How do you explain consciousness? | David Chalmers

Prevodilac: Ivana Krivokuća Lektor: Mile Živković

Right now

Baš sada

you have a movie playing inside your head.

vam se odvija film u glavi.

It's an amazing multi-track movie.

To je neverovatan film na više kanala.

It has 3D vision and surround sound

Ima 3D vid i okružujući zvuk

for what you're seeing and hearing right now,

za ono što sada vidite i čujete,

but that's just the start of it.

ali to je samo početak.

Your movie has smell and taste and touch.

Vaš film ima miris i ukus i dodir.

It has a sense of your body,

Ima osećaj vašeg tela,

pain, hunger, orgasms.

bol, glad, orgazme.

It has emotions,

Ima emocije,

anger and happiness.

gnev i sreću.

It has memories, like scenes from your childhood

Ima sećanja, kao što su scene iz vašeg detinjstva

playing before you.

koje se odigravaju pred vama.

And it has this constant voiceover narrative

I ima taj stalni narativ

in your stream of conscious thinking.

u vašem toku svesnog razmišljanja.

At the heart of this movie is you

U srcu ovog filma ste vi

experiencing all this directly.

koji to direktno doživljavate.

This movie is your stream of consciousness,

Ovaj film je vaš tok svesti,

the subject of experience

predmet iskustva

of the mind and the world.

uma i sveta.

Consciousness is one of the fundamental facts

Svest je jedna od fundamentalnih činjenica

of human existence.

ljudskog postojanja.

Each of us is conscious.

Svako od nas je svestan.

We all have our own inner movie,

Svi mi imamo naš sopstveni unutrašnji film,

you and you and you.

vi i vi i vi.

There's nothing we know about more directly.

Ne postoji ništa o čemu znamo više direktno.

At least, I know about my consciousness directly.

Ili makar ja znam o svojoj svesti direktno.

I can't be certain that you guys are conscious.

Ne mogu da budem siguran da ste vi svesni.

Consciousness also is what makes life worth living.

Svest je takođe ono što čini život vrednim življenja.

If we weren't conscious, nothing in our lives

Kada ne bismo bili svesni, ništa u našim životima

would have meaning or value.

ne bi imalo smisao niti vrednost.

But at the same time, it's the most

Ali istovremeno, to je

mysterious phenomenon in the universe.

najmisterioznija pojava u univerzumu.

Why are we conscious?

Zašto smo svesni? Zašto imamo te unutrašnje filmove?

Why do we have these inner movies?

Why aren't we just robots

Zašto nismo samo roboti

who process all this input,

koji obrađuju sve te ulazne podatke,

produce all that output,

proizvode sve te izlazne podatke,

without experiencing the inner movie at all?

bez doživljavanja unutrašnjeg filma?

Right now, nobody knows the answers

U ovom trenutku, niko ne zna odgovore

to those questions.

na ta pitanja.

I'm going to suggest that to integrate consciousness

Ukazaću da,

za integrisanje svesti u nauku

into science, some radical ideas may be needed.

mogu biti potrebne neke radikalne ideje.

Some people say a science of consciousness

Neki ljudi kažu da je nauka svesti nemoguća.

is impossible.

Science, by its nature, is objective.

Nauka je, po svojoj prirodi, objektivna.

Consciousness, by its nature, is subjective.

Svest je, po svojoj prirodi, subjektivna.

So there can never be a science of consciousness.

Dakle, nikada ne može postojati nauka o svesti.

For much of the 20th century, that view held sway.

Većim delom XX veka, to gledište je bilo uzdrmano.

Psychologists studied behavior objectively,

Psiholozi su proučavali ponašanje objektivno,

neuroscientists studied the brain objectively,

neurolozi su proučavali mozak objektivno,

and nobody even mentioned consciousness.

a niko nije čak ni pomenuo svest.

Even 30 years ago, when TED got started,

Čak i pre 30 godina, kada je TED započeo,

there was very little scientific work

bilo je veoma malo naučnog rada

on consciousness.

o svesti.

Now, about 20 years ago,

Pre oko 20 godina,

all that began to change.

sve to je počelo da se menja.

Neuroscientists like Francis Crick

Neurolozi kao što je Frensis Krik

and physicists like Roger Penrose

i fizičari poput Rodžera Penroza

said now is the time for science

govorili su da je vreme da se nauka

to attack consciousness.

lati svesti.

And since then, there's been a real explosion,

I od tada, nastala je prava eksplozija,

a flowering of scientific work

procvat naučnog rada

on consciousness.

o svesti. I taj rad je bio izvanredan.

And this work has been wonderful. It's been great.

Bio je sjajan.

But it also has some fundamental

Ali takođe ima nekih fundamentalnih ograničenja za sada.

limitations so far.

The centerpiece

Središnje mesto

of the science of consciousness in recent years

u nauci o svesti poslednjih godina

has been the search for correlations,

je imala potraga za korelacijama,

correlations between certain areas of the brain

korelacijama između određenih oblasti mozga

and certain states of consciousness.

i određenih stanja svesti.

Videli smo neke od ovih radova kod Nensi Kanvišer i izvrsnog rada

We saw some of this kind of work

from Nancy Kanwisher and the wonderful work

she presented just a few minutes ago.

koji je predstavila pre samo nekoliko minuta.

Now we understand much better, for example,

Sada mnogo bolje razumemo, na primer,

the kinds of brain areas that go along with

vrste moždanih oblasti koje idu uz

the conscious experience of seeing faces

svesno iskustvo gledanja lica

or of feeling pain

ili osećanja bola

or of feeling happy.

ili osećanja sreće.

But this is still a science of correlations.

Ali ovo je još uvek nauka korelacija.

It's not a science of explanations.

To nije nauka objašnjenja.

We know that these brain areas

Znamo da ove oblasti mozga

go along with certain kinds of conscious experience,

idu uz određene vrste svesnog iskustva,

but we don't know why they do.

ali ne znamo zašto je to tako.

I like to put this by saying

Volim da to istaknem govoreći

that this kind of work from neuroscience

da ova vrsta rada neurologije

is answering some of the questions

odgovara na neka pitanja

we want answered about consciousness,

o svesti na koja želimo odgovore,

the questions about what certain brain areas do

pitanja o tome

šta određene moždane oblasti rade i sa čim koreliraju.

and what they correlate with.

But in a certain sense, those are the easy problems.

Ali na neki način, to su laki problemi.

No knock on the neuroscientists.

Prepad na neuronaučnike.

There are no truly easy problems with consciousness.

Nema zaista lakih problema sa svešću.

But it doesn't address the real mystery

Ali to se ne odnosi na stvarnu misteriju

at the core of this subject:

u srži ovog predmeta:

why is it that all that physical processing in a brain

zašto uopšte sva psihička procesovanja u mozgu

should be accompanied by consciousness at all?

treba da budu praćena svesnošću?

Why is there this inner subjective movie?

Zašto postoji ovaj unutrašnji subjektivni film?

Right now, we don't really have a bead on that.

U ovom trenutku, nemamo baš jasnu metu za to.

And you might say,

I možete reći: "Hajde samo

let's just give neuroscience a few years.

da damo neurologiji nekoliko godina.

It'll turn out to be another emergent phenomenon

Ispostaviće se da je to još jedna popularna pojava,

like traffic jams, like hurricanes,

kao što su zastoji u saobraćaju, uragani,

like life, and we'll figure it out.

kao što je život, i otkrićemo ga.

The classical cases of emergence

Klasični slučajevi pojavljivanja

are all cases of emergent behavior,

su svi slučajevi pojavnog ponašanja,

how a traffic jam behaves,

kako se saobraćajna gužva ponaša,

how a hurricane functions,

kako uragan funkcioniše,

how a living organism reproduces

kako se živi organizam razmožava i prilagođava i metaboliše,

and adapts and metabolizes,

all questions about objective functioning.

sve su to pitanja o objektivnom funkcionisanju.

You could apply that to the human brain

Možete to primeniti na ljudskom mozgu pri objašnjavanju

in explaining some of the behaviors

nekih ponašanja i funkcija

and the functions of the human brain

ljudskog mozga kao pojavnog fenomena:

as emergent phenomena:

how we walk, how we talk, how we play chess,

kako hodamo,

govorimo, igramo šah,

all these questions about behavior.

sva ta pitanja o ponašanju.

But when it comes to consciousness,

Ali kada se radi o svesti,

questions about behavior

pitanja o ponašanju

are among the easy problems.

su među lakim problemima.

When it comes to the hard problem,

Kada je u pitanju težak problem,

that's the question of why is it

to je pitanje

that all this behavior

zašto je sve to ponašanje

is accompanied by subjective experience?

praćeno subjektivnim iskustvom?

And here, the standard paradigm

I ovde, standardna paradigma pojavnosti,

of emergence,

even the standard paradigms of neuroscience,

čak i standardna paradigma neurologije,

don't really, so far, have that much to say.

nemaju zaista, za sada, mnogo toga da kažu.

Now, I'm a scientific materialist at heart.

Ja sam naučni materijalista u srcu.

I want a scientific theory of consciousness

Želim naučnu teoriju svesti

that works,

koja funkcioniše,

and for a long time, I banged my head

i dugo vremena sam udarao glavom o zid

against the wall

looking for a theory of consciousness

tragajući za teorijom svesti

in purely physical terms

u čistim fizičkim terminima

that would work.

koja bi funkcionisala.

But I eventually came to the conclusion

Ali sam najzad došao do zaključka da to prosto nije funkcionisalo

that that just didn't work for systematic reasons.

zbog sistematskih razloga.

It's a long story,

Duga je to priča, ali suštinska ideja

but the core idea is just that what you get

je da ono što dobijate iz potpuno redukcionističkih objašnjenja

from purely reductionist explanations

in physical terms, in brain-based terms,

u fizičkim terminima na osnovi mozga,

is stories about the functioning of a system,

u pričama o funkcionisanju sistema,

its structure, its dynamics,

njegove strukture, njegove dinamike,

the behavior it produces,

ponašanja koje proizvodi,

great for solving the easy problems —

sjajno za rešavanje lakih problema --

how we behave, how we function —

kako se ponašamo, kako funkcionišemo -

but when it comes to subjective experience —

ali kada se radi o subjektivnom iskustvu -

why does all this feel like something from the inside? —

zašto sve to deluje kao nešto iznutra? -

that's something fundamentally new,

to je nešto fundamentalno novo,

and it's always a further question.

i to je uvek dodatno pitanje.

So I think we're at a kind of impasse here.

Tako da mislimo da smo ovde u ćorsokaku.

We've got this wonderful, great chain of explanation,

Imamo te divne, velike sisteme objašnjenja,

we're used to it, where physics explains chemistry,

navikli smo na njih, gde fizika objašnjava hemiju,

chemistry explains biology,

hemija objašnjava biologiju,

biology explains parts of psychology.

biologija objašnjava delove psihologije.

But consciousness

Ali svest

doesn't seem to fit into this picture.

izgleda da se ne uklapa u ovu sliku.

On the one hand, it's a datum

Sa jedne strane, činjenica je

that we're conscious.

da smo svesni.

On the other hand, we don't know how

Sa druge strane, ne znamo kako da to prilagodimo

to accommodate it into our scientific view of the world.

našem naučnom pogledu na svet.

So I think consciousness right now

Mislim da je svest u ovom trenutku

is a kind of anomaly,

vrsta anomalije, vrsta koju moramo da integrišemo

one that we need to integrate

u naš pogled na svet, ali još uvek ne vidimo kako.

into our view of the world, but we don't yet see how.

Faced with an anomaly like this,

Suočeni sa ovakvom anomalijom, radikalne ideje mogu biti potrebne,

radical ideas may be needed,

and I think that we may need one or two ideas

i mislim da možda imamo ideju ili dve

that initially seem crazy

koje se najpre čine ludim

before we can come to grips with consciousness

pre nego što se možemo uhvatiti u koštac sa svešću

scientifically.

naučno.

Now, there are a few candidates

Postoji nekoliko kandidata

for what those crazy ideas might be.

za to koje to lude ideje mogu biti.

My friend Dan Dennett, who's here today, has one.

Moj prijatelj Den Denet, koji je danas ovde, ima jednu takvu.

His crazy idea is that there is no hard problem

Njegova luda ideja je da nema teških problema svesti.

of consciousness.

The whole idea of the inner subjective movie

Cela ideja o unutrašnjem subjektivnom filmu

involves a kind of illusion or confusion.

podrazumeva vrstu iluzije ili zbrke. Zapravo, sve što treba da uradimo

Actually, all we've got to do is explain

je da objasnimo objektivne funkcije, ponašanja mozga,

the objective functions, the behaviors of the brain,

and then we've explained everything

i onda smo objasnili sve

that needs to be explained.

što treba da bude objašnjeno.

Well I say, more power to him.

Pa, više moći za njega.

That's the kind of radical idea

To je vrsta radikalne ideje

that we need to explore

gde treba da istražujemo

if you want to have a purely reductionist

ako želite da imate sasvim redukcionističke

brain-based theory of consciousness.

teorije o svesti zasnovane na mozgu.

At the same time, for me and for many other people,

Istovremeno, za mene i mnoge druge,

that view is a bit too close to simply

taj pogled je malo previše blizu

denying the datum of consciousness

prostom poricanju činjenice svesnosti

to be satisfactory.

da bi bila zadovoljavajuća.

So I go in a different direction.

Tako da idem u drugačijem pravcu.

In the time remaining,

Za preostalo vreme,

I want to explore two crazy ideas

želim da istražim dve lude ideje

that I think may have some promise.

za koje mislim da obećavaju.

The first crazy idea

Prva luda ideja je da je svest fundamentalna.

is that consciousness is fundamental.

Fizičari ponekad uzimaju neke aspekte univerzuma

Physicists sometimes take some aspects of the universe

as fundamental building blocks:

kao fundamentalne temelje:

space and time and mass.

prostor i vreme i masu.

They postulate fundamental laws governing them,

Oni postuliraju fundamentalne zakone koji upravljaju njima,

like the laws of gravity or of quantum mechanics.

kao što su zakoni gravitacije ili kvantne mehanike.

Ova fundamentalna svojstva i zakoni

These fundamental properties and laws

aren't explained in terms of anything more basic.

nisu objašnjena u pogledu bilo čega drugog bazičnijeg.

Rather, they're taken as primitive,

Umesto toga, uzeti su kao primitivi,

and you build up the world from there.

i odatle gradite svet.

Now sometimes, the list of fundamentals expands.

Ponekad, lista fundamentalnih stvari se proširuje.

In the 19th century, Maxwell figured out

U 19. veku, Maksvel je otkrio

that you can't explain electromagnetic phenomena

da ne možete objasniti elektomagnetni fenomen

in terms of the existing fundamentals —

u odnosu na postojeće fundamentalnosti -

space, time, mass, Newton's laws —

prostor, vreme, masu, Njutnove zakone -

so he postulated fundamental laws

pa je postulirao fundamentalne zakone

of electromagnetism

elekromagnetizma

and postulated electric charge

i postulirao je električni napon

as a fundamental element

kao fundamentalni element

that those laws govern.

kojim ti zakoni upravljaju.

I think that's the situation we're in

Mislim da je to situacija u kojoj smo

with consciousness.

sa svešću.

If you can't explain consciousness

Ako ne možete objasniti svest

in terms of the existing fundamentals —

u odnosu na postojeće fundamentalnosti -

space, time, mass, charge —

prostor, vreme, masu, napon -

then as a matter of logic, you need to expand the list.

onda, logično, morate da proširite listu.

The natural thing to do is to postulate

Prirodna stvar koju treba uraditi jeste postulirati samu svest

consciousness itself as something fundamental,

kao nešto fundamentalno,

a fundamental building block of nature.

fundamentalni temelj prirode.

This doesn't mean you suddenly can't do science with it.

To ne znači da se odjednom ne možete baviti naukom bez nje.

This opens up the way for you to do science with it.

Ovo stvara način da se bavite naukom sa njom.

What we then need is to study

Ono što nam je zatim potrebno

the fundamental laws governing consciousness,

je da proučavamo fundamentalne zakone

koji upravljaju svešću,

the laws that connect consciousness

zakone koji povezuju svest

to other fundamentals: space, time, mass,

sa drugim fundamentalnostima: prostorom, vremenom, masom,

physical processes.

fizičkim procesima.

Physicists sometimes say

Fizičari ponekad kažu

that we want fundamental laws so simple

da želimo tako jednostavne fundamentalne zakone

that we could write them on the front of a t-shirt.

da bismo ih mogli napisati na prednjoj strani majice.

Well I think something like that is the situation

Mislim da je tome slična i situacija

we're in with consciousness.

u kojoj smo sa svešću.

We want to find fundamental laws so simple

Želimo da pronađemo tako proste fundamentalne zakone

we could write them on the front of a t-shirt.

da ih možemo napisati na prednjoj strani majice.

We don't know what those laws are yet,

Još uvek ne znamo koji su to zakoni,

but that's what we're after.

ali to je ono za čime tragamo.

The second crazy idea

Druga luda ideja

is that consciousness might be universal.

je da bi svest mogla biti univerzalna.

Every system might have some degree

Svaki sistem može imati izvestan stepen

of consciousness.

svesnosti.

Ovo gledište se ponekad naziva panpsihizmom:

This view is sometimes called panpsychism:

pan for all, psych for mind,

pan za sve, psiha za dušu,

every system is conscious,

svaki sistem je svestan,

not just humans, dogs, mice, flies,

ne samo ljudi, psi, miševi, muve,

but even Rob Knight's microbes,

već čak i mikrobi Roba Najta,

elementary particles.

elementarne čestice.

Even a photon has some degree of consciousness.

Čak i foton ima izvestan stepen svesnosti.

The idea is not that photons are intelligent

Ideja nije u tome da su fotoni inteligentni

or thinking.

ili da misle.

It's not that a photon

Foton nije razoren strepnjom

is wracked with angst

jer misli: "Aaa, ja uvek zujim okolo skoro brzinom svestlosti.

because it's thinking, "Aww, I'm always buzzing around near the speed of light.

I never get to slow down and smell the roses."

Nikada ne stignem da usporim i pomirišem ruže."

No, not like that.

Ne, nije tako.

But the thought is maybe photons might have

Ali misli se da bi fotoni možda mogli imati

some element of raw, subjective feeling,

neke elemente sirovog, subjektivnog osećaja,

some primitive precursor to consciousness.

nekog primitivnog prethodnika svesti.

This may sound a bit kooky to you.

Ovo vam može zvučati pomalo čudno.

I mean, why would anyone think such a crazy thing?

Mislim, zašto bi iko mislio nešto tako suludo?

Some motivation comes from the first crazy idea,

Nešto motivacije potiče iz prve lude ideje,

that consciousness is fundamental.

da je svest fundamentalna.

If it's fundamental, like space and time and mass,

Ako je fundamentalna, kao prostor i vreme i masa,

it's natural to suppose that it might be universal too,

prirodno je pretpostaviti da takođe može biti i univerzalna,

the way they are.

onako kako su i oni.

It's also worth noting that although the idea

Takođe je vredno pomena da iako se ideja

seems counterintuitive to us,

nama čini kontraintuitivnom,

it's much less counterintuitive to people

mnogo je manje kontraintuitivna ljudima

from different cultures,

iz drugačijih kultura,

where the human mind is seen as much more

gde se čini da je ljudski um mnogo više

continuous with nature.

u skladu sa prirodom.

A deeper motivation comes from the idea that

Dublja motivacija potiče od ideje da

perhaps the most simple and powerful way

možda najjednostavniji i najsnažniji način

to find fundamental laws connecting consciousness

za pronalaženje fundamentalnih zakona

to physical processing

koji povezuju svest sa fizičkim procesima

is to link consciousness to information.

jeste povezati svest sa informacijom.

Wherever there's information processing,

Gde god da se obrađuju informacije

there's consciousness.

tu je svest.

Complex information processing, like in a human,

Kompleksna obrada informacija, kao kod ljudi,

complex consciousness.

kompleksna svest.

Simple information processing,

Jednostavna obrada informacija,

simple consciousness.

jednostavna svest.

A really exciting thing is in recent years

Zaista uzbudljiva stvar poslednjih godina:

a neuroscientist, Giulio Tononi,

neurolog Đulio Tononi

has taken this kind of theory

je usvojio ovu vrstu teorije

and developed it rigorously

i rigorozno je razvio

with a mathematical theory.

matematičkom teorijom.

He has a mathematical measure

On ima matematičku meru

of information integration

integracije informacija

which he calls phi,

koju zove fi,

measuring the amount of information

mereći količinu informacija

integrated in a system.

integrisanih u sistemu.

And he supposes that phi goes along

I pretpostavlja da fi ide uporedo

with consciousness.

sa svesnošću.

So in a human brain,

Tako da u ljudskom mozgu, neverovatno velika

incredibly large amount of information integration,

količina integracije informacija,

high degree of phi,

visok stepen fi,

a whole lot of consciousness.

mnogo svesti.

In a mouse, medium degree of information integration,

Kod miša, srednji stepen

integracije informacija, još uvek značajno,

still pretty significant,

pretty serious amount of consciousness.

ozbiljna količina svesnosti.

But as you go down to worms,

Ali kako idete niže ka crvima,

microbes, particles,

mikrobima, česticama,

the amount of phi falls off.

količina fi opada.

The amount of information integration falls off,

Količina integracije informacija opada, ali i dalje nije nula.

but it's still non-zero.

On Tononi's theory,

Po Tononijevoj teoriji,

there's still going to be a non-zero degree

još će biti stepena svesti iznad nule.

of consciousness.

In effect, he's proposing a fundamental law

U suštini, on predlaže fundamentalni zakon svesti:

of consciousness: high phi, high consciousness.

visok fi, visoka svesnost.

Now, I don't know if this theory is right,

Sad, ne znam da li je ova teorija ispravna,

but it's actually perhaps the leading theory right now

ali to je zapravo možda vodeća teorija sada

in the science of consciousness,

u nauci o svesti,

and it's been used to integrate a whole range

i korišćena je da integriše veliki opseg

of scientific data,

naučnih podataka,

and it does have a nice property that it is in fact simple enough

i ima lepo svojstvo da je zapravo dovoljno prosta

you can write it on the front of a t-shirt.

da je možete napisati na prednjoj strani majice.

Another final motivation is that

Još jedna konačna motivacija

panpsychism might help us to integrate

je da bi nam panpsihizam mogao pomoći da integrišemo

consciousness into the physical world.

svest u fizički svet.

Physicists and philosophers have often observed

Fizičari i filozofi su često primećivali

that physics is curiously abstract.

da je fizika neobično apstraktna.

It describes the structure of reality

Opisuje strukturu realnosti

using a bunch of equations,

koristeći gomilu jednačina, ali ne govori nam

but it doesn't tell us about the reality

o stvarnosti koja leži ispod toga.

that underlies it.

As Stephen Hawking puts it,

Kako Stiven Hokin kaže,

what puts the fire into the equations?

šta stavlja vatru u jednačine?

Well, on the panpsychist view,

Pa, sa gledišta panpsihiste,

you can leave the equations of physics as they are,

možete ostaviti jednačine fizike takvim kakve jesu,

but you can take them to be describing

ali možete ih uzeti da opisuju

the flux of consciousness.

tok svesti.

That's what physics really is ultimately doing,

To je ono što fizika zapravo

describing the flux of consciousness.

naposletku radi, opisuje tok svesti.

On this view, it's consciousness

Prema ovom gledištu, svest je ta

that puts the fire into the equations.

koja stavlja vatru u jednačine.

On that view, consciousness doesn't dangle

Prema tom gledištu, svest ne visi

outside the physical world

izvan fizičkog sveta

as some kind of extra.

kao neka vrsta dodatka.

It's there right at its heart.

Ona je baš tu u njegovom srcu.

This view, I think, the panpsychist view,

Ovo gledište, ja mislim, panpsihističko gledište

has the potential to transfigure our relationship

ima potencijal da preokrene naš odnos

to nature,

prema prirodi,

and it may have some pretty serious social

i može imati neke prilično ozbiljne socijalne

and ethical consequences.

i etičke posledice.

Some of these may be counterintuitive.

Neke od njih mogu biti kontraintuitivne.

I used to think I shouldn't eat anything

Nekada sam mislio da ne treba da jedem ništa

which is conscious,

što je svesno,

so therefore I should be vegetarian.

pa bi prema tome trebalo da budem vegetarijanac.

Sad, ako ste panpsihista i usvajate to gledište,

Now, if you're a panpsychist and you take that view,

you're going to go very hungry.

veoma ćete ogladneti.

So I think when you think about it,

Dakle mislim da, kada razmislite o tome, ovo teži da preobrati vaša gledišta,

this tends to transfigure your views,

whereas what matters for ethical purposes

imajući u vidu da ono što je važno

and moral considerations,

za etičke svrhe i moralna razmatranja,

not so much the fact of consciousness,

nije toliko činjenica o svesnosti,

but the degree and the complexity of consciousness.

već stepen i kompleksnost svesnosti.

It's also natural to ask about consciousness

Takođe je prirodno pitati se o svesti

in other systems, like computers.

u drugim sistemima, kao što su kompjuteri.

What about the artificially intelligent system

Šta je sa sistemom veštačke inteligencije

in the movie "Her," Samantha?

u filmu "Ona", Samanta?

Is she conscious?

Da li je ona svesna?

Well, if you take the informational,

Pa, ako uzmete informaciono,

panpsychist view,

panpsihističko gledište,

she certainly has complicated information processing

ona svakako ima komplikovanu obradu

and integration,

i integraciju informacija,

so the answer is very likely yes, she is conscious.

pa je vrlo verovatno da je odgovor da, ona je svesna.

If that's right, it raises pretty serious

Ako je to tačno, to pokreće prilično ozbiljna

ethical issues about both the ethics

etička pitanja,

kako o etici razvijanja inteligentnih kompjuterskih sistema,

of developing intelligent computer systems

and the ethics of turning them off.

tako i o etici njihovog isključivanja.

Finally, you might ask about the consciousness

Konačno, možete se zapitati

of whole groups,

o svesti čitavih grupa,

the planet.

planete.

Does Canada have its own consciousness?

Da li Kanada ima svoju sopstvenu svest?

Or at a more local level,

Ili više na lokalnom nivou,

da li integrisana grupa kao što je publika na TED konferenciji,

does an integrated group

like the audience at a TED conference,

are we right now having a collective TED consciousness,

da li mi upravo sada imamo kolektivnu TED svest,

unutrašnji film za ovu kolektivnu TED grupu

an inner movie

for this collective TED group

koji se razlikuje od unutrašnjih filmova

which is distinct from the inner movies

of each of our parts?

svakog od naših delova?

I don't know the answer to that question,

Ne znam odgovor na to pitanje, ali mislim

but I think it's at least one

worth taking seriously.

da bar njega vredi uzeti za ozbiljno.

Okay, so this panpsychist vision,

Okej, dakle ova panpsihistička vizija,

it is a radical one,

ona je radikalna,

and I don't know that it's correct.

i ne znam da li je ispravna.

I'm actually more confident about

Zapravo sam mnogo sigurniji

the first crazy idea,

u vezi sa prvom ludom idejom,

that consciousness is fundamental,

da je svest fundamentalna,

than about the second one,

nego drugom,

that it's universal.

da je univerzalna.

I mean, the view raises any number of questions,

Mislim, gledište pokreće veliki broj pitanja,

has any number of challenges,

ima veliki broj izazova,

like how do those little bits

kao što je kako oni mali delovi

of consciousness add up

svesti dodaju

to the kind of complex consciousness

do kompleksne svesnosti koju znamo i volimo.

we know and love.

Ako možemo odgovoriti na ta pitanja,

If we can answer those questions,

then I think we're going to be well on our way

onda mislim da ćemo biti na dobrom putu ka ozbiljnoj teoriji svesti.

to a serious theory of consciousness.

If not, well, this is the hardest problem perhaps

Ako ne, pa, ovo je možda najteži problem

in science and philosophy.

u nauci i filozofiji.

We can't expect to solve it overnight.

Ne možemo očekivati da će se rešiti preko noći.

Ali mislim da ćemo ga shvatiti na kraju.

But I do think we're going to figure it out eventually.

Understanding consciousness is a real key, I think,

Razumeti svest je pravi ključ, ja mislim,

both to understanding the universe

kako za razumevanje univerzuma

and to understanding ourselves.

tako i za razumevanje nas samih.

It may just take the right crazy idea.

Možda je samo potrebna prava suluda ideja.

Thank you.

Hvala vam.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)