Depression, the secret we share | Andrew Solomon

Prevodilac: Jasna Andjelkovic Lektor: Miloš Milosavljević

"Osetih pogreb u svom mozgu

"I felt a Funeral, in my Brain,

and Mourners to and fro

i ožalošćene kako dolaze i odlaze,

kept treading -- treading -- till [it seemed]

koračaju, koračaju, dok ne osetih

da razum puca.

that Sense was breaking through --

And when they all were seated,

A kada su svi seli,

a Service, like a Drum --

poče služba, kao bubanj,

kept beating -- beating -- till I [thought]

koji bije, bije

dok mi um ne utrnu.

my Mind was going numb --

And then I heard them lift a Box and creak across my Soul

I tada čuh kako podižu kovčeg

i škripe po mojoj duši

with those same Boots of Lead, again,

istim onim olovnim čizmama iznova,

then Space -- began to toll,

kad prostor poče nestajati,

As [all] the Heavens were a Bell, and Being, [but] an Ear,

kao da nebesa behu zvono

a bića behu uho

and I, and Silence, some strange Race,

i ja i tišina, čudna neka vrsta,

wrecked, solitary, here --

uništeni, osamljeni ovde.

[And] then a Plank in Reason, broke,

Tada se smisao potpuno rasprši,

and I fell down and down --

padao sam dublje i dublje,

and hit a World, at every plunge,

sudarajući se sa svetovima sa svakim ponorom

and Finished knowing -- then --"

i okončah spoznaju tada".

We know depression through metaphors.

Znamo o depresiji kroz metafore.

Emily Dickinson was able to convey it in language,

Emili DIkinson je pretočila u stih,

Goya in an image.

Goja u sliku.

Half the purpose of art is to describe such iconic states.

Pola svrhe umetnosti

je u opisima takvih tipskih stanja.

As for me, I had always thought myself tough,

Što se mene tiče, smatrao sam sebe jakim,

one of the people who could survive

jednim od onih koji bi preživeli

if I'd been sent to a concentration camp.

da su poslati u koncentracioni logor.

In 1991, I had a series of losses.

Godine 1991. zadesilo me je više gubitaka.

My mother died,

Moja majka je preminula,

a relationship I'd been in ended,

završila mi se tadašnja veza,

I moved back to the United States from some years abroad,

vratio sam se u Sjedinjene Države

nakon par godina u inostranstvu

and I got through all of those experiences intact.

i prošao sam kroz sva ta iskustva netaknut.

But in 1994, three years later,

Ali 1994., 3 godine kasnije,

I found myself losing interest in almost everything.

izgubio sam interes za skoro sve.

Nisam želeo da radim ništa

I didn't want to do any of the things I had previously wanted to do,

što sam ranije želeo,

and I didn't know why.

a nisam znao zbog čega.

The opposite of depression is not happiness, but vitality.

Nasuprot depresiji

nije sreća, već vitalnost,

a upravo je vitalnost

And it was vitality

that seemed to seep away from me in that moment.

nestala iz mene u tom momentu.

Everything there was to do seemed like too much work.

Sve što je trebalo učiniti

činilo se preteškim.

I would come home

Kada bih došao kući

and I would see the red light flashing on my answering machine,

i video crveno svetlo na telefonskoj sekretarici,

and instead of being thrilled to hear from my friends,

umesto ushićenosti što ću čuti prijatelje,

I would think,

pomislio bih:

"What a lot of people that is to have to call back."

"Koliko mnogo ljudi sad moram pozvati."

Or I would decide I should have lunch,

Ili kada bi trebalo da ručam,

and then I would think, but I'd have to get the food out

mislio bih: ali moram da uzmem hranu,

and put it on a plate

stavim je na tanjir i

and cut it up and chew it and swallow it,

isečem, sažvaćem, progutam

and it felt to me like the Stations of the Cross.

i osećao sam se kao da nosim krst sveta.

And one of the things that often gets lost in discussions of depression

Stvar koju često zaboravljamo

govoreći o depresiji

is that you know it's ridiculous.

je to da znamo da je apsurdna.

You know it's ridiculous while you're experiencing it.

Znate da je tako dok je doživljavate.

You know that most people manage

Znate da većina ljudi uspeva da posluša

to listen to their messages and eat lunch

sopstvene poruke i da jede,

and organize themselves to take a shower

da se organizuje da bi se istuširala

and go out the front door

i izađe iz kuće

and that it's not a big deal,

i da to nije naročit problem,

and yet you are nonetheless in its grip

ali ipak ostajete u njenom stisku

and you are unable to figure out any way around it.

i ne uspevate da pronađete izlaz.

And so I began to feel myself doing less

Počeo sam da primećujem da činim sve manje,

and thinking less

razmišljam manje,

and feeling less.

osećam manje.

It was a kind of nullity.

Bilo je kao neko ništavilo.

And then the anxiety set in.

A onda je nastupila anksioznost.

If you told me that I'd have to be depressed for the next month,

Da ste mi ikad rekli da moram da budem

depresivan narednih mesec dana,

I would say, "As long I know it'll be over in November, I can do it."

rekao bih: "Do novembra će biti gotovo, ja to mogu."

But if you said to me,

Ali, da ste mi rekli:

"You have to have acute anxiety for the next month,"

"Imaćeš akutnu anksioznost sledećih mesec dana",

radije bih sebi prerezao vene, nego da to prolazim.

I would rather slit my wrist than go through it.

It was the feeling all the time

To je bilo stalno osećanje

like that feeling you have if you're walking

kao da hodate,

and you slip or trip and the ground is rushing up at you,

pa se sapletete i padnete

a tlo se velikom brzinom primiče,

but instead of lasting half a second, the way that does,

ali umesto da traje delić sekunde,

it lasted for six months.

trajalo je šest meseci.

It's a sensation of being afraid all the time

To je doživljaj stalnog straha,

but not even knowing what it is that you're afraid of.

ne znajući čega se to bojite.

And it was at that point that I began to think

U tom momentu sam počeo da mislim

that it was just too painful to be alive,

da je previše bolno biti živ

and that the only reason not to kill oneself

i da je jedini razlog zbog kog se ne treba ubiti taj

was so as not to hurt other people.

da ne povredim druge ljude.

And finally one day, I woke up

Konačno, jednog jutra sam se probudio

and I thought perhaps I'd had a stroke,

misleći da sam možda imao šlog

because I lay in bed completely frozen,

jer sam ležao potpuno zamrznut u krevetu

looking at the telephone, thinking,

i gledao u telefon misleći:

"Something is wrong and I should call for help,"

"Nešto nije u redu, moram da potražim pomoć",

and I couldn't reach out my arm

a nisam mogao da pružim ruku

and pick up the phone and dial.

i podignem slušalicu i pozovem.

And finally, after four full hours of my lying and staring at it,

Najzad, nakon četiri sata ležanja i zurenja u njega,

the phone rang,

telefon je zazvonio

and somehow I managed to pick it up,

i nekako sam smogao snage da se javim.

and it was my father, and I said,

Bio je to moj otac.

Rekao sam: "U velikom sam problemu.

"I'm in serious trouble. We need to do something."

Moramo nešto preduzeti."

The next day I started with the medications and the therapy.

Idućeg dana počeo sam sa lekovima

i terapijom.

And I also started reckoning with this terrible question:

Takođe sam počeo da razmatram

ovo zastrašujuće pitanje:

If I'm not the tough person

Ako ja nisam ta jaka osoba

who could have made it through a concentration camp,

koja bi preživelai koncentracioni logor,

then who am I?

ko sam onda ja?

And if I have to take medication,

Ako moram uzimati lekove,

is that medication making me more fully myself,

da li me oni čine potpunijim bićem

or is it making me someone else?

ili će od mene napraviti nekog drugog?

And how do I feel about it if it's making me someone else?

I kako se osećam u vezi toga,

ako me čine drugom osobom?

Bio sam u prednosti iz dva razloga kada sam ušao u borbu.

I had two advantages as I went into the fight.

The first is that I knew that, objectively speaking,

Prvi je taj što sam znao, objektivno,

I had a nice life,

da imam dobar život

and that if I could only get well,

i ako bih ozdravio,

there was something at the other end that was worth living for.

imao bih zašto da nastavim,

nešto za šta vredi živeti.

And the other was that I had access to good treatment.

I drugo - imam dobru terapiju.

But I nonetheless emerged and relapsed,

Ali, bez obzira na to, bolest je nestajala i vraćala se,

and emerged and relapsed,

iznova

and emerged and relapsed,

i iznova,

and finally understood

dok konačno nisam shvatio

I would have to be on medication and in therapy forever.

da moram da budem na lekovima

i na terapiji zauvek.

And I thought,

Razmišljao sam: "Da li je to hemijski

"But is it a chemical problem or a psychological problem?

ili psihološki problem?

And does it need a chemical cure or a philosophical cure?"

Da li je potreban hemijski ili filozofski lek?"

And I couldn't figure out which it was.

Nisam mogao da ustanovim.

And then I understood that actually,

Shvatio sam da zapravo,

we aren't advanced enough in either area for it to explain things fully.

nismo dovoljno napredovali ni u jednoj od ovih oblasti

da bismo potpuno objasnili stvari.

The chemical cure and the psychological cure

I lekovi i psihoterapija

both have a role to play,

igraju ulogu,

and I also figured out that depression was something

a otkrio sam i da je depresija nešto

što je tako duboko ukorenjeno u nama,

that was braided so deep into us

that there was no separating it from our character and personality.

da se ne može odvojiti

od naše naravi i ličnosti.

I want to say that the treatments we have for depression are appalling.

Želim da naglasim da su nam tretmani

za depresiju izuzetno loši.

Nisu naročito efektni.

They're not very effective.

They're extremely costly.

Izuzetno su skupi,

They come with innumerable side effects.

uz bezbroj neželjenih efekata.

They're a disaster.

Katastrofalni su.

Ali sam zahvalan što živim danas,

But I am so grateful that I live now and not 50 years ago,

a ne pre 50 godina,

when there would have been almost nothing to be done.

kad skoro ništa nije moglo

da se uradi.

I hope that 50 years hence,

Nadam se da će za 50 godina

people will hear about my treatments

ljudi čuti za tretmane koje sam imao

i biti začuđeni da je neko pretrpeo

and be appalled that anyone endured such primitive science.

tako primitivne naučne metode.

Depression is the flaw in love.

Depresija je greška u ljubavi.

If you were married to someone and thought,

Ako biste bili u braku s nekim i mislili:

"Well, if my wife dies, I'll find another one,"

"Pa, ako mi žena umre, naći ću drugu",

it wouldn't be love as we know it.

to onda ne bi bila ljubav kakvu znamo.

There's no such thing as love without the anticipation of loss,

Ne postoji tako nešto kao što je ljubav

bez iščekivanja gubitka

and that specter of despair can be the engine of intimacy.

i taj spektar beznađa

može biti pokretač bliskosti.

There are three things people tend to confuse:

Postoje tri stvari koje ljudi često mešaju:

depression, grief and sadness.

depresija, žalost i tuga.

Grief is explicitly reactive.

Žalost je izrazito reaktivna.

If you have a loss and you feel incredibly unhappy,

Ako nekog izgubite i osećate se veoma nesrećno,

and then, six months later,

a šest meseci kasnije,

you are still deeply sad, but you're functioning a little better,

još uvek ste duboko tužni, ali funkcionišete nešto bolje,

u pitanju je najverovatnije žalost

it's probably grief,

and it will probably ultimately resolve itself in some measure.

i na kraju će se sve samo rešiti

u određenoj meri.

If you experience a catastrophic loss,

Ako vas snađe katastrofalan gubitak

and you feel terrible,

i osećate se strašno loše,

and six months later you can barely function at all,

a šest meseci kasnije jedva da funkcionišete,

then it's probably a depression that was triggered

onda verovatno imate depresiju uzrokovanu

katastrofalnim okolnostima.

by the catastrophic circumstances.

The trajectory tells us a great deal.

Tok nam govori mnogo toga.

People think of depression as being just sadness.

Ljudi misle da je depresija samo tuga.

It's much, much too much sadness,

To je jako mnogo tuge,

much too much grief

previše žalosti

at far too slight a cause.

zbog isuviše blagog razloga.

As I set out to understand depression,

Kada sam pokušao da razumem depresiju,

and to interview people who had experienced it,

intervjuišući ljude koji su je imali,

I found that there were people who seemed, on the surface,

nailazio sam na ljude koji,

površno gledajući, imaju

to have what sounded like relatively mild depression

relativno umerenu depresiju,

a potpuno su blokirani njom.

who were nonetheless utterly disabled by it.

And there were other people who had what sounded

A bilo je i onih za koje se činilo da imaju,

as they described it like terribly severe depression

po njihovom opisu,

izuzetno tešku depresiju,

who nonetheless had good lives

dok ipak imaju dobre živote

in the interstices between their depressive episodes.

između depresivnih epizoda.

And I set out to find out what it is that causes some people

I krenuo sam da otkrijem

šta je uzrok toga da neki ljudi

to be more resilient than other people.

imaju veću otpornost nego drugi.

What are the mechanisms that allow people to survive?

Koji to mehanizmi

omogućavaju ljudima da opstanu?

And I went out and I interviewed person after person

Ispitao sam mnogo osoba

who was suffering with depression.

koje pate od depresije.

One of the first people I interviewed

Jedan od prvih koje sam intervjuisao

opisao je depresiju

described depression as a slower way of being dead,

kao sporiji način umiranja

and that was a good thing for me to hear early on

i bilo je dobro što sam to čuo ranije

because it reminded me that that slow way of being dead

jer me je podsetilo

da taj sporiji način umiranja

can lead to actual deadness,

zapravo vodi stvarnoj smrti

that this is a serious business.

i da je u pitanju ozbiljna stvar.

It's the leading disability worldwide,

U pitanju je glavni uzrok invalidnosti širom sveta,

and people die of it every day.

od koga ljudi umiru svakodnevno.

One of the people I talked to when I was trying to understand this

Jedna osoba sa kojom sam pričao

pokušavajući da razumem ovo

was a beloved friend who I had known for many years,

je moja draga prijateljica

koju poznajem mnogo godina,

and who had had a psychotic episode in her freshman year of college,

a koja je ranije imala psihotičnu epizodu,

na svojoj prvoj godini studija,

and then plummeted into a horrific depression.

a zatim je upala u strašnu depresiju.

She had bipolar illness,

Imala je bipolarni poremećaj

or manic depression, as it was then known.

ili maničnu depresiju, kako se to tada zvalo.

And then she did very well for many years on lithium,

Zatim je bila vrlo dobro

dugo godina na litijumu,

a potom su joj

and then eventually, she was taken off her lithium

isključili litijum

to see how she would do without it,

da vide kako će biti bez njega

and she had another psychosis,

i tada je zadesila još jedna psihoza

and then plunged into the worst depression that I had ever seen

i upala je u najgoru depresiju

koju sam ikada video.

in which she sat in her parents' apartment,

Satima je sedela u stanu svojih roditelja

more or less catatonic, essentially without moving,

manje-više obamrla, maltene bez pokreta

day after day after day.

i tako iz dana u dan.

And when I interviewed her about that experience some years later --

Kada smo o tom iskustvu pričali par godina posle -

she's a poet and psychotherapist named Maggie Robbins --

ona je inače pesnikinja i psihoterapeut, Megi Robins -

when I interviewed her, she said,

kad sam je intervjuisao, rekla mi je:

"I was singing 'Where Have All The Flowers Gone,'

"U sebi sam pevala: "Gde je svo cveće nestalo"

over and over, to occupy my mind.

stalno iznova, samo da zaokupim misli.

I was singing to blot out the things my mind was saying,

Pevala sam da zataškam ono što mi je um govorio:

which were, 'You are nothing. You are nobody.

"Ti nisi ništa. Nisi niko.

Ne zaslužuješ da živiš".

You don't even deserve to live.'

And that was when I really started thinking

Tada sam počela da stvarno razmišljam

o samoubistvu."

about killing myself."

You don't think in depression that you've put on a gray veil

Kad ste u depresiji, vi ne mislite

da ste stavili sivi veo

and are seeing the world through the haze of a bad mood.

i gledate svet kroz tu maglu

lošeg raspoloženja.

You think that the veil has been taken away,

Već mislite da je zapravo veo nestao,

veo sreće

the veil of happiness,

and that now you're seeing truly.

i da sad vidite stvarno.

It's easier to help schizophrenics who perceive

Lakše je pomoći šizofreničnim osobama

that there's something foreign inside of them that needs to be exorcised,

koje primećuju da u njima ima nečeg stranog

što treba izbaciti.

but it's difficult with depressives,

Ali teško je kod depresivnih,

because we believe we are seeing the truth.

jer mi mislimo da vidimo istinu.

But the truth lies.

Ali istina laže.

I became obsessed with that sentence:

Postao sam opsednut tom rečenicom:

"But the truth lies."

"Ali istina laže."

And I discovered, as I talked to depressive people,

Otkrio sam, razgovarajući sa depresivnim ljudima,

that they have many delusional perceptions.

da imaju mnogo pogrešnih percepcija.

People will say, "No one loves me."

Kažu: "Niko me ne voli."

And you say, "I love you,

A vi kažete: "Ja te volim,

your wife loves you, your mother loves you."

žena te voli, majka te voli."

You can answer that one pretty readily, at least for most people.

Na to možete prilično lako odgovoriti,

barem većini ljudi.

Ali depresivni ljudi će takođe reći:

But people who are depressed will also say,

"No matter what we do, we're all just going to die in the end."

"Bez obzira šta radili,

svi ćemo umreti na kraju."

Or they'll say, "There can be no true communion

Ili: "Ne može biti istinske bliskosti

between two human beings.

između dva ljudska bića.

Each of us is trapped in his own body."

Zarobljeni smo, svako u svom telu."

To which you have to say,

Na šta morate uzvratiti:

"That's true,

"To je istina,

but I think we should focus right now on what to have for breakfast."

ali mislim da sada treba da se fokusiramo

na to šta ćemo jesti za doručak."

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

A lot of the time,

Uglavnom,

what they are expressing is not illness, but insight,

ono o čemu oni govore nije bolest, već gledište

and one comes to think what's really extraordinary

i pomislimo da je zaista neobično

is that most of us know about those existential questions

da većina nas zna da ova egzistencijalna pitanja postoje,

a ona nas ne ometaju naročito.

and they don't distract us very much.

There was a study I particularly liked

Jedna studija mi se posebno svidela,

in which a group of depressed and a group of non-depressed people

o grupi depresivnih

i grupi nedepresivnih ljudi

koji su zamoljeni da igraju video igricu sat vremena

were asked to play a video game for an hour,

and at the end of the hour,

i posle sat vremena,

they were asked how many little monsters they thought they had killed.

odgovore koliko malih čudovišta

misle da su ubili.

Depresivna grupa je obično bila precizna

The depressive group was usually accurate to within about 10 percent,

s greškom od oko 10 procenata,

and the non-depressed people

a nedepresivne osobe

guessed between 15 and 20 times as many little monsters --

govorile su da je broj ubijenih čudovišta

15 do 20 puta veći - (Smeh) -

(Laughter)

od stvarno ubijenih.

as they had actually killed.

A lot of people said, when I chose to write about my depression,

Kada sam rešio da pišem o svojoj depresiji, mnogi su rekli da

that it must be very difficult to be out of that closet,

mora da je vrlo teško

izaći sa tim u javnost, da ljudi saznaju.

to have people know.

Pitali su me: "Da li sada ljudi s tobom pričaju drugačije?"

They said, "Do people talk to you differently?"

I said, "Yes, people talk to me differently.

Rekao sam: "Da, pričaju drugačije.

They talk to me differently insofar

Drugačije utoliko što

as they start telling me about their experience,

počinju da mi govore o njihovim iskustvima

or their sister's experience,

ili iskustvu sestre

or their friend's experience.

ili prijatelja.

Things are different because now I know

Stvari su se izmenile jer sada znam

that depression is the family secret that everyone has.

da je depresija porodična tajna

koju svi imaju.

I went a few years ago to a conference,

Bio sam na konferenciji pre par godna

and on Friday of the three-day conference,

i u petak, prvog od tri dana konferencije,

one of the participants took me aside, and she said,

jedna od prisutnih me je pozvala sa strane i rekla:

"I suffer from depression and I'm a little embarrassed about it,

"Patim od depresije i

malo mi je neprijatno zbog toga,

ali koristim ovaj lek

but I've been taking this medication,

and I just wanted to ask you what you think?"

i zanima me vaše mišljenje?"

Potrudio sam se da je posavetujem najbolje što mogu.

And so I did my best to give her such advice as I could.

And then she said, "You know, my husband would never understand this.

Potom je rekla, "Ali, znate,

moj muž to ne bi razumeo.

He's really the kind of guy to whom this wouldn't make any sense,

On je neko kome bi to izgledalo besmisleno

i znate, neka to ostane među nama."

so, you know, it's just between us."

And I said, "Yes, that's fine."

I ja sam rekao, "U redu je."

On Sunday of the same conference,

U nedelju, na istoj konferenciji,

her husband took me aside,

njen suprug me je odveo na stranu

(Laughter)

and he said, "My wife wouldn't think

i rekao: "Moja supruga ne bi mislila

that I was really much of a guy if she knew this,

da sam neki muškarac da zna ovo,

but I've been dealing with this depression and I'm taking some medication,

ali ja bolujem od depresije

i koristim neki lek

and I wondered what you think?"

i pitao sam se šta vi mislite?"

They were hiding the same medication

Krili su

isti lek na dva različita mesta

in two different places in the same bedroom.

u istoj spavaćoj sobi.

(Laughter)

Rekao sam im da mislim

And I said that I thought communication within the marriage

da možda komunikacija u braku

might be triggering some of their problems.

prouzrokuje neke od njihovih problema.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

But I was also struck

Bio sam zatečen

teskobnom prirodom

by the burdensome nature of such mutual secrecy.

takve uzajamne tajnovitosti.

Depression is so exhausting.

Depresija je veoma iscrpljujuća,

It takes up so much of your time and energy,

traži toliko mnogo vremena i snage

and silence about it,

i ćutanja o njoj,

it really does make the depression worse.

što je, u stvari, pogoršava.

And then I began thinking

I onda sam počeo da razmišljam o načinima

about all the ways people make themselves better.

na koje ljudi pomažu sami sebi.

I'd started off as a medical conservative.

Počeo sam kao medicinski konzervativac.

I thought there were a few kinds of therapy that worked,

Mislio sam da postoji nekoliko vrsta terapija koje su plodonosne,

it was clear what they were --

bilo je jasno da jesu -

there was medication,

postoje lekovi,

there were certain psychotherapies,

određene vrste psihoterapija,

there was possibly electroconvulsive treatment,

mogućnost elektrokonvulzivnog tretmana,

a sve ostalo su besmislice.

and that everything else was nonsense.

But then I discovered something.

Ali onda sam otkrio nešto.

If you have brain cancer,

Ako imate tumor mozga

and you say that standing on your head for 20 minutes every morning

i kažete da stoj na glavi

20 minuta svakog jutra, čini da se osećate bolje,

makes you feel better,

it may make you feel better, but you still have brain cancer,

možda ćete se i osećati bolje,

ali i dalje ćete imati rak mozga

and you'll still probably die from it.

i verovatno ćete umreti od njega.

But if you say that you have depression,

Ali ako kažete da imate depresiju

and standing on your head for 20 minutes every day

i od svakodnevnog stoja na glavi po 20 minuta

se osećate bolje, znači da vam to pomaže,

makes you feel better, then it's worked,

because depression is an illness of how you feel,

jer je depresija oboljenje vaših osećanja

and if you feel better,

i ako se osećate bolje,

then you are effectively not depressed anymore.

onda više niste depresivni.

Pa sam tako postao mnogo tolerantniji

So I became much more tolerant

za širok spektar alternativnih tretmana.

of the vast world of alternative treatments.

And I get letters, I get hundreds of letters

Dobijam pisma, na stotine njih

from people writing to tell me about what's worked for them.

od ljudi koji mi pišu o onome što njima pomaže.

Danas su me pitali pre ovog govora,

Someone was asking me backstage today about meditation.

šta mislim o meditaciji.

My favorite of the letters that I got was the one that came from a woman

Od pisama koje dobio, omiljeno mi je

ono koje sam dobio od žene

who wrote and said that she had tried therapy, medication,

koja je napisala da je pokušala s terapijom,

lekovima i skoro svim drugim tretmanima,

she had tried pretty much everything,

ali je pronašla rešenje, i nadala se da ću to preneti svetu,

and she had found a solution and hoped I would tell the world,

u pravljenju malih stvari od prediva.

and that was making little things from yarn.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

She sent me some of them.

Poslala mi je neke od njih. (Smeh)

(Laughter)

And I'm not wearing them right now.

Trenutno ih ne nosim na sebi.

(Laughter)

I suggested to her that she also should look up

Rekao sam joj da možda treba da proveri da nema

obsessive compulsive disorder in the DSM.

opsesivno-kompulsivni poremećaj.

And yet, when I went to look at alternative treatments,

Dok sam tražio alternativne tretmane,

I also gained perspective on other treatments.

stekao sam uvid u druge načine lečenja.

I went through a tribal exorcism in Senegal

U Senegalu sam prošao kroz plemenski egzorcizam,

that involved a great deal of ram's blood

što uključuje dosta krvi od ovna,

and that I'm not going to detail right now,

ali ne bih da pričam o pojedinostima,

but a few years afterwards I was in Rwanda,

ali nekoliko godina kasnije bio sam u Ruandi,

working on a different project,

radeći na drugom projektu

and I happened to describe my experience to someone,

i nekome sam opisivao svoje iskustvo

and he said,

i on mi je rekao: "Znate,

"Well, that's West Africa, and we're in East Africa,

to je zapadna Afrika, a mi smo u Istočnoj Africi

and our rituals are in some ways very different,

i rituali nam se razlikuju,

but we do have some rituals

ali imamo neke rituale koji imaju

that have something in common with what you're describing."

nešto zajedničko sa onim što opisujete."

Rekao sam: "Zaista?", a on je rekao:

And he said,

"But we've had a lot of trouble with Western mental health workers,

Da, ali imamo mnogo problema sa radnicima za mentalno zdravlje sa zapada,

posebno sa onima koji su došli nakon genocida."

especially the ones who came right after the genocide."

Upitah: "Kakve probleme imate?"

I said, "What kind of trouble did you have?"

On je rekao: "Znate,

And he said, "Well, they would do this bizarre thing.

oni imaju uvrnutu praksu

They didn't take people out in the sunshine

da ne izvode ljude napolje, na sunce,

gde se svi bolje osećaju.

where you begin to feel better.

They didn't include drumming or music to get people's blood going.

Ne puštaju im bubnjeve ili muziku da im krv prostruji brže.

They didn't involve the whole community.

Ne uključuju celu zajednicu.

They didn't externalize the depression as an invasive spirit.

Ne projektuju depresiju

kao invazivni duh.

Instead what they did was they took people one at a time into dingy little rooms

Umesto toga, vode ih

jednog po jednog u sumorne male sobe

and had them talk for an hour

i puštaju ih da pričaju sat vremena

about bad things that had happened to them."

o lošim stvarima koje su im se desile."

(Laughter)

(Smeh) (Aplauz)

(Applause)

He said, "We had to ask them to leave the country."

Rekao je: "Morali smo da ih zamolimo da napuste zemlju."

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Now at the other end of alternative treatments,

Na drugom kraju alternativnih metoda,

ispričaću vam o Frenku Rusakovu.

let me tell you about Frank Russakoff.

Frenk Rusakov imao je jednu od najgorih

Frank Russakoff had the worst depression perhaps that I've ever seen in a man.

depresija koje sam ikada video kod ljudi.

He was constantly depressed.

Konstantno je bio depresivan.

He was, when I met him,

Kada sam ga upoznao, on je

at a point at which every month, he would have electroshock treatment.

svakog meseca išao na elektrošok tretman.

Then he would feel sort of disoriented for a week.

Onda bi bio dezorijentisan nedelju dana.

Then he would feel okay for a week.

Onda bi nedelju dana bio u redu.

Then he would have a week of going downhill.

Onda bi imao nedelju dana pogoršavanja.

And then he would have another electroshock treatment.

I onda bi imao novi elektrošok tretman.

Kad smo se sreli rekao mi je:

And he said to me when I met him,

"It's unbearable to go through my weeks this way.

"Nepodnošljivo je da prolazim kroz nedelje ovako.

Ne mogu ovako dalje.

I can't go on this way,

and I've figured out how I'm going to end it

Našao sam način da to okončam

if I don't get better."

ako mi ne bude bolje.

"But," he said to me, "I heard about a protocol at Mass General

Ali, čuo sam za metodu

bolnice Masačusets, zvanu cingulotomija,

for a procedure called a cingulotomy, which is a brain surgery,

što je operacija mozga

and I think I'm going to give that a try."

i mislim da ću pokušati sa tim."

And I remember being amazed at that point to think that someone

Sećam se da sam u tom momentu bio zapanjen

na pomisao da neko

who clearly had so many bad experiences

ko ima toliko loših iskustava

with so many different treatments

sa različitim tretmanima

still had buried in him, somewhere, enough optimism

još uvek čuva negde u sebi dovoljno optimizma

to reach out for one more.

da pokuša sa još jednim.

And he had the cingulotomy, and it was incredibly successful.

I obavljena mu je cingulotomija

i bila je neverovatno uspešna.

He's now a friend of mine.

Danas smo prijatelji.

He has a lovely wife and two beautiful children.

Ima predivnu suprugu i dvoje divne dece.

He wrote me a letter the Christmas after the surgery,

Pisao mi je na Božić nakon operacije

and he said,

i rekao je:

"My father sent me two presents this year,

"Otac mi je poslao dva poklona ove godine.

First, a motorized CD rack from The Sharper Image

Prvo, držač CD-ova sa motorom

that I didn't really need,

koji mi i nije baš potreban,

but I knew he was giving it to me to celebrate

ali znam da mi ga je poklonio da proslavi

the fact that I'm living on my own and have a job I seem to love.

činjenicu da živim samostalno

i da imam posao koji volim.

And the other present was a photo of my grandmother,

A drugi poklon

je bila slika moje bake

who committed suicide.

koja se ubila.

As I unwrapped it, I began to cry,

Otvorio sam poklon i počeo da plačem,

and my mother came over and said,

a majka je prišla i pitala:

'Are you crying because of the relatives you never knew?'

"Da li plačeš što je nikad nisi upoznao?"

Rekao sam: "Imala je istu bolest kao ja."

And I said, 'She had the same disease I have.'

I'm crying now as I write to you.

Plačem dok ti ovo pišem.

It's not that I'm so sad, but I get overwhelmed,

Nije da sam toliko tužan, nego su me preplavila osećanja,

I think, because I could have killed myself,

mislim zato što sam i ja mogao da se ubijem,

but my parents kept me going, and so did the doctors,

ali roditelji su me podržavali

i doktori

and I had the surgery.

i imao sam operaciju.

I'm alive and grateful.

Živ sam i zahvalan.

We live in the right time, even if it doesn't always feel like it."

Živimo u pravom vremenu,

čak i ako se ne čini uvek tako."

I was struck by the fact that depression

Pogodila me je činjenica da je depresija

is broadly perceived to be a modern, Western, middle-class thing,

široko shvaćena kao

moderna, zapadnjačka, stvar srednje klase,

and I went to look at how it operated in a variety of other contexts,

pa sam išao da vidim šta se događa

u drugim okruženjima

and one of the things I was most interested in

i jedna od stvari koja me je zainteresovala najviše

was depression among the indigent.

je depresija među siromašnima.

Te sam otišao da vidim

And so I went out to try to look

at what was being done for poor people with depression.

šta se čini za siromašne sa depresijom.

And what I discovered is that poor people

Otkrio sam da siromašni

are mostly not being treated for depression.

uglavnom ne leče depresiju.

Depresija je rezultat genetske sklonosti

Depression is the result of a genetic vulnerability,

which is presumably evenly distributed in the population,

ravnomerno zastupljene u populaciji

and triggering circumstances,

i okolnosti

which are likely to be more severe for people who are impoverished.

i koje su obično teže

kod ljudi koji su siromašni.

And yet it turns out that if you have a really lovely life

Ipak, ispostavlja se da ako imate

dobar život, a osećate se stalno loše,

but feel miserable all the time,

you think, "Why do I feel like this?

mislite: "Zašto se ovako osećam?

I must have depression."

Mora da imam depresiju."

And you set out to find treatment for it.

I potražite lek za to.

Ali, ako imate vrlo težak život

But if you have a perfectly awful life,

and you feel miserable all the time,

i stalno se osećate očajno,

the way you feel is commensurate with your life,

onda se to slaže sa vašim životom,

and it doesn't occur to you to think,

ni ne pomišljate:

"Maybe this is treatable."

"Možda je to izlečivo."

And so we have an epidemic in this country

Tako da u zemlji imamo epidemiju

of depression among impoverished people

depresije među siromašnima

that's not being picked up and that's not being treated

u vezi s kojom ništa ne preduzimamo, ne lečimo je

and that's not being addressed,

pa se ni ne razrešava

and it's a tragedy of a grand order.

i to je velika tragedija.

And so I found an academic

Tako sam naišao na profesorku

who was doing a research project in slums outside of D.C.,

koja je radila istraživanje

u siromašnim krajevima u blizini Vašingtona,

where she picked up women who had come in for other health problems

gde je birala žene koje dolaze zbog drugih zdravstvenih problema

and diagnosed them with depression,

i utvrdila da imaju depresiju

i obezbedila im šestomesečni eksperimentalni tretman.

and then provided six months of the experimental protocol.

One of them, Lolly, came in,

Jedna od njih, Loli, došla je

and this is what she said the day she came in.

i evo šta mi je rekla prvog dana.

Inače, u pitanju je žena sa

She said, and she was a woman, by the way, who had seven children.

sedmoro dece. Rekla je:

She said, "I used to have a job but I had to give it up

"Imala sam posao koji sam ostavila

because I couldn't go out of the house.

jer nisam mogla da izađem iz kuće.

Nemam šta da kažem deci.

I have nothing to say to my children.

In the morning, I can't wait for them to leave,

Ujutru jedva čekam da odu

and then I climb in bed and pull the covers over my head,

i onda se uvučem u krevet i pokrijem preko glave

i tri sata, kad se vraćaju kući,

and three o'clock when they come home,

dođe tako brzo."

it just comes so fast."

She said, "I've been taking a lot of Tylenol,

Rekla je: "Uzimala sam mnogo tilenola,

anything I can take so that I can sleep more.

bilo šta što će mi pomoći da spavam više.

My husband has been telling me I'm stupid, I'm ugly.

Muž mi je govorio da sam glupa, ružna.

I wish I could stop the pain."

Želela sam da prestane bol."

Well, she was brought into this experimental protocol,

Dovedena je na eksperimentalni tretman

and when I interviewed her six months later,

i kada smo razgovarali šest meseci kasnije,

she had taken a job working in childcare

prihvatila je posao čuvanja dece,

for the U.S. Navy, she had left the abusive husband,

za američku mornaricu, napustila je muža zlostavljača

i rekla mi je:

and she said to me,

"Deca su mi sada srećnija.

"My kids are so much happier now."

She said, "There's one room in my new place for the boys

U novom domu imamo odvojene sobe

za dečake i za devojčice,

and one room for the girls,

mada noću, dođu svi u moj krevet

but at night, they're just all up on my bed,

and we're doing homework all together and everything.

i radimo domaći zajedno.

One of them wants to be a preacher,

Jedan od dečaka želi da bude sveštenik,

one of them wants to be a firefighter,

jedan vatrogasac,

and one of the girls says she's going to be a lawyer.

jedna devojčica advokat.

They don't cry like they used to,

Ne plaču kao pre,

and they don't fight like they did.

ne svađaju se kao ranije.

To je sve što želim.

That's all I need now, is my kids.

Things keep on changing,

Stvari se i dalje menjaju,

the way I dress, the way I feel, the way I act.

to kako se oblačim, osećam, ponašam.

I can go outside not being afraid anymore,

Mogu da izađem napolje bez straha

and I don't think those bad feelings are coming back,

i mislim da se neće vratiti loša osećanja

i da nije bilo doktorke Mirande i svega,

and if it weren't for Dr. Miranda and that,

još bih bila kući sa prekrivačem preko glave,

I would still be at home with the covers pulled over my head,

if I were still alive at all.

ako bih bila živa uopšte.

Molila sam Boga da mi pošalje anđela

I asked the Lord to send me an angel,

and He heard my prayers."

i uslišio je moje molitve."

Bio sam ganut ovim iskustvima

I was really moved by these experiences,

and I decided that I wanted to write about them

i odlučio da želim da pišem o njima

not only in a book I was working on, but also in an article,

ne samo u knjizi na kojoj sam radio,

već i u članku

and I got a commission from The New York Times Magazine

i dobio sam angažman od Njujork Tajmsa

da pišem o depresiji među siromašnima.

to write about depression among the indigent.

Predao sam priču,

And I turned in my story,

and my editor called me and said, "We really can't publish this."

i urednica me pozvala i rekla:

"Ne možemo da objavimo ovo."

"Zašto ne?", upitao sam.

And I said, "Why not?"

And she said, "It just is too far-fetched.

Odgovorila mi je,: "Jednostavno, nerealno je.

These people who are sort of at the very bottom rung of society

Ljudi koji su na dnu drušvene lestvice

and then they get a few months of treatment

dobiju par meseci tretmana

and they're virtually ready to run Morgan Stanley?

i maltene mogu da budu direktori banke?

To je isuviše neverovatno."

It's just too implausible."

Rekla je: "Nikada ništa slično nisam čula."

She said, "I've never even heard of anything like it."

And I said, "The fact that you've never heard of it

Odgovorio sam: "Činjenica da nikad nisi čula za to

govori o tome da je to novost."

is an indication that it is news."

(Laughter)

(Smeh) (Aplauz)

(Applause)

"And you are a news magazine."

"A vi ste informativni časopis."

So after a certain amount of negotiation, they agreed to it.

I posle pregovaranja,

složili su se da objave tekst.

But I think a lot of what they said was connected in some strange way

Ali, mislim da je mnogo toga što su rekli

povezano na neki čudan način

to this distaste that people still have for the idea of treatment,

sa gnušanjem koje ti ljudi još uvek imaju

prema ideji lečenja,

the notion that somehow if we went out

ideji da ako bismo nekako

and treated a lot of people in indigent communities,

lečili mnogo ljudi u siromašnim zajedncama,

that would be exploitative,

to bi bilo eksploatisanje,

because we would be changing them.

jer bismo ih menjali.

There is this false moral imperative that seems to be all around us,

Postoji taj lažni moral

koji je izgleda svuda oko nas

that treatment of depression,

da su: lečenje depresije,

the medications and so on, are an artifice,

lekovi i slično, veštački

and that it's not natural.

i da to nije prirodno.

And I think that's very misguided.

Smatram da je to neispravan stav.

It would be natural for people's teeth to fall out,

Prirodno je da ljudima ispadaju zubi,

but there is nobody militating against toothpaste,

ali niko se ne protivi zubnoj pasti,

at least not in my circles.

bar ne u krugovima gde se ja krećem.

People then say,

Ljudi onda kažu: "Nije li depresija

"But isn't depression part of what people are supposed to experience?

jedna od stvari koje ljudi treba da iskuse?"

Zar nismo evoluirali da imamo depresiju?

Didn't we evolve to have depression?

Nije li to deo ličnosti?"

Isn't it part of your personality?"

To which I would say, mood is adaptive.

Na to bih rekao da je raspoloženje prilagodljivo.

Being able to have sadness and fear

Sposobnost da se ima tuga, strah,

and joy and pleasure

sreća i zadovoljstvo

and all of the other moods that we have, that's incredibly valuable.

i sva ostala raspoloženja koje imamo,

je izuzetno dragocena.

And major depression

Velika depresija je nešto što se desi

is something that happens when that system gets broken.

kada sistem zakaže.

It's maladaptive.

Kada je neprilagođen.

People will come to me and say,

Dolaze ljudi i govore:

"I think, though, if I just stick it out for another year,

"Mislim da kada bih izdržao još godinu dana,

I think I can just get through this."

mogao bih to da pobedim."

And I always say to them, "You may get through it,

A ja im uvek kažem: "Možda možeš,

ali nikad više nećeš imati 37 godina.

but you'll never be 37 again.

Life is short, and that's a whole year you're talking about giving up.

Život je kratak, a to je cela jedna godina

koje se odričeš.

Think it through."

Razmisli ponovo."

It's a strange poverty of the English language,

Čudna je ta ograničenost engleskog,

and indeed of many other languages,

a i mnogih drugih jezika,

that we use this same word, depression,

da koristimo istu reč - depresija

to describe how a kid feels when it rains on his birthday,

da opišemo kako se oseća dete

kad pada kiša na njegov rođendan

and to describe how somebody feels the minute before they commit suicide.

i da opišemo kako se oseća neko

minut pre samoubistva.

People say to me, "Well, is it continuous with normal sadness?"

Pitaju me: "Je li to produženo tugovanje?"

And I say, in a way it's continuous with normal sadness.

Govorim da, u neku ruku, jeste dug period uobičajenog tugovanja.

There is a certain amount of continuity,

Postoji određen kontinuitet,

but it's the same way there's continuity

ali to je isto kao što postoji kontinuitet

between having an iron fence outside your house

između gvozdene ograde oko kuće

kada se javi tačkica rđe

that gets a little rust spot

that you have to sand off and do a little repainting,

koju morate da išmirglate i malo prefarbate

and what happens if you leave the house for 100 years

i onog što se desi kada je kuća napuštena 100 godina

and it rusts through until it's only a pile of orange dust.

i ograda postane samo gomila

narandžaste prašine.

Upravo je ta narandžasta tačka,

And it's that orange dust spot,

that orange dust problem,

taj problem narandžaste prašine,

that's the one we're setting out to address.

ono na šta usmeravamo pažnju.

Ljudi kažu:

So now people say,

"Uzmeš ove srećne pilule i budeš srećan?"

"You take these happy pills, and do you feel happy?"

And I don't.

Ali nije tako.

But I don't feel sad about having to eat lunch,

Međutim, ne osećam se tužno kad treba da ručam

and I don't feel sad about my answering machine,

ili odgovorim na poruke sa telefonske sekretarice

and I don't feel sad about taking a shower.

i nisam tužan što treba da se istuširam.

I feel more, in fact, I think,

Osećam više, ja mislim,

because I can feel sadness without nullity.

jer mogu da osećam tugu bez ništavila.

I feel sad about professional disappointments,

Osećam tugu zbog poslovnih razočaranja,

about damaged relationships,

narušenih veza,

about global warming.

globalnog zagrevanja.

Those are the things that I feel sad about now.

To su stvari koje me rastuže danas.

And I said to myself, well, what is the conclusion?

I zapitao sam se, šta je zaključak?

How did those people who have better lives

Kako su oni koji imaju bolje živote

even with bigger depression manage to get through?

sa čak većom depresijom uspeli da se izbore?

What is the mechanism of resilience?

Koji je mehanizam otpornosti?

And what I came up with over time

I zaključio sam vremenom

was that the people who deny their experience,

da ljudi koji poriču svoje iskustvo,

and say, "I was depressed a long time ago,

oni koji govore: "Bio sam depresivan odavno

I never want to think about it again,

i ne želim više nikad da razmišljam o tome

I'm not going to look at it

i neću obraćati pažnju na to

and I'm just going to get on with my life,"

i samo ću nastaviti dalje sa svojim životom",

ironically, those are the people who are most enslaved by what they have.

ironično je što su to ljudi

koji su najviše zarobljeni onim što imaju.

Shutting out the depression strengthens it.

Isključivanjem depresije, ona ojačava.

While you hide from it, it grows.

Dok se krijete od nje, ona raste.

Ljudi koji prolaze bolje

And the people who do better

are the ones who are able to tolerate the fact that they have this condition.

su oni koji mogu da prihvate činjenicu

da imaju depresiju.

Oni koji mogu da prihvate svoju depresiju,

Those who can tolerate their depression are the ones who achieve resilience.

postižu otpornost.

So Frank Russakoff said to me,

Frenk Rusakof mi je rekao:

"If I had a do-over, I suppose I wouldn't do it this way,

"Da moram da uradim sve iz početka,

verovatno ne bih isto uradio,

but in a strange way, I'm grateful for what I've experienced.

ali na čudan način sam zahvalan

za proživljeno iskustvo.

I'm glad to have been in the hospital 40 times.

Drago mi je što sam bio 40 puta u bolnici,

naučio sam toliko mnogo o ljubavi

It taught me so much about love,

and my relationship with my parents and my doctors

i odnos sa mojim roditeljima i doktorima

has been so precious to me, and will be always."

mi je bio tako dragocen i uvek će biti."

And Maggie Robbins said,

A Megi Robins kaže:

"I used to volunteer in an AIDS clinic,

"Bila sam volonter na klinici za sidu

and I would just talk and talk and talk,

i samo bih pričala i pričala,

and the people I was dealing with weren't very responsive, and I thought,

a ljudi sa kojima sam radila

nisu mnogo odgovarali i pomišljala sam:

'That's not very friendly or helpful of them.'"

"To nije baš prijateljski s njihove strane, niti od pomoći."

(Laughter)

"And then I realized,

A onda sam shvatila

I realized that they weren't going to do more

da oni neće uložiti više truda

than make those first few minutes of small talk.

od tih prvih nekoliko minuta ćaskanja.

It was simply going to be an occasion

Jednostavno to je situacija

where I didn't have AIDS and I wasn't dying,

gde ja nemam sidu i ne umirem,

but could tolerate the fact that they did

ali mogu da prihvatim činjenicu da oni imaju

and they were.

i umiru.

Our needs are our greatest assets.

Naše potrebe su naše najveće preimućstvo.

Ispostavilo se da sam naučila da dajem

It turns out I've learned to give all the things I need."

ono što mi je samoj potrebno."

Valuing one's depression does not prevent a relapse,

Prihvatanje nečije depresije

ne sprečava da se ona vrati,

but it may make the prospect of relapse

ali će učiniti izglede za recidiv

and even relapse itself easier to tolerate.

i čak i sam recidiv lakšim za prihvatanje.

Poenta nije toliko

The question is not so much of finding great meaning

u pronalaženju višeg smisla i shvatanja

and deciding your depression has been very meaningful.

da je depresija bila jako značajna,

It's of seeking that meaning and thinking, when it comes again,

već u potrazi za tim značenjem

i razmišljanju da, kada bude naišla ponovo,

"This will be hellish, but I will learn something from it."

"biće pakleno teško,

al naučiće me nečemu."

I have learned in my own depression

Shvatio sam iz svoje depresije

how big an emotion can be,

koliko emocija može biti velika,

how it can be more real than facts,

stvarnija od činjenica

i shvatio sam da mi je to iskustvo

and I have found that that experience

has allowed me to experience positive emotion

omogućilo da doživim pozitivne emocije

in a more intense and more focused way.

na još jači i jasniji način.

The opposite of depression is not happiness,

Suprotno od depresije nije sreća,

but vitality,

već vitalnost,

and these days, my life is vital,

a ovih dana, moj je život vitalan,

čak i onih dana kada sam tužan.

even on the days when I'm sad.

I felt that funeral in my brain,

Osećao sam sahranu u svom mozgu

and I sat next to the colossus at the edge of the world,

i seo sam pored kolosa

na samoj ivici sveta,

and I have discovered something inside of myself

i otkrio

nešto unutar sebe samog

that I would have to call a soul

što bih nazvao dušom,

that I had never formulated until that day 20 years ago

a što nisam nikad formulisao do tog dana, pre 20 godina,

when hell came to pay me a surprise visit.

kad mi je pakao došao u iznenadnu posetu.

I think that while I hated being depressed

Dok sam mrzeo što imam depresiju

and would hate to be depressed again,

i mrzeo da je dobijem ponovo,

I've found a way to love my depression.

mislim da sam našao način da zavolim svoju depresiju.

I love it because it has forced me to find and cling to joy.

Volim je, jer me je naterala da

pronađem i prigrlim sreću.

I love it because each day I decide,

Volim je, jer svakog dana odlučujem,

sometimes gamely,

ponekad hrabro

and sometimes against the moment's reason,

i ponekad uprkos trenutnom razlogu

to cleave to the reasons for living.

da prigrlim razloge za življenje.

And that, I think, is a highly privileged rapture.

I mislim da je to oduševljenje velika privilegija,

Hvala vam.

Thank you.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)

Thank you.

(Applause)