Thelma Golden: How art gives shape to cultural change

翻译人员: Xun Zheng 校对人员: Xu Jiang

The brilliant playwright, Adrienne Kennedy,

卓有才情的剧作家阿德里安娜·肯尼迪

wrote a volume called

写过一本书

"People Who Led to My Plays."

“引领我的话剧的人们”。

And if I were to write a volume,

如果让我写这么一本书

it would be called,

应该会叫做

"Artists Who Have Led My Exhibitions"

“引领我的展览的艺术家们”

because my work,

因为我的工作

in understanding art and in understanding culture,

在理解艺术与文化上

has come by following artists,

是来自于追随艺术家们，

by looking at what artists mean

以了解艺术家们的想法

and what they do and who they are.

他们在做什么和他们是谁。

J.J. from "Good Times,"

杰·杰的《好时光》

(Applause)

(掌声)

significant to many people of course

对许多人来说意义非凡

because of "Dy-no-mite,"

正是因为他"太棒了"

but perhaps more significant

然而也许更有意义的是

as the first, really, black artist

他实际上是第一位出现在黄金档电视节目上

on primetime TV.

的黑人艺术家。

Jean-Michel Basquiat,

让·米歇尔·巴斯奎特，

important to me because [he was]

他对我很重要

the first black artist in real time

因为他是第一位黑人艺术家

that showed me the possibility of

随时告诉我

who and what I was about to enter into.

我要去了解的那些人和事情有无可能。

My overall project is about art --

我的整个项目都是关于艺术的，

specifically, about black artists --

特别是关于黑人艺术家们的，

very generally

概括地说

about the way in which art

是关于艺术通过何种方式

can change the way we think

改变我们对文化和自身

about culture and ourselves.

的思考方式。

My interest is in artists

艺术家们让我很感兴趣

who understand and rewrite history,

他们了解并改写历史，

who think about themselves

他们自我反思

within the narrative

通过那些来自于更广阔的艺术世界

of the larger world of art,

里所讲述的故事，

but who have created new places

而不是那些创建新领域

for us to see and understand.

让我们去观看和理解的艺术家们。

I'm showing two artists here, Glenn Ligon and Kara Walker,

在此，我要介绍两位艺术家，格伦·利根和卡尔·沃克。

two of many who really form for me

他们是促成我提出

the essential questions that I wanted to bring

我一直想提出的重要问题的众多艺术家中的两位，

as a curator to the world.

当我是一名馆长的时候。

I was interested in the idea

我对这些很感兴趣

of why and how

为什么和怎么样

I could create a new story,

我能编一个新的故事

a new narrative in art history

一个艺术史上全新的叙事故事

and a new narrative in the world.

和一个世界上全新的叙事故事。

And to do this, I knew

为了做成这个，我知道

that I had to see the way in which artists work,

我得去了解艺术家们是如何工作的，

understand the artist's studio

把艺术家们的工作室

as a laboratory,

当作实验室一样去了解，

imagine, then,

然后去想像

reinventing the museum as a think tank

将博物馆看成是智库，

and looking at the exhibition

将这些展览

as the ultimate white paper -- asking questions,

视作一张白纸，提出问题

providing the space

并提供思考

to look and to think about answers.

和找寻答案的空间。

In 1994,

1994年，

when I was a curator at the Whitney Museum,

我曾任惠特尼博物馆馆长时

I made an exhibition called Black Male.

举办了一个叫做"黑人男性"的展览

It looked at the intersection

这个展览关注

of race and gender

当代美国艺术中

in contemporary American art.

种族与性别的交集。

It sought to express

它试图去解释

the ways in which art

艺术通过何种方式

could provide a space for dialogue --

提供了一个对话的平台，

complicated dialogue,

复杂的对话，

dialogue with many, many points of entry --

有着多个切入点的对话，

and how the museum could be the space

还有博物馆是如何成为一个拥有这类对话

for this contest of ideas.

的场所。

This exhibition included

展览囊括了

over 20 artists

超过20名艺术家

of various ages and races,

各年龄、各种族的都有，

but all looking at black masculinity

但他们在关注黑人男性方面

from a very particular point of view.

有着各自的独特见解。

What was significant about this exhibition

这次展览的重大意义

is the way in which

是它给予我

it engaged me in my role

我的角色的方式

as a curator, as a catalyst,

作为馆长，作为媒介，

for this dialogue.

在这场对话中。

One of the things that happened

发生在这次展览中

very distinctly in the course of this exhibition

的一件很重要的事

is I was confronted with the idea

就是我直接面对

of how powerful images can be

图片能够有多么的震撼

in people's understanding of themselves and each other.

以及人们理解自身和彼此。

I'm showing you two works, one on the right by Leon Golub,

在此我要为你们展示两幅作品，右边的是来自于利昂戈·卢布

one on the left by Robert Colescott.

左边的来自于罗伯特科·尔斯科特

And in the course of the exhibition --

在这一次的展览中

which was contentious, controversial

他们备受争议

and ultimately, for me,

最终，对于我来说

life-changing

改变了生活，

in my sense of what art could be --

改变了我认为的艺术可能是什么，

a woman came up to me on the gallery floor

画廊里一位向我走来的女士

to express her concern about the nature

表达了她对一些本质问题的看法

of how powerful images could be

那就是图片能够有多震撼

and how we understood each other.

以及我们如何能了解彼此。

And she pointed to the work on the left

随后，她指着左边这幅作品

to tell me how problematic this image was,

告诉我这幅画有着怎样的问题，

as it related, for her, to the idea of

因为对她来说，这幅画涉及了

how black people had been represented.

我们一直以来的是如何描述黑人的。

And she pointed to the image on the right

她又指着右边这幅画

as an example, to me, of the kind of dignity

对我说，这是一个有关尊严的例子

that needed to be portrayed

需要加以描绘

to work against those images in the media.

去对抗大众媒体中（所描绘的）形象。

She then assigned these works racial identities,

然后她指出了这些作品作者的人种，

basically saying to me that the work on the right,

基本上告诉我右边这幅

clearly, was made by a black artist,

显然是黑人艺术家画的，

the work on the left, clearly, by a white artist,

左边那幅明显是白人艺术家的，

when, in effect,

实际上

that was the opposite case:

恰恰相反。

Bob Colescott, African-American artist;

鲍勃科·尔斯科特，非裔美国艺术家

Leon Golub, a white artist.

利昂·戈卢布，白人艺术家

The point of that for me was

重点是，对我来说，

to say -- in that space, in that moment --

在那个地点，那个时间，

that I really, more than anything,

我比什么都

wanted to understand

想要了解

how images could work, how images did work,

这些画怎么会产生作用，怎么样产生的作用，

and how artists provided

还有艺术家们怎么样通过这些作品

a space bigger than one

提供了一个比

that we could imagine in our day-to-day lives

我们在日常生活中能想象出来的

to work through these images.

更广阔的世界。

Fast-forward and I end up in Harlem;

最终我来到哈莱姆，

home for many of black America,

这里是许多美国黑人的故乡，

very much the psychic heart

非常适合从心灵上

of the black experience,

体验黑人的经历，

really the place where the Harlem Renaissance existed.

整个“哈莱姆文艺复兴”曾存在过这里。

Harlem now, sort of explaining

现在的哈莱姆,算是阐释

and thinking of itself in this part of the century,

和思考着它自身，作为这个世纪的一部分，

looking both backwards and forwards ...

既有回顾，又有展望。

I always say Harlem is an interesting community

我总认为哈莱姆是一个有趣的地方

because, unlike many other places,

因为，与其他地方不同，

it thinks of itself in the past, present

哈莱姆同时思考着它的过去，现在

and the future simultaneously;

和将来。

no one speaks of it just in the now.

没有人只谈论它的现在。

It's always what it was and what it can be.

（人们）总在说它过去如何，今后怎样。

And, in thinking about that,

想到这些，

then my second project, the second question I ask is:

我的第二个项目，也是第二个问题就来了。

Can a museum

博物馆

be a catalyst in a community?

能在社会中能作为媒介吗？

Can a museum house artists

能让艺术家们住在博物馆里，

and allow them to be change agents

允许他们成为改革的媒介

as communities rethink themselves?

作为社会的反思者吗？

This is Harlem, actually, on January 20th,

这实际上是，哈莱姆， 在1月20日的

thinking about itself in a very wonderful way.

深刻的自我反省。

So I work now at The Studio Museum in Harlem,

因此，现在我在哈莱姆的画室博物馆工作

thinking about exhibitions there,

想着那里的展览，

thinking about what it means to

思索着它对于

discover art's possibility.

找寻着艺术中的可能性的意义。

Now, what does this mean to some of you?

现在，这些对于你们有什么意义呢？

In some cases, I know that many of you

有些情况下，我知道许多人

are involved in cross-cultural dialogues,

融入跨文化的对话之中，

you're involved in ideas of creativity and innovation.

你融入在创造和革新的思想中。

Think about the place that artists can play in that --

想想属于艺术家们的地方吧。

that is the kind of incubation and advocacy

这正是我所酝酿和宣传的

that I work towards, in working with young, black artists.

和那些年轻的黑人艺术家们一起工作。

Think about artists, not as content providers,

想想那些艺术家们，别把他们当成画作的提供者，

though they can be brilliant at that,

尽管他们也相当了不起，

but, again, as real catalysts.

但是，再想想，他们作为真实的媒介。

The Studio Museum was founded in the late 60s.

画室博物馆建于60年代末。

And I bring this up because it's important to locate

我把它建起来，因为在历史上记下这一事件

this practice in history.

很重要，

To look at 1968,

1968年

in the incredible historic moment that it is,

一个令人难以置信的历史时刻

and think of the arc that has happened since then,

想想自那时发生的一切，

to think of the possibilities that we are all

想想可能性，我们

privileged to stand in today

今天有幸健在的可能性，

and imagine that this museum

想象一下这个博物馆

that came out of a moment of great protest

从伟大的抗议声中诞生，

and one that was so much about

它对研究历史

examining the history and the legacy

十分的重要

of important African-American artists

也是这个国家艺术史上

to the history of art in this country

非裔美国艺术家们的重要遗产

like Jacob Lawrence, Norman Lewis,

像雅各布·劳伦斯，诺曼·刘易斯，

Romare Bearden.

罗马勒·毕尔登。

And then, of course,

当然

to bring us to today.

也带给了我们今天。

In 1975, Muhammad Ali

1975年，穆罕默德·阿里

gave a lecture at Harvard University.

在哈佛大学举办了一场讲座。

After his lecture, a student got up and said to him,

讲座后，一位学生站起来对他说，

"Give us a poem."

“给我们做首诗吧”

And Mohammed Ali said, "Me, we."

于是，默罕默德·阿里说：“我，我们”

A profound statement about the individual and the community.

这是一份关于个人和社会的郑重宣言，

The space in which now,

关于现在的这个空间，

in my project of discovery, of thinking about artists,

这个我的项目所发现的，我的项目所关注的艺术家们

of trying to define

及我的项目正试着明确

what might be

黑人艺术文化运动

black art cultural movement of the 21st century.

在21世纪有可能是什么。

What that might mean

那对于此刻所有的文化运动来说

for cultural movements all over this moment,

可能意味这什么，

the "me, we" seems

“我，我们”这首诗看起来

incredibly prescient

高瞻远瞩

totally important.

非常重要。

To this end,

最后

the specific project that has made this possible for me

对于我，使这一切成为可能的具体项目

is a series of exhibitions,

是一系列的展览，

all titled with an F --

所有的名称里都带有F这个字母的展览，

Freestyle, Frequency and Flow --

“自由式”（Freestyle）、“频率”（Frequency）和“流动”（Flow）

which have set out to discover

这些展览已开始发现

and define

并且确定了

the young, black artists working in this moment

一些现在活跃在艺术界的年轻黑人艺术家们

who I feel strongly

我强烈认为他们

will continue to work over the next many years.

将要继续活跃好多年。

This series of exhibitions

这一系列展览

was made specifically

专门特别地

to try and question

尝试和质疑

the idea of what it would mean

一个想法，那就是现在把艺术看作媒介

now, at this point in history,

在现在这个历史时刻，

to see art as a catalyst;

意味着什么，

what it means now, at this point in history,

在这一历史时刻，有什么意义。

as we define and redefine culture,

就在我们定义并重新定义文化的时候，

black culture specifically in my case,

黑人文化，特别是在我的项目中的，

but culture generally.

而不是一般的文化。

I named this group of artists

我给这群艺术家起了个名字

around an idea, which I put out there

依照的是我在这里说的这些想法

called post-black,

叫“后黑派”。

really meant to define them

为了定义那些

as artists who came and start their work now,

前来开始工作的艺术家们，

looking back at history but start in this moment, historically.

他们一边回顾历史，一边在这一历史性时刻开始工作，。

It is really in this sense of discovery

这一发现确实很有意义

that I have a new set of questions that I'm asking.

它让我提出了一系新的问题。

This new set of questions is:

新的问题是：

What does it mean, right now,

此时此刻，

to be African-American in America?

在美国，作为一名非裔美国人意味着什么？

What can artwork say about this?

对此，艺术品可以表达什么？

Where can a museum exist

博物馆应该建在什么地方，

as the place for us all

作为一个让我们大家

to have this conversation?

进行艺术对话的场所？

Really, most exciting about this

真的，最让人激动的是

is thinking about the energy and the excitement

想到那些由年轻艺术家们带来的

that young artists can bring.

活力和激情。

Their works for me are about,

对我来说这些艺术家的作品

not always just simply

不是经常，只是简单地

about the aesthetic innovation

美学创新

that their minds imagine, that their visions create

他们想法新奇，视角独特

and put out there in the world,

面向世界，

but more, perhaps, importantly,

但是，也许更重要的是

through the excitement of the community

通过这种激情

that they create as important voices

这种艺术家们建立自己社区作为重要声音的激情

that would allow us right now to understand our situation,

使得我们了解现状，

as well as in the future.

还有未来。

I am continually amazed

还让我感到吃惊的是

by the way in which

通过这种方法

the subject of race

种族的话题

can take itself in many places

可以出现在许多

that we don't imagine it should be.

我们没想到的地方。

I am always amazed

还让我吃惊的是

by the way in which artists are willing

艺术家们工作

to do that in their work.

所采取的方式。

It is why I look to art.

这是我为何关注艺术的原因。

It's why I ask questions of art.

这是我为可质疑艺术的原因。

It is why I make exhibitions.

这是我为何举办展览的原因。

Now, this exhibition, as I said,

现在，这个展览，正如我所说的,

40 young artists done over the course of eight years,

花费了40位青年艺术家8年的时间，

and for me it's about considering the implications.

对我来说，它是经过深思远虑的。

It's considering the implications of

这分析了

what this generation has to say to the rest of us.

这一代人要对我们其余的人说些什么的影响

It's considering what it means for these artists

也涉及对这些艺术家而言这意味着什么

to be both out in the world as their work travels,

他们既要随着作品走向世界

but in their communities

也身处于现实社会中，

as people who are seeing and thinking

就像人们观察并思考

about the issues that face us.

我们所面临的那些事情。

It's also about thinking about

这个展览也对

the creative spirit and nurturing it,

创新精神以及如何培养它进行了思考。

and imagining, particularly in urban America,

想想，特别是在美国城区

about the nurturing of the spirit.

培养这种精神。

Now, where, perhaps, does this end up right now?

嗯，到哪里了，或许，现在要结束了？

For me, it is about re-imagining

对我来说，或许应该在国际背景下

this cultural discourse in an international context.

重新思考这一文化交流

So the last iteration of this project

因此这个项目的最后环节

has been called Flow,

叫做“流动”

with the idea now of creating

这个想法想要创建

a real network

一个全球艺术家的

of artists around the world;

真实网络，

really looking, not so much

真的去看，不仅是哈莱姆内外

from Harlem and out, but looking across,

而是关注全世界的。

and Flow looked at artists all born on the continent of Africa.

“流动”环节关注所有出生在非洲大陆的艺术家们

And as many of us think about that continent

正如我们之中许多人思考这片大陆

and think about what if means

思考在21世纪

to us all in the 21st century,

这片大陆对于我们意味着什么，

I have begun that looking

我开始关注

through artists, through artworks,

通过艺术家，通过艺术作品

and imagining what they can tell us about the future,

去想象他们要告诉我们一个怎样的未来

what they tell us about our future,

他们要告诉我们关于我们的未来，

and what they create in their sense of

还有他们创造了什么

offering us this great possibility of watching

使我们有更多机会了解

that continent emerge as part

这片成为

of our bigger dialogue.

更旷阔的对话的一部分的大陆。

So, what do I discover

因此，当我欣赏这些画作的时候

when I look at artworks?

我发现了什么？

What do I think about

当我思考艺术的时候

when I think about art?

我想到了什么？

I feel like the privilege I've had as a curator

我觉得作为馆长的权利

is not just the discovery of new works,

不仅是发现新的画作，

the discovery of exciting works.

发现已经存在的作品，

But, really, it has been

而应该是，

what I've discovered about myself

对自身的探索，

and what I can offer

以及将展览作为平台

in the space of an exhibition,

可以提供什么，

to talk about beauty, to talk about power,

去探讨美、去探讨力量，

to talk about ourselves,

去探讨我们自身，

and to talk and speak to each other.

以及彼此之间的交流。

That's what makes me get up every day

这使得我每天一起床

and want to think about

就开始思考

this generation of black artists and artists around the world.

这一代黑人艺术家以及世界上的艺术家们。

Thank you. (Applause)

谢谢