Eva Zeisel: The playful search for beauty

翻译人员: Shanshan Yan 校对人员: Chaoran Yu

So I understand that this meeting was planned,

我理解这个会议的初衷，

and the slogan was From Was to Still.

主题是从过去到静止。

And I am illustrating Still.

我正好是一个静止的实例。

Which, of course, I am not agreeing with because,

当然，我并不同意，因为，

although I am 94, I am not still working.

虽然我是94岁，但是我没有不动地工作。

And anybody who asks me, "Are you still doing this or that?"

有人问我：“你还在做这个或者那个吗？”

I don't answer because I'm not doing things still, I'm doing it like I always did.

我不能回答，因为我没有还在做事情，我一直都在像以前一样。

I still have -- or did I use the word still? I didn't mean that.

我还有－我用了“还”这个字吗？我不是那个意思。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

I have my file which is called To Do. I have my plans.

我有我的工作计划。我有我的安排。

I have my clients. I am doing my work like I always did.

我有我的客户。我一直像以前一样工作。

So this takes care of my age.

所以我没有变老了。

I want to show you my work so you know what I am doing and why I am here.

我想给你们看我的作品，你们从中可以知道我在做什么和我为什么现在在这里。

This was about 1925.

这是在1925年。

All of these things were made during the last 75 years.

所有这些东西都是在过去75年间做的。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

(Applause)

（掌声）

But, of course, I'm working since 25,

但是，当然，我从25岁一直在工作，

doing more or less what you see here. This is Castleton China.

做差不多你在这里看的这些东西。这是卡斯尔顿瓷器。

This was an exhibition at the Museum of Modern Art.

这是现代艺术馆的一次展览。

This is now for sale at the Metropolitan Museum.

这个目前在纽约大都会博物馆正在销售。

This is still at the Metropolitan Museum now for sale.

这个也还是在纽约大都会博物馆销售。

This is a portrait of my daughter and myself.

这是我和我女儿的肖像。

(Applause)

（掌声）

These were just some of the things I've made.

这些只是我做过的一些东西。

I made hundreds of them for the last 75 years.

我在过去的75年做了几百个这样的东西。

I call myself a maker of things.

我称我自己是一个东西的制造者。

I don't call myself an industrial designer because I'm other things.

我不叫我自己是一个工业设计师，因为我做的比这个多。

Industrial designers want to make novel things.

工业设计师想要做新奇的东西。

Novelty is a concept of commerce, not an aesthetic concept.

新奇是一个商业的概念，不是一个美学的概念。

The industrial design magazine, I believe, is called "Innovation."

工业设计杂志，我相信，那被称作“创新”。

Innovation is not part of the aim of my work.

创新不是我的工作的目标。

Well, makers of things: they make things more beautiful, more elegant,

那，东西的制作者：与手艺人相比他们使东西

more comfortable than just the craftsmen do.

更美丽、更优雅、更舒服。

I have so much to say. I have to think what I am going to say.

我有很多要说的。我不得不想清楚我将要说的话。

Well, to describe our profession otherwise,

我们要描述我们的专业，

we are actually concerned with the playful search for beauty.

我们实际上注重于嬉戏地寻找美。

That means the playful search for beauty was called the first activity of Man.

意思是人的最初的行为就是嬉戏地寻找美。

Sarah Smith, who was a mathematics professor at MIT, wrote,

萨拉.史密斯，一位麻省理工大学的数学教授曾写到：

"The playful search for beauty was Man's first activity --

“嬉戏地寻找美是人的最初行为－

that all useful qualities and all material qualities

就是说所有的功能和材料

were developed from the playful search for beauty."

都是在嬉戏地寻找美中开发的。“

These are tiles. The word, "playful" is a necessary aspect of our work

这些是瓷砖。“嬉戏”这个词是我们工作中的一个必要组成部分

because, actually, one of our problems is that we have to make,

因为，事实上，我们的其中一个问题是我们必须

produce, lovely things throughout all of life, and this for me is now 75 years.

毕生创造美好的事物，对于我来是现在已是75年。

So how can you, without drying up,

所以你怎么能，不干枯呢，

make things with the same pleasure, as a gift to others, for so long?

那么长时间用同样愉快的制作东西？就像给别人的一个礼物？

The playful is therefore an important part of our quality as designer.

因此“嬉戏”是一个设计师重要的一部分。

Let me tell you some about my life.

让我告诉你我的一些生活。

As I said, I started to do these things 75 years ago.

就像我说的，我从75年前开始做这些东西。

My first exhibition in the United States

我的第一个展览是美国

was at the Sesquicentennial exhibition in 1926 --

1926年的一百五十周年纪念展览－

that the Hungarian government sent one of my hand-drawn pieces as part of the exhibit.

匈牙利政府将我的一个手工制品送到这个展览。

My work actually took me through many countries,

我的工作确实带我去了很多的国家，

and showed me a great part of the world.

让我看了世界的很大一部分。

This is not that they took me -- the work didn't take me --

并不是他们带我－工作没有带我－

I made the things particularly because I wanted to use them to see the world.

我做东西特别是因为我想用他们去看世界。

I was incredibly curious to see the world, and I made all these things,

我对世界非常的好奇，我做了这些东西，

which then finally did take me to see many countries and many cultures.

最终让我体验到了很多国家和很多文化。

I started as an apprentice to a Hungarian craftsman,

我从一个学徒开始变成了一个匈牙利手工艺人，

and this taught me what the guild system was in Middle Ages.

这教会了我中世纪的行业系统。

The guild system: that means when I was an apprentice,

这个行业系统：意味着当我是一个学徒的时候，

I had to apprentice myself in order to become a pottery master.

为了变成瓷器专家，我必须先要让自己成为学徒。

In my shop where I studied, or learned, there was a traditional hierarchy

在我学习的商店，有一个传统的专家层次系统，

of master, journeyman and learned worker, and apprentice,

熟练工人，高级学徒和普通学徒，

and I worked as the apprentice.

那时我是一个学徒。

The work as an apprentice was very primitive.

学徒的工作是非常基础的。

That means I had to actually learn every aspect of making pottery by hand.

那意味着我不得不实际学习手工制做瓷器的每一个部分。

We mashed the clay with our feet when it came from the hillside.

我们用脚碾碎从山坡上找来的黏土。

After that, it had to be kneaded. It had to then go in, kind of, a mangle.

之后，它们必须被揉捏。

And then finally it was prepared for the throwing.

最后黏土就可以被摔打。

And there I really worked as an apprentice.

那时我确实像一个学徒一样工作。

My master took me to set ovens

我的老师带我去准备烤炉

because this was part of oven-making, oven-setting, in the time.

因为那时正好是用烤炉做东西的一部分。

And finally, I had received a document

最后，我得到了一个证书

that I had accomplished my apprenticeship successfully,

证明我已经成功的完成了学徒的阶段，

that I had behaved morally, and this document was given to me

我一直遵守道德，这个证书是

by the Guild of Roof-Coverers, Rail-Diggers, Oven-Setters,

房顶建造者，铁路建造者，烤炉设置者，

Chimney Sweeps and Potters.

烟囱打扫者和陶瓷工人行业颁发的。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

I also got at the time a workbook which explained my rights

我当时还得到了一个工作手册，上面规定了我的权利

and my working conditions, and I still have that workbook.

和我的工作条件，而且我现在还有这个工作手册。

First I set up a shop in my own garden,

首先我在自己的花园里建立了一个作坊，

and made pottery which I sold on the marketplace in Budapest.

制作一些我在布达佩斯市场上卖的瓷器。

And there I was sitting, and my then-boyfriend --

那时我和我的男朋友－

I didn't mean it was a boyfriend like it is meant today --

不是当今意义上的男朋友－

but my boyfriend and I sat at the market and sold the pots.

但是是我的男的朋友和我一起坐在市场上卖瓶子。

My mother thought that this was not very proper,

我母亲觉得那不是很得体，

so she sat with us to add propriety to this activity.

所以她就和我们一起坐着，让我们看起来更得体。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

However, after a while there was a new factory being built in Budapest,

然而，过了一段时间，在布达佩斯建立了一个新的工厂，

a pottery factory, a large one.

一个瓷器工厂，很大。

And I visited it with several ladies, and asked all sorts of questions of the director.

我就和一些女士一起去参观了那个工厂，问了老板很多各种各样的问题。

Then the director asked me, why do you ask all these questions?

然后那个老板就问我，为什么我问了所有这些问题。

I said, I also have a pottery.

我说，我也有一个瓷器作坊。

So he asked me, could he please visit me, and then finally he did,

然后他问我，他能不能来参观我的地方，最后他来了。

and explained to me that what I did now in my shop was an anachronism,

他告诉我，我当时在我的作坊里做的犯了一个时代性的错误。

that the industrial revolution had broken out,

工业革命已经爆发了，

and that I rather should join the factory.

我应该就进入他的工厂。

There he made an art department for me where I worked for several months.

当时他给了我一个艺术部门，我在那里工作了几个月。

However, everybody in the factory spent his time at the art department.

然而，工厂里的每个人都花时间在艺术部门。

The director there said there were several women casting

老板说有很多女工正在

and producing my designs now in molds, and this was sold also to America.

把我的设计制作成型，然后产品还会卖到美洲。

I remember that it was quite successful.

我记得当时很成功。

However, the director, the chemist, model maker -- everybody --

然而，老板、化学师、制模工人－每个人－

concerned himself much more with the art department --

比制作卫生间用品更多的注意这个艺术部门－

that means, with my work -- than making toilets,

也就是，我的工作－

so finally they got a letter from the center, from the bank who owned the factory,

所以最终他们得到了总部的一封信，总部是一个拥有这个工厂所有权的银行，

saying, make toilet-setting behind the art department, and that was my end.

信里说，让艺术部门负责设计卫生间用品，这样我就结束我的工作。

So this gave me the possibility because now I was a journeyman,

这就给我一个可能性，因为那时我已经是一个熟练工人，

and journeymen also take their satchel and go to see the world.

熟练工人就可以带着背包出去看世界了。

So as a journeyman, I put an ad into the paper that I had studied,

所以作为一个熟练工人，我在报纸上发了一个广告，

that I was a down-to-earth potter's journeyman

说我是一个脚踏实地的瓷器制作的熟练工人

and I was looking for a job as a journeyman.

而且我正在找一个熟练工人的工作。

And I got several answers, and I accepted the one

我得到了很多回应，我接受了其中一个

which was farthest from home and practically, I thought, halfway to America.

离家最远的工作，我觉得是去美洲的一半路程。

And that was in Hamburg.

那是在德国汉堡。

Then I first took this job in Hamburg, at an art pottery

然后我先在汉堡的一个艺术瓷器作坊工作

where everything was done on the wheel,

在那里所有东西都是在轮子上做的，

and so I worked in a shop where there were several potters.

那个作坊里有很多陶瓷工人。

And the first day, I was coming to take my place at the turntable --

第一天，我坐在一个转盘－

there were three or four turntables -- and one of them, behind where I was sitting,

那里有三四个转盘－其中一个，是在我坐的后面，

was a hunchback, a deaf-mute hunchback, who smelled very bad.

有一个驼背的人，又聋又哑，而且身上很臭。

So I doused him in cologne every day, which he thought was very nice,

我每天都用古龙水浇他，他觉得还不错，

and therefore he brought bread and butter every day,

所以他每天带面包和黄油，

which I had to eat out of courtesy.

我不得不客气的吃。

The first day I came to work in this shop

我在这个作坊工作的第一天

there was on my wheel a surprise for me.

在我的轮子上有一个惊喜。

My colleagues had thoughtfully put on the wheel where I was supposed to work

我的同事煞费苦心的在我将要工作的轮子上放了

a very nicely modeled natural man's organs.

一个非常逼真的男人的器官。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

After I brushed them off with a hand motion, they were very --

我用一个手势让他们碰了钉子，他们当时非常－

I finally was now accepted, and worked there for some six months.

我最终被接受了，并在那里工作了六个月。

This was my first job.

这是我第一个工作。

If I go on like this, you will be here till midnight.

如果我这样讲下去，你们在午夜的时候还会在这里。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

(Applause)

（掌声）

So I will try speed it up a little

所以我会试着加快一点速度

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Moderator: Eva, we have about five minutes.

主持人：伊娃，我们还有大约5分钟左右。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Eva Zeisel: Are you sure?

伊娃·蔡塞尔：你确定吗？

Moderator: Yes, I am sure.

主持人：是的，我确定。

EZ: Well, if you are sure,

伊娃·蔡塞尔：这样，如果你确定，

I have to tell you that within five minutes I will talk very fast.

我不得不告诉你，接下来的五分钟，我会讲的非常快。

And actually, my work took me to many countries

事实上，我的工作使我去了很多国家

because I used my work to fill my curiosity.

因为我用我的工作去满足我的好奇心。

And among other things, other countries I worked, was in the Soviet Union,

其中，我在苏联工作过，

where I worked from '32 to '37 -- actually, to '36.

那时我是32岁到37岁－事实上是36岁。

I was finally there, although I had nothing to do -- I was a foreign expert.

我最终在那，虽然我没有什么事情做－我当时是外国专家。

I became art director of the china and glass industry,

我成为了瓷器和玻璃工业的技术指导，

and eventually under Stalin's purges -- at the beginning of Stalin's purges,

并且在斯大林的清除运动中结束－在斯大林最初清除运动时，

I didn't know that hundreds of thousands of innocent people were arrested.

我不知道成百上千的无辜人民被捕了。

So I was arrested quite early in Stalin's purges,

所以我是在斯大林清除运动中比较早被捕的，

and spent 16 months in a Russian prison.

并在苏联的监狱里过了16个月。

The accusation was that I had successfully prepared an Attentat on Stalin's life.

指控是我成功的准备杀死斯大林。

This was a very dangerous accusation.

这是一个非常危险的指控。

And if this is the end of my five minutes, I want to tell you that

如果这是我五分钟的最后部分，我想要告诉你

I actually did survive, which was a surprise.

我实际上幸存了下来，是一个惊喜。

But since I survived and I'm here,

但是既然我幸存了下来，并且现在在这，

and since this is the end of the five minutes, I will --

既然这是五分钟的最后部分，我将－

Moderator: Tell me when your last trip to Russia was.

主持人：给我讲讲你上一次是什么时间去了俄罗斯。

Weren't you there recently?

你是不是最近刚去了？

EZ: Oh, this summer, in fact,

伊娃·蔡塞尔：哦，是这个夏天，事实上，

the Lomonosov factory was bought by an American company, invited me.

莱蒙诺索夫工厂被一个美国公司买了，邀请了我。

They found out that I had worked in '33 at this factory,

他们发现我在这个工厂工作了33年，

and they came to my studio in Rockland County,

他们来了我在罗克兰县的工作室，

and brought the 15 of their artists to visit me here.

还带了15个艺术家。

And they invited myself to come to the Russian factory last summer,

他们邀请我去年夏天去那个俄罗斯工厂，

in July, to make some dishes, design some dishes.

在7月份，去做一些盘子，设计一些盘子。

And since I don't like to travel alone, they also invited my daughter,

因为我不喜欢一个人旅行，他们还邀请了我的女儿，

son-in-law and granddaughter,

女婿和孙女，

so we had a lovely trip to see Russia today,

我们很喜欢那次旅行，看到了今日的俄罗斯，

which is not a very pleasant and happy view.

那不是一个非常美好和快乐的景象。

Here I am now, if this is the end? Thank you.

我就说到这，如果就这样结束了？谢谢。

(Applause)

（掌声）