Stanley McChrystal: The military case for sharing knowledge

107,933 views ใƒป 2014-05-07

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ืื ื ืœื—ืฅ ืคืขืžื™ื™ื ืขืœ ื”ื›ืชื•ื‘ื™ื•ืช ื‘ืื ื’ืœื™ืช ืœืžื˜ื” ื›ื“ื™ ืœื”ืคืขื™ืœ ืืช ื”ืกืจื˜ื•ืŸ.

ืžืชืจื’ื: Ido Dekkers ืžื‘ืงืจ: Tal Dekkers
00:12
When I was a young officer, they told me
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ื›ืฉื”ื™ื™ืชื™ ืงืฆื™ืŸ ืฆืขื™ืจ, ืืžืจื• ืœื™
00:14
to follow my instincts,
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ืœืœื›ืช ืื—ืจื™ ื”ืื™ืกื˜ื™ื ืงื˜ื™ื ืฉืœื™,
00:16
to go with my gut,
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ืœืœื›ืช ืขื ืชื—ื•ืฉืช ื”ื‘ื˜ืŸ,
00:19
and what I've learned
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ื•ืžื” ืฉืœืžื“ืชื™
00:21
is that often our instincts are wrong.
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ื–ื” ืฉืœืคืขืžื™ื ื”ืื™ื ืกื˜ื™ื ืงื˜ื™ื ืฉืœื• ื˜ื•ืขื™ื.
00:25
In the summer of 2010,
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ื‘ืงื™ืฅ 2010,
00:28
there was a massive leak of classified documents
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ื”ื™ืชื” ื“ืœื™ืคื” ืžืืกื™ื‘ื™ืช ืฉืœ ืžืกืžื›ื™ื ืžืกื•ื•ื’ื™ื
00:32
that came out of the Pentagon.
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ืฉื™ืฆืื” ืžื”ืคื ื˜ื’ื•ืŸ.
00:35
It shocked the world,
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ื–ื” ื–ืขื–ืข ืืช ื”ืขื•ืœื,
00:36
it shook up the American government,
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ื–ื” ื–ืขื–ืข ืืช ื”ืžืžืฉืœ ื”ืืžืจื™ืงืื™,
00:38
and it made people ask a lot of questions,
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ื•ื–ื” ื’ืจื ืœืื ืฉื™ื ืœืฉืื•ืœ ื”ืจื‘ื” ืฉืืœื•ืช,
00:40
because the sheer amount of information
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ืžืคื ื™ ืฉื”ื›ืžื•ืช ื”ืื“ื™ืจื” ืฉืœ ื”ืžื™ื“ืข
00:43
that was let out, and the potential impacts,
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ืฉื™ืฆืื”, ื•ื”ื”ืฉืœื›ื•ืช ื”ืคื•ื˜ื ืฆื™ืืœื™ื•ืช,
00:46
were significant.
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ื”ื™ื• ืžืฉืžืขื•ืชื™ื•ืช.
00:49
And one of the first questions we asked ourselves
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ื•ืื—ืช ื”ืฉืืœื•ืช ื”ืจืืฉื•ื ื•ืช ืฉืฉืืœื ื• ืืช ืขืฆืžื ื•
00:53
was why would a young soldier have access
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ื”ื™ืชื” ืœืžื” ืœื—ื™ื™ืœ ืฆืขื™ืจ ื™ืฉ ื’ื™ืฉื”
00:56
to that much information?
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ืœื›ืœ ื›ืš ื”ืจื‘ื” ืžื™ื“ืข?
00:59
Why would we let sensitive things
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ืœืžื” ื ืชื ื• ืœื“ื‘ืจื™ื ืจื’ื™ืฉื™ื
01:01
be with a relatively young person?
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ืœื”ื™ื•ืช ืขื ืื“ื ืฆืขื™ืจ ื™ื—ืกื™ืช?
01:05
In the summer of 2003, I was assigned to command
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ื‘ืงื™ื™ืฅ 2003, ื”ื•ืฆื‘ืชื™ ืœืคืงื“
01:08
a special operations task force,
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ืขืœ ื›ื•ื— ืžืฉื™ืžื” ืžื™ื•ื—ื“,
01:11
and that task force was spread across the Mideast
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ื•ื›ื•ื— ื”ืžืฉื™ืžื” ื”ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ืžืคื•ื–ืจ ื‘ืจื—ื‘ื™ ื”ืžื–ืจื— ื”ืชื™ื›ื•ืŸ
01:13
to fight al Qaeda.
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ื›ื“ื™ ืœื”ืœื—ื ื‘ืืœ ืงืขื™ื“ื”.
01:15
Our main effort was inside Iraq,
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ื”ืžืืžืฅ ื”ืขื™ืงืจื™ ื”ื™ื” ื‘ืชื•ืš ืขื™ืจืืง,
01:18
and our specified mission
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ื•ื”ืžืฉื™ืžื” ื”ืžื™ื•ืขื“ืช ืฉืœื ื•
01:20
was to defeat al Qaeda in Iraq.
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ื”ื™ืชื” ืœื”ื‘ื™ืก ืืช ืืœ ืงืขื™ื“ื” ื‘ืขื™ืจืืง.
01:21
For almost five years I stayed there,
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ื‘ืžืฉืš ื›ืžืขื˜ ื—ืžืฉ ืฉื ื™ื ื ืฉืืจืชื™ ืฉื,
01:25
and we focused on fighting a war
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ื•ื”ืชืžืงื“ื ื• ื‘ืœื—ื™ืžื” ื‘ืžืœื—ืžื”
01:26
that was unconventional and it was difficult
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ืฉื”ื™ืชื” ืœื ืงื•ื ื‘ื ืฆื™ื•ื ืœื™ืช ื•ื”ื™ื ื”ื™ืชื” ืงืฉื”
01:31
and it was bloody
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ื•ื”ื™ื ื”ื™ืชื” ืžื“ืžืžืช
01:33
and it often claimed its highest price
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ื•ื”ื™ื ื’ื‘ืชื” ื”ืจื‘ื” ืคืขืžื™ื ืืช ื”ืžื—ื™ืจ ื”ื›ื™ ื›ื‘ื“
01:36
among innocent people.
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ื‘ื™ืŸ ืื ืฉื™ื ื—ืคื™ื ืžืคืฉืข.
01:39
We did everything we could
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ืขืฉื™ื ื• ื›ืœ ืžื” ืฉื™ื›ื•ืœื ื•
01:42
to stop al Qaeda
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ืœืขืฆื•ืจ ืืช ืืœ ืงืขื™ื“ื”
01:44
and the foreign fighters that came in as suicide bombers
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ื•ื”ืœื•ื—ืžื™ื ื”ื–ืจื™ื ืฉื‘ืื• ื›ืžื—ื‘ืœื™ื ืžืชืื‘ื“ื™ื
01:47
and as accelerants to the violence.
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ื•ื›ืžืื™ืฆื™ื ืœืืœื™ืžื•ืช.
01:52
We honed our combat skills,
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ื”ืฉื—ื–ื ื• ืืช ื™ื›ื•ืœื•ืช ื”ืงืจื‘ ืฉืœื ื•,
01:54
we developed new equipment,
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ืคื™ืชื—ื ื• ืฆื™ื•ื“ ื—ื“ืฉ,
01:57
we parachuted, we helicoptered,
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ืฆื ื—ื ื•, ื˜ืกื ื• ื‘ื”ืœื™ืงื•ืคื˜ืจื™ื,
02:00
we took small boats, we drove, and we walked
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ืœืงื—ื ื• ืกื™ืจื•ืช ืงื˜ื ื•ืช, ื ืกืขื ื•, ื•ื”ืœื›ื ื•
02:02
to objectives night after night to stop
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ืœื™ืขื“ื™ื ืœื™ืœื” ืื—ืจื™ ืœื™ืœื” ื›ื“ื™ ืœืขืฆื•ืจ
02:05
the killing that this network was putting forward.
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ืืช ื”ื”ืจื’ ืฉื”ืจืฉืช ื”ื–ื• ื–ืจืขื”.
02:10
We bled,
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ื“ื™ืžืžื ื•.
02:13
we died,
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ืžืชื ื•,
02:14
and we killed to stop that organization
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ื•ื”ืจื’ื ื• ื›ื“ื™ ืœืขืฆื•ืจ ืืช ื”ืืจื’ื•ืŸ ื”ื”ื•ื
02:19
from the violence that they were putting
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ืžื”ืืœื™ืžื•ืช ืฉื”ื ื™ืฆืจื•
02:21
largely against the Iraqi people.
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ื‘ืขื™ืงืจ ื ื’ื“ ื”ืขื ื”ืขื™ืจืืงื™.
02:25
Now, we did what we knew,
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ืขื›ืฉื™ื•, ืขืฉื™ื ื• ืžื” ืฉื™ื“ืขื ื•,
02:28
how we had grown up, and one of the things that we knew,
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ืื™ืš ืฉื’ื“ืœื ื•, ื•ืื—ื“ ื”ื“ื‘ืจื™ื ืฉื™ื“ืขื ื•,
02:31
that was in our DNA, was secrecy.
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ืฉื”ื™ื” ื‘ DNA ืฉืœื ื•, ืฉื–ื” ืกื•ื“ื™ื•ืช.
02:34
It was security. It was protecting information.
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ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ื‘ื™ื˜ื—ื•ืŸ, ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ืœื”ื’ืŸ ืขืœ ื”ืžื™ื“ืข.
02:36
It was the idea that information was the lifeblood
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ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ื”ืจืขื™ื•ืŸ ืฉืžื™ื“ืข ื”ื™ื” ืกื ื”ื—ื™ื™ื
02:39
and it was what would protect and keep people safe.
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ื•ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ืžื” ืฉืžื’ืŸ ื•ืฉื•ืžืจ ืขืœ ืื ืฉื™ื ื‘ื˜ื•ื—ื™ื.
02:42
And we had a sense that,
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ื•ื”ื™ืชื” ืœื ื• ืชื—ื•ืฉื”,
02:44
as we operated within our organizations,
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ื›ืฉืคืขืœื ื• ื‘ืชื•ืš ื”ืืจื’ื•ืŸ ืฉืœื ื•,
02:46
it was important to keep information
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ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ื—ืฉื•ื‘ ืœืฉืžื•ืจ ืขืœ ื”ืžื™ื“ืข
02:48
in the silos within the organizations,
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ื‘ืชื•ืš ื”ืชืื™ื ื‘ืชื•ืš ื”ืืจื’ื•ื ื™ื,
02:50
particularly only give information
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ื‘ืขื™ืงืจ ืœืชืช ืžื™ื“ืข ืจืง
02:53
to people had a demonstrated need to know.
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ืœืื ืฉื™ื ืฉื”ืคื’ื™ื ื• ืืช ื”ืฆื•ืจืš ืœื“ืขืช.
02:57
But the question often came, who needed to know?
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ืื‘ืœ ืคืขืžื™ื ืจื‘ื•ืช ื‘ืื” ื”ืฉืืœื”, ืžื™ ืฆืจื™ืš ืœื“ืขืช?
03:02
Who needed, who had to have the information
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ืžื™ ื”ื™ื” ืฆืจื™ืš, ืœืžื™ ืฆืจื™ืš ื”ื™ื” ืœื”ื™ื•ืช ื”ืžื™ื“ืข
03:05
so that they could do the important parts of the job that you needed?
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ื›ืš ืฉื”ื ื™ื•ื›ืœื• ืœืขืฉื•ืช ื—ืœืงื™ื ื—ืฉื•ื‘ื™ื ื‘ืขื‘ื•ื“ื” ืฉื”ื™ื™ืชื ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื?
03:09
And in a tightly coupled world,
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ื•ื‘ืขื•ืœื ืขื ื—ื™ื‘ื•ืจื™ื ืฆืคื•ืคื™ื,
03:11
that's very hard to predict.
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ื–ื” ืžืื•ื“ ืงืฉื” ืœืฆืคื•ืช.
03:13
It's very hard to know who needs to have information
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ื–ื” ืžืื•ื“ ืงืฉื” ืœื“ืขืช ืžื™ ืฆืจื™ืš ื’ื™ืฉื” ืœืžื™ื“ืข
03:16
and who doesn't.
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ื•ืžื™ ืœื.
03:18
I used to deal with intelligence agencies,
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ืื ื™ ื”ืชืขืกืงืชื™ ืขื ืกื•ื›ื ื•ื™ื•ืช ืžื™ื“ืข,
03:20
and I'd complain that they weren't sharing enough intelligence,
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ื•ื”ื™ื™ืชื™ ืžืชืœื•ื ืŸ ืฉื”ืŸ ืœื ื—ื•ืœืงื•ืช ืžืกืคื™ืง ืžื•ื“ื™ืขื™ืŸ,
03:22
and with a straight face, they'd look at me and they'd say,
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ื•ืขื ืคืจืฆื•ืฃ ื™ืฉืจ, ื”ืŸ ื”ื™ื• ืžื‘ื™ื˜ื™ื ื‘ื™ ื•ืื•ืžืจื™ื,
03:24
"What aren't you getting?" (Laughter)
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"ืžื” ืืชื” ืœื ืžืงื‘ืœ?" (ืฆื—ื•ืง)
03:26
I said, "If I knew that, we wouldn't have a problem."
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ืืžืจืชื™, "ืื ื”ื™ื™ืชื™ ื™ื•ื“ืข, ืœื ื”ื™ืชื” ืœื ื• ื‘ืขื™ื”."
03:32
But what we found is we had to change.
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ืื‘ืœ ืžื” ืฉื’ื™ืœื™ื ื• ื–ื” ืฉื”ื™ื™ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœื”ืฉืชื ื•ืช.
03:34
We had to change our culture about information.
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ื”ื™ื™ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœืฉื ื•ืช ืืช ื”ืชืจื‘ื•ืช ืฉืœื ื• ื‘ื ื•ื’ืข ืœืžื™ื“ืข.
03:36
We had to knock down walls. We had to share.
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ื”ื™ื™ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœื”ืคื™ืœ ืงื™ืจื•ืช. ื”ื™ื™ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœื—ืœื•ืง.
03:38
We had to change from who needs to know
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ื”ื™ื™ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœืฉื ื•ืช ืžื”ืฆื•ืจืš ืœื“ืขืช
03:41
to the fact that who doesn't know,
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ืœืขื•ื‘ื“ื” ืฉืžื™ ืฉืœื ื™ื•ื“ืข,
03:43
and we need to tell, and tell them as quickly as we can.
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ืื ื—ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœืกืคืจ ืœื•, ื•ืื ื—ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœืกืคืจ ืœื• ื”ื›ื™ ืžื”ืจ ืฉืื ื—ื ื• ื™ื›ื•ืœื™ื.
03:46
It was a significant culture shift for an organization
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ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ืฉื™ื ื•ื™ ืชืจื‘ื•ืชื™ ืžืฉืžืขื•ืชื™ ืœืื™ืจื’ื•ืŸ
03:49
that had secrecy in its DNA.
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ืฉื”ื™ื” ืœื• ืกื•ื“ื™ื•ืช ื‘ DNA.
03:55
We started by doing things, by building,
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ื”ืชื—ืœื ื• ืœืขืฉื•ืช ื“ื‘ืจื™ื, ืœืคื™ ื‘ื ื™ื™ืŸ,
03:57
not working in offices,
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ืœื ืขื‘ื“ื ื• ื‘ืžืฉืจื“ื™ื,
03:59
knocking down walls, working in things we called
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ื”ื•ืจื“ื ื• ืงื™ืจื•ืช, ืขื‘ื“ื ื• ื‘ื“ื‘ืจื™ื ืฉื ืงืจืื™ื
04:00
situation awareness rooms,
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ื—ื“ืจื™ ืžืฆื‘ ืžื•ื“ืขื•ืช,
04:03
and in the summer of 2007,
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ื•ื‘ืงื™ืฅ 2007,
04:05
something happened which demonstrated this.
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ืžืฉื”ื• ืงืจื” ืฉื”ื“ื’ื™ื ืืช ื–ื”.
04:07
We captured the personnel records
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ืœื›ื“ื ื• ืืช ื”ืชื™ืงื™ื ื”ืื™ืฉื™ื™ื
04:09
for the people who were bringing foreign fighters
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ืฉืœ ื”ืื ืฉื™ื ืฉื”ื‘ื™ืื• ืœื•ื—ืžื™ื ื–ืจื™ื
04:11
into Iraq.
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ืœืชื•ืš ืขื™ืจืืง.
04:13
And when we got the personnel records, typically,
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ื•ื›ืฉืงื™ื‘ืœื ื• ืืช ื”ืชื™ืงื™ื ื”ืื™ืฉื™ื™ื, ื‘ื“ืจืš ื›ืœืœ,
04:15
we would have hidden these,
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ื”ื™ื™ื ื• ืžื—ื‘ื™ืื™ื ืื•ืชื,
04:17
shared them with a few intelligence agencies,
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ื—ื•ืœืงื™ื ืื•ืชื ืขื ืžืขื˜ ืกื•ื›ื ื•ื™ื•ืช ื‘ื™ื•ืŸ,
04:19
and then try to operate with them.
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ื•ืื– ืžื ืกื™ื ืœืคืขื•ืœ ืื™ืชื.
04:21
But as I was talking to my intelligence officer,
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ืื‘ืœ ื›ืฉื“ื‘ืจืชื™ ืขื ืงืฆื™ืŸ ื”ืžื•ื“ื™ืขื™ืŸ ืฉืœื™,
04:23
I said, "What do we do?"
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ืืžืจืชื™. "ืžื” ืื ื—ื ื• ืขื•ืฉื™ื?"
04:24
And he said, "Well, you found them." Our command.
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ื•ื”ื•ื ืืžืจ, "ื•ื‘ื›ืŸ, ืžืฆืืช ืื•ืชื." ื”ืคื™ืงื•ื“ ืฉืœื ื•.
04:27
"You can just declassify them."
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"ืืชื” ืคืฉื•ื˜ ื™ื›ื•ืœ ืœื”ื•ืจื™ื“ ืžื”ื ืืช ื”ืกื™ื•ื•ื’."
04:29
And I said, "Well, can we declassify them?
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ื•ืืžืจืชื™, "ื•ื‘ื›ืŸ, ืื ื™ ื™ื›ื•ืœ ืœื”ื•ืจื™ื“ ืžื”ื ืืช ื”ืกื™ื•ื•ื’?
04:31
What if the enemy finds out?"
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ืžื” ืื ื”ืื•ื™ื™ื‘ ื™ื’ืœื”?"
04:32
And he says, "They're their personnel records."
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ื•ื”ื•ื ืืžืจ, "ื–ื” ื”ืชื™ืงื™ื ื”ืื™ืฉื™ื™ื ืฉืœื”ื."
04:34
(Laughter)
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(ืฆื—ื•ืง)
04:36
So we did,
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ืื– ืขืฉื™ื ื• ืืช ื–ื”,
04:37
and a lot of people got upset about that,
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ื•ื”ืจื‘ื” ืื ืฉื™ื ื”ืชืจื’ื–ื• ืขืœ ื–ื”,
04:39
but as we passed that information around,
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ืื‘ืœ ื›ืฉื”ืขื‘ืจื ื• ืืช ื”ืžื™ื“ืข ื”ื–ื”,
04:41
suddenly you find that information is only of value
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ืคืชืื•ื ืืชื ืžื’ืœื™ื ืฉืœืžื™ื“ืข ื™ืฉ ืขืจืš ืจืง
04:44
if you give it to people who have the ability
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ืื ืืชื ื ื•ืชื ื™ื ืื•ืชื• ืœืื ืฉื™ื ืฉื™ืฉ ืœื”ื ืืช ื”ื™ื›ื•ืœืช
04:46
to do something with it.
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ืœืขืฉื•ืช ืื™ืชื• ืžืฉื”ื•.
04:48
The fact that I know something has zero value
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ืœืขื•ื‘ื“ื” ืฉืื ื™ ื™ื•ื“ืข ืžืฉื”ื• ืื™ืŸ ืขืจืš
04:50
if I'm not the person who can actually
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ืื ืื ื™ ืœื ื”ืื“ื ืฉื™ื›ื•ืœ ืœืžืขืฉื”
04:52
make something better because of it.
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ืœืขืฉื•ืช ืžืฉื”ื• ื˜ื•ื‘ ื™ื•ืชืจ ื‘ื’ืœืœื•.
04:54
So as a consequence, what we did was
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ืื– ื›ืชื•ืฆืื”, ืžื” ืฉืขืฉื™ื ื• ื”ื™ื”
04:56
we changed the idea of information,
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ืœืฉื ื•ืช ืืช ื”ืจืขื™ื•ืŸ ืฉืœ ืžื™ื“ืข,
04:59
instead of knowledge is power,
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ื‘ืžืงื•ื ื–ื” ืฉื™ื“ืข ื”ื•ื ื›ื•ื—,
05:01
to one where sharing is power.
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ืœื–ื” ืฉืฉื™ืชื•ืฃ ื”ื•ื ื›ื•ื—.
05:04
It was the fundamental shift,
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ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ืฉื™ื ื•ื™ ืžืฉืžืขื•ืชื™,
05:06
not new tactics, not new weapons,
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ืœื ื˜ืงื˜ื™ืงื” ื—ื“ืฉื”, ืœื ื ืฉืง ื—ื“ืฉ,
05:08
not new anything else.
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ืœื ืฉื•ื ื“ื‘ืจ ืื—ืจ ื—ื“ืฉ.
05:10
It was the idea that we were now part of a team
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ื–ื” ื”ื™ื” ื”ืจืขื™ื•ืŸ ืฉืขื›ืฉื™ื• ืื ื—ื ื• ื—ืœืง ืžืฆื•ื•ืช
05:12
in which information became the essential link
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ื‘ื• ืžื™ื“ืข ื”ื•ืคืš ืœืงื™ืฉื•ืจ ื”ื—ื™ื•ื ื™
05:15
between us, not a block between us.
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ื‘ื™ื ื™ื ื•, ืœื ืžื—ืกื•ื ื‘ื™ื ื™ื ื•.
05:19
And I want everybody to take a deep breath
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ื•ืื ื™ ืจื•ืฆื” ืฉื›ื•ืœื ื™ืงื—ื• ื ืฉื™ืžื” ืขืžื•ืงื”
05:22
and let it out,
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ื•ื™ืฉื—ืจืจื• ืื•ืชื”,
05:24
because in your life, there's going to be information
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ืžืคื ื™ ืฉื‘ื—ื™ื™ื, ื™ื”ื™ื” ืžื™ื“ืข
05:26
that leaks out you're not going to like.
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ืฉื“ื•ืœืฃ ืฉืœื ืชืื”ื‘ื•.
05:28
Somebody's going to get my college grades out,
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ืžื™ืฉื”ื• ื™ื“ืœื™ืฃ ืืช ืฆื™ื•ื ื™ ื”ืžื›ืœืœื” ืฉืœื™,
05:30
a that's going to be a disaster. (Laughter)
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ื•ื–ื” ื™ื”ื™ื” ืืกื•ืŸ. (ืฆื—ื•ืง)
05:34
But it's going to be okay, and I will tell you that
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ืื‘ืœ ื–ื” ื™ื”ื™ื” ื‘ืกื“ืจ, ื•ืื ื™ ืืกืคืจ ืœื›ื
05:38
I am more scared of the bureaucrat
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ืฉืื ื™ ื™ื•ืชืจ ืžืคื—ื“ ืžื”ื‘ื™ืจื•ืงืจื˜
05:41
that holds information in a desk drawer
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ืฉืžื—ื–ื™ืง ืžื™ื“ืข ื‘ืžื’ืจื”
05:43
or in a safe than I am of someone who leaks,
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ืื• ื‘ื›ืกืคืช ืžืฉืื ื™ ืžืคื—ื“ ืžืžื™ืฉื”ื• ืฉืžื“ืœื™ืฃ,
05:46
because ultimately, we'll be better off if we share.
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ืžืคื ื™ ืฉื‘ืกื•ืคื• ืฉืœ ื“ื‘ืจ, ื™ื”ื™ื” ื˜ื•ื‘ ื™ื•ืชืจ ืื ื ื—ืœื•ืง.
05:49
Thank you.
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ืชื•ื“ื” ืœื›ื.
05:51
(Applause)
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(ืžื—ื™ืื•ืช ื›ืคื™ื™ื)
05:57
Helen Walters: So I don't know if you were here this morning,
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ื”ืœืŸ ื•ื•ืœื˜ืจืก: ืื– ืื ื™ ืœื ื™ื•ื“ืขืช ืื ื”ื™ื™ืช ืคื” ื”ื‘ื•ืงืจ.
05:59
if you were able to catch Rick Ledgett,
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ืื ืจืื™ืช ืืช ืจื™ืง ืœื“ื’'ื˜,
06:01
the deputy director of the NSA
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ืกื’ืŸ ื”ืžื ื”ืœ ืฉืœ ื” NSA
06:03
who was responding to Edward Snowden's talk earlier this week.
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ืฉืขื ื” ืœืฉื™ื—ื” ืขื ืื“ื•ืืจื“ ืกื ื•ื“ืŸ ืžื•ืงื“ื ื™ื•ืชืจ ื”ืฉื‘ื•ืข.
06:07
I just wonder, do you think the American government
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ืื ื™ ืจืง ืชื•ื”ื”, ืืชื” ื—ื•ืฉื‘ ืฉื‘ืžืžืฉืœ ื”ืืžืจื™ืงืื™
06:09
should give Edward Snowden amnesty?
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ืฆืจื™ืš ืœืชืช ืœืื“ื•ืืจื“ ืกื ื•ื“ืŸ ื—ื ื™ื ื”?
06:12
Stanley McChrystal: I think that Rick said something very important.
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ืกื˜ื ืœื™ ืžืงืจื™ืกื˜ืœ: ืื ื™ ื—ื•ืฉื‘ ืฉืจื™ืง ืืžืจ ืžืฉื”ื• ืžืื•ื“ ื—ืฉื•ื‘.
06:14
We, most people, don't know all the facts.
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ืื ื—ื ื•, ืจื•ื‘ ื”ืื ืฉื™ื, ืœื ืžื›ื™ืจื™ื ืืช ื›ืœ ื”ืขื•ื‘ื“ื•ืช.
06:17
I think there are two parts of this.
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ืื ื™ ื—ื•ืฉื‘ ืฉื™ืฉ ืฉื ื™ ื—ืœืงื™ื ืœื–ื”.
06:18
Edward Snowden shined a light on an important need
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ืื“ื•ืืจื“ ืกื ื•ื“ืŸ ื”ืื™ืจ ื–ืจืงื•ืจ ืขืœ ืฆื•ืจืš ื—ืฉื•ื‘
06:22
that people had to understand.
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ืฉืื ืฉื™ื ื”ื™ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœื”ื‘ื™ืŸ.
06:23
He also took a lot of documents that he didn't have
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ื”ื•ื ื’ื ืœืงื— ื”ืจื‘ื” ืžืกืžื›ื™ื ืฉืœื ื”ื™ื” ืœื•
06:26
the knowledge to know the importance of,
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ืืช ื”ื™ื“ืข ืขืœ ื”ื—ืฉื™ื‘ื•ืช ืฉืœื”ื,
06:29
so I think we need to learn the facts about this case
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ืื– ืื ื™ ื—ื•ืฉื‘ ืฉืื ื—ื ื• ืฆืจื™ื›ื™ื ืœืœืžื•ื“ ืืช ื”ืขื•ื‘ื“ื•ืช ืขืœ ื”ืžืงืจื” ื”ื–ื”
06:31
before we make snap judgments
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ืœืคื ื™ ืฉื ื‘ื™ืข ื“ืขื”
06:33
about Edward Snowden.
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ืขืœ ืื“ื•ืืจื“ ืกื ื•ื“ืŸ.
06:35
HW: Thank you so much. Thank you.
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ื”.ื•.: ืชื•ื“ื” ืจื‘ื” ืœืš. ืชื•ื“ื” ืœืš.
06:37
(Applause)
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(ืžื—ื™ืื•ืช ื›ืคื™ื™ื)
ืขืœ ืืชืจ ื–ื”

ืืชืจ ื–ื” ื™ืฆื™ื’ ื‘ืคื ื™ื›ื ืกืจื˜ื•ื ื™ YouTube ื”ืžื•ืขื™ืœื™ื ืœืœื™ืžื•ื“ ืื ื’ืœื™ืช. ืชื•ื›ืœื• ืœืจืื•ืช ืฉื™ืขื•ืจื™ ืื ื’ืœื™ืช ื”ืžื•ืขื‘ืจื™ื ืขืœ ื™ื“ื™ ืžื•ืจื™ื ืžื”ืฉื•ืจื” ื”ืจืืฉื•ื ื” ืžืจื—ื‘ื™ ื”ืขื•ืœื. ืœื—ืฅ ืคืขืžื™ื™ื ืขืœ ื”ื›ืชื•ื‘ื™ื•ืช ื‘ืื ื’ืœื™ืช ื”ืžื•ืฆื’ื•ืช ื‘ื›ืœ ื“ืฃ ื•ื™ื“ืื• ื›ื“ื™ ืœื”ืคืขื™ืœ ืืช ื”ืกืจื˜ื•ืŸ ืžืฉื. ื”ื›ืชื•ื‘ื™ื•ืช ื’ื•ืœืœื•ืช ื‘ืกื ื›ืจื•ืŸ ืขื ื”ืคืขืœืช ื”ื•ื•ื™ื“ืื•. ืื ื™ืฉ ืœืš ื”ืขืจื•ืช ืื• ื‘ืงืฉื•ืช, ืื ื ืฆื•ืจ ืื™ืชื ื• ืงืฉืจ ื‘ืืžืฆืขื•ืช ื˜ื•ืคืก ื™ืฆื™ืจืช ืงืฉืจ ื–ื”.

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