Milton Glaser: How great design makes ideas new

翻译人员: Liang He 校对人员: Amy Zerotus

'Theme and variations' is one of those forms that

主题和变体是一种

require a certain kind of intellectual activity,

需要特定智力活动参与的形式。

because you are always comparing the variation

因为你总是在把变体和

with the theme that you hold in your mind.

已经存在于你脑海中的主题作比较。

You might say that the theme is nature

你也许会说主题是自然

and everything that follows is a variation on the subject.

与它相关的一切是这一主题的变体。

I was asked, I guess about six years ago,

我想大概是6年前，我被邀请

to do a series of paintings

创作一系列某种程度上是为

that in some way would celebrate the birth of Piero della Francesca.

皮耶罗•德拉•弗朗切斯卡庆生的绘画。

And it was very difficult for me to imagine

我很难想象

how to paint pictures that were based on Piero

该如何基于皮耶罗来做画

until I realized that I could look at Piero as nature --

后来我意识到我可以把他作为自然来看待。

that I would have the same attitude towards looking at Piero della Francesca

也就是说我在欣赏皮耶罗·德拉·弗朗切斯卡时

as I would if I were looking out a window at a tree.

就如同观赏窗外一棵普通的大树一般。

And that was enormously liberating to me.

这极大的解放了我，

Perhaps it's not a very insightful observation,

也许那并不是一种很透彻的观察，

but that really started me on a path to be able to do a kind of theme and variations

但是它真正地让我开始能够创造一些主题和变体。

based on a work by Piero,

根据皮耶罗的一幅作品，

in this case that remarkable painting that's in the Uffizi, "The Duke of Montefeltro,"

这里所说的是在乌菲兹的伟大画作——《蒙特菲尔特罗公爵》，

who faces his consort, Battista.

画中的他正面朝着他的夫人巴蒂斯塔。

Once I realized that I could take some liberties with the subject,

自从我意识到自己可以顺心所欲的围绕这一主题创造时，

I did the following series of drawings.

我完成了以下一系列的图画。

That's the real Piero della Francesca --

这是真实的皮耶罗•德拉•弗朗切斯。

one of the greatest portraits in human history.

它是人类历史上伟大的头像之一。

And these, I'll just show these without comment.

这些我将不做任何评说。

It's just a series of variations on the head of the Duke of Montefeltro,

它只是一系列的蒙特菲尔特罗公爵头像的变体，

who's a great, great figure in the Renaissance,

蒙特菲尔特罗公爵在文艺复兴时期是一位很了不起的人物，

and probably the basis for Machiavelli's "The Prince."

而且很可能是马基雅维利的作品《王子》的原型。

He apparently lost an eye in battle,

他在战争中失去了一只眼睛，

which is why he is always shown in profile.

这是为什么他总是以侧面示人。

And this is Battista.

这是巴蒂斯塔。

And then I decided I could move them around a little bit --

后来我想我可以稍微地把他们移动一下。

so that for the first time in history, they're facing the same direction.

这样在历史上他们第一次面向了同一个方向。

Whoops! Passed each other.

哎呀！他们错过了。

And then a visitor from another painting by Piero,

这是来自皮耶罗另一幅画作的访客，

this is from "The Resurrection of Christ" --

他来自“基督复活”，

as though the cast had just gotten of the set to have a chat.

这样就好像他们要开始聊天。

And now, four large panels:

现在是四大面板。

this is upper left;

这是左上角部分。

upper right;

右上角部分。

lower left;

左下角部分。

lower right.

右下角部分。

Incidentally, I've never understood the conflict between abstraction and naturalism.

顺便提一句，我从未理解抽象主义与自然主义之间的冲突，

Since all paintings are inherently abstract to begin with

因为所有的绘画本质上都是源于抽象

there doesn't seem to be an argument there.

没有什么可争论的。

On another subject --

又有一次，

(Laughter) --

（笑声）

I was driving in the country one day with my wife,

有一天我和妻子在乡下开着车，

and I saw this sign,

我看到了一个标志，

and I said, "That is a fabulous piece of design."

说：“那是不错的设计。”

And she said, "What are you talking about?"

而她却问道：“你在说什么？”

I said, "Well, it's so persuasive,

我说：“嗯，这很有说服力，

because the purpose of that sign is to get you into the garage,

因为这个标志的目的就是要让你去车库，

and since most people are so suspicious of garages,

而由于大部分人都是不放心车库这种地方，

and know that they're going to be ripped off,

认为自己会被宰，

they use the word 'reliable.'

所以他们用了“可靠的”这个词汇。

But everybody says they're reliable.

但每个人都可以说他们很可靠。

But, reliable Dutchman" --

但是，可靠的荷兰人~

(Laughter) --

（笑声）

"Fantastic!"

好极了！

Because as soon as you hear the word Dutchman --

因为一旦你听到Dutchman这个词——

which is an archaic word, nobody calls Dutch people "Dutchmen" anymore --

那是一个不再被用来称呼荷兰人的古老词汇——

but as soon as you hear Dutchman,

当你听到这个词，

you get this picture of the kid with his finger in the dike,

你会联想到有一个小孩将手指放在堤坝中

preventing the thing from falling and flooding Holland, and so on.

为了防止堤坝脱落并淹没荷兰而之类的画面。

And so the entire issue is detoxified by the use of "Dutchman."

因此整件事由于“Dutchman”的使用而更加清晰。

Now, if you think I'm exaggerating at all in this,

如果你们现在认为我是在夸张的话，

all you have to do is substitute something else, like "Indonesian."

可以试试将印度人之类的其它词语来代替荷兰人。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Or even "French."

甚至可以是法国人。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Now, "Swiss" works, but you know it's going to cost a lot of money.

当然瑞士人也行，但你知道那会花很多钱。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

I'm going to take you quickly through the actual process of doing a poster.

我将要带领你们快速地过一遍创作海报的真实过程。

I do a lot of work for the School of Visual Arts, where I teach,

我为我所从教的视觉艺术学院做了很多工作，

and the director of this school -- a remarkable man named Silas Rhodes --

一位非常出色的叫做西拉斯罗德的校长

often gives you a piece of text and he says, "Do something with this."

经常给你一小段文字然后说：“用它做点什么吧。”

And so he did.

他确实这么做了。

And this was the text -- "In words as fashion the same rule will hold/

这就是那一小段文字——“就时尚来说存在着同样的道理/

Alike fantastic if too new or old/

无论过于新颖或是陈旧都是同样出色的/

Be not the first by whom the new are tried/

不要成为第一个尝试新颖的人/

Nor yet the last to lay the old aside."

也不要成为最后抛弃陈旧的人。“

I could make nothing of that.

我当时没有任何想法。

And I really struggled with this one.

然后我确确实实很努力地去创作。

And the first thing I did, which was sort of in the absence of another idea,

我做的第一幅作品，还缺乏些创意，

was say I'll sort of write it out and make some words big,

可以看出我只是把它写出来并将一些词语加大而已，

and I'll have some kind of design on the back somehow,

同时在背景做了点设计，

and I was hoping -- as one often does -- to stumble into something.

我期望，正如人们经常希望的那样，能够碰巧创造出些什么。

So I took another crack at it --

因此我又创作了另一幅，将它分裂了一些，

you've got to keep it moving --

你必须继续努力。

and I Xeroxed some words on pieces of colored paper

我在彩色纸上打印了几个字

and I pasted them down on an ugly board.

把它们粘在一个丑陋的板子上

I thought that something would come out of it,

我认为某种东西一定会浮现出来，

like "Words rule fantastic new old first last Pope"

比如”词语 规则 奇妙的 新的 旧的 第一 最后 罗马教皇 “

because it's by Alexander Pope,

因为这是亚历山大蒲柏写的，

but I sort of made a mess out of it,

但是我将它搞得有些混乱了，

and then I thought I'd repeat it in some way so it was legible.

后来我认为应该重新整理它，这样才能清晰。

So, it was going nowhere.

因此，我陷入了僵局。

Sometimes, in the middle of a resistant problem,

有时候在解决一个顽固的问题期间，

I write down things that I know about it.

我会记录下我对它所了解的一起，

But you can see the beginning of an idea there,

而你能够从中发现一些想法的开端，

because you can see the word "new" emerging from the "old."

因为你会发现单词”new“从”old“中浮现出来，

That's what happens.

这就是事实。

There's a relationship between the old and the new;

在”old“和”new“之间存在某种关系，

the new emerges from the context of the old.

”new“从”old“的包围中浮现出来。

And then I did some variations of it,

后来我对它做了一些改变，

but it still wasn't coalescing graphically at all.

但是它在图形上仍然有些不是衔接的很好。

I had this other version which had something interesting about it

我另有一个比较有趣的版本，

in terms of being able to put it together in your mind from clues.

它能够将所有提示汇聚到一起形成于你脑中。

The W was clearly a W, the N was clearly an N,

这里的”W“显然是”W“，"N"显示是”N“

even though they were very fragmentary

即使他们不是非常连续，

and there wasn't a lot of information in it.

而且其中也并没有很多信息。

Then I got the words "new" and "old"

这样我就大概设计出了单词”new“和”old“。

and now I had regressed back to a point where there seemed to be no return.

现在我退回到了一个似乎不可返回的点上。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

I was really desperate at this point.

那时我相当绝望。

And so, I do something I'm truthfully ashamed of,

所以我做了一些说实话确实很羞愧的事情，

which is that I took two drawings I had made for another purpose

我找到了两幅另外创作的画作，

and I put them together.

然后将它们放在了一起，

It says "dreams" at the top.

在最上面写了”梦想“。

And I was going to do a thing, I say, "Well, change the copy.

然后我将要做的是，我会说：”“那么，改变一下这个副本。

Let it say something about dreams, and come to SVA

让它体现出梦想，来到视觉艺术学院

and you'll sort of fulfill your dreams."

你将可能实现你的梦想。”

But, to my credit,

但是值得赞扬的是，

I was so embarrassed about doing that

我对此感到很不好意思

that I never submitted this sketch.

因此我从来没有提交过这份草稿。

And, finally, I arrived at the following solution.

最后我使用了以下的解决方案。

Now, it doesn't look terribly interesting,

它看上不不是那么有意思，

but it does have something

但是它拥有某种

that distinguishes it from a lot of other posters.

与很多其它海报不同的东西。

For one thing, it transgresses the idea of what a poster's supposed to be,

比如，它违背了海报本应该具有的特点，

which is to be understood and seen immediately, and not explained.

就是应该直接地被看到和理解，而不需要解释。

I remember hearing all of you in the graphic arts --

我记得在图形艺术上听到大家都说

"If you have to explain it, it ain't working."

“如果你必须为此解释，则它没有任何效果。”

And one day I woke up and I said, "Well, suppose that's not true?"

有一天我醒过来然后说：“如果那是错的呢？”

(Laughter)

（笑声）

So here's what it says in my explanation at the bottom left.

所以在左下角就是我的解释

It says, "Thoughts: This poem is impossible.

上面是这样写的，“想法：这首诗是不可能的。

Silas usually has a better touch with his choice of quotations.

塞拉斯通常会较好选择引用语。

This one generates no imagery at all."

而这个并没有营造出任何画面感。”

I am now exposing myself to my audience, right?

我正在对我的听众表达我自己的想法，对吗？

Which is something you never want to do professionally.

这是你永远都不想认认真真去做的事。

"Maybe the words can make the image without anything else happening.

“也许文字可以构建出画面但除此之外别无他事。

What's the heart of this poem?

那么诗歌的核心是什么？

Don't be trendy if you want to be serious.

如果你想要认真就不要赶时尚。

Is doing the poster this way trendy in itself?

如此制作海报就本身来说是时尚的吗？

I guess one could reduce the idea further

我猜想任何人都可以进一步缩小想法，

by suggesting that the new emerges behind and through the old,

可以建议将”new“穿过”old“，

like this."

就像这样：“

And then I show you a little drawing --

那么我给你们看一副画——

you see, you remember that old thing I discarded?

你们还应该记得我抛弃的老的创作吧？

Well, I found a way to use it.

我发现了利用它的方法，

So, there's that little alternative over there,

所以那里出现了一些替代方案，

and I say, "Not bad," -- criticizing myself --

说我认为这并不坏，——自我批评——

"but more didactic than visual.

”但相比视觉更多的是说教。

Maybe what wants to be said is that old and the new are locked in a dialectical embrace,

也许真正想说的是陈旧的和新颖的是辩证的，

a kind of dance where each defines the other."

相互联系相互影响的。“

And then more self-questioning -- "Am I being simple-minded?

然后是更多的自我反省——”我是不是头脑简单了？

Is this the kind of simple that looks obvious, or the kind that looks profound?

这是看上去很明显的简单，还是看上去很深奥的简单呢？

There's a significant difference.

其中有着重大的区别。

This could be embarrassing.

这会是令人羞愧的。

Actually, I realize fear of embarrassment drives me as much as any ambition.

事实上，我察觉到对于困境的恐惧如同任何抱负一样驱动着我。

Do you think this sort of thing could really attract a student to the school?"

你们认为这真的会吸引一个学生来学校吗？

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Well, I think there are two fresh things here -- two fresh things.

不错，我认为这里有两件新鲜的事物——两个新鲜的事物。

One is the sort of willingness to expose myself to a critical audience,

一个是——在挑剔的听众面前表达自我的意愿，

and not to suggest that I am confident about what I'm doing.

这并不是指我对我做的事情充满了信心。

And as you know, you have to have a front.

正如你们所知道的，你必须有一个所要面对的方向，

I mean -- you've got to be confident;

我指你必须做到自信。

if you don't believe in your work, who else is going to believe in it?

如果你不相信你所做的一切，那么谁又会去相信呢？

So that's one thing,

所以这是第一个，有些

to introduce the idea of doubt into graphics.

将怀疑的思想引入到了图形中。

That can be a big contribution.

那会是一个很大的贡献。

The other thing is to actually give you two solutions for the price of one;

另一个是它给你提供了两种解决方案，

you get the big one

你可以选择大的这个，

and if you don't like that, how about the little one?

如果你不喜欢那个，那么小的这个怎么样？

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And that too is a relatively new idea.

那也是一个比较新的想法。

And here's just a series of experiments

这里有一系列的实验

where I ask the question of -- does a poster have to be square?

其中我问了一个问题——海报必须是方形的吗？

Now, this is a little illusion.

这有些幻象了。

That poster is not folded.

那个海报并没有被折叠。

It's not folded, that's a photograph

它没有被折叠，它是一张照片

and it's cut on the diagonal.

它在对角线上被剪裁了。

Same cheap trick in the upper left-hand corner.

在左上角使用了同样的小把戏。

And here,

这里，

a very peculiar poster because,

是一张非常奇特的海报，因为，

simply because of using the isometric perspective in the computer,

仅仅因为利用了计算机中的等距视角。

it won't sit still in the space.

它在空间中不是静止不动的。

At times, it seems to be wider at the back than the front,

有时候，仿佛后边比前边更加宽敞，

and then it shifts.

然后又改变了。

And if you sit here long enough, it'll float off the page into the audience.

如果你坐在这里足够久，它会离开页面漂到观众中。

But, we don't have time.

但是，我们没有时间。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And then an experiment --

然后又是一个实验——

a little bit about the nature of perspective,

有一点点关于透视的性质，

where the outside shape is determined by the peculiarity of perspective,

它的边缘形状由透视的特性决定，

but the shape of the bottle -- which is identical to the outside shape --

但是和边缘形状类似的瓶子的外形

is seen frontally.

看起来更靠前一些。

And another piece for the art directors' club

另一个为艺术总监们的俱乐部设计的

is "Anna Rees" casting long shadows.

是安娜里斯投射的长长的影子。

This is another poster from the School of Visual Arts.

这不是视觉艺术学院制作的海报。

There were 10 artists invited to participate in it,

有10位艺术家被邀请参与制作，

and it was one of those things where it was extremely competitive

这是众多竞争非常激烈的事情之一，

and I didn't want to be embarrassed,

我不想陷入尴尬窘境，

so I worked very hard on this.

所以我为此非常努力地工作。

The idea was -- and it was a brilliant idea --

它的想法是——这是一个不错的想法——

was to have 10 posters distributed throughout the city's subway system

在整个城市的地铁里粘贴10幅海报，

so every time you got on the subway you'd be passing a different poster,

这样每次进入地铁都可以经过不同的海报，

all of which had a different idea of what art is.

每一幅都有对于什么是艺术的不同理解。

But I was absolutely stuck on the idea of "art is"

但是我完全停留在“艺术”的理念上

and trying to determine what art was.

并且竭力去探寻艺术是什么。

But then I gave up and I said, "Well, art is whatever."

不过后来我放弃了并且认为：“任何事物都是艺术。”

And as soon as I said that,

当我意识到那点时，

I discovered that the word "hat" was hidden in the word "whatever,"

我发现单词“hat”隐藏在单词“whatever”中，

and that led me to the inevitable conclusion.

这将我引导到了这个必然的结论上。

But then again, it's on my list of didactic posters.

不过又一次它成为我的说教海报的一员。

My intent is to have a literary accompaniment that explains the poster,

我是想要用点文学来解释海报，

in case you don't get it.

以防你不能理解它。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Now this says, "Note to the viewer:

这里写着：“给观者的注解——

I thought I might use a visual cliche of our time -- Magritte's everyman --

我原想我可能会用这个时代的视觉上的陈词滥调，马格里特的人们，

to express the idea that art is mystery, continuity and history.

来表达艺术具有神秘性、连续性以及历史性这一想法。

I'm also convinced that, in an age of computer manipulation,

我也确信在电脑操控的时代，

surrealism has become banal,

超现实主义已然变得腐朽不堪，

a shadow of its former self.

成为了它前身的一道影子。

The phrase 'Art is whatever'

这个短语“任何事物都是艺术”

expresses the current inclusiveness that surrounds art-making --

解释了当下包围着艺术创作的包容性——

a sort of 'it ain't what you do, it's the way that you do it' notion.

有些“不是你要创作什么而是你创作的方式”的概念。

The shadow of Magritte falls across the central part of the poster

马格里特的影子铺盖了海报的中心部分

a poetic event that occurs as the shadow man isolates the word 'hat,'

当这个人形影子将隐藏在单词“whatever”中的“hat”这个词

hidden in the word 'whatever.'

孤立出来时产生了诗意效果。

The four hats shown in the poster suggests how art might be defined:

在海报中展示的靠前的帽子暗示了艺术可能被定义为

as a thing itself, the worth of the thing, the shadow of the thing,

一种事物本身、事物的价值、事物的影子

and the shape of the thing.

或者是事物的形状。

Whatever."

无论是什么。

(Applause)

（掌声）

OK.

好吧

(Applause)

（掌声）

And the one that I did not submit,

接下来是一幅我没有提交的作品，

which I still like,

但我仍然很喜欢。

I wanted to use the same phrase.

我想用同一个短语——

There were wonderful experiments by Bruno Munari

在许多年以前布鲁诺穆纳里曾做过

on letterforms some years ago --

一些关于字母形式的相当精彩的实验——

sort of, see how far you could go and still be able to read them.

来观察到了什么程度你们仍然能够把单词识别出来。

And that idea stuck in my head.

而且那种想法停留在我的脑中。

But then I took the pieces that I had taken off and put them at the bottom.

但是后来我把去掉的部分又重新组合起来放在下方，

And, of course those are the remains, and they're so labeled.

当然它们是残余下来的并且很具有标记性。

But what really happens is that you read it as:

但是事实上你将读到的是——

"Art is whatever remains."

“艺术是任何保存下来的事物。”

Thank you.

谢谢。

(Applause)

（鼓掌）