Fredy Peccerelli: A forensic anthropologist who brings closure for the “disappeared"

80,422 views ・ 2015-01-08

TED


请双击下面的英文字幕来播放视频。

翻译人员: Thomas Li 校对人员: Hong Li
00:12
Guatemala is recovering from a 36-year armed conflict.
0
12917
3168
危地马拉正在从一场 持续了36年的武装冲突中恢复。
00:16
A conflict that was fought during the Cold War.
1
16085
2531
一场在冷战时期便发生的冲突。
00:18
It was really just a small leftist insurgency
2
18616
4053
这本是一次左翼分子发起的 小规模叛乱,
00:22
and a devastating response by the state.
3
22669
3167
然而政府的反应却是毁灭性的。
00:25
What we have as a result is 200,000 civilian victims,
4
25836
2842
我们掌握的数据显示 有20万平民受害者,
00:28
160,000 of those killed in the communities:
5
28678
3654
其中有16万人被集体杀害;
00:32
small children, men, women, the elderly even.
6
32332
4096
小孩,男人,女人,甚至是老年人。
00:36
And then we have about 40,000 others, the missing,
7
36428
3430
另外还有4万人失踪,
00:39
the ones we're still looking for today.
8
39858
2320
直到今天我们仍然在寻找。
00:42
We call them the Desaparecidos.
9
42178
2560
我们管他们叫失踪者(西班牙语)。
00:44
Now, 83 percent of the victims are Mayan victims,
10
44738
2865
83%的受害者是玛雅人,
00:47
victims that are the descendants
11
47603
2405
他们是中美洲地区
00:50
of the original inhabitants of Central America.
12
50008
2736
原住民的后代。
00:52
And only about 17 percent are of European descent.
13
52744
3507
只有17%是欧洲后裔。
00:56
But the most important thing here is that
14
56251
2057
然而最重要的是
00:58
the very people who are supposed to defend us, the police, the military,
15
58308
6021
那些本应该保护我们的人 ——警察,军队,
01:04
are the ones that committed most of the crimes.
16
64329
2666
犯下了绝大部分的罪行。
01:08
Now the families, they want information.
17
68035
3292
现在家属想要了解真相。
01:11
They want to know what happened.
18
71335
1567
他们想知道发生了什么。
01:12
They want the bodies of their loved ones.
19
72902
2190
他们想要回所爱之人的遗体。
01:15
But most of all, what they want is they want you,
20
75092
3247
但最重要的是,他们想要每一个人,
01:18
they want everyone to know that their loved ones did nothing wrong.
21
78339
4056
包括你在内, 都了解他们的家人是无辜的。
01:23
Now, my case was that my father received death threats in 1980.
22
83515
5309
我父亲在1980年收到了死亡威胁。
01:29
And we left.
23
89203
1380
所以我们离开了。
01:30
We left Guatemala and we came here.
24
90583
1754
我们离开危地马拉来到这里。
01:32
So I grew up in New York,
25
92337
1206
所以我是在纽约长大的,
01:33
I grew up in Brooklyn as a matter of fact, and I went to New Utrecht High School
26
93543
3780
更具体点说是在布鲁克林, 我上的是新乌特勒支高中,
01:37
and I graduated from Brooklyn College.
27
97323
1818
然后从布鲁克林学院毕业。
01:39
The only thing was that
28
99141
1566
然而在当时
01:40
I really didn't know what was happening in Guatemala.
29
100707
3871
我真的不了解危地马拉在发生什么。
01:44
I didn't care for it; it was too painful.
30
104578
2869
我没有去关注它;这太痛苦了。
01:47
But it wasn't till 1995 that I decided to do something about it.
31
107447
4307
直到1995年我才决定要做些什么。
01:51
So I went back.
32
111754
1154
所以我回去了。
01:52
I went back to Guatemala, to look for the bodies,
33
112908
3580
我回到危地马拉,去找寻那些遗体,
01:56
to understand what happened and to look for part of myself as well.
34
116488
4473
去找寻过去发生了什么, 同时也找寻自我的一部分。
02:02
The way we work is that we give people information.
35
122051
3363
我们为人们提供信息。
02:05
We talk to the family members and we let them choose.
36
125414
2970
我们和家属们交谈,让他们做出选择。
02:08
We let them decide to tell us the stories,
37
128384
3230
让他们决定(是否) 告诉我们他们的故事,
02:11
to tell us what they saw,
38
131614
1852
描述他们的所见所闻,
02:13
to tell us about their loved ones.
39
133466
2128
描述自己的爱人。
02:15
And even more important,
40
135594
1286
更加重要的是,
02:16
we let them choose to give us a piece of themselves.
41
136880
3998
我们也让他们选择 是否愿意贡献自己的一部分(指DNA)。
02:20
A piece, an essence, of who they are.
42
140878
2476
关于他们身份的一段信息,一些精华。
02:23
And that DNA is what we're going to compare
43
143354
2257
我们将这些DNA
02:25
to the DNA that comes from the skeletons.
44
145611
2720
与骸骨里提取出来进行比对。
02:28
While we're doing that, though, we're looking for the bodies.
45
148331
3055
我们一边比对, 一边继续寻找遗体。
02:31
And these are skeletons by now,
46
151386
1988
现在(遗体)应该只剩下骸骨了,
02:33
most of these crimes happened 32 years ago.
47
153374
2906
因为绝大部分罪行都发生在32年前。
02:36
When we find the grave,
48
156280
1246
我们找到坟墓,
02:37
we take out the dirt and eventually clean the body, document it, and exhume it.
49
157526
4130
移走泥土,清洗骸骨, 登记注册,挖掘出来。
02:41
We literally bring the skeleton out of the ground.
50
161656
3439
我们真的会把骸骨从地下挖出来。
02:45
Once we have those bodies, though, we take them back to the city, to our lab,
51
165095
4142
挖出骸骨后,我们把它们带回来, 带到我们的实验室,
02:49
and we begin a process of trying to understand mainly two things:
52
169237
3084
然后开始调查两件事:
02:52
One is how people died.
53
172321
2293
一是人是怎么死的。
02:54
So here you see a gunshot wound to the back of the head
54
174614
3104
比方说这个人后脑有一处枪伤
02:57
or a machete wound, for example.
55
177718
2649
或者是被刀砍伤。
03:00
The other thing we want to understand is who they are.
56
180367
3326
二是这些人的身份。
03:03
Whether it's a baby,
57
183693
3459
是一个婴儿,
03:07
or an adult.
58
187152
1657
还是一个成人。
03:08
Whether it's a woman or a man.
59
188809
2140
是女人还是男人。
03:10
But when we're done with that analysis
60
190949
1783
当我们完成这(两)个分析后
03:12
what we'll do is we'll take a small fragment of the bone
61
192732
2726
我们取下一小块骨头碎片
03:15
and we'll extract DNA from it.
62
195458
2814
提取出DNA。
03:18
We'll take that DNA
63
198272
1095
将这段DNA
03:19
and then we'll compare it with the DNA of the families, of course.
64
199367
4760
与之前那些家庭提供的DNA作比对。
03:24
The best way to explain this to you is by showing you two cases.
65
204127
3644
为了便于理解,我给大家举两个例子。
03:27
The first is the case of the military diary.
66
207771
2547
第一个例子来自军事日志。
03:30
Now this is a document that was smuggled out of somewhere in 1999.
67
210318
4675
这份日志是在1999年 从某处私运过来的。
03:34
And what you see there is the state following individuals,
68
214993
4680
上面记录的是政府在 监视部分人的情况,
03:39
people that, like you, wanted to change their country,
69
219673
3931
这些人,和你们一样, 是想要改变这个国家的人,
03:43
and they jotted everything down.
70
223604
2880
政府会把这些人的一切都记录下来。
03:46
And one of the things that they wrote down is when they executed them.
71
226484
4250
其中一条就是何时处决他们。
03:50
Inside that yellow rectangle, you see a code,
72
230734
2981
在这个黄色方框中,有一个代码,
03:53
it's a secret code: 300.
73
233715
2311
这是一个秘密代码:300。
03:56
And then you see a date.
74
236026
1497
后面还有一个日期。
03:57
The 300 means "executed" and the date means when they were executed.
75
237523
3673
300表示“被处决”,而那个日期 则是执行的日期。
04:01
Now that's going to come into play in a second.
76
241196
3388
这两条信息我们马上会用到。
04:05
What we did is we conducted an exhumation in 2003,
77
245064
3625
我们调查了2003年的一次出土,
04:08
where we exhumed 220 bodies from 53 graves in a military base.
78
248689
4841
当时我们从一个军事基地的 53个坟墓里挖出了220具遗体。
04:14
Grave 9, though, matched the family of Sergio Saul Linares.
79
254640
3995
第9号坟墓(的骸骨)和 塞尔吉奥·索尔·利纳瑞斯的家庭匹配上了。
04:18
Now Sergio was a professor at the university.
80
258635
2726
塞尔吉奥是一名大学教授。
04:21
He graduted from Iowa State University
81
261361
2391
毕业于爱荷华州立大学,
04:23
and went back to Guatemala to change his country.
82
263752
2377
然后回到危地马拉去改变他的国家。
04:26
And he was captured on February 23, 1984.
83
266129
3874
他于1984年2月23日被捕。
04:30
And if you can see there, he was executed on March 29, 1984,
84
270003
4089
你如果看这里会知道, 他是1984年3月29日被处决的,
04:34
which was incredible.
85
274092
1566
这真的令人不可思议。
04:35
We had the body, we had the family's information and their DNA,
86
275658
3022
我们有骸骨,我们有家庭提供的信息 和他们的DNA,
04:38
and now we have documents that told us exactly what happened.
87
278680
3346
现在我们手里还有文件, 记录了事情的真相。
04:42
But most important is about two weeks later,
88
282026
3103
但最重要的是,两周之后,
04:45
we go another hit, another match
89
285129
2687
我们找到了另一个匹配的结果,
04:47
from the same grave to Amancio Villatoro.
90
287816
4801
来自同一个坟墓, 和阿曼西奥·比利亚托罗(的DNA)匹配。
04:52
The DNA of that body also matched the DNA of that family.
91
292617
2746
来自残骸的DNA和 他家庭成员的DNA相匹配。
04:55
And then we noticed that he was also in the diary.
92
295363
3369
然后我们发现他也在日志中出现过。
04:58
But it was amazing to see that he was also executed on March 29, 1984.
93
298732
5171
令人吃惊的是,我们发现 他也是在1984年3月29日被处决的。
05:03
So that led us to think, hmm, how many bodies were in the grave?
94
303903
3846
我们开始思考, 这个坟墓里到底有几具遗体?
05:08
Six.
95
308226
1187
6具。
05:09
So then we said, how many people were executed on March 29, 1984?
96
309413
6677
又有多少人是在 1984年3月29日被处决的?
05:18
That's right, six as well.
97
318716
2318
对的,也是6个人。
05:21
So we have Juan de Dios, Hugo, Moises and Zoilo.
98
321034
5692
所以还有胡安·德·迪奥斯,雨果, 莫伊塞斯和索伊洛。
05:26
All of them executed on the same date, all captured at different locations
99
326726
3848
他们都在同一天被处决—— 尽管他们是在不同的地方,
05:30
and at different moments.
100
330574
1754
不同的时刻被捕的——
05:32
All put in that grave.
101
332328
1164
但都被放进了那个坟墓。
05:33
The only thing we needed now was the DNA of those four families
102
333492
3144
我们现在唯一需要的 便是那四个家庭的DNA。
05:36
So we went and we looked for them and we found them.
103
336636
3245
所以我们立刻出发,找到了他们。
05:39
And we identified those six bodies and gave them back to the families.
104
339881
3963
然后我们弄清了这6具遗体的身份, 并归还给了他们的家属。
05:44
The other case I want to tell you about
105
344344
2439
我想告诉你们的另一个案例,
05:46
is that of a military base called CREOMPAZ.
106
346783
4088
发生在一处叫 “克雷欧姆帕斯”的军事基地。
05:50
It actually means, "to believe in peace," but the acronym really means
107
350871
4611
这个短语的意思是,“相信和平” , 然而它的全称实际上是
05:55
Regional Command Center for Peacekeeping Operations.
108
355482
3019
“维和行动地区指挥中心”。
05:58
And this is where the Guatemalan military trains peacekeepers from other countries,
109
358501
4990
来自其他国家的维和人员 在这里接受危地马拉军方的训练,
06:03
the ones that serve with the U.N.
110
363491
2841
这些维和人员曾被联合国
06:06
and go to countries like Haiti and the Congo.
111
366332
2763
派往海地和刚果等国执行任务。
06:09
Well, we have testimony that said that within this military base,
112
369095
3513
有证词表明,在这个军事基地里,
06:12
there were bodies, there were graves.
113
372608
2105
有遗体,有坟墓。
06:14
So we went in there with a search warrant and about two hours after we went in,
114
374713
3855
所以我们带着搜查令去了, 两个小时之后,
06:18
we found the first of 84 graves, a total of 533 bodies.
115
378568
5624
我们找到了84个坟墓, 以及总共533具遗体。
06:24
Now, if you think about that,
116
384192
2637
大家想象一下,
06:26
peacekeepers being trained on top of bodies.
117
386829
3337
维和人员踩在尸体上受训。
06:30
It's very ironic.
118
390166
1799
这场景多么讽刺。
06:33
But the bodies -- face down, most of them, hands tied behind their backs,
119
393545
5257
但那些遗体——绝大部分脸朝下, 手被绑在身后,
06:38
blindfolded, all types of trauma --
120
398802
2624
眼睛被蒙起来,伤痕累累——
06:41
these were people who were defenseless who were being executed.
121
401426
3079
明显就是在毫无抵抗能力的 情况下被处决的。
06:44
People that 533 families are looking for.
122
404505
4025
有533个家庭正在寻找他们。
06:48
So we're going to focus on Grave 15.
123
408530
2612
我们重点看一下15号坟墓。
06:51
Grave 15, what we noticed, was a grave full of women and children,
124
411142
3696
我们发现15号坟墓,里面全是妇女和儿童,
06:54
63 of them.
125
414838
2203
总共63个人。
06:57
And that immediately made us think,
126
417041
3228
我们当时都震惊了,
07:00
my goodness, where is there a case like this?
127
420269
2275
我的天呐,真是前所未见。
07:02
When I got to Guatemala in 1995,
128
422544
2693
1995年,当我抵达危地马拉的时候,
07:05
I heard of a case of a massacre that happened on May 14, 1982,
129
425237
4651
我听说了一场 发生在1982年5月14日的大屠杀,
07:09
where the army came in, killed the men,
130
429888
3133
军队攻进来,杀光了男人,
07:13
and took the women and children in helicopters to an unknown location.
131
433021
4235
然后把女人和孩子 用直升机运到了别处。
07:18
Well, guess what?
132
438026
942
07:18
The clothing from this grave matched the clothing from the region
133
438968
4193
猜猜发生了什么?
这个坟墓里的衣服 和那个地区的服饰匹配上了,
07:23
where these people were taken from,
134
443161
1730
就是刚才说的那些人,
07:24
where these women and children were taken from.
135
444891
2383
那些被带走的女人和 小孩所居住的区域。
07:27
So we conducted some DNA analysis, and guess what?
136
447274
2472
之后我们进行了DNA测试,
07:30
We identified Martina Rojas and Manuel Chen.
137
450767
2267
识别出了玛蒂娜·罗哈斯和曼纽尔·陈。
07:33
Both of them disappeared in that case, and now we could prove it.
138
453034
3075
他俩都在那次事件中失踪了, 而现在我们可以证实这一点。
07:36
We have physical evidence that proves that this happened
139
456109
3010
我们有实体证据证明
这些人都被带到了这个基地。
07:39
and that those people were taken to this base.
140
459119
2741
07:41
Now, Manuel Chen was three years old.
141
461860
3258
曼纽尔·陈当时只有3岁。
07:45
His mother went to the river to wash clothes, and she left him with a neighbor.
142
465118
4867
她妈妈到河边去洗衣服, 把他交给邻居照看。
07:49
That's when the army came
143
469985
1704
就是在那时军队来了,
07:51
and that's when he was taken away in a helicopter and never seen again
144
471689
3340
他被一架直升机带走, 再也没有出现过,
07:55
until we found him in Grave 15.
145
475029
1979
直到我们在15号坟墓里找到了他。
07:57
So now with science, with archaeology, with anthropology, with genetics,
146
477008
5718
在考古学、人类学、 遗传学等科学的帮助下,
08:02
what we're doing is, we're giving a voice to the voiceless.
147
482726
3234
我们能让弱势群体发出自己的声音。
08:05
But we're doing more than that.
148
485960
1685
但我们并未止步于此。
08:07
We're actually providing evidence for trials,
149
487645
2165
我们为审判提供证据,
08:09
like the genocide trial that happened last year in Guatemala
150
489810
3521
比如去年在危地马拉 举行的种族屠杀审判,
08:13
where General Ríos Montt was found guilty of genocide and sentenced to 80 years.
151
493332
4810
其中里奥斯·蒙特将军 因种族屠杀罪被判刑80年。
08:18
So I came here to tell you today that this is happening everywhere --
152
498142
3644
所以我今天来是想告诉大家 这样的事情仍在发生——
08:21
it's happening in Mexico right in front of us today --
153
501787
2724
就在我们眼皮底下,就在墨西哥——
08:24
and we can't let it go on anymore.
154
504511
1940
而我们必须行动起来。
08:26
We have to now come together and decide
155
506451
2901
我们必须团结一致,痛下决心,
08:29
that we're not going to have any more missing.
156
509352
2221
不要再让家破人亡的惨剧发生。
08:31
So no more missing, guys.
157
511573
1192
不要再有惨剧了,朋友们。
08:32
Okay? No more missing.
158
512765
2711
好吗?不要再有惨剧了。
08:35
Thank you.
159
515476
1243
谢谢。
08:36
(Applause)
160
516719
3216
(掌声)
关于本网站

这个网站将向你介绍对学习英语有用的YouTube视频。你将看到来自世界各地的一流教师教授的英语课程。双击每个视频页面上显示的英文字幕,即可从那里播放视频。字幕会随着视频的播放而同步滚动。如果你有任何意见或要求,请使用此联系表与我们联系。

https://forms.gle/WvT1wiN1qDtmnspy7


This website was created in October 2020 and last updated on June 12, 2025.

It is now archived and preserved as an English learning resource.

Some information may be out of date.

隐私政策

eng.lish.video

Developer's Blog