Sebastian Junger: Why veterans miss war

Prevodilac: Milenka Okuka Lektor: Mile Živković

I'm going to ask and try to answer,

Postaviću i pokušaću da odgovorim

in some ways, kind of an uncomfortable question.

na, na neki način, prilično neprijatno pitanje.

Both civilians, obviously, and soldiers

I civili, naravno, i vojnici

suffer in war;

ispaštaju u ratu.

I don't think any civilian has ever missed

Ne mislim da je ijednom civilu ikada nedostajao rat,

the war that they were subjected to.

rat kom je bio izložen.

I've been covering wars for almost 20 years,

Bavim se ratovima skoro 20 godina

and one of the remarkable things for me

i meni je neverovatno

is how many soldiers find themselves missing it.

koliko vojnika shvati da im nedostaje rat.

How is it someone can go through

Kako to da neko može da prođe

the worst experience imaginable,

kroz nezamislivo loše iskustvo

and come home, back to their home,

i vrati se kući, nazad svojoj kući

and their family, their country, and miss the war?

i svojoj porodici, svojoj zemlji i da mu nedostaje rat?

How does that work? What does it mean?

Šta je svrha toga? Šta to znači?

We have to answer that question,

Moramo da odgovorimo na to pitanje,

because if we don't, it'll be impossible

jer ako ne odgovorimo, biće nemoguće

to bring soldiers back

vojnicima vratiti

to a place in society where they belong,

mesto u društvu gde pripadaju

and I think it'll also be impossible to stop war,

i mislim da će biti nemoguće zaustaviti rat,

if we don't understand how that mechanism works.

ukoliko ne shvatimo kako taj mehanizam funkcioniše.

The problem is that war

Problem je što rat

does not have a simple, neat truth,

nema prostu, prikladnu istinu,

one simple, neat truth.

jednu prostu, prikladnu istinu.

Any sane person hates war,

Svako normalan mrzi rat,

hates the idea of war,

mrzi samu predstavu o ratu,

wouldn't want to have anything to do with it,

ne želi da ima bilo šta s tim,

doesn't want to be near it, doesn't want to know about it.

ne želi da bude blizu njega, ne želi da zna za njega.

That's a sane response to war.

To je razuman odgovor na rat.

But if I asked all of you in this room,

No ukoliko bih pitao sve vas u ovoj prostoriji

who here has paid money

ko je od vas platio

to go to a cinema

da ode u bioskop

and be entertained by a Hollywood war movie,

da ga zabavlja holivudski ratni film,

most of you would probably raise your hands.

verovatno bi većina vas podigla ruke.

That's what's so complicated about war.

Eto zašto je rat toliko komplikovan.

And trust me, if a room full of peace-loving people

I, verujte mi, ako puna soba ljubitelja mira

finds something compelling about war,

pronalazi nešto privlačno u ratu,

so do 20-year-old soldiers

tako je i s dvadesetogodišnjim vojnicima

who have been trained in it, I promise you.

koji su trenirani za njega, ovo vam garantujem.

That's the thing that has to be understood.

To je ono što bi trebalo razumeti.

I've covered war for about 20 years, as I said,

Bavim se ratom oko 20 godina, kao što sam rekao,

but my most intense experiences in combat

ali najintenzivnije iskustvo borbe

were with American soldiers in Afghanistan.

sam imao s američkim vojnicima u Avganistanu.

I've been in Africa, the Middle East,

Bejah u Africi, srednjem istoku,

Afghanistan in the '90s,

u Avganistanu tokom devedesetih,

but it was with American soldiers in 2007, 2008,

ali sam s američkim vojnicima 2007, 2008,

that I was confronted with

bio suočen

very intense combat.

s veoma žestokom borbom.

I was in a small valley called the Korengal Valley

Bio sam u maloj dolini, zvanoj Korengal,

in eastern Afghanistan.

u istočnom Avganistanu.

It was six miles long.

Bila je duga oko 10 km.

There were 150 men of Battle Company in that valley,

Bilo nas je 150 u Borbenoj družini u toj dolini

and for a while, while I was there,

i nakratko, dok sam bio tamo,

almost 20 percent of all the combat

skoro 20 procenata celokupne borbe,

in all of Afghanistan was happening

u čitavom Avganistanu se dešavalo

in those six miles.

u tih 10 km.

A hundred and fifty men were absorbing

Sto pedeset ljudi je apsorbovalo

almost a fifth of the combat for all of NATO forces

skoro petinu borbe svih NATO snaga

in the country, for a couple months.

u zemlji, tokom par meseci.

It was very intense.

Bilo je izuzetno žestoko.

I spent most of my time at a small outpost

Većinu vremena sam provodio na maloj predstraži

called Restrepo.

zvanoj Restrepo.

It was named after the platoon medic

Nazvana je po medicinskom vodniku

that had been killed about two months into the deployment.

koji je ubijen, otprilike dva meseca nakon razvrstavanja.

It was a few plywood B-huts

Činilo ju je nekoliko baraka od iverice,

clinging to a side of a ridge,

koje su se jednom stranom naslanjale na greben

and sandbags, bunkers, gun positions,

i vreće s peskom, bunkeri, pozicije za oružje

and there were 20 men up there

i bilo je tu 20 muškaraca

of Second Platoon, Battle Company.

iz drugog voda Borbene družine.

I spent most of my time up there.

Uglavnom sam tamo bio.

There was no running water.

Nismo imali tekuću vodu.

There was no way to bathe.

Nismo se kupali.

The guys were up there for a month at a time.

Momci su tamo bili već mesec dana.

They never even got out of their clothes.

Nisu se čak ni presvlačili.

They fought. The worked.

Borili su se, radili,

They slept in the same clothes.

spavali u istoj odeći.

They never took them off, and at the end of the month,

Nisu je svlačili i krajem meseca

they went back down to the company headquarters,

odlazili su do glavnog štaba,

and by then, their clothes were unwearable.

a do tad, odeća im je već bila nenosiva.

They burned them and got a new set.

Spalili bi je i dobili bi novi komplet.

There was no Internet. There was no phone.

Nije bilo interneta, ni telefona.

There was no communication with the outside world up there.

Nismo imali kontakt sa spoljnim svetom.

There was no cooked food.

Nije bilo kuvane hrane.

There was nothing up there

Tamo nije bilo ničega

that young men typically like:

što mladi inače vole:

no cars, no girls, no television, nothing

ni kola, ni devojaka, ni televizije, ničega

except combat.

osim borbe.

Combat they did learn to like.

Borbe, koju su naučili da vole.

I remember one day, it was a very hot day

Sećam se jednog dana, bio je vreo

in the spring,

prolećni dan

and we hadn't been in a fight

i mi nismo učestvovali u bici

in a couple of weeks, maybe.

par nedelja, možda.

Usually, the outpost was attacked,

Obično su napadali predstražu,

and we hadn't seen any combat in a couple of weeks,

a mi nismo uopšte videli borbu par nedelja,

and everyone was just stunned

i svi smo bili prosto zatečeni

with boredom and heat.

dosadom i vrućinom.

And I remember the lieutenant walking past me

Sećam se da je poručnik prošao pored mene

sort of stripped to the waist.

skoro go do pasa.

It was incredibly hot.

Bilo je neverovatno toplo.

Stripped to the waist, walked past me muttering,

Go do pasa, prošao je pored mene mrmljajući:

"Oh God, please someone attack us today."

"Gospode, kad bi nas neko napao danas."

That's how bored they were.

Eto koliko im je bilo dosadno.

That's war too, is a lieutenant saying,

I to je rat, poručnik koji govori:

"Please make something happen

"Molim te neka se nešto desi,

because we're going crazy."

inače ćemo izludeti."

To understand that,

Kako biste razumeli to,

you have to, for a moment,

morate, nakratko,

think about combat not morally --

da razmišljate o borbi, ne s moralne strane -

that's an important job to do —

to je važan posao -

but for a moment, don't think about it morally,

no nakratko, ne mislite o tome etički,

think about it neurologically.

mislite o tome s neurološke strane.

Let's think about what happens in your brain

Razmislimo o tome šta se dešava u vašem mozgu

when you're in combat.

kada ste u borbi.

First of all, the experience

Pre svega, samo iskustvo

is very bizarre, it's a very bizarre one.

je bizarno, veoma bizarno.

It's not what I had expected.

Nije ono što sam očekivao.

Usually, you're not scared.

Uglavnom ne osećate strah.

I've been very scared in combat,

Bilo me je veoma strah u toku borbe,

but most of the time when I was out there,

ali većinom dok sam bio tamo,

I wasn't scared.

nije me bilo strah.

I was very scared beforehand

Bilo me je veoma strah pre

and incredibly scared afterwards,

i izuzetno me je bilo strah posle,

and that fear that comes afterwards can last years.

a taj strah koji dođe posle može da traje godinama.

I haven't been shot at in six years,

Prošlo je šest godina kako sam pogođen,

and I was woken up very abruptly this morning

a jutros me naglo probudila

by a nightmare that I was being strafed by aircraft,

noćna mora da sam mitraljiran iz aviona,

six years later.

šest godina kasnije.

I've never even been strafed by aircraft,

Nikada nisam mitraljiran iz aviona,

and I was having nightmares about it.

a imao sam noćne more o tome.

Time slows down.

Vreme uspori.

You get this weird tunnel vision.

Dobiješ taj čudni tunelski vid.

You notice some details very, very, very accurately

Primećuješ neke detalje veoma, veoma, veoma precizno,

and other things drop out.

a sve ostale stvari nestaju.

It's almost a slightly altered state of mind.

To skoro da je blago pomerena svest.

What's happening in your brain

Ono što se dešava tvom mozgu

is you're getting an enormous amount of adrenaline

je da se ogromna količina adrenalina

pumped through your system.

pumpa kroz tvoj sistem.

Young men will go to great lengths

Nema šta mladi neće uraditi

to have that experience.

da dožive to iskustvo.

It's wired into us.

To je ugrađeno u nas.

It's hormonally supported.

Potpomognuto je hormonima.

The mortality rate for young men in society

Stopa smrtnosti mladića u društvu

is six times what it is for young women

je šest puta veća od smrtnosti devojaka,

from violence and from accidents,

kada su u pitanju nasilje i nesreće.

just the stupid stuff that young men do:

Neke od gluposti koje mladići rade:

jumping off of things they shouldn't jump off of,

skaču sa stvari s kojih ne bi trebalo da skaču,

lighting things on fire they shouldn't light on fire,

pale stvari koje ne bi trebalo da pale.

I mean, you know what I'm talking about.

Mislim, znate o čemu govorim.

They die at six times the rate

Umiru šest puta češće

that young women do.

od devojaka.

Statistically, you are safer as a teenage boy,

Statistički, sigurniji si kao tinejdžer,

you would be safer in the fire department

bio bi sigurniji u vatrogasnoj jedinici

or the police department in most American cities

ili policijskoj jedinici, u većini američkih gradova,

than just walking around the streets of your hometown

nego da samo šetaš ulicama svog rodnog grada

looking for something to do,

tražeći zabavu,

statistically.

statistički.

You can imagine how that plays out in combat.

Možete da zamislite koliko je to korisno u ratu.

At Restrepo, every guy up there was almost killed,

U Restrepu, svaki čovek je umalo poginuo,

including me,

uključujući i mene,

including my good friend Tim Hetherington,

i mog dobrog prijatelja Tima Heteringtona,

who was later killed in Libya.

koga su kasnije ubili u Libiji.

There were guys walking around

Ljudi su šetali naokolo

with bullet holes in their uniforms,

s rupama od metaka na uniformama,

rounds that had cut through the fabric

hici su im prosekli tkaninu,

and didn't touch their bodies.

ali nisu dotakli njihova tela.

I was leaning against some sandbags one morning,

Naslanjao sam se jednog jutra na neke vreće s peskom,

not much going on, sort of spacing out,

skoro da se ništa nije dešavalo, gotovo da sam odlutao,

and some sand was kicked into the side of,

i pesak je pogođen sa strane,

sort of hit the side of my face.

nekako me pogodilo u profil.

Something hit the side of my face, and I didn't know what it was.

Nešto me je pogodilo u lice, a ja nisam znao šta.

You have to understand about bullets

Morate da razumete da meci

that they go a lot faster than sound,

putuju mnogo brže nego zvuk,

so if someone shoots at you

zato ako neko puca u vas

from a few hundred meters,

s udaljenosti od nekoliko stotina metara,

the bullet goes by you, or hits you obviously,

metak će proći pored vas, ili će vas pogoditi, očigledno,

half a second or so before the sound catches up to it.

otprilike pola sekunda pre nego što čujete zvuk.

So I had some sand sprayed in the side of my face.

Dakle, pesak mi je prsnuo u lice.

Half a second later, I heard dut-dut-dut-dut-duh.

Pola sekunda kasnije čuo sam ta-ta-ta-ta.

It was machine gun fire.

Pucano je iz mitraljeza.

It was the first round, the first burst

Bila je to prva runda, prvi nalet borbe,

of an hour-long firefight.

koja je trajala sat vremena.

What had happened was the bullet hit,

Ono što se desilo je da je metak pogodio,

a bullet hit three or four inches from the side of my head.

metak je pogodio 7 - 10 cm od moje glave.

Imagine, just think about it, because I certainly did,

Zamislite, samo razmislite o tome, ja svakako jesam,

think about the angle of deviation that saved my life.

o uglu odstupanja koji mi je spasio život.

At 400 meters, it missed me by three inches.

S udaljenosti od 400 metara, promašio me za 8 cm.

Just think about the math on that.

Razmislite o toj matematici.

Every guy up there

Svaki čovek tamo

had some experience like that,

imao je slično iskustvo

at least once, if not many times.

bar jednom, ako ne i više puta.

The boys are up there for a year.

Momci su tamo po godinu dana.

They got back.

Vrate se.

Some of them got out of the Army

Neki napuste vojsku

and had tremendous psychological problems when they got home.

i imaju užasne psihičke probleme kada se vrate kući.

Some of them stayed in the Army

Neki ostanu u vojsci

and were more or less okay, psychologically.

i više-manje su dobro, psihički.

I was particularly close to a guy named Brendan O'Byrne.

Bio sam naročito blizak s momkom koji se zove Brendan O'Birn.

I'm still very good friends with him.

Još uvek smo dobri prijatelji.

He came back to the States. He got out of the Army.

Vratio se u SAD. Napustio je vojsku.

I had a dinner party one night.

Napravio sam zabavu jedne noći.

I invited him,

Pozvao sam ga

and he started talking with a woman,

i on je započeo razgovor s jednom ženom,

one of my friends,

mojom prijateljicom,

and she knew how bad it had been out there,

ona je znala koliko je loše bilo tamo,

and she said, "Brendan,

pa je upitala: "Brendane,

is there anything at all that you miss about

postoji li išta što ti nedostaje

being out in Afghanistan, about the war?"

iz Avganistana, iz rata?"

And he thought about it quite a long time,

On je razmišljao poprilično dugo

and finally he said, "Ma'am, I miss almost all of it."

i konačno rekao: "Gospođo, skoro da mi sve nedostaje."

And he's one of the most traumatized people

A on je jedan od najistraumiranijih ljudi

I've seen from that war.

koje sam sreo iz tog rata.

"Ma'am, I miss almost all of it."

"Gospođo, skoro da mi sve nedostaje."

What is he talking about?

O čemu on to priča?

He's not a psychopath.

On nije psihopata.

He doesn't miss killing people.

Ne nedostaje mu ubijanje ljudi.

He's not crazy. He doesn't miss getting shot at

Nije lud. Ne nedostaje mu ranjavanje

and seeing his friends get killed.

i da gleda kako ginu njegovi drugovi.

What is it that he misses? We have to answer that.

Šta mu tačno nedostaje? Moramo da odgovorimo na to.

If we're going to stop war, we have to answer that question.

Ukoliko želimo da rat prestane, moramo da odgovorimo na to pitanje.

I think what he missed is brotherhood.

Mislim da mu je nedostajalo bratstvo.

He missed, in some ways,

Nedostajalo mu je, na neki način,

the opposite of killing.

sve osim ubijanja.

What he missed was connection

Nedostajala mu je povezanost

to the other men he was with.

s muškarcima s kojima je bio.

Now, brotherhood is different from friendship.

Sad, bratstvo nije isto što i prijateljstvo.

Friendship happens in society, obviously.

Prijateljstva se dešavaju u društvu, očigledno.

The more you like someone,

Što vam se više neko sviđa,

the more you'd be willing to do for them.

to ste spremniji da mu pomažete.

Brotherhood has nothing to do

Bratstvo nema veze

with how you feel about the other person.

s tim šta osećate prema drugoj osobi.

It's a mutual agreement in a group

To je međusobni dogovor unutar grupe

that you will put the welfare of the group,

da ćete staviti dobrobit grupe,

you will put the safety of everyone in the group

da ćete staviti sigurnost svakoga iz grupe

above your own.

ispred sebe.

In effect, you're saying,

U suštini govoriš:

"I love these other people more than I love myself."

"Volim ove ljude više od sebe."

Brendan was a team leader

Brendan je bio vođa tima,

in command of three men,

zadužen za tri čoveka,

and the worst day in Afghanistan —

i njegov najgori dan u Avganistanu -

He was almost killed so many times.

umalo je poginuo toliko puta,

It didn't bother him.

nije mu to smetalo -

The worst thing that happened to him in Afghanistan

najgore što mu se desilo u Avganistanu

was one of his men was hit in the head with a bullet

je kada je metak pogodio jednog od njegovih ljudi u glavu,

in the helmet, knocked him over.

u šlem i prevrnuo ga.

They thought he was dead.

Mislili su da je mrtav.

It was in the middle of a huge firefight.

Bilo je to usred ogromne bitke.

No one could deal with it, and a minute later,

Niko nije mogao da mu pomogne i minut kasnije,

Kyle Steiner sat back up

Kajl Stajner se podigao,

from the dead, as it were,

kako se činilo iz mrtvih,

because he'd come back to consciousness.

jer mu se povratila svest.

The bullet had just knocked him out.

Metak ga je samo oborio.

It glanced off the helmet.

Odbio se o šlem.

He remembers people saying,

Seća se ljudi kako viču,

as he was sort of half-conscious,

pošto je bio polusvestan,

he remembers people saying,

seća se ljudi kako viču:

"Steiner's been hit in the head. Steiner's dead."

"Stajner je pogođen u glavu, mrtav je."

And he was thinking, "I'm not dead."

A on je mislio: "Nisam mrtav."

And he sat up.

I seo je.

And Brendan realized after that

A Brendan je nakon toga shvatio

that he could not protect his men,

da ne može da zaštiti svoje ljude.

and that was the only time he cried in Afghanistan,

To je bio jedini put da je zaplakao u Avganistanu,

was realizing that.

kada je shvatio to.

That's brotherhood.

To je bratstvo.

This wasn't invented recently.

To nije skorašnji izum.

Many of you have probably read "The Iliad."

Većina vas je verovatno čitala "Ilijadu".

Achilles surely would have risked his life

Ahil bi svakako rizikovao svoj život

or given his life to save his friend Patroclus.

ili bi dao svoj život da spase svog prijatelja Patrokla.

In World War II, there were many stories

Ima mnogo priča iz Drugog svetskog rata

of soldiers who were wounded,

o vojnicima koji su ranjeni,

were brought to a rear base hospital,

doneseni u pozadinske bazne bolnice,

who went AWOL,

uzeli su odsustvo,

crawled out of windows, slipped out doors,

ispuzali su kroz prozore, iskrali se na vrata,

went AWOL, wounded,

uzeli nedozvoljeno odsustvo i bili ranjeni,

to make their way back to the front lines

probijajući se u prve redove

to rejoin their brothers out there.

kako bi se ponovo pridružili braći.

So you think about Brendan,

Mislite na Brendana,

you think about all these soldiers

mislite na sve te vojnike

having an experience like that, a bond like that,

sa sličnim iskustvom, sa sličnom vezom,

in a small group,

unutar male grupe,

where they loved 20 other people

gde su voleli 20 drugih ljudi,

in some ways more than they loved themselves,

na neki način, više nego što vole sebe,

you think about how good that would feel, imagine it,

zamislite kako je to dobar osećaj, zamislite to

and they are blessed with that experience for a year,

i bili su blagosloveni tim iskustvom godinu dana,

and then they come home,

a onda su se vratili kući,

and they are just back in society

prosto su se ponovo zatekli u društvu,

like the rest of us are,

kao i svi mi,

not knowing who they can count on,

gde ne znaju na koga mogu da se oslone,

not knowing who loves them, who they can love,

ne znaju ko ih voli, koga oni smeju da vole,

not knowing exactly what anyone they know

ne znaju tačno šta bi bilo ko

would do for them if it came down to it.

učinio za njih ako dođe stani-pani.

That is terrifying.

To je zastrašujuće.

Compared to that,

U poređenju s tim,

war, psychologically, in some ways, is easy,

rat je psihički, na neki način lakši

compared to that kind of alienation.

od takve otuđenosti.

That's why they miss it,

Zato im nedostaje

and that's what we have to understand

i to je ono što moramo da razumemo

and in some ways fix in our society.

i da nekako popravimo u našem društvu.

Thank you very much.

Mnogo vam hvala.

(Applause)

(Aplauz)