Zeynep Tufekci: How the Internet has made social change easy to organize, hard to win

138,463 views ・ 2015-02-02

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翻译人员: Yolanda Zhang 校对人员: 杏儀 歐陽
00:12
So recently, we heard a lot about how social media helps empower protest,
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最近,我们时常听到 社交媒体如何支持了抗议活动,
00:17
and that's true,
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那是真的。
00:19
but after more than a decade
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但是经过十多年来
00:20
of studying and participating in multiple social movements,
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我对多种社会活动的研究和参与,
00:24
I've come to realize
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我认识到
00:26
that the way technology empowers social movements
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科技辅助社会运动的方式
00:29
can also paradoxically help weaken them.
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也可能反过来起到削弱的作用。
00:32
This is not inevitable, but overcoming it requires diving deep
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这并非不可避免, 但是要克服这个问题需要
00:36
into what makes success possible over the long term.
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深入了解长久以来到底什么是 取得成功的关键因素。
00:40
And the lessons apply in multiple domains.
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这些经验适用于不同的领域。
00:43
Now, take Turkey's Gezi Park protests, July 2013,
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举个例子:2013年7月 土耳其盖奇公园示威活动,
00:47
which I went back to study in the field.
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我曾回到过现场研究这个事件。
00:50
Twitter was key to its organizing.
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推特是组织这个抗议活动的关键。
00:52
It was everywhere in the park -- well, along with a lot of tear gas.
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推特遍布整个公园,还有催泪弹。
00:56
It wasn't all high tech.
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不完全是高科技。
00:58
But the people in Turkey had already gotten used to the power of Twitter
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不过土耳其的人民早已 习惯了推特的力量,
01:02
because of an unfortunate incident about a year before
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因为在一年前 一个很不幸的事件中,
01:05
when military jets had bombed and killed
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军队飞机轰炸并杀死了
01:09
34 Kurdish smugglers near the border region,
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靠近边界地区的34个库尔德走私者,
01:13
and Turkish media completely censored this news.
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土耳其媒体完全封锁了这个消息。
01:18
Editors sat in their newsrooms
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编辑们坐在新闻办公室里,
01:20
and waited for the government to tell them what to do.
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等待着政府的指令。
01:23
One frustrated journalist could not take this anymore.
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一位感到沮丧的记者再也无法忍受了。
01:25
He purchased his own plane ticket,
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他自掏腰包买了飞机票,
01:27
and went to the village where this had occurred.
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去了事发的村子。
01:29
And he was confronted by this scene:
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他看到了这样一番景象:
01:32
a line of coffins coming down a hill, relatives wailing.
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一排排的棺木从山坡上往下移动, 亲属们在悲泣。
01:38
He later he told me how overwhelmed he felt,
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他后来告诉我,他感到非常悲痛,
01:40
and didn't know what to do,
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不知如何是好,
01:42
so he took out his phone,
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于是他拿出手机,
01:44
like any one of us might,
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就像我们所有人一样,
01:45
and snapped that picture and tweeted it out.
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拍了照片,用推特传出去。
01:49
And voila, that picture went viral
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不出所料,这幅照片如同病毒一般
01:52
and broke the censorship and forced mass media to cover it.
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打破封锁,逼得大众传播开始报道。
01:57
So when, a year later, Turkey's Gezi protests happened,
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一年后,当土耳其的盖奇示威发生时,
02:00
it started as a protest about a park being razed,
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开始是因为一个公园被夷为平地,
02:03
but became an anti-authoritarian protest.
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但演变成了反独裁示威。
02:05
It wasn't surprising that media also censored it,
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不出所料,媒体封锁了这个消息,
02:09
but it got a little ridiculous at times.
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但有时实在太离谱。
02:12
When things were so intense,
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当事件演变到非常激烈的程度时,
02:14
when CNN International was broadcasting live from Istanbul,
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CNN国际频道在伊斯坦堡 进行了现场直播,
02:18
CNN Turkey instead was broadcasting a documentary on penguins.
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CNN土耳其频道同时播放的却是 企鹅的纪录片。
02:25
Now, I love penguin documentaries, but that wasn't the news of the day.
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我很喜欢企鹅记录片, 但是那不该是那天的头条新闻。
02:29
An angry viewer put his two screens together and snapped that picture,
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一位愤怒的观众将两个电视荧幕 放在一起,照了一张相片。
02:34
and that one too went viral,
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那张相片也开始疯狂传播,
02:36
and since then, people call Turkish media the penguin media. (Laughter)
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从此,大家就称土耳其媒体为企鹅媒体。 (笑声)
02:40
But this time, people knew what to do.
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但是这次,大家知道怎么做了。
02:42
They just took out their phones and looked for actual news.
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他们带上手机去寻找真正的新闻。
02:45
Better, they knew to go to the park and take pictures and participate
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或者他们干脆去公园照相、参与示威,
02:50
and share it more on social media.
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在社会媒体上分享信息。
02:52
Digital connectivity was used for everything from food to donations.
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数字化通讯系统已经应用到了各个领域, 譬如食物、捐款。
02:58
Everything was organized partially with the help of these new technologies.
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所有事件组织都借助了新技术。
03:03
And using Internet to mobilize and publicize protests
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用互联网来动员、宣传抗议活动
03:08
actually goes back a long way.
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实际上要追溯到很久以前。
03:10
Remember the Zapatistas,
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大家记得萨帕塔事件吗?
03:12
the peasant uprising in the southern Chiapas region of Mexico
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那是在墨西哥南部的 恰阿巴斯区的农民起义。
03:17
led by the masked, pipe-smoking, charismatic Subcomandante Marcos?
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由一个带着面具,抽着烟斗, 颇具魅力的名为马克斯的副指挥官所领导。
03:22
That was probably the first movement
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那应该是第一个
03:24
that got global attention thanks to the Internet.
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由于互联网而得到全球关注的事件。
03:27
Or consider Seattle '99,
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或想想99年的西雅图事件,
03:29
when a multinational grassroots effort brought global attention
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跨国基层民众协力让全球关注到了
03:34
to what was then an obscure organization, the World Trade Organization,
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那时仍默默无名的世界贸易组织。
03:38
by also utilizing these digital technologies to help them organize.
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他们也是运用了这种数字科技 来协助组织这个活动。
03:43
And more recently, movement after movement
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最近,一个接一个的事件
03:45
has shaken country after country:
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震撼了一个又一个国家:
03:48
the Arab uprisings from Bahrain to Tunisia to Egypt and more;
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巴林到突尼斯、埃及的阿拉伯起义等;
03:53
indignados in Spain, Italy, Greece; the Gezi Park protests;
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西班牙、意大利、希腊等国的抗议者; 盖奇公园的示威人群;
03:58
Taiwan; Euromaidan in Ukraine; Hong Kong.
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台湾;乌克兰的亲欧盟示威运动; 还有香港。
04:02
And think of more recent initiatives, like the #BringBackOurGirls hashtags.
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还有最近的,例如#把我们的女孩带回来 的口号 (14年4月尼日利亚寄宿学校若干女生被绑架)
04:07
Nowadays, a network of tweets can unleash a global awareness campaign.
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如今,网络短消息网络 能够发动全球觉醒活动。
04:14
A Facebook page can become the hub of a massive mobilization.
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脸书网页可以成为 一个大规模动员的枢纽。
04:18
Amazing.
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多么惊人啊!
04:20
But think of the moments I just mentioned.
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但想想我刚提到的那些例子。
04:24
The achievements they were able to have, their outcomes,
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他们所能取得的成就和效果,
04:29
are not really proportional to the size and energy they inspired.
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与他们所激发的民众数目和能量 并不成比例。
04:34
The hopes they rightfully raised are not really matched
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他们合法激起的希望却并没有
04:38
by what they were able to have as a result in the end.
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得到他们想要的结果。
04:42
And this raises a question:
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这就带出了一个问题:
04:46
As digital technology makes things easier for movements,
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当数字科技让一些活动变得更容易发起,
04:50
why haven't successful outcomes become more likely as well?
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为什么却不容易得到成功的结果?
04:54
In embracing digital platforms for activism and politics,
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将数字平台用在 行动主义和政治活动的同时,
05:00
are we overlooking some of the benefits of doing things the hard way?
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我们是不是忽略了传统活动中 那些有利的方面?
05:04
Now, I believe so.
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我是这样认为的。
05:05
I believe that the rule of thumb is:
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我相信常规的方法是:
05:07
Easier to mobilize does not always mean easier to achieve gains.
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很容易发动并不总是意味着 很容易实现目标。
05:12
Now, to be clear,
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我再解释一下,
05:15
technology does empower in multiple ways.
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科技的确推动了某些领域的发展。
05:18
It's very powerful.
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科技力量不容小视。
05:19
In Turkey, I watched four young college students
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在土耳其,我见到4个年轻的大学生
05:23
organize a countrywide citizen journalism network called 140Journos
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组织了一个全国市民新闻网络, 叫做140Journos,
05:28
that became the central hub for uncensored news in the country.
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它成为了全国非监管新闻的中心平台。
05:32
In Egypt, I saw another four young people use digital connectivity
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在埃及,我也见到了4个年轻人在2011年
05:37
to organize the supplies and logistics for 10 field hospitals,
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解放广场附近大范围冲突事件中, 用数字化通讯系统
05:41
very large operations,
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为10所战地医院
05:43
during massive clashes near Tahrir Square in 2011.
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组织了志愿和后勤服务, 那是非常庞大的系统。
05:49
And I asked the founder of this effort, called Tahrir Supplies,
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我问这个活动的发起者 ——”解放支援“组织,
05:53
how long it took him to go from when he had the idea to when he got started.
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从产生想法到付诸行动 究竟花了多长时间。
05:59
"Five minutes," he said. Five minutes.
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”5分钟,“他说。只有5分钟。
06:01
And he had no training or background in logistics.
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而他对后勤事务一无所知。
06:04
Or think of the Occupy movement which rocked the world in 2011.
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再想想2011年震撼全世界的 占领华尔街运动。
06:07
It started with a single email
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仅仅从《广告克星》杂志的 一封电子邮件开始,
06:09
from a magazine, Adbusters, to 90,000 subscribers in its list.
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转发到了9万订阅者的手中。
06:15
About two months after that first email,
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邮件发出去的2个月之后,
06:18
there were in the United States 600 ongoing occupations and protests.
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全美国就发起了 600起占领和抗议事件。
06:24
Less than one month after the first physical occupation in Zuccotti Park,
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在祖科蒂公园占领事件之后还不到1个月,
06:30
a global protest was held in about 82 countries, 950 cities.
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82个国家、950个城市 开展了全球性抗议活动。
06:37
It was one of the largest global protests ever organized.
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这是有史以来最大一次 全球性示威活动。
06:39
Now, compare that to what the Civil Rights Movement had to do in 1955 Alabama
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与1955年阿拉巴马州 发生的民权运动相比,
06:46
to protest the racially segregated bus system, which they wanted to boycott.
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即种族隔离公交系统, 呼吁大众拒绝坐公交。
06:52
They'd been preparing for many years
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这个运动酝酿了很多年,
06:54
and decided it was time to swing into action
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在罗莎·帕克斯被捕之后
06:56
after Rosa Parks was arrested.
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才被认为是时候该付诸行动。
06:58
But how do you get the word out --
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但是要怎么传播信息呢——
07:00
tomorrow we're going to start the boycott --
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明天就要开始进行抵制了——
07:02
when you don't have Facebook, texting, Twitter, none of that?
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那时候并没有脸书、短信、 推特之类的媒介?
07:08
So they had to mimeograph 52,000 leaflets
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于是他们需要影印5万2千份传单,
07:13
by sneaking into a university duplicating room
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这一切都要夜深人静之后
偷偷潜入一所大学的复印室暗中进行。
07:16
and working all night, secretly.
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07:18
They then used the 68 African-American organizations
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然后他们借助全城联系密切的
07:22
that criss-crossed the city to distribute those leaflets by hand.
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68个非洲裔美国人组织 来亲手发放这些传单。
07:26
And the logistical tasks were daunting, because these were poor people.
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后勤工作非常难组织, 因为这些都是穷人。
07:31
They had to get to work, boycott or no,
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毕竟他们都去上班赚钱, 抵制还是不抵制的确是个难题,
07:33
so a massive carpool was organized,
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所以大量的拼车活动组织起来了,
07:36
again by meeting.
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还是通过集会。
07:38
No texting, no Twitter, no Facebook.
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没有短信,没有推特,没有脸书。
07:40
They had to meet almost all the time to keep this carpool going.
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他们总是要碰面 保证拼车顺利进行。
07:44
Today, it would be so much easier.
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而如今,这一切都变得很简单了。
07:46
We could create a database, available rides and what rides you need,
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我们可以建立一个数据库, 哪些人有空车,哪些人需要搭车,
07:51
have the database coordinate, and use texting.
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用数据库进行协调,用短信沟通。
07:54
We wouldn't have to meet all that much.
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我们不再需要那样集会。
07:57
But again, consider this:
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不过再想想:
07:59
the Civil Rights Movement in the United States
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美国的民权运动
08:02
navigated a minefield of political dangers,
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进入了具有政治危险性的雷区,
08:07
faced repression and overcame, won major policy concessions,
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面临镇压,冲破镇压, 赢得了重大政策让步,
08:12
navigated and innovated through risks.
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组织和创新的每一步都充满了危险。
08:16
In contrast, three years after Occupy sparked
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对比而言,占领运动掀起了
08:19
that global conversation about inequality,
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不平等的全球话题3年之后,
08:22
the policies that fueled it are still in place.
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支持这种不平等的政策 丝毫没有改变。
08:25
Europe was also rocked by anti-austerity protests,
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欧洲也发生了许多反紧缩抗议活动,
08:29
but the continent didn't shift its direction.
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不过并没有取得任何成效。
08:33
In embracing these technologies,
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在充分利用这些技术的同时,
08:36
are we overlooking some of the benefits of slow and sustained?
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我们是不是忽略了缓慢长期的活动中 有利的一面呢?
08:42
To understand this,
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为了搞清楚这一点,
08:44
I went back to Turkey about a year after the Gezi protests
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盖奇抗议活动一年后 我回到了土耳其,
08:47
and I interviewed a range of people,
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采访了一些人,
08:49
from activists to politicians,
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包括活动家、政治家、
08:53
from both the ruling party and the opposition party and movements.
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统治集团、反对集团、各种运动。
08:58
I found that the Gezi protesters were despairing.
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我发现盖奇活动的抗议者感到很绝望。
09:01
They were frustrated,
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他们很沮丧,
09:03
and they had achieved much less than what they had hoped for.
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他们所达到的效果离期望相差太远。
09:06
This echoed what I'd been hearing around the world
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这也呼应了我在全球接触的
09:09
from many other protesters that I'm in touch with.
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其他抗议者的声音。
09:12
And I've come to realize that part of the problem
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我开始认识到一部分问题在于
09:15
is that today's protests have become a bit like climbing Mt. Everest
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当今的抗议活动有点像 借助60个西藏夏尔巴人
09:21
with the help of 60 Sherpas,
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来攀登珠穆朗玛峰,
09:23
and the Internet is our Sherpa.
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而网络就是我们的夏尔巴人。
09:26
What we're doing is taking the fast routes
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我们在做的是 找到最快的路径,
09:30
and not replacing the benefits of the slower work.
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却没有利用传统方式的好处。
09:34
Because, you see,
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因为你们想想看,
09:35
the kind of work that went into organizing
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以前组织的所有后勤工作
09:38
all those daunting, tedious logistical tasks
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都很繁琐、单调,
09:41
did not just take care of those tasks,
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并不只是为了完成工作,
09:44
they also created the kind of organization that could think together collectively
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这些工作创造了一种组织, 能够让大家万众一心,
09:48
and make hard decisions together,
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一起做出艰难的决定,
09:51
create consensus and innovate, and maybe even more crucially,
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达成一致、有所创新, 甚至更重要的是,
09:55
keep going together through differences.
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在求同存异中前行。
09:58
So when you see this March on Washington in 1963,
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当你们看到1963年3月 在华盛顿的这些人群时,
10:03
when you look at that picture,
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看着这张照片,
10:05
where this is the march where Martin Luther King gave his famous
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马丁路德金在人群中 进行了他的著名演讲,
10:08
"I have a dream" speech, 1963,
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1963年的“我有一个梦想”,
10:11
you don't just see a march and you don't just hear a powerful speech,
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看到的不只是浩荡的游行人群, 听到的不只是伟大的一篇演讲,
10:15
you also see the painstaking, long-term work that can put on that march.
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大家也看到了聚集人群所需的 长期艰辛工作。
10:21
And if you're in power,
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如果你掌握着实权,
10:22
you realize you have to take the capacity signaled by that march,
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你会认识到,你必须考虑 游行所显示的巨大能量,
10:27
not just the march, but the capacity signaled by that march, seriously.
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并不只是游行, 而是游行所传递的实实在在的能量。
10:31
In contrast, when you look at Occupy's global marches
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对比来看,占领华尔街的全球抗议活动
10:35
that were organized in two weeks,
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在2周内就组织好了
10:37
you see a lot of discontent,
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可以看到很多不满的情绪,
10:38
but you don't necessarily see teeth that can bite over the long term.
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但并不一定能看到长远效果。
10:43
And crucially, the Civil Rights Movement innovated tactically
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关键问题在于, 民权运动在战术上进行了创新,
10:47
from boycotts to lunch counter sit-ins to pickets to marches to freedom rides.
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从抵制、到餐厅静坐抗议、罢工纠察员、 游行、再到自由乘坐公交。
10:54
Today's movements scale up very quickly without the organizational base
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如今的运动缺乏有效的组织基础, 规模扩张得太快,
10:58
that can see them through the challenges.
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无法预见到可能面临的挑战。
11:00
They feel a little like startups that got very big
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有点类似于小型创业公司发展过快,
11:04
without knowing what to do next,
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却还不知道下一步要如何发展,
11:06
and they rarely manage to shift tactically
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而且也很少转换战略,
11:09
because they don't have the depth of capacity
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因为他们没有深厚的实力
11:11
to weather such transitions.
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来平和度过这段过渡期。
11:14
Now, I want to be clear: The magic is not in the mimeograph.
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我想表明: 成功的秘诀不在于蜡纸油印。
11:19
It's in that capacity to work together, think together collectively,
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而是同心协力、同舟共济的能力,
11:25
which can only be built over time with a lot of work.
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这种能力只有通过长期的 准备工作才能建立起来。
11:28
To understand all this,
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为了理解这个问题,
11:30
I interviewed a top official from the ruling party in Turkey,
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我采访了土耳其执政党的高级官员,
11:34
and I ask him, "How do you do it?"
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我问他, “你们是怎么赢得选举的?”
11:36
They too use digital technology extensively, so that's not it.
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他们也大面积使用了数字科技, 所以这不是根本原因。
11:40
So what's the secret?
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那么秘密是什么?
11:42
Well, he told me.
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他告诉我,
11:43
He said the key is he never took sugar with his tea.
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他说秘诀就是他喝茶从来不放糖。
11:50
I said, what has that got to do with anything?
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我说,这有什么关系吗?
11:53
Well, he said, his party starts getting ready for the next election
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他说,他的选举团队 在他选举获胜的第二天
11:56
the day after the last one,
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就开始准备下一场选举了,
11:58
and he spends all day every day meeting with voters in their homes,
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他每天都要去那些支持者家里走访,
12:02
in their wedding parties, circumcision ceremonies,
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参加他们的婚礼、割礼仪式,
12:04
and then he meets with his colleagues to compare notes.
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然后他与同事碰面交流会谈笔录。
12:07
With that many meetings every day, with tea offered at every one of them,
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每天他都要与群众会面, 每一家都会请他喝茶,
12:12
which he could not refuse, because that would be rude,
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他无法拒绝,因为那样很不礼貌,
12:15
he could not take even one cube of sugar per cup of tea,
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每一杯茶里连一块糖都不能放,
12:20
because that would be many kilos of sugar, he can't even calculate how many kilos,
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因为加起来会有好几公斤糖, 他根本数不过来,
12:24
and at that point I realized why he was speaking so fast.
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那时我就明白 为什么他说话这么快。
12:27
We had met in the afternoon, and he was already way over-caffeinated.
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我们是在下午会面的, 那时他已经摄入了太多咖啡因。
12:32
But his party won two major elections
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但是,在盖奇游行的那一年
他的团队轻松地 在两场重要选举中获胜。
12:37
within a year of the Gezi protests with comfortable margins.
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12:40
To be sure, governments have different resources to bring to the table.
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无可否认,政府部门 有很多不同的资源可以利用。
12:43
It's not the same game, but the differences are instructive.
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条件不同, 但是其中的差异非常具有启发性。
12:47
And like all such stories, this is not a story just of technology.
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就像所有类似事件, 这不是技术获胜。
12:51
It's what technology allows us to do converging with what we want to do.
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关键在于技术能够辅助我们 去做我们想做的事。
12:56
Today's social movements want to operate informally.
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当今的社会运动总想要以 非正式的形式操作。
12:59
They do not want institutional leadership.
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他们不想要任何机构的领导。
13:02
They want to stay out of politics because they fear corruption and cooptation.
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他们不想跟政治扯上关系, 对腐败和招降举措感到恐惧。
13:07
They have a point.
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他们有自己的办法。
13:08
Modern representative democracies are being strangled in many countries
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现代具有代表性的民主在很多国家
13:11
by powerful interests.
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已经被强大的利益扼杀。
13:14
But operating this way makes it hard for them
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但是这种方式让他们很难实现持久战,
13:17
to sustain over the long term and exert leverage over the system,
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并且在社会上产生足够的影响,
13:21
which leads to frustrated protesters dropping out,
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这就会导致沮丧的抗议者退出,
13:24
and even more corrupt politics.
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政治体系变得更腐败。
13:27
And politics and democracy without an effective challenge hobbles,
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不面临有效的挑战 政治和民主就无法进步,
13:32
because the causes that have inspired the modern recent movements are crucial.
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因为激励现代运动的原因非常关键。
13:39
Climate change is barreling towards us.
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气候变化的问题日益严峻。
13:42
Inequality is stifling human growth and potential and economies.
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不平等问题压制了人类的进步, 发展潜力和经济增长。
13:47
Authoritarianism is choking many countries.
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独裁主义让很多国家饱受摧残。
13:49
We need movements to be more effective.
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我们需要更有效的社会运动。
13:52
Now, some people have argued that the problem is
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现在,一些人认为问题在于
13:55
today's movements are not formed of people who take as many risks as before,
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当今那些举办运动的人 所面临的危险远不如以前,
14:01
and that is not true.
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但这并不是事实。
14:03
From Gezi to Tahrir to elsewhere,
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在盖奇、这埃及解放广场运动,
14:06
I've seen people put their lives and livelihoods on the line.
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我见到人们舍家弃业 投入到这些运动中去。
14:09
It's also not true, as Malcolm Gladwell claimed,
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事实也不像马尔科姆·格拉德威尔说的那样 (《纽约客》杂志撰稿人及畅销作家),
14:12
that today's protesters form weaker virtual ties.
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当今抗议者的凝聚力不足。
14:14
No, they come to these protests, just like before,
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这是不对的,这些人参加抗议活动,
14:18
with their friends, existing networks,
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跟朋友一起参与,与从前没什么两样,
14:21
and sometimes they do make new friends for life.
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有的时候甚至还能 遇到志同道合的挚交。
14:23
I still see the friends that I made
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现在我还是会跟10多年前
14:26
in those Zapatista-convened global protests more than a decade ago,
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在萨帕塔全球抗议活动上 认识的朋友见面聊天,
14:29
and the bonds between strangers are not worthless.
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陌生人之间的联系并非毫无价值。
14:32
When I got tear-gassed in Gezi,
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当我在盖奇遭受到催泪瓦斯的攻击,
14:34
people I didn't know helped me and one another instead of running away.
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陌生人帮助我和其他人一起撤离, 而不是只顾自己逃命。
14:40
In Tahrir, I saw people, protesters,
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在埃及解放广场运动中, 我见到了很多人,抗议者,
14:43
working really hard to keep each other safe and protected.
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拼命保护周围人的安全。
14:46
And digital awareness-raising is great,
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数字化宣传是个很不错的途径,
14:48
because changing minds is the bedrock of changing politics.
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因为改变思想是改变政治体制的基石。
14:51
But movements today have to move beyond participation at great scale very fast
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但是当今的运动需要 超越大范围快速的参与,
14:59
and figure out how to think together collectively,
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还要想办法让大家万众一心,
15:02
develop strong policy proposals, create consensus,
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发展强有力的政治意愿, 保持高度一致,
15:06
figure out the political steps and relate them to leverage,
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制定政治决策的发展步骤, 并想办法付诸实施,
15:10
because all these good intentions and bravery and sacrifice by itself
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毕竟仅有这些好的意愿、 勇气和牺牲精神
15:13
are not going to be enough.
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是远远不够的。
15:15
And there are many efforts.
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人们的确进行了很多努力。
15:17
In New Zealand, a group of young people are developing a platform called Loomio
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在新西兰,一群年轻人正在建立 一个叫做Loomio的平台,
15:21
for participatory decision making at scale.
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用来进行大规模参与决策的制定。
15:24
In Turkey, 140Journos are holding hack-a-thons
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在土耳其,140Journos正在举办“黑客松”
15:28
so that they support communities as well as citizen journalism.
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这样他们就可以同时支持社区活动 和大众新闻报导。
15:32
In Argentina, an open-source platform called DemocracyOS
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在阿根廷, 一个叫做DemocracyOS的开源平台
15:35
is bringing participation to parliaments and political parties.
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让议会和政治党派也能够参与进来。
15:39
These are all great, and we need more,
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这些都非常好, 我们还需要更多这样的组织,
15:42
but the answer won't just be better online decision-making,
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不过办法并不只在于更好的网络决策,
15:46
because to update democracy, we are going to need to innovate at every level,
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因为要改进民主制度, 我们需要在每个阶段都有所革新,
15:52
from the organizational to the political to the social.
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从组织层面到政治层面,再到社会层面。
15:56
Because to succeed over the long term,
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因为要获得长久的胜利,
16:00
sometimes you do need tea without sugar
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有时候你还是需要喝不放糖的茶,
16:03
along with your Twitter.
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尽管你有推特。
16:04
Thank you.
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谢谢大家。
16:06
(Applause)
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(掌声)
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