We don't "move on" from grief. We move forward with it | Nora McInerny | TED

Prevodilac: Dragana Savanovic Lektor: Ivana Krivokuća

So, 2014 was a big year for me.

Godina 2014. je bila važna za mene.

Do you ever have that,

Da li ste ikada imali tu

just like a big year, like a banner year?

veliku, važnu godinu?

For me, it went like this:

U mom slučaju, bilo je ovako:

October 3, I lost my second pregnancy.

Trećeg oktobra sam izgubila drugu bebu.

And then October 8, my dad died of cancer.

Onda mi je 8. oktobra tata umro od raka.

And then on November 25, my husband Aaron died

A onda je 25. novembra umro moj muž Aron

after three years with stage-four glioblastoma,

nakon tri godine borbe sa glioblastomom u 4. stadijumu,

which is just a fancy word for brain cancer.

što je samo fensi reč za tumor mozga.

So, I'm fun.

Dakle, baš sam zabavna.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

People love to invite me out all the time.

Ljudi stalno vole da me zovu da izađemo.

Packed social life.

Društveni život prebukiran.

Usually, when I talk about this period of my life,

Uglavnom, kada pričam o ovom periodu svog života,

the reaction I get is essentially:

reakcija koju dobijem je u suštini:

(Sighs)

(Uzdah)

"I can't -- I can't imagine."

„Ne mogu - ne mogu da zamislim."

But I do think you can.

Ali mislim da možete.

I think you can.

Mislim da možete.

And I think that you should

I mislim da treba

because, someday, it's going to happen to you.

jer, jednog dana, i vama će se to desiti.

Maybe not these specific losses in this specific order or at this speed,

Možda ne baš ovi gubici ovim redom i ovom brzinom,

but like I said, I'm very fun

ali kao što rekoh, ja sam zabavna

and the research that I have seen will stun you:

i istraživanje koje sam videla će vas zapanjiti:

everyone you love has a 100 percent chance of dying.

svi koje volite imaju 100% šanse da umru.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

And that's why you came to TED.

I zato ste došli na TED.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

(Applause)

(Aplauz)

So, since all of this loss happened,

Pošto sam doživela sve ove gubitke,

I've made it a career to talk about death and loss,

ostvarila sam karijeru pričanja o smrti i gubitku,

not just my own, because it's pretty easy to recap,

ne samo o sopstvenim, jer ih je prilično lako rezimirati,

but the losses and tragedies that other people have experienced.

već i gubicima i tragedijama koje su drugi ljudi iskusili.

It's a niche, I have to say.

Moram da kažem da je to branša.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

It's a small niche, and I wish I made more money, but ...

Uska branša, i volela bih da više zarađujem, ali...

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

I've written some very uplifting books,

Napisala sam neke vrlo stimulativne knjige,

host a very uplifting podcast, I started a little nonprofit.

vodim vrlo stimulativni podkast, osnovala malu neprofitnu organizaciju.

I'm just trying to do what I can

Pokušavam da uradim sve što mogu

to make more people comfortable with the uncomfortable,

da se pobrinem da je ljudima prijatno u neprijatnoj situaciji,

and grief is so uncomfortable.

a tuga zbog nečije smrti je jako neprijatna.

It's so uncomfortable, especially if it's someone else's grief.

Jako je neprijatna, pogotovo ako je tuđa tuga.

So part of that work is this group that I started with my friend Moe,

Deo tog posla je jedna grupa koju sam osnovala sa prijateljicom Mo,

who is also a widow;

koja je takođe udovica;

we call it the Hot Young Widows Club.

zovemo je Klub zgodnih mladih udovica.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

And it's real, we have membership cards

To je pravi klub, imamo članske karte

and T-shirts.

i majice.

And when your person dies, your husband, wife, girlfriend, boyfriend,

Kada vam neko umre, muž, žena, devojka, dečko,

literally don't care if you were married,

bukvalno nije važno jeste li bili u braku,

your friends and your family are just going to look around

prijatelji i porodica će tražiti

through friends of friends of friends of friends

među prijateljima prijateljevih prijatelja

dok ne nađu nekog ko je prošao kroz nešto slično,

until they find someone who's gone through something similar,

i onda vas gurnu jedno drugom

and then they'll push you towards each other

so you can talk amongst yourselves and not get your sad on other people.

kako biste mogli da popričate i ne prenosite vašu tugu na druge.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

So that's what we do.

To mi radimo.

It's just a series of small groups,

Imamo niz malih grupa

where men, women, gay, straight, married, partnered,

u kojima muškarci, žene, oni koji su gej, strejt, u braku ili sa partnerom

can talk about their dead person,

mogu pričati o osobi koja je umrla

and say the things

i reći stvari

that the other people in their lives aren't ready or willing to hear yet.

koje drugi ljudi u njihovom životu još uvek nisu spremni ili voljni da čuju.

Huge range of conversations.

Razgovori su raznovrsni.

Na primer: „Muž mi je umro pre dve nedelje,

Like, "My husband died two weeks ago,

a ne prestajem da mislim o seksu, je li to normalno?“

I can't stop thinking about sex, is that normal?"

Yeah.

Da.

"What if it's one of the Property Brothers?"

„Šta ako je u pitanju jedan brat iz emisije Property Brothers?“

Less normal, but I'll accept it.

Manje normalno, ali prihvatam.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Things like, "Look, when I'm out in public and I see old people holding hands,

Ili stvari kao: „Kada sam u javnosti i vidim starce kako se drže za ruke,

couples who have clearly been together for decades,

parove koji su očigledno zajedno decenijama,

and then I look at them and I imagine

kada ih vidim i zamislim

all of the things they've been through together,

sve stvari koje su zajedno prošli,

one dobre i one loše,

the good things, the bad things,

svađe oko toga ko će izneti smeće...

the arguments they've had over who should take out the trash ...

I just find my heart filled with rage."

srce mi se prosto ispuni besom.“

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

And that example is personal to me.

Pronalazim se u ovom primeru.

Most of the conversations that we have in the group

Većina razgovora koje vodimo u grupi

can and will just stay amongst ourselves,

mogu i ostaće među nama,

but there are things that we talk about

ali ima stvari o kojima pričamo

that the rest of the world -- the world that is grief-adjacent

od kojih ostatak sveta - sveta kojem je tuga bliska

but not yet grief-stricken --

a koji još nije pogođen tugom -

could really benefit from hearing.

može da ima koristi.

And if you can't tell,

A ako niste shvatili,

I'm only interested in / capable of unscientific studies,

zanimaju me, tj. sposobna sam samo za nenaučna istraživanja,

so what I did was go to The Hot Young Widows Club

pa sam otišla u Klub zgodnih mladih udovica

and say, "Hello, friends, remember when your person died?" They did.

i rekla: „Zdravo, prijatelji, sećate se kada vam je neko umro?“ Sećali su se.

"Do you remember all the things people said to you?"

„Sećate se svih stvari koje su vam ljudi rekli?“

„O, da.“

"Oh, yeah."

„Koje ste najviše mrzeli?“

"Which ones did you hate the most?"

Dobila sam mnogo komentara i odgovora, ljudi kažu mnogo toga,

I got a lot of comments, lot of answers, people say a lot of things,

ali dva odgovora su se brzo istakla.

but two rose to the top pretty quickly.

"Moving on."

„Nastaviti sa životom.“

Now, since 2014,

Od 2014. godine,

I will tell you I have remarried a very handsome man named Matthew,

reći ću vam da sam se ponovo udala za vrlo zgodnog muškarca Metjua,

we have four children in our blended family,

i imamo četvoro dece u našoj spojenoj porodici,

we live in the suburbs of Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA.

živimo u predgrađu Mineapolisa, u Minesoti, u SAD-u.

We have a rescue dog.

Udomili smo psa.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

I drive a minivan,

Vozim mini kombi,

like the kind where doors open and I don't even touch them.

onaj kojem se otvaraju vrata bez dodira.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Like, by any "mezhure," life is good.

Dakle, po svim merilima (mezhure), život je dobar.

Takođe, nikad nisam tako rekla „merilima“ (mezhure).

I've also never said "mezhure," I've never once said it that way.

Nikad nisam to tako rekla.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

I don't know where that came from.

Ne znam odakle mi to.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

I've never heard anyone else say it that way.

Nikad nisam čula da neko to tako kaže.

It looks like it should be said that way,

Izgleda kao da bi trebalo tako da se kaže,

and that's why the English language is trash, so ...

i zato je engleski jezik glupost...

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

So impressed with anyone who, like, speaks it

Impresionirana sam bilo kim ko ga govori

in addition to a language that makes sense -- good job.

pored jezika koji ima smisla - odlično.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

But by any measure ...

No, po svim merilima (measure)...

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

By any measure, life is really, really good, but I haven't "moved on."

Po svim merilima, život je stvarno, stvarno dobar, ali ja nisam zaboravila.

I haven't moved on, and I hate that phrase so much,

Nisam ostavila tugu iza sebe, i toliko mrzim taj izraz,

and I understand why other people do.

i razumem zašto ga ljudi mrze.

Because what it says

Jer u skladu s njim,

is that Aaron's life and death and love are just moments

Aronov život, smrt i ljubav su samo trenuci

that I can leave behind me -- and that I probably should.

koje mogu ostaviti iza sebe - i to bi i trebalo da uradim.

And when I talk about Aaron, I slip so easily into the present tense,

Kada pričam o Aronu, lako pređem na sadašnje vreme,

and I've always thought that made me weird.

i uvek sam mislila da je to čudno.

And then I noticed that everybody does it.

A onda sam primetila da svi to rade.

And it's not because we are in denial or because we're forgetful,

I to nije zato što poričemo realnost ili zato što smo zaboravni,

it's because the people we love, who we've lost,

već zato što su ljudi koje volimo, koje smo izgubili,

are still so present for us.

i dalje tu za nas.

So, when I say, "Oh, Aaron is ..."

E pa, kada kažem: „O, Aron je...“

It's because Aaron still is.

To je zato što i dalje jeste.

And it's not in the way that he was before,

Ne kao što je bio pre,

which was much better,

što je bilo mnogo bolje,

i ne onako kako vernici pokušavaju da mi objasne.

and it's not in the way that churchy people try to tell me that he would be.

It's just that he's indelible,

On je prosto neizbrisiv,

and so he is present for me.

tako da je za mene prisutan.

Here,

Ovde,

he's present for me in the work that I do,

prisutan je u poslu koji se bavim,

in the child that we had together,

u detetu koje smo imali zajedno,

in these three other children I'm raising,

u ovo troje dece koje odgajam,

who never met him, who share none of his DNA,

koja ga nikada nisu upoznala, koja nemaju njegov DNK,

but who are only in my life because I had Aaron

ali su u mom životu samo zato što sam imala Arona

and because I lost Aaron.

i zato što sam ga izgubila.

He's present in my marriage to Matthew,

Prisutan je i u mom braku sa Metjuom,

because Aaron's life and love and death

jer su me Aronov život, ljubav i smrt

made me the person that Matthew wanted to marry.

učinili osobom kojom je Metju poželeo da se oženi.

So I've not moved on from Aaron,

Tako da nisam ostavila Arona iza sebe,

I've moved forward with him.

nastavila sam dalje sa njim.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)

We spread Aaron's ashes in his favorite river in Minnesota,

Prosuli smo Aronov pepeo u njegovu omiljenu reku u Minesoti,

and when the bag was empty --

i kada je kesa bila prazna -

because when you're cremated, you fit into a plastic bag --

jer kada vas kremiraju, stanete u plastičnu kesu -

there were still ashes stuck to my fingers.

bilo je još pepela na mojim prstima.

And I could have just put my hands in the water and rinsed them,

Mogla sam samo da stavim ruke u vodu i da ih isperem,

ali umesto toga, oblizala sam šake,

but instead, I licked my hands clean,

because I was so afraid of losing more than I had already lost,

jer sam se toliko uplašila da ću izgubiti više nego što već jesam,

and I was so desperate to make sure that he would always be a part of me.

i očajnički sam želela da budem sigurna da će uvek biti deo mene.

But of course he would be.

Naravno da će biti.

Because when you watch your person fill himself with poison for three years,

Jer kada gledate nekog svog kako se kljuka otrovom tri godine,

just so he can stay alive a little bit longer with you,

samo kako bi ostao živ malo duže zbog vas,

that stays with you.

to ostaje u vama.

When you watch him fade from the healthy person he was the night you met

Kada gledate kako vene i od zdravog čoveka kakav je bio one noći kad vas je upoznao

to nothing, that stays with you.

postaje ništa, to ostaje u vama.

When you watch your son, who isn't even two years old yet,

Kada gledate vašeg sina, koji još nema ni dve godine,

walk up to his father's bed on the last day of his life,

kako prilazi očevom krevetu poslednjeg dana njegovog života,

like he knows what's coming in a few hours,

kao da zna šta se sprema za nekoliko sati,

and say, "I love you. All done. Bye, bye."

i kaže: „Volim te. Gotovo. Pa, pa.“

That stays with you.

To ostaje u vama.

Just like when you fall in love, finally, like really fall in love

Kao kad se konačno zaljubite, kada se stvarno zaljubite

with someone who gets you and sees you

u nekoga ko vas razume i vidi

and you even see, "Oh, my God, I've been wrong this entire time.

i čak i vi shvatite: „O bože, grešila sam svo ovo vreme.

Love is not a contest or a reality show -- it's so quiet,

Ljubav nije takmičenje ili rijaliti - već je tako mirna,

it's this invisible thread of calm that connects the two of us

nevidljiva nit smirenosti koja povezuje nas dvoje

even when everything is chaos,

čak i kada je sve u haosu,

when things are falling apart, even when he's gone."

kada se sve raspada, čak i kada njega nema."

That stays with you.

To ostaje u vama.

We used to do this thing --

Mi smo radili nešto -

because my hands are always freezing and he's so warm,

jer su moje ruke uvek ledene, a on je tako topao,

pa bih mu ja svoje led ledene ruke gurnula pod majicu...

where I would take my ice-cold hands and shove them up his shirt ...

press them against his hot bod.

i pritisnula ih uz njegovo vrelo telo.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

And he hated it so much,

On je to toliko mrzeo,

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

but he loved me,

ali je voleo mene,

and after he died, I laid in bed with Aaron

i nakon što je preminuo, legla sam u krevet sa Aronom,

and I put my hands underneath him

stavila svoje ruke ispod njega

and I felt his warmth.

i osetila njegovu toplotu.

And I can't even tell you if my hands were cold,

Ne mogu čak ni da vam kažem da li su mi ruke bile hladne,

but I can tell you

ali vam mogu reći

that I knew it was the last time I would ever do that.

da sam znala da je to bio poslednji put da ću to ikada uraditi.

And that that memory is always going to be sad.

I da će ta uspomena uvek biti tužna.

That memory will always hurt.

Ta uspomena će uvek boleti.

Even when I'm 600 years old and I'm just a hologram.

Čak i kada budem imala 600 godina i postanem samo hologram.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Just like the memory of meeting him is always going to make me laugh.

Kao što će me uspomena na upoznavanje s njim uvek nasmejavati.

Grief doesn't happen in this vacuum,

Tuga nije izolovan osećaj,

it happens alongside of and mixed in with all of these other emotions.

dešava se zajedno i pomešano sa svim tim drugim emocijama.

So, I met Matthew, my current husband --

Upoznala sam Metjua, mog sadašnjeg muža -

who doesn't love that title,

koji ne voli tu titulu,

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

but it's so accurate.

iako je tačna.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

I met Matthew, and ...

Upoznala sam Metjua i...

there was this audible sigh of relief among the people who love me,

i čuo se taj uzdah olakšanja među ljudima koji me vole,

like, "It's over!

u smislu „Gotovo je!

She did it.

Uspela je.

She got a happy ending, we can all go home.

Dobila je svoj srećan kraj, sada možemo kućama.

And we did good."

Bili smo dobri.“

And that narrative is so appealing even to me,

Ta priča je bila privlačna čak i meni,

and I thought maybe I had gotten that, too, but I didn't.

i mislila sam da sam možda to i dobila, ali nisam.

I got another chapter.

Dobila sam drugo poglavlje.

And it's such a good chapter -- I love you, honey --

I to jako dobro poglavlje - volim te dušo -

it's such a good chapter.

tako dobro poglavlje.

But especially at the beginning, it was like an alternate universe,

Pogotovo na početku, bilo je kao u drugom univerzumu,

or one of those old "choose your own adventure" books from the '80s

ili u jednoj od onih starih knjiga iz '80-ih „izaberite svoju avanturu"

where there are two parallel plot lines.

u kojima imate dva paralelna zapleta.

So I opened my heart to Matthew,

Otvorila sam svoje srce Metjuu,

and my brain was like, "Would you like to think about Aaron?

a mozak mi je govorio: „Da li bi htela da razmišljaš o Aronu?

Like, the past, the present, future, just get in there," and I did.

O prošlosti, sadašnjosti, budućnosti, ma samo hajde", i jesam.

And all of a sudden, those two plots were unfurling at once,

I odjednom, ta dva zapleta su se zajedno razvijala

and falling in love with Matthew really helped me realize the enormity

i zaljubljivanje u Metjua mi je pomoglo da uvidim veličinu

of what I lost when Aaron died.

onoga što sam izgubila kada je Aron preminuo.

And just as importantly,

Jednako važno,

it helped me realize that my love for Aaron

pomoglo mi je da uvidim da moja ljubav prema Aronu

and my grief for Aaron,

moja tuga za njim,

and my love for Matthew, are not opposing forces.

i moja ljubav prema Metjuu nisu oprečne sile.

They are just strands to the same thread.

Već samo dva kraja iste niti.

They're the same stuff.

One su ista stvar.

I'm ... what would my parents say?

Ja nisam... šta bi moji roditelji rekli?

I'm not special.

Ja nisam posebna.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

They had four kids, they were like ... frankly.

Oni su imali četvoro dece, bili su u fazonu... iskreno.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

But I'm not, I'm not special.

Ali i nisam, nisam posebna.

I know that, I'm fully aware

Znam to, potpuno sam svesna

that all day, every day, all around the world,

da se po ceo dan, svakog dana, svuda širom sveta,

terrible things are happening.

dešavaju užasne stvari.

All the time.

Stalno.

Like I said, fun person.

Kao što sam rekla, ja sam zabavna.

But terrible things are happening,

Ali užasne stvari se dešavaju,

people are experiencing deeply formative and traumatic losses every day.

ljudi svakog dana prolaze kroz duboko traumatične gubitke koji ih oblikuju.

And as part of my job,

Kao deo mog posla,

this weird podcast that I have,

u tom čudnom podkastu koji imam,

I sometimes talk to people

ponekad pričam sa ljudima

about the worst thing that's ever happened to them.

o najgoroj stvari koja im se ikada dogodila.

And sometimes, that's the loss of someone they love,

Ponekad, to je gubitak nekog voljenog,

sometimes days ago or weeks ago, years ago, even decades ago.

nekada pre nekoliko dana ili nedelja, godinama ili čak i decenijama pre.

And these people that I interview,

I ti ljudi koje intervjuišem

they haven't closed themselves around this loss

nisu se učaurili u tom gubitku

and made it the center of their lives.

i učinili ga centrom života.

They've lived, their worlds have kept spinning.

Živeli su, njihov svet je nastavio da se okreće.

But they're talking to me, a total stranger,

Ali oni pričaju sa mnom, potpunim strancem,

about the person they love who has died,

o nekom voljenom ko je preminuo,

because these are the experiences

jer su to iskustva

that mark us and make us just as much as the joyful ones.

koja nas obeleže i deo su nas jednako kao i ona radosna.

And just as permanently.

I jednako su trajna.

Long after you get your last sympathy card

Dugo nakon što dobijete poslednji izraz saučešća

or your last hot dish.

ili kuvano jelo.

Like, we don't look at the people around us

Mi ne tražimo ljude oko nas

experiencing life's joys and wonders and tell them to "move on," do we?

koji prolaze kroz radosti i čuda i govorimo im da nastave dalje, zar ne?

We don't send a card that's like, "Congratulations on your beautiful baby,"

Ne šaljemo čestitke tipa „Čestitamo na predivnoj bebi,“

and then, five years later, think like, "Another birthday party? Get over it."

a onda nakon pet godina pomislimo: „Još jedan rođendan? Prevaziđite to.“

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Da, shvatili smo, napunio je pet godina.

Yeah, we get it, he's five.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

Wow.

Super.

(Laughter)

(Smeh)

But grief is kind of one of those things,

Ali tuga je jedna od onih stvari koju,

like, falling in love or having a baby or watching "The Wire" on HBO,

kao zaljubiljivanje ili dobijanje deteta ili gledanje serije „Doušnici“ na HBO,

where you don't get it until you get it, until you do it.

ne shvatite dok ne shvatite, dok ne prođete kroz to.

And once you do it, once it's your love or your baby,

I tek kad prođete kroz to, tek kad je u pitanju vaša ljubav ili beba,

once it's your grief and your front row at the funeral,

vaša tuga, prvi red na sahrani,

you get it.

shvatite.

You understand what you're experiencing is not a moment in time,

Razumevanje onog što vam se dešava nije trenutak u vremenu,

it's not a bone that will reset,

nije kost koja će se ponovo namestiti,

but that you've been touched by something chronic.

nego ste dotaknuti nečim dugotrajnim.

Something incurable.

Nečim neizlečivim.

It's not fatal, but sometimes grief feels like it could be.

Nije fatalno, ali ponekad se čini da bi tuga to mogla biti.

And if we can't prevent it in one another,

A ako je ne možemo preduprediti jedni u drugima,

what can we do?

šta možemo uraditi?

What can we do other than try to remind one another

Šta drugo možemo osim da probamo da podsetimo jedni druge

that some things can't be fixed,

da se neke stvari ne mogu popraviti

and not all wounds are meant to heal?

i da ne mogu sve rane da se zaleče?

We need each other to remember,

Potrebni smo jedni drugima da se setimo,

to help each other remember,

da pomognemo jedni drugima da se setimo,

that grief is this multitasking emotion.

da je tuga skup emocija.

That you can and will be sad, and happy; you'll be grieving, and able to love

Da možete i da ćete biti tužni, i srećni; tugovaćete, i moći ćete da volite

in the same year or week, the same breath.

u istoj godini ili nedelji, u istom dahu.

We need to remember that a grieving person is going to laugh again and smile again.

Moramo zapamtiti da će onaj koji tuguje ponovo da se smeje i osmehuje.

If they're lucky, they'll even find love again.

Ako ima sreće, ponovo će naći ljubav.

But yes, absolutely, they're going to move forward.

Ali da, apsolutno, nastaviće dalje sa svojim životom.

But that doesn't mean that they've moved on.

Ali to ne znači da su ostavili tugu iza sebe.

Thank you.

Hvala.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)