How the NSA betrayed the world's trust -- time to act | Mikko Hypponen
407,075 views ・ 2013-11-07
请双击下面的英文字幕来播放视频。
翻译人员: Calvin Hsu
校对人员: Wu Di
00:12
The two most likely largest inventions
0
12492
4634
互联网和手机可以说是
00:17
of our generation
1
17126
2247
我们这个时代
00:19
are the Internet and the mobile phone.
2
19373
3193
最为重要的两大发明了
00:22
They've changed the world.
3
22566
2135
它们改变了整个世界
00:24
However, largely to our surprise,
4
24701
3515
然而,令我们非常吃惊的是
00:28
they also turned out to be the perfect tools
5
28216
4398
它们同时也成为了
00:32
for the surveillance state.
6
32614
3150
用于国家监视的完美工具
00:35
It turned out that the capability
7
35764
2897
事实上,收集关于我们
00:38
to collect data, information and connections
8
38661
4044
每个人或者说所有人的
00:42
about basically any of us and all of us
9
42705
4218
数据、信息以及关系的这种能力
00:46
is exactly what we've been hearing
10
46923
1813
正是这个夏天从
00:48
throughout of the summer
through revelations and leaks
11
48736
4607
西方情报机构
00:53
about Western intelligence agencies,
12
53343
3091
特别是美国情报机构
00:56
mostly U.S. intelligence agencies,
13
56434
3026
所透露或者泄露的
00:59
watching over the rest of the world.
14
59460
3173
这些情报机构监视着世界其它地方
01:02
We've heard about these starting with the
15
62633
3198
六月六日开始
01:05
revelations from June 6.
16
65831
3686
陆续听到一些泄露的消息
01:09
Edward Snowden started leaking information,
17
69517
3069
斯诺登开始透露
01:12
top secret classified information,
18
72586
2304
那些来源于美国情报机构的
01:14
from the U.S. intelligence agencies,
19
74890
1467
顶级机密信息
01:16
and we started learning about things like PRISM
20
76357
2469
于是我们也开始了解到一些
01:18
and XKeyscore and others.
21
78826
3267
诸如菱镜计划和XKeyscore的事情
01:22
And these are examples of the kinds of programs
22
82093
3105
这些都是美国情报机构
01:25
U.S. intelligence agencies are running right now,
23
85198
4279
正在运作的项目
01:29
against the whole rest of the world.
24
89477
3516
以此对抗世界其它国家
01:32
And if you look back about the forecasts
25
92993
3708
如果你回顾一下乔治·奥威尔
01:36
on surveillance by George Orwell,
26
96701
4101
有关监视的预言
01:40
well it turns out that
27
100817
2118
你会发现
01:42
George Orwell was an optimist.
28
102935
2504
奥威尔的确是一个乐观主义者
01:45
(Laughter)
29
105439
2480
(笑声)
01:47
We are right now seeing a much larger scale
30
107919
2700
如今我们看到的是大规模的
01:50
of tracking of individual citizens
31
110619
1898
对普通民众的跟踪
01:52
than he could have ever imagined.
32
112517
3632
这远远超出了他最初的想象
01:56
And this here is the infamous
33
116149
3535
这就是那个臭名昭著的
01:59
NSA data center in Utah.
34
119684
3844
美国犹他州的NSA数据中心
02:03
Due to be opened very soon,
35
123528
3156
在不久的将来开放后
02:06
it will be both a supercomputing center
36
126684
2791
它将成为一个超级计算中心
02:09
and a data storage center.
37
129475
2137
同时也将成为一个超大数据中心
02:11
You could basically imagine it has a large hall
38
131612
2893
你几乎可以想象那个被硬盘设备塞满的大厅
02:14
filled with hard drives storing data
39
134505
2456
无时不刻都在存储
02:16
they are collecting.
40
136961
2274
他们收集来的数据
02:19
And it's a pretty big building.
41
139235
2157
这是一幢巨大的建筑
02:21
How big? Well, I can give you the numbers --
42
141392
1851
具体有多大呢?我们来看一个数据
02:23
140,000 square meters --
43
143243
2022
14万平方米
02:25
but that doesn't really tell you very much.
44
145265
2606
可能你对这个数据也没有太多概念
02:27
Maybe it's better to imagine it as a comparison.
45
147871
3176
我们最好通过比较来想象
02:31
You think about the largest IKEA store
46
151047
2456
想想你去过的
02:33
you've ever been in.
47
153503
1747
最大的宜家家具吧
02:35
This is five times larger.
48
155250
3469
它将是宜家的五倍大
02:38
How many hard drives can you fit in an IKEA store?
49
158719
3076
想想你能在宜家塞进多少硬盘设备吧
02:41
Right? It's pretty big.
50
161795
2007
是吧?数目的确非常巨大!
02:43
We estimate that just the electricity bill
51
163802
2846
我们估算仅用于运行
02:46
for running this data center
52
166648
1876
这个数据中心的电费
02:48
is going to be in the tens of millions of dollars a year.
53
168524
3398
每年就需要数千万美元
02:51
And this kind of wholesale surveillance
54
171922
2509
而这种大规模的监视
02:54
means that they can collect our data
55
174431
2736
意味着他们可以收集我们的数据
02:57
and keep it basically forever,
56
177167
2003
并且基本上可以永久保留
02:59
keep it for extended periods of time,
57
179170
2509
保留很长时间
03:01
keep it for years, keep it for decades.
58
181679
3246
几年甚至几十年
03:04
And this opens up completely new kinds of risks
59
184925
3379
这个将给我们所有人
03:08
to us all.
60
188304
1946
带来前所未有的风险
03:10
And what this is is that it is wholesale
61
190250
3628
它将是一种大规模的对我们每个人的
03:13
blanket surveillance on everyone.
62
193878
4857
无障碍监视
03:18
Well, not exactly everyone,
63
198735
1554
当然,确切来说也不是对所有人
03:20
because the U.S. intelligence only has a legal right
64
200289
4028
因为美国情报机构只有对外国人的
03:24
to monitor foreigners.
65
204317
1970
合法监视权力
03:26
They can monitor foreigners
66
206287
1750
一旦那些非美国的数据流
03:28
when foreigners' data connections
67
208037
2810
到达或者经过美国
03:30
end up in the United States or pass
through the United States.
68
210847
3490
就要被监视了
03:34
And monitoring foreigners doesn't sound too bad
69
214337
2784
监视外国人听起来似乎没那么糟糕
03:37
until you realize
70
217121
2367
除非你意识到
03:39
that I'm a foreigner and you're a foreigner.
71
219488
3001
其实我们都是老外
03:42
In fact, 96 percent of the planet are foreigners.
72
222489
3786
事实上,这个星球上96%都是老外
03:46
(Laughter)
73
226275
1670
(笑)
03:47
Right?
74
227945
1887
是吧?
03:49
So it is wholesale blanket surveillance of all of us,
75
229832
4449
所以说只要你使用通信工具和互联网
03:54
all of us who use telecommunications and the Internet.
76
234281
4102
你就会被彻底监视
03:58
But don't get me wrong:
77
238383
1891
大家也别误会
04:00
There are actually types
of surveillance that are okay.
78
240274
5226
的确也有一些还不错的监视形式
04:05
I love freedom, but even I agree
79
245500
3029
我热爱自由,但我自始至终也同意
04:08
that some surveillance is fine.
80
248529
2279
有一些监视是有益的
04:10
If the law enforcement is trying to find a murderer,
81
250808
3903
比如如果执法机关正在寻找一名谋杀犯
04:14
or they're trying to catch a drug lord
82
254711
3102
或者搜捕一个贩毒者
04:17
or trying to prevent a school shooting,
83
257813
3604
或者试图阻止一场校园枪击案的发生
04:21
and they have leads and they have suspects,
84
261417
1677
并且他们中有头目有嫌疑犯
04:23
then it's perfectly fine for them
to tap the suspect's phone,
85
263094
3717
此时如果能监听他们的手机
04:26
and to intercept his Internet communications.
86
266811
3356
截获他们的网络通信那就太棒了
04:30
I'm not arguing that at all,
87
270167
1938
我并不反对这一点
04:32
but that's not what programs like PRISM are about.
88
272105
2824
但菱镜计划之类的项目并不是这么做的
04:34
They are not about doing surveillance on people
89
274929
2885
他们不是在监视那些
04:37
that they have reason
to suspect of some wrongdoings.
90
277814
3204
他们有理由怀疑的坏人
04:41
They're about doing surveillance on people
91
281018
1677
他们在监视那些
04:42
they know are innocent.
92
282695
3760
无辜的人
04:46
So the four main arguments
93
286455
2245
对于这样的监听
04:48
supporting surveillance like this,
94
288700
2152
有四条主要的理由
04:50
well, the first of all is that whenever you start
95
290852
2235
首先是只要你
04:53
discussing about these revelations,
96
293087
1895
一开始讨论信息泄露的问题
04:54
there will be naysayers trying to minimize
97
294982
2293
总会有反对者站出来
04:57
the importance of these revelations, saying that
98
297275
2188
把泄露的重要性降到最小
04:59
we knew all this already,
99
299463
1613
他们说我们早已知道这些
05:01
we knew it was happening, there's nothing new here.
100
301076
3580
我们知道在发生什么,没有什么新鲜的
05:04
And that's not true. Don't let anybody tell you
101
304656
3215
事实不是这样的
05:07
that we knew this already,
because we did not know this already.
102
307871
5712
谁说我们早知道这些?我们不知道
05:13
Our worst fears might have been something like this,
103
313583
3773
我们最大的恐惧就是这些事情已经发生
05:17
but we didn't know this was happening.
104
317356
1951
而我们一无所知
05:19
Now we know for a fact it's happening.
105
319307
2777
现在我们的确可以确定的知道在发生什么
05:22
We didn't know about this.
We didn't know about PRISM.
106
322084
2579
而我们之前并不了解
我们不了解PRISM
05:24
We didn't know about XKeyscore.
We didn't know about Cybertrans.
107
324663
2906
也不了解XKeyscore,Cybertrans
05:27
We didn't know about DoubleArrow.
108
327569
1950
还有DoubleArrow
05:29
We did not know about Skywriter --
109
329519
2148
以及Skywriter
05:31
all these different programs
110
331667
1695
这些各式各样
05:33
run by U.S. intelligence agencies.
111
333362
3241
由美国情报局运行的项目
05:36
But now we do.
112
336603
3029
但现在我们都了解了
05:39
And we did not know
113
339632
2166
我们之前也并不知道
05:41
that U.S. intelligence agencies go to extremes
114
341798
3075
美国情报机构如何极端到
05:44
such as infiltrating standardization bodies
115
344873
3837
通过渗透至标准组织内部
05:48
to sabotage encryption algorithms on purpose.
116
348710
4748
以达到削弱加密算法强度的目的
05:53
And what that means
117
353458
2037
这就意味着
05:55
is that you take something which is secure,
118
355495
1820
如果你拿到一份加密文件
05:57
an encryption algorithm which is so secure
119
357315
2421
它的加密算法可以安全到
05:59
that if you use that algorithm to encrypt one file,
120
359736
3107
使你加密之后
06:02
nobody can decrypt that file.
121
362843
1742
没有任何人可以解开它
06:04
Even if they take every single computer on the planet just to decrypt that one file,
122
364585
4413
即便你用地球上的每一个计算机去解密它
06:08
it's going to take millions of years.
123
368998
2060
也需要数百万年
06:11
So that's basically perfectly safe, uncrackable.
124
371058
2247
它可以说是绝密的,无懈可击
06:13
You take something which is that good
125
373305
2074
拿到这样一件完美的东西
06:15
and then you weaken it on purpose,
126
375379
2484
然后故意弱化它
06:17
making all of us less secure as an end result.
127
377863
5610
使得我们每个人终都变得不安全
06:23
A real-world equivalent would be that
128
383473
2131
现实生活中一个类似的例子是
06:25
intelligence agencies would force
129
385604
2652
情报机构会强行
06:28
some secret pin code into every single house alarm
130
388256
2827
将某种加密识别码植入每个家居防盗系统
06:31
so they could get into every single house
131
391083
1793
这样他们就可以进入任何一所房子
06:32
because, you know, bad people
might have house alarms,
132
392876
2246
因为坏人可能装有防盗系统
06:35
but it will also make all of us
133
395122
2439
但这样一来
06:37
less secure as an end result.
134
397561
2229
最后我们自己也变得不那么安全
06:39
Backdooring encryption algorithms
135
399790
3740
利用加密算法这个后门儿
06:43
just boggles the mind.
136
403530
3096
的确让人匪夷所思
06:46
But of course, these intelligence agencies
are doing their job.
137
406626
3775
当然啦,这些情报机构只是在履行自己的职责
06:50
This is what they have been told to do:
138
410401
1757
这正是他们被要求做的事情
06:52
do signals intelligence,
139
412158
2230
做信号情报
06:54
monitor telecommunications,
140
414388
2012
监视通讯渠道
06:56
monitor Internet traffic.
141
416400
1422
以及监测网络流量
06:57
That's what they're trying to do,
142
417822
1708
这正是他们尝试在做的
06:59
and since most, a very big part
of the Internet traffic today is encrypted,
143
419530
3082
由于目前相当大一部分的互联网流量是加密的
07:02
they're trying to find ways around the encryption.
144
422612
1957
他们也就在尝试通过加密寻找突破口
07:04
One way is to sabotage encryption algorithms,
145
424569
3057
削弱加密算法就是其中一种手段
07:07
which is a great example
146
427626
1885
这是美国情报机构如何
07:09
about how U.S. intelligence agencies
147
429511
2221
为所欲为
07:11
are running loose.
148
431732
1749
的一个极好的例子
07:13
They are completely out of control,
149
433481
1841
他们完全不受控制
07:15
and they should be brought back under control.
150
435322
4442
而这些应该加以控制
07:21
So what do we actually know about the leaks?
151
441629
2950
而我们对这些信息泄露的真实了解能有多少呢
07:24
Everything is based on the files
152
444579
2110
所有这些都基于
07:26
leaked by Mr. Snowden.
153
446689
2498
Snowden先生的那些泄露文件
07:29
The very first PRISM slides
154
449187
2848
从六月初
07:32
from the beginning of June
155
452035
1989
第一个PRISM的幻灯片开始
07:34
detail a collection program where the data
156
454024
2094
它详细描述了
07:36
is collected from service providers,
157
456118
1786
一个从服务提供商收集数据的项目
07:37
and they actually go and name the service providers
158
457904
2878
而且他们还对那些被使用的
07:40
they have access to.
159
460782
1331
服务商进行了命名
07:42
They even have a specific date
160
462113
2942
甚至为他们设立一个纪念日
07:45
on when the collection of data began
161
465055
2664
记载开始从各个服务提供商
07:47
for each of the service providers.
162
467719
1639
获取数据的日子
07:49
So for example, they name
the collection from Microsoft
163
469358
2287
比如,他们为2007年9月11号
07:51
started on September 11, 2007,
164
471645
3720
开始从Microsoft获取的那批数据起了名字
07:55
for Yahoo on the March 12, 2008,
165
475365
2732
还有2008年3月12号的Yahoo
07:58
and then others: Google, Facebook,
166
478097
3016
之后还有Google, Facebook
08:01
Skype, Apple and so on.
167
481113
3244
Skype, Apple等等
08:04
And every single one of these companies denies.
168
484357
2848
任何一个公司对此都呈否认态度
08:07
They all say that this simply isn't true,
169
487205
4395
都说这简直就是谎言
08:11
that they are not giving
backdoor access to their data.
170
491600
4608
他们从来没有开过后门让别人获取他们的数据
08:16
Yet we have these files.
171
496208
4123
但是我们的确得到了这些文件
08:20
So is one of the parties lying,
172
500331
2321
那么是其中一方在撒谎吗?
08:22
or is there some other alternative explanation?
173
502652
3323
有没有其他可能的解释?
08:25
And one explanation would be
174
505975
2922
一种可能的解释是
08:28
that these parties, these service providers,
175
508897
2887
这些当事人,也就是这些服务提供商
08:31
are not cooperating.
176
511784
1916
他们并没有合作
08:33
Instead, they've been hacked.
177
513700
3021
只是被黑了
08:36
That would explain it. They aren't cooperating. They've been hacked.
178
516721
3217
这种解释是合理的:他们没有参与而是受到了黑客攻击
08:39
In this case, they've been hacked
by their own government.
179
519938
4178
其实可以说是他们被自己的政府黑了
08:44
That might sound outlandish,
180
524116
2421
也许这听起来有点荒唐
08:46
but we already have cases where this has happened,
181
526537
2214
但我们的确有过这样的案例
08:48
for example, the case of the Flame malware
182
528751
3046
比如那个有关恶意软件Flame的案子
08:51
which we strongly believe was authored
183
531797
2033
我们之前多么坚信它是由
08:53
by the U.S. government,
184
533830
1897
美国政府授权的
08:55
and which, to spread, subverted the security
185
535727
3899
而就是它破坏了Windows的
08:59
of the Windows Update network,
186
539626
2886
网络升级系统的安全
09:02
meaning here, the company was hacked
187
542512
4093
这就意味着
09:06
by their own government.
188
546605
2358
他们被自己的政府黑了
09:08
And there's more evidence
189
548963
1599
当然还有更多
09:10
supporting this theory as well.
190
550562
2551
支撑这个说法的证据
09:13
Der Spiegel, from Germany, leaked more information
191
553113
4005
德国的明镜周刊(Der Spiegel)暴露了更多
09:17
about the operations run by the elite hacker units
192
557118
4265
有关这些情报机构中的顶级黑客团队
09:21
operating inside these intelligence agencies.
193
561383
3035
所做作为的信息
09:24
Inside NSA, the unit is called TAO,
194
564418
2626
在NSA内部, 这个部门被叫做TAO
09:27
Tailored Access Operations,
195
567044
1845
特定情报获取行动
09:28
and inside GCHQ, which is the U.K. equivalent,
196
568889
3564
这个等同于英国GCHQ内部的NAC
09:32
it's called NAC, Network Analysis Centre.
197
572453
3999
网络分析中心(Network Analysis Centre)
09:36
And these recent leaks of these three slides
198
576452
3844
最近泄露的这三个幻灯片
09:40
detail an operation
199
580296
2204
详细描述了一个由GCHQ情报局
09:42
run by this GCHQ intelligence agency
200
582500
3158
在英国发起的行动
09:45
from the United Kingdom
201
585658
1809
目标定位在
09:47
targeting a telecom here in Belgium.
202
587467
4233
一个比利时的电信公司
09:51
And what this really means
203
591700
2276
这件事表明了一个事实
09:53
is that an E.U. country's intelligence agency
204
593976
3888
一个欧盟国家的情报机构
09:57
is breaching the security
205
597864
2215
正在蓄意破坏
10:00
of a telecom of a fellow E.U. country on purpose,
206
600079
4813
联盟国家电信公司的安全
10:04
and they discuss it in their slides completely casually,
207
604892
3835
而他们在幻灯片里谈论这件事时
10:08
business as usual.
208
608727
1601
一如既往的自然
10:10
Here's the primary target,
209
610328
1668
这是主要目标
10:11
here's the secondary target,
210
611996
1378
这是次要目标
10:13
here's the teaming.
211
613374
1424
这是他们的团队
10:14
They probably have a team building
on Thursday evening in a pub.
212
614798
3856
他们通常会在周四晚上在酒吧里做团队建设的活动
10:18
They even use cheesy PowerPoint clip art
213
618654
3041
他们每成功一次
10:21
like, you know, "Success,"
214
621695
1707
就会用一些俗气的幻灯片
10:23
when they gain access to services like this.
215
623402
3264
庆祝所谓的胜利
10:26
What the hell?
216
626666
2826
他们究竟在搞什么鬼
10:31
And then there's the argument
217
631685
1833
有人会争辩说
10:33
that okay, yes, this might be going on,
218
633518
1660
是的,他们是在监视
10:35
but then again, other countries are doing it as well.
219
635178
2637
但话说回来,哪个国家没有这样的行动呢?
10:37
All countries spy.
220
637815
2423
也许真的是
10:40
And maybe that's true.
221
640238
1738
所有国家都有间谍
10:41
Many countries spy, not all of them,
but let's take an example.
222
641976
2438
很多国家都有,但并不是所有都是这样
10:44
Let's take, for example, Sweden.
223
644414
2111
比如说,瑞典
10:46
I'm speaking of Sweden because Sweden
224
646525
1376
我提起瑞典这个国家是因为
10:47
has a little bit of a similar law to the United States.
225
647901
2279
在法律方面它与美国是有些相似的
10:50
When your data traffic goes through Sweden,
226
650180
2123
当你的数据流经过瑞典的时候
10:52
their intelligence agency has a legal right by the law
227
652303
2810
他们的情报机构的确是有
10:55
to intercept that traffic.
228
655113
2001
截获这些数据的合法权力
10:57
All right, how many Swedish decisionmakers
229
657114
3205
那么,有多少瑞典的决策者
11:00
and politicians and business leaders
230
660319
2872
政治家和商业领袖
11:03
use, every day, U.S.-based services,
231
663191
3073
每天使用美国的服务呢?
11:06
like, you know, run Windows or OSX,
232
666264
3268
比如像使用Windows或OSX
11:09
or use Facebook or LinkedIn,
233
669532
2210
使用Facebook或LinkedIn
11:11
or store their data in clouds like iCloud
234
671742
3400
或者将数据上传到类似iCloud中进行云存储
11:15
or Skydrive or DropBox,
235
675142
3894
还有Skydrive或者DropBox
11:19
or maybe use online services like
Amazon web services or sales support?
236
679036
4303
也许还有一些在线服务,类似Amazon网络服务或者销售支持?
11:23
And the answer is, every single Swedish
business leader does that every single day.
237
683339
3957
答案是,每一个瑞典的商业人士每天都会使用它们
11:27
And then we turn it around.
238
687296
1599
那么如果我们反过来问
11:28
How many American leaders
239
688895
1905
有多少美国杰出人士
11:30
use Swedish webmails and cloud services?
240
690800
4293
使用瑞典的网络邮箱和云服务呢?
11:35
And the answer is zero.
241
695093
2040
答案是零
11:37
So this is not balanced.
242
697133
2269
所以这显然是不平衡的
11:39
It's not balanced by any means, not even close.
243
699402
4625
相差甚远
11:44
And when we do have the occasional
244
704027
2441
即使有一天我们偶然发现一个
11:46
European success story,
245
706468
2001
欧洲人获胜的故事
11:48
even those, then, typically end up being sold
to the United States.
246
708469
3566
典型的结局一定是这个服务被美国公司收购
11:52
Like, Skype used to be secure.
247
712035
2264
比如,Skype最初采用端到端的加密
11:54
It used to be end-to-end encrypted.
248
714299
2733
所以还是安全的
11:57
Then it was sold to the United States.
249
717032
2041
后来被卖给了美国后
11:59
Today, it no longer is secure.
250
719073
2649
就不再安全了
12:01
So once again, we take something which is secure
251
721722
3221
所以,我们再一次把一个原本安全的东西
12:04
and then we make it less secure on purpose,
252
724943
1870
弄得不再安全
12:06
making all of us less secure as an outcome.
253
726813
4484
使得我们所有人最终也都不再安全了
12:12
And then the argument that the United States
254
732855
2247
也有争论说
12:15
is only fighting terrorists.
255
735102
2018
美国只是在
12:17
It's the war on terror.
256
737120
1166
展开一场针对恐怖分子的战争
12:18
You shouldn't worry about it.
257
738286
2547
本来无需担忧
12:20
Well, it's not the war on terror.
258
740833
2230
但事实上它不是
12:23
Yes, part of it is war on terror, and yes,
259
743063
2173
是的,我们承认这中间有恐怖分子
12:25
there are terrorists, and they do kill and maim,
260
745236
2976
我们必须与这些
12:28
and we should fight them,
261
748212
1551
肆意残害的行为作战
12:29
but we know through these leaks
262
749763
1606
但从那些泄露的消息中我们也知道
12:31
that they have used the same techniques
263
751369
2582
他们在使用相同的手段
12:33
to listen to phone calls of European leaders,
264
753951
3336
监听那些欧洲的领导者
12:37
to tap the email of residents of Mexico and Brazil,
265
757287
3455
截获墨西哥和巴西居民的邮件
12:40
to read email traffic inside the United Nations Headquarters and E.U. Parliament,
266
760742
4806
甚至联合国总部以及欧盟议会的邮件
12:45
and I don't think they are trying to find terrorists
267
765548
3154
他们显然不会在欧盟议会内部
12:48
from inside the E.U. Parliament, right?
268
768702
3018
寻找恐怖分子,对吧?
12:51
It's not the war on terror.
269
771720
1948
所以,这不是一场针对恐怖分子的战争
12:53
Part of it might be, and there are terrorists,
270
773668
4142
虽然部分意义上可以说是
12:57
but are we really thinking about terrorists
271
777810
2427
恐怖主义的确是存在的
13:00
as such an existential threat
272
780237
2169
但我们会认为它是一种
13:02
that we are willing to do anything at all to fight them?
273
782406
3676
必需我们不惜一切代价去全力对抗的现存威胁么?
13:06
Are the Americans ready
to throw away the Constituion
274
786082
3491
美国人民准备为了恐怖分子
13:09
and throw it in the trash
just because there are terrorists?
275
789573
4241
而抛弃宪法?
13:13
And the same thing with the Bill of Rights
and all the amendments
276
793814
2524
抛弃那些人权法案?
13:16
and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights
277
796338
2317
还有世界人权宣言
13:18
and the E.U. conventions on human rights
and fundamental freedoms
278
798655
5151
欧盟那些关于人权和基本自由的法案
13:23
and the press freedom?
279
803806
1517
还有出版自由?
13:25
Do we really think terrorism
is such an existential threat,
280
805323
3815
我们真的认为恐怖主义
13:29
we are ready to do anything at all?
281
809138
3126
需要我们不惜这一切代价吗?
13:34
But people are scared about terrorists,
282
814490
2664
是的,人们惧怕恐怖主义
13:37
and then they think that
maybe that surveillance is okay
283
817154
2414
所以也许他们认为这样的监视是合理的
13:39
because they have nothing to hide.
284
819568
2044
反正也没什么需要隐藏的
13:41
Feel free to survey me if that helps.
285
821612
2707
需要的话那就随便监视好了
13:44
And whoever tells you that they have nothing to hide
286
824319
2888
但是,谁说他们没有什么值得隐藏起来的?
13:47
simply hasn't thought about this long enough.
287
827207
4713
只是他们还没有考虑那么长远罢了
13:54
(Applause)
288
834520
5865
(掌声)
14:00
Because we have this thing called privacy,
289
840385
2772
因为我们每个人都有隐私
14:03
and if you really think that you have nothing to hide,
290
843157
2345
如果你真的认为你没有什么要隐藏的
14:05
please make sure that's the first thing you tell me,
291
845502
2216
那你一定要弄清楚这是你告诉我的第一件事
14:07
because then I know
292
847718
1550
因为这之后我会觉得
14:09
that I should not trust you with any secrets,
293
849268
1640
不能再信任你
14:10
because obviously you can't keep a secret.
294
850908
3298
因为你明显不会保守秘密
14:17
But people are brutally honest with the Internet,
295
857065
3829
人们对互联网都表现出盲目的诚实
14:20
and when these leaks started,
296
860894
2696
当那些信息开始泄露的时候
14:23
many people were asking me about this.
297
863590
1878
许多人问我
14:25
And I have nothing to hide.
298
865468
1574
说他们没有什么需要隐瞒的
14:27
I'm not doing anything bad or anything illegal.
299
867042
3290
也没有做什么坏事或者违法的事情
14:30
Yet, I have nothing that I would in particular
300
870332
2785
而且我也没有什么想要与
14:33
like to share with an intelligence agency,
301
873117
2793
情报中心分享的特殊信息
14:35
especially a foreign intelligence agency.
302
875910
4137
何况还是国外的情报机构
14:40
And if we indeed need a Big Brother,
303
880047
2855
就算我们真的需要一个老大
14:42
I would much rather have a domestic Big Brother
304
882902
3478
我也希望他是本国的
14:46
than a foreign Big Brother.
305
886380
3160
而不是来自国外
14:49
And when the leaks started,
the very first thing I tweeted about this
306
889545
5059
当信息泄露开始的时候,我最先发表的
14:54
was a comment about how,
307
894604
2074
一条评论就是关于
14:56
when you've been using search engines,
308
896678
1688
当人们使用搜索引擎时,
14:58
you've been potentially leaking all that
to U.S. intelligence.
309
898366
3649
是如何将信息泄露给了美国情报机构
15:02
And two minutes later, I got a reply
310
902015
1972
两分钟后我收到一条回复
15:03
by somebody called Kimberly from the United States
311
903987
2336
来自一个叫做Kimberly的美国人
15:06
challenging me, like, why am I worried about this?
312
906323
2167
他反对我说
15:08
What am I sending to worry about this?
Am I sending naked pictures or something?
313
908503
4032
我又没有发送裸照之类的东西,为什么我还需要担心这个?
15:12
And my answer to Kimberly was
314
912535
1968
我回答他说
15:14
that what I'm sending is none of your business,
315
914503
3029
我发送什么与你无关
15:17
and it should be none
of your government's business either.
316
917532
4265
当然也与你的政府无关
15:21
Because that's what it's about. It's about privacy.
317
921797
2252
因为这就是隐私
15:24
Privacy is nonnegotiable.
318
924049
1914
这一点没什么好讨论的
15:25
It should be built in to all the systems we use.
319
925963
3960
就是应该在我们所用的所有系统得到保障
15:31
(Applause)
320
931968
3578
(鼓掌)
15:38
And one thing we should all understand
321
938830
2619
有一点我们需要知道的是
15:41
is that we are brutally honest with search engines.
322
941449
4599
我们对搜索引擎也是在盲目信任
15:46
You show me your search history,
323
946048
2751
只要你透露了你的搜索记录
15:48
and I'll find something incriminating
324
948799
2366
我就能在五分钟之内
15:51
or something embarrassing there in five minutes.
325
951165
3437
找到那些与之关联的让人尴尬的东西
15:54
We are more honest with search engines
326
954602
1788
我们对搜索引擎的诚实
15:56
than we are with our families.
327
956390
1762
常常多于对我们的家庭
15:58
Search engines know more about you
328
958152
2091
搜索引擎通常也比你的家人
16:00
than your family members know about you.
329
960243
2766
更了解你
16:03
And this is all the kind
of information we are giving away,
330
963009
3088
这就是那些我们
16:06
we are giving away to the United States.
331
966097
4375
泄露给美国的信息
16:10
And surveillance changes history.
332
970472
2478
监视改变历史
16:12
We know this through examples
of corrupt presidents like Nixon.
333
972950
3209
堕落总统Nixon之类的例子告诉我们这些
16:16
Imagine if he would have had the kind
of surveillance tools that are available today.
334
976159
4472
想象下如果他当时有现在这样的情报收集工具会怎么样吧
16:20
And let me actually quote
335
980631
2309
我想用巴西总统Dilma Rousseff夫人
16:22
the president of Brazil, Ms. Dilma Rousseff.
336
982940
3133
做个例子
16:26
She was one of the targets of NSA surveillance.
337
986073
3286
她就是NSA监视的对象之一
16:29
Her email was read, and she spoke
338
989359
2276
她的邮件被截获了
16:31
at the United Nations Headquarters, and she said,
339
991635
3023
她曾经在联合国总部质问
16:34
"If there is no right to privacy,
340
994658
2013
“如果没有隐私的权利
16:36
there can be no true freedom
of expression and opinion,
341
996671
2827
就不会有什么真正的言论自由和舆论自由
16:39
and therefore, there can be no effective democracy."
342
999498
5111
因此也不可能有有效的民主”
16:44
That's what it's about.
343
1004609
2345
就是这样
16:46
Privacy is the building block of our democracies.
344
1006954
3868
隐私是民主的基础
16:52
And to quote a fellow security researcher, Marcus Ranum,
345
1012611
3465
一名在安全方面的同行学者Marcus Ranum曾说
16:56
he said that the United States
is right now treating the Internet
346
1016076
3827
如今美国对互联网的态度
16:59
as it would be treating one of its colonies.
347
1019903
3093
就像对待他们的殖民地
17:02
So we are back to the age of colonization,
348
1022996
2565
所以我们已经又回到了殖民时代
17:05
and we, the foreign users of the Internet,
349
1025561
3062
我们这些互联网的外国用户
17:08
we should think about Americans as our masters.
350
1028623
3705
应该把美国当做自己的主人
17:15
So Mr. Snowden, he's been blamed for many things.
351
1035005
3975
Snowden先生曾经受到过种种指责
17:18
Some are blaming him for causing problems
352
1038980
2654
有些人谴责他带来了美国云产业
17:21
for the U.S. cloud industry
and software companies with these revelations --
353
1041634
3191
和软件公司的信息泄露问题
17:24
and blaming Snowden for causing problems
for the U.S. cloud industry
354
1044825
4296
而这些谴责就如同
17:29
would be the equivalent of blaming Al Gore
355
1049121
2459
在责备Al Gore
17:31
for causing global warming.
356
1051580
2317
带来全球变暖问题一样
17:33
(Laughter)
357
1053897
2254
(笑)
17:36
(Applause)
358
1056151
5071
(鼓掌)
17:43
So, what is there to be done?
359
1063853
6208
那么,我们该怎么办?
17:50
Should we worry. No, we shouldn't worry.
360
1070061
1780
我们需要担忧吗?不
17:51
We should be angry, because this is wrong,
361
1071841
2436
我们应该为这些丑恶的、无礼的、不该发生的事情
17:54
and it's rude, and it should not be done.
362
1074277
2739
而愤怒
17:57
But that's not going to really change the situation.
363
1077016
2268
但这些对改变现实无济于事
17:59
What's going to change the situation
for the rest of the world
364
1079284
3221
对于世界其它国家来说解决这一问题的方法
18:02
is to try to steer away
365
1082505
2282
就是尝试避开
18:04
from systems built in the United States.
366
1084787
2633
美国建立的这些系统
18:07
And that's much easier said than done.
367
1087420
2630
但这说起来容易做起来难
18:10
How do you do that?
368
1090050
1709
该怎么做呢
18:11
A single country, any single country in Europe
369
1091759
1799
任何一个欧洲国家
18:13
cannot replace and build replacements
370
1093558
2793
都没有能力替代
18:16
for the U.S.-made operating systems
and cloud services.
371
1096351
2762
美国制造的操作系统和云服务
18:19
But maybe you don't have to do it alone.
372
1099113
1893
但也许我们可以不用孤军奋战
18:21
Maybe you can do it together with other countries.
373
1101006
1769
而是与其它国家联合
18:22
The solution is open source.
374
1102775
3496
这个解决方案是开源的
18:26
By building together open, free, secure systems,
375
1106271
5613
通过一同构建这样一个开放、免费并安全的系统
18:31
we can go around such surveillance,
376
1111884
3108
我们可以绕开监视
18:34
and then one country doesn't have
to solve the problem by itself.
377
1114992
3223
并且每个国家都不再只靠自己的力量
18:38
It only has to solve one little problem.
378
1118215
2472
而只需要解决一个小问题
18:40
And to quote a fellow security researcher, Haroon Meer,
379
1120687
5523
我们的安全专家Haroon Meer说过
18:46
one country only has to make a small wave,
380
1126210
2969
每个国家都只能成为一个小水波
18:49
but those small waves together become a tide,
381
1129179
3467
而聚在一起就可以掀起巨浪
18:52
and the tide will lift all the boats up at the same time,
382
1132646
3620
从而可以同时载起所有的小船
18:56
and the tide we will build
383
1136266
1651
这个安全,免费并开源的系统
18:57
with secure, free, open-source systems,
384
1137917
3441
将成为推动我们所有人的彭波巨浪
19:01
will become the tide that will lift all of us
385
1141358
2399
使我们可以从此
19:03
up and above the surveillance state.
386
1143757
5582
彻底逃脱国家的监视
19:09
Thank you very much.
387
1149339
2112
谢谢大家
19:11
(Applause)
388
1151451
2398
(鼓掌)
New videos
Original video on YouTube.com
关于本网站
这个网站将向你介绍对学习英语有用的YouTube视频。你将看到来自世界各地的一流教师教授的英语课程。双击每个视频页面上显示的英文字幕,即可从那里播放视频。字幕会随着视频的播放而同步滚动。如果你有任何意见或要求,请使用此联系表与我们联系。