The global goals we've made progress on -- and the ones we haven't | Michael Green

287,598 views ・ 2018-11-30

TED


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譯者: Lilian Chiu 審譯者: Yanyan Hong
00:12
In 2015, the leaders of the world made a big promise.
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2015 年,世界領袖們 做出了一個大承諾。
00:18
A promise that over the next 15 years,
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這個承諾就是,在接下來十五年,
00:20
the lives of billions of people are going to get better
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數十億人的生活會變得更好,
00:24
with no one left behind.
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沒有人會被丟下。
00:27
That promise is the Sustainable Development Goals --
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那個承諾,就是永續發展目標——
00:30
the SDGs.
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縮寫 SDGs。
00:32
We're now three years in;
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現在已經過了三年,
00:34
a fifth of the way into the journey.
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走過了整個旅程的五分之一。
00:36
The clock is ticking.
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時間不斷流逝。
00:38
If we offtrack now,
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如果我們現在就偏離軌道,
00:39
it's going to get harder and harder to hit those goals.
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要達成目標會變得越來越難。
00:44
So what I want to do for you today is give you a snapshot
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所以,今天我想要做的, 是讓各位能約略了解
00:47
on where we are today,
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今天我們走到哪裡了,
00:48
some projections on where we're heading
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對未來我們會朝哪裡 前進做一些預測,
00:52
and some ideas on things we might need to do differently.
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也思考一下有哪些地方, 我們需要用不同的方式來做。
00:57
Now, the SDGs are of course spectacularly complicated.
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當然,永續發展目標是非常複雜的。
01:01
I would expect nothing less from the United Nations.
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很符合我對聯合國的期望。
01:03
(Laughter)
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(笑聲)要多少個目標?
01:04
How many goals?
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01:06
Maybe something tried and tested, like three, seven or 10.
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也許有嘗試過且有測試過的, 比如,三個、七個,或十個。
01:09
No, let's pick a prime number higher than 10.
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不,咱們挑個比十大的質數吧。
01:13
Seventeen goals.
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十七個目標。
01:15
I congratulate those of you who've memorized them already.
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如果你已經把那些目標 都記下來了,我要恭喜你。
01:18
For the rest of us, here they are.
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至於其他人,目標在這裡。
01:21
Seventeen goals ranging from ending poverty
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十七個目標,從終結貧困,
01:24
to inclusive cities
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到包容城市,到永續漁業;
01:25
to sustainable fisheries;
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01:27
all a comprehensive plan for the future of our world.
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都是為了我們世界的未來 所做的全面計畫。
01:31
But sadly, a plan without the data to measure it.
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但,感傷的是,沒有資料 可以測量這個計畫。
01:36
So how are we going to track progress?
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所以,我們要如何追蹤進展?
01:38
Well, I'm going to use today the Social Progress Index.
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嗯,今天,我要用的 是社會進步指數。
01:42
It's a measure of the quality of life of countries,
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它是針對國家生活品質 所做的一種測量值,
01:45
ranging from the basic needs of survival --
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範圍從基本的生存需求——
01:48
food, water, shelter, safety --
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食物、水、庇護所、安全——
01:51
through to the foundations of well-being --
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一直到幸福的基礎——
01:54
education, information, health and the environment --
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教育、資訊、健康,及環境——
01:57
and opportunity --
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及機會——權利、做選擇的自由、
01:59
rights, freedom of choice, inclusiveness and access to higher education.
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包容,及取得高等教育的途徑。
02:05
Now, the Social Progress Index doesn't look like the SDGs,
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社會進步指數看起來 並不像永續發展目標,
02:08
but fundamentally, it's measuring the same concepts,
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但,根本上, 它是在測量同樣的概念,
02:12
and the Social Progress Index has the advantage that we have the data.
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而社會進步指數有一項優勢, 就是我們有數據。
02:15
We have 51 indicators drawn from trusted sources
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我們有 51 項指標, 都來自可信任的來源,
02:19
to measure these concepts.
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可用來測量這些概念。
02:21
And also, what we can do because it's an index,
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此外,因為它是一個指數,
02:24
is add together all those indicators to give us an aggregate score
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我們還能把所有這些指標加起來, 得到一個合計的分數,
02:28
about how we're performing against the total package of the SDGs.
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代表我們對於整套 永續發展目標的表現。
02:33
Now, one caveat.
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有件事要注意。
02:34
The Social Progress Index is a measure of quality of life.
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社會進步指數是 生活品質的測量值。
02:37
We're not looking at whether this can be achieved
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我們在看的並不是在地球的 環境限制之內是否能達成它。
02:39
within the planet's environmental limits.
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02:41
You will need other tools to do that.
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需要其他工具才能做到這一點。
02:45
So how are we doing on the SDGs?
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所以,在永續發展目標上, 我們做得如何?
02:48
Well, I'm going to put the SDGs on a scale of zero to 100.
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我要把永續發展目標放到 零到一百的評分尺度上。
02:52
And zero is the absolute worst score on each of those 51 indicators:
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零分表示這所有 51 個 指標最糟糕的分數:
02:57
absolute social progress, zero.
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絕對的社會進展,零分。
02:59
And then 100 is the minimum standard required to achieve those SDGs.
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一百分是要達到永續發展 目標的最低標準。
03:04
A hundred is where we want to get to by 2030.
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我們希望在 2030 年能達到一百分。
03:08
So, where did we start on this journey?
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所以,我們在這趟旅程的 起始點在哪裡?
03:10
Fortunately, not at zero.
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幸運的是,並非從零分開始。
03:12
In 2015, the world score against the SDGs was 69.1.
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世界的永續發展目標
在 2015 年的分數是 69.1 分。
03:18
Some way on the way there but quite a long way to go.
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已經在朝目標前進, 但還有很長的路要走。
03:22
Now let me also emphasize that this world forecast,
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我也得要強調一下, 這是世界預測,
03:24
which is based on data from 180 countries,
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它的根據是 180 個國家的資料,
03:27
is population weighted.
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以人口數做加權。
03:29
So China has more weight in than Comoros;
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所以,中國的權重比葛摩還要高;
03:31
India has more weight in than Iceland.
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印度的權重比冰島還要高。
03:34
But we could unpack this and see how the countries are doing.
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但,我們能將它拆開來, 看國家的表現。
03:37
And the country today that is closest to achieving the SDGs is Denmark.
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現今,最接近達成目標的國家
是丹麥。
03:43
And the country with the furthest to go is Central African Republic.
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還有最長的路要走的 國家是中非共和國。
03:47
And everyone else is somewhere in between.
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其他的國家都在它們之間。
03:51
So the challenge for the SDGs
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所以,永續發展目標的挑戰 就是要試著在 2030 年
03:53
is to try and sweep all these dots across to the right, to 100 by 2030.
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把所有這些資料點都掃到 最右邊一百分的地方。
03:59
Can we get there?
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我們能做到嗎?
04:01
Well, with the Social Progress Index, we've got some time series data.
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針對社會進步指數, 我們有一些時間數列的資料。
04:04
So we have some idea of the trend that the countries are on,
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所以,我們能多少 了解一點國家的趨勢,
04:07
on which we can build some projections.
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我們可以再利用趨勢來做預測。
04:10
So let's have a look.
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所以,咱們來看看吧。 咱們從表現最好的國家丹麥開始。
04:12
Let's start with our top-performing country, Denmark.
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04:15
And yes, I'm pleased to say that Denmark is forecast to achieve the SDGs by 2030.
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是的,我很高興能夠說,預測丹麥
能在 2030 年達成永續發展目標。
04:20
Maybe not surprising, but I'll take a win.
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也許不讓人意外, 但也是一場勝仗。
04:23
Let's look at some of the other richer countries of the world --
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咱們來看看世界上其他較富有的 國家——世界七大工業國家。
04:27
the G7.
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我們發現,德國和日本 會達到目標,或很接近。
04:28
And we find that Germany and Japan will get there or thereabouts.
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04:33
But Canada, France, the UK and Italy are all going to fall short.
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但加拿大、法國、英國,
和義大利都沒辦法。
04:39
And the United States?
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美國呢?
04:41
Quite some way back.
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還要再差一點。
04:43
Now, this is sort of worrying news.
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這是蠻讓人擔心的消息。
04:46
But these are the richest countries in the world,
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但,這些是世界上最富有的國家,
04:49
not the most populous.
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不是最多人口的國家。
04:50
So let's take a look now at the biggest countries in the world,
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所以,現在咱們來看看 世界上最大的國家,
04:53
the ones that will most affect whether or not we achieve the SDGs.
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最會影響到我們是否能達成 永續發展目標的國家。
04:57
And here they are --
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就是這些國家——世界上 人口超過一億人的國家,
04:58
countries in the world with a population of higher than 100 million,
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05:01
ranging from China to Ethiopia.
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範圍從中國到衣索比亞。
05:04
Obviously, the US and Japan would be in that list,
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很顯然,美國和日本都會在名單上,
05:06
but we've looked at them already.
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但我們已經看過它們了。
05:08
So here we are.
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所以,來了。世界上最大的國家:
05:09
The biggest countries in the world; the dealbreakers for the SDGs.
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能否達成永續發展目標的關鍵。
05:12
And the country that's going to make most progress towards the SDGs
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將會在永續發展目標上 有最大進展的國家
05:16
is Mexico.
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是墨西哥。
05:18
Mexico is going to get to about 87,
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墨西哥會達到大約 87 分,
05:20
so just shy of where the US is going to get
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只比美國會達到的分數差一點,
05:23
but quite some way off our SDG target.
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但離我們的永續發展目標還相當遠。
05:26
Russia comes next.
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下一個是俄國。
05:27
Then China and Indonesia.
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接著是中國和印尼。
05:30
Then Brazil -- might've expected Brazil to do a bit better.
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然後是巴西——本來預期 巴西會比這好一點的。
05:33
Philippines,
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菲律賓,
05:35
and then a step down to India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Nigeria,
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接著下面是印度、孟加拉共和國、
巴基斯坦、奈及利亞, 接著是衣索比亞。
05:40
and then Ethiopia.
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05:42
So none of these countries are going to hit the SDGs.
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這些國家通通不會 達成永續發展目標。
05:46
And we can then take these numbers in all the countries of the world
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接著,我們可以拿全世界 所有國家的這些數字
05:49
to give ourselves a world forecast
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來做一個世界預測,
05:51
on achieving that total package of the SDGs.
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預測永續發展目標的整體達成度。
05:54
So remember, in 2015 we started at 69.1.
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別忘了,在 2015 年, 我們是從 69.1 分開始的。
05:59
I'm pleased to say that over the last three years,
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我很高興能夠說,在過去三年間,
06:01
we have made some progress.
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我們有一些進展。
06:02
In 2018, we've hit 70.5,
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2018 年,我們達到了 70.5 分,
06:07
and if we project that rate of progress forward to 2030,
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如果我們把這樣的進展率 推算到 2030 年,
06:10
that's going to get us to 75.2,
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我們可以達到 75.2 分,
06:13
which is obviously a long way short of our target.
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很顯然,離我們的目標還很遠。
06:17
Indeed, on current trends, we won't hit the 2030 targets until 2094.
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的確,依目前的趨勢,
我們要到 2094 年才能 達到目標,不是 2030 年。
06:26
Now, I don't know about you,
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我不知道你們怎麼樣, 但我是絕對不想等那麼久。
06:27
but I certainly don't want to wait that long.
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06:30
So what can we do about this?
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所以,我們能怎麼辦?
06:32
Well, the first thing to do is we've got to call out the rich countries.
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嗯,第一件事, 我們得召集富有國家。
06:35
Here are the countries closest to the SDGs,
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它們是最接近永續發展目標的國家,
06:38
with the greatest resources,
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且最有資源,卻又做不到目標。
06:40
and they're falling short.
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06:42
Maybe they think that this is like the Old World
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也許,它們認為這就像是 舊世界(東半球),
06:45
where goals for the UN are just for poor countries and not for them.
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聯合國的目標只是為 貧窮國家設定的,不是它們。
06:49
Well, you're wrong.
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嗯,你們錯了。永續發展 目標是給每個國家的,
06:50
The SDGs are for every country,
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06:52
and it's shameful that these wealthy countries are falling short.
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這些富有的國家沒達到 目標實在很可恥。
06:55
Every country needs a plan to implement the SDGs
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每個國家都需要一個計畫 來導入永續發展目標,
06:58
and deliver them for their citizens.
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並為其公民實現這些目標。
07:00
G7, other rich countries --
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七大工業國家,其他富有國家—— 振作起來好好做。
07:02
get your act together.
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07:05
The second thing we can do is look a bit further into the data
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我們能做的第二件事, 就是在看資料時更深入一點,
07:08
and see where there are opportunities to accelerate progress
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看看哪裡有機會可以讓進展更快,
07:11
or there are negative trends that we can reverse.
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或是哪裡有我們可以逆轉的負面趨勢。
07:15
So I'm going to take you into three areas.
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所以,我要帶各位進入三個領域。
07:17
One where we're doing quite well,
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其中一個,我們做得很好,
07:19
one where we really should be doing better
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其中一個,我們應該要能做更好,
07:21
and another where we've got some real problems.
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還有一個,我們真的 有些問題要解決。
07:25
Let's start with the good news,
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咱們先從好消息開始,
07:27
and I want to talk about what we call nutrition and basic medical care.
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我想要談的,是我們所謂的 營養和基本醫療照護。
07:31
This covers SDG 2 on no hunger
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這就包含了關於終止飢餓的 永續發展目標二,
07:33
and the basic elements of SDG 3 on health,
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及關於健康的目標三 底下的基本元素,
07:36
so maternal and child mortality, infectious diseases, etc ...
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母親和孩童的死亡率, 感染性疾病……
07:40
This is an area where most of the rich world has hit the SDGs.
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在這個領域中,大部分的 富有國家都達到了永續發展目標。
07:44
And we also find, looking at our big countries,
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從這些國家當中,我們也發現,
07:47
that the most advanced have got pretty close.
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最先進的國家最靠近目標。
07:50
Here are our 11 big countries,
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這是我們的前十一大國家,
07:52
and if you look at the top,
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請看看頂端,巴西和俄國 都很靠近永續發展目標。
07:53
Brazil and Russia are pretty close to the SDG target.
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07:57
But at the bottom --
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但在底部——衣索比亞、 巴基斯坦——還有很長的路要走。
07:58
Ethiopia, Pakistan -- a long way to go.
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08:00
That's where we are in 2018.
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這是我們 2018 年的狀況。 我們的軌道是什麼?
08:02
What's our trajectory?
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08:03
On the current trajectory,
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若依目前的軌道,
08:05
how far are we going to get by 2030?
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到 2030 年,我們能走多遠?
08:07
Well, let's have a look.
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咱們來看看。
08:09
Well, what we see is a lot of progress.
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我們看到的是許多進展。
08:11
See Bangladesh in the middle.
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中間的是孟加拉共和國。
08:13
If Bangladesh maintains its current rate of progress,
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如果孟加拉共和國 維持目前的進展,
08:16
it could get very close to that SDG target.
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它可能會非常接近永續發展目標。
08:19
And Ethiopia at the bottom is making a huge amount of progress
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而衣索比亞在底下, 目前它的進展相當大,
08:23
at the moment.
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08:24
If that can be maintained, Ethiopia could get a long way.
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如果能維持下去, 衣索比亞可以走得很遠。
08:28
We add this all up for all the countries of the world
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我們把全世界所有 國家的數字都加起來,
08:31
and our projection is a score of 94.5 by 2030.
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我們預測,
2030 年的分數會是 94.5 分。
08:36
And if countries like the Philippines, which have grown more slowly,
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如果像菲律賓這類成長比較慢的國家
08:40
could accelerate progress,
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能夠加速進展, 那麼我們就能離目標更近。
08:41
then we could get a lot closer.
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08:43
So there are reasons to be optimistic about SDGs 2 and 3.
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所以,對永續發展目標二 和三抱持樂觀是合理的。
08:48
But there's another very basic area of the SDGs where we're doing less well,
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但有另一個永續發展目標的基本領域,
我們就沒有做得很好,
08:52
which is SDG 6, on water and sanitation.
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那就是關於水和衛生的 永續發展目標六。
08:56
Again, it's an SDG where most of the rich countries
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同樣的,這也是大部分富有國家
08:59
have already achieved the targets.
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已經達成的永續發展目標。
09:01
And again, for our big countries --
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且,同樣的,大國——
09:03
our big 11 emerging countries,
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我們的十一個新興大國,
09:05
we see that some of the countries, like Russia and Mexico,
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我們可以發現,當中有些國家, 如俄國和墨西哥,
09:07
are very close to the target,
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都非常接近目標,
09:10
but Nigeria and other countries are a very long way back.
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但奈及利亞和其他國家 則落後非常多。
09:14
So how are we doing on this target?
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所以,在這個目標上, 我們做得如何?
09:16
What progress are we going to make over the next 12 years
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根據目前的行進方向,
在接下來十二年, 我們會有什麼進展?
09:19
based on the current direction of travel?
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09:22
Well, here we go ...
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嗯,來看吧……
09:23
and yes, there is some progress.
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是的,有一些進展。
09:25
Our top four countries are all hitting the SDG targets --
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排名前四的國家達到了 永續發展目標——
09:28
some are moving forward quite quickly.
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有些國家向前進的速度非常快。
09:30
But it's not enough to really move us forward significantly.
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但這樣還不足夠 讓我們有顯著的進展。
09:33
What we see is that for the world as a whole,
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我們可以看到,就整個世界來說,
09:36
we're forecasting a score of around 85, 86 by 2030 --
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我們預測 2030 年的分數
會在 85 或 86 分——
09:41
not fast enough.
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不夠快。
09:43
Now, obviously this is not good news,
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很顯然,這不是好消息,
09:45
but I think what this data also shows is that we could be doing a lot better.
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但我認為這些資料也意味著 我們還可以做得更好許多。
09:50
Water and sanitation is a solved problem.
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水和衛生的問題已經解決。
09:52
It's about scaling that solution everywhere.
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重點是要把解決方案的 規模做大,擴展到各地。
09:55
So if we could accelerate progress in some of those countries
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所以,如果我們能幫一些 改善緩慢的國家加速進展——
09:58
who are improving more slowly --
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09:59
Nigeria, the Philippines, etc. --
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奈及利亞、菲律賓等等——
10:01
then we could get a lot closer to the goal.
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那麼我們就可以更接近目標許多。
10:04
Indeed, I think SDG 6 is probably the biggest opportunity
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的確,我認為在所有永續發展目標中,
目標六可能是做到 步伐調整的最大機會。
10:08
of all the SDGs for a step change.
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10:13
So that's an area we could do better.
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這個領域,我們可以做得更好。
10:16
Let's look finally at an area where we are struggling,
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咱們最後來看看一個 讓我們很掙扎的領域,
10:19
which is what we call personal rights and inclusiveness.
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就是我們所謂的個人權利和包容。
10:23
This is covering concepts across a range of SDGs.
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這領域包含了永續發展 目標的不少概念。
10:26
SDG 1 on poverty, SDG 5 on gender equality,
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關於貧窮的永續發展目標一、
關於性別平等的目標五、
10:30
SDG 10 on inequality,
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關於不平等的目標十、
10:32
SDG 11 on inclusive cities
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關於包容城市的目標十一,
10:35
and SDG 16 on peace and justice.
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及關於和平與正義的目標十六。
10:38
So across those SDGs there are themes around rights and inclusiveness,
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在上述那些永續發展目標中, 都有關於權利和包容的主題,
10:42
and those may seem less immediate or pressing
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和飢餓及疾病相比,它們可能
10:45
than things like hunger and disease,
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沒有那麼急切或迫切,
10:47
but rights and inclusion are critical to an agenda of no one left behind.
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但如果要做到不丟下任何人, 權利和包容就很重要。
10:53
So how are we doing on those issues?
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所以,我們該怎麼處理這些議題?
10:55
Let's start off with personal rights.
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咱們從個人權利談起。
10:57
What I'm going to do first is show you our big countries in 2015.
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我要先讓各位看看 2015 年的大國。
11:01
So here they are,
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這裏,我把美國和日本又重新放進來,
11:03
and I've put the USA and Japan back in,
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所以這些是世界上 最大的十三個國家。
11:05
so it's our 13 biggest countries in the world.
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我們看到的分數差距很大。
11:07
And we see a wide range of scores.
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11:09
The United States at the top with Japan hitting the goals;
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最上頭的美國和日本達到目標;
11:12
China a long way behind.
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中國落後很多。
11:14
So what's been our direction of travel
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所以,在過去三年,在權利方面,
11:16
on the rights agenda over the last three years?
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我們的進展方向是什麼?
11:18
Let's have a look.
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咱們來看看。
11:19
Well, what we see is actually pretty ugly.
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嗯,我們所看到的其實十分難看。
11:23
The majority of the countries are standing still or moving backwards,
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大多數國家都沒有改變或開倒車,
11:27
and big countries like Brazil, India, China, Bangladesh
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像是巴西、印度、中國、 孟加拉共和國這些大國
11:30
have all seen significant declines.
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都有明顯的下降。
11:34
This is worrying.
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這很讓人擔心。
11:36
Let's have a look now at inclusiveness.
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現在來看看包容。
11:39
And inclusiveness is looking at things
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包容要看的項目包括
11:41
like violence and discrimination against minorities,
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針對少數族群的暴力和歧視、
11:44
gender equity, LGBT inclusion, etc...
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性別平等、LGBT 包容性等等。
11:47
And as a result, we see that the scores for our big countries are generally lower.
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因此,我們可以看見, 一般來說,大國的分數都比較低。
11:51
Every country, rich and poor alike, is struggling
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每個國家,不論富有或貧窮,
在建立包容社會上,都非常掙扎。
11:54
with building an inclusive society.
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11:56
But what's our direction of travel?
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但我們的方向是什麼?
11:58
Are we building more inclusive countries?
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我們在建立比較有包容性的國家嗎?
12:00
Let's have a look -- progress to 2018.
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咱們來看看——到 2018 年的進展。
12:03
And again we see the world moving backwards:
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同樣的,我們看見 世界正在開倒車:
12:05
most countries static,
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大部分的國家在原地踏步, 許多國家在開倒車——
12:07
a lot of countries going backwards --
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12:09
Bangladesh moving backwards --
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孟加拉共和國在開倒車——
12:11
but also, two of the countries that were leading --
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但,當中有兩個國家在領頭——
12:13
Brazil and the United States --
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巴西和美國——
12:15
have gone backwards significantly
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在過去三年間 開倒車的情況最顯著。
12:17
over the last three years.
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12:19
Let's sum this up now for the world as a whole.
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現在,咱們針對全世界來做個總結。
12:22
And what we see on personal rights for the whole world
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就全世界的個人權利來說, 我們看到的是
12:25
is we're forecasting actually a decline in the score on personal rights
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我們預測個人權利的分數會下降
12:28
to about 60,
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到大約 60 分,
12:30
and then this decline in the score of inclusiveness to about 42.
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接著,包容性的分數 則是下降到約 42 分。
12:35
Now, obviously these things can change quite quickly
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很顯然,隨著權利,
隨著法律的改變、態度的改變,
12:37
with rights and with changes in law, changes in attitudes,
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這些都有可能很快就跟著改變,
12:41
but we have to accept that on current trends,
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但我們得要接受, 依照目前的趨勢,
12:44
this is probably the most worrying aspect of the SDGs.
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這可能是永續發展目標的 各面向中最讓人擔心的一個了。
12:49
How I've depressed you ...
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我讓大家多麼失望啊……(笑聲)
12:51
(Laughter)
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12:52
I hope not because I think what we do see
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我希望沒有, 因為我認為我們看見的是
12:55
is that progress is happening in a lot of places
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在許多地方都看得到進展,
12:58
and there are opportunities for accelerating progress.
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且有機會可以加速進展。
13:01
We are living in a world that is tantalizingly close
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我們現在居住的世界,非常接近
13:05
to ensuring that no one need die of hunger or malaria or diarrhea.
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可以做到確保沒有人會因為
飢餓、瘧疾,或腹瀉而死。
13:11
If we can focus our efforts, mobilize resources,
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如果我們能把我們的 努力聚焦、動用資源、
13:14
galvanize the political will,
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刺激政治意願,
13:16
that step change is possible.
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那麼調整步伐是可能的。
13:19
But in focusing on those really basic, solvable SDGs,
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但當我們聚焦在那些非常基本、 可解決的永續發展目標上時,
13:23
we mustn't forget the whole package.
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我們也不能忘記整套目標。
13:25
The goals are an unwieldy set of indicators, goals and targets,
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這些目標是非常大的一組
指標、目標,和目的,
13:30
but they also include the challenges our world faces.
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但它們也包括了我們的 世界在面臨的挑戰。
13:34
The fact that the SDGs are focusing attention
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永續發展目標的注意力是集中在
13:36
on the fact that we face a crisis in personal rights and inclusiveness
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我們面臨個人權利 和包容性的危機上,
13:41
is a positive.
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這是好事。
13:43
If we forget that,
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如果我們忘了這點,
13:44
if we choose to double down on the SDGs that we can solve,
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如果我們選擇在我們能解決的 永續發展目標上加倍下注,
13:48
if we go for SDG à la carte and pick the most easy SDGs,
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如果我們把各項永續發展目標拆開來,
挑選最容易的目標,
13:54
then we will have missed the point of the SDGs,
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那我們就搞錯了永續發展目標的重點,
13:57
we will miss the goals
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也將會錯失目標,
13:59
and we will have failed on the promise of the SDGs.
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無法完成對於永續發展目標的承諾。
14:03
Thank you.
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謝謝。
14:04
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
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