Why fascism is so tempting -- and how your data could power it | Yuval Noah Harari

Prevodilac: Milenka Okuka Lektor: Tijana Mihajlović

Hello, everyone.

Zdravo svima.

It's a bit funny, because I did write that humans will become digital,

Malo je smešno jer sam pisao kako će ljudi da postanu digitalni,

but I didn't think it will happen so fast

ali nisam mislio da će tako brzo da se desi

and that it will happen to me.

i da će meni da se desi.

But here I am, as a digital avatar,

Ali, evo me u vidu digitalnog avatara,

and here you are, so let's start.

a eto i vas, pa zato počnimo.

And let's start with a question.

I započnimo pitanjem:

How many fascists are there in the audience today?

koliko fašista ima u publici danas?

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Well, it's a bit difficult to say,

Pa, malo je teško reći

because we've forgotten what fascism is.

jer smo zaboravili šta je fašizam.

People now use the term "fascist"

Ljudi trenutno koriste termin „fašista“

as a kind of general-purpose abuse.

kao neki vid opšteprimenljive uvrede.

Or they confuse fascism with nationalism.

Ili mešaju fašizam sa nacionalizmom.

So let's take a few minutes to clarify what fascism actually is,

Zato, odvojimo nekoliko minuta da razjasnimo šta je zapravo fašizam

and how it is different from nationalism.

i po čemu se razlikuje od nacionalizma.

The milder forms of nationalism have been among the most benevolent

Blaži oblici nacionalizma su među najdobroćudnijim

of human creations.

ljudskim tvorevinama.

Nations are communities of millions of strangers

Nacije su zajednice miliona stranaca

who don't really know each other.

koji se zaista međusobno ne poznaju.

For example, I don't know the eight million people

Na primer, ja ne poznajem osam miliona ljudi

who share my Israeli citizenship.

koji dele sa mnom izraelsko državljanstvo.

But thanks to nationalism,

Međutim, zahvaljujući nacionalizmu,

we can all care about one another and cooperate effectively.

svi možemo da brinemo jedni za druge i da efikasno sarađujemo.

This is very good.

Ovo je veoma dobro.

Some people, like John Lennon, imagine that without nationalism,

Neki ljudi, poput Džona Lenona, zamišljali su da bi bez nacionalizma

the world will be a peaceful paradise.

svet bio miroljubivi raj.

But far more likely,

Međutim, daleko je izvesnije

without nationalism, we would have been living in tribal chaos.

da bismo bez nacionalizma živeli u plemenskom haosu.

If you look today at the most prosperous and peaceful countries in the world,

Pogledate li današnje najprosperitetnije i najmirnije države na svetu,

countries like Sweden and Switzerland and Japan,

države poput Švedske, Švajcarske i Japana,

you will see that they have a very strong sense of nationalism.

videćete da oni imaju veoma snažan osećaj nacionalne pripadnosti.

In contrast, countries that lack a strong sense of nationalism,

Nasuprot tome, države kojima nedostaje snažan osećaj nacionalne pripadnosti,

like Congo and Somalia and Afghanistan,

poput Konga, Somalije i Avganistana,

tend to be violent and poor.

nasilnije su i siromašnije.

So what is fascism, and how is it different from nationalism?

Dakle, šta je fašizam i u čemu se razlikuje od nacionalizma?

Well, nationalism tells me that my nation is unique,

Pa, nacionalizam mi kaže da je moja nacija jedinstvena

and that I have special obligations towards my nation.

i da imam posebne dužnosti prema mojoj naciji.

Fascism, in contrast, tells me that my nation is supreme,

Fašizam, nasuprot tome, mi kaže da je moja nacija superiorna

and that I have exclusive obligations towards it.

i da imam isključive obaveze prema njoj.

I don't need to care about anybody or anything other than my nation.

Ne moram da marim za bilo koga ili za bilo šta osim moje nacije.

Usually, of course, people have many identities

Obično, naravno, ljudi imaju višestruke identitete

and loyalties to different groups.

i odanosti različitim grupama.

For example, I can be a good patriot, loyal to my country,

Na primer, mogu da budem dobar patriota, odan svojoj državi

and at the same time, be loyal to my family,

i da istovremeno budem odan svojoj porodici,

my neighborhood, my profession,

svom komšiluku, svojoj profesiji,

humankind as a whole,

čovečanstvu u celosti,

truth and beauty.

istini i lepoti.

Of course, when I have different identities and loyalties,

Naravno, kada imam različite identitete i odanosti,

it sometimes creates conflicts and complications.

to ponekad stvara sukobe i komplikacije.

But, well, who ever told you that life was easy?

Međutim, dobro, ko vam je ikad rekao da je život lak?

Life is complicated.

Život je komplikovan.

Deal with it.

Nosite se s tim.

Fascism is what happens when people try to ignore the complications

Do fašizma dolazi kada ljudi pokušaju da ignorišu komplikacije

and to make life too easy for themselves.

i pokušaju da suviše pojednostave život za sebe.

Fascism denies all identities except the national identity

Fašizam negira sve identitete osim nacionalnog identiteta

and insists that I have obligations only towards my nation.

i insistira da ja imam obaveze samo prema mojoj naciji.

If my nation demands that I sacrifice my family,

Ako moja nacija zahteva da žrtvujem moju porodicu,

then I will sacrifice my family.

onda ću da žrtvujem moju porodicu.

If the nation demands that I kill millions of people,

Ako nacija zahteva da ubijem milione ljudi,

then I will kill millions of people.

onda ću da ubijem milione ljudi.

And if my nation demands that I betray truth and beauty,

A ako moja nacija zahteva da izdam istinu i lepotu,

then I should betray truth and beauty.

onda treba i da izdam istinu i lepotu.

For example, how does a fascist evaluate art?

Na primer, kako fašista ocenjuje umetnost?

How does a fascist decide whether a movie is a good movie or a bad movie?

Kako fašista odlučuje da li je film dobar ili loš?

Well, it's very, very, very simple.

Pa, veoma, veoma, veoma je prosto.

There is really just one yardstick:

Zaista postoji samo jedno merilo:

if the movie serves the interests of the nation,

ako film služi interesima nacije,

it's a good movie;

onda je to dobar film;

if the movie doesn't serve the interests of the nation,

ako film ne služi interesima nacije,

it's a bad movie.

onda je to loš film.

That's it.

To je to.

Similarly, how does a fascist decide what to teach kids in school?

Slično, kako fašista odlučuje šta treba deca da uče u školi?

Again, it's very simple.

Opet, veoma je prosto.

There is just one yardstick:

Postoji samo jedno merilo:

you teach the kids whatever serves the interests of the nation.

podučavate decu bilo čemu što služi nacionalnom interesu.

The truth doesn't matter at all.

Istina uopšte nije važna.

Now, the horrors of the Second World War and of the Holocaust remind us

Sad, užasi Drugog svetskog rata i Holokausta nas podsećaju

of the terrible consequences of this way of thinking.

na jezive posledice ovog načina razmišljanja.

But usually, when we talk about the ills of fascism,

Međutim, obično kada govorimo o manama fašizma,

we do so in an ineffective way,

radimo to na neefikasan način

because we tend to depict fascism as a hideous monster,

jer često prikazujemo fašizam kao odvratno čudovište,

without really explaining what was so seductive about it.

a da zaista ne objašnjavamo šta je bilo tako zavodljivo u vezi s njim.

It's a bit like these Hollywood movies that depict the bad guys --

Pomalo liči na način na koji holivudski filmovi prikazuju negativce -

Voldemort or Sauron or Darth Vader --

Voldemora ili Saurona ili Darta Vejdera -

as ugly and mean and cruel.

kao ružne, zle i okrutne.

They're cruel even to their own supporters.

Oni su okrutni čak i prema sopstvenim podržavaocima.

When I see these movies, I never understand --

Kad odgledam ove filmove, uopšte ne razumem -

why would anybody be tempted to follow a disgusting creep like Voldemort?

zašto bi bilo koga privlačilo da prati odvratnog ljigavca poput Voldemora?

The problem with evil is that in real life,

Problem sa zlom je što u stvarnom životu

evil doesn't necessarily look ugly.

zlo nužno ne izgleda ružno.

It can look very beautiful.

Može da izgleda veoma lepo.

This is something that Christianity knew very well,

To je nešto čega je hrišćanstvo bilo veoma svesno,

which is why in Christian art, as [opposed to] Hollywood,

zbog čega je u hrišćanskoj umetnosti, nasuprot Holivudu,

Satan is usually depicted as a gorgeous hunk.

Satana često prikazan kao prelepi zavodnik.

This is why it's so difficult to resist the temptations of Satan,

Zbog toga je tako teško odoleti Sataninim iskušenjima

and why it is also difficult to resist the temptations of fascism.

i zbog toga je takođe teško odoleti iskušenjima fašizma.

Fascism makes people see themselves

Zbog fašizma ljudi sebe vide

as belonging to the most beautiful and most important thing in the world --

kao pripadnike najlepše i najvažnije stvari na svetu -

the nation.

nacije.

And then people think,

I onda ljudi misle:

"Well, they taught us that fascism is ugly.

„Dobro, učili su nas da je fašizam ružan.

But when I look in the mirror, I see something very beautiful,

Međutim, kad pogledam u ogledalo, vidim nešto veoma lepo,

so I can't be a fascist, right?"

pa ne mogu da budem fašista, zar ne?“

Wrong.

Greška.

That's the problem with fascism.

To je problem kod fašizma.

When you look in the fascist mirror,

Kada pogledate u fašističko ogledalo,

you see yourself as far more beautiful than you really are.

vidite sebe kao mnogo lepše nego što zaista jeste.

In the 1930s, when Germans looked in the fascist mirror,

Tokom 1930-ih, kad bi Nemci pogledali u fašističko ogledalo,

they saw Germany as the most beautiful thing in the world.

videli bi Nemačku kao nešto najlepše na svetu.

If today, Russians look in the fascist mirror,

Ako bi danas Rusi pogledali u fašističko ogledalo,

they will see Russia as the most beautiful thing in the world.

videli bi Rusiju kao nešto najlepše na svetu.

And if Israelis look in the fascist mirror,

I ako bi Izraelci pogledali u fašističko ogledalo,

they will see Israel as the most beautiful thing in the world.

videli bi Izrael kao nešto najlepše na svetu.

This does not mean that we are now facing a rerun of the 1930s.

Ovo ne znači da smo trenutno suočeni sa reprizom 1930-ih.

Fascism and dictatorships might come back,

Fašizam i diktature mogu da se vrate,

but they will come back in a new form,

ali će da se vrate u novom obliku,

a form which is much more relevant

obliku koji je daleko relevantniji

to the new technological realities of the 21st century.

za novu tehnološku stvarnost XXI veka.

In ancient times,

U drevna vremena,

land was the most important asset in the world.

zemlja je bila najvažniji posed na svetu.

Politics, therefore, was the struggle to control land.

Politika, samim tim, bila je borba za kontrolu zemlje.

And dictatorship meant that all the land was owned by a single ruler

A diktatura je značila da svu zemlju poseduje jedan vladar

or by a small oligarch.

ili manji oligarh.

And in the modern age, machines became more important than land.

A u moderno vreme, mašine su postale važnije od zemlje.

Politics became the struggle to control the machines.

Politika je postala borba da se kontrolišu mašine.

And dictatorship meant

A diktatura je značila

that too many of the machines became concentrated

da je preveliki broj mašina postao koncentrisan

in the hands of the government or of a small elite.

u rukama vlade ili malobrojne elite.

Now data is replacing both land and machines

Sada podaci uzimaju mesto zemlje i mašina

as the most important asset.

kao najvažnijeg poseda.

Politics becomes the struggle to control the flows of data.

Politika postaje borba da se kontroliše protok podataka.

And dictatorship now means

A diktatura trenutno znači

that too much data is being concentrated in the hands of the government

da je prevelika količina podataka koncentrisana u rukama vlade

or of a small elite.

ili malobrojne elite.

The greatest danger that now faces liberal democracy

Najveća opasnost s kojom je trenutno suočena liberalna demokratija

is that the revolution in information technology

je to što će revolucija u informacionoj tehnologiji

will make dictatorships more efficient than democracies.

učiniti diktature efikasnijim od demokratija.

In the 20th century,

U XX veku,

democracy and capitalism defeated fascism and communism

demokratija i kapitalizam su porazili fašizam i komunizam

because democracy was better at processing data and making decisions.

jer je demokratija bila bolja u obradi podataka i donošenju odluka.

Given 20th-century technology,

Uz tehnologiju XX veka,

it was simply inefficient to try and concentrate too much data

prosto je bilo neefikasno pokušavati koncentrisati preveliku količinu podataka

and too much power in one place.

i previše moći na jedno mesto.

But it is not a law of nature

Međutim, ne radi se o zakonu prirode

that centralized data processing is always less efficient

da je centralizovana obrada podataka uvek manje efikasna

than distributed data processing.

od raspodeljene obrade podataka.

With the rise of artificial intelligence and machine learning,

S usponom veštačke inteligencije i mašinskog učenja,

it might become feasible to process enormous amounts of information

mogla bi da postane izvodljiva obrada ogromne količine informacija

very efficiently in one place,

veoma efikasno na jednom mestu,

to take all the decisions in one place,

da se sve odluke stave na jedno mesto

and then centralized data processing will be more efficient

i tako bi centralizovana obrada podataka bila efikasnija

than distributed data processing.

od raspodeljene obrade podataka.

And then the main handicap of authoritarian regimes

I tada bi glavni nedostatak autoritarnih režima

in the 20th century --

iz XX veka -

their attempt to concentrate all the information in one place --

njihov pokušaj da koncentrišu sve informacije na jedno mesto -

it will become their greatest advantage.

postao njihova najveća prednost.

Another technological danger that threatens the future of democracy

Još jedna tehnološka opasnost koja preti budućnosti demokratije

is the merger of information technology with biotechnology,

je spajanje informacione tehnologije sa biotehnologijom,

which might result in the creation of algorithms

a to bi moglo da rezultira stvaranjem algoritama

that know me better than I know myself.

koji me poznaju bolje nego što ja poznajem sebe.

And once you have such algorithms,

A čim dobijete takve algoritme,

an external system, like the government,

spoljni sistemi, poput vlade,

cannot just predict my decisions,

ne samo da mogu predvideti moje postupke;

it can also manipulate my feelings, my emotions.

takođe mogu da manipulišu mojim osećanjima, mojim emocijama.

A dictator may not be able to provide me with good health care,

Diktator možda neće moći da mi pruži dobro zdravstvo,

but he will be able to make me love him

ali može da učini da ga volim

and to make me hate the opposition.

i da učini da mrzim opoziciju.

Democracy will find it difficult to survive such a development

Demokratiji će da bude teško da preživi takav razvoj

because, in the end,

jer, naposletku,

democracy is not based on human rationality;

demokratija nije zasnovana na ljudskoj racionalnosti;

it's based on human feelings.

zasnovana je na ljudskim osećanjima.

During elections and referendums,

Tokom izbora i referenduma,

you're not being asked, "What do you think?"

ne pitaju vas: „Šta mislite?“

You're actually being asked, "How do you feel?"

Zapravo vas pitaju: „Kako se osećate?“

And if somebody can manipulate your emotions effectively,

A ako neko može efikasno da manipuliše vašim emocijama,

democracy will become an emotional puppet show.

demokratija će da postane emocionalna lutkarska predstava.

So what can we do to prevent the return of fascism

Dakle, šta možemo da uradimo da sprečimo povratak fašizma

and the rise of new dictatorships?

i uspon novih diktatura?

The number one question that we face is: Who controls the data?

Prvo pitanje s kojim smo suočeni glasi: ko kontroliše podatke?

If you are an engineer,

Ako ste inženjer,

then find ways to prevent too much data

onda pronađite način da sprečite da prevelika količina podataka

from being concentrated in too few hands.

bude koncentrisana u premalo ruku.

And find ways to make sure

I pronađite načine da obezbedite

the distributed data processing is at least as efficient

da raspodeljena obrada podataka bude bar jednako efikasna

as centralized data processing.

kao i centralizovana obrada podataka.

This will be the best safeguard for democracy.

To će da bude najbolji branik demokratije.

As for the rest of us who are not engineers,

Što se tiče nas ostalih koji nismo inženjeri,

the number one question facing us

prvo pitanje s kojim smo suočeni

is how not to allow ourselves to be manipulated

jeste kako da ne dozvolimo da nama manipulišu

by those who control the data.

oni koji kontrolišu podatke.

The enemies of liberal democracy, they have a method.

Neprijatelji liberalne demokratije imaju metod.

They hack our feelings.

Hakuju naša osećanja.

Not our emails, not our bank accounts --

Ne naše imejlove, ne naše bankovne račune -

they hack our feelings of fear and hate and vanity,

hakuju naša osećanja straha, mržnje i taštine,

and then use these feelings

kako bi onda koristili ta osećanja

to polarize and destroy democracy from within.

da polarizuju i unište demokratiju iznutra.

This is actually a method

Ovo je zapravo metod

that Silicon Valley pioneered in order to sell us products.

koji je prva uvela Silicijumska dolina da bi nam prodavali proizvode.

But now, the enemies of democracy are using this very method

Međutim, sad neprijatelji demokratije koriste baš ovaj metod

to sell us fear and hate and vanity.

da nam prodaju strah, mržnju i taštinu.

They cannot create these feelings out of nothing.

Ne mogu stvarati ova osećanja ni iz čega.

So they get to know our own preexisting weaknesses.

Stoga upoznaju naše postojeće slabosti.

And then use them against us.

I potom ih koriste protiv nas.

And it is therefore the responsibility of all of us

Stoga je dužnost svih nas

to get to know our weaknesses

da spoznamo naše slabosti

and make sure that they do not become a weapon

i da se postaramo da one ne postanu oružja

in the hands of the enemies of democracy.

u rukama neprijatelja demokratije.

Getting to know our own weaknesses

Spoznaja naših slabosti

will also help us to avoid the trap of the fascist mirror.

takođe će da nam pomogne da izbegnemo zamku fašističkog ogledala.

As we explained earlier, fascism exploits our vanity.

Kao što smo ranije objasnli, fašizam eksploatiše našu taštinu.

It makes us see ourselves as far more beautiful than we really are.

Zbog njega vidimo sebe kao mnogo lepše nego što zaista jesmo.

This is the seduction.

Radi se o zavođenju.

But if you really know yourself,

Ali, ako uistinu poznajete sebe,

you will not fall for this kind of flattery.

nećete pasti na ovaj vid laskanja.

If somebody puts a mirror in front of your eyes

Ako vam neko pred oči stavi ogledalo

that hides all your ugly bits and makes you see yourself

koje sakriva sve vaše ružne delove, a zbog čega sebe vidite

as far more beautiful and far more important

daleko lepšim i daleko važnijim

than you really are,

nego što zaista jeste,

just break that mirror.

samo razbijte to ogledalo.

Thank you.

Hvala vam.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)

Chris Anderson: Yuval, thank you.

Kris Anderson: Juval, hvala ti.

Goodness me.

Za ime boga.

It's so nice to see you again.

Tako je lepo videti te opet.

So, if I understand you right,

Dakle, ako sam te dobro razumeo,

you're alerting us to two big dangers here.

upozoravaš nas na dve velike opasnosti.

One is the possible resurgence of a seductive form of fascism,

Jedna je mogući novi uspon zavodljivih oblika fašizma,

but close to that, dictatorships that may not exactly be fascistic,

ali blisko tome, diktature koje možda ne bi bile baš fašističke,

but control all the data.

već bi kontrolisale sve podatke.

I wonder if there's a third concern

Pitam se postoji li treća briga

that some people here have already expressed,

koju su neki ljudi ovde već izrazili,

which is where, not governments, but big corporations control all our data.

a to su ne vlade, već velike korporacije koje kontrolišu sve podatke.

What do you call that,

Kako nazivaš to

and how worried should we be about that?

i koliko bi trebalo da budemo zabrinuti zbog toga?

Yuval Noah Harari: Well, in the end, there isn't such a big difference

Juval Noa Harari: Pa, naposletku, nema naročito velike razlike

between the corporations and the governments,

između korporacija i vlada

because, as I said, the questions is: Who controls the data?

jer, kao što sam rekao, pitanje glasi: ko kontroliše podatke?

This is the real government.

To je stvarna vlada.

If you call it a corporation or a government --

Ako to nazivate korporacijom ili vladom -

if it's a corporation and it really controls the data,

ako je korporacija ta koja zaista kontroliše podatke,

this is our real government.

to je naša stvarna vlada.

So the difference is more apparent than real.

Dakle, razlika je pre prividna nego stvarna.

CA: But somehow, at least with corporations,

KA: Međutim, nekako, bar s korporacijama,

you can imagine market mechanisms where they can be taken down.

možemo da zamislimo mehanizme tržišta kojima ih možemo svrgnuti.

I mean, if consumers just decide

Mislim, ako potrošači prosto odluče

that the company is no longer operating in their interest,

da firma više ne posluje u njihovom interesu,

it does open the door to another market.

to otvara vrata za novo tržište.

It seems easier to imagine that

Čini se da je lakše to zamisliti

than, say, citizens rising up and taking down a government

nego, recimo, građane koji ustaju i svrgavaju vladu

that is in control of everything.

koja kontroliše sve.

YNH: Well, we are not there yet,

JNH: Pa, nismo još uvek stigli dotle,

but again, if a corporation really knows you better than you know yourself --

ali, opet, ako vas korporacija zaista poznaje bolje nego što vi poznajete sebe -

at least that it can manipulate your own deepest emotions and desires,

bar da može da manipuliše vašim najdubljim emocijama i žudnjama,

and you won't even realize --

pa vi nećete čak ni biti svesni -

you will think this is your authentic self.

mislićete da ste to autentični vi.

So in theory, yes, in theory, you can rise against a corporation,

Dakle, u teoriji, da, u teoriji možete da ustanete protiv korporacije,

just as, in theory, you can rise against a dictatorship.

baš kao što, u teoriji, možete da ustanete protiv diktature.

But in practice, it is extremely difficult.

Međutim, u praksi izuzetno je teško.

CA: So in "Homo Deus," you argue that this would be the century

KA: Dakle, u knjizi „Homo Deus“ raspravljaš da će ovo da bude vek

when humans kind of became gods,

u kom će ljudi da postanu bogovi na neki način,

either through development of artificial intelligence

bilo putem razvoja veštačke inteligencije

or through genetic engineering.

ili putem genetskog inženjeringa.

Has this prospect of political system shift, collapse

Da li je ovaj vid preokreta političkog sistema, kolapsa,

impacted your view on that possibility?

uticao na tvoje viđenje te mogućnosti?

YNH: Well, I think it makes it even more likely,

JNH: Mislim da je zbog toga ona još izglednija,

and more likely that it will happen faster,

i izglednije je da će brže da se desi,

because in times of crisis, people are willing to take risks

jer u kriznim vremenima, ljudi su spremni da rizikuju

that they wouldn't otherwise take.

kako inače ne bi.

And people are willing to try

I ljudi su spremni da isprobaju

all kinds of high-risk, high-gain technologies.

sve vidove visokorizičnih tehnologija sa visokim dobicima.

So these kinds of crises might serve the same function

Dakle, ovi vidovi kriza bi mogli da posluže istoj svrsi

as the two world wars in the 20th century.

kao dva svetska rata u XX veku.

The two world wars greatly accelerated

Dva svetska rata su uveliko ubrzala

the development of new and dangerous technologies.

razvoj novih i opasnih tehnologija.

And the same thing might happen in the 21st century.

A isto bi moglo da se desi u XXI veku.

I mean, you need to be a little crazy to run too fast,

Mislim, morate da budete malčice ludi da delujete ishitreno,

let's say, with genetic engineering.

recimo, sa genetskim inženjeringom.

But now you have more and more crazy people

Međutim, trenutno imate sve više ludih ljudi

in charge of different countries in the world,

koji upravljaju različitim državama u svetu,

so the chances are getting higher, not lower.

pa šanse postaju veće, a ne manje.

CA: So, putting it all together, Yuval, you've got this unique vision.

KA: Dakle, da sve zaokružimo, Juval, imaš tu jedinstvenu viziju.

Roll the clock forward 30 years.

Premotajmo sat 30 godina unapred.

What's your guess -- does humanity just somehow scrape through,

Šta pretpostavljaš - da li se čovečanstvo nekako zamalo provlači,

look back and say, "Wow, that was a close thing. We did it!"

osvrće se unazad i kaže: „Uh, to je bilo zamalo. Uspeli smo!“

Or not?

Ili ne?

YNH: So far, we've managed to overcome all the previous crises.

JNH: Do sad smo uspevali da prevaziđemo prethodne krize.

And especially if you look at liberal democracy

A naročito ako pogledate liberalnu demokratiju

and you think things are bad now,

i pomislite da su stvari trenutno loše,

just remember how much worse things looked in 1938 or in 1968.

samo se setite koliko su gore stvari izgledale 1938. ili 1968. godine.

So this is really nothing, this is just a small crisis.

Dakle, ovo uistinu nije ništa, ovo je tek mala kriza.

But you can never know,

Ali, nikad ne možete da znate

because, as a historian,

jer, kao istoričar,

I know that you should never underestimate human stupidity.

znam da nikad ne bi trebalo da potcenjujete ljudsku glupost.

(Laughter) (Applause)

(Smeh) (Aplauz)

It is one of the most powerful forces that shape history.

Ona je jedna od najsnažnijih sila koje oblikuju ljudsku istoriju.

CA: Yuval, it's been an absolute delight to have you with us.

KA: Juval, apsolutno je zadovoljstvo što si nam se pridružio.

Thank you for making the virtual trip.

Hvala na virtuelnom putovanju.

Želim ti prijatno veče tamo u Tel Avivu.

Have a great evening there in Tel Aviv.

Juval Harari!

Yuval Harari!

JNH: Mnogo vam hvala.

YNH: Thank you very much.

(Aplauz)

(Applause)