How women in rural India turned courage into capital | Chetna Gala Sinha
116,483 views ・ 2018-09-10
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譯者: Lilian Chiu
審譯者: Qiwen Lu
00:12
I'm here to tell you not just my story
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我來這裡,要跟大家
分享的不僅是我的故事,
00:16
but stories of exceptional women
from India whom I've met.
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還有我遇見的幾位
不凡的印度女性的故事。
00:21
They continue to inspire me,
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在我人生的道路上,
00:23
teach me, guide me
in my journey of my life.
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這些故事一直鼓舞我、
教導我、引導我。
00:28
These are incredible women.
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這些女人相當了不起。
00:30
They never had an opportunity
to go to school,
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她們從來沒有機會上學,
00:33
they had no degrees,
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她們沒有學位,
00:35
no travel, no exposure.
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沒有遊歷,沒有曝光。
00:38
Ordinary women
who did extraordinary things
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平凡的女人做出不凡的事,
00:41
with the greatest of their courage,
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她們有最偉大的勇氣、
00:43
wisdom and humility.
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智慧,以及謙卑。
00:46
These are my teachers.
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她們是我的老師。
00:49
For the last three decades,
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在過去三十年,
00:50
I've been working,
staying and living in India
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我在印度工作、居留、生活,
00:54
and working with women in rural India.
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和印度農村的女性合作。
00:58
I was born and brought up in Mumbai.
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我在孟買出生和長大。
01:01
When I was in college,
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我讀大學時,
01:02
I met Jayaprakash Narayan,
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我遇到了賈雅普拉卡什納拉揚,
01:05
famous Gandhian leader
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他是著名的甘地主義領袖,
01:08
who inspired youth to work in rural India.
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他鼓勵年輕人在印度農村工作。
01:12
I went into the villages
to work in rural India.
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為了在印度農村工作,
我進到村子裡。
01:15
I was part of land rights movement,
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我參與了地權運動、
01:18
farmers' movement
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農夫運動,
01:19
and women's movement.
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以及女性運動。
01:22
On the same line,
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我一直用這樣的方式,
01:23
I ended up in a very small village,
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最後到了一個非常小的村子,
01:26
fell in love with a young, handsome,
dynamic young farmer-leader
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愛上了一個年輕英俊
且很有動能的年輕農夫領袖,
01:33
who was not very educated,
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他沒有受過多少教育,
01:35
but he could pull the crowd.
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但他能夠帶動群眾。
01:37
And so in the passion of youth,
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出於年輕人的熱情,
01:40
I married him
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我嫁給他了,
01:42
and left Mumbai,
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並離開了孟買,
01:43
and went to a small village
which did not have running water
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到一個小村子去,
那裡沒有自來水,沒有廁所。
01:48
and no toilet.
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01:50
Honestly, my family
and friends were horrified.
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老實說,我的家人
和朋友都嚇壞了。
01:54
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
01:56
I was staying with my family,
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我和我的家人同住,
01:58
with my three children in the village,
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我和三個孩子同住在村子裡。
02:01
and one day,
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有一天,
02:03
a few years later one day,
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幾年後的某一天,
02:05
a woman called Kantabai came to me.
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一名叫做坎塔貝的女子來找我,
02:09
Kantabai said, "I want
to open a saving account.
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坎塔貝說:「我想開個儲蓄帳戶。
02:14
I want to save."
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我想要存錢。」
02:16
I asked Kantabai:
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我問坎塔貝:
02:18
"You are doing business of blacksmith.
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「你在做鐵匠的工作。
02:21
Do you have enough money to save?
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你有足夠的錢可以存嗎?
02:23
You are staying on the street.
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你還住在街頭。
02:26
Can you save?"
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你能存錢嗎?」
02:27
Kantabai was insistent.
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坎塔貝很堅持。
02:29
She said, "I want to save
because I want to buy a plastic sheet
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她說:「我想要存錢,因為我想要
在雨季來臨之前買一片塑膠板
02:34
before the monsoons arrive.
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02:36
I want to save my family from rain."
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為我的家人遮雨。」
02:39
I went with Kantabai to the bank.
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我和坎塔貝一起去銀行。
02:42
Kantabai wanted to save 10 rupees a day --
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坎塔貝想要一天存十盧比,
02:45
less than 15 cents.
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那還不到十五分錢。
02:48
Bank manager refused to open
the account of Kantabai.
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銀行經理拒絕幫坎塔貝開帳戶。
02:52
He said Kantabai's amount is too small
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他說坎塔貝的金額太小了,
02:56
and it's not worth his time.
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不值得他花時間。
03:00
Kantabai was not asking
any loan from the bank.
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坎塔貝沒有向這間銀行要求貸款。
03:03
She was not asking any subsidy
or grant from the government.
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她也沒有向政府要求任何補助金。
03:08
What she was asking
was to have a safe place
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她想要的只是一個安全的地方,
03:12
to save her hard-earned money.
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讓她可以安心存放辛苦賺來的錢。
03:14
And that was her right.
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那是她的權利。
03:16
And I went --
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而我去——
03:17
I said if banks are not opening
the account of Kantabai,
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我說,如果銀行不為坎塔貝開戶,
03:21
why not start the bank
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那為什麼不開一間銀行,
03:23
which will give an opportunity
for women like Kantabai to save?
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提供像坎塔貝這樣的女性
一個存錢的機會?
03:28
And I applied for the banking license
to Reserve Bank of India.
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我向印度儲備銀行
申請了銀行業務執照。
03:32
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
03:38
No, it was not an easy task.
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不,那並不是很簡單的事。
03:41
Our license was rejected --
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我們的執照申請被拒絕了。
03:43
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
03:45
on the grounds --
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原因是,
03:46
Reserve Bank said
that we cannot issue a license
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儲備銀行說,不能發執照給
03:49
to the bank whose promoting
members who are nonliterate.
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提倡的成員不識字的銀行。
03:53
I was terrified.
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我怔住了。
03:54
I was crying.
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我哭了。
03:56
And by coming back home,
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回到家,
03:58
I was continuously crying.
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我還不斷在哭。
04:00
I told Kantabai and other women
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我告訴坎塔貝和其他女性,
04:02
that we couldn't get the license
because our women are nonliterate.
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我們無法取得執照,
因為我們的女性們不識字。
04:07
Our women said, "Stop crying.
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我們的女性們說:「別哭了。
04:10
We will learn to read and write
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我們就來學讀和寫,
04:12
and apply again, so what?"
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然後再申請一次,又怎樣?」
04:14
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
04:21
We started our literacy classes.
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我們開始了識字課。
04:24
Every day our women would come.
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每天,我們的女性們都會來上課。
04:26
They were so determined
that after working the whole day,
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她們非常堅決,工作了一整天之後,
04:30
they would come to the class
and learn to read and write.
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還會來上課,學習讀和寫。
04:33
After five months,
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五個月後,
04:35
we applied again,
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我們再次申請,
04:36
but this time I didn't go alone.
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但這一次,我不是一個人去的。
04:39
Fifteen women accompanied me
to Reserve Bank of India.
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十五位女性陪我一起到
印度儲備銀行。
04:44
Our women told
the officer of Reserve Bank,
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我們的女性們告訴
儲備銀行的主管:
04:47
"You rejected the license
because we cannot read and write.
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「你之前因為我們不能讀寫
而拒絕了執照申請。
04:51
You rejected the license
because we are nonliterate."
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因為我們不識字而拒絕發照。」
04:55
But they said, "There were no schools
when we were growing,
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但她們說:「我們
成長的過程中沒有學校,
04:57
so we are not responsible
for our noneducation."
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所以我們沒受教育
並不是我們的錯。」
05:01
And they said, "We cannot read and write,
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她們說:「我們不能讀和寫,
05:04
but we can count."
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但我們會算。」
05:05
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
05:07
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
05:09
And they challenged the officer.
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她們挑戰那位主管。
05:12
"Then tell us to calculate
the interest of any principal amount."
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「那就叫我們計算
任何本金的利息。」
05:16
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
05:17
"If we are unable to do it,
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「如果我們算不出來,
05:19
don't give us license.
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就不要發執照給我們。
05:21
Tell your officers to do it
without a calculator
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叫你的職員不用計算機來算,
05:25
and see who can calculate faster."
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看誰算得比較快。」
05:27
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
05:33
Needless to say,
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不用說,
05:35
we got the banking license.
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我們得到銀行業務執照了。
05:36
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
05:38
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
05:42
Today, more than 100,000
women are banking with us
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現今,我們有超過十萬名女客戶,
05:46
and we have more
than 20 million dollars of capital.
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資本額超過兩千萬美元。
05:50
This is all women's savings,
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通通都是女性的存款,
05:52
women capital,
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女性的資本,
05:54
no outside investors
asking for a business plan.
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沒有外在的投資者
要求要提供事業計畫。
05:57
No.
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沒有。
05:58
It's our own rural women's savings.
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這都是我們農村女性的存款。
06:00
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
06:08
I also want to say that yes,
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我也想要說,是的,
06:10
after we got the license,
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在我們取得執照之後,
06:12
today Kantabai has her own house
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坎塔貝現在已經有了自己的房子,
06:15
and is staying with her family
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和她的家人住在一起,
06:17
in her own house
for herself and her family.
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她和家人住在自己的房子裡。
06:20
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
06:26
When we started our banking operations,
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當我們開始銀行的營運時,
06:28
I could see that our women
were not able to come to the bank
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我發現我們的女性無法來銀行,
06:31
because they used to lose the working day.
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因為這樣她們就會無法工作。
06:34
I thought if women
are not coming to the bank,
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我心想,如果女性無法來銀行,
06:36
bank will go to them,
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那銀行就去找她們,
06:38
and we started doorstep banking.
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我們就開始了家門銀行業務。
06:41
Recently, we starting digital banking.
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最近,我們開始了數位銀行業務。
06:44
Digital banking required
to remember a PIN number.
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數位銀行業務需要記得 PIN 碼。
06:47
Our women said,
"We don't want a PIN number.
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我們的女性說:
「我們不想要 PIN 碼。
06:51
That's not a good idea."
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那不是個好點子。」
06:53
And we tried to explain to them
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我們試著向她們解釋
06:54
that maybe you should
remember the PIN number;
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也許你們應該記住 PIN 碼;
06:57
we will help you
to remember the PIN number.
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我們會協助你們記住 PIN 碼。
06:59
They were firm.
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她們很堅定。
07:00
They said, "suggest something else,"
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她們說:「來點別的建議。」
07:02
and they --
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她們——
07:04
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
07:06
and they said, "What about thumb?"
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她們說:「用拇指如何?」
07:10
I thought that's a great idea.
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我認為那是個很棒的點子。
07:12
We'll link that digital banking
with biometric,
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我們把數位銀行業務
和生物測定學連結,
07:16
and now women use the digital
financial transaction
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現在,女人只要用拇指
就可以進行數位財務交易。
07:19
by using the thumb.
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07:21
And you know what they said?
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你們知道她們怎麼說嗎?
07:24
They said, "Anybody
can steal my PIN number
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她們說:「任何人
都能偷走我的 PIN 碼,
07:26
and take away my hard-earned money,
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拿走我的血汗錢,
07:28
but nobody can steal my thumb."
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但沒有人能偷走我的拇指。」
07:30
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
07:34
That reinforced the teaching
which I have always learned from women:
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那完全展現出了我從
女人身上所學到的事:
07:39
never provide poor solutions
to poor people.
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絕不要提供蹩腳的解決方案給窮人。
07:43
They are smart.
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他們很聰明。
07:45
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
07:53
A few months later,
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幾個月之後,
07:55
another woman came to the bank --
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另一位女性來到銀行——
07:57
Kerabai.
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克拉拜。
07:58
She mortgaged her gold and took the loan.
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她抵押了她的金子,取得了貸款。
08:02
I asked Kerabai, "Why are you
mortgaging your precious jewelry
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我問克拉拜:「你為什麼
要把你寶貴的珠寶拿來抵押
08:06
and taking a loan?"
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取得貸款?」
08:08
Kerabai said, "Don't you realize
that it's a terrible drought?
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克拉拜說:「你不知道
旱災很嚴重嗎?
08:12
There's no food or fodder for the animals.
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沒有食物或飼料可以給動物吃。
08:16
No water.
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沒有水。
08:17
I'm mortgaging gold to buy
food and fodder for my animals."
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我把金子拿來抵押,是為了
買食物和飼料給我的動物吃。」
08:21
And then she asks me,
"Can I mortgage gold and get water?"
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接著,她問我:「我能
把金子抵押換成水嗎?」
08:26
I had no answer.
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我沒有答案。
08:28
Kerabai challenged me:
"You're working in the village
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克拉拜挑戰我:「你在村子裡做
08:32
with women and finance,
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女性的財務工作,
08:33
but what if one day there's no water?
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但如果有一天,沒有水了呢?
08:37
If you leave this village,
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如果你離開這個村子,
08:38
with whom are you going to do banking?"
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你要跟誰做銀行生意?」
08:41
Kerabai had a valid question,
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克拉拜的問題是有根據的,
08:44
so in this drought,
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所以,在這場旱災時,
08:45
we decided to start
the cattle camp in the area.
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我們決定要在這個區域
開始一個牲口營。
08:49
It's where farmers can bring
their animals to one place
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農場主可以把他們的動物
帶到這個地方,
08:53
and get fodder and water.
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取得飼料和水。
08:57
It didn't rain.
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一直沒有下雨。
08:58
Cattle camp was extended for 18 months.
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牲口營延長到了十八個月。
09:01
Kerabai used to move around
in the cattle camp
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克拉拜那時會在牲口營中到處跑,
09:05
and sing the songs of encouragement.
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唱一些鼓勵的歌曲。
09:08
Kerabai became very popular.
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克拉拜變得很有名。
09:10
It rained and cattle camp was ended,
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後來下雨了,牲口營就終止了,
09:14
but after cattle camp ended,
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但在牲口營終止後,
09:16
Kerabai came to our radio --
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克拉拜來到我們的無線電台——
09:18
we have community radio
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我們有社區無線電台,
09:20
which has more than 100,000 listeners.
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有超過十萬名聽眾。
09:23
She said, "I want to have
a regular show on the radio."
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她說:「我想要在電台
有個固定的節目。」
09:28
Our radio manager said,
"Kerabai, you cannot read and write.
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我們的電台經理說:
「克拉拜,你不會讀和寫。
09:32
How will you write the script?"
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你要如何寫劇本?」
09:34
You know what she replied?
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你們知道她怎麼回嗎?
09:36
"I cannot read and write,
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「我不會讀和寫,
09:38
but I can sing.
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但我會唱。
09:39
What's the big deal?"
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有什麼大不了的?」
09:40
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)
09:42
And today,
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現今,
09:43
Kerabai is doing a regular radio program,
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克拉拜有一個固定的
無線電台節目,
09:47
and not only that,
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不只如此,
09:48
she's become a famous radio jockey
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她還成了有名的電台 DJ,
09:51
and she has been
invited by all of the radios,
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各個電台都想邀請她,
09:54
even from Mumbai.
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包括孟買的電台。
09:55
She gets the invitation
and she does the show.
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她受到邀請,她就去做節目。
09:58
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
10:04
Kerabai has become a local celebrity.
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克拉拜變成了當地的名人。
10:06
One day I asked Kerabai,
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有一天,我問克拉拜:
10:08
"How did you end up singing?"
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「你為什麼最後會選擇唱歌?」
10:11
She said, "Shall I tell you the real fact?
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她說:「我該告訴你真相嗎?
10:14
When I was pregnant with my first child,
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當我懷了第一個孩子時,
10:17
I was always hungry.
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我總是很飢餓。
10:19
I did not have enough food to eat.
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我沒有足夠的食物可以吃。
10:21
I did not have enough money to buy food,
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我沒有足夠的錢可以買食物,
10:24
and so to forget my hunger,
I started singing."
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所以,為了忘卻飢餓,
我開始唱歌。」
10:28
So strong and wise, no?
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很堅強也很睿智,對吧?
10:32
I always think that our women
overcome so many obstacles --
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我總是認為我們的女性
克服了許多障礙——
10:36
cultural, social, financial --
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文化的、社會的、財務的——
10:39
and they find out their ways.
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她們找到自己的路。
10:43
I would like to share another story:
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我還想要分享另一個故事:
10:45
Sunita Kamble.
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蘇妮塔坎布里。
10:47
She has taken a course
in a business school,
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她在商業學校上課,
10:51
and she has become a veterinary doctor.
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她變成了獸醫。
10:54
She's Dalit;
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她是賤民;
10:55
she comes from an untouchable caste,
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她來自最低的階層,
10:57
but she does artificial
insemination in goats.
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但她做羊的人工授精。
11:01
It is a very male-dominated profession
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那是個非常男性主導的職業,
11:04
and it is all the more
difficult for Sunita
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且對蘇妮塔來說更是困難,
11:06
because Sunita comes
from an untouchable caste.
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因為蘇妮塔來自最低的階層。
11:09
But she worked very hard.
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但她非常努力。
11:11
She did successful
goat deliveries in the region
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她在那個地區讓小羊成功出生,
11:15
and she became a famous goat doctor.
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且她變成了有名的羊醫生。
11:18
Recently, she got a national award.
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最近,她得到了一個國家獎項,
11:22
I went to Sunita's house to celebrate --
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我到蘇妮塔的家中慶祝——
11:25
to congratulate her.
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去恭喜她。
11:26
When I entered the village,
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當我進入村子時,
11:28
I saw a big cutout of Sunita.
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我看到蘇妮塔的大型看板圖片。
11:31
Sunita was smiling on that picture.
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圖片中的蘇妮塔在微笑。
11:33
I was really surprised
to see an untouchable,
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我真的感到很意外,一個賤民,
11:36
coming from the village,
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來自村子,
11:38
having a big cutout
at the entrance of the village.
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她的大型看板圖片
就放在村子的入口。
11:41
When I went to her house,
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當我到了她家時,
11:43
I was even more amazed
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還有更讓我驚奇的,
11:45
because upper caste leaders --
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因為上層階級的領導人——
11:47
men -- were sitting
in the house, in her house,
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男人——就坐在房子裡,
她的房子裡,
11:50
and having chai and water,
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喝印度奶茶和水,
11:53
which is very rare in India.
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這在印度是非常罕見的。
11:55
Upper caste leaders
do not go to an untouchable's house
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上層階級的領導人
不會去賤民的房子
11:57
and have chai or water.
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喝印度奶茶和水。
11:59
And they were requesting her
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他們希望她能
12:01
to come and address
the gathering of the village.
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參與村子的聚會並在聚會上演說。
12:05
Sunita broke centuries-old
caste conditioning in India.
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蘇妮塔打破了印度有
數世紀歷史的階級條件。
12:11
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
12:17
Let me come to what
the younger generations do.
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讓我來談談年輕世代會做什麼。
12:21
As I'm standing here --
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我站在這裡——
12:22
I'm so proud as I stand here,
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我很驕傲我能站在這裡,
12:25
from Mhaswad to Vancouver.
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2000
從姆哈斯瓦德到溫哥華。
12:28
Back home, Sarita Bhise --
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在家鄉,薩莉塔貝賽——
12:31
she's not even 16 years old.
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她甚至還不到十六歲。
12:34
She's preparing herself --
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她在讓自己做好準備——
12:36
she's a part of our sports program,
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她是我們運動計畫的一員,
12:38
Champions' program.
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1320
冠軍計畫。
12:40
She's preparing herself
to represent India in field hockey.
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她在讓自己做好準備,
代表印度參加曲棍球賽。
12:44
And you know where she's going?
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你們知道她要去哪裡嗎?
12:47
She's going to represent
in 2020 Olympics, Tokyo.
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2020 年她要代表去東京奧運。
12:52
(Applause)
266
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(掌聲)
12:58
Sarita comes from
a very poor shepherd community.
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薩莉塔來自一個
非常貧窮的牧羊社區。
13:01
I am just -- I couldn't be
more proud of her.
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我只是——我對她太感到驕傲了。
13:06
There are millions of women
like Sarita, Kerabai, Sunita,
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有數百萬名像薩莉塔、
克拉拜、蘇妮塔這樣的女人,
13:11
who can be around you also.
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2016
你們身邊可能也有。
13:13
They can be all over the world,
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可能全世界都有這樣的人,
13:15
but at first glance you may think
that they do not have anything to say,
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但看第一眼時,你可能會
認為她們沒有什麼可以說的,
13:20
they do not have anything to share.
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她們沒有什麼可以分享的。
13:22
You would be so wrong.
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那你就大錯特錯了。
13:24
I am so lucky that I'm working
with these women.
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我很幸運,能和這些女性合作。
13:28
They are sharing their stories with me,
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她們和我分享她們的故事,
13:31
they are sharing their wisdom with me,
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和我分享她們的智慧,
13:33
and I'm just lucky to be with them.
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我很幸運能和她們在一起。
13:38
20 years before --
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二十年前——
13:40
and I'm so proud --
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且我很驕傲——
13:42
we went to Reserve Bank of India
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我去了印度儲備銀行,
13:44
and we set up the first
rural women's bank.
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且設立了第一間農村女人的銀行。
13:47
Today they are pushing me
to go to National Stock Exchange
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現在,她們在催促我
去全國股票交易所,
13:51
to set up the first fund dedicated
to micro rural women entrepreneurs.
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設立第一個專門提供給
農村女性微型創業家的基金。
13:57
They are pushing me to set up
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她們在催促我成立
14:00
the first small finance
women's bank in the world.
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世界上第一個女性小型金融銀行。
14:04
And as one of them said,
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正如她們其中一人說的:
14:06
"My courage is my capital."
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「我的勇氣就是我的資本。」
14:08
And I say here,
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我說,在這裡,
14:10
their courage is my capital.
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她們的勇氣就是我的資本。
14:13
And if you want,
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如果你願意,
14:15
it can be yours also.
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她們的勇氣也能成為你的資本。
14:17
Thank you.
293
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謝謝。
14:18
(Applause)
294
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(掌聲)
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