Antony Gormley: Sculpted space, within and without

Translator: Joseph Geni Reviewer: Morton Bast

翻译人员: Yifan Wu 校对人员: Wei Wu

I'm going to tell you about why I became a sculptor,

我要告诉你们我成为雕塑家的缘由。

and you may think that sculptors,

你们可能会认为雕塑家，

well, they deal with meta, they deal with objects,

他们与元要素，与物质，

they deal with bodies,

还有与人体打交道，

but I think, really, what I care about most

但是我觉得，我真正最在乎的是

is making space, and that's what I've called this talk:

构造空间，而且我也把这个演讲命名为：

Making Space.

构造空间。

Space that exists within us,

空间存在于我们的生活中

and without us.

也存在于其以外

So, when I was a child,

在我还是个孩子的时候，

I don't know how many of you grew up in the '50s,

我不知道你们当中多少人是50年代长大的，

but I was sent upstairs for an enforced rest. (Laughter)

但是我曾经被迫上楼午休。（笑声）

It's a really bad idea. I mean, after lunch, you're, you know,

那真的不是个好主意。我是说，吃了午饭，你知道，

you're six, and you want to go and climb a tree.

一个6岁小孩，本应该想去爬树。

But I had to go upstairs, this tiny little room

但是我得上楼去，回到我狭小的房间，

that was actually made out of an old balcony,

其实是旧阳台改的，

so it was incredibly hot, small and light,

所以又热又狭小，而且太过于明亮

and I had to lie there. It was ridiculous.

我还必须得躺在那儿——这真是荒唐

But anyway, for some reason, I promised myself

不管怎么说，出于一些原因

that I wasn't going to move,

我下决心不动弹

that I was going to do this thing that Mummy

因为妈妈吩咐的事

wanted me to do.

我要做到

And there I was, lying there in this tiny space,

然后我就在那个小地方躺着，

hot, dark, claustrophobic, matchbox-sized, behind my eyes,

在我印象里，这地方又热，又黑，幽闭，只有火柴盒那么大

but it was really weird, like, after this went on

但是很奇怪，当我坚持午睡

for days, weeks, months, that space would get bigger

过了几天，几周，几个月，那个空间居然变大了，

and darker and cooler

变暗了，也凉快了。

until I really looked forward to that half an hour

最后我居然开始期待每天那半个小时的

of enforced immobility and rest,

强迫午睡休息

and I really looked forward to going to that place

而且我真的很想去那个地方呆着

of darkness.

到那片黑暗之中

Do you mind if we do something completely different?

介不介意咱们做些与众不同的事？

Can we all just close our eyes for a minute?

请大家闭眼一分钟

Now, this isn't going to be freaky.

不会有什么恐怖的事发生

It isn't some cultic thing. (Laughter)

也不是什么宗教仪式（笑声）

It's just, it's just, I just would like us all to go there.

我只想带着你们一起体会那种感觉

So I'm going to do it too. We'll all be there together.

所有我也会闭上眼。让我们一起来体会

So close your eyes for a minute.

现在请大家闭上眼

Here we are, in a space,

我们现在所在的这个空间

the subjective, collective space of the darkness of the body.

是黑暗的主观公共空间

I think of this as the place of imagination,

我认为这是想象力驰骋的空间

of potential,

是蕴含潜力的空间

but what are its qualities?

但是它有什么特点呢？

It is objectless. There are no things in it.

这里空无一物，其中什么也没有

It is dimensionless. It is limitless.

这里无边无垠，没有任何界限

It is endless.

这里无穷无尽。

Okay, open your eyes.

好啦，睁开眼吧。

That's the space that I think sculpture --

这个空间就是我认为雕塑－

which is a bit of a paradox, sculpture that is about

这有点矛盾，雕塑是在

making material propositions --

提出物质命题－

but I think that's the space

但是我认为那就是一个空间，

that sculpture can connect us with.

它能通过雕刻将我们联系起来。

So, imagine we're in the middle of America.

所以，想象我们在美洲中部。

You're asleep. You wake up,

你在熟睡。你醒来，

and without lifting your head from the earth

而且不用把头从地上抬起来

on your sleeping bag, you can see for 70 miles.

从你的睡袋上，你能看到70英里远的地方。

This is a dry lake bed.

这是一个干河床。

I was young. I'd just finished art school.

我那时还年轻，刚从艺术学校毕业。

I wanted to do something that was working

我想做一些直接和世界对话的工作，

directly with the world, directly with place.

直接和空间对话的工作。

This was a wonderful place, because it was a place

这是一个极好的地方，因为它是那种

where you could imagine that you were the

你可以尽情想象

first person to be there.

自己是第一个涉足那里的人

It was a place where nothing very much had happened.

它是那种没发生过什么事情的地方。

Anyway, bear with me.

不管怎么说，再忍受我一下。

I picked up a hand-sized stone,

我拾起一个拳头大小的石头，

threw it as far as I was able,

使劲地扔出去

it was about 22 meters.

大概扔了22米远

I then cleared all the stones within that radius

然后我捡起这个范围内的所有石头

and made a pile.

堆成一堆。

And that was the pile, by the way.

这就是那堆石头

And then, I stood on the pile,

然后，我站在石头堆上，

and threw all of those rocks out again,

把所有石头又扔出去了，

and here is rearranged desert.

然后这里变成了一个格局不同的沙漠。

You could say, well, it doesn't look very different

你可能会说，嗯，看起来和他开始的时候

from when he started.

没什么不一样。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

What's all the fuss about?

如此折腾究竟是为什么？

In fact, Chris was worried and said,

其实，Chris担心地说，

"Look, don't show them that slide,

“你看，不要给他们展示那页，

because they're just going to think you're another one of

因为他们会认为你是那种

those crazy modern artists who doesn't do much.

疯狂却光说不练的现代艺术家。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

But the fact is, this is evidence

但是事实是，这是一个

of a living body on other bodies,

生命体在其他生命体上的证据，

rocks that have been the subject of geological formation,

石头由地质变迁形成，

erosion, the action of time on objects.

腐蚀是时间作用在事物上的证据

This is a place, in a way, that I just

这个地方

would like you to, in a way, look at differently

我希望你们能用不同的角度来看待，

because of this event that has happened in it,

因为在这里发生的事情，

a human event,

是一个人类主导的事件

and in general, it just asks us to look again

一般情况下，它只是要我们来重新审视

at this world, so different from, in a way,

这个世界

the world that we have been sharing with each other,

它与我们共同生活熟知的世界是如此不同，

the technological world,

技术的世界

to look again at the elemental world.

再看看元素的世界。

The elemental world that we all live in is that space

我们都生活在元素的世界

that we all visited together, the darkness of the body.

是我们一起拜访的黑暗空间。

I wanted to start again with that environment,

我想重新从环境开始，

the environment of the intimate, subjective space

这个亲密、 主观的空间环境

that each of us lives in, but from the other side

我们每个人都生活在这个空间中

of appearance.

但我要从外部观察这个空间

So here is a daily activity of the studio.

所以这里有一个工作室的日常活动。

You can see I don't do much. I'm just standing there,

你们看到我不太忙，只需要站在那里

again with my eyes closed, and other people

同样闭上眼睛

are molding me, evidential.

而其他人在塑造我存在的证据

This is an indexical register of a lived moment

这是一个为时间中的实体鲜活存在的一刻

of a body in time.

而做成的一个索引登记

Can we map that space, using the language of neutrinos

我们可以用微子的语言来为这个空间绘制地图

or cosmic rays, taking the bounding condition of the body

或者用宇宙射线，以约束条件作为限制

as its limit, but in complete reversal of, in a way,

但从某种意义上

the most traditional Greek idea of pointing?

对最传统的希腊观点的“指示”是一种完全的逆转？

In the old days they used to take a lump of Pentelic marble

旧时代，人们采到一块大理石

and drill from the surface in order to identify the skin,

在表面钻孔来确定表层

the appearance,

确定外观

what Aristotle defined as the distinction

亚里士多德称之为

between substance and appearance,

物质与表象间的区别

the thing that makes things visible,

让事物可见的关键

but here we're working from the other side.

但我们从反面来做

Or can we do it as an exclusive membrane?

或者说，我们是否能做出一张独一无二的膜？

This is a lead case made around the space

这是铅制容器，包围了我身体所占据的那个空间

that my body occupied, but it's now void.

现在它是空的

This is a work called "Learning To See."

这个作品的名字是“学习去看”

It's a bit of, well, we could call it night,

它有点……我们可以称之为夜，

we could call it the 96 percent of gravity

我们可以称它为 96%的重力

that we don't know about, dark matter,

关于空间中未知的暗物质

placed in space, anyway, another version of a human space

这是人类存在于空间的另一个版本

in space at large, but I don't know if you can see,

我不知道你们是否注意到

the eyes are indicated, they're closed.

眼睛自身表明，它们是闭着的。

It's called "Learning To See" because it's about an object

它被叫做“学习去看”，因为这是关于一个

that hopefully works reflexively and talks about that

自反指代的物体，是一种幻想

vision or connection with the darkness of the body

是与黑暗的一种联系

that I see as a space of potential.

在这个我觉得充满潜力的空间中

Can we do it another way, using the language

我们能不能用另外一种方法

of particles around a nucleus, and talk about the body

用原子核周边粒子的语言

as an energy center?

来探讨作为一个能量中心的人体？

No longer about statues, no longer having to take that

无关乎雕像，无关乎站立的责任，

duty of standing, the standing of a human body,

无关乎人的矗立，

or the standing of a statue, release it,

或是雕塑的矗立，放开它

allow it to be an energy field, a space in space

让他成为一个能量场，一个在空间之中

that talks about human life, between becoming an entropy

讨论人类生命的空间，在成为熵

as a sort of concentration of attention,

它是一种注意的集合，

a human place of possibility in space at large.

和在整个空间中人类位置的可能性。

Is there another way?

有没有另外一种形式？

Dark matter now placed against a horizon.

暗物质现在被用来对抗视野

If minds live in bodies, if bodies live in clothes,

如果思想在身体中，身体在衣服中，

and then in rooms, and then in buildings,

衣服在房间中，房间在大楼中，

and then in cities, do they also have a final skin,

大楼在城市中，它们有最终的表层吗，

and is that skin perceptual?

这表层能感知到吗？

The horizon.

视野

And is art about

艺术是关于

trying to imagine what lies beyond the horizon?

试图想象视野之外有什么的吗？

Can we use, in a way, a body as an empty catalyst

我们能否用身体作为一种空催化剂

for a kind of empathy with the experience

为活的空间-时间的经验产生共鸣，

of space-time as it is lived, as I am standing here

就像我正站在你们面前

in front of you trying to feel and make a connection

试图感受和连接

in this space-time that we are sharing,

我们正在分享的时间空间，

can we use, at it were, the memory of a body,

我们能否用身体曾经的记忆，

of a human space in space to catalyze

空间中的人类空间去催化

an experience, again, firsthand experience,

一种经验，重申一下，是第一手的经验

of elemental time.

是元素时间的。

Human time, industrial time, tested against

人类时间，工业时间，用来检验

the time of the tides, in which these memories

时间的流动，在其中某个

of a particular body, that could be any body,

特定躯体的这些记忆，有可能是任何人的，

multiplied as in the time of mechanical reproduction,

成倍的像在机械的再生产的时间中

many times, placed over three square miles,

很多倍，放置在超过三平方英里，

a mile out to sea,

一英里外是海，

disappearing, in different conditions of day and night.

在不同的日夜条件中消失。

You can see this work. It's on the mouth of the Mersey,

你能看到这个工作。它在摩西河口

just outside Liverpool.

恰好在利物浦外。

And there you can see what a Liverpool sea looks like

在那里你可以看到利物浦河是什么样的

on a typical afternoon.

在一个特定的午后。

The pieces appear and disappear,

碎片出现又消失

but maybe more importantly --

但是也许更重要的是

this is just looking north from the center of the installation --

这仅仅从装置的中心往北看

they create a field, a field that involves

他们创造了一个场，这场涉及到

living and the surrogate bodies in a kind of relation,

活的和有某种联系的替代的躯体，

a relation with each other and a relation with that limit,

这是一种相互关联的联系，而且是一种有限制的联系，

the edge, the horizon.

边缘，视野。

Just moving on, is it possible,

继续，有无可能

taking that idea of mind, body, body-building,

用思想，躯体，身体构造的观点，

to supplant the first body,

来替代第一个躯体

the biological body, with the second,

生物上的躯体。第二个，

the body of architecture and the built environment.

建筑的躯体和环境的建构。

This is a work called "Room for the Great Australian Desert."

这被称作“大澳大利亚沙漠的空间。”

It's in an undefined location

它在一个未定义的位置

and I've never published where it is.

而且我从未公布过它在哪。

It's an object for the mind.

它是心灵的对象。

I think of it as a 21st-century Buddha.

我认为他是21世纪的佛

Again, the darkness of the body,

再次重申，躯体的黑暗，

now held within this bunker shape

嵌在沙坑的形状中

of the minimum position that a body needs to occupy,

它是躯体能占有的最小位置

a crouching body.

一个蜷缩的躯体

There's a hole at the anus, penis level.

在肛门和生殖器的位置有个洞。

There are holes at ears. There are no holes at the eyes.

耳朵上有洞。眼睛上没有洞。

There's a slot for the mouth. It's two and a half inches thick,

嘴里有个水池。有2.5英尺深，

concrete with a void interior.

由空的内部构成

Again, a site found with a completely flat

这里能看到完全平坦

360-degree horizon.

且360°视野无阻

This is just simply asking, again,

现在简单的问一下，

as if we had arrived for the first time,

好像我们第一次到达，

what is the relationship of the human project

人类工程与时间-空间的关系

to time and space?

是什么？

Taking that idiom of, as it were,

用那句老话，

the darkness of the body transferred to architecture,

躯体的黑暗转化成了建筑，

can you use architectural space not for living

你能不用建筑空间去生活

but as a metaphor,

但只作为隐喻，

and use its systolic, diastolic

用它的收缩压，舒张压

smaller and larger spaces to provide a kind of

更小和更大的空间来提供一种

firsthand somatic narrative for a journey through space,

第一手的体叙事用于穿越空间

light and darkness?

光明和黑暗的旅行？

This is a work of some proportion and some weight

这是一项作品，它的某些部分和某些质量

that makes the body into a city, an aggregation of cells

使它的躯体成为成为城市的一部分，是细胞的聚合

that are all interconnected

它们都内部相关联

and that allow certain visual access

且允许特定的视觉进入

at certain places.

在特定的位置

The last work that I just wanted to share with you

最后一个我想与大家分享的作品是

is "Blind Light," which is perhaps

“盲光”，这也许是

the most open work,

最开放的作品，

and in a conference of radical openness,

在一个异常开放的会议中，

I think maybe this is as radical as I get,

我能想到的也就只有异常

using light and water vapor as my materials.

用光和水蒸气作我的材料

Here is a box

这有个盒子

filled at one and a half atmospheres of atmospheric pressure,

装了1.5大气压的大气

with a cloud and with very bright light.

用云和很亮的光。

As you walk towards the ever-open threshold,

当你走向那个永远开放的门槛，

you disappear, both to yourselves and to others.

对你和他人来说，你消失了。

If you hold your hand out in front of you,

如果你把手放在你的面前，

you can't see it.

你看不见。

If you look down, you can't see your feet.

如果你向下看，你看不见你的脚。

You are now consciousness without an object,

你现在有了没有一个物质的意识，

freed from the dimensionful

没有维度

and measured way in which life links us

且能够测量生活将我们与

to the obligatory.

责任联系起的方式

But this is a space that is actually filled with people,

但是这确实是一个充满了人的空间，

disembodied voices,

无形的声音，

and out of that ambient environment,

且在周围环境之外，

when people come close to your own body zone,

当人们靠近你的身体地带，

very close, they appear to you as representations.

非常接近，他们对于你就像表征。

When they appear close to the edge,

当他们接近边缘时，

they are representations, representations in which

他们就是表征，表征

the viewers have become the viewed.

在观望者眼中是可视的。

For me, art is not about objects of high monetary exchange.

对我来说，艺术不是高价买卖的物品。

It's about reasserting our firsthand experience

它是确立我们的第一手经验

in present time.

在此时。

As John Cage said,

正如约翰 · 凯奇所说，

"We are not moving towards some kind of goal.

"我们并没有走向某种目标。

We are at the goal, and it is changing with us.

我们达到了目标，而它则随着我们变化。

If art has any purpose, it is to open our eyes to that fact."

艺术的目的就在于睁眼看清这个事实

Thank you very much.

谢谢。

(Applause)

（掌声）