Duolingo English Test | Teacher Luke Interview | Speak English Fluently with Steve Hatherly

Welcome to Speak English Fluently.

I’m your host Steve Hatherly.

And my guest today is Mr. Luke Jones.

Who was a teacher in Korea for I would say a brief stint, but it wasn't really that brief.

I think uh Luke told me, as we were chatting before we got started today, it was for a

total of eight years.

But Luke did make the decision to return to his home country of Wales.

And in 2018, that's when Luke decided to develop a YouTube channel.

A very popular idea with people these days.

But what's more interesting is the focus of the channel.

And we'll get to that in just a moment.

Well after achieving a pretty decent level of success uh subscribers in the range of

around 10 000 people, then it exploded to great success.

And now Luke has over 200,000 subscribers.

And as I just alluded to, his content deals with the Duolingo English Test.

And that will be the focus of our chat today.

Welcome to Speak English Fluently, Luke Jones.

It's great to meet you.

Sir.

Yeah.

thank you for the kind introduction.

And it's good to meet you and it's a pleasure to be on this show with you.

Wonderful.

So you were you were yourself in Korea for, did I get that right, eight years in total?

Yeah, I was eight almost nine years.

I lived in a small city called Changweon, first.

Then, I moved to Seoul where I got my say my full-time job at a university.

And that was brilliant.

I actually loved my time there.

I learned so much.

I met so many great people.

Wonderful.

After you returned to Wales, you decided to make the YouTube channel.

Was that upon the return to Wales?

Or was that something you were thinking about during your time here in Korea?

Yeah, that was before, actually.

So I moved to Wales about six months ago but as you mentioned, I started my channel

in 2018.

Basically, I just saw the trend of online education.

Even in 2018, it looked like lots of teachers were going online with their courses uh their

lectures so on and I just, yeah, I wanted to be a part of that.

I try to keep myself, you know, forward thinking and being as innovative as possible so I thought

that'd be a good thing to try out.

I started off slowly like everyone who has ever tried YouTube will know.

Of course.

It's a very hard - hard slug to start but you know after a while it does,

if you if you're good and you try hard, you can become successful on the channel as a

teacher especially.

That's great advice for any uh aspiring YouTuber I think, not just a language teacher.

So what was it?

I’m curious to know what was it that that made it happen and maybe you don't even know

but the subscribers were around 10,000 which is pretty impressive I mean

Yeah.

A lot of YouTubers say it's really hard to get to even a thousand subscribers but you

got to 10 and then all of a sudden, ‘boom’.

So do you know what it was?

Yeah, I do.

Yeah, it's really clear if you look into my analytics.

I changed my subject matter.

So I was doing general English, the same stuff as on this Shaw English channel.

A lot of other channels do the same type of content.

And I was doing the same, but then, I differentiated myself… differentiated myself by focusing

on the new Duolingo English Test.

And it was just a, you know, it's a popular niche without that many content creators.

So that's basically it.

And then the name… and the name of your channel is?

Teacher Luke and then hyphen Duolingo English Test.

Nothing, nothing very crazy about it.

But you know, yeah.

Very straightforward.

We'll get that… we'll get that information from you again at the… the end of our chat.

Well… well let's get into it then.

The main point of our chat for today.

So the Duolingo English Test.

Now, I’m familiar with Duolingo.

I myself have used it.

I studied French in Canada in school.

After living in Korea for a long time, I wanted to brush up on my French.

And I went to Duolingo to do that.

But I didn't know that there was something very specific for Duolingo that being an English

Test.

So can you tell us just in general what that is?

Yeah, sure so the Duolingo English Test is basically a new way to certify your English

level.

So it's very similar to the other popular Tests - the IELTS and TOEFL.

So if you want… if a student, an international student, wants to study in the U.S., Canada,

U.K., Australia, you name it, then they need to certify their English using a proficiency

exam.

So the Duolingo Test is the newest proficiency Test out there.

It's not that new, actually.

So it's about five years old uh which is relatively new but still not not… not that new.

However, it was during the coveted pandemic that this test became really popular.

How long have.

you mentioned.

uh IELTS and TOEFL, those I guess IELTS is mainly popular in the U.K. if I’m correct.

And then TOEFL, that's right um perhaps internationally, IELTS is internationally recognized as well.

Those have been around for a really long time, right?

Very long time, yeah.

I don't know exactly.

It’s a very long time.

um it's hard to say I don't…

I don't know exactly how long they've been around for.

But yeah, they're very well established.

And they have a really good reputation.

Right… and rightly so.

They're very good tests.

But the Duolingo English Test is relatively new, even though it's been five years.

Relatively speaking, it's not necessarily a long time.

How is it different?

How does it differentiate itself from the IELTS and the TOEFL Test?

Yeah, there are actually there are so many differences.

But there are three main differences I think I should talk about.

So the first one is that this exam is far more affordable and accessible to students.

The IELTS and TOEFL, they're quite expensive.

I’m not sure if you're aware, but they're, oh god, $200, $300 somewhere in that range

depending on what country you take it in.

And that's a lot of money for a lot of students, right?

The Duolingo English Test, on the other hand, is only $49.

So in that case, is far more affordable.

It's much more accessible because it's only a computer-based test.

You don't need to go to a test center to take this exam.

You just do it, uh, you just need to find a quiet room and get, uh, you know, get your

computer out with good internet access and then you're good to go.

You can take the Duolingo Test...

Sorry to interrupt you.

You can take that four times… uh… and take the TOEFL Test or the IELTS Test one

time.

Yeah, exactly right.

And that leads to…

Okay oh sorry yeah I want to talk a bit more about the accessibility because I think for

people like you and I who live in very developed countries, the idea of going to a test center

to take an exam is not that hard right.

We live… we can easily get to one maybe within an hour or two.

But for a lot of poorer students, let's say in other developing countries, uh… that's…

that's sometimes a really big challenge to get to a test center.

Right?

They might have to travel a day or two days and use you know a lot of money to get there

so… the fact that they that the Duolingo Test

is done at home, on their computer, that's actually a really big deal and it's game changing

in my mind for a lot of poorer students around the world.

Well that, and I think it would encourage students to take the test perhaps more often

than they might take the IELTS or the TOEFL Test because, number one, it's cheaper, as

you mentioned, you know you could take you could take the IELTS or the TOEFL once and

take the Duolingo Test four times.

Exactly.

But for other students, just that motivation of having to…

It's like going to the gym almost sometimes, right, you know.

I…

I…

I really want to take the test this time, but I’d have to go all the way hundreds

of miles to get there…

where you could take the Duolingo English Test in your living room, in your in your

underwear, if you wanted to.

You could actually could do that.

And the test is much shorter.

It takes about an hour.

Whereas the IELTS and TOEFL, they tend to take all day if you include traveling and,

you know, all the other stuff.

So the universities…

um… around the world, when we're talking about certification for students…

um…

Of course IELTS is accepted.

Of course TOEFL is accepted.

But what about the acceptance with Duolingo the English Test, only being around for five

years or so, is it widely accepted by universities…

English-speaking countries uh universities around the world?

Yeah.

That's a really important question for a lot of test takers.

Why take a test if the universities don't accept it?

Exactly.

Yeah, so, the answer is yes and no.

In the U.S. and Canada, oh I think almost every university accepts this exam.

Which is fantastic.

However, in the U.K. or Australia or other European countries, it's a bit of a mixed

bag.

You have to really go and check your individual university to see if they would accept this

test as a as you know proof of your English ability.

mm-hmm I believe that you know the Duolingo…

Duolingo is a company is an American company, right, so I think that probably has some influence

on the American universities.

On top of that, in the U.K., we've had a couple of visa scandals in the past with the other

exams like the TOEIC, so I think for the U.K., they're pretty strict and they they rely heavily

on IELTS for all types of visas including student visas.

Is it becoming more widely accepted now?

Can…

can we see a trend in universities um from English-speaking countries around the world

where it is becoming more widely accepted now?

Yeah, for sure.

Especially since the C19 pandemic.

Again, a lot of students around the world didn't have that opportunity to go to a test

center to do the IELTS of TOEFL.

So you know for universities, they want international students, and the only option a lot of students

had to, you know, certify their English was to do the Duolingo English Test.

So during that time, you know, thousands of universities started accepting the exam and

most of them have stuck around, at least they still do accept it.

Especially like I said, especially in North America.

Can you see a trend, conversely, can you see a trend with students now, where students

are aware that the Duolingo…

Duolingo English Test is… is becoming more uh… widely accepted?

Because I would think as a student, you know, you might know about IELTS and TOEFL and think

those are your two choices, and that's about it.

And you wouldn't even think to maybe hop on the internet and see if there are other options.

Are students now around the world becoming more aware of the Duolingo English Test?

And… and… and the fact that it is becoming more widely accepted?

Yeah, I believe so.

I believe so.

It's hard for me to give a you know a definitive answer on that, but I believe so.

If you look on Google Trends, as an indicator, then the popularity is always increasing,

so that that signifies to me that, yes, I think more students are aware of it.

And you know quite frankly would rather take it than the IELTS or TOEFL.

The Duolingo Test, I think we'll talk more about the questions later, but it is a much

more friendly test than the IELTS or TOEFL.

It's not intimidating.

They've done a good job of making the experience, you know, relatively pleasant.

Whereas the other exams are very, you know, academic paper-based, you go to a center…

Oh, I mean.

… intimidating.

I’ve seen… they're intimidating for native English speakers.

They’re hard.

They’re very hard.

I’ve seen this those TOEFL…

some of those TOEFL questions and I’ve thought to myself, how on earth, even a student whose

level or proficiency in English was pretty good, how would they be able to even understand

what question is being posed?

They're long-winded questions a lot of the time.

They're very difficult to answer.

Require critical thinking perhaps sometimes as well.

You're right when you say those tests are intimidating.

They… for sure they are and I, yeah, Duolingo have done a good job of making their, yeah,

the experience a lot friendlier.

Yeah, they've done a good job of that.

You know like it's not surprising because they, you know, originally are an application

for language learning - general language learning - so they have that skill set.

um but it's… it's definitely a friendlier exam for sure.

I think the cost, going back to that point too, um makes it less intimidating for the

students as well because when you're spending that much money on a test to be taken, uh

that puts more pressure on you as a student, right?

Oh, a huge…

it's a huge amount of pressure, yeah.

And like I said, especially for students who come from like poorer countries or developing

countries, that's… that's a lot of money $200.

Again, a lot of money.

So the… the test can be taken when?

Is it on a specific schedule, the Duolingo English Test?

Or can it be taken at any time?

It can be taken at any time.

Basically, the student takes it whenever and wherever he or she wants to do it.

So if you've got…

Again back to the accessibility of the test, that's a big… that's a that's a huge thing

for a lot of people.

So if you have deep pockets, you could take the test Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday,

Friday if you wanted to.

uh not exactly.

Okay.

You two Tests uh.. every 30 days.

Okay, still…

So there is a limit on that so… yeah I think…

Yeah, that's probably a wise move on their part, on Duolingo's part, not to allow students

to take it all the time.

It, you know, it adds to rel… to the reliability of the test and they can only do it twice

every 30 days.

Fair point.

How does that compare to the IELTS and the TOEFL?

Are they on a schedule, a specific schedule as well?

It's… their tests are further apart if I’m… if I’m correct.

um, yeah.

Yeah, I’m not exactly sure but, yeah, because most of the tests are done at a test center.

Of course there's a schedule for that.

My wife took the IELTS uh… just a few months ago.

um, how was her…

Like once every two weeks maybe or something like that.

How was her experience with that?

As a… from a student's perspective?

Yeah, it's exhausting.

It's exhausting.

So she took it to get her um U.K. visa.

um and yeah, she…

her English is great but she still had to learn strategies for the test.

um and then go to a test center and, you know, speak to another human and, an old British

guy.

And yeah, she didn't like it at all.

She was exhausted.

um she did well but that's, you know, beside the point.

She…

it was… it was, you know, it's a tough day for her for sure.

You mentioned the… the fact that, yeah, there are specific ways to prepare, uh, for

the IELTS and the TOEFL Tests and…

And there are classes out there about that.

And I'll… and I'll get to that in just a sec.

- tools of how to prepare - but what types of questions um can a student see on the Duolingo

English Test?

Yeah, right, so I will answer that question in one second, but I just want to make something

clear, that one of the goals of the Duolingo Test was that it… it tests a student's English

ability rather than their ability to take a test - if that makes sense.

So actually, I met…

I met up with the Duolingo marketing team about a year ago and they made that very clear

to me as a teacher.

They… they don't want the test to be like an IELTS or TOEFL, where you have to learn

strategies, not just English but strategies to pass the test or you have to write your

essay in a certain way.

They don't want to do that.

They want it to be a, you know, a test of someone's English ability.

And that's it, yeah.

So that's… that's different for… that's a different perspective for a lot of students.

Particularly students here in Korea but probably students around the world where the point

the point of preparing for a mathematics test is to show that you know the mathematics on

that particular day.

But it's not necessarily meant to show that you've got a really deep understanding of

the material perhaps.

Exactly right, exactly.

That's another major advantage, yeah.

Yes, so, the questions, what types of questions can we see?

Yeah, so there are…

there are 13 questions in total.

um there's been a change recently so around 13 different questions.

I won't go over each one… one by one.

That'll take a long time.

But I'll just kind of categorize them.

So we have the first category which I call ‘rapid fire’ questions.

I’m not sure what the Duolingo Tests really call them, but I call them rapid fire questions

because they are quick.

You have about four or five different types of questions and you only have between 60

and 90 seconds to answer them.

Okay.

Very quick.

So for example, a vocabulary - you get a list of quests… a list of words

uh 18 for example.

And you have to choose which ones are real English words.

Okay.

There are a bunch of fake ones and real ones - you choose the real ones.

You have 60 seconds to do that.

You have a dictation.

You know quick one sentence listen and type out what you hear.

Okay.

And there's reading the sentence out loud, you know, to test your pronunciation.

These types of rapid-fire quick questions.

So that's within what… that's within one question you… you said that there are 13

questions.

There are 13 different types.

So one type vocabulary.

There are two vocab questions.

There's a read aloud question.

But rather than go through all of them, I thought I'd categorize them.

So those are those questions they come at the at the beginning of the test.

I see.

Then you have a reading comprehension section which is, you know, kind of standardized.

You…

you read a paragraph and you answer some questions.

After that, you have the speaking and writing questions where you have to describe a photo

through speaking and writing.

And you have to do like longer responses to certain prompts.

And then, after that, you have the interview section, where you have to write a response

and give an oral response.

And the universities can actually view your answers for those.

Ah, so that part of the test is on camera.

So part of it, it's by the sounds of things, part of the test is perhaps multiple choice,

some of it is uh audio through your computer, through the student's computer, and then some

of it is on camera as well.

Yeah exactly.

I see.

Year right.

It was all kind of filmed…

like in in the top corner of the screen.

You can see your face.

But the last section, that's sent to the university you're applying to is.

They can see your response through speaking.

And they can read your written response.

There's another… that's another key… a few key points I should mention.

um especially for the speaking and writing question, well, especially for the writing

questions.

For the writing one, you only have five minutes to write a paragraph based on a prompt you're

given.

Whereas, on the other exams, you typically have around half an hour or 40 minutes.

So it's… you have to be… you have to be thinking quite quickly on this exam.

You have to read the questions and start typing almost immediately for… for every question.

Yeah, so, that's it.

That's challenging for students.

So by the sounds of things, um, it is a better test of proficiency in general, but it's not

necessarily easy by any stretch.

It doesn't mean that a student can simply not prepare at all for this test.

No, I don't think so.

um in terms of it being easier, a lot of people when they see it, they think oh yeah this

is easier than the IELTS or TOEFL.

And I agree in some to some extent that the, you know, as friendlier, so it looks a lot

easier.

But there's… it's more of a different skill you have to practice.

You have to do things quicker.

You have a lot of different types of questions coming at you really fast.

So it… um yeah, I wouldn't say it's easier.

And actually, if you look on the Duolingo Test website, they actually have done a lot

of research on this.. related to a comparison between, you know, a student's score and IELTS

and the Duolingo and, you know, it… it matches up pretty well.

From a teacher's perspective, from your perspective, when you… where you've… pardoned me…

where you've seen the IELTS, you've seen the TOEFL and you've seen the Duolingo English

Test.

You've obviously focused your channel on the Duolingo English Test - that leads me to believe

that from a teacher's perspective, you think this one is the best choice for students.

um well, yeah, I do.

I think if the, you know, if the university a student wants to apply for, accepts the

test, then yeah 100% I would always take… always advise them to take this exam.

uh it's like I said, it's so much cheaper, it's much more accessible, and it's a lot,

yeah, it just takes away a lot of stress I think and allows students to perform at the

best because they can do it at a time and place where they feel comfortable.

Yeah, that's an excellent point as well because, you know, if you're scheduled to take the

TOEFL Test or the IELTS Test on a particular day, at a particular time, and you happen

to be having an off day or maybe you're maybe something happened, and…

You have a cold for example.

Yeah, yeah exactly or you didn't get much sleep the night before.

Well then sorry.

You're stuck to their schedule and you've paid that two hundred dollars so that's it.

Whereas with the Duolingo English Test, it's up to the student whenever they want, when

they feel good, when they feel confident, ‘boom,’ let's do the test.

I’m ready for it.

Yeah, exactly like… it's like I said, it's a lot friendlier.

It's a lot…

it's a lot overall…

it's just a bet a better experience for… for test takers.

It kind of want makes me want to take the test and I am a native English speaker.

Actually, it's still hard.

I’ve taken it a few times, and after the hour, I was pretty tired, you know, that's

a lot.

It's very fast.

You get a lot of questions uh in a short space of time.

And you have to be thinking, you know, even as an English speaker, it was quite exhausting.

Did you ace it?

Did you get 100 out of 100?

Yeah, I got a good score.

I know, especially for like the speaking or writing ones, I know how to formulate a good

answer to like hit the checkpoints well.

That's… that's uh… that's a great point for students to know, is that for… for your

channel specifically, you have taken the test.

You know exactly what kind of questions are asked.

And you… and you also know how to answer the questions properly as well.

Yeah, right.

Yeah, exactly.

So, prior from…

my prior to me starting the YouTube channel, I was a teacher, and I taught academic English,

you know, helping students pass the IELTS Test.

And a lot of the… the way you have to score high on these tests is actually quite similar

with the IELTS and TOEFL in your, let's say speaking or writing answer, you need to show

a good awareness of the of the question to answer the question correctly and in detail.

You need to show good vocabulary, so using synonyms, or different verb tenses, you know,

that kind of stuff.

Grammar, um, to use complex sentences in your answer, like this.

There's… there are things that will… things you can do and you can practice that will

guarantee, guarantees is a strong word, but will help you get a good score.

So what kind of tools… let's get to that point now.

um we mentioned that there are specific strategies for IELTS and TOEFL where students are taught

how to take the test.

Yes, um, with Duolingo's English Test, I’m sure that there are methods or strategies

that students can can… can learn as well.

What types of things are those if you could give an example or two?

Yeah, okay, so like I mentioned, the rapid fire questions, the dictation, the vocabulary.

That's really a test of your English skills - listening or vocab.

But when it comes to the speaking and writing ones, there are things you can practice in

order to give a better response.

So just for example, um yeah, one of the spoken questions is to describe a photograph and

you need to do it for about 90 seconds.

Now, I’m not sure about you, but that's quite hard.

I was going to say…

A photo for 90 seconds is a long time.

Yeah, so a lot of students, they get a bit stuck.

Like they know what to talk about, they know the words, they know what to say, but they

can't speak for very long because we don't do that.

So there are things like what I teach which can almost like triggers to allow you to speak

longer.

So you know for example, like you can focus on the location of things in the photograph,

go into detail, you know, where…

where is almost everything located in the photo.

You can look at the… the main objects - if they're people or animals like what are they

doing using adverbs and adjectives to describe that.

Those type of strategies.

uh if there's a person in the picture, you could even say, okay think of an emotion and

then look at their face and say, oh they I feel like… they must be feeling like this

today.

And then you can expand on that by saying because perhaps this happened to them in the

morning…

You're allowed to speculate, actually.

You can… you can definitely do that on tests.

And that's an… also a thing I teach is speculation and how to make assumptions based on what's

happening in the photo.

That would make that a lot easier, right?

If you could…

Well it makes you speak for longer, right?

Yeah that's really exactly yeah exactly yeah It's almost like an octopus and it's legs…

Just look at the octopus's body and then go away eight legs off the body and just find

it, yeah… … and then you, yeah exactly, and that's

what I teach.

So I…

I have a website and I have some courses on there and I go through that in a lot of detail.

My YouTube… actually I do that…

my YouTube videos, too, which is obviously for free, but my website has a bit more detail

and a few more pdfs you can download.

Okay, well let's talk about those right now.

So the YouTube channel right now can…

Give us the name one more time.

Yeah, it's a Teacher Luke - Duolingo English Test.

um if you just search Duolingo Test, you'll… you'll see my face on the thumbnail.

So yeah, that's… that's enough.

What's an example of a recent video that you did for your channel?

Oh, I did… oh, I did spoken phrases to also increase your answer and make your answer

a lot smoother.

So for example, when you get a spoken prompt, usually you have a topic and then three or

four bullet pointed questions, and what a lot of students do is they answer one question

and they stop and then answer next and then the next.

Which is okay, but to make your answer smoother, and more fluent, which is on the scoring criteria,

you can use different phrases to kind of go… transition from one question to the next.

And… and move back if you need to.

So that was my latest video.

Gotcha.

Yeah, that's a… that's a good… good way to teach a student how to be a, or how to

appear to be a good conversationalist.

Yeah.

As well with the ability to kind of keep flowing from one sentence to the next to the next

without many interruptions, right?

Yeah, transitions, right.

Yeah that kind of stuff.

What kind of feedback have you gotten from um your subscribers who uh… from some of

your over 200,000 subscribers now?

And by the way congratulations.

I…

I don't thank you I said congratulations on that.

That's a wonderful achievement for you.

Yeah recently…

What type of uh feedback have you gotten from the students?

uh it's, to be honest, most of the comments are just the ‘thank you’ comments like

you know Teacher, Teacher Luke, they call me Teacher Luke, thank you I got my score

just by watching your YouTube videos.

Wow.

Or um, you know, I actually, I have an application which I’ve developed and at least they try

that they say, ‘oh, thank you it helped me a lot’.

And most of them just ‘thank you’ questions.

um on the other hand, I do have, you know, some questions about the um the…

Okay, so if a student breaks a rule on the Duolingo Test, then the test becomes uncertified.

So for example, like if… if you're because you take it at home, you need to make sure

your…

your eyes are pretty much uh looking at your computer the whole time,

You can't go away because they need to validate the test and make sure that no one's cheating,

right.

Off someone…

could be off camera show yeah okay…

There are a lot…

there are lots of rules students need to follow.

um so I do get a lot of emails about students or comments um saying you know can you help

me, I keep…

I keep breaking this rule by mistake, basically.

um it's very…

it's kind of hard for me to respond to those questions… to those types of comments but

um yeah Yeah.

So it's basically two.

I have ‘thank you’ comments and ‘help me’ comments.

Please… please help me stop breaking this rule.

Right well goodness…

thank goodness that's not a rule for me.

I think I’ve looked away from the camera numerous times during the chat…

It's just a natural reaction for people, right?

It is, unfortunately, it is, but yeah I know it is.

And I feel sorry for students because it's not easy to stare at your computer the whole

time for a whole hour.

Yeah.

But, you have to remember that this Duolingo Test, they are allowing you to take the test

from home.

And they have to make sure it's secure because it needs to be a reliable test, so you need

to focus on uh following the rules.

um the test is pretty…

they're pretty kind though the Duolingo because if you break a rule, you can actually take

the test again for free.

Oh, that's a great thing to know.

Yeah that's… that's…

I think that's very generous of them.

They… you'll get an email saying, our proctor found that you were looking away from up to

a three sec… up to five seconds or something and… can't do that so here's a you know

a free coupon or something like that.

I think they get three… three goes.

Okay, for the practice tests um… and then there are practice tests for the students

to take?

Yeah, on my website.

Yeah.

Okay, wonderful.

So yeah I was just gonna say we'll get to the website in in just a sec but I wanted

to ask, during the student’s practice test, do they get flagged or is there any guidance

that they might be breaking a rule?

No, unfortunately, not.

No, no.

So that… that could be something that's the Duolingo team…

I could suggest them… that's actually quite a good thing to do because actually on the

Duolingo website, you can do a 10-minute practice… to practice test so that could be that could

be good for them to… to flag those type of rules.

So from your website, students can get specific guidance from you, recommendations from you

on how they should be answering the questions.

That's the YouTube material.

uh when we go to the website, what do we get from your website?

Yeah, so I have two… let’s call them ‘products’ - two things I…

I sell on the website.

So I have courses - where students can take more detailed lessons from me, right.

YouTube is a bit um…

no, I focus, I do very good I know I…

I try very hard to make my YouTube videos as good as possible.

But the nature of YouTube means that you can't really organize lessons into a course because

YouTube's a bit more like just individual videos, whereas on my website, my courses

are very organized.

We go through strategies from like, you know, sentence one to sentence ten in your step-by-step

strategies.

And also there's pdfs they can download.

On top of that, I have…

I developed an application - a web app - where students can actually take thousands…

I think maybe 10,000 practice questions and get instant feedback.

Wow.

So it sounds like the complete package then.

From the website, they can have the course material where it's a… it's a step-by-step

process.

And then as a supplement, and correct me at any point if I’m wrong, but as a supplement

go to your YouTube channel and learn some guidance there.

But also, just learn some in general stuff that can help you with the test.

And then the app.

Well that's just convenient.

And you can get lots of help from that and use it whenever you want to.

Use it on your subway commute you know to school or something like that.

Yeah, exactly.

So when I… it was about a year ago, I started developing these…

these um tools… and I thought to myself, okay so what can

I what can I actually do you know help the students in the most like organized way?

I thought of it of learn and practice.

Learn… you learn the strategies from my YouTube or my online courses.

Learn lots about the test.

But then you need to practice it and get feedback.

So that's where the practice app came into… came into play.

And that was months of hard work, uh… sleepless nights, but we got it done.

And it works very well.

And yeah we got a lot of good feedback from… from that.

Fantastic.

So what are your final words?

As talking to your students, or potential subscribers right now, why should they come

to Luke Jone’s Duolingo English Test uh practice uh app or the YouTube channel or

or the website what…

what do they get?

Sell it to us.

Yeah well I’d actually…

yeah it's a good point.

So if a student wants to certify their English, I strongly recommend taking the Duolingo Test

as we've talked about throughout this conversation.

It's affordable, accessible, much…

much more friendly exam.

And I think that because of the way it's set up, you can actually achieve a better score.

Not because the Test is easier, but because you feel comfortable and more relaxed.

If you want to take that test, then of course come to my YouTube to study.

We have…

I have hundreds of videos on… on YouTube for free.

And my products, which I…

I do sell on my website.

uh the cheap… the most expensive ones like $14 so I try to make it affordable for all

students.

And yeah you can contact me.

I sometimes do live… live lessons where I can interact with my audience as well so…

Wonderful.

I’m around to…

I'll do my best to answer your questions basically and help you as much as I can.

All right so well let's go over it one more time to make sure we've got it all.

The YouTube channel is called…

Yeah, Teacher Luke - Duolingo English Test.

The website is… detready.com Duolingo English Test.

And the app is called…

That's on the website.

You can do the website you can access it through the website.

Yes, very good.

Well Luke Jones, once again congratulations to you on your success.

um this is a really interesting trend I think in the English as a second language uh community

where you know everyone is familiar with IELTS, everyone is familiar with TOEFL, but maybe

not everyone around the world is familiar with this new uh, maybe perhaps better option,

the Duolingo English Test.

Good luck in your future.

Good luck with all of your endeavors and thanks so much for uh being on speaking uh Speak

English Fluently today.

It was a pleasure.

Yeah thank you so much.

That was a lot of fun, thanks a lot.

Well thank you once again to Luke Jones uh for joining me on Speak English Fluently.

That was a lot of fun to learn about that particular topic and once again I wish Luke

success in the future.

If you want to check out some more interviews that I did from my own channel, you can search

Storytime Steve Hatherly, simply story time one word, and then Steve Hatherly.

My channel will pop up there.

Lots of fun interviews that you can enjoy, too.

uh, again, thank you to Luke Jones for joining me on Speak English Fluently and I hope you'll

come back next time.