What crows teach us about death | Kaeli Swift

90,144 views ・ 2020-11-23

TED


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Prevoditelj: Gita Sočković Recezent: Sanda Liker
00:12
Whether we want to or not, humans spend a great deal of time
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Bez obzira želimo li to ili ne, ljudi troše veliku količinu vremena
00:16
considering death.
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razmišljajući o smrti.
00:18
And it's possible we've been doing so since shortly after homo sapiens
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I moguće je da smo to radili nedugo nakon što su homo sapiensi
00:22
first began roaming the landscape.
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prvo počeli lutati krajolikom.
00:24
After all, the first intentional human burial
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Uostalom, smatra se da se prvi namjerni ljudski pokop
00:27
is thought to have occurred around 100,000 years ago.
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dogodio prije odprilike 100,000 godina.
00:32
What might those early people have been thinking
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O čemu su ti rani ljudi razmišljali
00:35
as they took the time to dig into the earth,
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kada su si uzeli vremena da iskopaju rupu u zemlji,
00:38
deposit the body
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polože tijelo
00:39
and carefully cover it up again?
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i oprezno ga ponovno pokriju?
00:41
Were they trying to protect it from scavengers
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Jesu li ga pokušavali zaštititi od strvinara
00:44
or stymie the spread of disease?
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ili spriječiti širenje bolesti?
00:47
Were they trying to honor the deceased?
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Jesu li pokušavali odati počast mrtvima?
00:50
Or did they just not want to have to look at a dead body?
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Ili samo nisu htjeli gledati u mrtvo tijelo?
00:54
Without the advent of a time machine,
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Bez izuma vremenskog stroja
00:55
we may never know for sure what those early people were thinking,
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nikada nećemo biti sigurni o čemu su ti rani ljudi razmišljali,
00:59
but one thing we do know is that humans are far from alone
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ali jedna stvar koju znamo je da su ljudi daleko od samih
01:03
in our attention towards the dead.
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u našoj pažnji prema mrtvima.
01:05
Like people, some animals,
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Kao i ljudi, neke životinje,
01:07
including the corvids, the family of birds
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uključujući Corvidae, obitelj ptica
01:10
that houses the crows, ravens, magpies and jays,
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u koju spadaju vrane, gavrani, svrake i šojke,
01:14
also seem to pay special attention to their dead.
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također obraćaju posebnu pažnju svojim pokojnima.
01:17
In fact, the rituals of corvids may have acted as the inspiration
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Zapravo, rituali Corvidae ptica vjerovatno su služile kao inspiracija
01:20
for our own.
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za naše.
01:22
After all, it was the raven that God sent down
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Uostalom, bio je gavran kojeg je Bog poslao na Zemlju
01:25
to teach Cain how to bury his slain brother Abel.
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da nauči Kaina kako da pokopa svog ubijenog brata Abela.
01:29
But despite this clear recognition by early people that other animals
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Ali bez obzira na to očito prepoznavanje ranih ljudi da se ostale životinje
01:32
attend to their dead,
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brinu u svojim pokojnima,
01:34
it's only fairly recently that science has really turned its attention
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tek je relativno nedavno znanost posvetila svoju pažnju
01:37
towards this phenomenon.
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toj pojavi.
01:39
In fact, a formal name for this field -- comparative thanatology --
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Zapravo, službeni naziv tog područja, komparativna tanatologija,
01:43
wasn't first introduced until 2016.
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nije se uveo do 2016.
01:47
In this growing field, we are beginning to appreciate what a rich place
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U tome rastućem području, počinjemo cijeniti koliko je bogata
01:51
the natural world is with respect to how other animals interact with their dead,
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priroda s obzirom na to kako ostale životinje komuniciraju sa svojim mrtvima
01:56
and it's in this growing body of knowledge
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i u tom rastućem području znanja
01:58
that that time machine to our early ancestors might be possible.
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taj vremenski stroj do naših predaka možda postoji.
02:03
So what are we learning in this growing field?
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O čemu učimo u tom rastućem području?
02:06
Well, right now we can split our understanding into two main groups.
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Trenutno možemo podijeliti naše shvaćanje u dvije glavne skupine.
02:11
In the first, we have animals that display stereotyped, predictable behaviors
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U prvoj imamo životinje koje pokazuju stereotipična, predvidiva ponašanja
02:15
towards their dead,
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prema njihovim pokojnima,
02:17
and for whom much of what we understand about them
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i od kojih većina toga što shvaćamo o njima
02:19
comes from experimental studies.
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dolazi od eksperimenata.
02:21
This group includes things like the social insects --
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Ta grupa uključuje bića kao društvene kukce,
02:24
bees and ants and termites --
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pčele, mrave i termite,
02:27
and for all of these animals, colony hygiene is of critical importance,
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i za sve te životinje, higijena kolonije je od kritične važnosti,
02:31
and so as a result these animals display rigorous undertaking behaviors
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i kao rezultat te životinje pokazuju rigorozna poduzetna ponašanja
02:35
in response to corpses.
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kao odgovor na trupla.
02:37
For example, they may physically remove carcasses from the colony.
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Na primjer, mogle bi fizički odstraniti truplo iz kolonije.
02:41
They may consume them.
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Mogle bi ih pojesti.
02:42
They may even construct tombs.
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Čak bi mogle konstruirati grobnice.
02:44
We see similar hygiene-driven responses in some colony-living mammals.
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Primjećujemo slične higijenski vođene reakcije u nekih kolonijskih sisavaca.
02:49
Rats, for example, will reliably bury cage-mates
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Štakori, na primjer, bi sigurno zakopali svoje suzatvorenike
02:52
that have been dead for 48 hours.
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koji su bili mrtvi 48 sati.
02:55
In our other group, we have animals that display more variable,
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U drugoj grupi imamo životinje koje pokazuju više promjenjiva,
02:59
perhaps more charismatic behaviors,
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možda ipak više karizmatična ponašanja
03:02
and for whom much of what we understand about them
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i za koje većina našeg shvaćanja njih
03:04
comes from anecdotes
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dolazi iz anegdota
03:06
by scientists or other observers.
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znanstvenika ili ostalih promatrača.
03:09
This is the animals whose death behaviors
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To su životinje čija su ponašanja vezana za smrt,
03:11
I suspect might be more familiar to folks.
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pretpostavljam, ljudima poznatija.
03:14
It includes organisms like elephants,
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To uključuje organizme kao slonove,
03:17
which are well-known for their attendance to their dead,
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za koje je poznata njihova briga o pokojnima,
03:20
even in popular culture.
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čak i u popularnoj kulturi.
03:21
In fact, they're even known to be attracted
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Čak je znano da ih privlače
03:23
to the bones of their deceased.
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kosti njihovih mrtvih.
03:26
It also includes animals like primates,
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Također uključuje životinje poput primata,
03:28
which display a wide variety of behaviors around their dead,
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koji pokazuju različite načine ponašanja oko svojih mrtvih,
03:31
from grooming them
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od dotjerivanja
03:33
to prolonged attention towards them,
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do dugotrajne pažnje prema njima,
03:36
guarding them,
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čuvanja njih,
03:38
even the transportation of dead infants.
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čak i premještanja mrtvih dojenčadi.
03:41
And that's actually a behavior we've seen in a number of animals,
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I to je zapravo ponašanje koje smo vidjeli kod nekolicine životinja,
03:44
like the dolphins for example.
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kao, na primjer, dupina.
03:46
You may remember the story of Tahlequah,
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Možda se sjećate priče o Tahlequahi,
03:48
the orca in the resident J pod in the Puget Sound,
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orki u rezidentnoj J čahuri u Puget Soundu
03:52
who during the summer of 2018
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koja je tijekom ljeta 2018.
03:54
carried her dead calf
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nosila svoje mrtvo mladunče
03:55
for an unprecedented 17 days.
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besprimjernih 17 dana.
04:00
Now, a story like that
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Sada, priča kao takva
04:01
is both heartbreaking and fascinating,
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je u isto vrijeme srcedrapajuća i fascinantna,
04:04
but it offers far more questions than it does answers.
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ali nam nudi mnogo više pitanja nego odgovora.
04:07
For example, why did Tahlequah carry her calf
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Na primjer, zašto je Tahlequah nosila svoje mladunče
04:10
for such a long period of time?
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tako dugo?
04:12
Was she just that stricken with grief?
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Je li bila toliko pogođena tugom?
04:16
Was she more confused by her unresponsive infant?
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Je li bila više zbunjena svojim nereagirajućim djetetom?
04:20
Or is this behavior just less rare in orcas
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Ili je to ponašanje samo manje rijetko među orkama
04:22
than we currently understand it to be?
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nego što trenutačno mislimo da jest?
04:25
But for a variety of reasons,
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Ali zbog raznih razloga
04:27
it's difficult to do the kinds of experimental studies
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teško je napraviti eksperimente
04:30
in an animal like an orca, or many of these other large mammals,
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na životinjama kao što su orke, ili veliki broj ostalih velikih sisavaca,
04:34
that might elucidate those kinds of questions.
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koji bi možda razjasnili ovakva pitanja.
04:37
So instead, science is turning to an animal whose behaviors around death
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Umjesto toga, znanost se okreće životinji o čijem ponašanju oko smrti
04:41
we've been thinking about since BCE:
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razmišljamo od razdoblja prije Krista:
04:44
the crows.
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vrane.
04:46
Like insects and primates,
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Kao kukci i primati,
04:47
crows also seem to pay special attention to their dead.
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čini se da i vrane obraćaju posebnu pažnju svojim pokojnima.
04:51
Typically, this manifests as the discovering bird alarm calling,
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Tipično to se očituje kao zov za otkrivanje ptice,
04:54
like you can see in this photo,
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kao što se primjećuje na slici,
04:56
followed by the recruitment of other birds to the area
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zapraćen novačenjem ostalih ptica u okolici
04:58
to form what we call a mob.
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koje stvaraju takozvani skup.
05:01
But it can be a little different than that too.
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Ali može biti i malo drugačije od toga.
05:04
For example, I've had people share with me seeing prolonged silent vigils by crows
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Na primjer, ljudi su mi znali reći kako su vidjeli produljena tiha bdjenja vrana
05:09
in response to deceased or dying crows.
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kao odaziv na mrtve ili umirujuće vrane.
05:12
I've even had people tell me of witnessing crows place objects
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Čak su mi ljudi govorili da su svjedočili kako vrane stavljaju stvari
05:15
like sticks and candy wrappers on or near the bodies of dead crows.
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poput grančica i omota od slatkiša na ili blizu tijela mrtvih vrana.
05:21
And this mix of observations puts these birds
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I ta masa opažanja stavlja te ptice
05:23
in a really important place in our scheme,
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u jako bitan položaj u našoj shemi,
05:26
because it suggests on the one hand they might be like the insects,
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zato što sugerira da u jednu ruku mogu biti poput kukaca,
05:30
displaying these very predictable behaviors,
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prikazivanjem tih veoma predvidivih ponašanja,
05:33
but on the other hand we have this handful of observations
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ali u drugu ruku imamo nekolicinu opažanja
05:36
that are more difficult to explain and feel a bit more like what we see
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koja su teža za objasniti i čine se bliže nečemu što primjećujemo
05:39
in some of the mammals like primates and elephants.
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u nekih sisavaca poput primata i slonova.
05:42
And like those animals, crows share an extremely large relative brain size
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I poput tih životinja, vrane dijele izuzetno veliku relativnu veličinu mozga
05:47
and the kinds of dynamic social lives that might invite more complexity
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i vrste dinamičnog društvenog života koje uvode više kompleksnosti
05:51
in how they respond to their dead.
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u način na koji reagiraju na svoje mrtve.
05:54
So I wanted to try to understand what was going on
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Zbog toga sam htjela razumjeti što se događa
05:58
when crows encounter a dead crow,
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kada vrane vide mrtvu vranu
06:00
and what this might teach us about the role of death in their world,
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i što nas to može naučiti o ulozi smrti u njihovom svijetu,
06:04
and possibly the worlds of other animals as well,
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a možda i u svjetovima ostalih životinja,
06:06
even those early versions of ourselves.
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čak i onih ranijih verzija nas.
06:10
There's a number of different ways that we could explain
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Postoji nekoliko načina na koje bismo mogli objasniti
06:13
why crows might be attracted to their dead.
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zašto vrane privlače njihovi mrtvi.
06:15
For example, maybe it's a social opportunity,
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Na primjer, možda je to prilika za socijalizaciju,
06:19
a way for them to explore why that individual died,
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način na koji istražuju zašto je pojedinac umro,
06:23
who they were
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tko je bio
06:24
and what impact this is going to have on the neighborhood moving forward.
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i kakav utjecaj će to imati na susjedstvo u budućnosti.
06:28
Maybe it's an expression of grief,
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Možda je to izraz žalosti,
06:30
like our own contemporary funerals.
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kao naši suvremeni sprovodi.
06:33
Or maybe it's a way that they learn about danger in their environment.
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Ili je to možda način na koji one uče o opasnostima u njihovoj okolini.
06:37
While all of those explanations are worth pursuing,
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Dok sva ta objašnjenja vrijedi istražiti,
06:40
and certainly not mutually exclusive,
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a sigurno nisu isključiva,
06:43
they're not all testable scientific questions.
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nisu sva provjerljiva znanstvena pitanja.
06:46
But that idea that dead crows might act as cues of danger, that is.
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To jest, ta ideja da mrtve vrane mogu služiti kao znakovi opasnosti.
06:51
So as a graduate student, I wanted to explore that question,
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Pa zato kao postdiplomac, htjela sam istražiti to pitanje,
06:55
particularly with respect to two ideas.
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posebno u odnosu na dvije ideje.
06:59
The first was whether they might be able to learn new predators,
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Prva je mogu li primijetiti nove grabežljivce,
07:02
specifically people,
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izričito ljude,
07:04
based on their association with dead crows.
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temeljeno na njihovoj asocijaciji s mrtvim vranama.
07:07
And the second was if they might learn places
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I druga je mogu li naučiti o mjestima
07:10
associated with where they find crow bodies.
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povezanim s onima gdje se pronalaze trupla vrana.
07:14
So to do this, I would go out into some unsuspecting Seattle neighborhood
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Kako bih napravila to, otišla bih u neko bezazleno susjedstvo u Seattleu
07:19
and I would start to feed a breeding pair of crows
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i počela bih hraniti parove vrana
07:21
over the course of three days,
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tijekom tri dana,
07:24
and this provided a baseline
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i to mi je dalo osnovnu liniju
07:25
for how quickly the crows would come down to a food pile,
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za koliko brzo bi vrane došle do hrpe s hranom
07:28
which, as you'll see in a minute, was really important.
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što je, vidjet ćete za minutu, bilo od velike važnosti.
07:31
Then, on the fourth day,
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Onda, na četvrti dan,
07:33
we would have our funeral.
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imat ćemo naš sprovod.
07:35
This is Linda.
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Ovo je Linda.
07:37
Linda is one of seven masks whose job was to stand there for 30 minutes
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Linda je jedna od sedam maski čiji je posao bio da stoji tamo 30 minuta
07:41
with her little hors d'oeuvre plate of dead crow
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sa svojim malim predjelima mrtve vrane
07:44
while I documented what happened.
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dok sam ja dokumentirala što se dogodilo.
07:46
Most importantly, though,
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Ono što je najvažnije,
07:48
her job was to come back after a week,
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njezin posao bio je vratiti se nakon tjedan dana,
07:50
now without the dead crow,
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sada bez mrtve vrane,
07:51
so that we could see if the birds would treat her just like any old pedestrian,
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kako bismo vidjeli hoće li je ptice tretirati kao bilo koji stari prolaznik
07:56
or if, instead, they would exhibit behaviors like alarm calling
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ili će, umjesto toga, pokazivati ponašanja kao što su alarmi
08:00
or dive bombing
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ili bombardiranje,
08:01
that would indicate that they perceived her as a predator.
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što bi nagovjestilo da je vide kao grabežljivca.
08:05
Now, given that we already knew crows were capable of learning
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Sada, sa spoznajom da već znamo kako su vrane sposobne učiti
08:08
and recognizing human faces,
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i prepoznati ljudska lica,
08:11
it may come as no surprise that the majority of crows in our study
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ne bi trebalo biti iznenađujuće da je većina vrana u našem istraživanju
08:15
did treat the masks that they saw handling dead crows as threats
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tretirala maske koje su vidjele kao prijetnju
08:18
when they saw them over the course of the next six weeks.
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kada su ih vidjele tijekom sljedećih šest tjedana.
08:22
Now, if you're sitting there thinking,
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Sada, ako sjedite ovdje misleći,
08:24
alright, give me a break,
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"dobro, daj,
08:26
look at that face, it is terrifying,
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pogledaj to lice, zastrašujuće je,
08:28
anyone would treat that as a threat
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bilo tko bi ga vidio kao prijetnju
08:30
if they saw it walking down the street,
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ako bi ga vidio da hoda po ulici",
08:33
know that you are not alone.
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znajte da niste sami.
08:35
As it turns out, a lot of the folks
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Kako se ispostavilo, mnogo ljudi
08:36
whose houses we did these experiments in front of
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ispred čijih smo kuća vodili eksperiment
08:39
felt the same way,
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osjećali su se isto,
08:40
but we'll save that for another time.
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ali o tome ćemo neki drugi put.
08:43
So you may be comforted to know that we did control tests
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Možda ćete se utješiti da znate da smo radili kontrolne testove
08:46
to make sure that crows don't share our preconceived bias against masks
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kako bismo bili sigurni da vrane ne dijele našu unaprijed stvorenu pristranost
08:50
that look a bit like the female version of Hannibal Lecter.
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protiv maski koje izgledaju poput ženske verzije Hannibala Lectera.
08:55
Now, in addition to finding that crows were able to make associations with people
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Povrh toga što smo saznali da su vrane sposobne napraviti asocijaciju s ljudima
08:59
based on their handling of dead crows,
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na osnovi njihovog tretiranja mrtvih vrana,
09:01
we also found that in the days following these funeral events,
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također smo saznali da danima nakon tih sprovoda,
09:04
as we continued to feed them,
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kako smo ih nastavili hraniti,
09:06
that their willingness to come down to the food pile significantly diminished,
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njihova volja da dođu dolje do hrpe hrane znatno se smanjila,
09:10
and we didn't see that same kind of decline in our control groups.
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te nismo vidjeli istu vrstu pada u našim kontrolnim skupinama.
09:14
So that suggests that, yes, crows can make associations
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To sugerira da, da, vrane mogu stvarati asocijacije
09:18
with particular places where they've seen dead crows.
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vezane za određena mjesta gdje su vidjele mrtve vrane.
09:22
So together, what that tells us is that
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Ukupno to nam govori da
09:24
while we certainly shouldn't discount those other explanations,
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iako ne možemo odbiti ona ostala objašnjenja,
09:28
we can feel pretty confident in saying
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možemo biti sigurni kada kažemo
09:30
that for crows, attention to their dead
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da za vrane, pažnja o njihovim mrtvima
09:32
might be a really important way
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je vjerojatno važan način
09:34
that these animals learn about danger.
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na koji te životinje uče o opasnosti.
09:37
And that's a nice, tidy little narrative
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To je lijepa, uredna mala priča
09:39
on which to hang our hats.
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koje se držimo.
09:41
But in life and death,
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Ali u životu i smrti,
09:43
things are rarely so neat,
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stvari su rijetko tako uredne
09:46
and I really came face to face with that in a follow-up experiment,
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i stvarno sam se suočila s time u pratećem eksperimentu
09:49
where we were looking at how crows respond to dead crows
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u kojem smo proučavali kako vrane reagiraju na mrtve vrane
09:52
in the absence of any kind of predator.
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kada nema nikakvog grabežljivca.
09:55
And suffice it to say, we found that in these cases,
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Dovoljno je reći da smo u tim slučajevima saznali
09:59
the wakes can get a little more weird.
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da stvari mogu postati malo čudnije.
10:03
So this is what that experimental setup looks like.
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Ovako izgleda pokusna instalacija.
10:05
You can see our stuffed dead crow alone on the sidewalk,
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Možemo vidjeti našu plišanu mrtvu vranu samu na pločniku
10:08
and it's been placed on the territory of a pair.
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i stavljena je na teritorij para.
10:11
(Squawk)
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(Kreštanje)
10:12
That is the alarm call by one of those territorial birds,
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To je alarmni zov jedne od tih teritorijalnih ptica,
10:15
and it's coming into frame.
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i dolazi u okvir.
10:18
Pretty soon, its mate is going to join it.
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Uskoro, njezin partner će joj se pridružiti.
10:23
And so far, this is all very usual.
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Zasad, ovo je sve uobičajeno.
10:26
This is what crows do.
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Ovo je što vrane rade.
10:28
OK, right now it's getting a little less usual.
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OK, sada postaje malo manje uobičajeno.
10:32
Not everyone here might be familiar with what bird sex looks like,
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Nije svatko upoznat s tim kako izgleda ptičji seks
10:36
so if you are not, this is what it looks like.
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pa ako niste, ovako to izgleda.
10:45
You're basically seeing a confluence of three behaviors:
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Praktički vidite sjecište triju ponašanja:
10:49
alarm, as indicated by the alarm calling;
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nemir, naznačen zovovima uzbune,
10:53
aggression, as indicated by the very forceful pecking
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agresiju, naznačenu vrlo nasilnim kljucanjem
10:56
by both one of the copulatory birds and one of the excited bystanders;
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od strane jedne od spolno aktivnih ptica i jednog od uzbuđenih promatrača;
11:01
and sexual arousal.
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i seksualno uzbuđenje.
11:03
Clearly, this is startling,
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Očigledno ovo je iznenađujuće
11:06
and interesting to think about and talk about.
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i zanimljivo za razmišljanje i pričanje.
11:09
But if our goal is to understand
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Ali ako je naš cilj razumjeti
11:12
the big picture of how animals interact with their dead,
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u cijelosti kako se životinje ponašaju sa svojim pokojnima,
11:15
then the most important question we should ask is, is this representative?
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onda je najvažnije pitanje, je li ovo reprezentativno?
11:19
Is this something that's happening consistently?
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Je li ovo nešto što se dosljedno događa?
11:22
And that's why being able to do systematic studies with crows
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Zato je mogućnost da se provode planski studiji s vranama
11:26
is so valuable,
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toliko vrijedna,
11:27
because after conducting hundreds of these trials,
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jer nakon provođenja stotina takvih ispitivanja
11:30
where I was placing these dead crows out on the sidewalks
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u kojima sam položila mrtve vrane na pločnike
11:32
on the territories of hundreds of different pairs,
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na teritorije stotina različitih parova,
11:35
what we found was that, no, it's not.
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saznali smo da ne, nije.
11:38
Contact of any kind,
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Kontakt bilo koje vrste,
11:40
whether it was sexual, aggressive
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bio seksualan, agresivan
11:42
or even just exploratory,
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ili samo izviđajan,
11:44
only occurred 30 percent of the time.
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pojavio se samo 30 posto vremena.
11:47
So given that this wasn't representative,
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S obzirom na to da nije bio reprezentativan,
11:50
this was the minority,
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to je bila manjina,
11:52
we may be tempted to just dismiss it
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možemo biti u iskušenju da ga samo otpustimo,
11:54
as irrelevant, odd, creepy, weird crow behavior.
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bez obzira na to koliko je to nebitno, čudno i jezivo ponašanje vrana.
11:58
But what may surprise you is that behaviors like aggression
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Što bi vas moglo iznenaditi je da su ponašanja poput agresije
12:01
or even sexual arousal
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pa čak i seksualnog uzbuđenja
12:03
aren't all that rare,
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nerijetka,
12:04
and certainly aren't constrained to just crows.
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i sigurno se ne pojavljuju samo kod vrana.
12:08
Because while the popular narrative when it comes to animal death behaviors
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Zato što je popularna priča kada dolazi do ponašanja kod životinjskih smrti
12:12
tends to focus on affiliative behaviors
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vezana za pripadna ponašanja,
12:15
like grooming or guarding,
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poput dotjerivanja i čuvanja,
12:17
that is far from the complete list of what even our closest relatives do
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to je daleko od potpune liste stvari koje čak i naši najbliži rođaci čine
12:21
around their dead.
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oko svojih mrtvih.
12:23
In fact, we've documented behaviors like biting, beating and even sex itself
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Zapravo, dokumentirali smo ponašanja poput ujedanja, tučnjave pa čak i samog seksa
12:29
in a wide variety of animals,
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kod širokog spektra životinja,
12:31
including many primates and dolphins.
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uključujući primate i dupine.
12:35
So where does this leave us in our understanding of animals
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Gdje nas to ostavlja u našem razumijevanju životinja
12:39
and their death rituals?
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i njihovih posmrtnih rituala?
12:41
Well, for crows, it suggests that,
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Pa, za vrane, to sugerira da,
12:43
like insects, they may have a strong adaptive driver
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poput insekata, možda imaju snažni prilagodljivi pokretač
12:47
in their interest in their dead.
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u njihovom interesu za mrtve.
12:49
In this case, it might be danger learning,
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U tom slučaju, moguće da uče u opasnosti,
12:52
and that might have acted as the inspiration
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i da je to služilo kao inspiracija
12:54
for our own rituals as well.
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za naše rituale.
12:57
But when we look more closely,
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Ali kada pogledamo bolje,
12:59
we see that there's no one simple narrative
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vidimo da ne postoji jednostavno objašnjenje
13:01
that can explain the vast array of behaviors
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koje može objasniti širok spektar ponašanja
13:04
we see in crows and many other animals.
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koje vidimo kod vrana i mnogih drugih životinja.
13:08
And that suggests that we are still far from completing that time machine.
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To sugerira da smo još uvijek daleko od dovršavanja tog vremenskog stroja.
13:13
But it's going to be a really fascinating ride.
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Ali, bit će to jako fascinantan put.
13:17
Thank you.
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Hvala.
13:18
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
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