请双击下面的英文字幕来播放视频。
翻译人员: Jenny Yang
校对人员: Angelia King
我是一个研究创造力的手术医生,
00:16
So I am a surgeon who studies creativity,
0
16045
2473
00:18
and I have never had a patient tell me,
1
18542
2828
从来没病人跟我说
00:21
"I really want you
to be creative during surgery,"
2
21394
2842
“我真希望你在手术时搞些创造。”
00:24
and so I guess
there's a little bit of irony to it.
3
24260
3119
所以我想这也是有点讽刺的。
00:27
I will say though that,
after having done surgery a lot,
4
27403
3300
我是说,做了那么多手术后,
00:30
it's similar to playing
a musical instrument.
5
30727
2210
就跟演奏一种乐器一样。
00:32
And for me, this deep
and enduring fascination with sound
6
32961
2830
对我来说, 对声音的持久而深切的痴迷
00:35
is what led me to both be a surgeon
7
35815
1742
引导我成为一个手术医生,
00:37
and to study the science
of sound, particularly music.
8
37581
2534
并研究声学,特别是音乐的。
所以我想在随后的几分钟里
00:40
I'm going to talk
over the next few minutes
9
40139
2049
我来讲一下我的职业
00:42
about my career
10
42212
1291
00:43
in terms of how I'm able to study music
11
43527
2284
我是怎样研究音乐
00:45
and try to grapple
with all these questions
12
45835
2034
怎样研究大脑是如何进行创造
00:47
of how the brain is able to be creative.
13
47893
2343
等问题的。
00:50
I've done most of this work
at Johns Hopkins University,
14
50260
2630
我的大部分的工作是在約翰斯霍普金斯大学进行的,
00:52
and at the National Institute
of Health where I was previously.
15
52914
2985
也有些是在我原先工作的国家健康研究所完成的。
我在这里给大家介绍一些科学实验
00:55
I'll go over some science experiments
and cover three musical experiments.
16
55923
3507
包括三个音乐实验。
我先给大家看一段录像。
00:59
I will start off by playing
a video for you.
17
59454
2056
这是基思·杰瑞特Keith Jarrett的一段录像,他是著名的即兴爵士作曲家,
01:01
This video is of Keith Jarrett,
who's a well-known jazz improviser
18
61534
3103
估计他也是能将即兴创造升华到非常高超境界
01:04
and probably the most
well-known, iconic example
19
64661
2444
的最著名,最有代表性的人物。
01:07
of someone who takes improvisation
to a higher level.
20
67129
2493
他可以即兴表演一场音乐会
01:09
And he'll improvise entire concerts
off the top of his head,
21
69646
3139
音乐就在他的大脑里即兴产生,
01:12
and he'll never play it
exactly the same way again,
22
72809
2405
他不会再用同样的手法演奏第二次。
所以,这是一种创作强度很高的一种形势,
01:15
so as a form of intense creativity,
23
75238
1985
我觉得这是一个很好的例子。
01:17
I think this is a great example.
24
77247
1618
01:18
And so why don't we go
and click the video.
25
78889
2347
我们为什么还不点击这视频看看。
01:21
(Music)
26
81260
4000
(音乐)
02:17
(Music ends)
27
137055
2001
这真是很神奇,精彩的即兴音乐。
02:19
It's really a remarkable
thing that happens there.
28
139080
2339
我是他的一个忠实的听众, 粉丝,
02:21
I've always as a listener, as a fan,
29
141443
1728
我听到这些会感到很震惊。
02:23
I listen to that, and I'm astounded.
30
143195
1717
02:24
I think -- how can this possibly be?
31
144936
1736
我想:这怎么可能?
02:26
How can the brain generate
that much information,
32
146696
2291
大脑怎么可能产生这么大量的信息,
同时爆发出这么多音乐?
02:29
that much music, spontaneously?
33
149011
1585
02:30
And so I set out
with this concept, scientifically,
34
150620
2616
所以我从这个概念出发,科学地认为
02:33
that artistic creativity,
it's magical, but it's not magic,
35
153260
4351
艺术创作,是神奇的,但不是魔术。
它是大脑的产物。
02:37
meaning that it's a product of the brain.
36
157635
2007
很少有不动脑子的人创作艺术。
02:39
There's not too many brain-dead
people creating art.
37
159666
2434
所以艺术创作的产生
02:42
With this notion that artistic creativity
is in fact a neurologic product,
38
162124
3631
事实上是神经的产物,
02:45
I took this thesis that we could study it
39
165779
2457
我开始了这个研究课题
02:48
just like we study any other
complex neurologic process,
40
168260
3114
就象研究其他复杂神经过程一样。
02:51
and there are subquestions
that I put there.
41
171398
2055
我想我提出了一些潜在的问题。
02:53
Is it possible to study
creativity scientifically?
42
173477
2386
我们是否能科学地研究创作力?
02:55
And I think that's a good question.
43
175887
2037
我觉得这是一个很好的问题。
02:57
And I'll tell you that most
scientific studies of music,
44
177948
2686
我想告诉你大多数的音乐科学研究
03:00
they're very dense,
45
180658
1518
都很高深莫测。
03:02
and when you go through them,
46
182200
1395
你很难在那些研究材料中发现音乐。
03:03
it's very hard to recognize
the music in it.
47
183619
2070
03:05
In fact, they seem to be
unmusical entirely
48
185713
2219
事实上, 它们完全是非音乐的
03:07
and to miss the point of the music.
49
187956
1794
完全丧失了音乐性。
03:09
This brings the second question:
50
189774
1556
这就带来了第二个问题:
03:11
Why should scientists study creativity?
51
191354
1882
为什么科学家研究创造力?
03:13
Maybe we're not the right people to do it.
52
193260
2079
也许我们不是解答这问题的合适人选。
03:15
(Laughter)
53
195363
999
也可能是,
03:16
Well it may be, but I will say that,
from a scientific perspective,
54
196386
3452
但是我要说的是, 从科学的观点出发
03:19
we talked a lot about innovation today,
55
199862
2018
我们今天谈论了很多有关发明创造的话题--
03:21
the science of innovation,
56
201904
1332
科学发明,
03:23
how much we understand
about how the brain is able to innovate
57
203260
2953
我们对大脑是如何创造的了解
才刚起步。
03:26
is in its infancy,
58
206237
1244
03:27
and truly, we know very little
about how we are able to be creative.
59
207505
3467
其实,我们对我们是怎样创造的知之甚少。
03:30
I think that we're going to see,
60
210996
1524
所以我们会在
03:32
over the next 10, 20, 30 years,
61
212544
1692
今后的10,20,30年间看见
03:34
a real science of creativity
that's burgeoning
62
214260
2171
一个真正现实的科学创造力会从兴起走向繁荣。
03:36
and is going to flourish,
63
216455
1201
03:37
Because we now have new methods
that can enable us
64
217680
2432
我们现在有了新的手法帮助我们
将向这样的一个过程过渡,
03:40
to take this process
like complex jazz improvisation,
65
220136
2524
一个复杂的即兴爵士乐创造的过程,并严格地分析研究它。
03:42
and study it rigorously.
66
222684
1374
所以说到大脑,
03:44
So it gets down to the brain.
67
224082
2147
我们所有的人都有一个非凡的大脑,
03:46
All of us have this remarkable brain,
68
226253
1794
至少现在来说,我们对它的了解是非常有限的。
03:48
which is poorly understood,
to say the least.
69
228071
2455
03:50
I think that neuroscientists
have more questions than answers,
70
230550
4198
我想神经学家
的问题比答案要多。
03:54
and I'm not going
to give you answers today,
71
234772
2202
而我今天也没办法给你很多答案,
03:56
just ask a lot of questions.
72
236998
1361
只能提出很多问题。
03:58
And that's what I do in my lab.
73
238383
1507
这也是基本上我在实验室做的事情。
03:59
I ask questions about what is the brain
doing to enable us to do this.
74
239914
3314
我追问到底大脑做了什么使得我们能做这些事情。
这是我用的主要方法,这是功能性的核磁共振成像。
04:03
This is the main method that I use.
This is functional MRI.
75
243252
2777
如果你用过核磁共振成像扫描仪,它们是一样的,
04:06
If you've been in an MRI scanner,
it's very much the same,
76
246053
2723
04:08
but this one is outfitted in a special way
to not just take pictures of your brain,
77
248800
3915
但是这个有特殊的配备
所以它不只是给你的大脑拍照,
04:12
but to also take pictures
of active areas of the brain.
78
252739
2927
而且给大脑活跃的区域拍照。
04:15
The way that's done is by the following:
79
255690
1905
整个完成的过程如下,
04:17
There's something called BOLD imaging,
80
257619
1810
这是叫做BOLD成像,
04:19
which is Blood Oxygen
Level Dependent imaging.
81
259453
2399
它代表血液氧气水平成像。
现在如果你在功能性核磁共振扫描仪中,
04:22
When you're in an fMRI scanner,
you're in a big magnet
82
262541
2585
你在一个大磁场里
04:25
that's aligning your molecules
in certain areas.
83
265150
2373
这是和你的一些特别区域的分子对应。
04:27
When an area of the brain is active,
meaning a neural area is active,
84
267547
3719
当大脑活跃时,也就是神经区域活跃时,
血液会往那个区域流动。
04:31
it gets blood flow shunted to that area.
85
271290
2238
04:33
That blood flow causes an increase
in local blood to that area
86
273552
4350
血液流动会导致那个
区域的血液增加
04:37
with a deoxyhemoglobin
change in concentration.
87
277926
2983
导致脱氧血红蛋白的浓度发生变化。
04:40
Deoxyhemoglobin can be detected by MRI,
88
280933
2155
核磁共振扫描仪可以探测脱氧血红蛋白,
但不能探测氧合血红蛋白。
04:43
whereas oxyhemoglobin can't.
89
283112
1850
04:44
So through this method of inference --
90
284986
1954
所以用这种手法来推理
04:46
and we're measuring blood flow,
not neural activity --
91
286964
2542
我们测量血液的流动,不是神经的活动。
我们可以说大脑的某个部分得到了更多的血液,
04:49
we say that an area of the brain
that's getting more blood
92
289530
2736
这个部分在人做某些事情时特别活跃。
04:52
was active during a particular task,
and that's the crux of how fMRI works.
93
292290
3542
这就是功能磁共振成像的关键。
这从90年代就被使用
04:55
And it's been used since the '90s
to study really complex processes.
94
295856
3905
用来研究复杂的过程。
04:59
I'm going to review a study that I did,
which was jazz in an fMRI scanner.
95
299785
3500
现在我来介绍我做的一个研究
是关于爵士的功能磁共振成像。
05:03
It was done with a colleague,
Alan Braun, at the NIH.
96
303309
2503
这是我和我的同事阿兰·布朗Alan Braun一起在国家健康研究所做的。
05:05
This is a short video
of how we did this project.
97
305836
2400
这是我们如果做这个实验的一段录像。
05:08
(Video) Charles Limb: This is a plastic
MIDI piano keyboard
98
308260
2781
(录像)查尔斯·林普Charles Limb: 这是一个塑料的MIDI琴键键盘
我们用它来做爵士实验。
05:11
that we use for the jazz experiments.
99
311065
1781
05:12
And it's a 35-key keyboard
100
312870
2053
它有35个键
05:14
designed to fit both inside the scanner,
101
314947
2460
是为了可以在扫描仪中使用而设计的,
它保证磁控安全,
05:17
be magnetically safe,
102
317431
1336
05:18
have minimal interference
that would contribute to any artifact,
103
318791
3842
并将可能造成影响的人为干扰
减到最小,
05:22
and have this cushion
so that it can rest on the players' legs
104
322657
2920
这个垫子可以放在演奏者的腿上,
05:25
while they're lying down in the scanner,
playing on their back.
105
325601
2955
他们在扫描仪中,他们是躺着弹琴的。
05:28
It works like this --
this doesn't actually produce any sound.
106
328580
3029
这是像这样工作的,它并不产生声音。
05:31
It sends out what's called
a MIDI signal --
107
331633
2443
它传递所谓的MIDI信号
也称为乐器数字界面,
05:34
or a Musical Instrument
Digital Interface --
108
334100
2049
通过这个电线传到盒子和计算机中,
05:36
through these wires into the box
and then the computer,
109
336173
2661
05:38
which then trigger
high-quality piano samples like this.
110
338858
2935
然后产生了象这样高质量钢琴声。
05:41
(Music)
111
341817
3241
(音乐)
(音乐)
05:48
(Music)
112
348309
3754
06:07
(Music ends)
113
367593
1975
06:09
OK, so it works.
114
369592
1644
CL:好的, 它是这样工作的。
06:11
And so through this piano keyboard,
115
371260
1976
所以通过钢琴的琴键,
06:13
we have the means to take
a musical process and study it.
116
373260
2743
我们可以有办法记录音乐的过程来进行研究。
所以你有了这个很酷的钢琴琴键后干什么呢?
06:16
So what do you do now that you have
this cool piano keyboard?
117
376027
2927
06:18
You can't just say,
"It's great we have a keyboard."
118
378978
2445
你不能说:“太好了,我们有了键盘了。”
我们得想出真正的科学实验。
06:21
We have to come up
with a scientific experiment.
119
381447
2324
实验其实是由以下的内容组成的。
06:23
The experiment
really rests on the following:
120
383795
2123
06:26
What happens in the brain during something
that's memorized and over-learned,
121
386189
3644
大脑在人们靠记忆演奏熟知的音乐时是怎样反应的?
06:29
and what happens in the brain
during something
122
389857
2155
大脑在演奏者自发和即兴创作
时又是如何反应的?
06:32
that is spontaneously
generated, or improvised,
123
392036
2274
从某个角度来说这与肌肉运动相匹配
06:34
in a way that's matched motorically
124
394334
1814
并符合低级感知运动的特征吗?
06:36
and in terms of lower-level
sensory motor features?
125
396172
2845
我这里有一段范例。
06:39
I have here what we call the paradigms.
126
399041
2595
06:41
There's a scale paradigm, which is playing
a scale up and down, memorized,
127
401660
3496
这是一段音阶范例, 只需要跟了音阶上下, 记住就行。
而这是对这段音阶的即兴发挥,
06:45
then there's improvising on a scale,
128
405180
1734
06:46
quarter notes, metronome, right hand --
129
406938
2037
4分音符, 节拍器和右手,
06:48
scientifically very safe,
130
408999
1571
科学上来说很妥当,
06:50
but musically really boring.
131
410594
1873
但是从音乐上来说很单调。
06:52
Then there's the bottom one,
which is called the jazz paradigm.
132
412491
2971
底下的这个,叫做爵士范例。
我们把专业的爵士乐演奏者请到国家健康研究中心,
06:55
So we brought professional
jazz players to the NIH,
133
415486
2404
我们让他们记住左边的这段音乐,左下
06:57
and we had them memorize
this piece of music on the lower-left,
134
417914
2953
就是你听到我弹的这段,
07:00
which is what you heard me playing --
135
420891
1818
然后我们让他们用同样的和音来即兴发挥。
07:02
and we had them improvise
to the same chord changes.
136
422733
2493
如果你能按右下角的按钮,
07:05
And if you can hit
that lower-right sound icon,
137
425250
2208
这就是扫描仪录下的例子。
07:07
that's an example
of what was recorded in the scanner.
138
427482
2828
(音乐)
07:10
(Music)
139
430334
3730
07:35
(Music ends)
140
455064
2001
说到底,这并不是最自然的环境,
07:37
In the end, it's not the most
natural environment,
141
457089
2416
但是他们能弹奏真的音乐。
07:39
but they're able to play real music.
142
459529
1906
我已经听了这段独奏200遍了,
07:41
And I've listened to that solo 200 times,
143
461459
1971
我还是喜欢它。
07:43
and I still like it.
144
463454
1177
07:44
And the musicians
were comfortable in the end.
145
464655
2387
音乐家们最后也感到挺舒适。
我们首先测量音符数量。
07:47
We first measured the number of notes.
146
467066
1824
07:48
Were they playing more notes
when they were improvising?
147
468914
2657
他们在即兴创作时会演奏很多音符吗?
结果不是这样。
07:51
That was not what was going on.
148
471595
1590
然后我们查看了大脑的活动。
07:53
And then we looked at the brain activity.
149
473209
1985
我来把这个给你们压缩在一起。
07:55
I will try to condense this for you.
150
475218
1808
这些对比图展示了大脑在
07:57
These are contrast maps that are showing
subtractions between what changes
151
477050
3480
在你做即兴创作时
08:00
when you're improvising
vs. when you're doing something memorized.
152
480554
3096
和你在做熟记的事情时的不同。
08:03
In red is an area that's active
in the prefrontal cortex,
153
483674
2785
左前头叶外皮的一个活跃地区呈红色,
这是在大脑的前叶。
08:06
the frontal lobe of the brain,
154
486483
1459
08:07
and in blue is this area
that was deactivated.
155
487966
2179
蓝色的地区是不活跃地区。
所以我们看到这个前额皮质一侧是一个焦点
08:10
So we had this focal area
called the medial prefrontal cortex
156
490169
2876
活跃程度很高。
08:13
that went way up in activity.
157
493069
1387
我们可以看到这前额皮质的这一侧一大块
08:14
We had this broad patch of area
called the lateral prefrontal cortex
158
494480
3230
活跃程度很低, 我在这里为你们总结一下。
08:17
that went way down in activity,
159
497734
1525
08:19
I'll summarize that for you.
160
499283
1488
这是大脑的多功能区域。
08:20
These are multifunctional
areas of the brain,
161
500795
2108
像我说的那样, 这不是大脑的爵士部分。
08:22
these are not the jazz areas of the brain.
162
502927
2155
它们担当了很多的事情
08:25
They do a whole host of things
163
505106
1928
包括自省,
08:27
that have to do with self-reflection,
164
507058
1859
08:28
introspection, working memory etc.
165
508941
2360
内省, 工作记忆等。
人的意识其实是处于大脑前叶。
08:31
Really, consciousness is seated
in the frontal lobe.
166
511325
2487
08:33
But we have this combination
167
513836
2034
但是我们发现这些联系在一起的
08:35
of an area that's thought to be involved
in self-monitoring, turning off,
168
515894
3449
主管自我控制的区域关闭了,
而这个代表自传
08:39
and this area that's thought
to be autobiographical,
169
519367
2463
自我表达的区域活跃起来。
08:41
or self-expressive, turning on.
170
521854
1535
所以我们想,至少初步是这么想,
08:43
We think, at least in this preliminary --
171
523413
2071
这只是一个研究, 可能是错误的。
08:45
it's one study; it's probably wrong,
but it's one study --
172
525508
2753
但是这是一个研究成果。
08:48
(Laughter)
173
528285
1039
我想至少是一个合理的解说
08:49
we think that at least
a reasonable hypothesis
174
529348
2731
就是, 要有创造力,
08:52
is that, to be creative,
175
532103
1161
08:53
you should have this weird dissociation
in your frontal lobe.
176
533288
2876
你需要跟你的大脑前叶达成这种奇怪的分离。
一个区域打开了,一个大的区域关闭了,
08:56
One area turns on,
and a big area shuts off,
177
536188
2524
因此你会感到不受局限的, 你愿意犯错,
08:58
so that you're not inhibited,
you're willing to make mistakes,
178
538736
2938
而不是老是去停止尝试
09:01
so that you're not constantly
shutting down
179
541698
2168
所有新创造的冲动。
09:03
all of these new generative impulses.
180
543890
1925
09:05
Now a lot of people know that music
is not always a solo activity --
181
545839
3445
很多人都知道音乐不总是一个单独的活动,
有的时候它是通过沟通合作完成的。
09:09
sometimes it's done communicatively.
182
549308
1720
所以下面的一个问题是:
09:11
The next question was:
183
551052
1184
09:12
What happens when musicians
are trading back and forth,
184
552260
2572
当音乐家们互相弹奏音乐时大脑是怎样活动的呢?
09:14
something called "trading fours,"
185
554856
1613
有种手法叫四小节交换,
09:16
which is something they do
normally in a jazz experiment.
186
556493
2823
这是种在爵士乐中常用的方法吗?
这是一个12小节的爵士。
09:19
So this is a 12-bar blues,
187
559340
1413
09:20
and I've broken it
down into four-bar groups,
188
560777
2109
这里我把它分成四小节一组,
09:22
so you would know how you would trade.
189
562910
1812
所以你知道怎么切换。
09:24
We brought a musician
into the scanner, same way,
190
564746
2286
我们用同样的办法把一个音乐人安排到扫描仪中,
让他记住这段旋律
09:27
had them memorize this melody
191
567056
1412
09:28
then had another musician
out in the control room
192
568492
2566
然后让另一个演奏者在控制室
跟他前后交互演奏。
09:31
trading back and forth interactively.
193
571082
1969
09:33
So this is a musician, Mike Pope,
194
573075
2624
这是那个音乐家,迈克·蒲柏Mike Pope,
09:35
one of the world's best bassists
and a fantastic piano player.
195
575723
3086
世界上最好的贝斯手, 一个奇妙的钢琴手。
09:38
(Music)
196
578833
6259
他现在在弹的这一段
09:45
He's now playing the piece
that we just saw
197
585116
2366
我们要看见的这一段
09:47
a little better than I wrote it.
198
587506
1730
只不过他弹得音乐比我写的音乐要好点。
09:49
(Video) CL: Mike, come on in.
199
589260
1766
(视频) CL:迈克Mile, 请进。 ( 男人:愿力量与你同在。)
09:51
Mike Pope: May the force be with you.
200
591050
1770
护士:你口袋里没其他东西吧,迈克Mike?
09:52
Nurse: Nothing in your pockets, Mike?
201
592844
1766
迈克·蒲柏Mike Pope: 没有, 我口袋里没东西。(护士:好的。)
09:54
MP: No. Nothing's in my pockets.
202
594634
1543
10:05
CL: You have to have the right
attitude to agree to do it.
203
605837
2778
CL:你答应做这个实验时需要有正确的态度。
(笑声)
10:08
(Laughter)
204
608639
1256
10:09
It's kind of fun, actually.
205
609919
1815
这其实挺好玩的。
10:11
(Music)
206
611758
1599
现在我们开始互相交互弹奏。
10:13
Now we're playing back and forth.
207
613381
1699
他在里面, 你可以看见他的腿在那儿。
10:15
He's in there.
You can see his legs up there.
208
615104
2212
10:17
(Music)
209
617340
1342
10:18
And then I'm in the control room here,
playing back and forth.
210
618706
3190
而我在控制室, 我们弹来弹去。
10:21
(Music)
211
621920
7000
(音乐)
10:31
(Music ends)
212
631390
1150
10:33
(Video) Mike Pope:
This is a pretty good representation
213
633260
3344
(视频)迈克·蒲柏Mike Pope:这很好的代表了
10:36
of what it's like.
214
636628
1784
演奏的状态。
10:38
And it's good that it's not too quick.
215
638436
2000
而且曲子不是太快,这很好。
10:40
The fact that we do it over and over again
216
640460
2579
我们之所以一遍又一遍地实验
是为了让你熟悉新的环境。
10:43
lets you acclimate to your surroundings.
217
643063
3270
那个头套对我来说,让我有点行动不便,
10:47
So the hardest thing for me
was the kinesthetic thing,
218
647293
2658
10:49
looking at my hands through two mirrors,
219
649975
3261
我通过两边的镜子
看见我的手,
10:53
laying on my back,
220
653260
1976
我仰面躺着
10:55
and not able to move at all
except for my hand.
221
655260
2678
除了手我完全不能动。
10:57
That was challenging.
222
657962
1872
这是很有挑战性的。
10:59
But again --
223
659858
1150
但是再说了,
有些时刻,真的,
11:02
there were moments, for sure --
224
662212
2786
有一些时刻
11:05
(Laughter)
225
665022
1001
11:06
there were moments of real, honest-to-God
musical interplay, for sure.
226
666047
4363
你会感到绝对发自内心地,诚挚地与音乐交流,真的。
CL:到此, 我来回顾一下。
11:11
CL: At this point,
I'll take a few moments.
227
671046
2002
你们到底看到了什么,
11:13
So what you're seeing here --
228
673072
1881
11:14
and I'm doing a cardinal sin in science,
229
674977
2077
而我在犯科学之大忌,
给你们展示初步的数据。
11:17
which is to show you preliminary data.
230
677078
1810
11:18
This is one subject's data.
231
678912
1753
这只是一个实验的数据。
11:20
This is, in fact, Mike Pope's data.
232
680689
1747
这是,事实上,迈克·蒲柏Mike Pope的数据。
11:22
So what am I showing you here?
233
682460
1476
所以我在这里给你看的是什么呢?
11:23
When he was trading fours with me,
improvising vs. memorized,
234
683960
4111
当他在跟我交换四小节的演奏时, 靠的是即兴不是记忆,
他的语言部分亮了起来,他的布洛卡区域
11:28
his language areas lit up,
his Broca's area,
235
688095
2749
11:30
in the inferior frontal gyrus on the left.
236
690868
2062
就是他左脑的前方下面的脑回。
11:32
He had it also homologous on the right.
237
692954
1909
其实他右脑边的同源也有同样的表现。
11:34
This is an area thought to be
involved in expressive communication.
238
694887
3159
这个区域被认为是有关于表达和交流的。
音乐是语言的想法,
11:38
This whole notion
that music is a language --
239
698070
2128
说到底大概是具有神经学基础的,
11:40
maybe there's a neurologic
basis to it after all,
240
700222
2299
11:42
and we can see it when two musicians
are having a musical conversation.
241
702545
3354
我们可以通过两个音乐人的音乐交流看到这结论。
11:45
So we've done this on eight subjects now,
242
705923
1973
我们已经对8个对象做了类似的实验,
11:47
and we're getting all the data together,
243
707920
1929
我们收集了所有的数据。
11:49
hopefully we'll have something
to say about it meaningfully.
244
709873
2825
希望我们可以能从中得出一些有意义的结论。
当我们说到即兴和语言时,我们还会想到什么呢?
11:52
Now when I think about improvisation
and the language, what's next?
245
712722
3243
说唱,当然, 说唱
11:55
Rap, of course, rap -- freestyle.
246
715989
2247
自由式说唱。
11:58
I've always been fascinated by freestyle.
247
718260
2747
我一直感到自由式说唱的形势很奇妙。
让我们在这里放一段录像。
12:01
And let's play this video.
248
721031
1513
12:02
(Video) Mos Def: Brown skin I be,
standing five-ten I be
249
722568
2838
(视频)摩斯·戴夫Mos Def:♫ ... 我是粽皮肤,我有五英尺十英寸高... brown skin I be, standing five-ten I be ♫
♫ 当我在你附近摇滚时Rockin' it when I be, in your vicinity ♫
12:05
Rockin' it when I be, in your vicinity
250
725430
2022
12:07
Whole-style synergy, recognize symmetry
251
727476
3020
♫ 整体协同,相互认识Whole-style synergy, recognize symmetry ♫
♫ 来吧试着伤害我,让我伤心欲绝Go and try to injure me, broke 'em down chemically ♫
12:10
Go and try to injure me,
broke 'em down chemically
252
730520
2334
12:12
Ain't the number 10 MC,
talk about how been I be
253
732878
2429
♫ 提及10 M.C.号码,谈到的正是我Ain't the number 10 M.C., talk about how been I be ♫
♫ 像肯尼迪的风格,在夜里10点到3点Styled it like Kennedy, late like a 10 to three ♫
12:15
Styled it like Kennedy,
late like a 10 to three
254
735331
2398
12:17
When I say when I be,
girls say bend that key cut
255
737753
2818
♫ 当我说我自己时,女孩们随声附和When I say when I be, girls say bend that key cut ♫
12:20
CL: So there's a lot of analogy
256
740595
1818
CL: 所以自由式说唱和爵士乐之间
12:22
between what takes place
in freestyle rap and jazz.
257
742437
2456
有很大的相似之处。
12:24
There are a lot of correlates
between the two forms of music,
258
744917
2917
事实上,我觉得在不同的时代,这两种音乐有很多相关的地方
。
12:27
I think, in different time periods,
in lot of ways,
259
747858
2447
在很多方面, 说唱实现了很多爵士曾经
12:30
rap serves the same social function
that jazz used to serve.
260
750329
2831
担当的社会功能。
所以我们该怎样科学地研究说唱呢?
12:33
So how do you study rap scientifically?
261
753184
1893
我同事觉得我很疯狂,
12:35
And my colleagues think I'm crazy,
but I think it's very viable.
262
755101
3135
但是我觉得这是可行的。
12:38
This is what you do:
263
758260
1227
这是你要做的:你请一个自由说唱的艺术家来
12:39
You have a freestyle artist come
and memorize a rap
264
759511
2747
记住你为他们写好的说唱词,
12:42
that you write for them,
265
762282
1221
他们以前从来没听说过这种说唱词,
12:43
that they've never heard before,
and then you have them freestyle.
266
763527
3432
然后你让他们自由发挥。
12:46
So I told my lab members
that I would rap for TED,
267
766983
2418
我告诉我实验室成员说我会在TED讲台说唱,
他们说:“不会吧,你不会真正说唱吧。”
12:49
and they said, "No, you won't."
268
769425
1642
然后我想--
12:51
And then I thought --
269
771091
1203
12:52
(Laughter)
270
772318
1316
(掌声)
12:53
(Applause)
271
773658
5726
这说唱词就在
12:59
But here's the thing.
272
779408
1280
13:00
With this big screen,
you can all rap with me. OK?
273
780712
2901
这大屏幕,你们可以跟我一起说唱,行吗?
13:03
So what we had them do
274
783637
1844
所以我们让他们做的是
13:05
was memorize this lower-left
sound icon, please.
275
785505
2596
请他们记住左下角的声音记号。
这是控制的条件。这是他们记住的说唱。
13:08
This is the control condition.
This is what they memorized.
276
788125
2893
计算机:♫ 记忆,即兴说唱Memory, thump. ♫
13:11
Computer: Memory, thump.
277
791042
2033
CL: ♫熟知一个重复节拍来动感说唱Thump of the beat in a known repeat ♫
13:13
CL: Thump of the beat in a known repeat
278
793099
2137
13:15
Rhythm and rhyme, they make me complete
279
795260
2976
♫节奏和韵律使我能完美说唱Rhythm and rhyme, they make me complete ♫
13:18
The climb is sublime when I'm on the mic
280
798260
2096
♫当我即兴说唱时,我就如同攀登上了高峰一样兴奋The climb is sublime when I'm on the mic ♫
13:20
Spittin' rhymes that hit you
like a lightning strike
281
800380
2556
♫ 这押韵的即兴表演就如同你被雷击一样Spittin' rhymes that hit you like a lightning strike ♫
13:22
Computer: Search.
282
802960
1164
♫我在这永恒追寻中寻求真理I search for the truth in this eternal quest ♫
13:24
CL: I search for the truth
in this eternal quest
283
804148
2344
♫ 我的激情可不等同于我的时尚,大家可能看出我不怎么打扮My passion's not fashion, you can see how I'm dressed ♫
13:26
My passion's not fashion,
you can see how I'm dressed
284
806516
2730
♫ 在我脑海中有些胡思乱语Psychopathic words, in my head appear ♫
13:29
Psychopathic words in my head appear
285
809270
1966
13:31
Whisper these lyrics only I can hear
286
811260
2238
♫ 这些微妙的细语只有我能理解Whisper these lyrics only I can hear ♫
13:33
Computer: Art.
287
813522
1172
13:34
CL: The art of discovering
and that which is hovering
288
814718
2630
♫ 对艺术的探索我还在徘徊的路上The art of discovering and that which is hovering ♫
♫ 在未知的内心深处Inside the mind of those unconfined ♫
13:37
Inside the mind of those unconfined
289
817372
1864
13:39
All of these words keep
pouring out like rain
290
819260
2976
♫ 所有这些轻声细语像才思泉涌一样不断地迸出All of these words keep pouring out like rain ♫
13:42
I need a mad scientist to check my brain
291
822260
2735
♫我需要一个疯狂的科学家来了解我才思泉涌的大脑I need a mad scientist to check my brain ♫
13:45
Computer: Stop.
292
825019
1307
(掌声)
13:46
(Applause)
293
826350
7000
我向你们保证,这不会再发生了。
13:55
I guarantee you
that will never happen again.
294
835530
2174
13:57
(Laughter)
295
837728
1941
(笑声)
13:59
So now, what's great
about these free-stylers,
296
839693
2188
这些自由式说唱家的伟大之处是
14:01
they will get cued different words.
297
841905
1862
你给他们不同的说唱词,他们也能演绎。
14:03
They don't know what's coming,
298
843791
1444
他们不知道你给他们什么样的说唱词,但是他们听了以后,会马上即兴发挥。
14:05
but they'll hear something off the cuff.
299
845259
1916
请按一下右边那个声音图标。
14:07
Go hit that right sound icon,
300
847199
1409
我们会给他们方框里的这些词'喜欢like', '不not','头head'。
14:08
there will be cued three square words:
like, not and head.
301
848632
2720
他们不知道接下来的词会是什么。
14:11
He doesn't know what's coming.
Computer: Like.
302
851376
2154
自由式说唱者:♫ 我有点像那些自由人士I'm like some kind of Freedom Beings ♫
14:13
Freestyler: I'm like some kind of
303
853554
1770
♫ 外星人,天文奇观[unclear] extraterrestrial, celestial scene ♫
14:15
extraterrestrial, celestial scene
304
855348
2229
14:17
Back in the days, I used to sit
in pyramids and meditate
305
857601
2837
♫ 回首往事,我曾坐在金字塔边冥想Back in the days, I used to sit in pyramids and meditate ♫
14:20
With two microphones -- Computer: Head
306
860462
2173
♫ 在我头上盘旋着2个麦克风With two microphones hovering over my head ♫
14:22
hovering over my head
307
862659
1334
♫ 看看我是否能听到一些声音,即兴说唱See if I could still listen, spittin' off the sound ♫
14:24
See if I could still listen,
308
864017
1363
14:25
spittin' off the sound
309
865404
1287
14:26
See what you grinning
310
866715
1185
♫ 看着大家在嬉笑See what you grinning ♫
14:27
I teach the children
in the back of the classroom
311
867924
2425
♫ 我在教室后面教学生I teach the children in the back of the classroom ♫
14:30
About the message of apocalyptical
312
870373
2397
♫ 有关启示论的福音About the message of apocalyptical ♫
14:32
Computer: Not.
313
872794
1160
14:33
Not really though,
'cause I've got to keep it simple
314
873978
2628
♫ 不是说真的,因为我要使它变简单Not really though, cuz I've got to keep it simple ♫
14:36
instrumental
315
876630
1606
♫ 乐器[unclear] instrumental ♫
14:38
Detrimental playing Super Mario
316
878260
2976
♫ 打超级玛利游戏有害Detrimental playing Super Mario ♫
14:41
boxes [unclear] hip hop
317
881260
3153
♫ 音乐盒子 嘻哈Hip Hop[unclear] boxes [unclear] hip hop ♫
14:44
Computer: Stop.
318
884437
1420
14:45
CL: It's an incredible
thing that's taking place.
319
885881
2311
CL: 令人难以置信的事情又发生了。
从神经学角度来讲,这些事情是有显著意义的。
14:48
It's doing something
neurologically remarkable.
320
888216
2226
无论你是否喜欢音乐,
14:50
Whether or not you like
the music is irrelevant.
321
890466
2316
仅从创造性的角度来说, 这也是非凡的。
14:52
Creatively speaking,
it's just a phenomenal thing.
322
892806
2401
这一小段录像记录了我们怎样用扫描仪的。
14:55
This is a short video
of how we do this in a scanner.
323
895231
2516
(笑声)
14:57
[fMRI of Hip-Hop Rap]
324
897771
1515
14:59
(Laughter)
325
899310
1136
(视频) CL: 我们和伊曼纽尔Emmanuel在一起。
15:00
(Video) CL: We're here with Emmanuel.
326
900470
1774
CL:顺便提一句, 这是从扫描仪里记录的。
15:02
CL: That was recorded
in the scanner, by the way.
327
902268
2306
(视频) CL: 这是伊曼纽尔Emmanuel 在扫描仪中的视频。
15:04
(Video) CL: That's Emmanuel
in the scanner.
328
904598
2109
他仅记住了一段韵律。
15:07
He's just memorized a rhyme for us.
329
907260
2000
15:10
[Control Condition Memorized Verses]
330
910302
2683
伊曼纽尔Emmanuel: ♫ 最棒的动感说唱不需要重复Top of the beat with no repeat ♫
15:13
Emmanuel: Top of the beat with no repeat
331
913009
2227
15:15
Rhythm and rhyme make me complete
332
915260
2976
♫ 节奏和韵律使我能完美地说唱Rhythm and rhyme make me complete ♫
15:18
Climb is sublime when I'm on the mic
333
918260
2976
♫ 当我即兴说唱时,我就如同攀登上了高峰一样兴奋Climb is sublime when I'm on the mic ♫
15:21
Spittin' rhymes that'll hit you
like a lightning strike
334
921260
2774
♫ 这押韵的即兴表演就如同你被雷击一样Spittin' rhymes that'll hit you like a lightning strike ♫
♫ 我在这永恒追寻中寻求真理I search for the truth in this eternal quest ♫
15:24
Computer: Search.
335
924058
1158
15:25
I search for the truth
in this eternal quest
336
925240
2260
♫ 我的激情可不等同于我的时尚,大家可能看出我不怎么打扮I'm passing on fashion; you can see how I'm dressed ♫
15:27
I'm passing on fashion;
you can see how I'm dressed
337
927524
2576
CL:好的, 就在这里结束吧。你们看见他的大脑发生了什么呢?
15:30
CL: I'm going to stop that there;
so what do we see in his brain?
338
930124
3063
这其实是四个说唱家的大脑记录。
15:33
This is four rappers' brains.
339
933211
1658
15:34
And we do see language areas lighting up,
340
934893
2036
我们看见了什么?我们看见了语言部分很活跃,
15:36
but then, eyes closed --
341
936953
1283
但是当他们闭了眼睛,
15:38
when you are freestyling vs. memorizing,
342
938260
3313
自由式发挥而不是单纯记忆时,
15:41
you've got major visual areas lighting up.
343
941597
2154
你看见视觉区域也活跃起来。
15:43
You've got major cerebellar activity,
which is involved in motor coordination.
344
943775
3689
你看见大量协调运动的小脑活动。
如果将有创造性的活动和单纯记忆的活动来比较
15:47
You have heightened brain activity
when you're doing a comparable task,
345
947488
3356
大脑活动在做创造性活动时更为活跃。
15:50
when that one task is creative
and the other task is memorized.
346
950868
2958
15:53
It's very preliminary,
but I think it's kind of cool.
347
953850
2784
这还是很初步的研究, 但是我觉得很酷。
总之,我们还有很多问题可以引申。
15:56
To conclude, we've got
a lot of questions to ask,
348
956658
2308
15:58
and like I said, we'll ask questions
here, not answer them.
349
958990
2905
正如我说的, 我们到这里来是提出问题的, 而不是回答问题的。
16:01
But we want to get at the root
of what is creative genius neurologically,
350
961919
3451
但是我们想从神经学的角度来了解创造天才的真相。
我认为, 用这些手法,我们跟目标更接近了。
16:05
and I think, with these methods,
we're getting close.
351
965394
2557
16:07
And I think, hopefully
in the next 10, 20 years,
352
967975
2303
我希望在今后的10,20年间,
你会看见真正有意义的研究,
16:10
you'll see real, meaningful studies
353
970302
1897
它是说科学要追赶上艺术,
16:12
that say science has to catch up to art,
354
972223
3013
16:15
and maybe we're starting now to get there.
355
975260
2388
也许我们可以从现在开始追赶这个目标。
16:17
Thank you for your time, I appreciate it.
356
977672
1998
谢谢你们费时听我的演讲,我很感激。
16:19
(Applause)
357
979694
4008
(鼓掌)
New videos
关于本网站
这个网站将向你介绍对学习英语有用的YouTube视频。你将看到来自世界各地的一流教师教授的英语课程。双击每个视频页面上显示的英文字幕,即可从那里播放视频。字幕会随着视频的播放而同步滚动。如果你有任何意见或要求,请使用此联系表与我们联系。