Strange answers to the psychopath test | Jon Ronson | TED

24,369,475 views ใƒป 2012-08-15

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์•„๋ž˜ ์˜๋ฌธ์ž๋ง‰์„ ๋”๋ธ”ํด๋ฆญํ•˜์‹œ๋ฉด ์˜์ƒ์ด ์žฌ์ƒ๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.

00:00
Translator: Timothy Covell Reviewer: Morton Bast
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๋ฒˆ์—ญ: K Bang ๊ฒ€ํ† : Youna Jung
์ด์•ผ๊ธฐ๋Š” ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ์‹œ์ž‘๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค: ์ €๋Š” ์นœ๊ตฌ์ง‘์— ์žˆ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
00:16
The story starts: I was at a friend's house,
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00:19
and she had on her shelf a copy of the DSM manual,
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๊ทธ๋…€์˜ ์ง‘ ์ฑ…์žฅ์—๋Š” DSM ์„ค๋ช…์„œ๊ฐ€ ํ•œ ๊ถŒ ์žˆ์—ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ *DSM: ์ง„๋‹จ๊ณผ ํ†ต๊ณ„ ์—ฐ๊ฐ
00:23
which is the manual of mental disorders.
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๊ทธ๊ฑด ์ •์‹ ์žฅ์• ์— ๋Œ€ํ•œ ์„ค๋ช…์„œ์˜€์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
00:25
It lists every known mental disorder.
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๊ฑฐ๊ธฐ์—๋Š” ์•Œ๋ ค์ง„ ๋ชจ๋“  ์ •์‹ ์žฅ์• ๊ฐ€ ๋‚˜์—ด๋˜์–ด ์žˆ์–ด์š”.
์ด๋Ÿฐ ์ฑ…์€, 1950๋…„๋Œ€์—๋Š”, ์•„์ฃผ ์–‡์•˜๋Š”๋ฐ
00:29
And it used to be, back in the '50s, a very slim pamphlet.
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00:32
And then it got bigger and bigger and bigger,
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์ ์  ๋” ๋ถ„๋Ÿ‰์ด ๋Š˜์–ด๋‚˜
00:34
and now it's 886 pages long.
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์ง€๊ธˆ์€ 886 ์ชฝ์ด๋‚˜ ๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
์ง€๊ธˆ์€ 374๊ฐœ์˜ ์ •์‹  ์žฅ์• ๋ฅผ ๋‚˜์—ดํ•˜๊ณ  ์žˆ์ฃ .
00:38
And it lists currently 374 mental disorders.
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00:42
So I was leafing through it,
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์ด ์ฑ…์„ ๋Œ€์ถฉ ํ›‘์–ด๋ณด๋‹ค๊ฐ€
00:44
wondering if I had any mental disorders,
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๋‚˜์—๊ฒŒ๋Š” ์–ด๋–ค ์ •์‹  ์žฅ์• ๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋‚˜ ๊ถ๊ธˆํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
12๊ฐ€์ง€๋‚˜ ๊ฐ–๊ณ  ์žˆ๋”๋ผ๊ณ ์š”.
00:47
and it turns out I've got 12.
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00:48
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
00:49
I've got generalized anxiety disorder,
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์ œ๊ฒ ์ผ๋ฐ˜ํ™”๋œ ๋ถˆ์•ˆ ์žฅ์• ๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ
00:52
which is a given.
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๊ทธ๊ฑด ๊ธฐ๋ณธ์ด๊ตฌ์š”.
00:53
I've got nightmare disorder,
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์•…๋ชฝ๋„ ์žˆ์ฃ .
00:55
which is categorized
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์ด๊ฑด ๋ˆ„๊ตฐ๊ฐ€ ์ซ“์•„์˜ค๊ฑฐ๋‚˜
00:57
if you have recurrent dreams of being pursued or declared a failure,
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์‹คํŒจํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฟˆ์„ ๊ณ„์† ๊พธ๋Š”๊ฑด๋ฐ --
01:01
and all my dreams involve people chasing me down the street
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์ด๋Ÿฐ ๊ฟˆ์€ ์ „๋ถ€, ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ๊ธธ์—์„œ ์ €๋ฅผ ๋”ฐ๋ผ ์˜ค๊ฑฐ๋‚˜
01:05
going, "You're a failure!"
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"๋„ˆ๋Š” ์‹คํŒจ์ž์•ผ."๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•˜๋Š”๊ฑฐ์ฃ 
01:06
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
01:08
I've got parent-child relational problems,
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์ €๋Š” ๋ถ€์ž(็ˆถๅญ)๊ด€๊ณ„ ๋ฌธ์ œ๋„ ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ
01:11
which I blame my parents for.
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์ด๊ฑด ์ œ๊ฐ€ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ ๋ถ€๋ชจ๋‹˜์„ ์ฑ…๋งํ•˜๋Š”๊ฑฐ์—์š”.
01:13
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
๋†๋‹ด์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์•„๋‹ˆ์—์š” ๋†๋‹ด์ด ์•„๋‹ˆ์˜ˆ์š”.
01:15
I'm kidding. I'm not kidding.
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01:17
I'm kidding.
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๋†๋‹ด์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
01:19
And I've got malingering.
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์ €๋Š” ๊พ€๋ณ‘๋„ ๋ถ€๋ฆฌ๊ณ ์š”.
01:21
And I think it's actually quite rare
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์ œ ์ƒ๊ฐ์— ๊พ€๋ณ‘๊ณผ ์ผ๋ฐ˜ํ™”๋œ ๋ถˆ์•ˆ ์žฅ์• ๋ฅผ
01:22
to have both malingering and generalized anxiety disorder,
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ํ•จ๊ป˜ ๊ฐ€์ง€๊ณ  ์žˆ๋Š”๊ฑด ์ƒ๋‹นํžˆ ๋“œ๋ฌผ์–ด์š”.
01:25
because malingering tends to make me feel very anxious.
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์™œ๋ƒํ•˜๋ฉด ๊พ€๋ณ‘์€ ํ•ญ์ƒ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ๋ญ”๊ฐ€๋ฅผ ๊ฑฑ์ •ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋งŒ๋“ค๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”.
01:28
Anyway, I was looking through this book,
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์–ด์จŒ๋“ , ์ €๋Š” ์ด ์ฑ…์„ ๋ณด๋‹ค๊ฐ€
01:30
wondering if I was much crazier than I thought I was,
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์ œ ์ž์‹ ์ด ์ƒ๊ฐํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์— ๋น„ํ•ด์„œ ์–ผ๋งˆ๋‚˜ ๋” ๋ฏธ์ณค๋Š”์ง€ ๊ถ๊ธˆํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
01:33
or maybe it's not a good idea to diagnose yourself with a mental disorder
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ๋ฐ, ํ›ˆ๋ จ๋œ ํ”„๋กœ๊ฐ€ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ๋ฉด,
01:36
if you're not a trained professional,
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์ž๊ธฐ ์ž์‹ ์„ ์ •์‹  ์žฅ์• ๋ผ๊ณ  ์ง„๋‹จํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒŒ ์ข‹์€ ์ƒ๊ฐ์€ ์•„๋‹ˆ์ฃ .
์•„๋‹ˆ๋ฉด, ์ „์‹ ๊ณผ ์˜์‚ฌ๋Š” ๊ทผ๋ณธ์ ์œผ๋กœ ์ธ๊ฐ„์ ์ธ ํ–‰๋™์—
01:39
or maybe the psychiatry profession has a kind of strange desire
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01:43
to label what's essentially normal human behavior as a mental disorder.
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์ •์‹  ์žฅ์• ๋ผ๊ณ  ์ด๋ฆ„ ๋ถ™์ด๋ ค๋Š” ์ด์ƒํ•œ ๊ฐˆ๋ง์ด ์žˆ๋˜์ง€์š”.
01:48
I didn't know which of these was true, but I thought it was kind of interesting,
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์ €๋Š” ์ด ๊ฐ€์šด์— ๋”๋–ค๊ฒŒ ์ง„์‹ค์ธ์ง€ ์•Œ ์ˆ˜๊ฐ€ ์—†์—ˆ์ง€๋งŒ
์ด๋Ÿฐ๊ฒŒ ์žฌ๋ฏธ์žˆ๋‹ค๋Š” ์ƒ๊ฐ์„ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ •์‹ ๊ณผ ์˜์‚ฌ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด ๋น„ํŒ์ ์ธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์˜
01:52
and I thought maybe I should meet a critic of psychiatry
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01:55
to get their view,
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์˜๊ฒฌ์„ ๋“ค์–ด๋ณด์ž๊ณ  ์ƒ๊ฐํ–ˆ์ฃ .
01:56
which is how I ended up having lunch with the Scientologists.
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๊ทธ๋ ‡๊ฒŒํ•ด์„œ ์‚ฌ์ด์—”ํ†จ๋กœ์ง€ ์ถ”์ข…์ž์™€ ์ ์‹ฌ์„ ๋จน๊ฒŒ ๋์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
01:59
(Laughter)
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02:01
It was a man called Brian, who runs a crack team of Scientologists
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๋ธŒ๋ผ์ด์–ธ์ด๋ผ๋Š” ๋‚จ์ž์˜€์–ด์š”.
์ด ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ์‚ฌ์ด์—”ํ†จ๋กœ์ง€ ์ถ”์ข…์ž๋“ค์˜ ๋‹จ์ฒด๋ฅผ ์šด์˜ํ•˜๊ณ  ์žˆ๊ณ 
02:05
who are determined to destroy psychiatry wherever it lies.
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๊ธฐํšŒ๋งŒ ๋˜๋ฉด ์ •์‹ ์˜ํ•™์„ ๋ถ€์ˆด๋ฒ„๊ฒ ๋‹ค๊ณ  ๋‹ค์ง์„ ํ•œ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด์ฃ .
02:09
They're called the CCHR.
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์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ์ด๋Ÿฐ๊ฑธ CCHR ์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ถ€๋ฆ…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. **Citizens commission of human rights
02:11
And I said to him, "Can you prove to me
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์ฃ . :"์ •์‹ ์˜ํ•™์ด๋ž€๊ฒŒ ๋ฏฟ์„ ์ˆ˜ ์—†๋Š”
02:14
that psychiatry is a pseudo-science that can't be trusted?"
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์˜์‚ฌ(ๆ“ฌไผผ)๊ณผํ•™์ด๋ผ๋Š” ๊ฑธ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ์ฆ๋ช…ํ•ด ์ค„ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๊นŒ?"
๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "๋„ค, ์ฆ๋ช…ํ•ด ๋“œ๋ฆฌ์ฃ ."
02:18
And he said, "Yes, we can prove it to you."
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ์š”?"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌป์ž
02:21
And I said, "How?"
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"ํ† ๋‹ˆ๋ฅผ ์†Œ๊ฐœํ•ด๋“œ๋ฆฌ์ฃ ."๋ผ๊ณ  ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
02:22
And he said, "We're going to introduce you to Tony."
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"ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ๋ˆ„๊ตฐ๋ฐ์š”?" ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋˜๋ฌผ์—ˆ์ฃ .
02:26
And I said, "Who's Tony?"
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"ํ† ๋‹ˆ๋Š” ๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์— ์žˆ์–ด์š”."๋ผ๊ณ  ๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
02:28
And he said, "Tony's in Broadmoor."
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02:31
Now, Broadmoor is Broadmoor Hospital.
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๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด๋ž€ ๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด ๋ณ‘์›์ด๋ž€ ๋œป์ด์ฃ .
02:33
It used to be known as the Broadmoor Asylum for the Criminally Insane.
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์—ฌ๊ธฐ๋Š” ํ˜•์‚ฌ์ ์œผ๋กœ ์ •์‹ ์ด์ƒ ํŒ์ •์„ ๋ฐ›์€ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์„ ์ˆ˜์šฉํ•˜๋Š” ๊ณณ์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ์•Œ๋ ค์ ธ ์žˆ์–ด์š”.
02:38
It's where they send the serial killers,
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์—ฌ๊ธฐ๋Š” ์—ฐ์‡„์‚ด์ธ๋ฒ”์ด๋‚˜
๋„์ €ํžˆ ์–ด์ฉŒ์ง€ ๋ชปํ•  ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์„ ๋ณด๋‚ด๋Š” ๊ณณ์ด์ฃ .
02:41
and the people who can't help themselves.
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋ธŒ๋ผ์ด์–ธ์—๊ฒŒ ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์–ด์š”. "ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ๋ฌด์Šจ ์ผ์„ ์ €์งˆ๋Ÿฟ๋Š”๋ฐ์š”?"
02:43
And I said to Brian, "Well, what did Tony do?"
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ•˜๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
02:46
And he said, "Hardly anything.
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"๊ฑฐ์˜ ํ•œ๊ฒƒ๋„ ์—†์–ด์š”. ๊ทธ์ € ๋ˆ„๊ตฐ๊ฐ€๋ฅผ ์ข€ ํŒจ์คฌ๊ณ 
02:49
He beat someone up or something,
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๊ฐ์˜ฅ ์‚ด์ด๋ฅผ ๋น ์ ธ๋‚˜์˜ค๋ ค๊ณ  ๊ฑฐ์ง“์œผ๋กœ ๋ฏธ์นœ ์ฒ™์„ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
02:52
and he decided to fake madness to get out of a prison sentence.
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ๋ฐ, ๊ทธ๋Š” ๋ฏธ์นœ ์ฒ™์„ ๋„ˆ๋ฌด ์ž˜ํ•˜๋Š” ๋ฐ”๋žŒ์— ๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์— ๊ฐ–ํžŒ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
02:57
But he faked it too well, and now he's stuck in Broadmoor
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์•„๋ฌด๋„ ๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋ฉ€์ฉกํ•˜๋‹ค๊ณ  ์ƒ๊ฐํ•˜์ง€ ์•Š์„๊ฑธ์š”.
03:02
and nobody will believe he's sane.
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03:04
Do you want us to try and get you into Broadmoor to meet Tony?"
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ํ† ๋‹ˆ๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋‚  ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๊ฒŒ ๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์— ๋„ฃ์–ด๋“œ๋ฆด๊นŒ์š”?"
์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "๋„ค ๊ทธ๋ž˜์ฃผ์„ธ์š”."
03:08
So I said, "Yes, please."
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๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ €๋Š” ๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ดํ–‰ ๊ธฐ์ฐจ๋ฅผ ํƒ‘๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
03:10
So I got the train to Broadmoor.
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03:12
I began to yawn uncontrollably around Kempton Park,
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์ „ ์ผํ”„ํ†ค ๊ณต์› ์ฃผ๋ณ€์—์„œ ์ฃผ์ฒดํ•  ์ˆ˜ ์—†์ด ํ•˜ํ’ˆ์„ ํ•ด๋Œ”์ฃ .
์™ธ๊ฒฌ์ƒ์œผ๋กœ๋Š” ๊ฐœ๋“ค์ด ๋ถˆ์•ˆํ•  ๋•Œ ํ•˜๋Š” ํ–‰๋™์ด๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”. --
03:16
which apparently is what dogs also do when anxious,
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03:18
they yawn uncontrollably.
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๊ฐœ๋“ค์€ ๋ฏธ์นœ๋“ฏ์ด ํ•˜ํ’ˆ์„ ํ•ด๋Œ‘๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
03:20
And we got to Broadmoor.
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์ €๋Š” ๊ฒฐ๊ตญ ๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด๋กœ ๋“ค์–ด๊ฐ€์ฃ .
03:22
And I got taken through gate after gate after gate after gate
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๋ฌธ์„ ์ง€๋‚˜ ๋‹ค์Œ ๋ฌธ์„ ์ง€๋‚˜ ๋˜ ๋‹ค์Œ ๋ฌธ์„ ์ง€๋‚˜๊ณ  ๋˜ ์ง€๋‚˜์„œ
03:27
into the wellness center, which is where you get to meet the patients.
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๊ฑด๊ฐ•๊ด€๋ฆฌ์†Œ๋กœ ๋“ค์–ด๊ฐ”์–ด์š”.
์—ฌ๊ธฐ์„œ ํ™˜์ž๋“ค์„ ๋งŒ๋‚˜๊ฒŒ ๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
03:30
It looks like a giant Hampton Inn.
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์—„์ฒญ ํฐ 'ํ–„ํ”„ํ†ค ์ธ' ๊ฐ™์ด ์ƒ๊ฒผ์–ด์š”.
03:34
It's all peach and pine and calming colors.
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์ „์ฒด๊ฐ€ ๋ณต์ˆญ์•„์™€ ์†Œ๋‚˜๋ฌด, ๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ์ž”์ž”ํ•œ ์ƒ‰์œผ๋กœ ๋˜์–ด ์žˆ์—ˆ์ฃ .
03:38
And the only bold colors are the reds of the panic buttons.
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๋‹จ ํ•˜๋‚˜ ๋ˆˆ์— ๋„๋Š” ์ƒ‰์€ ๊ณตํ™ฉ ๋ฒ„ํŠผ์˜ ๋นจ๊ฐ„ ์ƒ‰๋ฟ์ด์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ ๋Š” ํ™˜์ž๋“ค์ด ๋ฐ€๋ ค๋“ค์–ด ์™”์–ด์š”.
03:44
And the patients started drifting in.
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ํ™˜์ž๋“ค์€ ์ƒ๋‹นํžˆ ์‚ด ์ช˜๊ณ , ์Šค์›จํŠธ ๋ฐ”์ง€๋ฅผ ์ž…๊ณ  ์žˆ์—ˆ๊ณ 
03:47
And they were quite overweight and wearing sweatpants,
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๊ฝค ๊ณ ๋ถ„๊ณ ๋ถ„ํ•ด ๋ณด์˜€์–ด์š”.
03:51
and quite docile-looking.
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03:52
And Brian the Scientologist whispered to me,
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์‚ฌ์ด์—”ํ†จ๋กœ์ง€ ์ถ”์ข…์ž์ธ ๋ธŒ๋ผ์ด์–ธ์ด ์ œ๊ฒŒ ๋‚˜์ฆˆ๋ง‰ํžˆ ๋งํ–ˆ์ฃ .
"์ € ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค ์•ฝ์— ์ทจํ•ด์žˆ์–ด์š”."
03:55
"They're medicated,"
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๊ทธ๊ฑด ์‚ฌ์ด์—”ํ†จ๋กœ์ง€ ์ถ”์ข…์ž๋“ค์—๊ฒ ์ตœ์•…์˜ ์ฃ„์•…๊ณผ ๊ฐ™์€ ๊ฒƒ์ด์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
03:57
which, to the Scientologists, is like the worst evil in the world,
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04:00
but I'm thinking it's probably a good idea.
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ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ ์ €๋Š” ๊ฝค ์ข‹์€ ์ƒ๊ฐ์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ์—ฌ๊ธฐ๊ณ  ์žˆ์ฃ .
04:03
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
04:05
And then Brian said, "Here's Tony."
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ ๋Š” ๋ธŒ๋ผ์ด์–ธ์ด ๋งํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. "์ €๊ธฐ ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ์™€์š”."
ํ•œ ๋‚จ์ž๊ฐ€ ๊ฑธ์–ด ๋“ค์–ด์˜ค๊ณ  ์žˆ์—ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
04:08
And a man was walking in.
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์‚ด์ช„ ๋ณด์ด์ง€๋„ ์•Š์•˜๊ณ  ์‹ ์ฒด๋„ ์•„์ฃผ ์ข‹์•„ ๋ณด์˜€์–ด์š”.
04:10
And he wasn't overweight, he was in very good physical shape.
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04:13
And he wasn't wearing sweatpants,
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ์Šค์›จํŠธ ๋ฐ”์ง€๋„ ์•ˆ ์ž…์—ˆ๊ตฌ์š”.
04:15
he was wearing a pinstripe suit.
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๊ทธ๋Š” ๊ฐ€๋Š” ๋ฌด๋Šฌ๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋Š” ๋ฐ”์ง€๋ฅผ ์ž…๊ณ  ์žˆ์—ˆ์ฃ .
04:18
And he had his arm outstretched
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๊ทธ๋Š” ์–ดํ”„๋ Œํ‹ฐ์Šค๋ฅผ ๋งˆ์น˜๊ณ  ๋‚˜์˜ค๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ *์–ดํ”„๋ Œํ‹ฐ์Šค: TV ํ”„๋กœ๊ทธ๋žจ
04:20
like someone out of The Apprentice.
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ํŒ”์„ ๋ฒŒ๋ฆฐ ์ฑ„์˜€์–ด์š”.
04:22
He looked like a man who wanted to wear an outfit
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ์ œ๊ฐ€ ์•„์ฃผ ๋ฉ€์ฉกํ•˜๋‹ค๊ณ  ์—ฌ๊ธธ ๋งŒํผ
04:25
that would convince me that he was very sane.
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๊น”๋”ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ์ฐจ๋ ค ์ž…๊ธฐ๋ฅผ ์›ํ•˜๋Š” ๋“ฏํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ž๋ฆฌ์— ์•‰์•˜์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
04:30
And he sat down.
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04:31
And I said, "So is it true that you faked your way in here?"
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์ฃ . "์—ฌ๊ธฐ ๋“ค์–ด์˜ฌ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๊ฒŒ ์—ฐ๊ธฐํ•œ๊ฒŒ ๋งž์•„์š”?"
๊ทธ๋Š” " ์•„, ๊ทธ๋Ÿผ์š”. ์ •๋ง ๊ทธ๋ ‡์ฃ . ์ œ๊ฐ€ 17์‚ด๋•Œ, ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์„ ๋•Œ๋ ธ์ฃ .
04:34
And he said, "Yep. Yep. Absolutely. I beat someone up when I was 17.
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์žฌํŒ์„ ๊ธฐ๋‹ค๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ
04:38
And I was in prison awaiting trial,
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04:40
and my cellmate said to me,
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์ œ ๊ฐ๋ฐฉ ์ข…๋ฃŒ๊ฐ€ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
04:41
'You know what you have to do?
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'๋‚ด๊ฐ€ ๋ฐฉ๋ฒ•์„ ์•Œ๋ ค์ค„๊นŒ?
04:43
Fake madness.
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๋ฏธ์นœ ์ฒ™ ํ•ด.
๋„ค๊ฐ€ ๋ฏธ์ณค๋‹ค๊ณ  ํ•˜๋ฉด, ํ›จ์”ฌ ํŽธํ•œ ๋ฐ๋กœ ๋ณด๋‚ผ๊ฑฐ์•ผ.
04:45
Tell them you're mad, you'll get sent to some cushy hospital.
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๊ฐ„ํ˜ธ์›๋“ค์ด ํ”ผ์ž๋ฅผ ๊ฐ€์ ธ๋‹ค ์ฃผ๊ณ 
04:48
Nurses will bring you pizzas, you'll have your own PlayStation.'"
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๋„ค ์†Œ์œ ์˜ ํ”Œ๋ ˆ์ด์Šคํ…Œ์ด์…˜๋„ ๊ฐ–๊ฒŒ ๋˜๊ฑธ.' "
04:52
I said, "Well, how did you do it?"
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋˜ ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์ฃ . " ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”?"
04:54
He said, "Well, I asked to see the prison psychiatrist.
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์ฃ . "๊ต๋„์†Œ ์ •์‹ ๊ณผ์˜์‚ฌ๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋‚˜๊ณ  ์‹ถ๋‹ค๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
'ํฌ๋ž˜์‰ฌ'๋ผ๋Š” ์˜ํ™”๋ฅผ ๋ณธ์ ์ด ์žˆ๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”.
04:57
And I'd just seen a film called 'Crash,'
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04:59
in which people get sexual pleasure from crashing cars into walls.
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๊ฑฐ๊ธฐ์„œ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ์ž๋™์ฐจ๋ฅผ ๋ฒฝ์— ๋ถ€๋”ชํžˆ๋ฉฐ ์„ฑ์  ์พŒ๊ฐ์„ ์–ป์–ด์š”.
๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ œ๊ฐ€ ์ •์‹ ๊ณผ ์˜์‚ฌ์—๊ฒŒ ๊ทธ๋žฌ์ฃ .
05:03
So I said to the psychiatrist,
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'๋‚˜๋Š” ์ž๋™์ฐจ๋ฅผ ๋ฒฝ์— ๋ถ€๋”ชํžˆ๋ฉด ์„ฑ์  ์พŒ๊ฐ์„ ์–ป์–ด์š”..' "
05:05
'I get sexual pleasure from crashing cars into walls.'"
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "๊ทธ ๋ฐ–์—๋Š”์š”?" ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌป์ž
05:09
And I said, "What else?"
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05:10
He said, "Oh, yeah. I told the psychiatrist
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๊ทธ๋Š” " ์•„.. ์ •์‹ ๊ณผ ์˜์‚ฌ์—๊ฒŒ
์—ฌ์ž๋“ค์ด ์ฃฝ๋Š”๊ฑธ ๋ณด๋ฉด ๋‚ด๊ฐ€ ์ •์ƒ์œผ๋กœ ๋Š๊ปด์ ธ์„œ
05:13
that I wanted to watch women as they died,
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05:16
because it would make me feel more normal."
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ๊ฑธ ๋ณด๊ณ  ์‹ถ๋‹ค๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”." ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋งํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
05:18
I said, "Where'd you get that from?"
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ๊ฑด ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ์•Œ์•˜์–ด์š”?" ๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•˜์ž
05:20
He said, "Oh, from a biography of Ted Bundy that they had
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๊ทธ๋Š” "๊ต๋„์†Œ ๋„์„œ๊ด€์— ์žˆ๋Š”
05:23
at the prison library."
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ํ…Œ๋“œ ๋ฒˆ๋””์˜ ์ž์„œ์ „์„ ์ฝ์—ˆ๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”." ๋ผ๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์ฃ . *ํ…Œ๋“œ ๋ฒˆ๋””: ์•…๋ช… ๋†’์€ ์—ฐ์‡„ ์‚ด์ธ๋ฒ”
์–ด์จŒ๋“ , ๊ทธ์˜ ๋ง๋Œ€๋กœ ๊ทธ๋Š” ๋ฏธ์นœ ์ง“์„ ๋„ˆ๋ฌด ์ž˜ ํ•œ ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
05:25
Anyway, he faked madness too well, he said.
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05:29
And they didn't send him to some cushy hospital.
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์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ๊ทธ๋ฅผ ํŽธํ•œ ๋ณ‘์›์œผ๋กœ ๋ณด๋‚ด์ง€ ์•Š์•˜์–ด์š”.
๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด๋กœ ๋ณด๋‚ธ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
05:31
They sent him to Broadmoor.
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05:33
And the minute he got there,
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๊ฑฐ๊ธฐ ๋„์ฐฉํ•˜์ž ๋งˆ์ž
05:35
said he took one look at the place, asked to see the psychiatrist,
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์ฃผ์œ„๋ฅผ ๋Œ์•„๋ณด๊ณ ๋Š”, ๊ทธ๋Š” ์ •์‹ ๊ณผ ์˜์‚ฌ๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋‚˜๊ณ  ์‹ถ๋‹ค๋ฉฐ
"๋ญ”๊ฐ€ ์•„์ฃผ ์ž˜ ๋ชป ๋์–ด์š”.
05:38
said, "There's been a terrible misunderstanding.
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์ €๋Š” ์ •์‹ ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋ณ‘๋“ ๊ฒŒ ์•„๋‹™๋‹ˆ๋‹ค"๋ผ๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
05:40
I'm not mentally ill."
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "์—ฌ๊ธฐ์— ์–ผ๋งˆ๋‚˜ ์žˆ์—ˆ์ฃ ?"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌป์ž
05:43
I said, "How long have you been here for?"
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"ํ .., ์›๋ž˜ ๋ฒ”์ฃ„์˜ ํ˜•๊ธฐ๋Š” ๋งˆ์ณค์–ด์š”"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
05:45
He said, "Well, if I'd just done my time in prison
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05:47
for the original crime, I'd have got five years.
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"5๋…„ ํ˜•์ด์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
05:50
I've been in Broadmoor for 12 years."
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๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์—๋Š” 12๋…„ ์žˆ์—ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค."
ํ† ๋‹ˆ์˜ ๋ง์— ์˜ํ•˜๋ฉด ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์—๊ฒŒ ์ •์‹ ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋ฉ€์ฉกํ•˜๋‹ค๋Š”๊ฑธ ์•Œ๋ฆฌ๋Š”๊ฒŒ
05:56
Tony said that it's a lot harder to convince people you're sane
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๋ฏธ์ณค๋‹ค๊ณ  ํ™•์‹ ์‹œํ‚ค๋Š” ๊ฒƒ๋ณด๋‹ค ํ›จ์”ฌ ๋” ํž˜๋“ค๋”๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•˜๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
06:00
than it is to convince them you're crazy.
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06:02
He said, "I thought the best way to seem normal
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. " ์ œ ์ƒ๊ฐ์— ๊ฐ€์žฅ ์ •์ƒ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋ณด์ด๋Š” ๋ฐฉ๋ฒ•์€
06:04
would be to talk to people normally about normal things
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์ถ•๊ตฌ๋‚˜ ํ‹ฐ๋น„์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ, ๋ณดํ†ต ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ํ•˜๋Š” ์ผ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด์„œ
์ •์ƒ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋งํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฑฐ๋ž๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
06:07
like football or what's on TV.
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์ €๋Š” "์ƒˆ ๊ณผํ•™์ž(New Scientist)"๋ผ๋Š” ์žก์ง€๋„ ์ •๊ธฐ ๊ตฌ๋…ํ•˜๋Š”๋ฐ
06:09
I subscribe to New Scientist,
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06:11
and recently they had an article
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์ตœ๊ทผ์— ๊ธฐ์‚ฌ๋ฅผ ํ•˜๋‚˜๋ฅผ ํ•˜๋‚˜ ์ฝ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
06:12
about how the U.S. Army was training bumblebees to sniff out explosives.
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๋ฏธ๊ตญ ๊ตฐ๋Œ€๊ฐ€ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ๋ฒŒ์ด ํญ๋ฐœ๋ฌผ์„ ์ฐพ์•„๋‚ด๋„๋ก ํ›ˆ๋ จ์‹œํ‚ค๋Š”์ง€์— ๋Œ€ํ•œ ๊ฑฐ์˜€์ฃ .
06:17
So I said to a nurse,
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๊ฐ„ํ˜ธ์‚ฌ์—๊ฒŒ ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
06:18
'Did you know that the U.S. Army is training bumblebees
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'๋ฏธ๊ตญ ๊ตฐ๋Œ€๊ฐ€ ๋ฒŒ์ด ํญ๋ฐ•๋ฌผ์„ ์ฐพ์•„๋‚ด๋„๋ก ํ›ˆ๋ จ์‹œํ‚ค๋Š”๊ฑธ
06:21
to sniff out explosives?'
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์•Œ๊ณ  ์žˆ์–ด์š”?'
์ œ๊ฐ€ ์ œ ์˜๋ฃŒ ๊ธฐ๋ก์„ ๋ดค๋”๋‹ˆ,
06:23
When I read my medical notes, I saw they'd written:
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ์ผ๋”๊ตฐ์š”:
'๋ฒŒ์ด ํญ๋ฐœ๋ฌผ์„ ์ฐพ์•„๋‚ผ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๋‹ค๊ณ  ๋ฏฟ๋Š”๋‹ค.' "
06:26
'Believes bees can sniff out explosives.'"
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06:29
(Laughter)
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋ฐ˜๋ฌธํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. "๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ํ•ญ์ƒ ์ œ ์ •์‹  ์ƒํƒœ์— ๋Œ€ํ•œ
06:31
He said, "You know, they're always looking out for nonverbal clues
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๋น„์–ธ์–ด์  ๋‹จ์„œ๋ฅผ ์ฐพ์•„๋‚ด๋ ค๊ณ  ํ•ด์š”.
06:34
to my mental state.
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ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ '์ •์ƒ์ธ์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ ์•‰๋Š”๋‹ค'๋Š” ๊ฒŒ ๋ญ์ฃ ?
06:36
But how do you sit in a sane way?
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06:38
How do you cross your legs in a sane way?
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  '์ •์ƒ์ธ์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ ๋‹ค๋ฆฌ๋ฅผ ๊ผฌ๊ณ  ์•‰๋Š”๋‹ค'๋Š” ๊ฑด ๋˜ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ?
06:41
It's just impossible."
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๊ทธ๊ฑด ๊ทธ์ € ๋ถˆ๊ฐ€๋Šฅํ•ด์š”"
06:42
When Tony said that to me,
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ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ๊ทธ๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋งํ•  ๋•Œ,
06:44
I thought to myself, "Am I sitting like a journalist?
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์ €๋Š” ํ˜ผ์ž ์ƒ๊ฐํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "๋‚˜๋Š” ์ €๋„๋ฆฌ์ŠคํŠธ์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ ์•‰์„๊นŒ?
๋‚˜๋Š” ์ €๋„๋ฆฌ์ŠคํŠธ์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ ๋‹ค๋ฆฌ๋ฅผ ๊ผฌ๊ณ  ์•‰๋‚˜?
06:48
Am I crossing my legs like a journalist?"
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๊ทธ๋Š” " ์ œ ์•ˆ์˜ ํ•œ ์ผ ์—๋Š” ์Šคํƒ์›ฐ ์ŠคํŠธ๋žญ๊ธ€๋Ÿฌ๊ฐ™์€ ์ธก๋ฉด๋„ ์žˆ๊ณ  *์Šคํƒ์›ฐ ์ŠคํŠธ๋žญ๊ธ€๋Ÿฌ: ์˜๊ตญ์˜ ์—ฐ์‡„ ์‚ด์ธ๋ฒ”
06:51
He said, "You know, I've got the Stockwell Strangler on one side of me,
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06:56
and I've got the 'Tiptoe Through the Tulips' rapist
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๋‹ค๋ฅธ ํ•œ์ชฝ์—๋Š” 'ํŠœ๋ฆฝ์‚ฌ์ด๋กœ ์ข…์ข…๊ฑธ์Œ' ๊ฐ•๊ฐ„๋ฒ”๊ฐ™์€ ์ธก๋ฉด๋„ ์žˆ์–ด์š”. *ํŠœ๋ฆฝ์‚ฌ์ด๋กœ ์ข…์ข…๊ฑธ์Œ: ์˜ค๋ž˜๋œ ๋™์š” ์ œ๋ชฉ
06:58
on the other side of me.
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07:00
So I tend to stay in my room a lot because I find them quite frightening.
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ ๊ฒƒ๋“ค์ด ์ •๋ง ๋ฌด์„œ์›Œ์„œ, ์ €๋Š” ๋ฐฉ์— ํ˜ผ์ž ์žˆ๋Š” ํŽธ์ด์—์š”.
07:03
And they take that as a sign of madness.
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์ € ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ๊ทธ๊ฑธ ๋ฏธ์ณ๊ฐ€๋Š” ์ฆ์„ธ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฐ›์•„๋“ค์ด์ฃ .
07:05
They say it proves that I'm aloof and grandiose."
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์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ๊ทธ๊ฑธ๋กœ ์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋ƒ‰๋‹ดํ•˜๊ณ  ๊ฑฐ๋“ค๋จน๊ฑฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ํ‘œ์‹œ๋ฅผ ํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฑฐ๋ผ๊ณ ๋“ค ํ•˜์ฃ ."
๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์—์„œ๋งŒ, ๋‹ค๋ฅธ ์—ฐ์‡„์‚ด์ธ๋ฒ”๊ณผ ์–ด์šธ๋ฆฌ์ง€ ์•Š๋Š”๊ฑธ
07:09
So, only in Broadmoor would not wanting to hang out with serial killers
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07:13
be a sign of madness.
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๋ฏธ์ณ๊ฐ€๋Š” ์ฆ์„ธ๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•˜๋Š”๊ฑฐ์—์š”.
์–ด์จ‹๋“ , ์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋ณด๊ธฐ์— ๊ทธ๋Š” ์™„์ „ํžˆ ๋ฉ€์ฉกํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. -- ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ ์ œ๊ฐ€ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ์•Œ๊ฒ ์–ด์š”?
07:15
Anyway, he seemed completely normal to me, but what did I know?
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์ง‘์œผ๋กœ ๋Œ์•„์™€์„œ ์ €๋Š” ๊ทธ์˜ ๋‹ด๋‹น์˜์ธ ์•ค์†Œ๋‹ˆ ๋งค๋“ ์—๊ฒŒ ์ด๋ฉ”์ผ์„ ๋ณด๋ƒˆ์ฃ .
07:19
And when I got home I emailed his clinician, Anthony Maden.
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"์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ๋œ๊ฑฐ์—์š”?"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
07:22
I said, "What's the story?"
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07:23
And he said, "Yep. We accept that Tony faked madness
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๊ทธ์˜ ๋‹ต์€ "๊ทธ๋ž˜์š”. ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ์ˆ˜๊ฐ์ƒํ™œ์„ ๋ฉดํ•˜๋ ค๊ณ  ๊ฑฐ์ง“์œผ๋กœ ๋ฏธ์นœ ์ฒ™ํ•œ๊ฑธ ์•Œ๊ณ  ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
07:27
to get out of a prison sentence, because his hallucinations --
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๊ทธ ์ด์œ ๋Š”, ์šฐ์„ , ๋‚ก์€ ์ˆ˜๋ฒ•์ธ ํ™˜์˜(ๅนปๅฝฑ)์ฆ์„ธ๊ฐ€
07:30
that had seemed quite cliche to begin with --
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07:33
just vanished the minute he got to Broadmoor.
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๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์— ์˜ค์ž๋งˆ์ž ๋ฐ”๋กœ ์—†์–ด์กŒ๋‹ค๋Š”๊ฑฐ์ฃ .
07:35
However, we have assessed him,
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ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ, ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ๊ทธ๋ฅผ ํ‰๊ฐ€ํ–ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ
07:37
and we've determined that what he is
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์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ํ˜„์žฌ์˜ ๊ทธ๋Š” ์ •์‹ ์งˆํ™˜์„ ๊ฐ€์กŒ๋‹ค๊ณ  ๊ฒฐ๋ก ์„ ๋‚ด๋ ธ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
07:40
is a psychopath."
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07:42
And in fact, faking madness
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์‚ฌ์‹ค ๋ฏธ์นœ์ฒ™ ํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์€
์ •ํ™•ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ์ผ์ข…์˜ ์‚ฌ๊ธฐํ–‰์œ„์ด๊ณ  ์ •์‹ ์งˆํ™˜์  ๊ธฐ๋งŒํ–‰์œ„์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
07:44
is exactly the kind of cunning and manipulative act of a psychopath.
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07:48
It's on the checklist: cunning, manipulative.
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๊ทธ๊ฑด ๊ฒ€์‚ฌํ•ญ๋ชฉ์—๋„ ์žˆ์–ด์š”: ์‚ฌ๊ธฐ์™€ ์˜๋„์  ๊ธฐ๋งŒ
๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ์ž์‹ ์˜ ๋‡Œ๊ฐ€ ์ž˜ ๋ชป ๋๋‹ค๊ณ  ์†์ด๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์€
07:51
So, faking your brain going wrong
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์ •๋ง๋กœ ๋‡Œ๊ฐ€ ์ž˜ ๋ชป ๋๋‹ค๋Š” ์ฆ๊ฑฐ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
07:53
is evidence that your brain has gone wrong.
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07:56
And I spoke to other experts,
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์ €๋Š” ๋‹ค๋ฅธ ์ „๋ฌธ๊ฐ€์™€๋„ ์ƒ์˜ํ•ด ๋ดฃ๋Š”๋ฐ
07:57
and they said the pinstripe suit -- classic psychopath --
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค ๋ง๋กœ ๊ฐ€๋Š” ๋ฌด๋Šฌ ์˜ท์€ ์ „ํ˜•์ ์ธ ์ •์‹ ์งˆํ™˜์˜ ํ‘œ์ถœ์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
08:01
speaks to items one and two on the checklist:
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๊ฒ€์‚ฌ์ง€์— ์žˆ๋Š” ํ•œ๋‘๊ฐœ์˜ ๋ฌธํ•ญ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด ๋งํ•˜์ž๋ฉด --
๋ง์ด ๋งŽ๊ณ , ์™ธ๊ฒฌ์ƒ์œผ๋กœ๋Š” ๊น”๋”ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ, ํ˜ผ์ž์˜ ์ž์กด์‹ฌ์— ์ฐจ์„œ ๊ฑฐ๋“ค๋จน๊ฑฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ์ƒํƒœ ๋ง์ด์—์š”.
08:04
glibness, superficial charm and grandiose sense of self-worth.
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08:07
And I said, "Well, but why didn't he hang out with the other patients?"
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์ฃ . "๊ทธ๋Ÿผ, ๊ทธ๋Š” ์™œ ๋‹ค๋ฅธ ํ™˜์ž๋“ค๊ณผ ํ•จ๊ป˜ ์–ด์šธ๋ฆฌ์ง€ ์•Š์œผ๋ ค๊ณ  ํ•˜์ฃ ?
08:11
Classic psychopath -- it speaks to grandiosity and also lack of empathy.
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์ „ํ˜•์ ์ธ ์ •์‹ ์งˆํ™˜ -- ๊ณผ์žฅ๊ณผ ๊ฐ์ •์ด์ž… -- ์ด์ฃ .
08:15
So all the things that had seemed most normal about Tony
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ํ† ๋‹ˆ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด์„œ ์ •์ƒ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋ณด์ด๋Š” ๋ชจ๋“  ๊ฒƒ์ด
08:19
was evidence, according to his clinician,
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ํ† ๋ฏธ๊ฐ€ ์•“๊ณ  ์žˆ๋Š” ์งˆํ™˜์˜ ์ฆ๊ฑฐ์˜€์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค, ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋‹ด๋‹น์˜๊ฐ€ ๋งํ•˜๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ํ† ๋‹ˆ์˜ ์งˆํ™˜์€ ์ƒˆ๋กœ์šด ๋ฐฉ์‹์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
08:22
that he was mad in this new way.
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08:24
He was a psychopath.
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๊ทธ๋Š” ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์˜€์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. *์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค - ํญ๋ ฅ์„ฑ์„ ๋™๋ฐ˜ํ•˜๋Š” ์ด์ƒ์‹ฌ๋ฆฌ ์†Œ์œ ์ž
08:26
And his clinician said to me, "If you want to know more about psychopaths,
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๊ทธ์˜ ๋‹ด๋‹น์˜๋Š” ์ œ๊ฒŒ
"์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด์„œ ๋” ์•Œ๊ณ  ์‹ถ์œผ๋ฉด
08:29
you can go on a psychopath-spotting course
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์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜ ํ™•์ง„ ๊ฐ•์ขŒ๋ฅผ ๋“ค์–ด๋ณด์„ธ์š”.
08:32
run by Robert Hare, who invented the psychopath checklist."
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์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜ ๊ฒ€์‚ฌ์ง€๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋“  ๋กœ๋ฒ„ํŠธ ํ—ค์–ด๊ฐ€ ์šด์˜ํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฐ•์˜๊ฐ€ ์žˆ์–ด์š”."๋ผ๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์ฃ .
08:35
So I did.
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๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ €๋Š” ๊ทธ ๊ฐ•์˜๋ฅผ ์ˆ˜๊ฐ•ํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
08:36
I went on a psychopath-spotting course,
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์ €๋Š” ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค ํ™•์ง„ ๊ฐ•์ขŒ๋ฅผ ์ˆ˜๊ฐ•ํ–ˆ๊ณ 
08:39
and I am now a certified --
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์ง€๊ธˆ์€ ์ž๊ฒฉ์ฆ๋„ ๊ฐ–๊ณ  ์žˆ์–ด์š” --
์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ•˜๊ฑด๋ฐ, ์ง€๋‚˜์น˜๊ฒŒ ์ „๋ฌธํ™”๋œ --
08:43
and I have to say, extremely adept -- psychopath spotter.
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์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค ํ™•์ง„ ์ž๊ฒฉ์ด ์žˆ์ฃ .
์ด๋Ÿฐ ํ†ต๊ณ„๊ฐ€ ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค:
08:48
So, here's the statistics:
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์ •์ƒ์ธ 100๋ช… ์ค‘์— 1๋ช…์€ ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค๋‹ค.
08:51
One in a hundred regular people is a psychopath.
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์—ฌ๊ธฐ ์ด ๊ฐ•์—ฐ์žฅ์—๋Š” 1,500๋ช…์ด ์žˆ์œผ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ
08:56
So there's 1,500 people in his room.
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์—ฌ๋Ÿฌ๋ถ„๋“ค ์ค‘ 15๋ช…์€ ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์˜ˆ์š”.
09:00
Fifteen of you are psychopaths.
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๊ทธ ์ˆซ์ž๊ฐ€ CEO์™€ ๊ณ ์œ„๊ธ‰ ํšŒ์‚ฌ์›๋“ค์—๊ฒŒ๋Š”
09:05
Although that figure rises to four percent of CEOs and business leaders,
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์กฐ๊ธˆ ๋” ๋†’๊ธฐ๋Š” ํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
09:10
so I think there's a very good chance
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ์ œ ์ƒ๊ฐ์—๋Š”, ์ด ๊ฐ•์—ฐ์žฅ์—
09:12
there's about 30 or 40 psychopaths in this room.
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์•ฝ 30์—์„œ 40%์˜ ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋‹ค๋Š” ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
09:17
It could be carnage by the end of the night.
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๊ฐ•์—ฐ์ด ๋๋‚  ์˜ค๋Š˜ ๋ฐค ์ฏค์ด๋ฉด ๋Œ€๋Ÿ‰ ํ•™์‚ด์ด ์‹œ์ž‘๋ ๋Ÿฐ์ง€๋„ ๋ชจ๋ฅด๊ฒ ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
09:20
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ) (์›ƒ์Œ)
09:24
Hare said the reason why is because capitalism at its most ruthless
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ํ—ค์–ด์˜ ๋ง์— ๋”ฐ๋ฅด๋ฉด ๊ทธ ์ด์œ ๋Š” ์ •๋ง ๋ฌด๋ชจํ•œ ์ด ์ž๋ณธ์ฃผ์˜๊ฐ€
09:29
rewards psychopathic behavior --
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์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์  ํ–‰๋™์— ์ตœ๋Œ€์˜ ์ˆ˜ํ˜œ๋ฅผ ์ฃผ๊ธฐ ๋•Œ๋ฌธ์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. --
09:32
the lack of empathy, the glibness,
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๋™๊ฐ์˜ ๋ถ€์กฑ, ๋– ๋ฒŒ์ž„,
09:37
cunning, manipulative.
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์‚ฌ๊ธฐ, ๊ธฐ๋งŒ ๊ฐ™์€ ๊ฒƒ๋“ค์ด์š”.
09:39
In fact, capitalism, perhaps at its most remorseless,
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์‚ฌ์‹ค, ๊ฐ€์žฅ ๋ƒ‰์ •ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋ณธ๋‹ค๋ฉด ์ž๋ณธ์ฃผ์˜๋Š”
09:42
is a physical manifestation of psychopathy.
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์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์˜ ๋ฌผ๋ฆฌ์  ํ‘œ์ƒ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
๊ทธ๊ฑด ๊ฒฐ๊ตญ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ ๋ชจ๋‘์—๊ฒŒ ์˜ํ–ฅ์„ ์ฃผ๋Š”
09:47
It's like a form of psychopathy that's come down to affect us all.
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์ผ์ข…์˜ ์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜๊ณผ ๊ฐ™์•„์š”.
09:52
Hare said, "You know what? Forget about some guy at Broadmoor
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ํ—ค์–ด๊ฐ€ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋งํ•œ ์ ์ด ์žˆ์–ด์š”. "๊ทธ๊ฑฐ ์•Œ์•„์š”? ๋ฏธ์นœ ์ฒ™์„ ํ–ˆ๊ฑด ๋ง๊ฑด
09:55
who may or may not have faked madness.
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๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์— ์žˆ๋Š” ๊ทธ ์นœ๊ตฌ๋Š” ์ด์ œ ์žŠ์œผ์„ธ์š”.
09:57
Who cares? That's not a big story.
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๋ˆ„๊ฐ€ ์ƒ๊ด€ํ•œ๋‹ต๋‹ˆ๊นŒ? ๊ทธ๊ฑด ๋ญ ๋Œ€๋‹จํ•œ ์ด์•ผ๊ธฐ๋„ ์•„๋‹ˆ์ฃ .
09:58
The big story," he said, "is corporate psychopathy.
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์ •๋ง ๊ต‰์žฅํ•œ๊ฑด ๊ธฐ์—…์ ์ธ ์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜์ด์—์š”.
10:01
You want to go and interview yourself some corporate psychopaths."
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์ง์ ‘ ๊ฐ€์„œ ๊ธฐ์—…์  ์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜์ž๋“ค์„ ๋งŒ๋‚˜ ์ธํ„ฐ๋ทฐ๋ฅผ ํ•ด๋ณด์„ธ์š”."
10:06
So I gave it a try. I wrote to the Enron people.
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๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ํ•ด๋ดค์–ด์š”. ์ €๋Š” ์—”๋ก ์‚ฌ(็คพ) ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์—๊ฒŒ ํŽธ์ง€๋ฅผ ์ผ์ฃ .
10:09
I said, "Could I come and interview you in prison,
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๊ทธ๋žฌ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. "๊ต๋„์†Œ์—์„œ ๋‹น์‹ ๋“ค์„ ๋งŒ๋‚˜
์ •๋ง ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์ธ์ง€ ์ง„๋‹จํ•ด๋ด๋„ ๋ ๊นŒ์š”?"
10:11
to find out it you're psychopaths?"
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๊ทธ๋“ค์€ ๋‹ตํ•˜์ง€ ์•Š์•˜์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
10:13
(Laughter)
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10:14
And they didn't reply.
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10:16
(Laughter)
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10:17
So I changed tack.
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๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ €๋Š” ๋ฐฉํ–ฅ์„ ๋ฐ”๊ฟจ์ฃ .
10:19
I emailed "Chainsaw Al" Dunlap,
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"์ „๊ธฐํ†ฑ ์•จ" ๋˜๋žฉ์—๊ฒŒ ์ด๋ฉ”์ผ์„ ๋ณด๋ƒˆ์–ด์š”. *"์ „๊ธฐํ†ฑ ์•จ" ๋˜๋žฉ: ์€ํ‡ด ์ „๋ฌธ ๊ฒฝ์˜์ž, ์ •๋ฆฌ ํ•ด๊ณ ๋กœ ์œ ๋ช…ํ•จ
10:22
the asset stripper from the 1990s.
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1990๋…„๋Œ€์˜ ์ž๋ณธ ๊ตฌ์กฐ ์กฐ์ • ์ „๋ฌธ๊ฐ€์ฃ .
10:26
He would come into failing businesses
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์ด ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ๋งํ•ด๊ฐ€๋Š” ์‚ฌ์—…์„ ์ธ์ˆ˜ํ•ด์„œ ๋…ธ๋™์ž์˜ 30%๋ฅผ ์ค„์ด๋ฉด์„œ
10:28
and close down 30 percent of the workforce,
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10:30
just turn American towns into ghost towns.
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๋ฏธ๊ตญ์˜ ๋งˆ์„๋“ค์„ ์ดˆํ† ํ™”์‹œ์ผœ ์œ ๋ น ๋งˆ์„๋กœ ๋งŒ๋“œ๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด์—ˆ์ฃ .
10:33
And I emailed him and I said,
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์—๊ฒŒ ์ด๋Ÿฐ ์ด๋ฉ”์ผ์„ ๋ณด๋ƒˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
10:35
"I believe you may have a very special brain anomaly
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"์ €๋Š” ๋‹น์‹ ์ด ๋ˆ„๊ตฐ๊ฐ€๋ฅผ ์•ฝํƒˆํ•˜์—ฌ
์ž์‹ ์„ ํŠน๋ณ„ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋งŒ๋“ค๊ณ ๋„ ๋‘๋ ค์›€์„ ๊ฐ–์ง€ ์•Š๋Š”
10:38
that makes you ... special,
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10:40
and interested in the predatory spirit, and fearless.
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๋งค์šฐ ํŠน์ดํ•œ ๋‡Œ์˜ ๋ฌธ์ œ๋ฅผ ๊ฐ€์ง€๊ณ  ์žˆ๋‹ค๊ณ  ์ƒ๊ฐํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
10:44
Can I come and interview you about your special brain anomaly?"
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๊ฐ€์„œ ๋‹น์‹  ๋‡Œ์˜ ํŠน์ดํ•œ ๋ฌธ์ œ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด
์ธํ„ฐ๋ทฐ๋ฅผ ํ•  ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ์„๊นŒ์š”?"
๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "์˜ค์„ธ์š”"
10:48
And he said, "Come on over!"
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10:49
(Laughter)
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10:51
So I went to Al Dunlap's grand Florida mansion.
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๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ œ๊ฐ€ ํ”Œ๋กœ๋ฆฌ๋‹ค ์ €ํƒ์œผ๋กœ ๋˜๋žฉ์„ ์ฐพ์•„๊ฐ”์ฃ .
10:54
It was filled with sculptures of predatory animals.
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๊ทธ์˜ ์ €ํƒ์€ ํฌ์•…์Šค๋Ÿฐ ๋™๋ฌผ๋“ค์˜ ์กฐ๊ฐ๋“ค๋กœ ๊ฝ‰ ์ฐจ ์žˆ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
10:59
There were lions and tigers -- he was taking me through the garden --
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์‚ฌ์ž์™€ ํ˜ธ๋ž‘์ด๊ฐ€ ์žˆ์—ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ์ €๋ฅผ ์ •์›์„ ๊ฐ€๋กœ์งˆ๋Ÿฌ ์ธ๋„ํ–ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ
11:03
there were falcons and eagles,
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๋…์ˆ˜๋ฆฌ์™€ ๋งค๋„ ์žˆ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
11:05
he was saying, "Over there you've got sharks and --"
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์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ๋„ ๋งํ•˜๋”๊ตฐ์š”. "์ €๊ธฐ ์ƒ์–ด๋„ ์žˆ์–ด์š”."
์ด ๋ง์€ ์ข€ ์•ฝํ•˜๊ฒŒ ํ–ˆ์ฃ .
11:08
he was saying this in a less effeminate way --
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11:10
"You've got more sharks and you've got tigers."
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"์ƒ์–ด๋„ ๋” ์žˆ๊ณ  ํ˜ธ๋ž‘์ด๋„ ์žˆ์–ด์š”."
11:16
It was like Narnia.
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๊ผญ ๋‚˜๋‹ˆ์•„ ๊ฐ™์•˜์–ด์š”.
11:18
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
11:21
And then we went into his kitchen.
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๋‚˜์„œ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ๊ทธ์˜ ๋ถ€์—Œ์œผ๋กœ ๊ฐ”์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
11:24
Now, Al Dunlap would be brought in to save failing companies,
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์•จ ๋˜๋žฉ์€ ๋ฌด๋„ˆ์ ธ๊ฐ€๋Š” ํšŒ์‚ฌ๋ฅผ ๊ตฌํ•˜๋ผ๊ณ  ์˜์ž…๋˜๊ณค ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
11:28
he'd close down 30 percent of the workforce.
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๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ๋ฐ ๊ทธ๋Š” ๋…ธ๋™์ž์˜ 30%๋‚˜ ์ •๋ฆฌํ•ด๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
11:30
And he'd quite often fire people with a joke.
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๊ทธ๋Š” ๋†๋‹ด์„ ์„ž์–ด๊ฐ€๋ฉฐ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์„ ํ•ด๊ณ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
11:33
Like, for instance, one famous story about him,
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์˜ˆ๋ฅผ ๋“ค๋ฉด, ์ด ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์— ๊ด€ํ•œ ์œ ๋ช…ํ•œ ์ด์•ผ๊ธฐ๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ,
11:36
somebody came up to him and said, "I've just bought myself a new car."
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์–ด๋–ค ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด ๊ทธ์—๊ฒŒ ์™€์„œ "์ € ์ƒˆ์ฐจ๋ฅผ ์ƒ€์–ด์š”."๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•˜์ž
11:39
And he said, "Well, you may have a new car,
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"์ด์ œ ์ƒˆ ์ฐจ๋ฅผ ๊ฐ€์ง€๊ฒŒ ๋˜์—ˆ๊ตฐ์š”.
11:41
but I'll tell you what you don't have -- a job."
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๊ฐ–์ง€ ๋ชปํ•œ๊ฑธ ์•Œ๋ ค๋“œ๋ฆด๊นŒ์š”. ๋‹น์‹ ์€ ์ด์ œ ์ง์žฅ์ด ์—†์„๊ฑฐ์š”." ๋ผ๊ณ  ํ–ˆ๋‹ค์ฃ .
11:46
So in his kitchen --
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11:47
he was in there with his wife, Judy, and his bodyguard, Sean --
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์–ด์จŒ๋“ , ๊ทธ์˜ ๋ถ€์—Œ์—์„œ -- ๊ทธ๋Š” ๊ทธ์˜ ๋ถ€์ธ ์ฅฌ๋””์™€ ๊ฒฝํ˜ธ์›์ธ ์…˜๊ณผ ํ•จ๊ป˜ ์„œ ์žˆ์—ˆ์–ด์š”. --
์ œ๊ฐ€ ๊ทธ๋žฌ์ฃ  "์ œ๊ฐ€ ์ด๋ฉ”์ผ๋กœ
11:50
and I said, "You know how I said in my email
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๋‹น์‹ ์„ ๊ฐ๋ณ„ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ํ•˜๋Š” ๋‡Œ์˜ ํŠน๋ณ„ํ•œ ๋ฌธ์ œ์ ์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด์„œ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ๋ง์”€๋“œ๋ ธ๋Š”์ง€ ์•„์‹œ์ฃ ?"
11:53
that you might have a special brain anomaly that makes you special?"
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11:56
He said, "Yeah, it's an amazing theory, it's like Star Trek.
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ด๋žฌ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค . "๋„ค, ๋†€๋ผ์šด ์ด๋ก ์ด๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
๊ผญ ์Šคํƒ€ ํŠธ๋ž™๊ฐ™๋˜๋ฐ์š”. ๋‹น์‹ ์€ ์•„๋ฌด๋„ ๊ฐ€์ง€ ์•Š์€ ๊ธธ์„ ๊ฐ€๋ ค๊ณ  ํ•˜๋”๊ตฐ์š”."
11:59
You're going where no man has gone before."
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12:01
And I said, "Well --" (Clears throat)
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "์Œ.. ์–ด๋–ค ์ •์‹ ๊ณผ ์˜์‚ฌ๋“ค์€
12:04
(Laughter)
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12:06
Some psychologists might say
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12:09
that this makes you --" (Mumbles)
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๋‹น์‹ ์„...๋ผ๊ณ  ์ง„๋‹จํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค." (์–ผ๋ฒ„๋ฌด๋ฆผ)
12:12
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
12:13
And he said, "What?"
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋ฌผ์–ด์š” "๋ญ๋ผ๊ตฌ์š”?"
์ œ๊ฐ€ ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋งํ–ˆ์ฃ  "์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์š”."
12:16
And I said, "A psychopath."
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12:17
And I said, "I've got a list of psychopathic traits in my pocket.
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ ๋Š” " ์ œ ์ฃผ๋จธ๋‹ˆ์—๋Š” ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค์˜ ์ง•์กฐ๋ฅผ ๋‚˜์—ดํ•œ ๋ชฉ๋ก์ด ์žˆ์–ด์š”.
12:21
Can I go through them with you?"
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๋‹น์‹ ํ•œํ…Œ ๊ทธ๊ฑธ ํ™•์ธํ•ด๋ด๋„ ๋ ๊นŒ์š”?"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌผ์—ˆ์ฃ .
12:24
And he looked intrigued despite himself,
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ํฅ๋ฏธ๊ฐ€ ๋‹๋Š”์ง€
12:26
and he said, "Okay, go on."
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"๊ทธ๋ž˜๋ณด์ฃ ." ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
12:28
And I said, "Okay. Grandiose sense of self-worth."
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "์ข‹์•„์š”. "๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ์ฃ . ์ž์‹ ๊ฐ์— ์ฐจ์„œ ๊ฑฐ๋“ค๋จน๊ฑฐ๋ฆฌ๊ธฐ."
12:31
Which I have to say, would have been hard for him to deny,
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๊ผญ ๋ง์”€๋“œ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ์‹ถ์€๊ฑด, ๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด ๊ทธ๊ฑธ ๋ถ€์ •ํ•˜๊ธด ์–ด๋ ค์› ์„๊ฑฐ์—์š”.
12:34
because he was standing under a giant oil painting of himself.
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์™œ๋ƒํ•˜๋ฉด ๊ทธ๋Š” ์ปค๋‹ค๋ž€ ์ž์‹ ์˜ ์œ ํ™” ์ดˆ์ƒ ์•„๋ž˜ ์„œ ์žˆ์—ˆ๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”.
12:37
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
12:41
He said, "Well, you've got to believe in you!"
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "๋‹น์‹ ์„ ๋ฏฟ์–ด์•ผ๊ฒ ์ฃ !"
12:45
And I said, "Manipulative."
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. "๊ธฐ๋งŒ"
12:47
He said, "That's leadership."
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋”๊ตฐ์š” "๊ทธ๊ฑด ๋ฆฌ๋”์‰ฝ์ด์ฃ ."
12:49
(Laughter)
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12:50
And I said, "Shallow affect,
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋งํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "ํ”ผ์ƒ์  ์ •์„œ:
ํŠน์ • ๊ฐ์ •์˜ ํญ์„ ๋Š๋ผ์ง€ ๋ชปํ•˜๋Š” ์ƒํƒœ."
12:53
an inability to experience a range of emotions."
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12:55
He said, "Who wants to be weighed down by some nonsense emotions?"
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋งํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. "๋ˆ„๊ฐ€ ์–•์€ ๊ฐ์ •์œผ๋กœ ๊ฒฝ์†”ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ํ–‰๋™ํ•˜๋ ค๊ณ  ํ•˜๊ฒ ์Šต๋‹ˆ๊นŒ?"
๊ทธ๋Š” ์ ์  ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค ํ™•์ •์„ ๋‹ค๋‹ค๋ฅด๊ณ  ์žˆ์—ˆ์ฃ .
12:59
So he was going down the psychopath checklist,
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13:01
basically turning it into "Who Moved My Cheese?"
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๊ทธ๋Š” ๊ทธ ๋ชฉ๋ก์— ์ด๋Ÿฐ ์‹์œผ๋กœ ๋Œ€์‘ํ•˜๋Š”๊ฑฐ์˜€์–ด์š” "๋ˆ„๊ฐ€ ๋‚ด ์น˜์ฆˆ๋ฅผ ์˜ฎ๊ฒจ๋†จ์–ด?"
13:04
(Laughter)
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(์›ƒ์Œ)
13:07
But I did notice something happening to me the day I was with Al Dunlap.
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ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ ์ €๋Š” ์ œ๊ฐ€ ์•จ ๋˜๋žฉ๊ณผ ํ•จ๊ป˜ ์žˆ๋˜ ๊ทธ๋‚ , ์ €์—๊ฒŒ ๋ญ”๊ฐ€ ์ผ์–ด๋‚˜๋Š” ๊ฑธ ๋Š๊ผˆ์–ด์š”.
13:11
Whenever he said anything to me that was kind of normal --
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์ฒญ์†Œ๋…„ ์‹œ์ ˆ์˜ ๋ฒ”์ฃ„๋ฅผ ๋ถ€์ •ํ•˜๋Š” ๋“ฑ,
13:13
like he said "no" to juvenile delinquency,
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ž์‹ ์ด ์ •์ƒ์ ์ด๋ผ๊ณ  ๋งํ•  ๋•Œ๋งˆ๋‹ค ๋ง์ด์ฃ .
13:16
he said he got accepted into West Point,
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๊ทธ๋Š” ์ž์‹ ์ด ๋ฏธ๊ตญ ์œก๊ตฐ์‚ฌ๊ด€ํ•™๊ต์— ์ž…ํ•™ํ–ˆ์—ˆ๊ณ 
13:18
and they don't let delinquents in West Point.
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๊ทธ๊ณณ์€ ์ „๊ณผ์ž๋ฅผ ์ž…ํ•™์‹œํ‚ค์ง€ ์•Š๋Š”๋‹ค๊ณ  ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
13:21
He said "no" to many short-term marital relationships.
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๋˜ '๋‹จ๊ธฐ์ ์ธ ํ˜ผ์ธ ๊ด€๊ณ„]๋„ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ถ€์ •ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
13:24
He's only ever been married twice.
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๊ทธ๋Š” ๊ฒจ์šฐ ๋‘๋ฒˆ ๋ฐ–์— ํ˜ผ์ธํ•˜์ง€ ์•Š์•˜์ฃ .
์ž˜ ์•Œ๋ ค์กŒ๋“ฏ์ด, ๊ทธ์˜ ์ฒซ ๋ถ€์ธ์€ ์ดํ˜ผ ๊ณต์†Œ์žฅ์—
13:26
Admittedly, his first wife cited in her divorce papers
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13:29
that he once threatened her with a knife
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์ž์‹ ์„ ์นผ๋กœ ์œ„ํ˜‘ํ•œ ์ ์ด ์žˆ๋‹ค๊ณ  ์–ธ๊ธ‰ํ–ˆ๊ณ 
13:31
and said he always wondered what human flesh tasted like,
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์ธ์œก(ไบบ่‚‰)์ด ์–ด๋–ค ๋ง›์ผ๊นŒ ํ•ญ์ƒ ๊ถ๊ธˆํ•ดํ•˜๊ณค ํ–ˆ๋‹ต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ ๋ถ€๋ถ€๊ด€๊ณ„๊ฐ€ ๋‚˜๋น ์ ธ ํฅ๋ถ„์— ๋น ์ง„ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ์„œ๋กœ์—๊ฒŒ ์•ˆ์ข‹์€ ๋ง๋„ ํ•˜๊ธฐ ๋งˆ๋ จ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
13:34
but people say stupid things to each other
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13:36
in bad marriages in the heat of an argument,
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๊ทธ๋Š” ๋‘๋ฒˆ์งธ ๊ฒฐํ˜ผ ์ƒํ™œ์„ 41๋…„ ์งธ ํ•ด์™”์–ด์š”.
13:38
and his second marriage has lasted 41 years.
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด ์ •์ƒ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋ณด์ด๋Š” ์ด์•ผ๊ธฐ๋ฅผ ํ•  ๋•Œ๋งˆ๋‹ค,
13:41
So whenever he said anything to me that just seemed kind of non-psychopathic,
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์ € ํ˜ผ์ž ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ์ƒ๊ฐํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. '๋‚ด ์ฑ…์— ์ €๊ฑด ํ•ญ๋ชฉ์œผ๋กœ ๋„ฃ์ง€ ๋ง์•„์•ผ์ง€' ๋ผ๊ณ ์š”.
13:45
I thought to myself, well I'm not going to put that in my book.
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13:48
And then I realized that becoming a psychopath spotter
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ์ œ๊ฐ€ ์•Œ์•„์ฐจ๋ฆฐ๊ฑด ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค ๊ฒ€์‚ฌ์ง€๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋“ค๋‹ค ๋ณด๋ฉด
๋งŒ๋“œ๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋„ ์•ฝ๊ฐ„ ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค ๊ฐ™์•„์ง„๋‹ค๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์ด์ง€์š”.
13:52
had kind of turned me a little bit psychopathic.
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13:55
Because I was desperate to shove him in a box marked "Psychopath."
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๋งˆ์น˜ ์ œ๊ฐ€ '์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค'๋ผ๋Š” ๋ฐ•์Šค์— ์ด ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์„ ๋ฐ€์–ด๋„ฃ์œผ๋ ค๊ณ  ์•ˆ๊ฐ„ํž˜์„ ์“ฐ๊ณ  ์žˆ๋Š” ๊ฒƒ ๊ฐ™์•˜์–ด์š”.
14:00
I was desperate to define him by his maddest edges.
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๊ทธ์˜ ๊ฐ€์žฅ ๋น„์ •์ƒ์ ์ธ ๋ฉด๋งŒ ๋ถ€๊ฐ์‹œํ‚ค๋ฉด์„œ ๋ง์ด์ฃ .
14:05
And I realized, my God --
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๋˜ ์•Œ๊ฒŒ ๋œ ๊ฒƒ์€.. ์ด๋Ÿฐ! ์ €๋Š” ์ด๋Ÿฐ ์ผ์„ 20๋…„์งธ ํ•ด์˜ค๊ณ  ์žˆ์–ด์š”.
14:06
this is what I've been doing for 20 years.
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14:08
It's what all journalists do.
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์ด๊ฑด ์‚ฌ์‹ค ๋ชจ๋“  ์ €๋„๋ฆฌ์ŠคํŠธ๋“ค์ด ํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์ด๊ณ ์š”.
14:10
We travel across the world with our notepads in our hands,
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์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ์†์— ๋…ธํŠธ๋ฅผ ๋“ค๊ณ  ์ „ ์„ธ๊ณ„๋ฅผ ๋– ๋Œ๋ฉฐ
14:13
and we wait for the gems.
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๋ณด๋ฌผ์„ ์ฐพ์•„๋‹ค๋‹ˆ์ฃ .
์—ฌ๊ธฐ์„œ ๋ณด๋ฌผ์ด๋ž€๊ฑด, ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๊ฐ€ ์ธํ„ฐ๋ทฐํ•˜๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์˜
14:16
And the gems are always the outermost aspects
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14:20
of our interviewee's personality.
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๊ฒ‰๋ชจ์Šต๋งŒ์„ ๋ฐ”ํƒ•์œผ๋กœ ์งœ๋งž์ถ”๋Š” ๋งค๋ ฅ์ ์ธ ๊ธฐ์‚ฟ๊ฑฐ๋ฆฌ์ง€์š”.
14:22
And we stitch them together like medieval monks,
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์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ ๊ฒƒ๋“ค์„ ๋งˆ์น˜ ์ค‘์„ธ์˜ ์ˆ˜๋„์‚ฌ์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ ํ•จ๊ป˜ ๊ฟฐ์–ด ๋งž์ถ”๋Š”๊ฑฐ์—์š”.
14:25
and we leave the normal stuff on the floor.
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์ •์ƒ์ ์ด๊ณ  ์ง€๋ฃจํ•œ ์–˜๊ธฐ๋“ค์€ ์ง‘์–ด์น˜์šด ์ฑ„๋กœ์š”.
์‹ค์ œ๋กœ ์ด ๋‚˜๋ผ์—์„œ๋Š” ๋งŽ์€ ์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜๋“ค์ด ๊ณผ๋„ํ•œ ์ง„๋‹จ์„ ๋ฐ›๊ณ  ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
14:30
And you know, this is a country that over-diagnoses
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14:33
certain mental disorders hugely.
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14:36
Childhood bipolar --
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์•„๋™ ์กฐ์šธ์ฆ -- ์ ๊ฒŒ๋Š” 4์‚ด์งœ๋ฆฌ ์•„์ด๋“ค๊นŒ์ง€
14:37
children as young as four are being labeled bipolar
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์•„๋™ ์กฐ์šธ์ฆ ์ง„๋‹จ์„ ๋ฐ›์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
14:41
because they have temper tantrums,
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์•„์ด๊ฐ€ ์งœ์ฆ์„ ์ž˜ ๋ถ€๋ฆฐ๋‹ค๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์„ ๊ทผ๊ฑฐ๋กœ ๋ง์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
14:43
which scores them high on the bipolar checklist.
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์งœ์ฆ์€ ์กฐ์šธ์ฆ ๊ฒ€์‚ฌ์— ๋†’์€ ์ ์ˆ˜๋ฅผ ๋”ํ•˜๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”.
14:48
When I got back to London, Tony phoned me.
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ๋Ÿฐ๋˜์— ๋Œ์•„์™”์„ ๊นจ, ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ์ „ํ™”ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
14:52
He said, "Why haven't you been returning my calls?"
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ " ์™œ ์ œ ์ „ํ™”์— ๋Œ€๋‹ต์„ ์•ˆํ•ด ์คฌ์Šต๋‹ˆ๊นŒ?" ๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌป๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
14:55
I said, "Well, they say that you're a psychopath."
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์ œ๊ฐ€ "์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ๋‹น์‹ ์„ ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ถ€๋ฅด๋˜๋ฐ์š”" ๋ผ๊ณ  ํ•˜์ž
14:58
And he said, "I'm not a psychopath."
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"์ €๋Š” ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค๊ฐ€ ์•„๋‹™๋‹ˆ๋‹ค."๋ผ๊ณ  ๋Œ€๋‹ตํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
15:00
He said, "You know what?
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ด๋Ÿฌ๋”๊ตฐ์š”. "๊ทธ๊ฑฐ ์•„์„ธ์š”? ๊ฐ๊ด€์‹ ๋ฌธํ•ญ์—์„œ '๋ฐ˜์„ฑํ•  ์ค„ ๋ชจ๋ฅธ๋‹ค'๋ผ๋Š” ์„ ์ง€๊ฐ€ ์žˆ์—ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ์š”
15:02
One of the items on the checklist is lack of remorse,
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15:04
but another item on the checklist is cunning, manipulative.
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๊ทธ ๋ฌธํ•ญ์˜ ๋‹ค๋ฅธ ์„ ์ง€๋Š” '๊ตํ™œํ•˜๋‹ค' ์˜€์–ด์š”.
15:07
So when you say you feel remorse for your crime,
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๊ทธ ๋ฌธํ•ญ์— '๋‚ด๊ฐ€ ์ €์ง€๋ฅธ ๋ฒ”์ฃ„์— ๋Œ€ํ•ด ๋ฐ˜์„ฑํ•œ๋‹ค'๋ผ๊ณ  ์‘๋‹ตํ•˜๋ฉด
15:09
they say, 'Typical of the psychopath
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๊ฒ€์‚ฌ ๊ฒฐ๊ณผ๋Š” ์ €๋ฅผ ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋ถ„๋ฅ˜ํ•  ๊ฒƒ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
15:11
to cunningly say he feels remorse when he doesn't.'
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"๊ตํ™œํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋ฐ˜์„ฑํ•˜๋Š” ์ฒ™ํ•˜๋Š” ์ „ํ˜•์ ์ธ ์‹ธ์ด์ฝ”ํŒจ์Šค"
15:15
It's like witchcraft, they turn everything upside-down."
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๊ทธ๊ฑด ๋งˆ์ˆ ๊ณผ ๊ฐ™์€ ๊ฑฐ์—์š”. ๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ ๋ฐฉ์‹์œผ๋กœ๋Š” ๋ญ๋“  ๊ฑฐ๊พธ๋กœ ๋’ค์ง‘์„์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”."
"์ œ ์ถœ์†Œ์ผ์ด ๋‹ค๊ฐ€์˜ค๋Š”๋ฐ
15:19
He said, "I've got a tribunal coming up.
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15:21
Will you come to it?"
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์˜ค์‹œ๊ฒ ์–ด์š”?"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌป๋”๊ตฐ์š”.
๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๊ณ ๋งˆ ํ–ˆ์ฃ .
15:24
So I said okay.
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15:25
So I went to his tribunal.
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ถœ์†Œํ•  ๋•Œ ๊ฐ”์–ด์š”.
15:28
And after 14 years in Broadmoor, they let him go.
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๋ธŒ๋กœ๋“œ๋ฌด์–ด์—์„œ 14๋…„์„ ๋ณด๋‚ธ ํ›„, ๊ทธ๋ฅผ ํ’€์–ด์ค€๊ฑฐ์ฃ .
์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์€ ๊ทธ๋ฅผ ๋ฌดํ•œ์ • ๊ฐ€๋‘ฌ๋‘์–ด์„  ์•ˆ๋œ๋‹ค๊ณ  ๊ฒฐ์ •ํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
15:33
They decided that he shouldn't be held indefinitely
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15:35
because he scores high on a checklist that might mean
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๊ทธ ์ด์œ ๋Š” ๊ฒ€์‚ฌ์—์„œ ๋†’์€ ์ ์ˆ˜๋ฅผ ๋ฐ›์•„
15:39
that he would have a greater than average chance of recidivism.
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ํ‰๊ท ์ ์œผ๋กœ ๋‚˜ํƒ€๋‚˜๋Š” ์ƒ์Šต์  ๋ฒ”ํ–‰ ๊ฐ€๋Šฅ์„ฑ ๋ณด๋‹ค๋Š” ์ข‹์„ ๊ฐ€๋Šฅ์„ฑ์ด ์žˆ๊ธฐ ๋•Œ๋ฌธ์ด์—ˆ๋‹ค๋Š” ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
15:44
So they let him go.
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๊ทธ๋ฅผ ํ’€์–ด ์ฃผ์—ˆ์ฃ .
15:46
And outside in the corridor he said to me,
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๋ณต๋„ ๋์—์„œ ๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ๋งํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
15:48
"You know what, Jon?
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"์กด, ์ด๊ฑฐ ์•„์„ธ์š”?
์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ๋ˆ„๊ตฌ๋‚˜ ์กฐ๊ธˆ์”ฉ์€ ์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜์ด ์žˆ์–ด์š”."
15:50
Everyone's a bit psychopathic."
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15:52
He said, "You are, I am. Well, obviously I am."
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๊ทธ๊ฐ€ "๋‹น์‹ ๋„, ์ €๋„. ์ €์˜ ๊ฒฝ์šฐ๋Š” ํŠนํžˆ ๋ถ„๋ช…ํ•˜์ฃ ."
์ œ๊ฐ€ "์ด์ œ ๋ญ˜ ํ• ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ?"๋ผ๊ณ  ๋ฌป์ž
15:57
I said, "What are you going to do now?"
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์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋‹ตํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. "๋ฒจ๊ธฐ์—๋กœ ๊ฐˆ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
15:59
He said, "I'm going to go to Belgium.
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16:01
There's a woman there that I fancy.
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์ข‹์•„ํ•˜๋Š” ์—ฌ์ž๊ฐ€ ๊ฑฐ๊ธฐ ์žˆ๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”.
16:03
But she's married, so I'm going to have to get her split up from her husband."
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๊ทธ ์—ฌ์ž๋Š” ๊ฒฐํ˜ผ์„ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”. ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ œ๊ฐ€ ๊ทธ ๋‚จํŽธ๊ณผ ํ—ค์–ด์ง€๊ฒŒ ํ• ๊ฒ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค."
(์›ƒ์Œ)
16:07
(Laughter)
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์–ด์ฉ„๋“ , ๊ทธ๊ฒŒ 2๋…„ ์ „์ด์—ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
16:11
Anyway, that was two years ago,
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16:14
and that's where my book ended.
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๊ฑฐ๊ธฐ์„œ ์ œ ์ฑ…์€ ๋๋งˆ์นฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
16:15
And for the last 20 months, everything was fine.
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์ง€๋‚œ 1๋…„ ๋ฐ˜ ๋™์•ˆ, ๋ชจ๋“ ๊ฒŒ ์ข‹์•˜์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
์•„๋ฌด ๋ฌธ์ œ๋„ ์ผ์–ด๋‚˜์ง€ ์•Š์•˜์–ด์š”.
16:21
Nothing bad happened.
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16:22
He was living with a girl outside London.
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ๋Ÿฐ๋˜ ๊ทผ๊ต์— ์–ด๋–ค ์—ฌ์ž์™€ ํ•จ๊ป˜ ์‚ด๊ณ  ์žˆ์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
16:24
He was, according to Brian the Scientologist,
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๋ธŒ๋ผ์ด์–ธ ์ด๋ผ๋Š” ์‚ฌ์–ธํ†จ๋กœ์ง€์ŠคํŠธ์— ์˜ํ•˜๋ฉด, ๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€
16:26
making up for lost time, which I know sounds ominous,
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์žƒ์–ด๋ฒ„๋ฆฐ ์‹œ๊ฐ„์„ ๋ณด์ƒ๋ฐ›๊ณ  ์‹ถ์–ด ํ–ˆ๋‹ต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. --
16:29
but isn't necessarily ominous.
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ์ƒ๊ฐ์— ๊ทธ๊ฑด ์ฉ ์ข‹์€ ์ง•์กฐ๋Š” ์•„๋‹ˆ์—ˆ์ง€๋งŒ ๋ฐ˜๋“œ์‹œ ๋‚˜์˜๋‹ค๋Š” ๋ณด์žฅ๋„ ์—†์—ˆ์–ด์š”.
๋ถˆํ–‰ํ•˜๊ฒŒ๋„, 20๊ฐœ์›”์ด ์ง€๋‚˜,
16:32
Unfortunately, after 20 months,
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16:34
he did go back to jail for a month.
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๊ทธ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ๋‹ค์‹œ ๊ฐ์˜ฅ์— ๋ณด๋‚ด์กŒ์–ด์š”.
16:36
He got into a "fracas" in a bar, he called it.
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์ˆ ์ง‘์—์„œ ์‹ธ์›€์— ์—ฐ๋ฃจ๋œ๊ฑฐ์ฃ . ๊ทธ๋Š” ๊ทธ๊ฑธ ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋งํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
ํ•œ๋‹ฌ๊ฐ„ ๊ต๋„์†Œ์— ๊ฐ€๊ณ  ๋ง์•˜๋‹ค.
16:41
Ended up going to jail for a month, which I know is bad,
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์ œ๊ฐ€ ์ƒ๊ฐ์—๋„ ์ฐธ ์•ˆ๋œ ์ผ์ด์ฃ .
16:44
but at least a month implies that whatever the fracas was,
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๊ทธ๋ ‡์ง€๋งŒ, ํ•œ ๋‹ฌ์ด๋ž€๊ฑธ ๋ณด๋ฉด, ๊ทธ ์‹ธ์›€์ด ์–ด๋• ๋“  ๊ฐ„์—
16:47
it wasn't too bad.
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์•„์ฃผ ๋‚˜์œ ์ข…๋ฅ˜๋Š” ์•„๋‹ˆ์—ˆ๋‚˜๋ด์š”.
๋‚˜์ค‘์— ๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ์ „ํ™”๋ฅผ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”.
16:50
And then he phoned me.
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16:53
And you know what, I think it's right that Tony is out.
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์ œ ์ƒ๊ฐ์—๋Š” ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ํ’€๋ ค๋‚˜๋Š”๊ฒŒ ์˜ณ์•„์š”.
์‚ฌ๋žŒ์€ ๊ทธ๊ฐ€ ๊ฐ€์žฅ ๋‚˜์œ ๋ชจ์Šต์ผ ๋•Œ๋ฅผ ๊ธฐ์ค€์œผ๋กœ ํŒ๋‹จํ•ด์„œ๋Š” ์•ˆ๋˜๊ฑฐ๋“ ์š”.
16:58
Because you shouldn't define people by their maddest edges.
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17:01
And what Tony is, is he's a semi-psychopath.
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ํ† ๋‹ˆ์˜ ์ƒํƒœ๋Š” ์ •์‹  ์งˆํ™˜๊ณผ ์ •์ƒ์˜ ์ค‘๊ฐ„์ฏค ๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
๊ทธ๋Š” ํšŒ์ƒ‰์ง€๋Œ€์ฒ˜๋Ÿผ ๋ณด์ด์ง€ ์•Š์€ ์„ธ์ƒ์—์„œ ํšŒ์ƒ‰์ง€๋Œ€์— ์‚ด๊ณ  ์žˆ๋Š”๊ฑฐ์ฃ .
17:05
He's a gray area in a world that doesn't like gray areas.
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ํ•˜์ง€๋งŒ, ํšŒ์ƒ‰์ง€๋Œ€๋Š” ๋ณต์žกํ•˜๊ธฐ๋„ ํ•˜๊ณ 
17:11
But the gray areas are where you find the complexity.
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์ธ๊ฐ„์„ฑ์ด ์กด์žฌํ•˜๊ธฐ๋„ ํ•˜๋Š” ๋ถ€๋ถ„์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
17:16
It's where you find the humanity,
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17:18
and it's where you find the truth.
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๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ณ  ๊ทธ๊ณณ์ด ์‚ฌ๋žŒ๋“ค์ด ์ง„์‹ค์„ ์ฐพ์•„๋‚ด๋Š” ๊ณณ์ด์ฃ .
17:21
And Tony said to me,
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ํ† ๋‹ˆ๊ฐ€ ์ œ๊ฒŒ ์ด๋žฌ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
17:23
"Jon, could I buy you a drink in a bar?
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"์กด, ๋‚ด๊ฐ€ ์ˆ  ํ•œ์ž” ์‚ด๊นŒ์š”?
17:27
I just want to thank you for everything you've done for me."
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๋‹น์‹ ์ด ์ œ๊ฒŒ ํ•ด์ค€ ๋ชจ๋“  ๊ฒƒ์— ๊ทธ์ € ๊ฐ์‚ฌํ•˜๊ณ  ์‹ถ์–ด์š”."
17:30
And I didn't go.
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์ €๋Š” ๊ฐ€์ง€ ์•Š์•˜์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์—ฌ๋Ÿฌ๋ถ„๋“ค์€ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ํ•˜์…จ๊ฒ ์–ด์š”?
17:32
What would you have done?
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17:35
Thank you.
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๊ฐ์‚ฌํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.
17:37
(Applause)
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(๋ฐ•์ˆ˜)
์ด ์›น์‚ฌ์ดํŠธ ์ •๋ณด

์ด ์‚ฌ์ดํŠธ๋Š” ์˜์–ด ํ•™์Šต์— ์œ ์šฉํ•œ YouTube ๋™์˜์ƒ์„ ์†Œ๊ฐœํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์ „ ์„ธ๊ณ„ ์ตœ๊ณ ์˜ ์„ ์ƒ๋‹˜๋“ค์ด ๊ฐ€๋ฅด์น˜๋Š” ์˜์–ด ์ˆ˜์—…์„ ๋ณด๊ฒŒ ๋  ๊ฒƒ์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ๊ฐ ๋™์˜์ƒ ํŽ˜์ด์ง€์— ํ‘œ์‹œ๋˜๋Š” ์˜์–ด ์ž๋ง‰์„ ๋”๋ธ” ํด๋ฆญํ•˜๋ฉด ๊ทธ๊ณณ์—์„œ ๋™์˜์ƒ์ด ์žฌ์ƒ๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ๋น„๋””์˜ค ์žฌ์ƒ์— ๋งž์ถฐ ์ž๋ง‰์ด ์Šคํฌ๋กค๋ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์˜๊ฒฌ์ด๋‚˜ ์š”์ฒญ์ด ์žˆ๋Š” ๊ฒฝ์šฐ ์ด ๋ฌธ์˜ ์–‘์‹์„ ์‚ฌ์šฉํ•˜์—ฌ ๋ฌธ์˜ํ•˜์‹ญ์‹œ์˜ค.

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