedicated,

然后你要为他们提供专注

passionate service to them.

而热情的服务。

And then you have to tell them the truth about entrepreneurship.

你要告诉他们创业精神的真谛。

The smallest company, the biggest company,

不论是大公司还是小企业，

has to be capable of doing three things beautifully:

都能把以下三件事做得很好：

The product that you want to sell has to be fantastic,

产品质量要过硬，

you have to have fantastic marketing,

市场营销要高效，

and you have to have tremendous financial management.

财务管理要精明。

Guess what?

问题是什么呢？

We have never met a single human being

这世上从来没有一个人

in the world who can make it, sell it and look after the money.

能同时做好生产、销售以及财务的工作。

It doesn't exist.

这种人不存在。

This person has never been born.

这样的能人尚未出生。

We've done the research, and we have looked

我们做过调查，对世界上

at the 100 iconic companies of the world --

100家标杆企业进行研究--

Carnegie, Westinghouse, Edison, Ford,

卡内基培训公司，西屋公司，爱迪生公司，福特汽车公司，

all the new companies, Google, Yahoo.

以及所有这些新兴产业的公司，如谷歌，雅虎。

There's only one thing that all the successful companies

世界上所有成功的企业只有一个

in the world have in common, only one:

共同点，只有一个：

None were started by one person.

没有一个企业是靠一人之力创建的。

Now we teach entrepreneurship to 16-year-olds

现在我们在诺森伯兰郡（英国）

in Northumberland, and we start the class

教授16岁青年们创业学，我们一开始

by giving them the first two pages of Richard Branson's autobiography,

把理查德·布兰森（英国亿万富翁）自传的前两页给他们看，

and the task of the 16-year-olds is to underline,

这些学生们的任务就是用下划线标出

in the first two pages of Richard Branson's autobiography

并统计理查德·布兰森自传前两页中

how many times Richard uses the word "I"

用了多少次“我”这个字

and how many times he uses the word "we."

和用了多少次“我们”这个词。

Never the word "I," and the word "we" 32 times.

“我”一次都没有，“我们”用了32次。

He wasn't alone when he started.

他刚起步时并非单枪匹马。

Nobody started a company alone. No one.

没人能独自创立一个企业。没人。

So we can create the community

所以我们可以建立一个社区，

where we have facilitators who come from a small business background

在这个社区里，我们有来自小型企业背景的辅助商

sitting in cafes, in bars, and your dedicated buddies

在咖啡馆中、酒吧里为你出谋划策，

who will do to you, what somebody did for this gentleman

我们能为你提供这位满怀抱负的先生

who talks about this epic,

所受到的帮助，

somebody who will say to you, "What do you need?

我们会问你：“你需要什么？

What can you do? Can you make it?

你能做什么？你能生产出来吗？

Okay, can you sell it? Can you look after the money?"

你能销售出去吗？你能打理资金吗？”

"Oh, no, I cannot do this.""Would you like me to find you somebody?"

“啊，这个我办不到。”“那要我替你找人帮忙吗？”

We activate communities.

我们鼓舞各个社区进行创业。

We have groups of volunteers supporting the Enterprise Facilitator

我们有志愿者团队帮助创业辅助商

to help you to find resources and people

为客户集结资源及人力。

and we have discovered that the miracle

我们发现当地人群的智慧

of the intelligence of local people is such

能创造出奇迹

that you can change the culture and the economy

能改变社区的文化和经济，

of this community just by capturing the passion,

只要你能好好利用人们这份热情，

the energy and imagination of your own people.

这种活力，这种想象力。

Thank you. (Applause)

谢谢。（掌声）