Why you should know how much your coworkers get paid | David Burkus

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2016-10-11・ 2536    386


How much do you get paid? How does it compare to the people you work with? You should know, and so should they, says management researcher David Burkus. In this talk, Burkus questions our cultural assumptions around keeping salaries secret and makes a compelling case for why sharing them could benefit employees, organizations and society. TEDTalks is a daily video podcast of the best talks and performances from the TED Conference, where the world's leading thinkers and doers give the talk of their lives in 18 minutes (or less). Look for talks on Technology, Entertainment and Design -- plus science, business, global issues, the arts and much more. Find closed captions and translated subtitles in many languages at http://www.ted.com/translate Follow TED news on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/tednews Like TED on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TED Subscribe to our channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/TEDtalksDirector

Instruction

Double-click on the English captions to play the video from there.

翻译人员: Yangyang Liu 校对人员: Junyi Sha
00:13
How much do you get paid?
你的工资是多少?
00:15
Don't answer that out loud.
先别说出来。
00:17
But put a number in your head.
在脑子里想一下。
00:20
Now: How much do you think the person sitting next to you gets paid?
现在想想: 你觉得邻座的工资是多少?
00:25
Again, don't answer out loud.
也别说出来。
00:27
(Laughter)
(笑声)
00:29
At work, how much do you think
你觉得办公室里
00:31
the person sitting in the cubicle or the desk next to you gets paid?
坐在旁边的同事的工资又是多少?
00:35
Do you know?
你知道吗?
00:36
Should you know?
你应该知道吗?
00:38
Notice, it's a little uncomfortable for me to even ask you those questions.
问这些问题连我都觉得不太自在,
00:42
But admit it -- you kind of want to know.
但是承认吧—— 你有点想知道答案。
00:46
Most of us are uncomfortable with the idea of broadcasting our salary.
我们大多数人都不想 告诉别人自己的工资,
00:50
We're not supposed to tell our neighbors,
我们不想把工资告诉邻居,
00:52
and we're definitely not supposed to tell our office neighbors.
也绝对不想告诉办公室的同事。
00:55
The assumed reason is that if everybody knew what everybody got paid,
可能如果大家都知道别人的工资,
00:59
then all hell would break loose.
就要天下大乱了。
01:01
There'd be arguments, there'd be fights,
可能会出现争吵,打架,
01:03
there might even be a few people who quit.
甚至会有人辞职。
01:05
But what if secrecy is actually the reason for all that strife?
但如果这个秘密恰恰 就是冲突的起因呢?
01:09
And what would happen if we removed that secrecy?
如果我们揭开这个秘密会发生什么呢?
01:12
What if openness actually increased the sense of fairness and collaboration
公开薪资能不能增进公司内部的合作,
还有公平感呢?
01:16
inside a company?
01:17
What would happen if we had total pay transparency?
如果完全公开薪资信息,那会发生什么呢?
01:22
For the past several years,
过去的几年里,
01:23
I've been studying the corporate and entrepreneurial leaders
我一直在研究那些质疑 传统经营理念的
01:26
who question the conventional wisdom about how to run a company.
企业家和创业者。
01:30
And the question of pay keeps coming up.
而薪资待遇的问题不断浮出水面。
01:33
And the answers keep surprising.
答案也在不断挑战传统观念。
01:36
It turns out that pay transparency --
结果表明,薪资透明 —
01:38
sharing salaries openly across a company --
在整个公司中公开薪资数据 —
01:40
makes for a better workplace for both the employee
会为雇员和雇主
营造更好的工作环境。
01:43
and for the organization.
01:45
When people don't know how their pay compares to their peers',
当人们不知道他们同事的工资时,
01:48
they're more likely to feel underpaid
他们总会感觉自己工资太低,
01:50
and maybe even discriminated against.
甚至受到了歧视。
01:52
Do you want to work at a place that tolerates the idea
你想在一个你觉得自己的工资太低
01:55
that you feel underpaid or discriminated against?
或者遭到歧视的地方工作吗?
01:58
But keeping salaries secret does exactly that,
对薪资保密恰恰会导致这样的结果,
02:01
and it's a practice as old as it is common,
却被长期且普遍的接受,
02:04
despite the fact that in the United States,
尽管美国法律
02:06
the law protects an employee's right to discuss their pay.
保护雇员讨论薪资的权利。
02:11
In one famous example from decades ago,
几十年前,有一个著名的例子,
02:13
the management of Vanity Fair magazine
《名利场》杂志的管理层
02:16
actually circulated a memo entitled:
发布了一条规则:
02:18
"Forbidding Discussion Among Employees of Salary Received."
“禁止员工讨论工资。”
02:21
"Forbidding" discussion among employees of salary received.
“禁止”员工讨论工资。
02:25
Now that memo didn't sit well with everybody.
不是所有人都 接受得了这条规则,
02:27
New York literary figures Dorothy Parker,
纽约文坛人物多乐西·帕克,
02:29
Robert Benchley and Robert Sherwood,
罗伯特·本克利 和罗伯特·舍伍德,
02:31
all writers in the Algonquin Round Table,
三位阿冈昆圆桌会议的作家,
02:33
decided to stand up for transparency
决定为薪资透明而战,
02:35
and showed up for work the next day
第二天上班时,
02:37
with their salary written on signs hanging from their neck.
他们脖子上挂了个牌子, 上面写了自己的工资。
02:40
(Laughter)
(笑声)
02:42
Imagine showing up for work
想象一下你去上班时,
02:44
with your salary just written across your chest for all to see.
胸前挂着工资牌,谁都能看到。
02:49
But why would a company even want to discourage salary discussions?
但是为什么公司 会反对讨论薪资呢?
02:52
Why do some people go along with it, while others revolt against it?
为什么一些人服从, 而另一些人反对呢?
02:57
It turns out that in addition to the assumed reasons,
除了之前猜测的理由之外,
03:00
pay secrecy is actually a way to save a lot of money.
对薪资保密还是省钱的良方。
03:04
You see, keeping salaries secret
想想看,工资不透明会导致
03:06
leads to what economists call "information asymmetry."
经济学家所说的“信息不对称”。
03:09
This is a situation where, in a negotiation,
在这种情况下谈判的双方,
03:11
one party has loads more information than the other.
一方比另一方掌握更多的信息。
03:14
And in hiring or promotion or annual raise discussions,
在招聘、升职、加薪的讨论中,
03:18
an employer can use that secrecy to save a lot of money.
雇主就可以用这个秘密省很多钱。
03:22
Imagine how much better you could negotiate for a raise
想象一下,知道每个人的工资,
对你的加薪谈判多么有利。
03:25
if you knew everybody's salary.
03:29
Economists warn that information asymmetry
经济学家提醒道:信息不对称
03:32
can cause markets to go awry.
会导致市场偏离正轨。
03:33
Someone leaves a pay stub on the copier,
如果有人在复印时 不小心遗留了一张工资表,
03:35
and suddenly everybody is shouting at each other.
很快大家就会彼此争论起来。
03:38
In fact, they even warn
事实上,经济学家甚至还提醒,
03:40
that information asymmetry can lead to a total market failure.
信息不对称可能导致市场失调。
03:46
And I think we're almost there.
我认为我们正处在这个边缘,
03:48
Here's why:
原因就在于:
03:49
first, most employees have no idea how their pay compares to their peers'.
首先,大部分雇员不清楚 自己与同事的工资存在多少差异。
03:54
In a 2015 survey of 70,000 employees,
在2015年进行的一项 覆盖7万名雇员的调查中,
03:58
two-thirds of everyone who is paid at the market rate
三分之二的调查者 认为他们被压低了薪水,
04:02
said that they felt they were underpaid.
虽然他们拿到的都是基于市场 正常水平支付的工资。
04:05
And of everybody who felt that they were underpaid,
这些认为被压低工资的人,
04:07
60 percent said that they intended to quit,
有60%说他们想要辞职,
04:10
regardless of where they were -- underpaid, overpaid
不管他们的实际工资 是过低还是过高,
04:13
or right at the market rate.
还是恰好在正常水平。
04:16
If you were part of this survey, what would you say?
如果你参与这个调查, 你会怎么说?
04:18
Are you underpaid?
你被压低工资了吗?
04:19
Well, wait -- how do you even know,
等一下,既然都 不允许谈论工资,
04:22
because you're not allowed to talk about it?
你又怎么知道是被压低了?
04:24
Next, information asymmetry, pay secrecy,
其次,信息不对称, 薪资保密,
04:28
makes it easier to ignore the discrimination
会让市场中现实存在的歧视
04:31
that's already present in the market today.
更容易被忽视。
04:34
In a 2011 report from the Institute for Women's Policy Research,
妇女政策研究协会在 2011年发布的一份报告显示,
04:37
the gender wage gap between men and women
男性和女性的工资差距
04:40
was 23 percent.
高达23%。
04:42
This is where that 77 cents on the dollar comes from.
这就是“1美元中的77美分” (职场女性的薪酬是男性同事的77%)的来历。
04:45
But in the Federal Government,
但在联邦政府部门,
薪资是有固定标准的,
04:47
where salaries are pinned to certain levels
每个雇员都清楚这个标准,
04:49
and everybody knows what those levels are,
那里的性别薪资 差距就只有11% —
04:51
the gender wage gap shrinks to 11 percent --
04:53
and this is before controlling for any of the factors
这还是在实施经济学家呼吁的
04:55
that economists argue over whether or not to control for.
控制措施之前的数据。
04:59
If we really want to close the gender wage gap,
如果我们真的想 消除性别薪资差距,
05:01
maybe we should start by opening up the payroll.
可能需要从公开工资单开始。
05:04
If this is what total market failure looks like,
如果市场失灵就是这个样子,
05:08
then openness remains the only way to ensure fairness.
那公开透明仍是 保证公平的唯一方法。
05:12
Now, I realize that letting people know what you make
我知道公开收入,
05:14
might feel uncomfortable,
可能让人不舒服,
05:16
but isn't it less uncomfortable
但总是怀疑
自己被歧视,
05:18
than always wondering if you're being discriminated against,
05:20
or if your wife or your daughter or your sister is being paid unfairly?
或者家里的女性被不公平的 压低薪水不是更让人郁闷吗?
05:25
Openness remains the best way to ensure fairness,
公开是保证公平的最好手段,
05:29
and pay transparency does that.
薪资透明就是一种。
05:31
That's why entrepreneurial leaders and corporate leaders
这就是这些年 企业家和创业者们
05:34
have been experimenting with sharing salaries for years.
尝试公开薪资的原因,
05:37
Like Dane Atkinson.
比如戴恩·阿特金森。
05:38
Dane is a serial entrepreneur who started many companies
戴恩是位连续创业者, 他在创建前几个公司时
05:42
in a pay secrecy condition
使用了薪资保密制度,
05:44
and even used that condition to pay two equally qualified people
甚至会给两个能力相同的员工
05:47
dramatically different salaries,
支付截然不同的薪水,
05:49
depending on how well they could negotiate.
仅仅因为他们 谈薪水的能力不同。
05:52
And Dane saw the strife that happened as a result of this.
戴恩发现这导致了冲突。
05:55
So when he started his newest company, SumAll,
所以当他创办新公司 SumAll 时,
他从一开始就实施了透明薪资制度。
05:58
he committed to salary transparency from the beginning.
06:01
And the results have been amazing.
然而效果出乎意料的好。
06:04
And in study after study,
在一个个的研究中,
06:06
when people know how they're being paid
当人们知道他们的收入
06:07
and how that pay compares to their peers',
和同事相比处于什么水平,
他们会加倍努力工作,提高绩效,
06:10
they're more likely to work hard to improve their performance,
06:12
more likely to be engaged, and they're less likely to quit.
更容易被动员,更不容易辞职。
06:15
That's why Dane's not alone.
这就是为什么像戴恩 一样的人越来越多。
06:17
From technology start-ups like Buffer,
从类似 Buffer 的初创科技公司,
06:19
to the tens of thousands of employees at Whole Foods,
到 Whole Foods 这样的 数万人的大公司,
06:23
where not only is your salary available for everyone to see,
不但大家的薪资都透明化,
06:26
but the performance data for the store and for your department
而且每个分店、 每个部门的绩效数据
06:29
is available on the company intranet
也在公司内网
06:31
for all to see.
对所有人公开。
06:33
Now, pay transparency takes a lot of forms.
实际上,薪资透明有很多方式,
06:36
It's not one size fits all.
并不是一成不变的。
06:38
Some post their salaries for all to see.
有的公司把薪资向所有人公开。
06:40
Some only keep it inside the company.
有的只是在公司内部公开,
06:42
Some post the formula for calculating pay,
有的公开薪资的计算公式,
06:45
and others post the pay levels
有的公开他们的薪资级别,
06:47
and affix everybody to that level.
并且公开员工对应的级别。
06:49
So you don't have to make signs
所以你不用为每个员工
06:51
for all of your employees to wear around the office.
做个工资牌挂在身上。
06:53
And you don't have to be the only one wearing a sign
你也不用像三位作家一样
06:56
that you made at home.
自己做个工资牌挂在身上。
06:58
But we can all take greater steps towards pay transparency.
但我们可以一起努力, 推进薪资透明化。
07:02
For those of you that have the authority
如果你有权利在公司里
07:04
to move forward towards transparency:
推进工资透明化:
现在是你向前迈进的时候了。
07:06
it's time to move forward.
07:07
And for those of you that don't have that authority:
如果你没有这样的权利,
现在就是站起来, 争取这个权利的时候。
07:10
it's time to stand up for your right to.
07:13
So how much do you get paid?
那么,你的工资是多少呢?
07:16
And how does that compare to the people you work with?
和你的同事相比怎么样?
07:19
You should know.
你应该知道。
07:21
And so should they.
他们也应该知道。
07:23
Thank you.
谢谢。
07:25
(Applause)
(掌声)
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