Greg Asner: Ecology from the air

84,693 views ・ 2013-11-19

TED


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譯者: Aileen Huang 審譯者: Willy Feng
00:12
Technology can change our understanding of nature.
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我們對自然的認識 隨著科技而改變
00:16
Take for example the case of lions.
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拿獅子來說
00:19
For centuries, it's been said that female lions
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好幾世紀以來 我們都認為
00:22
do all of the hunting out in the open savanna,
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只有母獅會在大草原上會狩獵
00:24
and male lions do nothing until it's time for dinner.
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公獅總是坐享其成
00:28
You've heard this too, I can tell.
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就以這一對而言 這是正確的
00:31
Well recently, I led an airborne mapping campaign
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我最近主持的空拍地形描繪計畫
00:34
in the Kruger National Park in South Africa.
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位於南非的克魯格國家公園
00:36
Our colleagues put GPS tracking collars
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我們在公獅跟母獅的
00:39
on male and female lions,
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頸子上配戴GPS追蹤頸環
00:41
and we mapped their hunting behavior
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然後我們從空中追蹤
00:42
from the air.
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觀察牠們的狩獵習性
00:44
The lower left shows a lion sizing up
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左下方的圖 可以看出一隻獅子準備獵食
00:46
a herd of impala for a kill,
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要把羚羊群聚一起 準備狩獵
00:48
and the right shows what I call
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右圖就是我說的
00:50
the lion viewshed.
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獅子的視域
00:52
That's how far the lion can see in all directions
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這是獅子在各方向視野所及的範圍
00:54
until his or her view is obstructed by vegetation.
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直到視野被植被遮擋
00:59
And what we found
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我們發現
01:00
is that male lions are not the lazy hunters
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公獅並不是我們想像中
01:03
we thought them to be.
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好吃懶做的傢伙
01:04
They just use a different strategy.
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牠們只是用了不同的策略
01:06
Whereas the female lions hunt
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相較於喜愛在大草原
01:08
out in the open savanna
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進行長距離狩獵的母獅
01:09
over long distances, usually during the day,
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通常是日間狩獵
01:12
male lions use an ambush strategy
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公獅更喜歡在夜間埋伏
01:15
in dense vegetation, and often at night.
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在茂密的植被區域
01:19
This video shows the actual hunting viewsheds
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這段影片說明 母獅跟公獅狩獵視域的差異性
01:22
of male lions on the left
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左邊是公獅的視域
01:23
and females on the right.
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右邊的是母獅
01:25
Red and darker colors show more dense vegetation,
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紅色深色區塊 表示茂密的植被
01:28
and the white are wide open spaces.
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白色區塊代表開放場域
01:30
And this is the viewshed right literally at the eye level
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這個視域高度
01:33
of hunting male and female lions.
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就是公獅跟母獅眼睛看到的高度
01:36
All of a sudden, you get a very clear understanding
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你會突然瞭解
01:38
of the very spooky conditions under which
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公獅狩獵時的
01:41
male lions do their hunting.
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詭譎氣氛
01:43
I bring up this example to begin,
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我以這個例子開場白 因為它能強調
01:44
because it emphasizes how little we know about nature.
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我們對大自然的了解這麼淺
01:49
There's been a huge amount of work done so far
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時至今日 已有大量計畫投入
01:52
to try to slow down our losses of tropical forests,
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試圖減緩熱帶森林消失
01:55
and we are losing our forests at a rapid rate,
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儘管它消失的速度迅速
01:57
as shown in red on the slide.
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可以從投影片上的紅色看出來
01:59
I find it ironic that we're doing so much,
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諷刺的是 我們做得這麼多
02:01
yet these areas are fairly unknown to science.
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對科學而言 這些卻是陌生的區域
02:05
So how can we save what we don't understand?
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究竟如何保護我們不了解的雨林呢
02:08
Now I'm a global ecologist and an Earth explorer
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我是全球生態學家跟地球探險家
02:10
with a background in physics and chemistry
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我有物理跟化學的背景
02:12
and biology and a lot of other boring subjects,
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還有生物以及一堆無聊科目的知識
02:15
but above all, I'm obsessed with what we don't know
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但更重要的是
02:18
about our planet.
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我對於未知的地球的狂熱
02:20
So I created this,
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所以我創立了
02:22
the Carnegie Airborne Observatory, or CAO.
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卡內基空中天文台號 簡稱CAO
02:25
It may look like a plane with a fancy paint job,
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它看起來像一架花俏的飛機
02:27
but I packed it with over 1,000 kilos
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但是當我把它裝滿
02:30
of high-tech sensors, computers,
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超過1000公斤的高科技感應器、電腦
02:32
and a very motivated staff
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還有一群積極主動的組員
02:34
of Earth scientists and pilots.
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地球科學家跟飛行員
02:37
Two of our instruments are very unique:
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我們有兩台非常特別的儀器
02:39
one is called an imaging spectrometer
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一個是成像光譜儀
02:40
that can actually measure the chemical composition
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它能即時測量 飛行路線經過的
02:42
of plants as we fly over them.
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植物的化學成分
02:45
Another one is a set of lasers,
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另一台是一組雷射
02:47
very high-powered lasers,
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非常高功率的雷射
02:49
that fire out of the bottom of the plane,
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能從飛機底部射出
02:51
sweeping across the ecosystem
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掃過整個生態統
02:53
and measuring it at nearly 500,000 times per second
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同時以幾乎每秒50萬的速度
02:57
in high-resolution 3D.
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掃瞄出3D高解析圖
02:59
Here's an image of the Golden Gate Bridge
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這是舊金山的金門大橋
03:01
in San Francisco, not far from where I live.
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距離我家不太遠
03:04
Although we flew straight over this bridge,
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儘管我們飛過了這座橋
03:05
we imaged it in 3D, captured its color
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我們以3D描繪 記錄色彩
03:07
in just a few seconds.
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僅僅花了幾秒鐘
03:09
But the real power of the CAO
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但是CAO真正的強項
03:11
is its ability to capture the actual building blocks
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是它能記錄生態系裡的
03:13
of ecosystems.
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組成元件
03:15
This is a small town in the Amazon,
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這是亞馬遜的一個小鎮
03:17
imaged with the CAO.
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以CAO描繪的
03:18
We can slice through our data
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我們能從資料中取樣分析
03:20
and see, for example, the 3D structure
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例如植被的3D結構
03:22
of the vegetation and the buildings,
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還有建築
03:25
or we can use the chemical information
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或是我們可以應用化學資料
03:27
to actually figure out how fast the plants are growing
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來調查植物的生長速度
03:29
as we fly over them.
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在我們飛越它們的當下
03:31
The hottest pinks are the fastest-growing plants.
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深粉紅色的是生長最迅速的植物
03:34
And we can see biodiversity in ways
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我們觀察到的生物多樣性
03:36
that you never could have imagined.
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也是從所未見的
03:38
This is what a rainforest might look like
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如果你從熱氣球往下看
03:40
as you fly over it in a hot air balloon.
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雨林可能會長這樣
03:42
This is how we see a rainforest,
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但這是我們看到的雨林
03:44
in kaleidoscopic color that tells us
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跟萬花筒一樣的繽紛色彩
03:46
that there are many species living with one another.
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告訴我們有很多生物同時存在
03:49
But you have to remember that these trees
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你別忘了
03:51
are literally bigger than whales,
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這些樹有的比鯨魚還要大
03:54
and what that means is that they're impossible to understand
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也就是說 如果僅僅在地面上走過
03:57
just by walking on the ground below them.
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你是絕對無法了解它們的
03:59
So our imagery is 3D, it's chemical, it's biological,
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所以我們的影像是3D的 是化學的 是生物的
04:04
and this tells us not only the species
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它說明的
04:06
that are living in the canopy,
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不只是在樹冠層的生物
04:08
but it tells us a lot of information
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還有很多的資訊
04:10
about the rest of the species that occupy the rainforest.
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關於雨林中的其他物種
04:13
Now I created the CAO
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我創立CAO的目的
04:15
in order to answer questions that have proven
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是為了解開不論從任何制高點
04:18
extremely challenging to answer from any other vantage point,
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都具有相當挑戰性的問題
04:21
such as from the ground, or from satellite sensors.
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不論是從地面或是衛星感測器
04:24
I want to share three of those questions with you today.
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今天我要跟你分享其中三個問題
04:27
The first questions is,
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第一個問題
04:29
how do we manage our carbon reserves
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我們該如何管理
04:30
in tropical forests?
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熱帶森林的碳儲量?
04:33
Tropical forests contain a huge amount of carbon in the trees,
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熱帶森林的樹木含有大量的二氧化碳
04:37
and we need to keep that carbon in those forests
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我們必須把二氧化碳保留在森林裡
04:39
if we're going to avoid any further global warming.
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如果要避免地球暖化持續惡化
04:43
Unfortunately, global carbon emissions
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遺憾的是全球森林砍伐
04:45
from deforestation
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所釋出的碳排放量
04:47
now equals the global transportation sector.
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已經等於全球交通釋出的碳排放量
04:50
That's all ships, airplanes, trains and automobiles combined.
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這包含所有的船隻、飛機、火車、汽車總和
04:54
So it's understandable that policy negotiators
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所以政策談判者當然會
04:57
have been working hard to reduce deforestation,
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持續努力減低森林砍伐
05:00
but they're doing it on landscapes
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但是這些地區 在科學領域中
05:01
that are hardly known to science.
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都是相對陌生的區域
05:04
If you don't know where the carbon is exactly,
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如果不確實知道二氧化碳在哪裡
05:06
in detail, how can you know what you're losing?
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又該如何知道會失去什麼呢?
05:09
Basically, we need a high-tech accounting system.
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其實我們需要一個高科技的會計系統
05:13
With our system, we're able to see the carbon stocks
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在我們的系統裡 你可以仔細看見
05:15
of tropical forests in utter detail.
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熱帶雨林的碳儲量
05:18
The red shows, obviously, closed-canopy tropical forest,
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紅色區塊是熱帶森林的茂密樹冠層
05:21
and then you see the cookie cutting,
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然後像是蛋糕被切開
05:23
or the cutting of the forest in yellows and greens.
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黃色跟綠色區塊是被開發的地帶
05:27
It's like cutting a cake except this cake
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就像切蛋糕一樣
05:30
is about whale deep.
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只是這塊蛋糕大概有一隻鯨魚這麼深
05:32
And yet, we can zoom in and see the forest
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我們能同時放大
05:34
and the trees at the same time.
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看看森林還有樹木
05:36
And what's amazing is, even though we flew
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驚人的是
05:38
very high above this forest,
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儘管我們從高空飛過
05:40
later on in analysis, we can go in
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分析之後 我們能進入
05:42
and actually experience the treetrops,
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並且體驗樹冠層的
05:44
leaf by leaf, branch by branch,
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每一片葉 每一個樹枝
05:47
just as the other species that live in this forest
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如同森林裡的其他生物一樣
05:50
experience it along with the trees themselves.
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親身體驗這些樹木
05:53
We've been using the technology to explore
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我們應用這種科技探索
05:55
and to actually put out the first carbon geographies
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並整合出第一份
05:58
in high resolution
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高解析度的碳地圖
06:00
in faraway places like the Amazon Basin
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包含遙遠的亞馬遜河流域
06:02
and not-so-faraway places like the United States
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還有鄰近的
06:04
and Central America.
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美國跟中美洲
06:06
What I'm going to do is I'm going to take you on a high-resolution, first-time tour
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現在我要帶你體驗 首度的高解析碳地理圖
06:09
of the carbon landscapes of Peru and then Panama.
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探索祕魯跟巴拿馬
06:13
The colors are going to be going from red to blue.
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顏色會由紅色到藍色
06:16
Red is extremely high carbon stocks,
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紅色是極高碳含量
06:18
your largest cathedral forests you can imagine,
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這裡有你能想像到最壯觀的森林
06:21
and blue are very low carbon stocks.
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藍色代表很低的碳含量
06:23
And let me tell you, Peru alone is an amazing place,
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單單是祕魯 就是一個不可思議的地方
06:25
totally unknown in terms of its carbon geography
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她的碳地圖
06:28
until today.
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從未被探討過
06:29
We can fly to this area in northern Peru
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我們先飛到祕魯北部
06:31
and see super high carbon stocks in red,
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紅色代表極高碳含量
06:33
and the Amazon River and floodplain
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亞馬遜河域跟洪氾區
06:35
cutting right through it.
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切過了這個地區
06:37
We can go to an area of utter devastation
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再看看狀況極糟的地方
06:38
caused by deforestation in blue,
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因為森林砍伐轉為藍色
06:40
and the virus of deforestation spreading out in orange.
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森林砍伐如同病毒 蔓延到橘色的區域
06:44
We can also fly to the southern Andes
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我們再飛到安第斯山脈的南方
06:46
to see the tree line and see exactly how
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看看森林的邊緣
06:48
the carbon geography ends
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隨著上升的山脈地形
06:50
as we go up into the mountain system.
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觀察碳地圖如何止盡
06:53
And we can go to the biggest swamp in the western Amazon.
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接著來到西亞馬遜的最大沼澤地
06:56
It's a watery dreamworld
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這個夢幻水澤地
06:57
akin to Jim Cameron's "Avatar."
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類似詹姆斯·卡麥隆的「阿凡達」
07:00
We can go to one of the smallest tropical countries,
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我們可以到最小的熱帶國家
07:03
Panama, and see also a huge range
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巴拿馬
07:05
of carbon variation,
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觀察變化萬千的碳地圖
07:07
from high in red to low in blue.
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從高密度的紅色 到低密度的藍色
07:09
Unfortunately, most of the carbon is lost in the lowlands,
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可惜低地的碳含量 已經消失殆盡
07:12
but what you see that's left,
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但是看到左側的區塊
07:13
in terms of high carbon stocks in greens and reds,
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紅色跟綠色標示的高碳含量
07:16
is the stuff that's up in the mountains.
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是在山區的部分
07:18
One interesting exception to this
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有個例外 很有趣
07:20
is right in the middle of your screen.
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在銀幕的正中央
07:22
You're seeing the buffer zone around the Panama Canal.
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是巴拿馬運河周遭的緩衝區
07:25
That's in the reds and yellows.
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紅色跟黃色的區塊
07:27
The canal authorities are using force
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運河的管理單位 以強制手段
07:28
to protect their watershed and global commerce.
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捍衛的流域跟全球經濟
07:31
This kind of carbon mapping
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這樣的碳地圖描繪
07:33
has transformed conservation
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改變了環境保育
07:35
and resource policy development.
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以及資源政策的發展
07:36
It's really advancing our ability to save forests
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大大提升我們的能力
07:39
and to curb climate change.
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在保育森林跟抑制氣候變遷 有很大助益
07:41
My second question: How do we prepare for climate change
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我的第二個問題是: 我們該如何為氣候變遷做準備?
07:45
in a place like the Amazon rainforest?
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以亞馬遜熱帶雨林為例
07:47
Let me tell you, I spend a lot of time
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我花了很多時間在這些地方
07:48
in these places, and we're seeing the climate changing already.
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而且我們已經看到氣候變遷
07:52
Temperatures are increasing,
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溫度上升
07:53
and what's really happening is we're getting a lot of droughts,
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真實的是 乾旱越來越頻繁
07:56
recurring droughts.
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重複不斷的乾旱
07:58
The 2010 mega-drought is shown here
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這裡顯示2010年的超級旱災
07:59
with red showing an area about the size of Western Europe.
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標註的紅色區塊 有西歐這麼大
08:03
The Amazon was so dry in 2010
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2010年的亞馬遜非常乾燥
08:05
that even the main stem of the Amazon river itself
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甚至連亞馬遜河的主流
08:08
dried up partially, as you see in the photo
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有一部分都乾枯了
08:10
in the lower portion of the slide.
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在幻燈片的下半部可以看到
08:13
What we found is that in very remote areas,
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我們發現在非常偏遠地區
08:16
these droughts are having a big negative impact
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這些乾旱對於熱帶森林
08:19
on tropical forests.
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有很大的負面衝擊
08:21
For example, these are all of the dead trees in red
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舉例 紅色顯示的是因為2010年旱災
08:23
that suffered mortality following the 2010 drought.
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受災的枯死樹木
08:26
This area happens to be on the border
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受災區在
08:28
of Peru and Brazil,
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祕魯跟巴西的邊境
08:30
totally unexplored,
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是從未被探索過的地帶
08:31
almost totally unknown scientifically.
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幾乎是科學上的未知地帶
08:34
So what we think, as Earth scientists,
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身為地球科學家
08:36
is species are going to have to migrate
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我們認為物種會遷移
08:38
with climate change from the east in Brazil
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隨著氣候的變遷
08:41
all the way west into the Andes
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從巴西東部 往西移動到安地斯
08:43
and up into the mountains
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往山上遷移
08:45
in order to minimize their exposure to climate change.
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儘量減低氣候變遷 對他們的衝擊
08:48
One of the problems with this is that humans
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其中一個問題就是
08:50
are taking apart the western Amazon as we speak.
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人類整在瓦解西亞馬遜區域
08:53
Look at this 100-square-kilometer gash
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看看這個100平方公尺的開發區
08:55
in the forest created by gold miners.
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這是金礦工在森林裡開墾的
08:58
You see the forest in green in 3D,
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3D的綠色區塊是森林
09:01
and you see the effects of gold mining
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還有金礦開採帶來的效果
09:02
down below the soil surface.
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在地底下的系統裡
09:05
Species have nowhere to migrate in a system like this, obviously.
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物種沒有任何地方可以遷移
09:09
If you haven't been to the Amazon, you should go.
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如果你還沒去過亞馬遜 你真應該去
09:12
It's an amazing experience every time,
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不論你去哪裡
09:14
no matter where you go.
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每一次都是不可思議的經驗
09:16
You're going to probably see it this way, on a river.
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你可能會看到這種河上景色
09:19
But what happens is a lot of times
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但很多時候
09:21
the rivers hide what's really going on
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河流會隱藏森林裡的
09:23
back in the forest itself.
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事實真相
09:25
We flew over this same river,
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我們飛越同一條河流
09:27
imaged the system in 3D.
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以3D掃描這個河域系統
09:29
The forest is on the left.
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左邊的有森林
09:31
And then we can digitally remove the forest
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然後我們以數位分析 把森林移開
09:33
and see what's going on below the canopy.
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觀察樹冠層底下
09:35
And in this case, we found gold mining activity,
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結果我們發現金礦開採活動
09:38
all of it illegal,
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全都是非法的
09:39
set back away from the river's edge,
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全都遠離河岸
09:41
as you'll see in those strange pockmarks
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看那些奇怪的麻子點點
09:43
coming up on your screen on the right.
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在銀幕的右側
09:45
Don't worry, we're working with the authorities
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放心 我們已經跟當局在努力
09:47
to deal with this and many, many other problems
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解決這個地區的採礦問題
09:50
in the region.
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和許多其他的問題
09:52
So in order to put together a conservation plan
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為了成立保育計畫
09:55
for these unique, important corridors
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給這些獨特又重要的廊道
09:57
like the western Amazon and the Andes Amazon corridor,
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例如西亞馬遜 以及安地斯亞馬遜廊道
10:00
we have to start making
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我們開始製作
10:02
geographically explicit plans now.
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地理上明確的計畫
10:05
How do we do that if we don't know the geography of biodiversity in the region,
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如果不清楚這區域 生物多樣性的地理
10:09
if it's so unknown to science?
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又該怎麼著手呢?
10:10
So what we've been doing is using
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所以我們應用
10:12
the laser-guided spectroscopy from the CAO
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CAO的雷射導引光譜
10:15
to map for the first time the biodiversity
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繪製第一個亞馬遜雨林的
10:18
of the Amazon rainforest.
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生物多樣性地圖
10:19
Here you see actual data showing different species in different colors.
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這個資料以顏色標註不同的物種
10:23
Reds are one type of species, blues are another,
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紅色的是相同物種 藍色則是另一種
10:25
and greens are yet another.
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綠色也是不同種的物種
10:27
And when we take this together and scale up
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當我們放大這張圖
10:29
to the regional level,
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到區域性的規模
10:31
we get a completely new geography
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我們看見一個全新的地理圖像
10:34
of biodiversity unknown prior to this work.
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顯示前所未知的生物多樣性
10:38
This tells us where the big biodiversity changes
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這告訴我們哪裡有大規模的生物樣性變化
10:40
occur from habitat to habitat,
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從一個棲息地 到另一個棲息地
10:42
and that's really important because it tells us
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這非常重要 因為我們可以知道
10:44
a lot about where species may migrate to
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隨著氣候的變遷
10:47
and migrate from as the climate shifts.
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很多物種的遷移動向
10:50
And this is the pivotal information that's needed
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保護區發展計劃的決策者
10:53
by decision makers to develop protected areas
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正需要這種以他們區域背景做規劃的關鍵資訊
10:57
in the context of their regional development plans.
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正需要這種以他們區域背景做規劃的關鍵資訊
11:00
And third and final question is,
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第三個也是最後的問題
11:02
how do we manage biodiversity on a planet
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我們如何管理地球上
11:04
of protected ecosystems?
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受保護的生態系裡的生物多樣性?
11:06
The example I started out with about lions hunting,
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我最初舉例的獅子狩獵
11:09
that was a study we did
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那是我們的一項研究
11:11
behind the fence line of a protected area
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1992
在南非的
11:13
in South Africa.
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圈化保護區裡
11:15
And the truth is, much of Africa's nature
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事實上 未來非洲大部分的自然
11:17
is going to persist into the future
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將會在這種圈化的保護區裡延續
11:19
in protected areas like I show in blue on the screen.
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像銀幕上看到的藍色區塊
11:22
This puts incredible pressure and responsibility
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這在公園的管理處
11:24
on park management.
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造成極大的壓力跟責任
11:26
They need to do and make decisions
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他們必須做出並且執行決策
11:29
that will benefit all of the species that they're protecting.
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讓所有受保護的物種受益
11:32
Some of their decisions have really big impacts.
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他們的一些決策有重大的影響
11:35
For example, how much and where
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例如 以火作為管理工具的
11:37
to use fire as a management tool?
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次數跟地點
11:40
Or, how to deal with a large species like elephants,
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或是如何管理大型動物 例如大象
11:43
which may, if their populations get too large,
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大象可能繁衍過量
11:45
have a negative impact on the ecosystem
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對生態系裡的其他物種
11:47
and on other species.
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產生負面衝擊
11:49
And let me tell you, these types of dynamics
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這些動態變化
11:51
really play out on the landscape.
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是真實在大地上演的
11:53
In the foreground is an area with lots of fire
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前景看到的是大量用火
11:56
and lots of elephants:
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還有很多大象的地帶
11:57
wide open savanna in blue, and just a few trees.
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藍色是開放性的大草原 樹很少
12:01
As we cross this fence line, now we're getting
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當我們跨過這個圍籬
12:03
into an area that has had protection from fire
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進入的地區 用火適當
12:05
and zero elephants:
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也沒有大象
12:07
dense vegetation, a radically different ecosystem.
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茂密的植被 跟一個全然不同的生態系
12:11
And in a place like Kruger,
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在克魯格國家公園
12:14
the soaring elephant densities
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大象的族群暴增
12:15
are a real problem.
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已經是個難題
12:17
I know it's a sensitive issue for many of you,
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我知道對很多人而言 這議題很敏感
12:20
and there are no easy answers with this.
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這也沒有簡單的答案
12:22
But what's good is that the technology we've developed
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但往好處想 我們發展的科技
12:25
and we're working with in South Africa, for example,
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還有例如我們跟南非的合作
12:27
is allowing us to map every single tree in the savanna,
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讓我們描繪了大草原上的每棵樹
12:30
and then through repeat flights
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經過反覆的飛行
12:32
we're able to see which trees
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我們看到哪些樹
12:34
are being pushed over by elephants,
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被大象推倒
12:36
in the red as you see on the screen, and how much that's happening
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從銀幕上的紅色 可以看見
12:39
in different types of landscapes in the savanna.
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還有次數的頻繁度 在大草原上不同的地景
12:42
That's giving park managers
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這是公園管理員
12:43
a very first opportunity to use
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有史以來第一次有機會用
12:46
tactical management strategies that are more nuanced
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更細微的管理策略
12:49
and don't lead to those extremes that I just showed you.
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進而避免我們剛看到的極端狀況
12:54
So really, the way we're looking
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所以 我們現在看待保護區的方式
12:56
at protected areas nowadays
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所以 我們現在看待保護區的方式
12:58
is to think of it as tending to a circle of life,
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已經趨向一種生命循環
13:01
where we have fire management,
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我們有用火管理, 大象管理
13:03
elephant management, those impacts on the structure of the ecosystem,
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這些衝擊生態系統的結構
13:08
and then those impacts
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1990
而且這些衝擊
13:10
affecting everything from insects
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影響的所有物種
13:12
up to apex predators like lions.
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小至昆蟲 大至食物鏈頂端的獅子
13:15
Going forward, I plan to greatly expand
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在未來 我計劃更大量使用
13:16
the airborne observatory.
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卡內基空中天文台號
13:18
I'm hoping to actually put the technology into orbit
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我希望讓這技術上星球軌道
13:20
so we can manage the entire planet
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以這種技術
13:22
with technologies like this.
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管理我們的整個星球
13:24
Until then, you're going to find me flying
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在那之前 你會看到我不停飛行
13:26
in some remote place that you've never heard of.
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在你從未耳聞的偏遠地區
13:28
I just want to end by saying that technology is
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最後我要說 在管理我們的星球
13:31
absolutely critical to managing our planet,
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這項科技絕對有關鍵的角色
13:34
but even more important is the understanding
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但更重要的是理解它
13:36
and wisdom to apply it.
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還有妥善的運用
13:38
Thank you.
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謝謝
13:40
(Applause)
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4077
(掌聲)

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