Julian Baggini: Is there a real you?

翻译人员: Chen Li 校对人员: Yolanda Zhang

Is there a real you?

真实的你存在吗？

This might seem to you like a very odd question.

也许对你来说这是一个 奇怪的问题。

Because, you might ask,

因为你可能会问，

how do we find the real you,

我们怎么寻找真实的自己，

how do you know what the real you is?

而你又如何知道什么才是 真实的自己呢？

And so forth.

诸如此类。

But the idea that there must be a real you,

不过一定存在一个真实的你，

surely that's obvious.

这个想法显然是成立的。

If there's anything real in the world, it's you.

如果这个世界存在什么真实的事物， 那就是你。

Well, I'm not quite sure.

不过，我其实没那么确定。

At least we have to understand a bit better what that means.

至少我们要对这个问题 理解的深入一些。

Now certainly, I think there are lots of things in our culture around us

当然，我认为 我们周围的文化中有很多东西

which sort of reinforce the idea

或多或少都强化了这样一种想法，

that for each one of us, we have a kind of a core, an essence.

那就是我们当中的每一个人 都具备一个核心，一种本质。

There is something about what it means to be you which defines you,

存在一些能够定义你的东西， 使你成为你自己，

and it's kind of permanent and unchanging.

它是永恒不变的。

The most kind of crude way in which we have it,

其中有一些很不精确的方式，

are things like horoscopes.

比如星座，等等。

You know, people are very wedded to these, actually.

事实上人们对这些相当痴迷。

People put them on their Facebook profile

把它们放在脸书资料里，

就好像这些东西很有意义似的，

as though they are meaningul,

you even know your Chinese horoscope as well.

你甚至还知道自己的生肖属相。

There are also more scientific versions of this,

还有更多具有科学性的版本，

all sorts of ways of profiling personality type,

各种各样定义人格类型的方法，

such as the Myers-Briggs tests, for example.

比如像麦尔斯-布里格斯性格分类测试。

I don't know if you've done those.

不知道你们有没有做过这个。

A lot of companies use these for recruitment.

很多公司把这种测试用在招聘中。

You answer a lot of questions,

你要回答很多问题，

and this is supposed to reveal something about your core personality.

以此来揭示你的某些核心人格。

And of course, the popular fascination with this is enormous.

当然，这些测试是相当流行的。

In magazines like this, you'll see,

在这类的杂志中，你可以看到

in the bottom left corner, they'll advertise in virtually every issue

几乎在每一刊的左下角，

some kind of personality thing.

都有这类性格测试的广告。

And if you pick up one of those magazines,

一旦你拿起这种杂志，

it's hard to resist, isn't it?

就很难抗拒，不是么？

Doing the test to find what is your learning style,

用这些测试来找出你的学习模式，

what is your loving style, or what is your working style?

你的恋爱模式， 还有你的工作模式。

Are you this kind of person or that?

比如你是哪种类型的人？

So I think that we have a common-sense idea

我想我们有一个共识，

that there is a kind of core or essence of ourselves

就是都认为自己有一种

to be discovered.

有待发掘的核心特质。

And that this is kind of a permanent truth about ourselves,

有一种关乎我们自身的永恒真相，

something that's the same throughout life.

一生都不会改变。

Well, that's the idea I want to challenge.

然而这正是我要挑战的认知。

And I have to say now, I'll say it a bit later,

我现在就得说，一会还会再讲，

but I'm not challenging this just because I'm weird,

我要挑战这种认知 并不是因为我这人很怪，

the challenge actually has a very, very long and distinguished history.

事实上这个挑战已经有一段 悠久显赫的历史了。

最普遍的想法是，

Here's the common-sense idea.

There is you.

这是你。

You are the individuals you are, and you have this kind of core.

你是你这个个体， 并且有这类的核心特征。

Now in your life, what happens is that you, of course,

而在你的一生中，当然

accumulate different experiences and so forth.

你会积累不同的经历等等。

So you have memories,

于是你有了记忆，

and these memories help to create what you are.

这些记忆帮助你塑造了自己。

You have desires, maybe for a cookie,

你有欲望，也许只是想要一块饼干，

maybe for something that we don't want to talk about

也许是一些早晨十一点在学校

at 11 o'clock in the morning in a school.

我们不想去讨论的东西。

You will have beliefs.

你还会有信仰，

This is a number plate from someone in America.

这是一个美国人的车牌。

I don't know whether this number plate, which says "messiah 1,"

我不知道这个车牌显示的“弥赛亚 1”

indicates that the driver believes in the messiah,

是否表示这个司机相信救世主，

or that they are the messiah.

或者他们自己就是救世主。

Either way, they have beliefs about messiahs.

不管怎样，他们信仰弥赛亚。

We have knowledge.

我们有知识。

We have sensations and experiences as well.

也有直觉和经历。

It's not just intellectual things.

并不只有智力方面的东西。

So this is kind of the common-sense model, I think,

我想这就是一个有关“你是什么”的

of what a person is.

常识性模型。

There is a person who has all the things that make up our life experiences.

你是这么一个人， 拥有这些构成你人生经历的事物。

But the suggestion I want to put to you today

但今天我想提出的观点却是，

is that there's something fundamentally wrong with this model.

这个模型具有根本性的错误。

And I can show you what's wrong with one click.

我可以很简洁的给你们展示问题在哪里。

Which is there isn't actually a "you" at the heart of all these experiences.

所有这些经历的中心其实 并不存在那个真实的“你”。

Strange thought? Well, maybe not.

这个想法很奇怪吗？ 不尽然。

What is there, then?

那这些经历中究竟有些什么呢？

显然，有记忆、欲望、意愿、直觉，

Well, clearly there are memories, desires, intentions, sensations,

and so forth.

等等诸如此类。

但事实上这些事物是存在的，

But what happens is these things exist,

and they're kind of all integrated,

而且整合在一起，

they're overlapped, they're connected in various different ways.

他们以各种各样的方式相互交错， 彼此连接。

They're connecting partly, and perhaps even mainly,

他们之间有部分连接， 也许甚至是大部分连接，

because they all belong to one body and one brain.

因为他们属于同一个身体， 同一个大脑。

But there's also a narrative, a story we tell about ourselves,

不过还有这样一种叙述， 关于自己的故事，

the experiences we have when we remember past things.

那些在我们回忆过去时所获得的经历。

We do things because of other things.

我们所做的事情都有其缘由。

So what we desire is partly a result of what we believe,

我们的欲望部分源于我们的信仰，

and what we remember is also informing us what we know.

我们的记忆也决定了我们的认知。

And so really, there are all these things,

的确，所有这些东西

like beliefs, desires, sensations, experiences,

比如信仰，欲望，直觉和经历，

they're all related to each other,

他们都相互关联，

and that just is you.

这就构成了“你”。

In some ways, it's a small difference from the common-sense understanding.

某种意义上， 这与我们的基本认知只有些微的不同。

In some ways, it's a massive one.

而某种意义上，这种偏差却是巨大的。

It's the shift between thinking of yourself

这是在把你自己当做

as a thing which has all the experiences of life,

拥有所有这些人生经历的事物，

and thinking of yourself as simply that collection

以及把你自己当做所有这些 人生经历的合集

of all experiences in life.

之间的一种转换。

You are the sum of your parts.

你是所有部分的集合。

Now those parts are also physical parts, of course,

当然，这些也可以是身体的部分，

brains, bodies and legs and things,

比如大脑，躯干，肢体等等，

but they aren't so important, actually.

但事实上这些都不那么重要。

If you have a heart transplant, you're still the same person.

假设你做了心脏移植， 你还是那个你。

If you have a memory transplant, are you the same person?

但如果你做了记忆移植， 你还是那个你吗？

If you have a belief transplant, would you be the same person?

如果是信仰移植呢， 你还是原来的你吗？

Now this idea, that what we are, the way to understand ourselves,

所以，这个关于我们是什么 以及如何认识自身的想法，

is as not of some permanent being, which has experiences,

它认为我们不是什么拥有 经历的永恒个体，

but is kind of a collection of experiences,

而是这些经历的集合，

might strike you as kind of weird.

这种想法可能会让你觉得有点儿奇怪。

But actually, I don't think it should be weird.

但事实上，我觉得一点都不。

In a way, it's common sense.

某种程度上，这也是常识。

Because I just invite you to think about, by comparison,

我请大家通过比较，想想

think about pretty much anything else in the universe,

宇宙中其它的诸多事物，

maybe apart from the very most fundamental forces or powers.

不用考虑那些最基本的力或者功。

Let's take something like water.

举个水的例子吧。

Now my science isn't very good.

我的科学素养很一般。

We might say something like water has two parts hydrogen

我们可以说水含有两份氢

and one parts oxygen, right?

和一份氧，对吧？

We all know that.

这个我们都知道。

I hope no one in this room thinks that what that means

希望这个屋子里没有人会理解为

is there is a thing called water, and attached to it

有一种叫做水的东西，

附着着氢原子和氧原子，

are hydrogen and oxygen atoms,

and that's what water is.

认为这就是水。

Of course we don't.

我们当然不会这么想。

We understand, very easily, very straightforwardly,

我们都能轻易而直接的理解，

that water is nothing more

水不过是

than the hydrogen and oxygen molecules suitably arranged.

氢和氧以恰当的形式排列而成的。

Everything else in the universe is the same.

宇宙中的其他任何事物也一样。

There's no mystery about my watch, for example.

比如，我的手表也没有什么神秘的。

我们说它有表面，指针，

We say the watch has a face, and hands,

and a mechanism and a battery,

还有机械装置以及电池。

But what we really mean is,

不过我们的真正意思

we don't think there is a thing called the watch

并不是认为一种叫做表的东西，

to which we then attach all these bits.

上面附着上所有这些元件。

We understand very clearly that you get the parts of the watch,

我们很清楚 当你把所有这些元件组合起来，

you put them together, and you create a watch.

就可以得到一个手表。

Now if everything else in the universe is like this,

如果宇宙中所有事物都是这样，

why are we different?

我们又有什么特殊的呢？

Why think of ourselves

为什么我们不把自己认为是

as somehow not just being a collection of all our parts,

所有部件的组合，

but somehow being a separate, permanent entity which has those parts?

而是一个拥有那些部件的 某种独立而永恒的存在？

Now this view is not particularly new, actually.

这种看法其实并不新鲜。

It has quite a long lineage.

它已经有着一段很长的传承。

在佛教里有，

You find it in Buddhism,

you find it in 17th, 18th-century philosophy

十七，十八世纪的哲学里有

going through to the current day, people like Locke and Hume.

直至现在，以洛克（译注：17世纪英国哲学家） 和休谟（译注：18世纪苏格兰哲学家）为代表的思想。

But interestingly, it's also a view

但有趣的是，这也是一种

increasingly being heard reinforced by neuroscience.

越来越经常听到的被神经科学不断加强的想法。

This is Paul Broks, he's a clinical neuropsychologist,

这是保罗·布洛克斯， 一位临床神经心理学家，

and he says this:

他是这样说的：

"We have a deep intuition that there is a core,

“我们有一种根深蒂固的直觉：

an essence there, and it's hard to shake off,

就是存在一种核心特质， 很难摆脱，

probably impossible to shake off, I suspect.

我甚至怀疑也许是根本无法摆脱的。

But it's true that neuroscience shows that there is no centre in the brain

但神经科学的确显示， 我们的大脑中没有什么让

where things do all come together."

所有东西都集合在一起的中心区域。”

So when you look at the brain,

那么当你观察大脑，

and you look at how the brain makes possible a sense of self,

观察大脑如何形成自我意识，

you find that there isn't a central control spot in the brain.

你会发现根本不存在什么中心控制点。

There is no kind of center where everything happens.

不存在所有事件集中发生的区域。

There are lots of different processes in the brain,

大脑中有大量不同的进程，

all of which operate, in a way, quite independently.

各自以相当独立的方式运行着。

But it's because of the way that they relate

但是，他们之间相互关联的方式

that we get this sense of self.

使得我们有了自我的意识。

The term I use in the book, I call it the ego trick.

我在书里把它叫做自我迷局。

It's like a mechanical trick.

就像机械迷局一样。

It's not that we don't exist,

这不是说我们不存在，

it's just that the trick is to make us feel that inside of us

而是这个迷局使得我们感觉

is something more unified than is really there.

在我们内部有一种更为统一的存在。

Now you might think this is a worrying idea.

也许你会觉得这个想法让人感到沮丧。

You might think that if it's true,

你也许会想，如果这是真的，

that for each one of us there is no abiding core of self,

我们每个人都没有持久的核心自我，

no permanent essence,

没有永恒的实质，

does that mean that really, the self is an illusion?

这是否意味着自我是一种假象呢?

Does it mean that we really don't exist?

是否意味着我们并不存在？

There is no real you.

没有什么真正的你。

Well, a lot of people actually do use this talk of illusion and so forth.

的确有很多人接纳了这种 假象之类的说法。

These are three psychologists, Thomas Metzinger, Bruce Hood,

比如有三位心理学家， 托马斯·梅辛革，布鲁斯·胡德

Susan Blackmore,

以及苏珊·布莱克默，

a lot of these people do talk the language of illusion,

这些人都支持这种假象学说，

the self is an illusion, it's a fiction.

认为自我是一种假象，是虚构的。

But I don't think this is a very helpful way of looking at it.

不过我不觉得这种理解方式 在这个问题上有任何的帮助。

Go back to the watch.

The watch isn't an illusion, because there is nothing to the watch

我们回到手表的例子。

手表不是假象， 因为除了部件的组合

other than a collection of its parts.

没有其它东西了。

In the same way, we're not illusions either.

同样的，我们也不是假象。

The fact that we are, in some ways, just this very, very complex collection,

事实上，从某种角度来说， 我们只是一个

ordered collection of things,

极其复杂的有序集合，

does not mean we're not real.

并不意味着我们不是真实存在的。

I can give you a very sort of rough metaphor for this.

我可以给你们一个非常粗浅的比喻。

Let's take something like a waterfall.

就拿瀑布来说吧。

These are the Iguazu Falls, in Argentina.

这是阿根廷的伊瓜苏瀑布。

Now if you take something like this,

如果仔细想想，

you can appreciate the fact that in lots of ways,

你就会领会到，从很多方面来看，

there's nothing permanent about this.

它都不是永恒的。

For one thing, it's always changing.

首先，它永远在变化中。

The waters are always carving new channels.

这些水总在冲蚀出新的路径，

with changes and tides and the weather,

随着潮汐和天气的变化，

some things dry up, new things are created.

有的干涸了，有的则刚刚形成。

Of course the water that flows through the waterfall

当然，瀑布中流淌着的水

is different every single instance.

每一刻都是不同的。

But it doesn't mean that the Iguazu Falls are an illusion.

但这并不是说伊瓜苏瀑布就是假象。

It doesn't mean it's not real.

并不是说它就是非真实的了。

What it means is we have to understand what it is

这意味着，我们需要将它理解为

as something which has a history,

是一种拥有过往的事物，

has certain things that keep it together,

是某些东西的集合，

but it's a process, it's fluid, it's forever changing.

不过它是一个过程， 流动着的，始终变化着的。

Now that, I think, is a model for understanding ourselves,

我觉得这就是一个 可以用来认识我们自己的模型，

and I think it's a liberating model.

一个释放性的模型。

Because if you think that you have this fixed, permanent essence,

因为如果你认为自己有什么 固定的永恒的特质，

which is always the same, throughout your life, no matter what,

无论怎样都终其一生而存在，

in a sense you're kind of trapped.

那么在某种意义上你已经被套住了。

You're born with an essence,

你生而具备某种特质，

that's what you are until you die,

而它就会定义你，直到死亡，

if you believe in an afterlife, maybe you continue.

如果你相信有来生， 也许还会继续。

But if you think of yourself as being, in a way,

但如果你换种方式，

not a thing as such, but a kind of a process,

认为自己不是这样一种事物， 而是一个过程，

something that is changing,

一个处于变化中的过程，

then I think that's quite liberating.

我觉得这就是一种解放。

Because unlike the the waterfalls,

因为与瀑布不同，

we actually have the capacity to channel

我们其实在一定程度上具备

the direction of our development for ourselves to a certain degree.

为自己的发展规划方向的能力。

Now we've got to be careful here, right?

现在我们要小心了，对吧？

If you watch the X-Factor too much, you might buy into this idea

如果你看了太多“X音素” （译注：英国真人选秀节目），你可能会深信

that we can all be whatever we want to be.

我们可能成为任何想成为的人。

That's not true.

但事实并非如此。

I've heard some fantastic musicians this morning,

今早我听到一些非常棒的音乐家的演奏，

and I am very confident that I could in no way be as good as them.

我非常确信我没法达到他们的水平。

I could practice hard and maybe be good,

我可以刻苦练习，也许会做的不错，

but I don't have that really natural ability.

但我并不具备这个天赋。

There are limits to what we can achieve.

我们可以实现的总是有限的。

There are limits to what we can make of ourselves.

在造就自我方面我们能力有限，

But nevertheless, we do have this capacity

但无论如何，我们至少具备

to, in a sense, shape ourselves.

在一定程度上塑造自己的能力。

The true self, as it were then,

真实的自己，

is not something that is just there for you to discover,

并不是等着你去发现的什么东西，

you don't sort of look into your soul and find your true self,

你不是在灵魂中寻找那个真实的自己。

What you are partly doing, at least,

你或多或少正在做的，

is actually creating your true self.

其实是在创造真实的自己。

And this, I think, is very, very significant,

这一点我觉得非常重要，

particularly at this stage of life you're at.

尤其对于你所在的人生阶段。

You'll be aware of the fact

你会意识到这些年

how much of you changed over recent years.

自己变化了多少。

If you have any videos of yourself, three or four years ago,

如果你有自己三四年前的视频，

you probably feel embarrassed because you don't recognize yourself.

你也许会感到很尴尬， 因为你都快认不出自己了。

So I want to get that message over, that what we need to do

我希望能传递这样的信息， 我们需要做的

is think about ourselves as things that we can shape,

就是认为我们自己是可以塑造，

and channel and change.

规划，并不断改变的事物。

This is the Buddha, again:

佛说：

"Well-makers lead the water,

“水人调船，

fletchers bend the arrow,

弓匠调角，

carpenters bend a log of wood,

巧匠调木，

wise people fashion themselves."

智者调身。”

And that's the idea I want to leave you with,

这正是我要传达给你们的理念，

that your true self is not something that you will have to go searching for,

你无须寻找真实的自己，

as a mystery, and maybe never ever find.

也许这是个永远无法解开的谜。

To the extent you have a true self,

即便存在真实的自己，

it's something that you in part discover,

你也需要一边发掘，

but in part create.

一边创造。

and that, I think, is a liberating and exciting prospect.

这是一种自由释放性的， 非常的令人振奋的观点。

Thank you very much.

谢谢大家。