Homaro Cantu + Ben Roche: Cooking as alchemy

96,525 views ・ 2011-12-15

TED


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譯者: Regina Chu 審譯者: Joan Liu
00:15
Ben Roche: So I'm Ben, by the way.
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班:所以,順便一題,我是班
00:17
Homaro Cantu: And I'm Homaro.
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何馬若:而我是何馬若
00:19
BR: And we're chefs. So when Moto
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班:我們是廚師。所以摩托餐廳
00:21
opened in 2004, people didn't really know
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於2004年開幕時,大家都搞不清楚
00:23
what to expect. A lot of people thought
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到底我們在玩什麼。很多人以為
00:25
that it was a Japanese restaurant, and
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這是家日本料理餐廳,
00:27
maybe it was the name, maybe it was
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或許是因為餐廳名字,或許是因為
00:29
the logo, which was like a Japanese
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餐廳商標真的很像日本字
00:31
character, but anyway, we had all these
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反正,我們收到
00:33
requests for Japanese food, which is
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一大堆詢問要點日本菜,可是
00:35
really not what we did. And after about
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我們真的不是做日本料理的。就在
00:37
the ten thousandth request for a maki roll,
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我們收到第一萬份要點壽司卷的詢問後
00:39
we decided to give the people
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我們決定要供應
00:41
what they wanted. So this picture is
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大家想吃的東西。所以這張圖片
00:43
an example of printed food, and this was
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是「印表機食物」樣品,這也是
00:45
the first foray into what we like to call
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我們第一次進軍我們稱之為
00:47
flavor transformation. So this is all
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味覺轉化的實驗。所以
00:49
the ingredients, all the flavor of, you know,
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你知道,就是把製作壽司卷的材料
00:51
a standard maki roll, printed onto
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及壽司卷的味道,印在
00:53
a little piece of paper.
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一張小小的紙上給客人吃
00:55
HC: So our diners started to get bored
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何:我們的客人很快就對這個點子
00:57
with this idea, and we decided to give them
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失去興趣了,因此我們決定
00:59
the same course twice, so here we actually
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把同一道菜上兩次,也就是說我們
01:02
took an element from the maki roll and
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仿造「壽司卷紙」這道菜
01:04
and took a picture of a dish and then
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照了一道菜的相片,然後
01:06
basically served that picture with the dish.
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就把這道菜的相片及這道菜一起端上桌
01:09
So this dish in particular is basically
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所以現在這道菜基本上是
01:11
champagne with seafood.
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香檳配海鮮
01:13
The champagne grapes that you see are
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這裡的香檳葡萄
01:15
actually carbonated grapes. A little bit of
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其實是灌了二氧化碳(發泡)的葡萄,再放
01:17
seafood and some crème fraiche and the
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一點海鮮以及crème fraiche (法式酸奶油)
01:19
picture actually tastes exactly like the dish. (Laughter)
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而這張相片吃起來味道就像這道菜。(笑聲)
01:22
BR: But it's not all just edible pictures.
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班:不過不只是可食用的相片
01:24
We decided to do something
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我們還決定要做點
01:26
a little bit different and transform flavors
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不一樣的東西來轉變那些
01:28
that were very familiar -- so in this case,
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很熟悉的味道—所以情況就是
01:31
we have carrot cake.
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我們要挑戰紅蘿蔔蛋糕
01:33
So we take a carrot cake, put it
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所以我們拿了一個紅蘿蔔蛋糕
01:35
in a blender, and we have kind of like
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把它放進果汁機裡攪一攪,就得到
01:37
a carrot cake juice, and then that went into
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很像紅蘿蔔蛋糕果汁的東西,然後放進
01:39
a balloon frozen in liquid nitrogen to create
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氣球裡,再用液態氮冰凍
01:41
this hollow shell of carrot cake
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做成這個中空的東西,我覺得很像
01:44
ice cream, I guess, and it comes off
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紅蘿蔔蛋糕冰淇淋,而且成品呢
01:46
looking like, you know,
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看起來很像,你知道
01:48
Jupiter's floating around your plate.
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木星飄浮在盤子上
01:50
So yeah, we're transforming things into
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所以是的,我們要把食材變成
01:52
something that you have absolutely
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你完全無法聯想的
01:54
no reference for.
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另一種食物
01:56
HC: And here's something we have no
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何:這個是我們
01:58
reference to eat. This is a cigar, and
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絕對想不到可以吃的東西。這是雪茄
02:00
basically it's a Cuban cigar made out of
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而且還是一枝古巴雪茄
02:02
a Cuban pork sandwich, so we take these
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用古巴豬肉三明治做的,我們把這些
02:04
spices that go into the pork shoulder,
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醃豬肩胛肉所需的香料
02:06
we fashion that into ash. We take
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做成煙灰的樣子。我們
02:08
the sandwich and wrap it up in
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把三明治用甘藍菜葉
02:10
a collard green, put an edible label
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包起來,再用一張可以吃的紙作商標
02:12
that bears no similarity to
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看起來一點都不像
02:14
a Cohiba cigar label, and we put it
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可喜巴雪茄,我們把它放在
02:16
in a dollar ninety-nine ashtray and charge
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一個1.99美元的煙灰缸裡,然後收你
02:18
you about twenty bucks for it. (Laughter)
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大約20美元吃這道菜。(笑聲)
02:21
HC: Delicious.
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何:真好!
02:23
BR: That's not it, though.
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班:但這不是我們的目的。
02:25
Instead of making foods that
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除了做一些讓你看起來
02:27
look like things that you wouldn't eat,
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不能吃的食物給你吃之外
02:29
we decided to make ingredients
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我們還做了一些
02:31
look like dishes that you know.
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看起來很熟悉的食物
02:33
So this is a plate of nachos.
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這是一盤墨西哥玉米片
02:35
The difference between our nachos
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但是這盤玉米片跟
02:37
and the other guy's nachos,
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你所知道的玉米片的不同在於
02:39
is that this is actually a dessert.
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這盤玉米片其實是道甜點
02:41
So the chips are candied,
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所以這些脆片其實是糖片
02:43
the ground beef is made from chocolate,
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牛絞肉是巧可力做的
02:45
and the cheese is made from a shredded
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起士則是以削成條狀的
02:47
mango sorbet that gets shredded
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芒果雪酪充當,因為削完後
02:49
into liquid nitrogen to look like cheese.
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就放在液態氮裡,所以看起來真的很像起士
02:51
And after doing all of this
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就在把這些材料
02:53
dematerialization and reconfiguring
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拆散重組後
02:56
of this, of these ingredients, we realized
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我們瞭解到
02:59
that it was pretty cool,
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其實這還滿酷的
03:01
because as we served it, we learned that
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因為我們出這道菜時,發現
03:03
the dish actually behaves like the real thing,
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這道假玉米片裝的還真像
03:05
where the cheese begins to melt.
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因為「起士」開始融化了
03:07
So when you're looking at this thing
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所以當你坐在我們的餐廳
03:09
in the dining room, you have this sensation
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看這這道菜,你會以為
03:11
that this is actually a plate of nachos,
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這真的是盤墨西哥玉米片
03:13
and it's not really until you begin tasting it
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直到你吃了之後
03:15
that you realize this is a dessert, and
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才會恍然大悟原來這是甜品
03:17
it's just kind of like a mind-ripper.
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有一種精神分裂的感覺
03:20
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
03:22
HC: So we had been creating
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何:所以我們
03:24
all of these dishes out of a
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在一個一點都不像廚房
03:26
kitchen that was more like
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卻比較像修車場的地方
03:28
a mechanic's shop than a kitchen, and
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實驗這些菜
03:30
the next logical step for us was to install
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所以下一步理所當然是
03:32
a state-of-the-art laboratory,
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打造一個擁有最新科技的實驗室
03:34
and that's what we have here.
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這個就是我們的實驗室
03:36
So we put this in the basement, and we
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我們蓋在地下室,而且
03:38
got really serious about food, like
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我們開始很認真地看待食物
03:40
serious experimentation.
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就像真的實驗一樣
03:42
BR: One of the really cool things about
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班:有一件非常酷的事是
03:44
the lab, besides that we have a new
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這個廚房除了有新的科學實驗室外
03:46
science lab in the kitchen, is that,
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它還有
03:48
you know, with this new equipment, and
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你知道,這些新的儀器
03:50
this new approach, all these
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以及新的烹調手法
03:52
different doors to creativity that we never
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而那前所未見、通往創意的門
03:54
knew were there began to open, and so the
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就這樣打開了
03:56
experiments and the food and the dishes
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所以這些實驗,這些食物,還有這些
03:58
that we created, they just kept going
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創意菜色,就這樣不斷地
04:01
further and further out there.
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產生出來,而且愈來愈勁爆。
04:03
HC: Let's talk about flavor transformation,
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何:我們來談談味覺轉變
04:05
and let's actually make some cool stuff.
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就來做點酷東西吧
04:07
You see a cow with its tongue hanging out.
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你一定看過牛把舌頭伸出來的樣子
04:09
What I see is a cow about to eat something
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我每次看到都認為牠是準備要吃
04:11
delicious. What is that cow eating?
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美味的食物。牛在吃什麼呢?
04:14
And why is it delicious?
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為什麼這麼好吃?
04:16
So the cow, basically, eats three basic
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所以基本上給牛餵食三樣基本的東西
04:18
things in their feed: corn, beets, and barley,
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玉米、甜菜及大麥
04:22
and so what I do is I actually
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所以我就提出
04:24
challenge my staff with these crazy,
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一些瘋狂的點子挑戰我的員工
04:26
wild ideas. Can we take what the cow
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我們能不能拿牛吃的東西
04:29
eats, remove the cow, and then make
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但不要用真正的牛肉,
04:31
some hamburgers out of that?
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來做成漢堡?
04:33
And basically the reaction tends to be
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大家聽到後的反應基本上
04:35
kind of like this. (Laughter)
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是這樣的。(笑聲)
04:37
BR: Yeah, that's our chef de cuisine,
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班:是啊,這是我們的行政主廚
04:39
Chris Jones. This is not the only guy
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克里斯·瓊斯。他不是唯一一個
04:41
that just flips out when we assign
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對我們交待的無理差事
04:43
a ridiculous task, but a lot of these ideas,
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發火的人,對我們的員工而言
04:46
they're hard to understand.
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我們的想法簡直是匪夷所思
04:48
They're hard to just get automatically.
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很難一說就懂
04:50
There's a lot of research and a lot of
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這些創意菜裡
04:53
failure, trial and error -- I guess, more error --
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充滿了研究
04:56
that goes into each and every dish,
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也充滿了失敗、摸索,我猜錯誤居多
04:58
so we don't always get it right, and it takes
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我們不是一次到位的,通常
05:00
a while for us to be able to explain that
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我們要想很久才能解釋清楚
05:02
to people.
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給他們聽
05:04
HC: So, after about a day of Chris and I
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何:所以就在我跟克里斯
05:06
staring at each other, we came up with
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大眼瞪小眼了一整天之後,我們做出
05:08
something that was pretty close
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一個還滿像
05:10
to the hamburger patty, and as you can
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漢堡肉的東西,你看
05:12
see it basically forms like hamburger meat.
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它弄起來還真像漢堡肉
05:14
This is made from three ingredients:
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這東西用三樣材料做成
05:17
beets, barley, corn, and so it
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甜菜、大麥及玉米,所以
05:19
actually cooks up like hamburger meat,
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它煮起來像漢堡肉
05:21
looks and tastes like hamburger meat,
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看起來、吃起來像漢堡肉
05:23
and not only that, but it's basically
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不只這樣,這個東西
05:26
removing the cow from the equation.
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不需要用牛肉了
05:28
So replicating food, taking it into that
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所以要如何複製食物,並且進展到
05:31
next level is where we're going.
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下一個階段是我們想要做的
05:33
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
05:36
BR: And it's definitely the world's first
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班:而且這絕對是世界第一個
05:38
bleeding veggie burger,
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會「滴血」的素漢堡
05:40
which is a cool side effect.
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還滿酷的效果啊
05:43
And a miracle berry, if you're not familiar
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還有利用神秘果,如果你沒聽過
05:45
with it, is a natural ingredient, and it
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它是一種天然的食物
05:47
contains a special property.
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含有一種特別的物質
05:49
It's a glycoprotein called miraculin,
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是稱作神秘果素的糖蛋白
05:51
a naturally occurring thing. It still freaks
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是天然形成的,每次我吃神秘果
05:53
me out every time I eat it, but it has a
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都驚異不已,它有一種特質
05:55
unique ability to mask certain taste
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能遮蔽味蕾上對某些味覺
05:57
receptors on your tongue, so that primarily
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的受體,主要是
05:59
sour taste receptors, so normally things
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酸味的受體,所以那些
06:01
that would taste very sour or tart,
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嘗起來酸澀的東西
06:03
somehow begin to taste very sweet.
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會變的非常甜
06:06
HC: You're about to eat a lemon,
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何:你明明在吃檸檬
06:08
and now it tastes like lemonade.
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但味道卻像蜂蜜檸檬汁
06:10
Let's just stop and think about the
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現在讓我們來想想
06:12
economic benefits of something like that.
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這種神秘果類的東西有什麼經濟效益
06:14
We could eliminate sugar across the board
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說不定我們做餅乾糖果及汽水的時候
06:16
for all confectionary products and sodas,
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不需要用糖了
06:18
and we can replace it with
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我們可以用
06:20
all-natural fresh fruit.
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天然的新鮮水果代替糖
06:22
BR: So you see us here cutting up
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班:你看我們在這裡切
06:24
some watermelon. The idea with this
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西瓜。這個點子的出發點是
06:26
is that we're going to eliminate tons of
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我們要藉著「製造」鮪魚來減少成千上萬的
06:28
food miles, wasted energy,
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食物里程,能源浪費
06:31
and overfishing of tuna by creating tuna,
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以及過度捕撈鮪魚
06:34
or any exotic produce or item
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或者用在地的有機農產
06:37
from a very far-away place,
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避免從很遠很遠的地方運送
06:40
with local, organic produce;
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稀有農產或食材;
06:43
so we have a watermelon from Wisconsin.
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所以我們使用威斯康辛州產的西瓜
06:45
HC: So if miracle berries take sour things
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何:所以如果神秘果
06:47
and turn them into sweet things,
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能把酸變甜
06:49
we have this other pixie dust
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我們還有其他的魔法粉
06:51
that we put on the watermelon, and it
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可以撒在西瓜上
06:53
makes it go from sweet to savory.
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讓甜變成開胃的好滋味
06:56
So after we do that, we put it into
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所以我們灑了這種粉在西瓜上之後
06:58
a vacuum bag, add a little bit of seaweed,
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就把它用真空袋裝著,加了點海苔
07:00
some spices, and we roll it, and this
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一些調味料,然後捲起來
07:03
starts taking on the appearance of tuna.
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這東西開始穿上鮪魚裝
07:05
So the key now is to make it
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所以現在的重點是怎麼樣讓它
07:07
behave like tuna.
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表現的也像鮪魚
07:09
BR: And then after a quick dip into some
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班:然後很快的把它浸到
07:11
liquid nitrogen to get that perfect sear,
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液態氮裡,完美的封住「肉汁」
07:14
we really have something that looks,
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我們就得到了一個看起來
07:16
tastes and behaves like the real thing.
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吃起來、表現起來都很像真的鮪魚的東西
07:19
HC: So the key thing to remember here is,
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何:所以要記住的重點是
07:22
we don't really care
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我們其實一點都不在乎
07:25
what this tuna really is.
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這個「鮪魚」到底是甚麼做的
07:27
As long as it's good for you and good for
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其實這無關緊要
07:29
the environment, it doesn't matter.
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只要它對你、對環保都有益
07:31
But where is this going?
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可是這可以發展到什麼地步?
07:33
How can we take this idea of tricking your
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我們怎樣把這個欺騙你的味蕾的點子
07:35
tastebuds and leapfrog it into something
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發揚光大成
07:37
that we can do today that could be
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馬上就可以應用
07:39
a disruptive food technology?
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卻具顛覆性的食品科技?
07:41
So here's the next challenge.
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所以這是我們下一個挑戰
07:43
I told the staff, let's just take a bunch
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我告訴員工,就拿一堆
07:45
of wild plants, think of them as
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野生植物,視他們為
07:47
food ingredients. As long as they're
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食材。
07:49
non-poisonous to the human body,
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去芝加哥市路邊散散步
07:51
go out around Chicago sidewalks,
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只要他們對人體無毒害
07:53
take it, blend it, cook it and then
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就採摘、混和、烹調這些野生植物
07:55
have everybody flavor-trip on it at Moto.
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然後讓摩托餐廳的客人來個風味冒險
07:58
Let's charge them a boatload of cash for this
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而且還要收他們很多錢
08:00
and see what they think. (Laughter)
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然後看看他們反應如何。(笑聲)
08:04
BR: Yeah, so you can imagine, a task
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班:對啊,正如你所料,
08:06
like this -- this is another one of those
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這樣的工作─這是另一個讓我們
08:08
assignments that the kitchen staff
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廚房員工恨我們的
08:10
hated us for. But we really had to almost
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差事。但我們真的需要
08:12
relearn how to cook in general,
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重新學習如何烹調
08:15
because these are ingredients, you know,
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因為你知道,這些食材
08:17
plant life that we're, one, unfamiliar with,
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第一,這些植物都不是我們熟悉的
08:19
and two, we have no reference for how
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第二,我們也無從得知怎麼
08:21
to cook these things because
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煮這些東西,因為
08:23
people don't eat them.
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這些東西原來是不能吃的
08:25
So we really had to think about new, creative ways
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所以我們真的需要思索一些新的、有創意的方法
08:27
to flavor, new ways to cook
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來調味,以及新的烹調法
08:29
and to change texture -- and that was
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還要能改變口感,這是
08:31
the main issue with this challenge.
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這項挑戰最難的部分
08:33
HC: So this is where we step into the future
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何:這就是我們對未來的挑戰
08:36
and we leapfrog ahead.
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向前跨一大步的地方
08:38
So developing nations
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所以開發中國家
08:40
and first-world nations,
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還有第一世界的國家
08:42
imagine if you could take these wild plants
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想像一下如果你可以拿野生植物
08:44
and consume them, food miles would
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來吃,食物里程就可以
08:46
basically turn into food feet.
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變成食物旅程
08:48
This disruptive mentality of what food is
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這種對「什麼是食物」的革命性心態調整
08:50
would essentially open up the encyclopedia
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可以拓展百科全書
08:53
of what raw ingredients are, even if we just
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生食材的項目, 即使我們只是
08:55
swapped out, say, one of these for flour,
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譬如說,把上述的野花野草代替麵粉
08:57
that would eliminate so much energy
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就可以減少許多能源
09:00
and so much waste.
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及許多浪費
09:02
And to give you a simple example here as to
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所以我們拿到底我們給顧客吃什麼
09:04
what we actually fed these customers,
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做一個簡單的例子
09:06
there's a bale of hay there
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這裡有一堆稻草
09:08
and some crab apples.
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還有一些野生酸蘋果
09:10
And basically we took hay and crab apples
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基本上我們就是拿稻草及野生酸蘋果
09:12
and made barbecue sauce out of those two ingredients.
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作成烤肉醬
09:14
People swore they were eating
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大家都發誓他們吃到的
09:16
barbecue sauce, and this is free food.
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就是真的烤肉醬,而這兩種食材是免錢的
09:19
BR: Thanks, guys.
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班:謝謝各位
09:22
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
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