Sasa Vucinic: Why a free press is the best investment

譯者: Hsing-Yi Fang(方幸意) 審譯者: Shelley Krishna Tsang

Video: Narrator: An event seen from one point of view

影像：旁白：從一個觀點看一個事件，

gives one impression.

讓人產生一種印象，

Seen from another point of view, it gives quite a different impression.

然從另一個觀點看時，又產生一種截然不同的印象。

But it's only when you get the whole picture you can fully understand

唯有看到整體狀況，你才能完整瞭解事件

what's going on.

的進行狀況。

Sasha Vucinic: It's a great clip, isn't it?

沙沙·維奇尼克：它是一部很棒的短片，不是嗎？

And I found that in 29 seconds, it tells more about

我發現這部短片在29秒內所要傳達

the power of, and importance of, independent media

獨立媒體之力量和重要性

than I could say in an hour.

遠比我談一小時的內容還要有力。

So I thought that it will be good to start with it.

所以我認為今天的主題很適合以它做開場。

And also start with a little bit of statistics.

也很適合先來看一些統計資料。

According to relevant researchers, 83 percent of the population of this planet

據相關研究指出，地球上83％的人口

lives in the societies without independent press.

生活在沒有獨立媒體的社會中。

Think about that number: 83 percent of the population on the whole planet

仔細思考這個數字：全球83％的人口

does not really know what is going on in their countries.

並未真確知道他們的國家究竟發生什麼事。

The information they get gets filtered through somebody

他們所得的資訊已經被他人

who either twists that information, or colors that information,

以扭曲、渲染，

does something with it.

或以其它方式過濾了。

So they're deprived of understanding their reality.

因此，他們被剝奪了瞭解事實的權利。

That is just to understand how big and important this problem is.

以上的內容主要讓我們瞭解這個問題有多重大。

Now those of you who are lucky enough to live in those societies

現在在座的各位，是幸運生活在

that represent 17 percent, I think should enjoy it until it lasts.

那17％人口的社會裏， 我認為各位應該在獨立媒體續存時好好享有。

You know, Sunday morning, you flick the paper, get your cappuccino.

你知道嗎？當星期日早晨，你翻閱報紙，品用咖啡，

Enjoy it while it lasts.

在它尚存時好好享受。

Because as we heard yesterday, countries can lose stars from their flags,

因為正如昨天我們得知的，一個國家不但能失去它自己國旗上的星星，

but they can also lose press freedom,

但能失去新聞自由。

as I guess Americans among us can tell us more about.

我想在我們之中的美國朋友們會有很多話要分享，

But that's totally another and separate topic.

但那會完全是另一個話題。

So I can go back to my story.

所以我要回到我自己的故事。

My story starts -- the story I want to share -- starts in 1991.

我要分享的故事始於1991年。

At that time I was running B92, the only independent,

那時我正在經營B92，是整個國家唯一獨立

for that matter the only electronic media, in the country.

更可說是是唯一的電子媒體。

And I guess we were sharing -- we had that regular life of the only

而那時認為我們正在分享的是——我們處在一個國家裏擁有唯一

independent media in the country, operating in hostile environment,

獨立媒體的常態生活——政府欲使你

where government really wants to make your life miserable.

生活處於不幸的敵對環境。

And there are different ways.

它們用不同的方式，

Yeah, it was the usual cocktail:

那是一些慣用的手法：

a little bit of threats, a little bit of friendly advice,

帶著一點威脅，一點友善建議，

a little bit of financial police, a little bit of text control,

一點金融管制，一點文字控制。

so you always have somebody who never leaves your office.

所以總是有這麼一個人從不離開你們的辦公室。

But what they really do, which is very powerful,

但他們真正從事的事情卻是帶來很大的影響，

and that is what governments in the late '90s started doing

而這就是90年代後期政府開始做的事情，

if they don't like independent media companies --

即如果他們不喜歡獨立媒體公司，

you know, they threaten your advertisers.

你知道，他們就威脅你的廣告客戶。

Once they threaten your advertisers, market forces are actually,

一旦他們威脅你的廣告商， 市場力量實際上

you know, destroyed, and the advertisers do not want to come --

你知道，就被摧毀了，廣告主他們不會來了。

no matter how much does it make sense for them --

不管有多少意義及理由應該刊登廣告，

do not want to come and advertise.

他們都不願意，

And you have a problem making ends meet.

而你的生計就會出問題了。

At that time at the beginning of the '90s, we had that problem,

在90年代初期，我們遇到的問題，

which was, you know, survival below one side,

你知道的，一方面是生存，

but what was really painful for me was,

但最讓我痛苦的是，

remember, the beginning of the '90s, Yugoslavia is falling apart.

記得在90年代初期，南斯拉夫正在瓦解。

We were sitting over there with a country in a downfall,

我們在一旁觀望一個國家垮臺，

in a slow-motion downfall.

如慢動作般的垮臺。

And we all had all of that on tapes.

而我們把這所有情形都錄下來。

We had the ability to understand what was going on.

我們有能力瞭解這事件的發展過程。

We were actually recording history.

我們事實上就是在紀錄歷史。

The problem was that we had to re-tape that history a week later;

問題就在一周後，我們要重錄歷史，

because if we did not, we could not afford enough tapes

因為如果不重錄，我們負擔不起足夠的影帶將那段歷史存錄。

to keep archives of that history.

將那段歷史存錄。

So if I gave you that picture, I don't want to go too long on that.

我想給各位這個事件的概況，而不在這件事上多費時間說明。

In that context a gentleman came to my office at that time.

在當時，一位先生來到我的辦公室。

It was still 1991.

當時仍是1991年。

He was running a media systems organization

那位先生在經營一家媒體系統組織，

which is still in business, the gentleman is still in business.

這公司至今仍在營業，這位先生也還在業界。

And what did I know at that time about media systems?

而當時我哪了解媒體系統？

I would think media systems were organizations,

我認為既然是媒體系統，

which means they should help you.

就應該是幫助我們的組織。

So I prepared two plans for that meeting, two strategic plans:

因此我為了當時會議制定兩個策略計畫：

the small one and the big one.

一個小計畫及一個大計畫。

The small one was, I just wanted him

小計畫是：我想讓他

to help us get those damn tapes,

幫我們把那些該死的錄影帶得手，

so we can keep that archive for the next 50 years.

如此讓我們得以把完整的檔案存放50年；

The big plan was to ask him for a 1,000,000-dollar loan.

大的計畫則是向他請求一百萬元的貸款，

Because I thought, I still maintain,

因我當時認為，直到現在也仍認為，

that serious and independent media companies are great business.

嚴肅的獨立媒體公司是很大的事業。

And I thought that B92 will survive and be a great company

此外，B92會存活下去，

once Milosevic is gone, which turned out to be true.

且一旦米洛舍維奇下臺 （後來確事實成真），B92就會成為一家優秀的公司。

It's now probably either the biggest or the second biggest

至今B92可能不是國家最大，也是第二大

media company in the country.

的媒體公司了。

And I thought that the only thing that we needed at that time

我當時認為我們唯一需要的，

was 1,000,000-dollar loan to take us through those hard times.

就是那一百萬元帶領我們度過難關

To make a long story short, the gentleman comes into the office,

長話短說，這位先生進來我們的辦公室，

great suit and tie.

很棒的的西裝領帶。

I gave him what I thought was a brilliant explanation

我給了他當時我自認精采的政治情勢說明，

of the political situation and explained how hard and difficult

述說政治情況將多惡劣，

the war will be.

戰爭會多艱難。

Actually, I underestimated the atrocities, I have to admit.

事實上，我還低估當時暴行的程度，我必須承認。

Anyway, after that whole, big, long explanation,

總之，在一番長篇說明後，

the only question he had for me -- and this is not a joke --

他向我提及唯一的問題是——這不是笑話——

is, are we paying royalties after we broadcast music

我們播放麥克．傑克遜的歌是否

of Michael Jackson?

須支付版權費？

That was really the only question he had.

這的確是他問的唯一一個問題。

He left, and I remember being actually very angry at myself

當他離開後，我記得我很生自己的氣

because I thought there must be an institution in the world

因為我覺得這個世界上肯定有一個

that is providing loans to media companies.

提供貸款給媒體公司的機構。

It's so obvious, straight in your face,

這實在是太顯而易見，

and somebody must have thought of it.

而且一定有人想到

Somebody must have started something like that.

並開啟了先例。

And I thought, I'm just dumb and I cannot find it.

我當時想著：我就是笨，所以我找不到這樣的機構。

You know, in my defense, there was no Google at that time;

不過在我的辯詞，當時還沒有谷歌；

you could not just Google in '91.

91年不能用谷歌搜尋。

So I thought that that's actually my problem.

所以那時真的認為是我自己的問題。

Now we go from here, fast forward to 1995.

現在，我們從這裏快轉到1995年。

I have -- I left the country, I have a meeting with George Soros,

我已經離開那個國家。我要與喬治•索羅斯會面，

trying for the third time to convince him that

並第三次嘗試說服他的基金會應該

his foundation should invest in something that should

投資一個運作

operate like a media bank.

如媒體銀行的機構。

And basically what I was saying is very simple.

基本上我的說明很簡單：

You know, forget about charity; it doesn't work.

你知道，忘掉慈善機構，那是行不通的；

Forget about handouts; 20,000 dollars do not help anybody.

忘掉捐款，兩萬塊並幫不了任何人。

What you should do is you should treat media companies as a business.

你們應該將媒體公司視為商業組織。

It's business anywhere.

現今，商業無所不在。

Media business, or any other business, it needs to be capitalized.

媒體商業如其他商業一樣，都需要資本。

And what these guys need, actually, is access to capital.

他們真正需要的是獲取資本的管道。

So third meeting, arguments are pretty well exercised.

所以這第三次會面，我的論點已經說明很徹底。

At the end of the meeting he says,

會面將結束時他說

look, it is not going to work; you will never see your money back;

“我跟你說，這個主意行不通，你的投資會無法回收。

but my foundations will put 500,000 dollars so you can test the idea.

但是我的基金會給你50萬，讓你驗證這個主意，

See that it will not work.

證明它不會成功。

He said, I'll give you a rope to hang yourself.

他說，“我會給你一條繩讓你上吊。”

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

I knew two things after that meeting.

會後我釐清了兩件事。

First, under no circumstances I want to hang myself.

第一，無論如何我都不會上吊；

And second, that I have no idea how to make it work.

第二，我不知道該如何使我的想法付諸實行。

You see, at the level of a concept, it was a great concept.

從概念的層面來看，這是個很好的概念。

But it's one thing to have a concept;

但是有個好概念是一回事，

it's a totally separate thing to actually make it work.

將其付諸實現又完全是另外一回事。

So I had absolutely no idea how that could actually work.

所以我完全不知道該如何實際執行。

Had the wrong idea; I thought that we can be a bank.

我認為我們可以成為銀行的想法是錯誤的。

You see banks -- I don't know if there are any bankers over here;

你想想銀行——不知道在座的有沒有銀行家，

I apologize in advance -- but it's the best job in the world.

我提前道歉，銀行家確實是世界上最好的工作了。

You know, you find somebody who is respectable

你找一個有名望

and has a lot of money.

又有錢的人，

You give them more money; they repay you that over a time.

你給他更多的錢；他在一段時間內償還給你。

You collect interest and do nothing in between.

在此期間，你什麼都不用做，只收利息。

So I thought, why don't we get into that business?

所以我當時想：為什麼我們不做這種生意？

(Laughter)

（笑聲）

So here we are having our first client, brilliant.

我們的第一個客戶來了。很傑出——

First independent newspaper in Slovakia.

斯洛伐克的第一家獨立報社。

The government cutting them off

政府切斷他們

from all the printing facilities in Bratislava.

在布拉迪斯拉發印刷的任何管道。

So here's the daily newspaper

因此這一份日報，

that has to be printed 400 kilometers away from the capital.

須在離首都400公里外印刷。

It's a daily newspaper with a deadline of 4 p.m.

一份每天下午4點發行的日報。

That means that they have no sports;

這就意味著他們沒有體育新聞，

they have no latest news; circulation goes down.

沒有最新報導，發行量下降。

It's a kind of very nice, sophisticated way

這是一種相當漂亮高明地

how to economically strangle a daily newspaper.

從經濟上扼殺日報生存的方式。

They come to us with a request for a loan.

這家報社向我們尋求貸款。

They want to -- the only way for them to survive

他們存活下去的唯一出路，

is to get a printing press.

目的就是要買一台印刷機——

And we said, that's fine; let's meet;

我們說，好啊，那會個面吧，

you'll bring us your business plan, which eventually they did.

你把你的事業計畫帶來。他們最終拿來了。

We start the meeting.

會議開始時，

I get these two pieces of paper, not like this, A4 format,

我拿著兩張紙，不是像A4這樣的紙，

so it's much bigger.

是還要大很多。

A lot of numbers there. A lot of numbers.

上面有很多數字，很多數字。

But however you put it, you know, the numbers

但是不管你怎麼解讀，這些數字

do not make any sense.

並未表示意義。

And that's the best they could do.

而這是他們最多能做的程度。

We were the best that they could do.

他們真的只能做到這個程度。

So that is how we understood what our method is.

因此我們去了解我們的方法為何。

It's not a bank. We had to actually

它不是銀行。我們必須真正

go into these companies and earn our return

深入這些公司

by fixing them -- by establishing management systems,

藉解決問題以獲取報酬，如建置管理系統

by providing all that knowledge, how do you run a business

及提供商業運作知識

on one side -- while they all know how to run, how to create content.

——而他們精通的是如何運作及創造內容。

Just quickly on the results.

很快說明我們的結果。

Over these 10 years, 40 million dollars in affordable financing,

超過這10年內， 4千萬元資金的可貸範圍，

average interest rate five percent to six percent.

平均利息5％到6％。

Lately we are going wild, charging seven percent from time to time.

最近我們有些瘋狂：有時候我們索價7％的利息。

We do it in 17 countries of the developing world.

我們在17個開發中國家運作。

And here is the most stunning number.

下面是最驚人的數字。

Return rate -- the one that Soros was so worried about -- 97 percent.

報酬率——也是索羅斯所擔心的——97％。

97 percent of all the scheduled repayments came back to us on time.

97％還款按期準時回來。

What do we typically finance?

我們一般提供融資給那些項目？

We finance anything that a media company would need,

我們提供融資給一家體公司所需要的任何東西，

from printing presses to transmitters.

從印刷流程到傳輸。

What is most important is we do it

最重要的是我們融資的形式

either in form of loans, equities, lease --

—— 貸款、入股、或租賃——

whatever is appropriate for, you know, supporting anybody.

無論你適合何種形式，我們都支持。

But what is most important here is, who do we finance?

但最重要的是，我們融資給誰？

We believe that in the last 10 years companies

我相信過去10年內

that we've financed are actually the best media companies

我們融資的公司，事實上是開發中國家裏最好的媒體公司。

in the developing world.

最好的媒體公司。

That is a "Who is Who" list.

有這麼一個“名人錄”。

And I could spend hours talking about them,

有關他們的故事我可以花上幾個小時談，

because they're all kind of heroes.

因為他們某種程度上都可以稱是英雄。

And I can, but I'll give you just, maybe one,

而我或許就講一個我們自己接觸的例子，

and depending on time I may give you two examples

視時間而定，我可以提供給大家

who we work with.

與我們一起工作的兩個例子。

You see we started working in Eastern and Central Europe,

你可以看到我們起初在東歐和中歐運作，

and moved to Russia.

之後轉移俄國。

Our first loan in Russia was in Chelyabinsk.

我們在俄羅斯的第一份貸款是在車裏阿賓斯克州。

I'll bet half of you have never heard of that place.

我敢打賭在座有一半沒有聽過那個地方。

In the south of Russia there's a guy called

在俄羅斯南部，有一個叫

Boris Nikolayevich Kirshin, who is running

伯利斯•尼古拉斯維奇的人，

an independent newspaper there.

在那兒辦獨立報紙。

The city was closed until early '90s

這城市直到90年代初前都是封閉的。

because, of all things, they were producing glass for Tupolev planes.

他們在為托波力飛機生產玻璃。

Anyway, he's running independent newspaper there.

總之，他在那裏辦獨立報紙。

After two years working with us, he becomes

與我們一起工作兩年後，他的報紙

the most respected newspaper in that small place.

為當地聲望最高。

Governor comes to him one day,

有一天總督來找他，

actually invites him to come to his office.

事實上是請他去總督辦公室。

He goes and sees the governor. The governor says,

他去見總督。總督說：

Boris Nikolayevich, I understand you are doing a great job,

伯利斯•尼古拉斯維奇，我知道你辦報辦得很好，

and you are the most respected newspaper in our district.

也是我們區裏最有聲望的。

And I want to offer you a deal.

我想跟你作筆交易。

Can you please give me your newspaper for the next nine months,

之後九個月裏，請你將報紙交給我辦，

because I have elections --

因為我有選舉

there are elections coming up in nine months.

九個月後有選舉。

I will not run, but it's very important for me

我不參選，但是我很重視

who is going to succeed me.

由誰繼任我。

So give me the paper for nine months. I'll give it back to you.

所以你把報紙交給我九個月，我會再還給你，

I have no interest in being in media business.

我沒興趣待在媒體業裡。

How much would that cost?

你想出價多少？

Boris Nikolayevich says, "It's not for sale."

伯利斯•尼古拉斯維奇說：“報社不賣。”

The governor says, "We will close you."

總督說：“我要把你的報社關了。”

Boris Nikolayevich says, "No, you cannot do it."

伯利斯•尼古拉斯維奇說：“你關不了。”

Six months later the newspaper was closed.

六個月後報社被關掉。

Luckily, we had enough time to help Boris Nikolayevich

幸好我們有足夠的時間幫助伯利斯•尼古拉斯維奇

take all the assets out of that company and bring him into a new one,

把原來公司的資產帶到新公司，

to get all the subscription lists, rehire staff.

並把訂閱名單弄到手，重新僱用員工。

So what the governor got was an empty shell.

最後總督得到的只是一個空殼。

But that is what happens if you're in business of independent media,

然而處於獨立媒體業裏

and if you are a banker for independent media.

當獨立媒體業的銀行家 就是如此發生。

So it sounds like a great story.

因此聽起來這是個很了不起的故事。

Somewhere down the road we opened a media management center.

一段時間後，我們開了一家媒體管理中心，

We started our media lab, sounds like a real great story.

創立媒體實驗室，這聽起來很棒。

But there is a second angle to that.

但這裡有第二個角度去看事情，

The second angle, like in this clip.

但是從第二個個角度來看，就像那部短片一樣，

If you take the camera above, you start thinking

另一個角度就是 當你用攝像機，你開始再想想

about these numbers again.

那些數字。

40 million dollars over 10 years spread over 17 countries.

超過10年的時間4千萬元分散至17個國家裏。

That is not too much, is it?

那並不很多，是不是？

It's actually just a drop in the sea.

其實這是杯水車薪。

Because when you think about the importance,

因為當你考慮到問題的重要性時—

some of the issues that we were talking about last night --

當中有些議題是昨晚我們討論的，

this last session we had about Africa and his

比如上一回關於非洲的演講及

hypothetical 50 billion dollars destined for Africa.

假設輸送給非洲的500億元。

All of those, not all, half of those problems mentioned last night --

昨晚所有的問題，至少有一半的問題

government accountability, corruption, how do you fight corruption,

—— 政府責任，腐敗，如何對抗腐敗，

giving voice to unheard, to poor --

給底層人、窮人發聲的機會— —

it's why independent media is in business.

這就是為什麼獨立媒體有市場，

And it's why it was invented.

會被創造。

So from that perspective, what we did is just really

所以從此觀點來看，獨立媒體這麼大的市場需求 ，

one drop in the sea of that need that we can identify.

我們做的真的僅是冰山一角。

Now ours is just one story.

我們的故事僅是其中一個小故事。

I'm sure that in this room there are, like, 15 other wonderful stories

我相信在這個房間裡，有其他15個

of nonprofits doing spectacular work.

非營利組織的精采經營故事。

Here is where the problem is,

而這就是問題所在，

and I'll explain to you as well as I can what the problem is.

我向大家解釋問題到底是什麼。

And it's called fundraising.

這問題就是籌資。

Imagine that this third of this room is filled

假設這間屋子有三分之一坐滿了

with people who represent different foundations.

不同基金會的代表。

Imagine two thirds over here running excellent organizations,

另外三分之二則是運作優秀的組織，

doing very important work.

做著非常重要的工作。

Now imagine that every second person over here

現在想像這邊每兩人有一人

is deaf, does not hear, and switch the lights off.

是耳聾，聽不見，然後把屋裡的電燈關了，

Now that is how difficult it is to match people

把房間這邊的人配對

from this side of the room

給這房間另一邊的人

with people of that side of the room.

之困難就是如此。

So we thought that some kind of a big idea is needed

因此我們認為需要大創意

to reform, to totally rethink fundraising.

進行改革、重新思考籌資。

You know, instead of people running in this dark,

不讓人們在黑暗中

trying to find their own match, who will be willing,

盲目尋找

who has the same goals.

志同

Instead of all of that we thought there is --

道合的對象。

something new needs to be invented.

此新的運作方式必須發展，

And we came up with this idea of issuing bonds,

因我們想出發行債券的主意、新聞自由債券。

press freedom bonds.

新聞自由債券。

If there are investors willing to finance

如果有投資者願為

U.S. government budget deficit,

美國政府預算赤字融資，

why wouldn't we find investors willing to finance

難道我們找不到願為

press freedom deficit?

“新聞自由赤字” 投資的人嗎？

We've decided to do it this fall; we will issue them,

我們已經決定今年秋天開始進行，

probably in denominations of 1,000 dollars.

預計是面值1000元的債券。

I don't want to advertise them too much; that's not the point.

我不想在這兒打太多廣告，這不是演講的重點。

But the point is, if we ever survive to actually issue them,

重點是，如果我們能真正生存去發行債券，

find enough investors that this can be considered a success,

找到足夠的投資者而使其成功，

there's nothing stopping the next organization

說不定另一個組織

to start to issue bonds next spring.

明年春天就開始發行債券，

And those can be environmental bonds.

他們發行可能是環境債券。

And then two weeks later, Iqbal Quadir can issue his

可能再過兩個星期，伊克柏•卡迪爾開始

electricity in Bangladesh bonds.

在孟加拉發行電力債券。

And before you know it, any social cause

無形之中，任何一個社會性原因

can be actually financed in this way.

都可以找到融資的方法。

Now we do daydreaming in 11:30 with 55 seconds left.

現在是11：30我們還有55秒的時間做白日夢。

But let's take the idea further.

讓我們進一步思考這個想法。

You do it, you start it in the States, because it's,

我們在美國開始進行，因為這些

you know, concepts are very, very close to American minds.

概念很貼近美國人的思維。

But you can actually bring it to Europe, too.

然而你也完全可以把它帶到歐洲，

You can bring it to Asia.

帶到亞洲去實行。

You can, once you have all of those different points,

當你擁有這些地方之所有不同觀點都在實行時，

you can make it easy for investors.

你就可以讓投資變得更簡易。

Put all of those bonds at one place

把這些債券放在一起，

and they sit down and click.

讓投資者坐下來點擊。

Once you have more than 10 of them

若達超過10種債券時，

you have to develop some kind of a matrix.

你必須發展一些模型。

What do investors get?

投資者從中獲得什麼？

On one side financial, on the other side social.

一方面是經濟利益，一方面是社會影響力。

So that brings the idea of some kind of rating agency,

由此產生了類似

Morningstar type.

晨星的評級機構想法。

It says, you know, social impact over here is spectacular, five stars.

如社會影響力在這邊很重要，給五個星。

Financial, they give you one percent, only one star.

經濟回報僅1％，只給一個星。

Now take it to the last step.

再把這個概念帶到到最後一步，

Once you have all of that put together,

一旦這些條件齊全了，

there's not one reason why you couldn't actually have

就沒有理由不能設立

a marketplace for all of that,

一家交易場所，

where you cannot dispose of all of those bonds in a pretty quick way.

能很快地進行債券處理

And in that way you organize the financing

及組織所要的融資

so there are no dark rooms, no blind people

如此一來交易就不會有黑房間，

running around to find each other.

無人盲目地相互找尋對方了，

Thank you.

謝謝。