Bryan Stevenson: We need to talk about an injustice | TED

翻译人员: Xiaoqiao Xie 校对人员: Dong Mao

很荣幸来到这里

Well, this is a really extraordinary honor for me.

我大多数时候都

I spend most of my time in jails, in prisons, on death row.

在管教所，在监狱里，在死囚室中

I spend most of my time in very low-income communities,

大部分时间我在低收入的社区里工作

in the projects and places where there's a great deal of hopelessness.

在充满绝望的地区，做前途暗淡的项目

今天来到TED

And being here at TED and seeing the stimulation, hearing it,

看到听到这些激动人心的演讲

has been very, very energizing to me.

给了我一针强心剂

And one of the things that's emerged in my short time here

在这短短的时间里，我注意到

is that TED has an identity.

TED有自己的定位

And you can actually say things here that have impacts around the world.

你可以看到这里发生的事情

影响全世界

And sometimes when it comes through TED, it has meaning and power

有时当事情发生在TED的讲台上

比发生在别处

that it doesn't have when it doesn't.

更有意义，更有影响

And I mention that because I think identity is really important.

我提起这个是因为我觉得自我定位很重要

我们已经听了一些精彩的演说

And we've had some fantastic presentations.

我们已经体会到

And I think what we've learned is that, if you're a teacher,

作为一个老师，你的话是有影响力的

your words can be meaningful,

如果你是个很慈善的老师

but if you're a compassionate teacher, they can be especially meaningful.

你的教导就格外意味深长

作为一个医生，你能够帮助人

If you're a doctor, you can do some good things,

如果你是个体恤病人的医生，你能帮助更多

but if you're a caring doctor, you can do some other things.

所以我想讲讲定位的重要性

So I want to talk about the power of identity.

我不是从做律师

And I didn't learn about this actually practicing law

或者做其他项目学到怎样自我定位的

and doing the work that I do.

我其实是从我外婆那里学到的

I actually learned about this from my grandmother.

我的家庭

I grew up in a house that was the traditional African American home

是一个传统的黑人家庭

只有一个女家长

that was dominated by a matriarch,

and that matriarch was my grandmother.

就是我的外婆

她很坚韧， 也很强壮

She was tough, she was strong, she was powerful.

威风凛凛

She was the end of every argument in our family.

家里有争执，她有决定权

(Laughter)

She was the beginning of a lot of arguments in our family.

不过很多事儿也是她挑起来的

(Laughter)

她的父母曾是真正的黑奴

She was the daughter of people who were actually enslaved.

弗吉尼亚州19世纪40年代，她父母落草为奴

Her parents were born in slavery in Virginia in the 1840s.

我外婆是十九世纪八十年代生的

She was born in the 1880s,

这段父母被奴役的经历

and the experience of slavery

决定了她看世界的角度

very much shaped the way she saw the world.

And my grandmother was tough, but she was also loving.

我的外婆很强势，但她也很慈爱

当我是个小男孩时

When I would see her as a little boy,

每次见到她都拥抱我

she'd come up to me and give me these hugs.

她抱得那么紧，我都透不过气来

And she'd squeeze me so tight I could barely breathe,

然后她才会放开我

and then she'd let me go.

一两个小时之后，当我再见她

And an hour or two later, if I saw her,

她会过来问我：“还能感觉我的拥抱么？”

she'd come over to me and say, "Bryan, do you still feel me hugging you?"

如果我说“感觉不到了”，她就再度出击

If I said, "No," she'd assault me again,

直到我说“感觉得到”，她才放开我

and if I said, "Yes," she'd leave me alone.

她就是有这个能力

And she just had this quality that you always wanted to be near her.

让你老是想亲近她

唯一的挑战是她有十个儿女

And the only challenge was that she had 10 children.

My mom was the youngest of her 10 kids.

我妈妈是十个里最年轻的

And sometimes when I would go and spend time with her,

常常当我去和外婆亲近时

很难让她注意到我，有时间陪我

it would be difficult to get her time and attention.

我的表兄妹们总是无处不在

My cousins would be running around everywhere.

我记得，当我八九岁时的一次

And I remember, when I was about eight or nine years old,

我早上醒来，跑到客厅

waking up one morning, going into the living room,

所有的表兄妹都在

and all of my cousins were running around.

我外婆坐在房间的另一端

And my grandmother was sitting across the room,

盯着我看

staring at me.

一开始我以为我们在玩游戏

And at first, I thought we were playing a game.

我就看回去，对她笑笑

And I would look at her, and I'd smile, but she was very serious.

但我外婆是很严肃的

大概十五还是二十分钟之后

And after about 15 or 20 minutes of this,

她站起来，穿过房间

she got up and she came across the room,

and she took me by the hand,

牵住我的手

and she said, "Come on, Bryan. You and I are going to have a talk."

对我说：“过来，布莱恩，我们得谈谈。”

这就像是昨天才发生的一样

And I remember this just like it happened yesterday.

I never will forget it.

我永远忘不掉

She took me out back and said, "Bryan, I'm going to tell you something,

她把我带到一边说：“我想和你说些事，

你不许和任何人说。”

but you don't tell anybody what I tell you."

我答应了：“好的，姥姥。”

I said, "OK, Mama."

她说：“保证绝不说出去。”我回答：“保证。”

She said, "Now, you make sure you don't do that."

I said, "Sure."

然后我们坐下，她看着我

Then she sat me down and she looked at me,

说：“我想让你知道

and she said, "I want you to know I've been watching you."

我观察你一段时间了。”

And she said, "I think you're special."

接着她说：“你是个特别的孩子。”

She said, "I think you can do anything you want to do."

她说：“我确信你是无所不能的。”

这我永远不会忘记

I will never forget it.

And then she said, "I just need you to promise me three things, Bryan."

接着她说：“我想让你向我保证三件事。”

我说：“好的姥姥。”

I said, "OK, Mama."

她说：“第一，我想让你保证

She said, "The first thing I want you to promise me

你会永远爱你的妈妈。”

is that you'll always love your mom."

她说：“你妈妈是我的心头肉，

She said, "That's my baby girl,

你得向我保证你会永远爱护她。”

and you have to promise me now you'll always take care of her."

我很爱我妈妈，我说：“好，姥姥，我会。”

Well, I adored my mom, so I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that."

接着她说：“第二件事，是你要答应我

Then she said, "The second thing I want you to promise me

你会永远走正路

is that you'll always do the right thing,

即使走正路是很难的选择。”

even when the right thing is the hard thing."

我想了想回答：“好的姥姥，我会的。”

And I thought about it, and I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that."

最后她说：“第三件事，我要你保证

Then finally, she said, "The third thing I want you to promise me

你永不喝酒。”

is that you'll never drink alcohol."

（笑声）

(Laughter)

我才九岁，我答应：“好，姥姥，我保证。”

Well, I was nine years old, so I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that."

我在南部的乡下长大

I grew up in the country in the rural South,

我有个哥哥大我一岁，还有个妹妹小我一岁

and I have a brother a year older than me and a sister a year younger.

当我十四五岁时

When I was about 14 or 15,

one day, my brother came home and he had this six-pack of beer;

一天我哥哥带回到家半打啤酒——

我都不知道他怎么弄到的——

I don't know where he got it.

他带上我和我妹妹，跑到树林里

He grabbed me and my sister, and we went out in the woods,

一通疯玩疯跑

and we were just out there doing the stuff we crazily did,

他喝了一口啤酒，递给我妹妹，她也喝了

and he had a sip of this beer and gave some to my sister

然后他们递给了我

and she had some, and they offered it to me.

我说：“我不要。没事，你们喝。我不喝。”

I said, "No, that's OK. Y'all go ahead. I'm not going to have any."

我哥哥说：“来嘛，我们今个儿都喝。你老是和我们一条阵线的。

My brother said, "Come on. We're doing this today; you always do what we do.

我喝了点，妹妹也喝了点，你来些。”

I had some, your sister had some. Have some beer."

我说：“不，我不想喝。你们喝你们喝。”

I said, "No, I don't feel right about that. Y'all go ahead."

我哥哥盯住我

问：“你有什么毛病？喝一点。”

And then my brother stared at me and said, "What's wrong with you? Have some beer."

接着他细细打量了我一会，问我：

Then he looked at me real hard and said,

“噢，你不会还想着

"Oh, I hope you're not still hung up on that conversation Mama had with you."

姥姥要你保证的事吧。”

（笑声）

(Laughter)

我说：“你在说什么呀？”

I said, "What are you talking about?"

他说：“姥姥和每个外孙都说他很特别。”

He said, "Oh, Mama tells all the grandkids that they're special."

（笑声）

(Laughter)

I was devastated.

我这个伤心呀

（笑声）

(Laughter)

现在我想向大家坦白一件事

And I'm going to admit something to you.

可能不该在这里说

I'm going to tell you something I probably shouldn't.

因为这个演讲是会到处播的

I know this might be broadcast broadly.

我今年五十二了

But I'm 52 years old,

我要向大家承认

and I'm going to admit to you

that I've never had a drop of alcohol.

我从来没有喝过一滴酒

(Applause)

（掌声）

I don't say that because I think that's virtuous;

这不是为了显派我多有道德

I say that because there is power in identity.

是为了说明自我定位的威力

When we create the right kind of identity,

当我们决定了正确的定位

we can say things to the world around us

我们就可以让全世界接受

that they don't actually believe make sense.

他们本来想不到的事情

我们能让世界做

We can get them to do things that they don't think they can do.

他们本来觉得做不到的事情

当我想到我的外婆

When I thought about my grandmother,

她当然觉得每个外孙都很特别

of course she would think all her grandkids were special.

我的外公因为违了禁在蹲监狱

My grandfather was in prison during prohibition.

我不止一个舅舅死与和酗酒有关的疾病

My male uncles died of alcohol-related diseases.

这些原则都是我外婆相信我们应该坚持的

And these were the things she thought we needed to commit to.

我想向大家介绍的

Well, I've been trying to say something about our criminal justice system.

是我们刑事执法系统

和四十年前比

This country is very different today than it was 40 years ago.

这个国家变了很多

In 1972, there were 300,000 people in jails and prisons.

在1972年，监狱里只有三十万人

今天，有两百三十万

Today, there are 2.3 million.

The United States now has the highest rate of incarceration

今天美国是世界上

服刑人口比例最高的国家

in the world.

We have seven million people on probation and parole.

我们有七百万人在缓刑期和假释期

And mass incarceration, in my judgment,

在我看来，这样的大量判刑

has fundamentally changed our world.

完全改变了我们的世界

在贫穷的社区里，在有色人种社区里

In poor communities, in communities of color,

充满了绝望

there is this despair,

这样的绝望

there is this hopelessness

that is being shaped by these outcomes.

是由这些改变带来的

三分之一的黑人男性

One out of three Black men between the ages of 18 and 30

十八岁到三十岁之间的

is in jail, in prison, on probation or parole.

不是在监狱里，就是在缓刑期或者假释期

在全国各处的城市社区里——

In urban communities across this country --

洛杉矶，费城，巴尔的摩，华盛顿——

Los Angeles, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington --

百分之五十到六十的有色人种的年轻人

50 to 60 percent of all young men of color

不是在监狱里，就是在缓刑期或者假释期

are in jail or prison

or on probation or parole.

我们的司法系统不仅是改变了

Our system isn't just being shaped in these ways

而是围绕着种族问题扭曲了

that seem to be distorting around race,

也围绕着贫困扭曲了

they're also distorted by poverty.

这个国家的司法系统

We have a system of justice in this country

会对你特殊照顾

that treats you much better if you're rich and guilty

如果你是有罪的富人而不是无辜的穷人的话

than if you're poor and innocent.

财富，而不是过失本身

Wealth, not culpability, shapes outcomes.

决定了最终结果

And yet, we seem to be very comfortable.

可是，我们还挺自在的呢

玩弄恐惧和愤怒的政治手腕

The politics of fear and anger have made us believe

说服了我们

that these are problems that are not our problems.

事不关己

We've been disconnected.

高高挂起

我对这个很感兴趣

It's interesting to me.

We're looking at some very interesting developments in our work.

我们日常工作能看一些很有意思的变革

我所在的阿拉巴马州，像很多其他州一样

My state of Alabama, like a number of states,

如果你被判有罪

actually permanently disenfranchises you if you have a criminal conviction.

就终身剥夺你的政治权力

现在在阿拉巴马州

Right now in Alabama,

34 percent of the Black male population has permanently lost the right to vote.

百分之三十四的黑人男性

永远失去了投票权

我们向前看十年

We're actually projecting that in another 10 years,

这个剥夺政治权利的比例

the level of disenfranchisement will be as high as it's been

将和投票权法案通过之前

since prior to the passage of the Voting Rights Act.

一样的高

可是没人提半个字

And there is this stunning silence.

我代表孩子们上庭

I represent children.

很多我的被告都很年轻

A lot of my clients are very young.

The United States is the only country in the world

美国是世界上唯一能将

十三岁的孩子

where we sentence 13-year-old children

判成终身监禁的国家

to die in prison.

We have life imprisonment without parole for kids in this country.

我国对孩子判终身监禁，还不得假释

我们其实现在就在帮这些人上诉

And we're actually doing some litigation.

世界上独一份

The only country in the world.

我也代理死刑犯的官司

I represent people on death row.

It's interesting, this question of the death penalty.

死刑这件事很发人深省

我们从各种渠道了解到

In many ways, we've been taught to think that the real question is:

（死刑的）根本问题是

人该不该为他们犯的罪行偿命

Do people deserve to die for the crimes they've committed?

And that's a very sensible question.

这是个非常合理的问题

但是另一方面

But there's another way of thinking about where we are in our identity.

问题是我们的自我定位

另一个想问题的方式

The other way of thinking about it is not:

不是人们该不该为罪行偿命

Do people deserve to die for the crimes they commit?,

而是我们配不配杀他们

but: Do we deserve to kill?

我是说，这个问题非常震撼

I mean, it's fascinating.

死刑在美国是常有差错的

Death penalty in America is defined by error.

For every nine people who have been executed,

每九个被判死刑的人

we've actually identified one innocent person

有一个后来会被证明无罪

被免死刑

who's been exonerated and released from death row.

这种错误率——

A kind of astonishing error rate --

九分之一的人完全无辜

one out of nine people, innocent.

我得说，非常震撼

I mean, it's fascinating.

学航空的人知道，如果每九架飞机里

In aviation, we would never let people fly on airplanes

if, for every nine planes that took off,

会有一架出事故

one would crash.

我们肯定是不会让这玩意儿载人飞的

(Laughter)

But somehow, we can insulate ourselves from this problem.

但是莫名其妙地我们就能忽视死刑的问题

因为这不是我们自身的问题

It's not our problem.

It's not our burden.

这不是我们自身的麻烦

It's not our struggle.

这不是我们自身的挣扎

I talk a lot about these issues.

我谈了很多问题

I talk about race

种族，还有

and this question of whether we deserve to kill.

我们配不配执行死刑

And it's interesting,

这很发人深省。当我教美国黑人历史的时候

when I teach my students about African American history,

我和学生讲奴隶制

I tell them about slavery.

和他们讲恐怖主义

I tell them about terrorism,

那个始于大复兴晚期

the era that began at the end of reconstruction

一直到二战时期的时代

that went on to World War II.

We don't really know very much about it.

我们并不真的了解那段历史

But for African Americans in this country,

但是对于这个国家的黑人来说

that was an era defined by terror.

那是个白色恐怖时代

在很多社区，人们害怕随时会被私刑处死

In many communities, people had to worry about being lynched.

人们担心随时会被炸弹袭击

They had to worry about being bombed.

那个白色恐怖时代，改变了他们的生活

It was the threat of terror that shaped their lives.

那时的人现在上了年纪，来和我说

And these older people come up to me now and say,

“史蒂文森先生，你到处演讲

"Mr. Stevenson, you give talks, you make speeches,

你得告诉大家

you tell people to stop saying we're dealing with terrorism

别说什么911以后是我们美国有史以来

for the first time in our nation's history after 9/11."

第一次对付恐怖主义。”

They tell me to say, "No, tell them that we grew up with that."

他们让我说：“我们就是在恐怖里长大的。”

那个恐怖主义的时代，当然了

And that era of terrorism, of course, was followed by segregation

最后演变成了无法逾越的鸿沟

数十年的种族歧视

and decades of racial subordination

和种族隔离

and apartheid.

然而，我们这个国家

And yet, we have in this country

this dynamic where we really don't like to talk about our problems.

不喜欢讨论存在的问题

我们不喜欢讨论历史

We don't like to talk about our history.

And because of that, we really haven't understood

正因如此，我们不能真正理解

what it's meant to do the things we've done historically.

我们有史以来做了什么

我们不停地产生冲突

We're constantly running into each other.

不停地制造紧张气氛

We're constantly creating tensions and conflicts.

我们没法讨论种族问题

We have a hard time talking about race,

我相信是因为我们不愿意正视

and I believe it's because we are unwilling to commit ourselves

to a process of truth and reconciliation.

一系列的事实，不愿意达成和解

In South Africa,

在南非，人们知道

people understood that we couldn't overcome apartheid

我们不能忘记种族隔离

除非我们诚实面对，达成和解

without a commitment to truth and reconciliation.

在卢旺达，即使种族灭绝后，人们还是正视了

In Rwanda, even after the genocide, there was this commitment.

但是在美国我们不愿意这么干

But in this country, we haven't done that.

我也在德国谈过死刑的问题

I was giving some lectures in Germany about the death penalty.

结果很绝妙

It was fascinating,

因为在讲谈后有个学者站起来

because one of the scholars stood up after the presentation

说：“你要知道，

and said, "Well, you know, it's deeply troubling

听你谈这个很痛心。”

to hear what you're talking about."

她说：“我们德国没有死刑。

He said, "We don't have the death penalty in Germany,

and of course, we can never have the death penalty in Germany."

当然了，我们德国永远也不可能有死刑。”

全场肃静

And the room got very quiet,

and this woman said,

这位女士说：

"There's no way, with our history,

“因为我们的历史，

我们永不可能决定

we could ever engage in the systematic killing of human beings.

有系统地杀人。

公开化且下意识地

It would be unconscionable for us

执行死刑，对我们来说

to, in an intentional and deliberate way,

是良心上无法接受的

set about executing people."

我思考了这个问题

And I thought about that.

如果我整天

What would it feel like to be living in a world

都看着德国人杀人

where the nation-state of Germany was executing people,

毫无道理地屠杀犹太人

especially if they were disproportionately Jewish?

我会有什么感受？

我无法忍受

I couldn't bear it.

It would be unconscionable.

那真是太不合理了

And yet, in this country,

但是，在我们这个国家

在南方各州

in the states of the Old South,

我们真的在屠杀——

we execute people --

当仅仅因为受害人是白人而不是黑人

where you're 11 times more likely to get the death penalty

你被判死刑的机率上升十倍时

if the victim is white than if the victim is Black,

当仅仅因为被告是黑人而不是白人

22 times more likely to get it

你被判死刑的机率上升二十一倍时——

if the defendant is Black and the victim is white --

在这些州，到处埋着

in the very states where there are, buried in the ground,

被私刑处死的人

the bodies of people who were lynched.

可是，我们还是漠不关心

And yet, there is this disconnect.

我相信这说明我们有定位危机

Well, I believe that our identity is at risk,

当我们对这些棘手的问题

that when we actually don't care about these difficult things,

置之不顾时

我们却仍旧对那些正面的好事儿

the positive and wonderful things are nonetheless implicated.

一如既往地关心

We love innovation.

我们爱极了革新

We love technology. We love creativity.

我们爱技术，我们爱创造

We love entertainment.

我们爱娱乐

但是最终

But ultimately,

这些好的现实

those realities are shadowed by suffering,

都被痛苦煎熬，

abuse, degradation,

滥用职权，剥夺人权

边缘化，蒙上了阴影

marginalization.

对于我来说两者合一

And for me, it becomes necessary to integrate the two,

是必要的

因为最终我们谈的

because ultimately, we are talking about a need to be more hopeful,

是怎么更有希望

更有保障，更有贡献

more committed, more dedicated

to the basic challenges of living in a complex world.

来应付生活在这个复杂社会中的种种挑战

对于我来说那需要

And for me, that means

花时间思考和讨论

spending time thinking and talking about the poor, the disadvantaged,

穷人阶层，弱势群体

those who will never get to TED,

那些永远也没机会来TED的人

不过想着他们其实在某种意义上

but thinking about them in a way that is integrated in our own lives.

是把他们融合进我们的生活里

要知道最终，我们得相信那些没亲眼见的事

You know, ultimately, we all have to believe things we haven't seen.

We do.

我们不得不。作为理智的社会，这么聪明的社会

As rational as we are, as committed to intellect as we are,

innovation, creativity, development

革新，创造

发展，并不仅仅

comes not from the ideas in our mind alone.

在我们脑子里空想出来的

它们是从我们脑子里的智慧

They come from the ideas in our mind

that are also fueled by some conviction in our heart.

和我们心里的信念

相结合的产物

And it's that mind-heart connection that I believe compels us

这个灵智合一

我相信会驱使我们

不仅仅是对那些

to not just be attentive to all the bright and dazzly things,

光明的事情更上心

同时对那些黑暗面和棘手的事情也是一样

but also the dark and difficult things.

韦克拉乌·哈韦尔，这位捷克的杰出领导人，谈过这个问题

Václav Havel, the great Czech leader, talked about this.

He said, "When we were in Eastern Europe and dealing with oppression,

他说：“当我们在东欧解决强制压迫的问题时

我们希望能成就很多

we wanted all kinds of things.

But mostly what we needed was hope,

但是最重要的，我们要一个希望

an orientation of the spirit,

一个心灵的指向

a willingness to sometimes be in hopeless places

一种不惮于体会绝望的态度

以及为史留证的意愿。”

and be a witness."

Well, that orientation of the spirit is very much at the core of what I believe

这个心灵的指向

就是我的核心信念

我们的TED社会

even TED communities have to be engaged in.

也要参与进来

这里不应有任何东西把

There is no disconnect around technology and design

高新的科技和完美的设计

that will allow us to be fully human

和我们的人性间隔开来

只要我们还能注意到痛苦

until we pay attention to suffering,

to poverty, to exclusion, to unfairness, to injustice.

注意到贫穷，制约，不公，和冤屈

我想提醒大家

Now, I will warn you

that this kind of identity is a much more challenging identity

这样的定位

是很有挑战性的

than ones that don't pay attention to this.

比起那些漠不关心的定位来说

它会影响你

It will get to you.

I had the great privilege, when I was a young lawyer,

当我是个年轻律师，我有幸见到帕克斯夫人

of meeting Rosa Parks.

帕克斯夫人曾时不时会到蒙哥马利

And Ms. Parks used to come back to Montgomery every now and then,

每次她都会和两个好友会面

and she would get together with two of her dearest friends,

两位上了年纪的女性

these older women,

姜妮·卡尔，她是蒙哥马利

Johnnie Carr, who was the organizer of the Montgomery bus boycott --

公车抵制运动的组织者——

非常出色的黑人女性——

amazing African American woman --

and Virginia Durr, a white woman,

还有弗吉尼亚·杜尔，一位白人女性

whose husband, Clifford Durr, represented Dr. King.

她丈夫克利福德·杜尔是马丁·路德·金的律师

这些女士们经常聚在一起讨论问题

And these women would get together and just talk.

And every now and then Ms. Carr would call me,

有时卡尔夫人会给我打电话

and she'd say, "Bryan, Ms. Parks is coming to town.

问我：“帕克斯夫人回来了，我们要聚聚。

We're going to get together and talk. Do you want to come over and listen?"

你愿不愿意来听我们谈话？”

我会说：“当然，夫人，我愿意。”

And I'd say, "Yes, ma'am, I do."

她会问：“你来这里具体干什么呀？”

She'd say, "What are you going to do when you get here?"

我会说：“我就想听听。”

I said, "I'm going to listen."

然后我会过去，只是倾听

And I'd go over there and I would, I'd just listen.

这些聚会总是非常激动和鼓舞人心的

It would be so energizing and so empowering.

有一次我在那里听她们谈话

And one time I was over there listening to these women talk,

几小时后帕克斯夫人问我

and after a couple of hours, Ms. Parks turned to me and said,

她问：“布莱恩，和我讲讲你的平等司法倡议。

"Bryan, tell me what the Equal Justice Initiative is.

和我讲讲你打算做什么。”

Tell me what you're trying to do."

我就开始大讲特讲

And I began giving her my rap.

我说：“我们想向不公正的待遇提出挑战。

"We're trying to challenge injustice.

我们想帮那些被误判了刑的人。

We're trying to help people who have been wrongly convicted.

我们想和在刑法制度里的

We're trying to confront bias and discrimination

偏见和歧视做对抗。

in the administration of criminal justice.

给孩子被判终身无法假释的制度给终结掉。

We're trying to end life without parole sentences for children.

我们想为死刑制度做些改变。

We're trying to do something about the death penalty.

我们想减少监狱人口。

We're trying to reduce the prison population.

我们还想杜绝过度泛滥的监禁。”

我做了一个全本无删减的演讲，当我结束时，她盯着我

We're trying to end mass incarceration."

I gave her my whole rap, and when I finished she looked at me

说：“别别别。”

and she said, "Mmm mmm mmm.

她说：“这些会让你很累，很累，很累的。”

That's going to make you tired, tired, tired."

（笑声）

(Laughter)

And that's when Ms. Carr leaned forward, she put her finger in my face,

这时卡尔夫人凑过来，她把手放在我脸边说：

“这就是为什么你要很勇敢很勇敢很勇敢。”

she said, "That's why you've got to be brave, brave, brave."

我确信TED这个社会

And I actually believe that the TED community

needs to be more courageous.

需要更有胆量些

我们需要找到出路

We need to find ways to embrace these challenges,

来面对这些挑战

这些问题，这些痛苦

these problems, the suffering.

因为最终，我们的整体的人性取决于

Because ultimately, our humanity depends on everyone's humanity.

每个人的人性

I've learned very simple things doing the work that I do.

在我的工作中

我学到了非常简单的原则

It's just taught me very simple things.

我开始理解，开始相信

I've come to understand and to believe

我们每一个人

that each of us is more than the worst thing we've ever done.

都不会被我们最坏的一面所定义

I believe that for every person on the planet.

我相信，对于这个星球上的每一个人

如果他撒了个谎，并不说明他就是个骗子

I think if somebody tells a lie, they're not just a liar.

如果他拿了不属于他的东西

I think if somebody takes something that doesn't belong to them,

并不说明他就是个惯偷

they're not just a thief.

甚至你杀了人，并不说明你就是个冷血杀手

I think even if you kill someone, you're not just a killer.

因为我相信人类有基本的尊严

And because of that, there's this basic human dignity

法律必须尊重它

that must be respected by law.

我也相信

I also believe

在我们国家的很多地方

that in many parts of this country,

当然甚至这个世界的很多地方

and certainly in many parts of this globe,

that the opposite of poverty is not wealth.

贫穷的反面，不是富裕

我不相信这个

I don't believe that.

我认为，在很多很多地方

I actually think, in too many places,

贫穷的反面，是公正

the opposite of poverty is justice.

最后，我相信

And finally, I believe

尽管（我们的科技和设计）很有声色

that, despite the fact that it is so dramatic and so beautiful

很美妙，很鼓动人心

and so inspiring and so stimulating,

也很刺激

we will ultimately not be judged by our technology,

但我们本身最终不会被科技所评价

也不会被设计所衡量

we won't be judged by our design,

we won't be judged by our intellect and reason.

我们也不会被智慧和哲学来打分

Ultimately, you judge the character of a society

最终，人们会评价我们这个社会

not by how they treat their rich and the powerful and the privileged,

不是根据我们怎么款待富人，有特权的人

而是根据我们怎么对待穷人

but by how they treat the poor,

the condemned,

被谴责的人，被囚禁的人

the incarcerated.

因为正是在这个合流点

Because it's in that nexus

我们真正地开始对于我们是什么样的人

that we actually begin to understand truly profound things

有了深入的理解

about who we are.

I sometimes get out of balance.

我常失去平衡。我想用个故事结束我的演讲

I'll end with this story.

我有时工作太多

I sometimes push too hard.

I do get tired, as we all do.

很累，就像大家每个人一样

有时这些想法太多而思考跟不上

Sometimes those ideas get ahead of our thinking

结果是很严重的

in ways that are important.

我曾经为这些孩子们辩护

And I've been representing these kids

他们被判了很重的刑

who have been sentenced to these very harsh sentences.

我去管教所，看见我的被告都是十三四岁

And I go to the jail and I see my client, who's 13 and 14,

他们被说成是成年人，作为成年人对待

and he's been certified to stand trial as an adult.

I start thinking, well, how did that happen?

我开始想，到底是怎么一回事？

一个法官，怎么能够把一个人

How can a judge turn you into something that you're not?

判定成一个不同的人？

And the judge has certified him as an adult, but I see this kid.

这个法官说他是成年人，但我只看见一个孩子

And I was up too late one night and I started thinking,

一天晚上我彻夜难眠，不止地想

天哪，如果法官能把你写成另一个人

well, if the judge can turn you into something you're not,

这个法官肯定有魔法

the judge must have magic power.

对了，布莱恩，这个法官有魔法

Yeah, Bryan, the judge has some magic power.

You should ask for some of that.

你可得学着点

And because I was up too late and wasn't thinking real straight,

因为我睡得太晚，脑子不清楚

我开始做一个议案

I started working on a motion.

我有个被告，十四岁，一个黑人小孩子

I had a client who was 14 years old, a young, poor Black kid.

我开始做他的辩护

And I started working on this motion, and the head of the motion was:

标题是：“提案：将我的

"Motion to try my poor, 14-year-old Black male client

十四岁的穷黑孩子

想成一个七十五岁的特级

like a privileged, white, 75-year-old corporate executive."

白人企业高管。”

(Laughter)

（掌声）

(Applause and cheers)

在这个提案里

And I put in my motion that there was prosecutorial misconduct

我说检察院，警察局和法庭都处理不当

and police misconduct and judicial misconduct.

说这个法院没有合情合法这一说之类的疯话

There was a crazy line in there

about how there's no conduct in this county, it's all misconduct.

全是故意乱判

第二天早上我醒来回想，我是做了个梦呢

And the next morning, I woke up and I thought,

还是真的写了这个提案？

now, did I dream that crazy motion, or did I actually write it?

恐怖的是，不光我真写了

And to my horror, not only had I written it,

我还寄给法院了

but I had sent it to court.

（掌声）

(Applause)

几个月过去了

A couple months went by,

and I just had forgotten all about it.

我全忘了有这么回事

最后我决定

And I finally decided,

天哪，我得上庭去做这个案子

"Gosh, I've got to go to the court and do this crazy case."

我跳上车

And I got in my car, and I was feeling really overwhelmed -- overwhelmed.

觉得很紧张——非常紧张

我上车开到法庭

And I got in my car and went to this courthouse.

我在想，这将会是场硬仗，会很痛苦

And I was thinking, this is going to be so difficult, so painful.

最后我终于钻出车子，开始往法庭走

And I finally got out of the car and started walking up to the courthouse.

当我上台阶时

And as I was walking up the steps,

有个上了年纪的黑人老伯，法院的清洁工

there was an older Black man who was the janitor in this courthouse.

他看见我，跑来说

When this man saw me, he came over and said, "Who are you?"

他问：“你是谁？”

我说：“我是律师。”他说：“你，是律师？”我说：“是的。先生。”

I said, "I'm a lawyer." He said, "You're a lawyer?" I said, "Yes, sir."

这个老伯凑过来

And this man came over to me, and he hugged me.

给了我一个拥抱

And he whispered in my ear.

他悄悄在我耳边说

He said, "I'm so proud of you."

他说：“我真为你骄傲。”

我得和大家承认

And I have to tell you, it was energizing.

这可给了我一针强心剂

It connected deeply with something in me

他的话提醒了我心深处

我的自我定位

about identity,

about the capacity of every person to contribute to community,

提醒了我每个人都应该

对社会，对更好的前景做出的贡献

to a perspective that is hopeful.

所以我跑到法庭里

Well, I went into the courtroom.

我一走进去，法官看见我就说：

And as soon as I walked in, the judge saw me coming.

“史蒂文森先生，是你写了这个疯案么？”

He said, "Mr. Stevenson, did you write this crazy motion?"

我说：“是先生，是我写的。”我们开始争论

I said, "Yes, sir. I did." And we started arguing.

人们陆续跑进来，因为大家都愤怒了

And people started coming in,

我的确写了不少挺够劲的事情

just outraged I'd written these crazy things.

警察也进来了

And police officers were coming in

助理检察官也进来了，书记员也进来了

and assistant prosecutors and clerk workers.

我还没回过神来，整个法庭站满了人

Before I knew it, the courtroom was filled with people

全很愤怒，因为我们在谈种族问题

angry that we were talking about race,

我们在谈贫穷

that we were talking about poverty, talking about inequality.

我们在谈不平等待遇

我眼角瞟到那个清洁工，在外面走来走去

And out of the corner of my eye, I could see this janitor pacing back and forth.

不断向里张望，他也都能听到人们的抱怨

He kept looking through the window and could hear all the holler.

他就这样来回来去地走

最后，这个黑人老伯进来了

And finally, this older Black man with a very worried look on his face

一脸担心地坐在我后面

came into the courtroom and sat behind me, almost at counsel table.

几乎顶到了辩护台

Ten minutes later, the judge said we'd take a break.

十分钟后，法官提议休息一下

休息期间，一个副警长觉得清洁工进法庭

During the break, there was a deputy sheriff who was offended

有失面子

that the janitor had come into court.

这个副警长跳起来，向这个老伯冲过去

The deputy jumped up and ran over to this older Black man.

说：“吉米，你来法庭里干什么？”

He said, "Jimmy, what are you doing in this courtroom?"

这个老黑人站起来

And this older Black man stood up and looked at that deputy

看看这个副警长，看看我

and he looked at me,

他说：“我进来

and he said, "I came into this courtroom to tell this young man,

是想告诉这个年轻人

往前看，往好了看，挺住。”

'Keep your eyes on the prize, hold on.'"

我今天来TED

I've come to TED

because I believe that many of you understand

是因为我相信这里很多人都明白

这个世界的道德的弧线尽管很长

that the moral arc of the universe is long,

但是永远向着公正的一边倾斜

but it bends toward justice;

在我们开始关心人权和尊严之前

that we cannot be full, evolved human beings

我们无法真正完成进化

until we care about human rights and basic dignity;

that all of our survival is tied to the survival of everyone;

我们的生存

和每一个人的生存都分不开

that our visions of technology and design

我们在科技和设计上的前景

在娱乐和创造力上的眼光

and entertainment and creativity

必须与人性，慈善，和公正的远见

have to be married with visions of humanity, compassion and justice.

相结合

最重要的是

And more than anything, for those of you who share that,

对于每个执着此见的人

I've simply come to tell you

我只想和你说

to keep your eyes on the prize, hold on.

往前看，往好了看，挺住

谢谢大家

Thank you very much.

(Applause and cheers)

（掌声）

Chris Anderson: Brian, so you heard and saw

克里斯·安德森：你应该听到看到

an obvious desire by this audience, this community,

这些听众，这个群体

to help you on your way and to do something on this issue.

想帮你，想做贡献的意愿了

Other than writing a check,

除了给你写支票

我们还能做什么？

what could we do?

BS: Well, there are opportunities all around us.

布莱恩：有很多机会

If you live in the state of California, for example,

比如，如果你在加州住

今年春天有个公投

there's a referendum coming up this spring

将是个很大的工夫

where there's going to be an effort to redirect some of the money we spend

关于重新分配我们在惩戒人上花的钱

on the politics of punishment.

比如，在加州

For example, here in California,

在未来五年内

we're going to spend one billion dollars

我们将花掉一亿美元——

on the death penalty in the next five years --

一亿呀

one billion dollars.

And yet, 46 percent of all homicide cases don't result in arrest,

同时，百分之四十六的凶杀案

都没有下落

56 percent of all rape cases don't result.

百分之五十六的强奸案，查不出来

这个公投是个改变现状的机会

So there's an opportunity to change that.

这个公投将提出把这些钱

And this referendum would propose

having those dollars go to law enforcement and safety.

花在执法和保安上

我认为这个机会我们能帮忙

And I think that opportunity exists all around us.

克瑞斯：在近三十年

CA: There's been this huge decline in crime in America

美国的犯罪率有个大下降

over the last three decades.

有人说部分原因是

And part of the narrative of that

is sometimes that it's about increased incarceration rates.

和大幅上升的监禁率有关

你对持这个说法的人会怎么讲？

What would you say to someone who believed that?

布莱恩：其实犯罪率

BS: Well, actually, the violent crime rate has remained relatively stable.

几乎没怎么变

这个国家上升的监禁率

The great increase in mass incarceration in this country

并不是在暴力犯罪这一类里的

wasn't really in violent crime categories.

而是由毒品的滥用所导致的

It was this misguided war on drugs.

That's where the dramatic increases have come

这才是我们监狱人口

in our prison population.

上升的主要原因

(Applause)

And we got carried away with the rhetoric of punishment.

我们在花哨的惩戒上走得有点太远了

And so we have "Three Strikes" laws

同时我们有三击出局的规定

that put people in prison forever

能把一些人永久监禁起来

for stealing a bicycle, for low-level property crimes,

只是因为偷了辆自行车，或者一点点财物

rather than making them give those resources back

我们并不给他们机会对受害人

to the people who they victimized.

作出补偿

I believe we need to do more

我相信我们需要给犯罪的人更多帮助

to help people who are victimized by crime,

而不是剥夺他们仅有的

not do less.

我想现今的刑法哲学

And I think our current punishment philosophy

对谁也没有利

does nothing for no one.

And I think that's the orientation that we have to change.

我认为这个大方向应该改变

（掌声）

(Applause)

克里斯：布莱恩，你今天震了大家一把

CA: Bryan, you've struck a massive chord here.

你真是很个能鼓舞人心的家伙

You're an inspiring person.

Thank you so much for coming to TED. Thank you.

非常感谢你来TED。谢谢

(Applause and cheers)

（掌声）

BS: Thank you. Thank you.

(Applause and cheers)