Onora O'Neill: What we don't understand about trust

Prevodilac: Vesna Savić Lektor: Mile Živković

So I'm going to talk about trust,

Pričaću vam o poverenju

and I'm going to start by reminding you

i počeću podsećanjem

of the standard views that people have about trust.

na standardne stavove koje ljudi imaju o poverenju.

I think these are so commonplace,

Mislim da su toliko uobičajeni

they've become clichés of our society.

da su postali klišei našeg društva.

And I think there are three.

Mislim da ih je tri.

One's a claim: there has been a great decline in trust,

Prvi je tvrdnja: javio se veliki pad u poverenju,

very widely believed.

i to mišljenje je vrlo rasprostranjeno.

The second is an aim: we should have more trust.

Drugi je težnja: treba da imamo više poverenja.

And the third is a task: we should rebuild trust.

Treći je zadatak: poverenje treba da povratimo.

I think that the claim, the aim and the task

Mislim da su te tri stvari - tvrdnja, težnja i zadatak -

are all misconceived.

svi pogrešno shvaćeni.

So what I'm going to try to tell you today

Danas ću pokušati da vam ispričam

is a different story about a claim, an aim and a task

jednu drugačiju priču o tvrdnji, težnji i zadatku,

which I think give one quite a lot better purchase on the matter.

koja, mislim, daje jednu bolju sliku čitave stvari.

First the claim: Why do people think trust has declined?

Prvo, tvrdnja: zašto ljudi misle da je poverenje opalo?

And if I really think about it on the basis of my own evidence,

Ako istinski razmislim o tome, na osnovu sopstvenog iskustva,

I don't know the answer.

ja odgovor ne znam.

I'm inclined to think it may have declined

Težim mišljenju da je možda opalo

in some activities or some institutions

u nekim aktivnostima ili nekim institucijama,

and it might have grown in others.

a možda poraslo u drugim.

I don't have an overview.

Nemam nikakav pregled.

But, of course, I can look at the opinion polls,

Naravno, mogu da pogledam istraživanja javnog mnenja,

and the opinion polls are supposedly

a istraživanja javnog mnenja su navodno

the source of a belief that trust has declined.

izvor uverenja da je poverenje opalo.

When you actually look at opinion polls across time,

Ako stvarno pogledate istraživanja javnog mnenja tokom vremena,

there's not much evidence for that.

nema tako puno dokaza.

That's to say, the people who were mistrusted

To jest, osobe u koje se nije imalo poverenja

20 years ago,

pre 20 godina -

principally journalists and politicians, are still mistrusted.

najpre novinari i političari - i dalje ne zavređuju poverenje.

And the people who were highly trusted 20 years ago

A ljudima kojima se pre 20 godina jako verovalo

are still rather highly trusted: judges, nurses.

njima se i dalje prilično veruje, i to su sudije, medicinske sestre.

The rest of us are in between,

Mi ostali smo u sredini,

and by the way, the average person in the street

a uzgred, prosečan prolaznik na ulici

is almost exactly midway.

je gotovo tačno na sredini.

But is that good evidence?

Ali da li je to dobar dokaz?

What opinion polls record is, of course, opinions.

Ono što istraživanja javnog mnenja beleže je, naravno, mišljenje.

What else can they record?

Šta drugo mogu beležiti?

So they're looking at the generic attitudes

Dakle, posmatraju se opšti stavovi

that people report when you ask them certain questions.

koje ljudi zauzmu kada im se postave određena pitanja.

Do you trust politicians? Do you trust teachers?

Da li verujete političarima? Da li verujete nastavnicima?

Now if somebody said to you, "Do you trust greengrocers?

Kad bi vas neko pitao: „Da li verujete piljarima?

Do you trust fishmongers?

Da li verujete prodavcima ribe?

Do you trust elementary school teachers?"

Da li verujete nastavnicima u osnovnim školama?",

you would probably begin by saying, "To do what?"

Verovatno ćete započeti sa: „U vezi sa čim?"

And that would be a perfectly sensible response.

I to bi bila savršeno razumna reakcija.

And you might say, when you understood the answer to that,

I kada shvatite odgovor na to, rekli biste:

"Well, I trust some of them, but not others."

„Pa, nekima verujem, a nekima ne."

That's a perfectly rational thing.

To je savršeno razumno.

In short, in our real lives,

Ukratko, u našem stvarnom životu

we seek to place trust in a differentiated way.

težimo da poverenje ukažemo na različite načine.

We don't make an assumption that the level of trust

Ne pretpostavljamo da će nivo poverenja -

that we will have in every instance of a certain type

koje dajemo svakom

of official or office-holder or type of person

zvaničniku ili funkcioneru ili nekoj trećoj osobi -

is going to be uniform.

da će taj nivo svuda biti isti.

I might, for example, say that I certainly trust

Ja bih na primer rekla da svakako verujem

a certain elementary school teacher I know

određenoj nastavnici koju znam

to teach the reception class to read,

da uči prvake da čitaju,

but in no way to drive the school minibus.

ali ne bih imala poverenja u nju da vozi školski autobus.

I might, after all, know that she wasn't a good driver.

Možda, ipak, znam da ona nije dobar vozač.

I might trust my most loquacious friend

Možda bih verovala da moj najbrbljiviji prijatelj

to keep a conversation going

može da održava razgovor,

but not -- but perhaps not to keep a secret.

ali ne - verovatno ne i da sačuva tajnu.

Simple.

Prosto.

So if we've got those evidence in our ordinary lives

Ako imamo takve dokaze u našim običnim životima

of the way that trust is differentiated,

o različitim načinima ukazivanja poverenja,

why do we sort of drop all that intelligence

zašto mi onda takve informacije zaboravljamo

when we think about trust more abstractly?

kada malo apstraktnije razmislimo o poverenju?

I think the polls are very bad guides

Mislim da su ankete veoma loši pokazatelji

to the level of trust that actually exists,

nivoa poverenja koje zaista postoji,

because they try to obliterate the good judgment

jer pokušavaju da umanje zdrav razum

that goes into placing trust.

koji koristimo kada nekom ukazujemo poverenje.

Secondly, what about the aim?

Drugo, šta je s ciljem?

The aim is to have more trust.

Cilj je da imamo više poverenja.

Well frankly, I think that's a stupid aim.

Iskreno, ja smatram da je to glup cilj.

It's not what I would aim at.

To nije nešto čemu bih ja težila.

I would aim to have more trust in the trustworthy

Ja bih težila ka tome da imamo poverenja u one koji su ga vredni,

but not in the untrustworthy.

a ne u one koji nisu. (Smeh)

In fact, I aim positively to try not to trust the untrustworthy.

Zapravo, ja istinski pokušavam da ne dajem poverenje onima koji ga nisu vredni.

And I think, of those people who, for example,

I mislim da, od ljudi koji su, primera radi.

placed their savings with the very aptly named Mr. Madoff,

svoju ušteđevinu poverili gospodinu zgodno nazvanom Mejdof,

who then made off with them,

koji ih je potom izigrao

and I think of them, and I think, well, yes,

i kad pomislim na te ljude, da, onda pomislim

too much trust.

da su imali previše poverenja.

More trust is not an intelligent aim in this life.

Imati više poverenja nije pametan cilj u životu.

Intelligently placed and intelligently refused trust

Pametno poklonjeno i pametno uskraćeno poverenje

is the proper aim.

su podesni ciljevi.

Well once one says that, one says, yeah, okay,

Kaže se da,

that means that what matters in the first place

znači, ono što je pre svega bitno

is not trust but trustworthiness.

nije poverenje, već zavređivanje poverenja.

It's judging how trustworthy people are

Procenjivanje koliko su ljudi vredni poverenja

in particular respects.

u određenom smislu.

And I think that judgment requires us to look at three things.

I ja mislim da ta procena zahteva da obratimo pažnju na tri stvari.

Are they competent? Are they honest? Are they reliable?

Da li su sposobni? Da li su iskreni? Da li su pouzdani?

And if we find that a person is competent

I ako vidimo da je neka osoba sposobna

in the relevant matters,

za određene stvari,

and reliable and honest,

i pouzdana i iskrena,

we'll have a pretty good reason to trust them,

imamo prilično dobar osnov da joj verujemo,

because they'll be trustworthy.

jer je vredna poverenja.

But if, on the other hand, they're unreliable, we might not.

Ako, s druge strane, nije pouzdana, onda nećemo verovati.

I have friends who are competent and honest,

Imam prijatelje koji su sposobni i pošteni,

but I would not trust them to post a letter,

ali se ne bih oslonila na njih da pošalju pismo

because they're forgetful.

jer su zaboravni,

I have friends who are very confident

Imam prijatelje koji veruju

they can do certain things,

da mogu da urade određene stvari,

but I realize that they overestimate their own competence.

ali vidim da precenjuju sopstvene sposobnosti.

And I'm very glad to say, I don't think I have many friends

I veoma mi je drago da mogu da kažem da mislim da nemam puno prijatelja

who are competent and reliable but extremely dishonest.

koji su sposobni i pouzdani, ali izrazito nepošteni.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

If so, I haven't yet spotted it.

A ako ih ima, onda nisam primetila.

But that's what we're looking for:

Ali, to je ono što tražimo:

trustworthiness before trust.

zavređivanje poverenja pre samog poverenja.

Trust is the response.

Poverenje je odgovor na to.

Trustworthiness is what we have to judge.

Moramo da procenimo da li je neko vredan poverenja.

And, of course, it's difficult.

To je, naravno, teško.

Across the last few decades, we've tried to construct

Tokom prethodnih nekoliko decenija pokušali smo da stvorimo

systems of accountability for all sorts of institutions

sisteme odgovornosti različitih institucija,

and professionals and officials and so on

profesionalaca i zvaničnika, itd.

that will make it easier for us to judge their trustworthiness.

da bismo sebi olakšali procenu da li su vredni poverenja.

A lot of these systems have the converse effect.

Mnogo tih sistema ima suprotan efekat.

They don't work as they're supposed to.

Ne funkcionišu onako kako bi trebalo.

I remember I was talking with a midwife who said,

Sećam se da sam pričala s jednom babicom koja je rekla:

"Well, you see, the problem is it takes longer

„Pa, vidite, problem je što više vremena treba

to do the paperwork than to deliver the baby."

da se odradi papirologija nego da se rodi beba."

And all over our public life, our institutional life,

I u celom našem javnom životu, u institucijama

we find that problem,

nailazimo na taj problem

that the system of accountability

da sistem za procenu,

that is meant to secure trustworthiness

koji bi trebalo da osigura zavređivanje poverenja

and evidence of trustworthiness

i dokaze za to,

is actually doing the opposite.

zapravo radi suprotno.

It is distracting people who have to do difficult tasks,

Smeta ljudima koji treba da obavljaju teške zadatke,

like midwives, from doing them

poput babica,

by requiring them to tick the boxes, as we say.

zahtevajući da, što se kaže, štikliraju kvadratiće,

You can all give your own examples there.

Svi imate primere toga.

So so much for the aim.

Toliko o cilju.

The aim, I think, is more trustworthiness,

Cilj je, mislim, pre zavređivanje poverenja

and that is going to be different

i to će se razlikovati

if we are trying to be trustworthy

ako pokušavamo da budemo vredni poverenja

and communicate our trustworthiness to other people,

i da našu vrednost pokažemo drugma

and if we are trying to judge whether other people

i ako pokušavamo da procenimo da li su drugi ljudi,

or office-holders or politicians are trustworthy.

zvaničnici ili političari vredni poverenja.

It's not easy. It is judgment, and simple reaction,

To nije lako. Tu nema mesta proceni i prostoj reakciji,

attitudes, don't do adequately here.

kao ni stavovima.

Now thirdly, the task.

Treće, zadatak.

Calling the task rebuilding trust, I think,

Mislim da nazivanje zadatka ponovnim izgrađivanjem poverenja

also gets things backwards.

znači nešto sasvim suprotno..

It suggests that you and I should rebuild trust.

To bi značilo da treba da opet izgradimo poverenje.

Well, we can do that for ourselves.

Možemo to sami da uradimo.

We can rebuild a bit of trustworthiness.

Možemo ponovo zavrediti malo poverenja.

We can do it two people together trying to improve trust.

Dvoje ljudi mogu pokušati da zajedno unaprede poverenje.

But trust, in the end, is distinctive

Ali, na kraju krajeva, poverenje je posebno

because it's given by other people.

po tome što ga dobijamo od drugih ljudi.

You can't rebuild what other people give you.

Ne možete ponovo izgraditi ono što vam ljudi ukazuju.

You have to give them the basis

Morate im dati povoda

for giving you their trust.

da imaju poverenja u vas.

So you have to, I think, be trustworthy.

Tako da mislim da morate biti vredni poverenja.

And that, of course, is because you can't fool

Naravno, to je zato što ne možete nekoga varati

all of the people all of the time, usually.

sve vreme. Bar obično ne.

But you also have to provide usable evidence

Takođe morate imati opipljive dokaze

that you are trustworthy.

da ste vredni poverenja.

How to do it?

Kako to uraditi?

Well every day, all over the place, it's being done

To svakoga dana svuda rade

by ordinary people, by officials, by institutions,

obični ljudi, zvaničnici, institucije,

quite effectively.

i to veoma dobro.

Let me give you a simple commercial example.

Daću vam jedan prost komercijalni primer.

The shop where I buy my socks says I may take them back,

Radnja u kojoj kupujem čarape kaže da ih mogu vratiti,

and they don't ask any questions.

i da ne postavljaju nikakva pitanja.

They take them back and give me the money

Uzmu ih nazad i vrate mi novac

or give me the pair of socks of the color I wanted.

ili mi daju par čarapa u boji koju tražim.

That's super. I trust them

To je odlično.

Verujem im zato što su sebe učinili ranjivim.

because they have made themselves vulnerable to me.

I think there's a big lesson in that.

U tome je velika pouka.

If you make yourself vulnerable to the other party,

Ako sebe učinite ranjivim

then that is very good evidence that you are trustworthy

to je onda dobar dokaz da ste vredni poverenja

and you have confidence in what you are saying.

i da verujete u to što govorite.

So in the end, I think what we are aiming for

Na kraju, mislim da svi imamo cilj

is not very difficult to discern.

koji nije toliko teško prepoznati.

It is relationships in which people are trustworthy

To su veze u kojima su ljudi vredni poverenja

and can judge when and how the other person

i mogu da procene kada je i kako je druga osoba

is trustworthy.

vredna poverenja.

So the moral of all this is,

Pouka svega ovoga je

we need to think much less about trust,

da treba da manje razmišljamo o poverenju,

let alone about attitudes of trust

a da i ne spominjemo stavove o poverenju,

detected or mis-detected by opinion polls,

koje ankete javnog mnenja otkriju ili ne otkriju,

much more about being trustworthy,

i treba da više razmišljamo o tome da budemo vredni poverenja

and how you give people adequate, useful

i o tome kako ljudima pružamo adekvatne, korisne

and simple evidence that you're trustworthy.

i jednostavne dokaze da smo vredni poverenja.

Thanks.

Hvala.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)