Niall Ferguson: The 6 killer apps of prosperity

349,245 views ・ 2011-09-19

TED


Please double-click on the English subtitles below to play the video.

00:15
Let's talk about billions.
0
15260
3000
00:18
Let's talk about
1
18260
3000
00:21
past and future billions.
2
21260
3000
00:24
We know
3
24260
2000
00:26
that about 106 billion people
4
26260
3000
00:29
have ever lived.
5
29260
2000
00:31
And we know that most of them are dead.
6
31260
3000
00:34
And we also know
7
34260
2000
00:36
that most of them live or lived in Asia.
8
36260
2000
00:38
And we also know
9
38260
2000
00:40
that most of them were or are very poor --
10
40260
4000
00:44
did not live for very long.
11
44260
3000
00:47
Let's talk about billions.
12
47260
3000
00:50
Let's talk about
13
50260
2000
00:52
the 195,000 billion dollars of wealth
14
52260
4000
00:56
in the world today.
15
56260
3000
00:59
We know that most of that wealth
16
59260
3000
01:02
was made after the year 1800.
17
62260
3000
01:05
And we know that most of it
18
65260
3000
01:08
is currently owned
19
68260
2000
01:10
by people we might call Westerners:
20
70260
4000
01:14
Europeans, North Americans, Australasians.
21
74260
4000
01:18
19 percent of the world's population today,
22
78260
3000
01:21
Westerners own two-thirds of its wealth.
23
81260
4000
01:25
Economic historians
24
85260
2000
01:27
call this "The Great Divergence."
25
87260
3000
01:30
And this slide here
26
90260
2000
01:32
is the best simplification
27
92260
2000
01:34
of the Great Divergence story
28
94260
2000
01:36
I can offer you.
29
96260
2000
01:38
It's basically two ratios
30
98260
2000
01:40
of per capita GDP,
31
100260
2000
01:42
per capita gross domestic product,
32
102260
3000
01:45
so average income.
33
105260
2000
01:47
One, the red line,
34
107260
2000
01:49
is the ratio of British to Indian
35
109260
2000
01:51
per capita income.
36
111260
2000
01:53
And the blue line
37
113260
2000
01:55
is the ratio of American to Chinese.
38
115260
3000
01:58
And this chart goes back to 1500.
39
118260
2000
02:00
And you can see here
40
120260
2000
02:02
that there's an exponential Great Divergence.
41
122260
3000
02:05
They start off pretty close together.
42
125260
2000
02:07
In fact, in 1500,
43
127260
2000
02:09
the average Chinese was richer than the average North American.
44
129260
3000
02:13
When you get to the 1970s,
45
133260
3000
02:16
which is where this chart ends,
46
136260
2000
02:18
the average Briton is more than 10 times richer
47
138260
2000
02:20
than the average Indian.
48
140260
2000
02:22
And that's allowing
49
142260
2000
02:24
for differences in the cost of living.
50
144260
2000
02:26
It's based on purchasing power parity.
51
146260
3000
02:29
The average American
52
149260
2000
02:31
is nearly 20 times richer
53
151260
2000
02:33
than the average Chinese
54
153260
2000
02:35
by the 1970s.
55
155260
2000
02:37
So why?
56
157260
3000
02:40
This wasn't just an economic story.
57
160260
3000
02:43
If you take the 10 countries
58
163260
2000
02:45
that went on to become
59
165260
3000
02:48
the Western empires,
60
168260
2000
02:50
in 1500 they were really quite tiny --
61
170260
3000
02:53
five percent of the world's land surface,
62
173260
2000
02:55
16 percent of its population,
63
175260
2000
02:57
maybe 20 percent of its income.
64
177260
3000
03:00
By 1913,
65
180260
2000
03:02
these 10 countries, plus the United States,
66
182260
3000
03:05
controlled vast global empires --
67
185260
3000
03:08
58 percent of the world's territory,
68
188260
2000
03:10
about the same percentage of its population,
69
190260
3000
03:13
and a really huge, nearly three-quarters share
70
193260
3000
03:16
of global economic output.
71
196260
2000
03:18
And notice, most of that went to the motherland,
72
198260
4000
03:22
to the imperial metropoles,
73
202260
2000
03:24
not to their colonial possessions.
74
204260
3000
03:28
Now you can't just blame this on imperialism --
75
208260
2000
03:30
though many people have tried to do so --
76
210260
3000
03:33
for two reasons.
77
213260
3000
03:36
One, empire was the least original thing
78
216260
3000
03:39
that the West did after 1500.
79
219260
3000
03:42
Everybody did empire.
80
222260
3000
03:45
They beat preexisting Oriental empires
81
225260
3000
03:48
like the Mughals and the Ottomans.
82
228260
2000
03:50
So it really doesn't look like empire is a great explanation
83
230260
3000
03:53
for the Great Divergence.
84
233260
2000
03:55
In any case, as you may remember,
85
235260
2000
03:57
the Great Divergence reaches its zenith in the 1970s,
86
237260
3000
04:00
some considerable time after decolonization.
87
240260
4000
04:04
This is not a new question.
88
244260
2000
04:06
Samuel Johnson,
89
246260
2000
04:08
the great lexicographer,
90
248260
2000
04:10
[posed] it through his character Rasselas
91
250260
3000
04:13
in his novel "Rasselas, Prince of Abissinia,"
92
253260
3000
04:16
published in 1759.
93
256260
3000
04:19
"By what means are the Europeans thus powerful;
94
259260
3000
04:22
or why, since they can so easily visit Asia and Africa
95
262260
3000
04:25
for trade or conquest,
96
265260
3000
04:28
cannot the Asiaticks and Africans
97
268260
2000
04:30
invade their coasts,
98
270260
2000
04:32
plant colonies in their ports,
99
272260
2000
04:34
and give laws to their natural princes?
100
274260
3000
04:37
The same wind that carries them back
101
277260
3000
04:40
would bring us thither?"
102
280260
2000
04:42
That's a great question.
103
282260
2000
04:44
And you know what,
104
284260
2000
04:46
it was also being asked at roughly the same time
105
286260
2000
04:48
by the Resterners -- by the people in the rest of the world --
106
288260
3000
04:51
like Ibrahim Muteferrika,
107
291260
3000
04:54
an Ottoman official,
108
294260
2000
04:56
the man who introduced printing, very belatedly,
109
296260
3000
04:59
to the Ottoman Empire --
110
299260
2000
05:01
who said in a book published in 1731,
111
301260
3000
05:04
"Why do Christian nations which were so weak in the past
112
304260
2000
05:06
compared with Muslim nations
113
306260
2000
05:08
begin to dominate so many lands in modern times
114
308260
4000
05:12
and even defeat the once victorious Ottoman armies?"
115
312260
4000
05:16
Unlike Rasselas,
116
316260
2000
05:18
Muteferrika had an answer to that question,
117
318260
2000
05:20
which was correct.
118
320260
3000
05:23
He said it was "because they have laws and rules
119
323260
4000
05:27
invented by reason."
120
327260
4000
05:31
It's not geography.
121
331260
3000
05:34
You may think we can explain the Great Divergence
122
334260
2000
05:36
in terms of geography.
123
336260
2000
05:38
We know that's wrong,
124
338260
2000
05:40
because we conducted two great natural experiments in the 20th century
125
340260
2000
05:42
to see if geography mattered more than institutions.
126
342260
2000
05:44
We took all the Germans,
127
344260
3000
05:47
we divided them roughly in two,
128
347260
2000
05:49
and we gave the ones in the East communism,
129
349260
3000
05:52
and you see the result.
130
352260
3000
05:55
Within an incredibly short period of time,
131
355260
2000
05:57
people living in the German Democratic Republic
132
357260
2000
05:59
produced Trabants, the Trabbi,
133
359260
3000
06:02
one of the world's worst ever cars,
134
362260
3000
06:05
while people in the West produced the Mercedes Benz.
135
365260
3000
06:08
If you still don't believe me,
136
368260
2000
06:10
we conducted the experiment also in the Korean Peninsula.
137
370260
2000
06:12
And we decided we'd take Koreans
138
372260
2000
06:14
in roughly the same geographical place
139
374260
2000
06:16
with, notice, the same basic traditional culture,
140
376260
4000
06:20
and we divided them in two, and we gave the Northerners communism.
141
380260
3000
06:23
And the result is an even bigger divergence
142
383260
3000
06:26
in a very short space of time
143
386260
2000
06:28
than happened in Germany.
144
388260
2000
06:30
Not a big divergence in terms of uniform design for border guards admittedly,
145
390260
4000
06:34
but in almost every other respect,
146
394260
2000
06:36
it's a huge divergence.
147
396260
2000
06:38
Which leads me to think
148
398260
2000
06:40
that neither geography nor national character,
149
400260
2000
06:42
popular explanations for this kind of thing,
150
402260
2000
06:44
are really significant.
151
404260
3000
06:47
It's the ideas.
152
407260
2000
06:49
It's the institutions.
153
409260
2000
06:51
This must be true
154
411260
2000
06:53
because a Scotsman said it.
155
413260
2000
06:55
And I think I'm the only Scotsman here at the Edinburgh TED.
156
415260
3000
06:58
So let me just explain to you
157
418260
2000
07:00
that the smartest man ever was a Scotsman.
158
420260
3000
07:03
He was Adam Smith --
159
423260
2000
07:05
not Billy Connolly, not Sean Connery --
160
425260
3000
07:08
though he is very smart indeed.
161
428260
3000
07:11
(Laughter)
162
431260
3000
07:14
Smith -- and I want you to go
163
434260
2000
07:16
and bow down before his statue in the Royal Mile;
164
436260
3000
07:19
it's a wonderful statue --
165
439260
2000
07:21
Smith, in the "Wealth of Nations"
166
441260
2000
07:23
published in 1776 --
167
443260
2000
07:25
that's the most important thing that happened that year ...
168
445260
3000
07:28
(Laughter)
169
448260
3000
07:31
You bet.
170
451260
3000
07:34
There was a little local difficulty in some of our minor colonies, but ...
171
454260
3000
07:37
(Laughter)
172
457260
2000
07:39
"China seems to have been long stationary,
173
459260
2000
07:41
and probably long ago acquired that full complement of riches
174
461260
3000
07:44
which is consistent with the nature of its laws and institutions.
175
464260
4000
07:48
But this complement may be much inferior
176
468260
2000
07:50
to what, with other laws and institutions,
177
470260
3000
07:53
the nature of its soil, climate, and situation
178
473260
2000
07:55
might admit of."
179
475260
2000
07:57
That is so right and so cool.
180
477260
2000
07:59
And he said it such a long time ago.
181
479260
3000
08:02
But you know, this is a TED audience,
182
482260
3000
08:05
and if I keep talking about institutions,
183
485260
2000
08:07
you're going to turn off.
184
487260
2000
08:09
So I'm going to translate this into language that you can understand.
185
489260
3000
08:13
Let's call them the killer apps.
186
493260
4000
08:17
I want to explain to you that there were six killer apps
187
497260
3000
08:20
that set the West apart from the rest.
188
500260
3000
08:23
And they're kind of like the apps on your phone,
189
503260
2000
08:25
in the sense that they look quite simple.
190
505260
2000
08:27
They're just icons; you click on them.
191
507260
2000
08:29
But behind the icon, there's complex code.
192
509260
3000
08:32
It's the same with institutions.
193
512260
2000
08:34
There are six
194
514260
2000
08:36
which I think explain the Great Divergence.
195
516260
3000
08:39
One, competition.
196
519260
2000
08:41
Two, the scientific revolution.
197
521260
2000
08:43
Three, property rights.
198
523260
2000
08:45
Four, modern medicine.
199
525260
2000
08:47
Five, the consumer society.
200
527260
2000
08:49
And six, the work ethic.
201
529260
2000
08:51
You can play a game and try and think of one I've missed at,
202
531260
2000
08:53
or try and boil it down to just four,
203
533260
3000
08:56
but you'll lose.
204
536260
2000
08:58
(Laughter)
205
538260
2000
09:00
Let me very briefly tell you what I mean by this,
206
540260
3000
09:03
synthesizing the work of many economic historians
207
543260
3000
09:06
in the process.
208
546260
2000
09:08
Competition means,
209
548260
2000
09:10
not only were there a hundred different political units in Europe in 1500,
210
550260
2000
09:12
but within each of these units,
211
552260
2000
09:14
there was competition between corporations as well as sovereigns.
212
554260
4000
09:18
The ancestor of the modern corporation, the City of London Corporation,
213
558260
3000
09:21
existed in the 12th century.
214
561260
2000
09:23
Nothing like this existed in China,
215
563260
2000
09:25
where there was one monolithic state
216
565260
2000
09:27
covering a fifth of humanity,
217
567260
2000
09:29
and anyone with any ambition
218
569260
2000
09:31
had to pass one standardized examination,
219
571260
2000
09:33
which took three days and was very difficult
220
573260
2000
09:35
and involved memorizing vast numbers of characters
221
575260
3000
09:38
and very complex Confucian essay writing.
222
578260
4000
09:42
The scientific revolution was different
223
582260
3000
09:45
from the science that had been achieved in the Oriental world
224
585260
3000
09:48
in a number of crucial ways,
225
588260
2000
09:50
the most important being
226
590260
2000
09:52
that, through the experimental method,
227
592260
2000
09:54
it gave men control over nature in a way that had not been possible before.
228
594260
3000
09:57
Example: Benjamin Robins's extraordinary application
229
597260
4000
10:01
of Newtonian physics to ballistics.
230
601260
3000
10:04
Once you do that,
231
604260
2000
10:06
your artillery becomes accurate.
232
606260
3000
10:09
Think of what that means.
233
609260
2000
10:11
That really was a killer application.
234
611260
2000
10:13
(Laughter)
235
613260
3000
10:16
Meanwhile, there's no scientific revolution anywhere else.
236
616260
3000
10:19
The Ottoman Empire's not that far from Europe,
237
619260
2000
10:21
but there's no scientific revolution there.
238
621260
2000
10:23
In fact, they demolish Taqi al-Din's observatory,
239
623260
3000
10:26
because it's considered blasphemous
240
626260
2000
10:28
to inquire into the mind of God.
241
628260
3000
10:31
Property rights: It's not the democracy, folks;
242
631260
3000
10:34
it's having the rule of law based on private property rights.
243
634260
3000
10:37
That's what makes the difference
244
637260
2000
10:39
between North America and South America.
245
639260
2000
10:41
You could turn up in North America
246
641260
2000
10:43
having signed a deed of indenture
247
643260
2000
10:45
saying, "I'll work for nothing for five years.
248
645260
2000
10:47
You just have to feed me."
249
647260
2000
10:49
But at the end of it, you've got a hundred acres of land.
250
649260
3000
10:52
That's the land grant
251
652260
2000
10:54
on the bottom half of the slide.
252
654260
2000
10:56
That's not possible in Latin America
253
656260
3000
10:59
where land is held onto
254
659260
2000
11:01
by a tiny elite descended from the conquistadors.
255
661260
2000
11:03
And you can see here the huge divergence
256
663260
2000
11:05
that happens in property ownership between North and South.
257
665260
3000
11:08
Most people in rural North America
258
668260
2000
11:10
owned some land by 1900.
259
670260
3000
11:13
Hardly anyone in South America did.
260
673260
2000
11:15
That's another killer app.
261
675260
3000
11:18
Modern medicine in the late 19th century
262
678260
2000
11:20
began to make major breakthroughs
263
680260
2000
11:22
against the infectious diseases that killed a lot of people.
264
682260
2000
11:24
And this was another killer app --
265
684260
2000
11:26
the very opposite of a killer,
266
686260
2000
11:28
because it doubled, and then more than doubled, human life expectancy.
267
688260
3000
11:31
It even did that
268
691260
2000
11:33
in the European empires.
269
693260
2000
11:35
Even in places like Senegal,
270
695260
2000
11:37
beginning in the early 20th century,
271
697260
2000
11:39
there were major breakthroughs in public health,
272
699260
2000
11:41
and life expectancy began to rise.
273
701260
2000
11:43
It doesn't rise any faster
274
703260
2000
11:45
after these countries become independent.
275
705260
2000
11:47
The empires weren't all bad.
276
707260
2000
11:49
The consumer society is what you need
277
709260
2000
11:51
for the Industrial Revolution to have a point.
278
711260
3000
11:54
You need people to want to wear tons of clothes.
279
714260
2000
11:56
You've all bought an article of clothing in the last month;
280
716260
2000
11:58
I guarantee it.
281
718260
2000
12:00
That's the consumer society,
282
720260
2000
12:02
and it propels economic growth
283
722260
2000
12:04
more than even technological change itself.
284
724260
3000
12:07
Japan was the first non-Western society
285
727260
2000
12:09
to embrace it.
286
729260
2000
12:11
The alternative,
287
731260
2000
12:13
which was proposed by Mahatma Gandhi,
288
733260
2000
12:15
was to institutionalize and make poverty permanent.
289
735260
3000
12:18
Very few Indians today
290
738260
2000
12:20
wish that India had gone down
291
740260
2000
12:22
Mahatma Gandhi's road.
292
742260
3000
12:25
Finally, the work ethic.
293
745260
2000
12:27
Max Weber thought that was peculiarly Protestant.
294
747260
3000
12:30
He was wrong.
295
750260
2000
12:32
Any culture can get the work ethic
296
752260
2000
12:34
if the institutions are there
297
754260
2000
12:36
to create the incentive to work.
298
756260
2000
12:38
We know this
299
758260
2000
12:40
because today the work ethic
300
760260
2000
12:42
is no longer a Protestant, Western phenomenon.
301
762260
3000
12:45
In fact, the West has lost its work ethic.
302
765260
3000
12:48
Today, the average Korean
303
768260
3000
12:51
works a thousand hours more a year
304
771260
4000
12:55
than the average German --
305
775260
2000
12:57
a thousand.
306
777260
2000
12:59
And this is part
307
779260
2000
13:01
of a really extraordinary phenomenon,
308
781260
3000
13:04
and that is the end of the Great Divergence.
309
784260
3000
13:07
Who's got the work ethic now?
310
787260
2000
13:09
Take a look at mathematical attainment
311
789260
3000
13:12
by 15 year-olds.
312
792260
2000
13:14
At the top of the international league table
313
794260
2000
13:16
according to the latest PISA study,
314
796260
3000
13:19
is the Shanghai district of China.
315
799260
2000
13:21
The gap between Shanghai
316
801260
2000
13:23
and the United Kingdom and the United States
317
803260
3000
13:26
is as big as the gap between the U.K. and the U.S.
318
806260
3000
13:29
and Albania and Tunisia.
319
809260
3000
13:32
You probably assume
320
812260
2000
13:34
that because the iPhone was designed in California
321
814260
2000
13:36
but assembled in China
322
816260
2000
13:38
that the West still leads in terms of technological innovation.
323
818260
3000
13:41
You're wrong.
324
821260
2000
13:43
In terms of patents,
325
823260
2000
13:45
there's no question that the East is ahead.
326
825260
2000
13:47
Not only has Japan been ahead for some time,
327
827260
3000
13:50
South Korea has gone into third place,
328
830260
3000
13:53
and China is just about to overtake Germany.
329
833260
3000
13:56
Why?
330
836260
2000
13:58
Because the killer apps can be downloaded.
331
838260
2000
14:00
It's open source.
332
840260
2000
14:02
Any society can adopt these institutions,
333
842260
2000
14:04
and when they do,
334
844260
2000
14:06
they achieve what the West achieved after 1500 --
335
846260
4000
14:10
only faster.
336
850260
2000
14:12
This is the Great Reconvergence,
337
852260
2000
14:14
and it's the biggest story of your lifetime.
338
854260
4000
14:18
Because it's on your watch that this is happening.
339
858260
3000
14:21
It's our generation
340
861260
2000
14:23
that is witnessing the end of Western predominance.
341
863260
2000
14:25
The average American used to be more than 20 times richer
342
865260
2000
14:27
than the average Chinese.
343
867260
2000
14:29
Now it's just five times,
344
869260
2000
14:31
and soon it will be 2.5 times.
345
871260
2000
14:33
So I want to end with three questions
346
873260
3000
14:36
for the future billions,
347
876260
2000
14:38
just ahead of 2016,
348
878260
3000
14:41
when the United States will lose its place
349
881260
2000
14:43
as number one economy to China.
350
883260
3000
14:46
The first is, can you delete these apps,
351
886260
4000
14:50
and are we in the process of doing so
352
890260
2000
14:52
in the Western world?
353
892260
2000
14:54
The second question is,
354
894260
2000
14:56
does the sequencing of the download matter?
355
896260
4000
15:00
And could Africa get that sequencing wrong?
356
900260
5000
15:05
One obvious implication of modern economic history
357
905260
2000
15:07
is that it's quite hard to transition to democracy
358
907260
3000
15:10
before you've established
359
910260
2000
15:12
secure private property rights.
360
912260
3000
15:15
Warning: that may not work.
361
915260
3000
15:18
And third, can China do without
362
918260
2000
15:20
killer app number three?
363
920260
2000
15:22
That's the one that John Locke systematized
364
922260
4000
15:26
when he said that freedom was rooted in private property rights
365
926260
4000
15:30
and the protection of law.
366
930260
2000
15:32
That's the basis
367
932260
2000
15:34
for the Western model
368
934260
2000
15:36
of representative government.
369
936260
3000
15:39
Now this picture shows the demolition
370
939260
2000
15:41
of the Chinese artist Ai Weiwei's studio
371
941260
3000
15:44
in Shanghai earlier this year.
372
944260
2000
15:46
He's now free again,
373
946260
2000
15:48
having been detained, as you know, for some time.
374
948260
2000
15:50
But I don't think his studio has been rebuilt.
375
950260
3000
15:55
Winston Churchill once defined civilization
376
955260
4000
15:59
in a lecture he gave in the fateful year of 1938.
377
959260
4000
16:03
And I think these words really nail it:
378
963260
3000
16:06
"It means a society based upon the opinion of civilians.
379
966260
4000
16:10
It means that violence, the rule of warriors and despotic chiefs,
380
970260
3000
16:13
the conditions of camps and warfare, of riot and tyranny,
381
973260
3000
16:16
give place to parliaments where laws are made,
382
976260
3000
16:19
and independent courts of justice
383
979260
2000
16:21
in which over long periods those laws are maintained.
384
981260
3000
16:24
That is civilization --
385
984260
2000
16:26
and in its soil grow continually
386
986260
2000
16:28
freedom, comfort and culture,"
387
988260
3000
16:31
what all TEDsters care about most.
388
991260
4000
16:35
"When civilization reigns in any country,
389
995260
3000
16:38
a wider and less harassed life
390
998260
3000
16:41
is afforded to the masses of the people."
391
1001260
3000
16:44
That's so true.
392
1004260
3000
16:48
I don't think the decline of Western civilization
393
1008260
3000
16:51
is inevitable,
394
1011260
2000
16:53
because I don't think history operates
395
1013260
3000
16:56
in this kind of life-cycle model,
396
1016260
2000
16:58
beautifully illustrated by Thomas Cole's
397
1018260
2000
17:00
"Course of Empire" paintings.
398
1020260
3000
17:03
That's not the way history works.
399
1023260
3000
17:06
That's not the way the West rose,
400
1026260
2000
17:08
and I don't think it's the way the West will fall.
401
1028260
3000
17:11
The West may collapse very suddenly.
402
1031260
3000
17:14
Complex civilizations do that,
403
1034260
3000
17:17
because they operate, most of the time,
404
1037260
2000
17:19
on the edge of chaos.
405
1039260
2000
17:21
That's one of the most profound insights
406
1041260
3000
17:24
to come out of the historical study of complex institutions
407
1044260
3000
17:27
like civilizations.
408
1047260
3000
17:30
No, we may hang on,
409
1050260
2000
17:32
despite the huge burdens of debt that we've accumulated,
410
1052260
4000
17:36
despite the evidence that we've lost our work ethic
411
1056260
3000
17:39
and other parts of our historical mojo.
412
1059260
3000
17:42
But one thing is for sure,
413
1062260
2000
17:44
the Great Divergence
414
1064260
2000
17:46
is over, folks.
415
1066260
2000
17:48
Thanks very much.
416
1068260
2000
17:50
(Applause)
417
1070260
25000
18:15
Bruno Giussani: Niall,
418
1095260
2000
18:17
I am just curious
419
1097260
2000
18:19
about your take on the other region of the world that's booming,
420
1099260
3000
18:22
which is Latin America.
421
1102260
3000
18:25
What's your view on that?
422
1105260
3000
18:28
Niall Ferguson: Well I really am not just talking
423
1108260
2000
18:30
about the rise of the East;
424
1110260
2000
18:32
I'm talking about the rise of the Rest,
425
1112260
2000
18:34
and that includes South America.
426
1114260
2000
18:36
I once asked one of my colleagues at Harvard,
427
1116260
2000
18:38
"Hey, is South America part of the West?"
428
1118260
2000
18:40
He was an expert in Latin American history.
429
1120260
2000
18:42
He said, "I don't know; I'll have to think about that."
430
1122260
2000
18:44
That tells you something really important.
431
1124260
2000
18:46
I think if you look at what is happening in Brazil in particular,
432
1126260
2000
18:48
but also Chile,
433
1128260
2000
18:50
which was in many ways the one that led the way
434
1130260
3000
18:53
in transforming the institutions of economic life,
435
1133260
3000
18:56
there's a very bright future indeed.
436
1136260
3000
18:59
So my story really is
437
1139260
2000
19:01
as much about that convergence in the Americas
438
1141260
3000
19:04
as it's a convergence story in Eurasia.
439
1144260
2000
19:06
BG: And there is this impression
440
1146260
2000
19:08
that North America and Europe
441
1148260
2000
19:10
are not really paying attention
442
1150260
2000
19:12
to these trends.
443
1152260
2000
19:14
Mostly they're worried about each other.
444
1154260
3000
19:17
The Americans think that the European model is going to crumble tomorrow.
445
1157260
3000
19:20
The Europeans think that the American budget is going to explode tomorrow.
446
1160260
3000
19:23
And that's all we seem to be caring about recently.
447
1163260
3000
19:26
NF: I think the fiscal crisis
448
1166260
2000
19:28
that we see in the developed World right now -- both sides of the Atlantic --
449
1168260
3000
19:31
is essentially the same thing
450
1171260
2000
19:33
taking different forms
451
1173260
2000
19:35
in terms of political culture.
452
1175260
2000
19:37
And it's a crisis that has its structural facet --
453
1177260
4000
19:41
it's partly to do with demographics.
454
1181260
2000
19:43
But it's also, of course, to do with the massive crisis
455
1183260
3000
19:46
that followed excessive leverage,
456
1186260
2000
19:48
excessive borrowing in the private sector.
457
1188260
2000
19:50
That crisis,
458
1190260
2000
19:52
which has been the focus of so much attention, including by me,
459
1192260
3000
19:55
I think is an epiphenomenon.
460
1195260
2000
19:57
The financial crisis is really a relatively small historic phenomenon,
461
1197260
3000
20:00
which has just accelerated
462
1200260
2000
20:02
this huge shift,
463
1202260
2000
20:04
which ends half a millennium of Western ascendancy.
464
1204260
2000
20:06
I think that's its real importance.
465
1206260
2000
20:08
BG: Niall, thank you. (NF: Thank you very much, Bruno.)
466
1208260
2000
20:10
(Applause)
467
1210260
3000
About this website

This site will introduce you to YouTube videos that are useful for learning English. You will see English lessons taught by top-notch teachers from around the world. Double-click on the English subtitles displayed on each video page to play the video from there. The subtitles scroll in sync with the video playback. If you have any comments or requests, please contact us using this contact form.

https://forms.gle/WvT1wiN1qDtmnspy7