Marcel Dicke: Why not eat insects?

譯者: Wang-Ju Tsai 審譯者: Adrienne Lin

Okay, I'm going to show you

我又要來告訴你們

again something about our diets.

一些有關我們飲食的事。

And I would like to know what the audience is,

我想先知道現場聽衆有哪些人

and so who of you ever ate insects?

曾有人吃過昆蟲嗎？

That's quite a lot.

還真不少。

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

But still, you're not representing

然而，在場的各位

the overall population of the Earth.

並不代表全球人口的實況

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

Because there's 80 percent out there that really eats insects.

因爲，實際上全球百分之八十的人吃昆蟲

But this is quite good.

而這樣是很好的。

Why not eat insects? Well first, what are insects?

何不食昆蟲？首先我們要定義，什麽是昆蟲？

Insects are animals that walk around on six legs.

昆蟲是有六隻腳的動物

And here you see just a selection.

這裡你可以看到一些種類

There's six million species of insects on this planet,

全球有六百萬種的昆蟲

six million species.

六百萬種。

There's a few hundreds of mammals --

哺乳類只有幾百種

six million species of insects.

而昆蟲有六百萬種。

In fact, if we count all the individual organisms,

而且，如果我們把所有生物個體算進來

we would come at much larger numbers.

我們得到的不只這個數字。

In fact, of all animals on Earth,

事實上，地球上的動物

of all animal species,

所有的種類都算進去

80 percent walks on six legs.

百分之八十都是六隻腳的動物。

But if we would count all the individuals,

如果我們把所有的生物個體都算進來

and we take an average weight of them,

再取所有的平均重量

it would amount to something like 200 to 2,000 kilograms

你我每個人會對應到

for each of you and me on Earth.

大概200到2000公斤重的昆蟲。

That means that in terms of biomass,

這表示，就生物質量來説

insects are more abundant than we are,

昆蟲佔的比重比我們人類還大很多。

and we're not on a planet of men,

我們住的不是人的星球

but we're on a planet of insects.

而是昆蟲的星球。

Insects are not only there in nature,

昆蟲不只存在自然裏

but they also are involved in our economy,

也跟我們的經濟息息相關

usually without us knowing.

這點大部分的我們都不知道。

There was an estimation,

根據幾年前

a conservative estimation, a couple of years ago

一項保守的估算說

that the U.S. economy

昆蟲給美國經濟

benefited by 57 billion

每年帶來

dollars per year.

570億美金的效益。

It's a number -- very large --

對美國的經濟來説

a contribution to the economy of the United States for free.

這是一個十分大，但免費的貢獻。

And so I looked up what the economy was paying

我也順便查了

for the war in Iraq

同一年

in the same year.

花在伊拉克戰爭的費用

It was 80 billion U.S. dollars.

是800億美金。

Well we know that that

我們都知道

was not a cheap war.

伊拉克戰爭並不便宜。

So insects, just for free,

但是昆蟲，免費地

contribute to the economy of the United States

為美國的經濟帶來

with about the same order of magnitude,

相當於伊戰規模的效益

just for free, without everyone knowing.

卻沒有任何人知道。

And not only in the States,

而且不止在美國，在任何國家、

but in any country, in any economy.

任何經濟體系裏都有這樣的效益

What do they do?

昆蟲們是怎麽辦到的？

They remove dung, they pollinate our crops.

昆蟲會分解糞便，幫農作物授粉

A third of all the fruits that we eat

我們吃的水果

are all a result

有三分之一

of insects taking care of the reproduction of plants.

都是藉由昆蟲授粉而生産的。

They control pests,

昆蟲抑制害蟲的蔓延

and they're food for animals.

也是動物的食物來源

They're at the start of food chains.

他們位於食物鏈的底層

Small animals eat insects.

小動物吃昆蟲

Even larger animals eat insects.

大型的動物也吃昆蟲。

But the small animals that eat insects

吃昆蟲的小動物

are being eaten by larger animals,

被大動物吃掉

still larger animals.

又被更大的動物吃掉

And at the end of the food chain, we are eating them as well.

位於食物鏈末端的我們也吃昆蟲。

There's quite a lot of people that are eating insects.

有很多人吃昆蟲

And here you see me

這是我在中國

in a small, provincial town in China, Lijiang --

一個人口兩百萬

about two million inhabitants.

叫麗江的小城。

If you go out for dinner, like in a fish restaurant,

你去吃晚餐，就像在海產店

where you can select which fish you want to eat,

你挑選你要吃的魚

you can select which insects you would like to eat.

在這裡你挑選你要吃的昆蟲。

And they prepare it in a wonderful way.

廚師把昆蟲變成色香味俱全的菜。

And here you see me enjoying a meal

你看我在吃的昆蟲大餐有

with caterpillars, locusts,

毛毛蟲、蝗蟲

bee pupae -- delicacies.

蜜蜂等等。

And you can eat something new everyday.

每天還有新菜色

There's more than 1,000 species of insects

全球有超過1000種的昆蟲

that are being eaten all around the globe.

被人類食用。

That's quite a bit more

跟我們吃的

than just a few mammals that we're eating,

像牛、豬、羊

like a cow or a pig

區區幾種哺乳類比起來

or a sheep.

這是相當大的數量。

More than 1,000 species --

超過1000種

an enormous variety.

這種類是很多的

And now you may think, okay,

你可能會想

in this provincial town in China they're doing that, but not us.

好吧，中國這個鄉下地方的人吃蟲，我們可不吃。

Well we've seen already that quite some of you

我們剛才看到了

already ate insects maybe occasionally,

在場各位裏有些人偶爾可能吃昆蟲。

but I can tell you that every one of you

我可以跟你們說，

is eating insects, without any exception.

所有的人都吃昆蟲，而且沒有例外。

You're eating at least

每一年你至少

500 grams per year.

吃進了五百公克

What are you eating?

怎麽會呢？

Tomato soup, peanut butter,

番茄湯、花生醬

chocolate, noodles --

巧克力、麵條等

any processed food that you're eating

所有處理過的食品

contains insects,

都包含昆蟲

because insects are here all around us,

因爲昆蟲無所不在

and when they're out there in nature

在大自然裏、在我們的左右、

they're also in our crops.

在穀物裏。

Some fruits get some insect damage.

有些水果受到蟲咬

Those are the fruits, if they're tomato,

像是番茄、

that go to the tomato soup.

就被加工做成湯

If they don't have any damage, they go to the grocery.

沒被蟲咬的水果才會拿到市場來賣

And that's your view of a tomato.

這是你印象中的漂亮的番茄。

But there's tomatoes that end up in a soup,

但是也有很多番茄直接被做成湯

and as long as they meet

食品裏可能出現各式各樣的東西

the requirements of the food agency,

只要能符合

there can be all kinds of things in there,

食品管理單位的規定

no problem.

就沒有問題。

In fact, why would we put these balls in the soup,

事實上，番茄湯裡何必再放肉？

there's meat in there anyway?

裡面早就有（蟲）肉了

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

In fact, all our processed foods

所有處理過的食品

contain more proteins

所含的蛋白質的量

than we would be aware of.

都比我們認爲的還多。

So anything is a good protein source already.

所以基本上所有的食品都含蛋白質。

Now you may say,

現在你可能會說

"Okay, so we're eating 500 grams just by accident."

“好吧，這500克是我們不小心吃進去的。”

We're even doing this on purpose.

事實上，在很多食品裏

In a lot of food items that we have --

我們也會故意加蟲進去。

I have only two items

我這裡有兩樣

here on the slide --

在投影片上

pink cookies or surimi sticks

粉紅色餅乾和蟹肉棒

or, if you like, Campari --

或是，Campari烈酒

a lot of our food products that are of a red color

很多我們吃的紅色的東西

are dyed with a natural dye.

是用天然紅色染料染的。

The surimi sticks

蟹肉棒

[of] crabmeat, or is being sold as crab meat,

是蟹肉，或是仿蟹肉

is white fish

實際是白魚肉

that's being dyed with cochineal.

用胭脂蟲酸染色的。

Cochineal is a product

胭脂蟲酸是

of an insect that lives off these cacti.

是寄生在仙人掌上的蟲作的染料。

It's being produced in large amounts,

胭脂蟲酸是量產的產物

150 to 180 metric tons per year

年產量為150到180公噸

in the Canary Islands in Peru,

主要產在祕魯的加那利群島

and it's big business.

是一項重要的產業。

One gram of cochineal

每一克胭脂蟲酸

costs about 30 euros.

要價30歐元

One gram of gold

黃金一公克

is 30 euros.

也是30歐元

So it's a very precious thing

所以我們使用的這個食物染料

that we're using to dye our foods.

是非常珍貴的。

Now the situation in the world is going to change

對你我和這個地球而言

for you and me, for everyone on this Earth.

現在世界的局勢將會改變。

The human population is growing very rapidly

這世界的人口正在急速增加

and is growing exponentially.

成指數爆炸性地增加

Where, at the moment, we have

現在全球大約

something between six and seven billion people,

有60到70億的人口

it will grow to about nine billion

到2050年

in 2050.

會增加到90億。

That means that we have a lot more mouths to feed,

這表示會有更多張嘴嗷嗷待哺。

and this is something that worries more and more people.

越來越多人開始為這個為這個問題擔心。

There was an FAO conference last October

聯合國糧農組織去年十月

that was completely devoted to this.

開了一個會專門來討論這個問題。

How are we going to feed this world?

如何能產生足夠的食物？

And if you look at the figures up there,

你如果看看這些數字

it says that we have a third more mouths to feed,

說世界人口將增加33%

but we need an agricultural production increase

但是農業產出必須增加70%

of 70 percent.

才能餵飽所有人。

And that's especially because this world population

這是因爲，

is increasing,

雖然人口在增加

and it's increasing, not only in numbers,

但增加的不只是量

but we're also getting wealthier,

我們也越來越有錢

and anyone that gets wealthier starts to eat more

有錢的人除了吃得更多

and also starts to eat more meat.

也吃更多的肉。

And meat, in fact, is something

而肉，事實上

that costs a lot

要耗費

of our agricultural production.

更多的農業產能。

Our diet consists, [in] some part, of animal proteins,

我們的飲食的一部分是動物性蛋白

and at the moment, most of us here

而這些動物性蛋白我們大部分

get it from livestock,

是從畜牧牲畜、

from fish, from game.

從魚、家禽那裏得來，

And we eat quite a lot of it.

我們吃的動物性蛋白還不少。

In the developed world it's on average

在已開發國家裏

80 kilograms per person per year,

平均每人每年吃80公斤的肉

which goes up to 120

而在美國

in the United States

更是高達120公斤

and a bit lower in some other countries,

在一些國家雖然吃得少一些

but on average 80 kilograms

但是平均

per person per year.

每人每年80公斤。

In the developing world it's much lower.

在開發中國家就少很多

It's 25 kilograms per person per year.

每人每年25公斤

But it's increasing enormously.

但急速增長中。

In China in the last 20 years,

在中國過去20年裏

it increased from 20 to 50,

消耗的肉從20增加到50公斤

and it's still increasing.

還在持續增加中。

So if a third of the world population

所以，如果世界三分之一的人口

is going to increase its meat consumption

消耗的肉量將會

from 25 to 80 on average,

從25增加到80公斤

and a third of the world population

另外，三分之一的世界人口

is living in China and in India,

住在中國和印度

we're having an enormous demand on meat.

那麽我們對肉將會有很大量的需求。

And of course, we are not there to say

當然，我們不能說

that's only for us, it's not for them.

只有我們能吃肉，這三分之一的人不能吃肉。

They have the same share that we have.

他們跟我們有一樣的權利。

Now to start with, I should say

說起來，第一點我覺得

that we are eating way too much meat

在歐美國家裏

in the Western world.

我們吃太多肉了。

We could do with much, much less --

事實上我們可以少吃一點的

and I know, I've been a vegetarian for a long time,

這點我很清楚，因爲我吃素很久了

and you can easily do without anything.

我知道肉可以不吃

You'll get proteins in any kind of food anyway.

從很多食物你都可以獲取蛋白質。

But then there's a lot of problems

再者，肉的生産過程裏

that come with meat production,

有很多問題

and we're being faced with that more and more often.

而這些問題的出現也越來越頻繁。

The first problem that we're facing is human health.

首當其衝的問題就是人體的健康。

Pigs are quite like us.

豬跟人很像

They're even models in medicine,

不單做人類藥劑試驗的對象

and we can even transplant organs from a pig to a human.

也還可以移植器官給人類。

That means that pigs also share diseases with us.

這表示說豬也和人有很多共同的疾病

And a pig disease,

豬的疾病

a pig virus, and a human virus

一株豬的病毒，和人的病毒

can both proliferate,

都是會增殖的。

and because of their kind of reproduction,

因爲兩種病毒的複製

they can combine and produce a new virus.

可以交叉而產生一株新的病毒

This has happened in the Netherlands in the 1990s

這在1990年代在荷蘭爆發的傳統豬瘟裏

during the classical swine fever outbreak.

就發現這樣的事。

You get a new disease that can be deadly.

而這種新的病是會致命的。

We eat insects -- they're so distantly related from us

因爲昆蟲和我們之間物種差異十分大

that this doesn't happen.

這種事是不會發生的。

So that's one point for insects.

所以在這方面，昆蟲獲得一分。

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

And there's the conversion factor.

另外還有生産報酬率的因素

You take 10 kilograms of feed,

10公斤的飼料

you can get one kilogram of beef,

可以養出一公斤的牛肉

but you can get nine kilograms of locust meat.

但是蝗蟲肉可以養出9公斤

So if you would be an entrepreneur,

如果你是老闆

what would you do?

你要養那一種？

With 10 kilograms of input,

同樣是10公斤的飼料

you can get either one or nine kg. of output.

你可以得到1或9公斤的產出。

So far we're taking

目前我們還都是選擇

the one, or up to five kilograms of output.

1公斤，最多到5公斤的產出

We're not taking the bonus yet.

紅利都還放在那邊沒人拿呢，

We're not taking the nine kilograms of output yet.

我們都還沒去拿這9公斤的產出，

So that's two points for insects.

所以到這裡昆蟲得兩分

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

And there's the environment.

再來有環境的考量

If we take 10 kilograms of food --

如果我們用10公斤的飼料

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

and it results in one kilogram of beef,

來產出1公斤的牛肉

the other nine kilograms are waste,

那麽有9公斤是排泄掉了

and a lot of that is manure.

其中大部分變成糞便排出

If you produce insects, you have less manure

如果你改養昆蟲，每公斤飼料投入

per kilogram of meat that you produce.

所產生的糞便量是比較少的

So less waste.

產生的排泄物較少。

Furthermore, per kilogram of manure,

再者，就每一公斤的糞便

you have much, much less ammonia

產生的氨氣

and fewer greenhouse gases

和溫室氣體而言，

when you have insect manure

昆蟲糞便在這方面

than when you have cow manure.

比起牛糞又少了很多。

So you have less waste,

所以總體的排泄物較少

and the waste that you have is not as environmental malign

而且就對環境的為害上來說

as it is with cow dung.

昆蟲糞比牛糞還要不嚴重

So that's three points for insects.

昆蟲現在積分為三分

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

Now there's a big "if," of course,

當然，目前有一個大問號

and it is if insects produce meat

那就是，昆蟲所做的肉的品質

that is of good quality.

是好的嗎？

Well there have been all kinds of analyses

經過各種試驗和分析

and in terms of protein, or fat, or vitamins,

就蛋白質、油脂、和維他命的含量

it's very good.

結果是另人滿意的。

In fact, it's comparable

事實上，昆蟲作的肉跟我們現在吃的肉

to anything we eat as meat at the moment.

品質比起來是不相上下的

And even in terms of calories, it is very good.

甚至於在熱量的提供上，是十分好的。

One kilogram of grasshoppers

一公斤的蚱蜢

has the same amount of calories

所含的熱量相當於

as 10 hot dogs, or six Big Macs.

十條熱狗或六個大麥克堡。

So that's four points for insects.

昆蟲得到第四分

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

I can go on,

我可以一直說下去

and I could make many more points for insects,

舉出更多昆蟲的優點

but time doesn't allow this.

但是時間有限

So the question is, why not eat insects?

問題的重點在於，何不食昆蟲？

I gave you at least four arguments in favor.

我可以提出四個賣點。

We'll have to.

我們大家

Even if you don't like it,

即使你不喜歡

you'll have to get used to this

也要去習慣這些事。

because at the moment,

在目前

70 percent of all our agricultural land

70%的農地

is being used to produce livestock.

被用來生産牲畜。

That's not only the land

這包含的不只是

where the livestock is walking and feeding,

放、養動物需要的土地

but it's also other areas

更包含了

where the feed is being produced and being transported.

種植飼料所用的土地。

We can increase it a bit

如果再開發一點熱帶雨林的話

at the expense of rainforests,

我們可以把蓄養動物的面積再增加一點

but there's a limitation very soon.

但很快也會到達極限的。

And if you remember that we need to increase

你如果還記得我們剛講的

agricultural production by 70 percent,

農業產出量還需要增加70%

we're not going to make it that way.

這樣做是不會成功的。

We could much better change

比較好的方法是

from meat, from beef,

把肉、牛肉的消耗量

to insects.

用昆蟲來取代。

And then 80 percent of the world

再説世界80%的人口

already eats insects,

已經在吃蟲了

so we are just a minority --

事實上，我們這些

in a country like the U.K., the USA,

在英國、美國、荷蘭

the Netherlands, anywhere.

不吃蟲的人才是少數。

On the left-hand side, you see a market in Laos

在左邊，你看到這是在寮國的市場

where they have abundantly present

有大量的昆蟲

all kinds of insects that you choose for dinner for the night.

可以讓你選擇來做晚餐，

On the right-hand side you see a grasshopper.

在右邊是一隻蚱蜢

So people there are eating them,

那裏人們吃蚱蜢

not because they're hungry,

不是因爲沒東西吃

but because they think it's a delicacy.

而是因爲他們覺得蚱蜢是美食。

It's just very good food.

蚱蜢是好東西。

You can vary enormously.

你可以吃很多

It has many benefits.

對身體很有助益

In fact, we have delicacy

事實上，很多我們所謂的美食

that's very much like this grasshopper:

跟蚱蜢很像

shrimps, a delicacy

像蝦子，美食之一

being sold at a high price.

售價高得不得了

Who wouldn't like to eat a shrimp?

誰不愛吃蝦？

There are a few people who don't like shrimp,

不愛吃蝦的人是少數吧

but shrimp, or crabs,

但是蝦子、螃蟹、

or crayfish,

小龍蝦

are very closely related.

基本上都是同一類的。

They are delicacies.

這都是美食。

In fact, a locust is a "shrimp" of the land,

事實上，蝗蟲是陸上的蝦子

and it would make very good into our diet.

也很適合我們食用

So why are we not eating insects yet?

那爲什麽我們還不吃昆蟲呢？

Well that's just a matter of mindset.

這歸咎到我們的心態問題

We're not used to it,

我們還不習慣

and we see insects as these organisms that are very different from us.

我們把昆蟲當成跟我們很不一樣的生物

That's why we're changing the perception of insects.

所以我們要改變我們對昆蟲的認知

And I'm working very hard with my colleague, Arnold van Huis,

我跟我的同事Arnold van Huis在努力

in telling people what insects are,

告訴人們昆蟲是什麽

what magnificent things they are,

昆蟲是多美妙的東西

what magnificent jobs they do in nature.

對大自然的貢獻有多大。

And in fact, without insects,

事實上，沒有了昆蟲

we would not be here in this room,

我們今天也不可能在這裡

because if the insects die out,

因爲沒有了昆蟲

we will soon die out as well.

我們也不能生存。

If we die out, the insects will continue very happily.

我們要是滅亡了，昆蟲還會繼續快樂地存活下去。

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

So we have to get used to the idea of eating insects.

所以我們最好接受吃昆蟲的想法。

And some might think, well they're not yet available.

有人會說，就算敢吃也還買不到

Well they are.

這是錯的

There are entrepreneurs in the Netherlands that produce them,

在荷蘭現在有人在量產

and one of them is here in the audience,

她今天也在台下

Marian Peeters, who's in the picture.

Marian Peeters 是相片中的這個人

I predict that later this year, you'll get them in the supermarkets --

我預計今年年底，你就可以在超級市場買到

not visible, but as animal protein

不是一隻一隻的買，而是以動物蛋白的方式

in the food.

出現在食品裏。

And maybe by 2020,

很可能在2020年以前

you'll buy them just knowing that this is an insect that you're going to eat.

你也會清楚地知道和接受去吃昆蟲產品

And they're being made in the most wonderful ways.

昆蟲加工品也會出現在各種美妙的東西裏

A Dutch chocolate maker.

這是一個荷蘭巧克力師傅

(Music)

（音樂）

(Applause)

（掌聲）

So there's even a lot of design to it.

還能弄成很多設計和裝飾

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

Well in the Netherlands, we have an innovative Minister of Agriculture,

在荷蘭我們有很會創新的農業部長

and she puts the insects on the menu

她指示部裏的員工餐廳

in her restaurant in her ministry.

提供昆蟲類的菜

And when she got all the Ministers of Agriculture of the E.U.

最近她還把歐盟各國的農業部長

over to the Hague recently,

請到(荷蘭)海牙來

she went to a high-class restaurant,

他們一起去一間高級餐廳

and they ate insects all together.

一起享用了昆蟲餐。

It's not something that is a hobby of mine.

這不只是我個人的小嗜好

It's really taken off the ground.

而是真正要成爲一股流行。

So why not eat insects?

所以，何不食昆蟲？

You should try it yourself.

你該親自試試。

A couple of years ago, we had 1,750 people all together

幾年前，我們找了1750人

in a square in Wageningen town,

一起在Wageningen市的廣場

and they ate insects at the same moment,

大家一起品嘗昆蟲

and this was still big, big news.

這在當時還是條大新聞。

I think soon it will not be big news anymore when we all eat insects,

我想，如果大家都吃昆蟲的話，這就不會再是大新聞了

because it's just a normal way of doing.

因爲這就變得平凡無奇了

So you can try it yourself today,

所以今天你可以自己試一試

and I would say, enjoy.

我會祝你用餐愉快。

And I'm going to show to Bruno some first tries,

我讓Bruno先來試一試

and he can have the first bite.

他可以當第一個試吃的

(Applause)

（掌聲）

Bruno Giussani: Look at them first. Look at them first.

Bruno Giussani：先看看，先看看

Marcel Dicke: It's all protein.

Marcel Dicke：這都是蛋白質

BG: That's exactly the same [one] you saw in the video actually.

BG：這跟你在影片裏看到的一模一樣

And it looks delicious.

看起來也挺好吃的

They just make it [with] nuts or something.

裡面還加了堅果什麽的

MD: Thank you.

MD:謝謝大家

(Applause)

（掌聲）