How architecture helped music evolve | David Byrne

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This is the venue

Ovo je mjesto

where, as a young man,

gdje sam, kao mladić,

some of the music that I wrote was first performed.

prvi put izveo neke od pjesama koje sam napisao.

It was, remarkably,

Začudo, ta je prostorija

a pretty good sounding room.

imala zaista dobru akustiku.

With all the uneven walls and all the crap everywhere,

S neravnim zidovima i svim tim smećem uokolo,

it actually sounded pretty good.

zapravo je zvučala jako dobro.

This is a song that was recorded there.

Ovo je pjesma koja je ondje snimljena.

(Music)

(Glazba)

This is not Talking Heads,

Ovo nisu Talking Heads,

in the picture anyway.

barem ne na slici.

(Music: "A Clean Break (Let's Work)" by Talking Heads)

(Glazba: „ A Clean Break (Let's Work)“ izvođač Talking Heads)

So the nature of the room

Priroda te prostorije

meant that words could be understood.

omogućila je riječima da budu razumljive.

The lyrics of the songs could be pretty much understood.

Riječi pjesama poprilično su se mogle shvatiti.

The sound system was kind of decent.

Ozvučenje je bilo pristojno.

And there wasn't a lot of reverberation in the room.

I nije bilo puno jeke u prostoriji

So the rhythms

pa su i ritmovi

could be pretty intact too,

mogli biti poprilično netaknuti,

pretty concise.

poprilično jezgroviti.

Other places around the country had similar rooms.

Diljem zemlje i druga su mjesta imala slične prostore.

This is Tootsie's Orchid Lounge in Nashville.

Ovo je Tootsie's Orchid Lounge u Nashville-u.

The music was in some ways different,

Glazba je bila na neke načine različita,

but in structure and form,

ali u strukturi i formi,

very much the same.

veoma slična.

The clientele behavior was very much the same too.

Ponašanje klijentele je također bilo više manje isto.

And so the bands at Tootsie's

I tako su bendovi u Tootsie's Lounge-u

or at CBGB's

ili u CBGB-u

had to play loud enough --

morali svirati dovoljno glasno --

the volume had to be loud enough to overcome

jačina zvuka je morala biti dovoljno glasna kako bi nadvladala

people falling down, shouting out

padanje ljudi, njihovo vikanje

and doing whatever else they were doing.

i sve drugo što su radili.

Since then, I've played other places

Od tada, svirao sam i na drugim mjestima

that are much nicer.

koja su mnogo ugodnija.

I've played the Disney Hall here

Svirao sam u Disney Hallu ovdje

and Carnegie Hall and places like that.

i Carnegie Hallu i takvim mjestima.

And it's been very exciting.

I bilo je to veoma uzbudljivo.

But I also noticed that sometimes the music

Također sam primijetio da ponekad glazba

that I had written,

koju sam napisao,

or was writing at the time,

ili sam pisao u to vrijeme,

didn't sound all that great

nije zvučala posve dobro

in some of those halls.

u nekima od tih dvorana.

We managed,

Snalazili smo se,

but sometimes those halls didn't seem exactly suited

ali katkad se te dvorane nisu činile posve prikladne

to the music I was making

za glazbu koju sam radio

or had made.

ili sam napravio.

So I asked myself:

Pa sam se upitao:

Do I write stuff

Pišem li stvari

for specific rooms?

za određene prostorije?

Do I have a place, a venue,

Imam li na umu mjesto ili prostor

in mind when I write?

kada pišem?

Is that a kind of model for creativity?

Je li to model za kreativnost?

Do we all make things with

Radimo li svi pjesme

a venue, a context, in mind?

s mjestom, kontekstom na umu?

Okay, Africa.

Ok, Afrika.

(Music: "Wenlenga" / Various artists)

(Glazba: „Wenlenga“ različiti izvođači)

Most of the popular music that we know now

Većina popularne glazbe danas

has a big part of its roots in West Africa.

ima velik dio svojih korijena u zapadnoj Africi.

And the music there,

I glazba tamo,

I would say, the instruments,

instrumenti,

the intricate rhythms,

zamršeni ritmovi,

the way it's played, the setting, the context,

način na koji se svira, okruženje, kontekst,

it's all perfect. It all works perfect.

sve je savršeno. Funkcionira savršeno.

The music works perfectly in that setting.

Glazba u tom okruženju funkcionira savršeno.

There's no big room

Nema velike prostorije

to create reverberation and confuse the rhythms.

koja bi stvarala jeku i pomiješala ritmove.

The instruments are loud enough

Instrumenti su dovoljno glasni

that they can be heard without amplification, etc., etc.

da se mogu čuti bez pojačavanja itd. itd.

It's no accident.

To nije slučajnost.

It's perfect for that particular context.

Savršeno je za taj određeni kontekst.

And it would be a mess

I bilo bi katastrofa

in a context like this. This is a gothic cathedral.

u ovakvom kontekstu. Ovo je gotička katedrala.

(Music: "Spem In Alium" by Thomas Tallis)

(Glazba: „Spem In Alium“ autor Thomas Tallis)

In a gothic cathedral, this kind of music is perfect.

U gotičkoj katedrali, ovakva je glazba savršena.

It doesn't change key, the notes are long,

Nema promjene ključa, note su duge,

there's almost no rhythm whatsoever,

gotovo pa uopće nema ritma

and the room flatters the music.

i prostor pogoduje glazbi.

It actually improves it.

Zapravo ju poboljšava.

This is the room that Bach

Ovo je prostor za koji je Bach

wrote some of his music for. This is the organ.

pisao neke od svojih skladbi. Ovo su orgulje.

It's not as big as a gothic cathedral,

Nije veliko poput gotičke katedrale,

so he can write things that are a little bit more intricate.

pa može pisati neke malo zamršenije skladbe.

He can, very innovatively,

On može, veoma inovativno,

actually change keys

zapravo mijenjati ključ

without risking huge dissonances.

bez riskiranja velike disonance.

(Music: "Fantasia On Jesu, Mein Freunde" by Johann S. Bach)

(Glazba: „ Fantasia On Jesu, Mein Freunde“ autor Johann S. Bach)

This is a little bit later.

Ovo je malo kasnije.

This is the kind of rooms that Mozart wrote in.

Ovo su prostorije poput one u kojoj je Mozart skladao.

I think we're in like 1770, somewhere around there.

Mislim da se nalazimo otprilike u 1770. godini.

They're smaller, even less reverberant,

Prostorije su manje, još manje odjekuju,

so he can write really frilly music

pa on može pisati veoma ukrašenu

that's very intricate -- and it works.

i zamršenu glazbu -- i to funkcionira.

(Music: "Sonata in F," KV 13, by Wolfgang A. Mozart)

(Glazba: „Sonata u F-duru“ KV 13 autor Wolfgang A. Mozart)

It fits the room perfectly.

Savršeno se uklapa u prostoriju.

This is La Scala.

Ovo je La Scala.

It's around the same time,

To je otprilike isto vrijeme,

I think it was built around 1776.

mislim da je sagrađena otprilike 1776.

People in the audience in these opera houses, when they were built,

Ljudi u publici u tim opernim kućama, kada su sagrađene,

they used to yell out to one another.

običavali su dovikivati se.

They used to eat, drink and yell out to people on the stage,

Oni su jeli, pili i vikali prema ljudima na pozornici,

just like they do at CBGB's and places like that.

baš kao što to čine ljudi u CBGB-u i takvim mjestima.

If they liked an aria,

Ako im se svidjela arija,

they would holler and suggest

oni bi uzvikivali i predložili

that it be done again as an encore,

da se ponovi kao bis,

not at the end of the show, but immediately.

ne na kraju priredbe već odmah.

(Laughter)

(Smijeh)

And well, that was an opera experience.

I to je bilo iskustvo opere.

This is the opera house that Wagner built for himself.

Ovo je operna kuća koju je za svoje potrebe sagradio Wagner.

And the size of the room is not that big.

Veličina prostorije nije toliko velika.

It's smaller than this.

Manja je od ovog.

But Wagner made an innovation.

Ali ovdje je Wagner uveo inovaciju.

He wanted a bigger band.

Želio je veći orkestar.

He wanted a little more bombast,

Želio je više bombastičnosti

so he increased the size of the orchestra pit

pa je povećao veličinu orkestralne rupe

so he could get more low-end instruments in there.

kako bi ondje mogao smjestiti više instrumenata za niske lage.

(Music: "Lohengrin / Prelude to Act III" by Richard Wagner)

(Glazba: „Lohengrin/ preludij III. čina“ autor: Richard Wagner)

Okay.

Ok.

This is Carnegie Hall.

Ovo je Carnegie Hall.

Obviously, this kind of thing became popular.

Očito, ovo je postalo popularno.

The halls got bigger. Carnegie Hall's fair-sized.

Dvorane su postale veće. Carnegie Hall je poštene veličine.

It's larger than some of the other symphony halls.

Veća je od nekih drugih simfonijskih dvorana.

And they're a lot more reverberant

One odjekuju puno više

than La Scala.

nego La Scala.

Around the same,

Otprilike u to vrijeme,

according to Alex Ross who writes for the New Yorker,

prema Alexu Rossu koji piše za New Yorker,

this kind of rule came into effect

pojavilo se pravilo

that audiences had to be quiet --

da publika mora biti tiha --

no more eating, drinking and yelling at the stage,

nema više jedenja, pijenja, vikanja prema pozornici

or gossiping with one another

ili tračanja jednih s drugima

during the show.

tijekom predstave.

They had to be very quiet.

Morali su biti vrlo tihi.

So those two things combined meant that

Dakle, te su dvije stvari kombinirano značile

a different kind of music

da je drugačija vrsta glazbe

worked best in these kind of halls.

najbolje funkcionirala u takvim dvoranama.

It meant that there could be extreme dynamics,

To je značilo da može biti ekstremne dinamike,

which there weren't in some of these

koje nije bilo u nekim drugim

other kinds of music.

vrstama glazbe.

Quiet parts could be heard

Tihi dijelovi,

that would have been drowned out

koji bi prije bili ugušeni

by all the gossiping and shouting.

tračanjem i vikanjem, sada su se mogli čuti.

But because of the reverberation

Zbog jeke

in those rooms like Carnegie Hall,

u takvim prostorima poput Carnegie Halla,

the music had to be maybe a little less rhythmic

glazba je morala biti možda malo manje ritmična

and a little more textural.

i malo više teksturalna.

(Music: "Symphony No. 8 in E Flat Major" by Gustav Mahler)

(Glazba: „Simfonija br. 8 u Es-duru“ autor Gustav Mahler)

This is Mahler.

Ovo je Mahler.

It looks like Bob Dylan, but it's Mahler.

Izgeda kao Bob Dylan, ali je Mahler.

That was Bob's last record, yeah.

To je zadnja Bobova ploča, da.

(Laughter)

(Smijeh)

Popular music, coming along at the same time.

Popularna glazba napreduje u to isto vrijeme.

This is a jazz band.

Ovo je jazz bend.

According to Scott Joplin, the bands were playing

Prema Scottu Joplinu bendovi su svirali

on riverboats and clubs.

na riječnim brodovima i u klubovima.

Again, it's noisy. They're playing for dancers.

Ponovno je bučno. Sviraju za plesače.

There's certain sections of the song -- the songs had different sections

Postoje pojedini dijelovi u pjesmi -- pjesme su imale različite dijelove

that the dancers really liked.

koji su se jako sviđali plesačima.

And they'd say, "Play that part again."

I oni bi rekli: „Svirajte taj dio ponovno.“

Well, there's only so many times

Međutim, ne možete plesačima svirati

you can play the same section of a song over and over again for the dancers.

jedan te isti dio pjesme u nedogled.

So the bands started to improvise new melodies.

Pa su bendovi počeli improvizirati nove melodije.

And a new form of music was born.

I rođena je nova vrsta glazbe.

(Music: "Royal Garden Blues" by W.C. Handy / Ethel Waters)

(Glazba: „Royal Garden Blues“ izvođači W.C.Handy/ Ethel Waters).

These are played mainly in small rooms.

Ovakva glazba se svira uglavnom u malim prostorima.

People are dancing, shouting and drinking.

Ljudi plešu, viču i piju.

So the music has to be loud enough

Dakle, glazba mora biti dovoljno glasna

to be heard above that.

da se čuje unatoč tome.

Same thing goes true for -- that's the beginning of the century --

Nešto započinje za -- to je početak stoljeća --

for the whole of 20th-century popular music,

za svu popularnu glazbu 20. stoljeća,

whether it's rock or Latin music or whatever.

bio to rock, latinoamerička glazba ili bilo što drugo.

[Live music] doesn't really change that much.

(Živa glazba) zapravo se ne mijenja puno.

It changes about a third of the way into the 20th century,

Mijenja se otprilike nakon jedne trećine 20. stoljeća,

when this became

kada ovo postaje

one of the primary venues for music.

jedan od glavnih prostora za izvođenje glazbe.

And this was one way

I ovo je jedan od načina

that the music got there.

na koje je glazba ondje došla.

Microphones enabled singers, in particular,

Mikrofoni su omogućili osobito pjevačima,

and musicians and composers,

ali i glazbenicima i skladateljima

to completely change the kind of music

da posve promijene vrstu glazbe

that they were writing.

koju su pisali.

So far, a lot of the stuff that was on the radio was live music,

Do tada, puno je stvari na radiju bilo živa glazba,

but singers, like Frank Sinatra,

ali pjevači, poput Franka Sinatre

could use the mic

su mogli uzeti mikrofon

and do things

i izvoditi stvari

that they could never do without a microphone.

koje bi bez mikrofona bile nemoguće.

Other singers after him

Pjevači nakon njega

went even further.

otišli su još dalje.

(Music: "My Funny Valentine" by Chet Baker)

(Glazba: „My Funny Valentine“ izvođač Chet Baker)

This is Chet Baker.

Ovo je Chet Baker.

And this kind of thing

Ovakva vrsta stvari

would have been impossible without a microphone.

bila bi nemoguća bez mikrofona.

It would have been impossible without recorded music as well.

Bila bi nemoguća i bez snimljene glazbe također.

And he's singing right into your ear.

On vam pjeva ravno u uho.

He's whispering into your ears.

Šapće vam na uho.

The effect is just electric.

Efekt je jednostavno električan.

It's like the guy is sitting next to you,

Kao da čovjek sjedi do vas,

whispering who knows what into your ear.

šaputajući vam tko zna što na uho.

So at this point, music diverged.

U ovom trenutku imamo razilaženje u glazbi.

There's live music,

Postoji živa glazba

and there's recorded music.

i postoji snimljena glazba.

And they no longer have to be exactly the same.

I one više ne moraju nužno biti posve iste.

Now there's venues like this, a discotheque,

Postoje prostori puput ovog, diskoteke,

and there's jukeboxes in bars,

i postoje „đuboksi“ u barovima,

where you don't even need to have a band.

gdje više uopće ne morate imati bend.

There doesn't need to be any

Više uopće ne postoji potreba

live performing musicians whatsoever,

za sviračima žive glazbe,

and the sound systems are good.

i sustavi ozvučenja su dobri.

People began to make music

Ljudi su počeli raditi glazbu

specifically for discos

posebno za disko

and for those sound systems.

i takve sustave ozvučenja.

And, as with jazz,

I kao što se dogodilo i sa jazzom,

the dancers liked certain sections

plesači su voljeli neke dijelove

more than they did others.

više nego neke druge.

So the early hip-hop guys would loop certain sections.

Pa su rani hip-hoperi u petlju stavili određene dijelove.

(Music: "Rapper's Delight" by The Sugarhill Gang)

(Glazba: „Rapper's Delight“ izvođač the Sugarhill Gang)

The MC would improvise lyrics

MC bi improvizirao riječi

in the same way that the jazz players would improvise melodies.

na isti način na koji su jazz izvođači improvizirali melodije.

And another new form of music was born.

I tako je nastala još jedna vrsta glazbe.

Live performance, when it was incredibly successful,

Nastupi uživo, kada bi bili nevjerojatno uspješni,

ended up in what is probably, acoustically,

završili su u akustično

the worst sounding venues on the planet:

najgorim prostorima na planetu:

sports stadiums,

sportskim stadionima,

basketball arenas and hockey arenas.

košarkaškim i hokej arenama.

Musicians who ended up there did the best they could.

Glazbenici koji su tamo završili radili su najbolje što su mogli.

They wrote what is now called arena rock,

Pisali su ono što se danas zove arena rock,

which is medium-speed ballads.

tj. srednje brze balade.

(Music: "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For" by U2)

(Glazba: „I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For“ izvođač U2)

They did the best they could

Napravili su najbolje što su mogli

given that this is what they're writing for.

s obzirom da je ovo ono za što pišu.

The tempos are medium. It sounds big.

Tempo je umjeren. Zvuči veliko.

It's more a social situation

To je više socijalna

than a musical situation.

nego glazbena situacija.

And in some ways, the music

I na neki način, glazba

that they're writing for this place

koju pišu za ovakva mjesta

works perfectly.

savršeno funkcionira.

So there's more new venues.

Dakle, ima više novih prostora.

One of the new ones is the automobile.

Jedan od novijih je automobil.

I grew up with a radio in a car.

Ja sam odrastao s radijem u autu.

But now that's evolved into something else.

Sada je to evoluiralo u nešto drugo.

The car is a whole venue.

Auto je jedno cjelovito mjesto.

(Music: "Who U Wit" by Lil' Jon & the East Side Boyz)

(Glazba: „Who U Wit“ izvođač Lil'Jon & the East Side Boyz).

The music that, I would say, is written

Glazba koja je, rekao bih, napisana

for automobile sound systems

za zvučne sisteme u autima,

works perfectly on it.

na njima savršeno funkcionira.

It might not be what you want to listen to at home,

To možda nije glazba koju bi slušali kod kuće,

but it works great in the car --

ali super funkcionira u autima --

has a huge frequency spectrum,

ima veliki spektar frekvencije,

you know, big bass and high-end

znate, dobar bas i gornje lage

and the voice kind of stuck in the middle.

i glas koji je negdje u sredini.

Automobile music, you can share with your friends.

Automobilsku glazbu možete dijeliti s prijateljima.

There's one other kind of new venue,

Postoji još jedna nova vrsta prostora,

the private MP3 player.

privatni MP3 player.

Presumably, this is just for Christian music.

Po svoj prilici, to je samo za kršćansku glazbu.

(Laughter)

(Smijeh)

And in some ways it's like Carnegie Hall,

Na neke načine isto je kao Carnegie Hall,

or when the audience had to hush up,

ili onome kada publika mora šutjeti

because you can now hear every single detail.

jer sada možete čuti svaki detalj.

In other ways, it's more like the West African music

Na neke druge načine, više je kao glazba zapadne Afrike

because if the music in an MP3 player gets too quiet,

jer ako glazba na Mp3 playeru postane pretiha,

you turn it up, and the next minute,

pojačate je, i sljedeće minute

your ears are blasted out by a louder passage.

uši vam otpadnu zahvaljujući glasnom odlomku.

So that doesn't really work.

Dakle, to zapravo ne funkcionira.

I think pop music, mainly,

Mislim da je pop glazba danas pretežito,

it's written today,

u dobroj mjeri,

to some extent, is written for these kind of players,

napisana za takvu vrstu playera,

for this kind of personal experience

za tu vrstu osobnog iskustva

where you can hear extreme detail,

gdje možete čuti ekstremne detalje,

but the dynamic doesn't change that much.

ali se dinamika ne mijenja baš puno.

So I asked myself:

Upitao sam se:

Okay, is this

Ok, je li to

a model for creation,

model za kreativnost,

this adaptation that we do?

adaptacija kroz koju prolazimo?

And does it happen anywhere else?

I događa li se negdje drugdje?

Well, according to David Attenborough and some other people,

Prema Davidu Attenboroughu i nekim drugim ljudima

birds do it too --

i ptice to rade --

that the birds in the canopy,

ptice među krošnjama,

where the foliage is dense,

gdje je lišće gusto,

their calls tend to be

glasaju se uglavnom

high-pitched, short and repetitive.

visoko, kratko i ponavljajući se.

And the birds on the floor

A ptice na podu

tend to have lower pitched calls,

imaju nižu visinu tonova

so that they don't get distorted

kako se oni ne bi iskrivili

when they bounce off the forest floor.

dok se odbijaju od šumskog poda.

And birds like this Savannah sparrow,

Ptice poput vrapca iz Savanne

they tend to have a buzzing

imaju glasanje

(Sound clip: Savannah sparrow song)

(Zvučni isječak: pjesma savanaškog vrapca)

type call.

nalik na zujanje.

And it turns out that

Ispada da je

a sound like this

takav tip zvuka

is the most energy efficient and practical way

energetski najučinkovitiji i najpraktičniji način

to transmit their call

da prenesu svoj glas

across the fields and savannahs.

preko polja i savana.

Other birds, like this tanager,

Druge ptice, poput ove tangare

have adapted within the same species.

su se prilagodile unutar iste vrste.

The tananger on the East Coast of the United States,

Tangara na istočnoj obali SAD-a,

where the forests are a little denser,

gdje su šume malo gušće,

has one kind of call,

ima jedan način glasanja,

and the tananger on the other side, on the west

a tangara na drugoj strani, na zapadu

(Sound clip: Scarlet tanager song)

( Zvučni isječak: pjesma grimizne tangare)

has a different kind of call.

ima drugačiji način glasanja.

(Sound clip: Scarlet tanager song)

( Zvučni isječak: pjesma grimizne tangare)

So birds do it too.

Dakle, i ptice to rade.

And I thought:

Pomislio sam:

Well, if this is a model for creation,

Ako je ovo model za stvaranje,

if we make music,

ako radimo glazbu,

primarily the form at least,

primarno formu ako ništa drugo,

to fit these contexts,

da se uklapa u te kontekste

and if we make art to fit gallery walls or museum walls,

i ako radimo umjetnost koja se uklapa na zidove galerija ili muzeja,

and if we write software to fit existing operating systems,

ako pišemo software koji se uklapaju u postojeće operacijske sustave,

is that how it works?

je li to način na koji sve funkcionira?

Yeah. I think it's evolutionary.

Da. Mislim da je to evolucionalno.

It's adaptive.

To je prilagođavajuće.

But the pleasure and the passion and the joy

Ali užitak i strast

is still there.

su još uvijek ondje.

This is a reverse view of things

Ovo je način pogleda na stvari suprotan

from the kind of traditional Romantic view.

onom tradicionalnom romantičnom pogledu.

The Romantic view is that

Pogled romantizma je taj da

first comes the passion

prvo dolazi strast

and then the outpouring of emotion,

i nakon toga odljev emocija,

and then somehow it gets shaped into something.

i tek nakon toga se to nekako oblikuje u nešto.

And I'm saying,

Ja govorim,

well, the passion's still there,

strast je još uvijek tu,

but the vessel

ali spremnik

that it's going to be injected into and poured into,

u koji će ona biti ubačena i izlivena,

that is instinctively and intuitively

to je nešto što je instinktivno i intuitivno

created first.

stvoreno prvo.

We already know where that passion is going.

Mi već znamo gdje ta strast ide.

But this conflict of views is kind of interesting.

Ali taj konflikt pogleda je na neki način zanimljiv.

The writer,

Pisac

Thomas Frank,

Thomas Frank

says that

kaže da

this might be a kind of explanation

bi to moglo biti objašnjenje

why some voters vote

zašto neki glasači glasaju

against their best interests,

protiv svojih interesa.

that voters, like a lot of us,

Glasači, poput mnogih od nas,

assume, that if they hear something that sounds like it's sincere,

pretpostavljaju da ako čuju nešto što zvuči iskreno,

that it's coming from the gut, that it's passionate,

da je to i uvjerljivo, da je strastveno,

that it's more authentic.

da je autentičnije.

And they'll vote for that.

I glasat će za to.

So that, if somebody can fake sincerity,

Pa bi netko, ako može glumiti iskrenost

if they can fake passion,

i strast

they stand a better chance

imao bolje šanse

of being selected in that way,

biti izabran na takav način,

which seems a little dangerous.

što se čini malo opasnim.

I'm saying the two, the passion, the joy,

Ja govorim da to dvoje, strast

are not mutually exclusive.

i radost, ne isključuju jedno drugo.

Maybe what the world needs now is for us to realize

Možda je ono što svijet sada treba jest da shvatimo

that we are like the birds.

da smo kao ptice.

We adapt.

Prilagođavamo se.

We sing.

Pjevamo.

And like the birds, the joy is still there,

I kao i kod ptica, radost je još uvijek tu,

even though we have changed what we do

čak i ako mijenjamo ono što činimo

to fit the context.

kako bismo se uklopili u kontekst.

Thank you very much.

Hvala najljepša!

(Applause)

(Pljesak)