Alison Gopnik: What do babies think?

394,029 views ・ 2011-10-10

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Prevoditelj: Vedrana Vučković Jakšić Recezent: Tilen Pigac - EFZG
00:15
What is going on
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Što se događa
00:17
in this baby's mind?
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u umu ove bebe?
00:19
If you'd asked people this 30 years ago,
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Da ste postavili ovo pitanje prije 30 godina,
00:21
most people, including psychologists,
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većina ljudi, uključujući psihologe,
00:23
would have said that this baby was irrational,
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rekla bi da je ova beba iracionalna,
00:26
illogical, egocentric --
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nerazborita, egocentrična --
00:28
that he couldn't take the perspective of another person
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da ne može gledati iz perspektive druge osobe
00:30
or understand cause and effect.
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i shvatiti uzrok i posljedicu.
00:32
In the last 20 years,
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Posljednjih 20 godina
00:34
developmental science has completely overturned that picture.
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razvojna je znanost u potpunosti promijenila tu sliku.
00:37
So in some ways,
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Tako na neki način
00:39
we think that this baby's thinking
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mislimo da je razmišljanje ove bebe
00:41
is like the thinking of the most brilliant scientists.
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poput razmišljanja najbistrijih znanstvenika.
00:45
Let me give you just one example of this.
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Navest ću samo jedan primjer.
00:47
One thing that this baby could be thinking about,
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Jedna od stvari o kojoj bi ova beba mogla razmišljati,
00:50
that could be going on in his mind,
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što bi se moglo odvijati u njezinom umu,
00:52
is trying to figure out
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pokušaj je shvaćanja
00:54
what's going on in the mind of that other baby.
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što se događa u umu druge bebe.
00:57
After all, one of the things that's hardest for all of us to do
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Na kraju krajeva, jedna je od najtežih stvari
01:00
is to figure out what other people are thinking and feeling.
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shvatiti o čemu ostali ljudi razmišljaju i što osjećaju.
01:03
And maybe the hardest thing of all
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A možda je najteže od svega
01:05
is to figure out that what other people think and feel
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shvatiti da ono što drugi misle i osjećaju
01:08
isn't actually exactly like what we think and feel.
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nije isto kao ono što mi mislimo i osjećamo.
01:10
Anyone who's followed politics can testify
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Svi koji su pratili politiku mogu potvrditi
01:12
to how hard that is for some people to get.
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koliko je nekim ljudima teško to shvatiti.
01:15
We wanted to know
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Željeli smo saznati
01:17
if babies and young children
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mogu li bebe i mala djeca
01:19
could understand this really profound thing about other people.
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razumjeti nešto tako duboko u vezi drugih ljudi.
01:22
Now the question is: How could we ask them?
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Pitanje je kako bismo ih mogli to pitati.
01:24
Babies, after all, can't talk,
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Bebe, na koncu, ne govore
01:26
and if you ask a three year-old
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a ako pitate trogodišnjaka
01:28
to tell you what he thinks,
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da vam kaže o čemu razmišlja
01:30
what you'll get is a beautiful stream of consciousness monologue
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dobit ćete prekrasan monolog struje svijesti
01:33
about ponies and birthdays and things like that.
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o ponijima, rođendanima i sličnim stvarima.
01:36
So how do we actually ask them the question?
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Kako im zaista možemo postaviti to pitanje?
01:39
Well it turns out that the secret was broccoli.
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Ispada da je tajna bila u brokuli.
01:42
What we did -- Betty Rapacholi, who was one of my students, and I --
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Ono što smo moja studentica, Betty Rapacholi, i ja učinile --
01:46
was actually to give the babies two bowls of food:
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dale smo bebama dvije zdjelice s hranom:
01:49
one bowl of raw broccoli
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zdjelicu sirove brokule
01:51
and one bowl of delicious goldfish crackers.
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i zdjelicu slasnih krekera u obliku ribica.
01:54
Now all of the babies, even in Berkley,
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Sve bebe, čak i u Berkleyju,
01:57
like the crackers and don't like the raw broccoli.
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vole krekere, a ne vole sirovu brokulu.
02:00
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
02:02
But then what Betty did
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No Betty je
02:04
was to take a little taste of food from each bowl.
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kušala malo hrane iz obje zdjelice.
02:07
And she would act as if she liked it or she didn't.
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I ponašala se kao da je voli ili ne voli.
02:09
So half the time, she acted
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Polovicu se vremena ponašala
02:11
as if she liked the crackers and didn't like the broccoli --
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kao da voli krekere, a ne voli brokulu --
02:13
just like a baby and any other sane person.
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kao beba i svi ostali zdravog razuma.
02:16
But half the time,
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No ostalo bi vrijeme
02:18
what she would do is take a little bit of the broccoli
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uzela komadić brokule
02:20
and go, "Mmmmm, broccoli.
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i rekla: "Mmmmm, brokula.
02:23
I tasted the broccoli. Mmmmm."
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Kušala sam brokulu. Mmmmm."
02:26
And then she would take a little bit of the crackers,
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A zatim bi uzela malo krekera
02:28
and she'd go, "Eww, yuck, crackers.
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i rekla: "Bljak, krekeri.
02:32
I tasted the crackers. Eww, yuck."
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Kušala sam krekere. Bljak."
02:35
So she'd act as if what she wanted
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Ponašala se kao da je ono što želi
02:37
was just the opposite of what the babies wanted.
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upravo suprotno od onoga što bebe žele.
02:40
We did this with 15 and 18 month-old babies.
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Učinili smo to s bebama od 15 i 18 mjeseci.
02:42
And then she would simply put her hand out and say,
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Zatim bi ispružila ruku i rekla:
02:45
"Can you give me some?"
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"Hoćeš li mi dati malo?"
02:47
So the question is: What would the baby give her,
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Pitanje je: Što će joj bebe dati,
02:49
what they liked or what she liked?
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ono što se njima sviđa ili što se njoj sviđa?
02:51
And the remarkable thing was that 18 month-old babies,
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Zapanjujuće je da bi joj bebe stare 18 mjeseci,
02:54
just barely walking and talking,
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koje jedva hodaju i govore,
02:56
would give her the crackers if she liked the crackers,
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dale krekere ako je pokazala da voli krekere,
02:59
but they would give her the broccoli if she liked the broccoli.
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a brokulu ako je pokazala da voli brokulu.
03:02
On the other hand,
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S druge strane,
03:04
15 month-olds would stare at her for a long time
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bebe stare 15 mjeseci dugo bi zurile u nju
03:06
if she acted as if she liked the broccoli,
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ako se ponašala kao da voli brokulu
03:08
like they couldn't figure this out.
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kao da to ne mogu shvatiti.
03:11
But then after they stared for a long time,
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No nakon dugog zurenja
03:13
they would just give her the crackers,
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jednostavno bi joj dale krekere
03:15
what they thought everybody must like.
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misleći da njih svi moraju voljeti.
03:17
So there are two really remarkable things about this.
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Postoje dvije izvanredne stvari u vezi toga.
03:20
The first one is that these little 18 month-old babies
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Prva je da su te male bebe stare 18 mjeseci
03:23
have already discovered
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već otkrile
03:25
this really profound fact about human nature,
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tu duboku činjenicu o ljudskoj prirodi,
03:27
that we don't always want the same thing.
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da ne želimo uvijek iste stvari.
03:29
And what's more, they felt that they should actually do things
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Štoviše, osjetile su da trebaju činiti ono
03:31
to help other people get what they wanted.
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što će drugima pomoći da dobiju ono što žele.
03:34
Even more remarkably though,
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Međutim, što je još nevjerojatnije,
03:36
the fact that 15 month-olds didn't do this
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činjenica da bebe stare 15 mjeseci nisu to učinile
03:39
suggests that these 18 month-olds had learned
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daje naslutiti da su bebe stare 18 mjeseci naučile
03:42
this deep, profound fact about human nature
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tu duboku, ozbiljnu činjenicu o ljudskoj prirodi
03:45
in the three months from when they were 15 months old.
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unutar tri mjeseca počevši od dobi od 15 mjeseci.
03:48
So children both know more and learn more
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Znači, djeca znaju više i uče više
03:50
than we ever would have thought.
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nego što bismo ikad pomislili.
03:52
And this is just one of hundreds and hundreds of studies over the last 20 years
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A to je samo jedna od stotina i stotina istraživanja tijekom posljednjih 20 godina
03:56
that's actually demonstrated it.
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koja su to doista dokazala.
03:58
The question you might ask though is:
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No mogli biste upitati:
04:00
Why do children learn so much?
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zašto djeca uče toliko?
04:03
And how is it possible for them to learn so much
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Kako je moguće da nauče toliko mnogo
04:05
in such a short time?
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u tako malo vremena?
04:07
I mean, after all, if you look at babies superficially,
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Na kraju krajeva, ako površno pogledate bebe
04:09
they seem pretty useless.
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čine se prilično beskorisnima.
04:11
And actually in many ways, they're worse than useless,
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Na mnogo načina čak su i više nego beskorisne
04:14
because we have to put so much time and energy
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jer moramo uložiti toliko vremena i energije
04:16
into just keeping them alive.
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samo da bismo ih održali na životu.
04:18
But if we turn to evolution
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No ako u evoluciji potražimo
04:20
for an answer to this puzzle
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rješenje zagonetke
04:22
of why we spend so much time
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zašto toliko vremena trošimo
04:24
taking care of useless babies,
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na brigu za beskorisne bebe,
04:27
it turns out that there's actually an answer.
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proizlazi da odgovor zapravo postoji.
04:30
If we look across many, many different species of animals,
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Ako pogledamo brojne različite vrste životinja,
04:33
not just us primates,
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ne samo nas primate,
04:35
but also including other mammals, birds,
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no ako uključimo ostale sisavce, ptice,
04:37
even marsupials
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čak tobolčare,
04:39
like kangaroos and wombats,
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kao što su klokani i vombati,
04:41
it turns out that there's a relationship
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proizlazi da postoji veza
04:43
between how long a childhood a species has
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između trajanja djetinjstva određene vrste
04:47
and how big their brains are compared to their bodies
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i veličine njihovih mozgova u usporedbi s tijelom
04:51
and how smart and flexible they are.
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te njihove pameti i fleksibilnosti.
04:53
And sort of the posterbirds for this idea are the birds up there.
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Ptice za ilustraciju ove zamisli ove su ptice ovdje.
04:56
On one side
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S jedne je strane
04:58
is a New Caledonian crow.
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vrana iz Nove Kaledonije.
05:00
And crows and other corvidae, ravens, rooks and so forth,
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Vrane i ostale ptice te porodice, gavrani, gačci itd.,
05:03
are incredibly smart birds.
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nevjerojatno su pametne ptice.
05:05
They're as smart as chimpanzees in some respects.
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U nekim su aspektima pametne kao čimpanze.
05:08
And this is a bird on the cover of science
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Ovo je ptica na naslovnici časopisa Science
05:10
who's learned how to use a tool to get food.
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koja je naučila koristiti alat da bi došla do hrane.
05:13
On the other hand,
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S druge strane,
05:15
we have our friend the domestic chicken.
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imamo našu prijateljicu, domaću kokoš.
05:17
And chickens and ducks and geese and turkeys
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A kokoši, patke, guske i pure
05:20
are basically as dumb as dumps.
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u biti glupe su kao klada.
05:22
So they're very, very good at pecking for grain,
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Veoma su dobre u kljucanju da bi dobile zrno,
05:25
and they're not much good at doing anything else.
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no osim toga nisu baš dobre ni u čemu.
05:28
Well it turns out that the babies,
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Proizlazi da su mladi vrane
05:30
the New Caledonian crow babies, are fledglings.
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zapravo žutokljunci.
05:32
They depend on their moms
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Oni ovise o svojim majkama
05:34
to drop worms in their little open mouths
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i crvima koje im one ispuštaju u otvorena ustašca
05:37
for as long as two years,
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tijekom cijele dvije godine,
05:39
which is a really long time in the life of a bird.
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što je prilično dugo u životu jedne ptice.
05:41
Whereas the chickens are actually mature
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Dok kokoši zapravo sazriju
05:43
within a couple of months.
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za nekoliko mjeseci.
05:45
So childhood is the reason
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Dakle, djetinjstvo je razlog
05:48
why the crows end up on the cover of Science
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zašto vrane završe na naslovnici Sciencea,
05:50
and the chickens end up in the soup pot.
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a kokoši završe u loncu s juhom.
05:52
There's something about that long childhood
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Postoji nešto u vezi s dugim djetinjstvom
05:55
that seems to be connected
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što se čini povezanim
05:57
to knowledge and learning.
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sa znanjem i učenjem.
05:59
Well what kind of explanation could we have for this?
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Kako bismo to mogli objasniti?
06:02
Well some animals, like the chicken,
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Neke životinje, kao što su kokoši,
06:05
seem to be beautifully suited
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savršeno rade
06:07
to doing just one thing very well.
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samo jednu stvar.
06:09
So they seem to be beautifully suited
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Čini se da su savršeno prilagođene
06:12
to pecking grain in one environment.
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za kljucanje zrnja u jednom okruženju.
06:14
Other creatures, like the crows,
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Ostala stvorenja, poput vrana,
06:16
aren't very good at doing anything in particular,
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nisu posebno dobra ni u čemu određenom,
06:18
but they're extremely good
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no iznimno su dobra
06:20
at learning about laws of different environments.
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u učenju zakona o različitim okolinama.
06:22
And of course, we human beings
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A mi, ljudska bića,
06:24
are way out on the end of the distribution like the crows.
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na samome smo kraju te podjele, kao vrane.
06:27
We have bigger brains relative to our bodies
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Imamo puno veće mozgove s obzirom na tijela
06:29
by far than any other animal.
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od bilo koje druge životinje.
06:31
We're smarter, we're more flexible,
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Pametniji smo, prilagodljiviji,
06:33
we can learn more,
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možemo više naučiti,
06:35
we survive in more different environments,
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preživljavamo u više različitih okolina,
06:37
we migrated to cover the world and even go to outer space.
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selidbama smo pokrili cijeli svijet, odlazimo čak i u svemir.
06:40
And our babies and children are dependent on us
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A naše bebe i djeca ovise o nama
06:43
for much longer than the babies of any other species.
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mnogo dulje nego mladunčad bilo koje druge vrste.
06:46
My son is 23.
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Moj sin ima 23 godine.
06:48
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
06:50
And at least until they're 23,
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Najmanje do 23. godine
06:52
we're still popping those worms
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ubacujemo crviće
06:54
into those little open mouths.
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u njihova otvorena ustašca.
06:57
All right, why would we see this correlation?
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Zašto bismo proučavali tu korelaciju?
07:00
Well an idea is that that strategy, that learning strategy,
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Naša je ideja da je ta strategija, ta strategija učenja,
07:04
is an extremely powerful, great strategy for getting on in the world,
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iznimno snažna i značajna strategija za snalaženje u svijetu,
07:07
but it has one big disadvantage.
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no ima jedan veliki nedostatak.
07:09
And that one big disadvantage
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Taj veliki nedostatak
07:11
is that, until you actually do all that learning,
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je da, dok ne naučite sve potrebno,
07:14
you're going to be helpless.
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bit ćete bespomoćni.
07:16
So you don't want to have the mastodon charging at you
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Ne želite se naći u situaciji da mastodont juri na vas
07:19
and be saying to yourself,
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i govoriti si:
07:21
"A slingshot or maybe a spear might work. Which would actually be better?"
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"Praćka bi mi mogla pomoći, ili možda koplje. Što bi bilo bolje?"
07:25
You want to know all that
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Želite znati sve to
07:27
before the mastodons actually show up.
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prije nego što se mastodonti stvarno pojave.
07:29
And the way the evolutions seems to have solved that problem
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Način na koji je evolucija očito riješila taj problem
07:32
is with a kind of division of labor.
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neka je vrsta podjele rada.
07:34
So the idea is that we have this early period when we're completely protected.
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Ideja je da postoji početno razdoblje u kojem smo zaštićeni.
07:37
We don't have to do anything. All we have to do is learn.
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Ne moramo činiti ništa. Moramo samo učiti.
07:40
And then as adults,
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Zatim, kao odrasli
07:42
we can take all those things that we learned when we were babies and children
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uzimamo sve ono što smo naučili kao bebe i djeca
07:45
and actually put them to work to do things out there in the world.
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i upotrijebiti to za razne stvari u stvarnom svijetu.
07:48
So one way of thinking about it
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Jedan od načina na koji možemo razmišljati
07:50
is that babies and young children
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je da su bebe i mala djeca
07:52
are like the research and development division of the human species.
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poput odjela za istraživanja i razvoj ljudske vrste.
07:55
So they're the protected blue sky guys
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Oni su zaštićena grupa na vrhu
07:58
who just have to go out and learn and have good ideas,
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koja samo mora istraživati, učiti i imati dobre ideje,
08:00
and we're production and marketing.
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a mi smo proizvodnja i marketing.
08:02
We have to take all those ideas
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Mi moramo uzeti sve te ideje
08:04
that we learned when we were children
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koje smo naučili kao djeca
08:06
and actually put them to use.
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i upotrijebiti ih.
08:08
Another way of thinking about it
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Drugi način na koji možemo razmišljati
08:10
is instead of thinking of babies and children
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je da, umjesto da smatramo bebe i djecu
08:12
as being like defective grownups,
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manjkavim odraslim ljudima,
08:14
we should think about them
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trebali bismo ih smatrati
08:16
as being a different developmental stage of the same species --
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drukčijim razvojnim stadijem iste vrste --
08:18
kind of like caterpillars and butterflies --
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poput gusjenica i leptira --
08:21
except that they're actually the brilliant butterflies
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osim što su oni zapravo pametni leptirići
08:23
who are flitting around the garden and exploring,
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koji lepršaju po vrtu i istražuju,
08:26
and we're the caterpillars
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a mi smo gusjenice
08:28
who are inching along our narrow, grownup, adult path.
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koje gmižu svojom uskom, zrelom, odraslom stazom.
08:31
If this is true, if these babies are designed to learn --
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Ako je to istina, ako su bebe stvorene da bi učile --
08:34
and this evolutionary story would say children are for learning,
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te bi prema toj evolucijskoj priči djeca bila za učenje,
08:37
that's what they're for --
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to je njihova svrha --
08:39
we might expect
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možemo očekivati
08:41
that they would have really powerful learning mechanisms.
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da imaju iznimno snažne mehanizme učenja.
08:43
And in fact, the baby's brain
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Čini se da je mozak bebe
08:46
seems to be the most powerful learning computer
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najsnažnije računalo za učenje
08:48
on the planet.
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na planetu.
08:50
But real computers are actually getting to be a lot better.
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No prava računala zapravo postaju mnogo bolja.
08:53
And there's been a revolution
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Došlo je do revolucije
08:55
in our understanding of machine learning recently.
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u našem shvaćanju strojnog učenja u zadnje vrijeme.
08:57
And it all depends on the ideas of this guy,
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A sve to ovisi o idejama ovog čovjeka,
09:00
the Reverend Thomas Bayes,
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Velečasnog Thomasa Bayesa,
09:02
who was a statistician and mathematician in the 18th century.
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statističara i matematičara iz 18. stoljeća.
09:05
And essentially what Bayes did
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U biti, ono što je Bayes učinio
09:08
was to provide a mathematical way
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bilo je pružanje matematičkog načina,
09:10
using probability theory
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tj. korištenje teorije vjerojatnosti,
09:12
to characterize, describe,
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za karakterizaciju, opisivanje
09:14
the way that scientists find out about the world.
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načina na koji znanstvenici spoznaju svijet.
09:16
So what scientists do
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Ono što znanstvenici čine
09:18
is they have a hypothesis that they think might be likely to start with.
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je da imaju hipotezu s kojom misle da bi mogli započeti.
09:21
They go out and test it against the evidence.
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Zatim je ispituju pomoću dokaza.
09:23
The evidence makes them change that hypothesis.
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Zbog dokaza moraju izmijeniti tu hipotezu.
09:25
Then they test that new hypothesis
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Zatim ispituju novu hipotezu
09:27
and so on and so forth.
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i tako dalje i tako dalje.
09:29
And what Bayes showed was a mathematical way that you could do that.
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Bayes je pokazao matematički način na koji to možete činiti
09:32
And that mathematics is at the core
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te da je matematika u samoj srži
09:34
of the best machine learning programs that we have now.
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najboljih programa za strojno učenje koje imamo.
09:36
And some 10 years ago,
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Prije nekih 10 godina
09:38
I suggested that babies might be doing the same thing.
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natuknula sam da je moguće da bebe rade istu stvar.
09:42
So if you want to know what's going on
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Dakle, ako želite znati što se događa
09:44
underneath those beautiful brown eyes,
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iza tih prekrasnih smeđih očiju,
09:46
I think it actually looks something like this.
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mislim da ćete dobiti nešto poput ovoga.
09:48
This is Reverend Bayes's notebook.
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Ovo je bilježnica Velečasnog Bayesa.
09:50
So I think those babies are actually making complicated calculations
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Mislim da bebe zapravo izvode komplicirane izračune
09:53
with conditional probabilities that they're revising
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uz moguće vjerojatnosti koje preispituju
09:56
to figure out how the world works.
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kako bi otkrili kako svijet funkcionira.
09:58
All right, now that might seem like an even taller order to actually demonstrate.
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Možda vam se čini da će taj poredak biti još teže dokazati
10:02
Because after all, if you ask even grownups about statistics,
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jer će čak i odrasli,
10:04
they look extremely stupid.
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ispast će glupi.
10:06
How could it be that children are doing statistics?
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Kako je onda moguće da djeca rade statističke izračune?
10:09
So to test this we used a machine that we have
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Da bismo to ispitali koristili smo
10:11
called the Blicket Detector.
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napravu po imenu Blicket Detector.
10:13
This is a box that lights up and plays music
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Radi se o kutiji koja se upali i počne svirati
10:15
when you put some things on it and not others.
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kada stavite točno određene stvari na nju.
10:18
And using this very simple machine,
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Korištenjem ove jednostavne naprave
10:20
my lab and others have done dozens of studies
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moj je laboratorij proveo na desetke istraživanja
10:22
showing just how good babies are
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koja su pokazala koliko bebe dobro
10:24
at learning about the world.
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uče o svijetu.
10:26
Let me mention just one
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Spomenut ću samo jedno
10:28
that we did with Tumar Kushner, my student.
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koje smo proveli s mojim studentom Tumarom Kushnerom.
10:30
If I showed you this detector,
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Kad bih vam pokazala detektor
10:32
you would be likely to think to begin with
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vjerojatno biste pomislili
10:34
that the way to make the detector go
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da možete aktivirati detektor
10:36
would be to put a block on top of the detector.
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tako da stavite blok na vrh.
10:39
But actually, this detector
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No taj detektor
10:41
works in a bit of a strange way.
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radi na pomalo neobičan način.
10:43
Because if you wave a block over the top of the detector,
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Ako mahnete blokom iznad detektora
10:46
something you wouldn't ever think of to begin with,
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na što ne biste ni pomislili,
10:49
the detector will actually activate two out of three times.
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detektor će se aktivirati dva od tri puta.
10:52
Whereas, if you do the likely thing, put the block on the detector,
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No ako učinite očekivano, tj. stavite blok na detektor,
10:55
it will only activate two out of six times.
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on će se aktivirati samo dva od šest puta.
10:59
So the unlikely hypothesis
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Manje vjerojatna hipoteza
11:01
actually has stronger evidence.
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zapravo ima snažnije dokaze.
11:03
It looks as if the waving
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Čini se da je mahanje
11:05
is a more effective strategy than the other strategy.
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učinkovitije od druge navedene strategije.
11:07
So we did just this; we gave four year-olds this pattern of evidence,
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Upravo smo to učinili; dali smo četverogodišnjacima taj uzorak
11:10
and we just asked them to make it go.
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i pitali smo ih da ga aktiviraju.
11:12
And sure enough, the four year-olds used the evidence
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Naravno, četverogodišnjaci su upotrijebili dokaze
11:15
to wave the object on top of the detector.
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i mahali predmetom iznad detektora.
11:18
Now there are two things that are really interesting about this.
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Dvije su stvari u vezi ovoga doista zanimljive.
11:21
The first one is, again, remember, these are four year-olds.
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Jedna je, podsjetimo se, radi se o četverogodišnjacima.
11:24
They're just learning how to count.
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Oni tek uče brojati.
11:26
But unconsciously,
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No nesvjesno
11:28
they're doing these quite complicated calculations
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izvode prilično komplicirane izračune
11:30
that will give them a conditional probability measure.
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koji će im dati mjeru za vjerojatnost.
11:33
And the other interesting thing
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Druga je zanimljiva stvar
11:35
is that they're using that evidence
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da koriste te dokaze
11:37
to get to an idea, get to a hypothesis about the world,
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da bi stvorili ideju, hipotezu o svijetu,
11:40
that seems very unlikely to begin with.
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koja se na samome početku ne čini izglednom.
11:43
And in studies we've just been doing in my lab, similar studies,
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Sličnim ispitivanjima koja trenutno provodimo u mojem laboratoriju
11:46
we've show that four year-olds are actually better
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pokazali smo da su četverogodišnjaci zapravo bolji
11:48
at finding out an unlikely hypothesis
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u otkrivanju manje vjerojatnih hipoteza
11:51
than adults are when we give them exactly the same task.
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nego odrasli, kada im damo potpuno isti zadatak.
11:54
So in these circumstances,
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U tim okolnostima
11:56
the children are using statistics to find out about the world,
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djeca koriste statistiku da bi došla do saznanja o svijetu,
11:59
but after all, scientists also do experiments,
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no na koncu, znanstvenici također izvode pokuse,
12:02
and we wanted to see if children are doing experiments.
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a mi smo željeli saznate izvode li djeca pokuse.
12:05
When children do experiments we call it "getting into everything"
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Kada djeca eksperimentiraju, kažemo da "guraju nos svuda"
12:08
or else "playing."
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ili se "igraju".
12:10
And there's been a bunch of interesting studies recently
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U zadnje je vrijeme provedeno mnoštvo zanimljivih ispitivanja
12:13
that have shown this playing around
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koja pokazuju da je njihovo igranje
12:16
is really a kind of experimental research program.
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zapravo vrsta eksperimentalnog programa istraživanja.
12:18
Here's one from Cristine Legare's lab.
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Navest ću jedno iz laboratorija Cristine Le Gare.
12:21
What Cristine did was use our Blicket Detectors.
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Cristine je upotrijebila naš detektor
12:24
And what she did was show children
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Pokazala je djeci
12:26
that yellow ones made it go and red ones didn't,
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da će ga žuti aktivirati, a crveni neće,
12:28
and then she showed them an anomaly.
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a zatim im je pokazala jednu nepravilnost.
12:31
And what you'll see
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Vidjet ćete
12:33
is that this little boy will go through five hypotheses
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da će ovaj dječačić proći pet hipoteza
12:36
in the space of two minutes.
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unutar dvije minute.
12:39
(Video) Boy: How about this?
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(Videozapis) Dječak: A ovako?
12:43
Same as the other side.
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Isto kao i s druge strane.
12:46
Alison Gopnik: Okay, so his first hypothesis has just been falsified.
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Alison Gopnik: Prva hipoteza upravo se pokazala netočnom.
12:55
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
12:57
Boy: This one lighted up, and this one nothing.
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Dječak: Ova se upalila, a ova nije.
13:00
AG: Okay, he's got his experimental notebook out.
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AG: Pripremio je svoju bilježnicu za eksperimente.
13:06
Boy: What's making this light up.
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Dječak: Kako se ova upali?
13:11
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
13:20
I don't know.
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Ne znam.
13:22
AG: Every scientist will recognize that expression of despair.
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AG: Svaki će znanstvenik prepoznati ovaj izraz očaja.
13:26
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
13:29
Boy: Oh, it's because this needs to be like this,
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Dječak: O, to je zato što mora biti kao ova,
13:35
and this needs to be like this.
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a ova mora biti kao ova.
13:37
AG: Okay, hypothesis two.
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AG: OK, druga hipoteza.
13:40
Boy: That's why.
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Dečko: Eto zašto.
13:42
Oh.
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Oh.
13:44
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
13:49
AG: Now this is his next idea.
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AG: A sada sljedeća ideja.
13:51
He told the experimenter to do this,
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Rekao je eksperimentatorici da učini ovo,
13:53
to try putting it out onto the other location.
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da ga pokuša staviti na drugi.
13:57
Not working either.
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Ni to nije upalilo.
14:02
Boy: Oh, because the light goes only to here,
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Dječak: O, zato što svjetlo ide samo do ovdje,
14:06
not here.
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a ne do ovdje.
14:09
Oh, the bottom of this box
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Dno ove kutije
14:12
has electricity in here,
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ima struju unutra,
14:14
but this doesn't have electricity.
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ali ova nema struju.
14:16
AG: Okay, that's a fourth hypothesis.
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AG: OK, to je četvrta hipoteza.
14:18
Boy: It's lighting up.
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Dječak: Pali se.
14:20
So when you put four.
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Znači kada staviš četiri.
14:26
So you put four on this one to make it light up
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Staviš četiri na ovu da se upali
14:29
and two on this one to make it light up.
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i dva na ovu da se upali.
14:31
AG: Okay,there's his fifth hypothesis.
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AG: OK, eto i pete hipoteze.
14:33
Now that is a particularly --
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To je posebno --
14:36
that is a particularly adorable and articulate little boy,
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posebno simpatičan i rječit dječačić,
14:39
but what Cristine discovered is this is actually quite typical.
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no Cristine je otkrila da je to zapravo prilično tipično.
14:42
If you look at the way children play, when you ask them to explain something,
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Ako pogledate način na koji se djeca igraju, kada ih pitate da nešto objasne,
14:45
what they really do is do a series of experiments.
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oni zapravo izvode niz eksperimenata.
14:48
This is actually pretty typical of four year-olds.
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To je zapravo tipično za četverogodišnjake.
14:51
Well, what's it like to be this kind of creature?
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No, kako je to biti ovakvo stvorenje?
14:54
What's it like to be one of these brilliant butterflies
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Kako je to biti jedan od ovih bistrih leptirića
14:57
who can test five hypotheses in two minutes?
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koji mogu ispitati pet hipoteza u dvije minute?
15:00
Well, if you go back to those psychologists and philosophers,
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Ako se vratimo onim psiholozima i filozofima,
15:03
a lot of them have said
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mnogo ih je reklo
15:05
that babies and young children were barely conscious
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da su bebe i mala djeca jedva svjesna
15:07
if they were conscious at all.
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ako uopće i jesu svjesna.
15:09
And I think just the opposite is true.
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Mislim da je točno upravo suprotno.
15:11
I think babies and children are actually more conscious than we are as adults.
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Mislim da su bebe i djeca zapravo svjesnija nego mi kao odrasli.
15:14
Now here's what we know about how adult consciousness works.
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Evo što znamo o tome kako funkcionira svjesnost odraslih.
15:17
And adults' attention and consciousness
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Pažnja i svijest odraslih
15:19
look kind of like a spotlight.
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izgleda poput snopa svjetlosti.
15:21
So what happens for adults
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Kod odraslih se događa
15:23
is we decide that something's relevant or important,
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da odlučuju je li nešto relevantno ili važno
15:25
we should pay attention to it.
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i trebaju li na to obratiti pažnju.
15:27
Our consciousness of that thing that we're attending to
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Naša svijest o toj stvari koju pratimo
15:29
becomes extremely bright and vivid,
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postaje blještava i jasna
15:32
and everything else sort of goes dark.
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a sve ostalo postaje tamno.
15:34
And we even know something about the way the brain does this.
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Čak i znamo nešto o načinu na koji mozak to radi.
15:37
So what happens when we pay attention
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Kada na nešto obratimo pozornost
15:39
is that the prefrontal cortex, the sort of executive part of our brains,
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prefrontalni korteks, neka vrsta izvršnog dijela mozga,
15:42
sends a signal
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šalje signal
15:44
that makes a little part of our brain much more flexible,
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koji maleni dio mozga čini znatno fleksibilnijim
15:46
more plastic, better at learning,
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gipkijim, sposobnijim za učenje,
15:48
and shuts down activity
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a gasi aktivnost
15:50
in all the rest of our brains.
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u ostalim dijelovima mozga.
15:52
So we have a very focused, purpose-driven kind of attention.
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Naša je pažnja veoma usredotočena, usmjerena na ostvarenje cilja.
15:56
If we look at babies and young children,
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Ako pogledamo bebe i malu djecu
15:58
we see something very different.
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vidjet ćemo nešto veoma različito.
16:00
I think babies and young children
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Mislim da bebe i mala djeca
16:02
seem to have more of a lantern of consciousness
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prije imaju nešto poput lanterne svjesnosti
16:04
than a spotlight of consciousness.
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nego usmjerenog snopa.
16:06
So babies and young children are very bad
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Bebe i mala djeca nisu dobra
16:09
at narrowing down to just one thing.
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u usredotočavanju samo na jednu stvar.
16:12
But they're very good at taking in lots of information
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No veoma su dobre u primanju mnoštva informacija
16:15
from lots of different sources at once.
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iz raznih izvora istovremeno.
16:17
And if you actually look in their brains,
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Ako pogledate njihove mozgove,
16:19
you see that they're flooded with these neurotransmitters
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vidjet ćete da su prepuni neurotransmitera
16:22
that are really good at inducing learning and plasticity,
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koji su dobri u poticanju učenja i prilagodljivosti
16:24
and the inhibitory parts haven't come on yet.
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a inhibitorni se dijelovi nisu još pojavili.
16:27
So when we say that babies and young children
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Kada kažemo da bebe i mala djeca
16:29
are bad at paying attention,
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nisu dobra u obraćanju pozornosti
16:31
what we really mean is that they're bad at not paying attention.
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zapravo mislimo da nisu dobra u neobraćanju pozornosti.
16:35
So they're bad at getting rid
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Nisu dobra u odbacivanju
16:37
of all the interesting things that could tell them something
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svih zanimljivih stvari koje bi im nešto mogle otkriti
16:39
and just looking at the thing that's important.
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i usredotočavanju na jednu stvar koja je bitna.
16:41
That's the kind of attention, the kind of consciousness,
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To je vrsta pozornosti, vrsta svjesnosti,
16:44
that we might expect
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koju možemo očekivati
16:46
from those butterflies who are designed to learn.
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od tih leptirića koji su stvoreni da bi učili.
16:48
Well if we want to think about a way
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Ako želimo razmisliti o načinu
16:50
of getting a taste of that kind of baby consciousness as adults,
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na koji mi kao odrasli možemo dobiti malo dječje svjesnosti,
16:54
I think the best thing is think about cases
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mislim da je najbolje razmisliti o slučajevima
16:56
where we're put in a new situation that we've never been in before --
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kada smo u novoj situaciji u kojoj se nikad prije nismo našli --
16:59
when we fall in love with someone new,
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kada se zaljubimo u nekoga novoga,
17:01
or when we're in a new city for the first time.
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ili kada smo prvi put u novom gradu.
17:04
And what happens then is not that our consciousness contracts,
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Tada se naša svjesnost ne skuplja,
17:06
it expands,
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ona se širi
17:08
so that those three days in Paris
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pa se tri dana u Parizu
17:10
seem to be more full of consciousness and experience
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čine punija svjesnosti i iskustava
17:12
than all the months of being
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nego svi mjeseci u kojima
17:14
a walking, talking, faculty meeting-attending zombie back home.
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kao zombi hodamo, govorimo i idemo na sastanke u svome gradu.
17:18
And by the way, that coffee,
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Usput, ta kava,
17:20
that wonderful coffee you've been drinking downstairs,
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ta izvrsna kava koju ste popili dolje,
17:22
actually mimics the effect
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zapravo oponaša učinak
17:24
of those baby neurotransmitters.
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dječjih neurotransmitera.
17:26
So what's it like to be a baby?
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Kako je to biti beba?
17:28
It's like being in love
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Kao da ste zaljubljeni
17:30
in Paris for the first time
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dok ste prvi put u Parizu
17:32
after you've had three double-espressos.
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nakon što ste popili tri dupla espressa.
17:34
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
17:37
That's a fantastic way to be,
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To je fantastično stanje,
17:39
but it does tend to leave you waking up crying at three o'clock in the morning.
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no moglo bi se dogoditi da se probudite u suzama u tri sata ujutro.
17:43
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
17:46
Now it's good to be a grownup.
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Nije loše biti odrasla osoba.
17:48
I don't want to say too much about how wonderful babies are.
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Ne želim reći previše o tome kako su bebe divne.
17:50
It's good to be a grownup.
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Nije loše biti odrastao.
17:52
We can do things like tie our shoelaces and cross the street by ourselves.
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Sami možemo vezati vezice na cipelama i prelaziti cestu.
17:55
And it makes sense that we put a lot of effort
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Ima smisla to što ulažemo mnogo truda
17:57
into making babies think like adults do.
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da bismo naučili bebe da misle kao odrasli.
18:01
But if what we want is to be like those butterflies,
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No ako želimo biti poput tih leptirića,
18:04
to have open-mindedness, open learning,
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biti otvoreni za nove ideje, spremni na učenje,
18:07
imagination, creativity, innovation,
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maštu, kreativnost, inovacije,
18:09
maybe at least some of the time
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barem dio vremena
18:11
we should be getting the adults
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trebali bismo poticati odrasle
18:13
to start thinking more like children.
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da počnu razmišljati više kao djeca.
18:15
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
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