Mary Lou Jepsen: Could future devices read images from our brains?

79,109 views

2014-03-03 ・ TED


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Mary Lou Jepsen: Could future devices read images from our brains?

79,109 views ・ 2014-03-03

TED


Dvaput kliknite na engleske titlove ispod za reprodukciju videozapisa.

Prevoditelj: Ivan Stamenković Recezent: Senzos Osijek
00:12
I had brain surgery 18 years ago,
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Bila sam na operaciji mozga prije 18 godina,
00:15
and since that time, brain science has become
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i otada je neuroznanost postala
00:17
a personal passion of mine.
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moja strast.
00:19
I'm actually an engineer.
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Ja sam zapravo inženjer.
00:21
And first let me say, I recently joined
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Molim vas prvo mi dopustite da kažem da sam se nedavno pridružila
00:24
Google's Moonshot group,
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Googleovoj Moonshot grupi
00:25
where I had a division,
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gdje sam imala odjel,
00:27
the display division in Google X,
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odjel za prikazivanje u Google X-u
00:29
and the brain science work I'm speaking about today
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a neuroznanstvenim radom o kojem ću govoriti danas
00:31
is work I did before I joined Google
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sam se bavila prije nego sam se pridružila Googleu
00:34
and on the side outside of Google.
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i dok sam radila za Google to mi je bio projekt sa strane.
00:37
So that said, there's a stigma
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Rekavši ovo, postoji stigma
00:40
when you have brain surgery.
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za osobe koje su imale operaciju na mozgu.
00:42
Are you still smart or not?
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Jeste li još pametni ili ne?
00:45
And if not, can you make yourself smart again?
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A ako niste, možete li ponovno postati pametni?
00:49
After my neurosurgery,
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Nakon operacije na mozgu,
00:51
part of my brain was missing,
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nedostajao mi je jedan dio mozga,
00:53
and I had to deal with that.
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i ja sam se jednostavno morala suočiti s tim.
00:55
It wasn't the grey matter, but it was the gooey part dead center
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Nije to bila siva tvar, već je to bio ljigavi dio na sredini
00:58
that makes key hormones and neurotransmitters.
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koji proizvodi ključne hormone i neurotransmitere.
01:02
Immediately after my surgery,
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Odmah nakon operacije
01:04
I had to decide what amounts of each of over
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morala sam odlučiti o dozama svakog
01:06
a dozen powerful chemicals to take each day,
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od desetak jakih lijekova koje ću uzimati svaki dan
01:10
because if I just took nothing,
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jer da ne uzimam ništa,
01:12
I would die within hours.
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umrla bih unutar nekoliko sati.
01:14
Every day now for 18 years -- every single day --
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Svaki dan već 18 godina -- svaki, baš svaki dan --
01:18
I've had to try to decide the combinations
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morala sam pokušati odlučiti o kombinaciji
01:21
and mixtures of chemicals,
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i mješavini lijekova,
01:22
and try to get them, to stay alive.
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te ih nabaviti kako bih preživjela.
01:26
There have been several close calls.
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Nekoliko puta sam izbjegla smrt za dlaku.
01:29
But luckily, I'm an experimentalist at heart,
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Ali na sreću, ja sam eksperimentator u srcu,
01:33
so I decided I would experiment
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pa sam odlučila eksperimentirati
01:36
to try to find more optimal dosages
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kako bih pokušala naći optimalnu dozu
01:38
because there really isn't a clear road map
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zato što ne postoje jasne upute
01:40
on this that's detailed.
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za ovakve slučajeve koje su detaljno opisane
01:42
I began to try different mixtures,
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Počela sam isprobavati različite mješavine,
01:44
and I was blown away by how
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i šokiralo me kako
01:47
tiny changes in dosages
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male promjene u doziranju
01:49
dramatically changed my sense of self,
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dramatično mijenjaju moje poimanje same sebe,
01:52
my sense of who I was, my thinking,
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poimanje tko sam ja, moje razmišljanje,
01:54
my behavior towards people.
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moje ponašanje prema ljudima.
01:56
One particularly dramatic case:
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Jedan posebno dramatičan slučaj:
01:59
for a couple months I actually tried dosages
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nekoliko mjeseci sam koristila dozu
02:00
and chemicals typical of a man in his early 20s,
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i lijekove karakteristične za muškarca u ranim 20-ima,
02:04
and I was blown away by how my thoughts changed.
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i potpuno me šokiralo kako su se moje misli promijenile.
02:07
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
02:10
I was angry all the time,
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Bila sam ljuta cijelo vrijeme,
02:13
I thought about sex constantly,
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stalno sam mislila o seksu,
02:15
and I thought I was the smartest person
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i mislila sam da sam najpametnija osoba
02:18
in the entire world, and
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na cijelom svijetu, i
02:20
—(Laughter)—
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--(Smijeh)--
02:23
of course over the years I'd met guys kind of like that,
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naravno tijekom godina sam upoznala dečke koji su na neki način takvi,
02:26
or maybe kind of toned-down versions of that.
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ili koji su možda malo blaža verzija toga.
02:28
I was kind of extreme.
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Bila sam pomalo ekstremna.
02:30
But to me, the surprise was,
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Ali za mene je bilo iznenađujuće to
02:33
I wasn't trying to be arrogant.
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što ja nisam pokušavala biti arogantna.
02:35
I was actually trying,
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Zapravo sam pokušavala,
02:38
with a little bit of insecurity,
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pomalo nesigurna,
02:40
to actually fix a problem in front of me,
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zapravo riješiti problem koji se našao preda mnom
02:43
and it just didn't come out that way.
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ali to jednostavno nije tako ispalo..
02:45
So I couldn't handle it.
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Tako da to nisam mogla riješiti.
02:47
I changed my dosages.
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Promijenila sam dozu.
02:48
But that experience, I think, gave me
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Ali, mislim, da mi je to iskustvo donijelo
02:51
a new appreciation for men
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novopronađeno poštovanje za muškarce
02:52
and what they might walk through,
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i za ono što bi oni mogli proživljavati,
02:54
and I've gotten along with men
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i mnogo se bolje slažem s muškarcima
02:56
a lot better since then.
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otada.
02:58
What I was trying to do
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Ono što sam pokušavala napraviti
02:59
with tuning these hormones
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regulirajući ove hormone
03:01
and neurotransmitters and so forth
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i neurotransmitere i slično
03:04
was to try to get my intelligence back
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jest vratiti natrag inteligenciju
03:07
after my illness and surgery,
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nakon bolesti i operacije,
03:10
my creative thought, my idea flow.
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moje kreativne ideje, moj tijek ideja.
03:12
And I think mostly in images,
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Ja razmišljam uglavnom u slikama
03:15
and so for me that became a key metric --
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i zbog toga je to za mene postalo ključna mjera --
03:18
how to get these mental images
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kako upotrijebiti ove mentalne slike
03:20
that I use as a way of rapid prototyping,
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koje koristim kao vrstu brzog stvaranja prototipa,
03:23
if you will, my ideas,
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jednostavno rečeno, moje ideje,
03:25
trying on different new ideas for size,
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isprobavajući različite nove ideje,
03:27
playing out scenarios.
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odigravajući različite scenarije.
03:29
This kind of thinking isn't new.
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Ova vrsta razmišljanja nije ništa novo.
03:31
Philiosophers like Hume and Descartes and Hobbes
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Filozofi poput Humea i Descartesa i Hobbesa
03:34
saw things similarly.
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su slično gledali na stvari.
03:35
They thought that mental images and ideas
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Oni su smatrali da su mentalne slike i ideje
03:38
were actually the same thing.
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zapravo isto.
03:40
There are those today that dispute that,
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Danas postoje oni koji to pobijaju,
03:43
and lots of debates about how the mind works,
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i vodi se mnogo rasprava o tome kako mozak radi,
03:46
but for me it's simple:
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ali za mene je to vrlo jednostavno:
03:48
Mental images, for most of us,
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Mentalne slike, za većinu nas,
03:50
are central in inventive and creative thinking.
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su ključne za inventivno i kreativno razmišljanje.
03:54
So after several years,
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Tako nakon nekoliko godina,
03:56
I tuned myself up and I have lots of great,
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podesila sam sve sustave i imam mnogo divnih,
03:59
really vivid mental images with a lot of sophistication
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vrlo živih, vrlo sofisticiranih mentalnih slika
04:02
and the analytical backbone behind them.
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koje imaju analitičku kičmu kao temelj.
04:05
And so now I'm working on,
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I sada radim na tome da vidim
04:06
how can I get these mental images in my mind
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na koji način mogu mentalne slike iz mozga
04:11
out to my computer screen faster?
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brže prenijeti na zaslon računala?
04:13
Can you imagine, if you will,
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Možete li zamisliti, molim vas,
04:16
a movie director being able to use
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filmsku redateljicu koja je sposobna koristiti
04:18
her imagination alone to direct the world in front of her?
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samo svoju maštu kako bi režirala svijet koji se nalazi ispred nje?
04:21
Or a musician to get the music out of his head?
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Ili glazbenika kako bi prenio glazbu iz svoje glave?
04:25
There are incredible possibilities with this
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Postoje nevjerovatne stvari koje možemo raditi s ovim
04:27
as a way for creative people
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kako bi kreativni ljudi
04:29
to share at light speed.
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mogli dijeliti svoje zamisli brzinom svjetlosti.
04:32
And the truth is, the remaining bottleneck
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A istina je da je jedina preostala prepreka
04:34
in being able to do this
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koja nas sprečava da ovo učinimo
04:35
is just upping the resolution of brain scan systems.
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zapravo samo poboljšanje rezolucije sustava za skeniranje mozga.
04:39
So let me show you why I think we're pretty close to getting there
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I dopustite da vam pokažem zašto mislim da smo blizu postizanja tog cilja
04:42
by sharing with you two recent experiments
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i s vama podijelim dva eksperimenta koja su nedavno provele
04:44
from two top neuroscience groups.
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dvije vrhunske neuroznanstvene grupe.
04:47
Both used fMRI technology --
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Obje grupe su koristile fMRI --
04:49
functional magnetic resonance imaging technology --
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tehnologiju funkcionalne magnentske rezonancija --
04:51
to image the brain,
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kako bi snimili mozak
04:53
and here is a brain scan set from Giorgio Ganis
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i ovdje imamo set slika Giorgia Ganisa
04:56
and his colleagues at Harvard.
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i njegovih kolega sa Harvarda.
04:58
And the left-hand column shows a brain scan
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A lijeva stupac pokazuje sliku mozga
05:01
of a person looking at an image.
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osobe koja gleda nekakvu sliku.
05:04
The middle column shows the brainscan
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u srednjem stupcu se nalazi slika mozga
05:06
of that same individual
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istog pojedinca
05:08
imagining, seeing that same image.
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dok zamišlja kako gleda istu sliku.
05:11
And the right column was created
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A desni stupac je nastao
05:13
by subtracting the middle column from the left column,
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oduzimanjem srednjeg stupca od lijevog stupca
05:17
showing the difference to be nearly zero.
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te pokazuje da je razlika skoro ravna nuli
05:20
This was repeated on lots of different individuals
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Ovaj eksperiment je ponovljen na velikom broju različitih osoba
05:22
with lots of different images,
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i koristeći veliki broj različitih slika,
05:25
always with a similar result.
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a rezultat je uvijek bio sličan.
05:27
The difference between seeing an image
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Razlika između gledanja slike
05:29
and imagining seeing that same image
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i zamišljanja gledanja te iste slike
05:31
is next to nothing.
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je skoro nikakva.
05:34
Next let me share with you one other experiment,
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Sad mi dopustite da s vama podijelim još jedan eksperiment,
05:36
this from Jack Gallant's lab at Cal Berkeley.
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koji je proveo laboratorij Jacka Gallanta na Sveučilištu Berkley, Kalifornija.
05:41
They've been able to decode brainwaves
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Oni su uspjeli dekodirati moždane valove
05:43
into recognizable visual fields.
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u prepoznatljiva vizualna polja.
05:45
So let me set this up for you.
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Da vam malo pojasnim ovo.
05:47
In this experiment, individuals were shown
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U ovom eksperimentu, pojedincima su prikazivane
05:49
hundreds of hours of YouTube videos
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stotine sati Youtube videa
05:51
while scans were made of their brains
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a istovremeno su im rađeni snimci mozga
05:53
to create a large library of their brain reacting
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kako bi se stvorila velika arhiva načina na koji njihov mozak reagira
05:56
to video sequences.
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na video isječke.
05:59
Then a new movie was shown with new images,
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Tada im je prikazan novi film s novim slikama,
06:02
new people, new animals in it,
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novim ljudima, novim životinjama,
06:04
and a new scan set was recorded.
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i snimljen je novi set snimaka.
06:06
The computer, using brain scan data alone,
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Računalo, koristeći samo podatke snimaka mozga,
06:09
decoded that new brain scan
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je dekodiralo da taj novi snimak mozga
06:11
to show what it thought the individual was actually seeing.
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pokazuje ono što misli da pojedinac zapravo vidi.
06:16
On the right-hand side, you see the computer's guess,
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Na desnoj strani, možete vidjeti pretpostavku računala,
06:19
and on the left-hand side, the presented clip.
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a na lijevoj strani, isječak koji je prikazan.
06:23
This is the jaw-dropper.
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Ovo je toliko zapanjujuće da će vam se zavrtiti glava.
06:25
We are so close to being able to do this.
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Toliko smo blizu da ostvarimo ovo.
06:28
We just need to up the resolution.
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samo trebamo poboljšati rezoluciju.
06:31
And now remember that when you see an image
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I zapamtite da kad vidite sliku
06:34
versus when you imagine that same image,
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naspram kad tu istu sliku zamislite,
06:36
it creates the same brain scan.
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nastaje jednak snimak mozga.
06:40
So this was done with the highest-resolution
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Ovo je napravljeno sa najvećom rezolucijom
06:42
brain scan systems available today,
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koja je dostupna kod snimanja mozga danas,
06:45
and their resolution has increased really
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a njihova rezolucija se poboljšala negdje
06:46
about a thousandfold in the last several years.
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za tisuću puta u posljednijh nekoliko godina.
06:50
Next we need to increase the resolution
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Sada moramo poboljšati rezoluciju
06:52
another thousandfold
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za još tisuću puta
06:54
to get a deeper glimpse.
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kako bi dobili bolji pogled.
06:56
How do we do that?
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Kako to možemo učiniti?
06:57
There's a lot of techniques in this approach.
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Postoji mnogo tehnika kod ovakvog pristupa.
07:00
One way is to crack open your skull and put in electrodes.
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Jedan način je da rastvorimo lubanju i ubacimo elektrode.
07:03
I'm not for that.
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Ja osobno nisam za to.
07:05
There's a lot of new imaging techniques
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Mnogo novih tehnika snimanja
07:08
being proposed, some even by me,
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predlaže se danas, a neke sam predložila i ja
07:10
but given the recent success of MRI,
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ali s obzirom na nedavni uspjeh snimanja magnetskom rezonancom
07:13
first we need to ask the question,
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prvo moramo postaviti pitanje,
07:15
is it the end of the road with this technology?
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je li je to kraj za ovu tehnologiju?
07:17
Conventional wisdom says the only way
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Konvecionalna mudrost kaže da je jedini način
07:20
to get higher resolution is with bigger magnets,
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da se dobije viša rezolucija korištenje većih magneta,
07:22
but at this point bigger magnets
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ali u ovom trenutku veći magneti bi
07:24
only offer incremental resolution improvements,
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pridonijeli samo malom poboljšanju rezolucije
07:28
not the thousandfold we need.
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ali ne i tisuću puta koliko mi trebamo.
07:30
I'm putting forward an idea:
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Ja predlažem da:
07:32
instead of bigger magnets,
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umjesto većih magneta,
07:34
let's make better magnets.
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napravimo bolje magnete.
07:36
There's some new technology breakthroughs
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Veliki napreci su postignuti u novoj tehnologiji
07:38
in nanoscience
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poput nanoznanosti
07:40
when applied to magnetic structures
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i njenoj primjeni u magnetskim strukturama
07:42
that have created a whole new class of magnets,
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koji su stvorili skroz novu kategoriju magneta,
07:45
and with these magnets, we can lay down
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i s ovakvim magnetima, možemo postaviti
07:47
very fine detailed magnetic field patterns
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vrlo sitno detaljizirane uzorke magnetskih polja
07:49
throughout the brain,
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kroz mozak
07:51
and using those, we can actually create
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i koristeći ih možemo zapravo stvoriti
07:54
holographic-like interference structures
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holografske interferencijske strukture
07:57
to get precision control over many patterns,
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kako bi dobili preciznu kontrolu nad mnogim uzorcima,
08:00
as is shown here by shifting things.
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kako je pokazano ovdje samo drugačijim pristupom.
08:03
We can create much more complicated structures
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Možemo stvoriti mnogo kompliciranije strukture
08:06
with slightly different arrangements,
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a koristeći tek malo promijenjen poredak
08:08
kind of like making Spirograph.
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kao da radimo Spirograf.
08:11
So why does that matter?
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I zašto je to bitno?
08:13
A lot of effort in MRI over the years
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Mnogo truda u MRI-ju kroz godine
08:16
has gone into making really big,
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je uloženo u proizvodnju zaista velikih,
08:19
really huge magnets, right?
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ogromnih magneta, zar ne?
08:21
But yet most of the recent advances
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Ali većina novijih otkrića
08:24
in resolution have actually come from
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na području rezolucije je rezultat
08:26
ingeniously clever encoding and decoding solutions
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genijalnih i inteligentnih rješenja kodiranja i dekodiranja
08:30
in the F.M. radio frequency transmitters and receivers
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na odašiljačima i prijamnicima F.M. radio frekvencija
08:33
in the MRI systems.
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u MRI sustavima.
08:36
Let's also, instead of a uniform magnetic field,
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Također, umjesto uniformnih magnetskih polja
08:39
put down structured magnetic patterns
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sastavimo strukturirane magnetske uzorke
08:42
in addition to the F.M. radio frequencies.
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zajedno s F.M. radio frekvencijama.
08:45
So by combining the magnetics patterns
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Tako koristeći ovakve magnetske uzorke
08:47
with the patterns in the F.M. radio frequencies
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s uzorcima u obradi F.M. radio frekvencija
08:50
processing which can massively increase
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možemo uvelike povećati
08:52
the information that we can extract
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količinu informacija koju možemo izvući
08:54
in a single scan.
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u jednom snimku.
08:57
And on top of that, we can then layer
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I povrh svega toga, tada možemo još pridodati
08:59
our ever-growing knowledge of brain structure and memory
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svoje rastuće znanje strukture mozga i sjećanja
09:03
to create a thousandfold increase that we need.
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kako bismo stvorili tisuću puta veću jačinu koju trebamo.
09:07
And using fMRI, we should be able to measure
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a koristeći fMRI, trebali bismo moći izmjeriti
09:10
not just oxygenated blood flow,
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ne samo protok krvi obogaćene kisikom
09:12
but the hormones and neurotransmitters I've talked about
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već i razinu hormona i neurotransmitera koje sam spomenula
09:15
and maybe even the direct neural activity,
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a možda čak i izravnu neuro aktvnost
09:17
which is the dream.
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poput snova.
09:19
We're going to be able to dump our ideas
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Moći ćemo staviti svoje ideje
09:21
directly to digital media.
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ravno na digitalne medije.
09:24
Could you imagine if we could leapfrog language
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Možete li zamisliti kad bismo mogli zaobići jezik
09:26
and communicate directly with human thought?
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i sporazumijevati se direktno ljudskom misli?
09:31
What would we be capable of then?
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Za što bismo sve bili sposobni?
09:34
And how will we learn to deal
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I kako bismo naučili nositi se s
09:36
with the truths of unfiltered human thought?
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istinama nefiltrirane ljudske misli?
09:41
You think the Internet was big.
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Mislite da je Internet velik.
09:43
These are huge questions.
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Postoji mnogo velikih pitanja.
09:46
It might be irresistible as a tool
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Ovo bi moglo biti neodoljivo kao alat
09:48
to amplify our thinking and communication skills.
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za poboljšanje sposobnosti razmišljanja i sporazumijevanja.
09:52
And indeed, this very same tool
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I zaista, ovaj isti alat
09:54
may prove to lead to the cure
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bi se mogao pokazati kao put do lijeka
09:56
for Alzheimer's and similar diseases.
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za Alzeheimerovu bolesti i druge slične bolesti.
09:59
We have little option but to open this door.
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Nemamo izbora nego otvoriti vrata ove prilike.
10:03
Regardless, pick a year --
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Bez obzira, izaberite godinu --
10:04
will it happen in five years or 15 years?
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hoće li se to dogoditi za 5 ili 15 godina?
10:06
It's hard to imagine it taking much longer.
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Teško mogu zamisliti da bi to trebalo trajati duže.
10:11
We need to learn how to take this step together.
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Moramo naučiti kako napraviti ovaj korak zajednički.
10:15
Thank you.
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Hvala vam.
10:17
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
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