How flags unite (and divide) us | Michael Green

Transcriber: Joseph Geni Reviewer: Camille Martínez

譯者: Lilian Chiu 審譯者: Amanda Zhu

In 1989,

在 1989 年，

an artist by the name of Dread Scott,

TED 曾經有榮幸邀請來演說過的

who has also graced the TED stage,

藝術家德雷德史考特

created a piece of art in Chicago,

在芝加哥創作了一件作品，

where he simply placed an American flag on the ground

作品很簡單，

他只將一面美國國旗放在地上，

and then invited you the viewer to go and stand on that flag

接著邀請觀者過去站在國旗上，

and record how it felt in a journal.

並請他們在日誌上 寫下那是怎樣的感覺。

And to me, one of the most powerful things written in that journal, in essence, says,

對我來說，日誌中最震撼的一篇紀錄，

扼要地說是：

"Why are we so OK

「為什麼有人無家可歸 我們也覺得完全沒有關係，

with homeless people,

with human beings laying on the ground,

人類躺在地上沒關係，

but not flags?"

但國旗卻不行？」

And to some of you, this piece of art is quite disturbing.

對某些人而言， 這件作品讓人很不舒服。

And that's kind of the point of this talk --

這也算是這場演說的重點——

not to upset you or to make you mad

並不是要讓你感到沮喪或憤怒，

but to prove to you that flags have an incredible power,

而是要向你證明， 旗幟有很不可思議的力量，

and that even if you think you don't care about flags, you do.

且即使你認為你不在乎旗幟， 其實你很在乎。

You know you do.

你知道你很在乎。

Alright.

好，在演說結束時， 我希望你能受到鼓舞，

By the end of it, I hope that you're inspired

to go out and harness this power of flags and fight for a better world.

去運用旗幟的力量， 為了更好的世界而努力。

但在那之前，

But before we get there,

we're going to start on the opposite end of the spectrum.

我們先從最壞的開始談講。

And before I show you the next stuff, I need to say that anything I show here

在我做接下來的展示前，我要先聲明，

我不是在為任何展示的內容背書，

is not an endorsement,

it's usually quite the opposite.

通常還剛好相反。

But more than anything, what I want to do is create a space here

我最想做的，是在這裡創造一個空間，

where we can look at these flags, these designs,

讓我們來研究這些旗幟、這些設計，

and examine how they make us feel.

並探討它們帶給我們什麼感覺。

We're going to talk about our emotions.

我們會談到我們的情緒。 大家都 OK 嗎？

Is that OK with everybody?

OK.

好。

Are you ready for your first flag?

準備好看第一面旗幟了嗎？

Cool, we'll start with an easy one.

很好，我們先從簡單的開始。

That was a joke. (Laughs)

那是笑話。（笑）

So, some of you may be a little bit uneasy sitting in a room with this.

在座有些人可能會覺得 和它同處一室不太自在。

I'm certainly feeling uneasy standing in front of it.

我站在它前面確實覺得很不自在。

Some of you may be feeling a little bit of pride.

有些人可能會覺得有一點驕傲。

And that's understandable. This is Texas. This is not a rare sight, is it?

那是可以理解的。

這裡是德州，所以並不稀奇，對吧？

But let's start with the facts.

但我們先從事實開始。

So this is not the Confederate flag. OK?

這並不是南方聯邦的旗幟。好嗎？

This is the battle flag of the Army of Northern Virginia

這是北維吉尼亞陸軍戰旗，

led by General Robert E. Lee.

該軍團是由羅伯特李將軍統帥。

So next time someone tells you that this is their heritage,

所以下次有人告訴你 這是他們的歷史遺產，

unless their family fought for that very specific militia,

若他們的家人沒有為 那支民兵軍團打過仗，

they're wrong, alright?

他們就錯了。

And you have a flag expert's permission to tell them so.

且有位旗幟專家 允許你這樣告訴他們。

This flag rose into prominence during the mid-1950s and '60s

在 1950 年代中期到 1960 年代， 隨著黑人民權運動聲勢高漲，

as a response to the growing Civil Rights Movement.

這面旗幟的聲望越來越高。

And then of course today,

當然，現今對大多數人而言， 它漸漸變成了南部聯盟的代表。

it has come to represent the Confederacy to most of us.

But I shouldn't have to remind you what the Confederacy is.

但你們應該知道南方聯邦是什麼。

It was a rogue nation

它是起義對抗美國的反叛軍國家，

that rose up against the United States,

waged war on the US,

向美國開戰，

and at one point in time,

且這一度還是史上 最不美國的事物之一。

this was one of the most un-American things you could have.

But yet, this flag is protected

但，保護美國國旗的法律

by the same laws that protect the United States flag

在佛羅里達、喬治雅、

in the states of Florida, Georgia,

南卡羅萊納、密西西比， 及路易斯安納州

South Carolina, Mississippi and Louisiana.

同樣也保護著這面旗幟，

But let's pick on Georgia for a second, shall we?

我們來找一下喬治亞州的麻煩好嗎？

So in 1956,

1956 年，

a few years after desegregation was mandated in public schools,

在下令廢除公立學校的 種族隔離措施命令的幾年前，

Georgia changed their state flag to this.

喬治亞州把州旗改成這面旗幟。

I think everyone watching can agree

我想，在看的人都認同，

that this was not meant to be a flag that every Georgian was proud to fly

喬治亞州的居民 並不會覺得把這面旗幟

掛在家門外是件驕傲的事，對吧？

outside of their home, was it?

No.

不會。

就像在 1950 年代中期及 60 年代 豎立的所有南方聯邦雕像一樣，

Just like all of the Confederate statues erected in the mid-1950s and '60s,

this was meant to be a symbol of who was in charge

它是種象徵，

象徵誰在當家作主、誰不是。

and who was not.

This remained the flag of Georgia

在 2001 年之前，

until the year 2001,

它一直都是喬治亞州的州旗，

and in that year, they changed their flag

2001 年，他們把旗幟

to this.

改成這樣。

Now, as a flag expert, I can tell you: this is officially ugly.

身為旗幟專家，我可以告訴各位，

這面旗幟真的很醜。

OK? It's OK to laugh at this flag.

可以嘲笑這面旗幟沒關係。

It's ugly, and because it's so ugly,

它很醜。

這是他們在短短兩年後 就把它換掉的原因之一。

that's one of the reasons they changed it just two years later.

They had a referendum

他們舉辦了公投， 讓大家選擇要那面旗幟，

where they got to choose between that thing

and then what is now the current flag of Georgia.

還是現在的喬治亞州旗。

Now some of you might be wondering,

有些人可能在納悶： 「等等，麥可，

"Wait a second, Michael --

若那面旗幟不是南方聯邦以前的旗幟，

if that before wasn't the Confederate flag,

what was the Confederate flag?"

那南方聯邦的旗幟是什麼？」

Georgia flies the first flag of the Confederate States of America

到今天，喬治亞州都一直 掛著南方聯盟最早的旗幟。

to this day.

They just slapped their state seal on it.

他們只是把州徽放上去。

Well, let's go back to our emotions for a second.

先回來談一下我們的情緒。

That didn't punch you in the gut as much as the other one did, did it?

它並沒有像另一面旗幟 給你那麼大的衝擊，是吧？

Right?

對吧？

And that's why I love flags.

那就是我愛旗幟的原因。

They are the simplest pieces of design,

它們是最簡單的設計作品，

usually just two or three colors,

通常只有兩、三個顏色，

just some bars or stripes.

只有一些條紋。

But yet, they can invoke the deepest emotions within us.

但，它們卻能挑起 我們心底深處的情緒。

They'll make us swell with pride

它們會讓我們心中充滿驕傲

or burn with hatred.

或因為恨意而怒火中燒。

We will die for a flag

我們會為了一面旗幟而死，

or even kill for one.

甚至為了一面旗幟而殺戮。

One of my favorite designers, his name is Wally Olins,

沃利奧林斯是我最喜歡的設計師之一，

they call him the father of nation branding,

他被稱為國家品牌行銷之父，

and he's quoted as saying

引述他的一句話：

that "Everyone wants to belong,

「大家都想要歸屬感，

and then they want to display symbols of belonging."

接著他們會想要展示歸屬感的象徵。」

And it's crazy that these pieces of cloth that are just sewn together or dyed

也不過是把幾片布料 縫在一起或染色，

come to be such a sacred item,

就能變成如此神聖的物品， 真的很瘋狂，

and that's because they become parts of our identity.

那是因為它們變成了 我們身分的一部分。

They are powerful tools to unify

旗幟是強大的團結工具，

but equally powerful tools to divide.

卻也是同樣強大的分裂工具。

You ready for the next flag?

準備好看下一面旗幟了嗎？

Right.

好。

Take a moment.

花點時間。

Really examine how you felt when this hit the screen.

真正去探究一下這面旗幟 顯示出來時你有什麼感覺。

I'm going to change the slide pretty quickly

我要趕快切換投影片，

so you don't take pictures of me in front of this one.

以免你們拍下我站在它前面的照片。

(Laughter)

（笑聲）好嗎？

Alright?

So Germany after World War I,

所以，在一次大戰之後的德國，

it was in a pretty bad state,

狀況很糟糕，

and a young Adolf Hitler had a lot of -- let's call them -- "ideas,"

年輕的阿道夫希特勒有很多的

——我們姑且稱為——想法，

of how Germany got to where they'd gotten

關於德國如何走到這步田地

and how to get them out.

及該如何脫身的想法。

He spent entire chapters in his book "Mein Kampf,"

它寫了《我的奮鬥》這本書， 我不建議大家讀。

書中有一整個章節

which I don't recommend reading,

about how Germany lost World War I

都在談德國之所以會輸掉一次大戰，

partially because the British had better graphic design

部分原因是英國有比較好的 平面設計和宣傳手段。

and better propaganda.

So, as the Nazi Party rose,

隨著納粹黨興起，

Hitler created one of the thickest brand guides I've ever seen.

希特勒寫了我所見過 最厚的品牌指南之一。

It's thicker than most company brand guides today,

現今多數公司的 品牌指南都沒那麼厚。

and in it, he details titles and uniforms

在指南中，他細節說明了頭銜、

制服，以及許多許多旗幟。

and lots and lots of flags.

Hitler knew the power of flags.

希特勒知道旗幟的力量， 在《我的奮鬥》中，他說：

He says in "Mein Kampf,"

"The new flag ... should prove effective as a large poster,

「這面新旗幟……應該會證明 它和大海報一樣有效，」

[because] in hundreds of thousands of cases

因為「在數十萬個案例中，

a really striking emblem may be the first cause

能夠喚醒人們想要 參與運動的最初成因

of awakening interest in a movement."

很可能就是顯眼的標誌。」

He was an artist, after all.

畢竟他是藝術家。

He knew the power of visual identity and uniforms

他知道視覺身分和制服的力量

could reignite the German identity.

可以再次讓德國的身分發光。

And to millions of Germans, this was a welcome sign.

且對數百萬名德國人而言， 這是個歡迎標誌。

But of course, this was also a mark of death to others.

但，當然對其他人而言， 這也是個死亡的標記。

We don't often think of flags as weapons,

我們通常不會把旗幟視為武器，

but like the Confederate battle flag,

但就像南方聯邦的戰旗一樣， 德國人用他們的旗幟

the Germans used their flag

to make an out-group feel unwelcome

去讓不屬於他們族群的外人 感到不受歡迎

and less than.

以及矮一截。

You see, when you create a flag, you immediately do two things:

當你創造出一面旗幟時， 同時也做了兩件事：

你創造了這個符號 所代表的「自己人」團體，

you create an in-group,

a group that's meant to be represented by the symbol,

但你也無可避免地區隔出「外人」。

but then, inevitably, you create an out-group.

And usually, that's subtle.

通常，那是不知不覺的。

It's a byproduct.

那是種副產品，通常不是本意。

It's usually not the intent.

But the Germans were very clear as to who was represented by the swastika

但德國人非常清楚納粹黨徽

代表的是什麼人、不是什麼人。

and who was not.

In 1935, Jewish people were banned from flying German flags.

1935 年，

猶太人被禁止掛出德國旗幟。

And in this way,

以這樣的方式，

the Germans, maybe more than any other time in history,

德國人把旗幟團結和分裂的雙重力量

used the dual power of flags

發揮得比歷史上任何時候 都還要更淋漓盡致，

to unite but also to divide.

Flags were used as identity weapons.

旗幟被用來當作身分武器。

And now, in 2019, the Nazi flag is banned from being flown

現在是 2019 年，

在德國，所有人都被禁止 掛出納粹旗幟，

by anyone in Germany

and anyone in Austria, in Hungary, in Russia and in Ukraine.

在奧地利、匈牙利、俄羅斯， 以及烏克蘭也都是如此。

Think about that.

想想看，竟然會禁止一塊布。

It's a piece of cloth, but it's banned.

On its face, that sounds crazy.

單從表面看，聽起來很瘋狂。

But I don't think anyone in this room would disagree

但我相信在座各位都會同意，

that it's probably good.

這麼做是好事。

Sounds a lot like a weapon.

當它是武器似的。

As a vexillologist,

身為旗幟學家，

sometimes the most interesting thing about a flag

有時，旗幟最有趣的地方，

is not so much its design,

並不在於它的設計，

but it's those laws around the flag.

而是和旗幟有關的法律。

For instance,

比如，

in India, to create an Indian flag,

在印度，若要製造印度國旗，

you must use a hand-spun cloth named "khadi."

必須要用一種叫做 「khadi」的手工紡紗布料。

If you make a flag out of anything else,

如果你用其他材料製作國旗，

you could go to jail for up to three years.

你可能會因此坐牢，最長三年。

It's crazy.

很瘋狂。

Here in Texas,

在德州這裡，

we've all heard

我們都聽過

that the Texas flag is the only state flag that can fly at the same height

全美各州只有德州州旗可以

掛得和美國國旗一樣高，對吧？

as the US, flag, right?

因為我們成為州之前是個國家。

Because we were a nation before we were a state.

Who here has heard that?

有誰聽過這件事？

Yeah.

很好。

Well, I'm here to tell you that is completely false. OK?

我要告訴各位，這完全是假的，好嗎？

First of all, we were not the only state that was a nation before joining up.

首先，除了我們之外還有其他州 在加入美國之前也是個國家。

And secondly, all state flags can fly at the same height as the US flag

再者，根據《美國國旗法》，

所有的州旗都可以 掛在和美國國旗同樣的高度。

according to the US flag code.

And I don't have to ask you how you feel about this one, right?

我不需要問大家 對這面旗幟的感覺吧？

Most of us grew up pledging allegiance to this every morning,

我們大部分人在成長過程中， 每天早晨都會向它宣誓忠誠，

knowing we should never let it touch the ground, etc.

也知道絕對不能 讓它接觸地面等等。

We take our flag code very seriously here in the United States.

在美國，我們非常認真看待國旗法。

You remember, recently some NFL players kneeling during the national anthem.

還記得嗎，最近有些國家美式足球聯盟 球員在唱國歌時跪下。

It was a big controversy.

那造成很大的爭議。

They were breaking the flag code.

他們觸犯了國旗法。

It states during the national anthem,

國旗法規範，在唱國歌時，

stand at attention, hand at the heart, etc.

要立正站好，手放在心上等等。

But what was fascinating to me as a vexillologist

但身為旗幟學家，我覺得有趣的是

當這種事發生時， 我並沒有看到任何人感到不悅。

is that I didn't see anyone getting upset

when something like this happens.

The flag code says, "The flag should never be carried flat or horizontally,

國旗法說：「國旗絕對 不能攤平或水平攜帶，

but always aloft and free."

一定要高掛並自由飄揚。」

So sometimes during the exact same national anthem,

所以同樣在唱國歌時，

this was being done, and no one's upset.

有時會看到這個，但沒人感到不悅。

Or this. This happens all the time.

或者像這樣，這很常見。

The flag code is clear:

國旗法清楚規定

"No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or on an athletic uniform."

「國旗的任何一部分 都不能被用來當作服裝或運動制服。」

This is Texas A&M baseball,

這是德州農工大學的棒球隊。

not to get them in trouble, but this happens all the time,

我不是要給他們添麻煩， 但這種狀況很常見，

especially in November.

特別是在十一月。

I'm sure, I can almost guarantee when you leave here tonight,

我幾乎可以肯定，你今晚離開這裡時，

you will see on the back of someone's car or truck

會在某人的汽車或卡車後側

a black and white American flag with a blue stripe,

看到黑白的美國國旗 搭配藍色的細條紋，對吧？

a thin blue line, right?

Blue Lives Matter.

「重視藍色的警察生命」。

That breaks the flag code in multiple ways.

那就違反了好幾條國旗法。

But all of these things are done with the best intent.

但做這些事情的目的 都是出於好意。

No one's here to argue that.

沒有人會反對這一點。

But of course they break a section of the flag code

但這些做法當然違反了 國旗法的一個章節，

titled "Respect for the Flag,"

叫做「尊敬國旗」，

so by putting this on your uniform,

所以把它放到你的制服上，

you are legally disrespecting the flag.

就法律層面來說， 你就是對國旗不敬。

And what I find interesting

我覺得很有趣，

is that those NFL players kneeling during the anthem

那些在唱國歌時跪下的美式足球球員

and the people who would put Blue Lives Matters stickers on their car

以及會把「重視藍色的警察生命」 貼紙貼在車上的人

是在一項重大議題上 立場對立的兩種人，

are both on the opposite end of a very big issue,

but they're both breaking the exact same law,

但他們都違反了同樣的法律，

a law that is 100 percent unenforceable.

百分之百無法執行的一條法律。

In fact, it was Dread Scott's piece of art in 1989

事實上，是德雷德史考特 在 1989 年的那件作品

that led the Supreme Court to rule that the flag code is just a guideline.

導致最高法庭判定 國旗法只是參考的指南。

You cannot be prosecuted for breaking the flag code.

你不會因為違反國旗法而被起訴。

You cannot be forced to be patriotic.

法律不能強迫你愛國。

So why, then, have all of these little laws around how we use our flag

那麼，既然無法執行 這些和國旗相關的小法律，

為什麼還要制訂它們？

if you can't enforce them?

And that's because a nation

那是因為國家

is a fragile collective idea.

是一種脆弱的集體想法。

It only exists in our minds.

它只存在於我們的腦袋裡。

Can I see this? Thank you.

我能看一下這個嗎？謝謝。

Sometimes a flag is the only tangible symbol of that idea.

有時，那個想法唯一的 有形象徵就是旗幟。

Right? Our unity is sometimes only held together by literal threads.

對吧？我們的團結 有時只是用紗線維持著。

And that's powerful.

那很強大。

The flag code is meant to preserve and protect that fragile idea,

國旗法的目的是要 維護、保護那脆弱的想法，

while also protecting your right to break it.

同時也要保護你違反它的權利。

And that's what's special about the United States, right?

那就是美國的特別之處，對吧？

And that's what's unique about our flag.

那就是我們國旗的獨特之處。 我們的國旗很了不起。

Our flag is amazing.

It has changed more than any other flag in the world.

在全世界所有的國旗中， 它變更過最多次。

It's the flag code that says when a new state is created,

國旗法指出，當有一個新的州成立，

a star shall be added to the union of the flag,

就應該在國旗上加一顆星星，

and such addition shall take place on the fourth day of July.

且應該要在七月四日時 將星星加上去。

Our flag is unique because it is meant to grow as we grow.

我們的國旗很獨特， 因為它會隨著我們一起成長。

By design and by law,

在設計上以及在法律上，

it is meant to change with us.

它本來就應該與我們一同改變。

It's a living symbol of our individuality,

它是種活的象徵， 代表我們個體獨立性、

our diversity in the stars

從那些星星可看出來的多樣性，

and our unity.

以及我們的團結。

We have a gift in the United States to have a flag that is inclusive.

在美國，我們很有幸 能有一面具包容性的國旗。

If the Nazi flag was an identity weapon,

如果納粹旗幟是身分武器，

the United States flag, by design alone, stands in direct contrast.

光是在設計上，美國國旗 就代表完全相反的立場。

And I have to say, as a vexillologist in 2019,

我必須要說，身為 身在 2019 年的旗幟學家，

using this flag

把這面旗幟當成 對付任何人的身分武器，

as an identity weapon against anyone

disrespects it far more than letting it touch the ground

這樣的不敬，遠超過讓它接觸地面，

or any one of the other little laws that we break every day.

或者在日常中違反那些小法律。

Right?

對吧？

This flag is a symbol of our unity.

這面國旗象徵著我們的團結。

We should never use this as a weapon against someone else.

我們絕對不能把它用來 當作對付任何人的武器。

I resonate so deeply with the person who wrote in Dread Scott's journal,

在德雷德史考特的日誌中，

有一篇讓我有好深的共鳴：

"We should never value the symbol over the thing that it symbolizes.

「我們不該重視『象徵物』 勝過『它所象徵的意義』。

We should never value a piece of cloth over a human life."

我們不該重視一塊布料 勝過一條人命。」

And if you're ever going to use a piece of cloth as a weapon,

如果你打算用一塊布料來當武器，

you should never use this one,

千萬不要用這一塊，

not when it has always had room for more stars.

因為它還有空間容納更多星星。

Hopefully by now, you've felt the power of flags,

希望到此刻，你已經 感受到了旗幟的力量，

and you can see what they can do.

也能了解它們能做到什麼。

So what if we harnessed that power,

如果我們能利用那種力量，

and we used it to fight for something greater?

為更偉大的目標努力，會有什麼結果？

This is the flag of Earth,

這是地球的旗幟，

designed by Oskar Pernefeldt of Sweden.

由瑞典的奧斯卡佩內菲特設計。

Just imagine with me for a second:

和我一起想像一下：

What if we celebrated our humanity

如果我們一起讚頌人類，

as much if not more

如同或超過我們 對於國籍的讚頌會如何？

than we celebrate our nationalities?

As we become a spacefaring civilization and we go off into the stars,

隨著我們成為能在太空 旅行穿越星系的文明，

what do our nations mean anyway

當你站在火星或其他行星的表面上時，

when you're standing on the surface of Mars or any other planet?

我們的國家還有什麼意義？

And then of course, back here on Earth,

當然，在地球上，

as our planet is facing a climate crisis,

我們的星球正面臨氣候危機，

as our climate could be unlivable in our children or grandchildren's lifetime,

到了我們的孩子或孫子的時代， 氣候可能就不適居了，

I believe we need a strong symbol, a flag,

我相信我們需要一個更強力的象徵，

一面旗幟，來讓我們同心協力，

to unite us to fight,

not just as nations,

不只是以國家的身分，

but as a species.

而是以物種的身分。

Thank you.

謝謝。

(Applause)

（掌聲）