Dare to refuse the origin myths that claim who you are | Chetan Bhatt

翻译人员: Han Yu 校对人员: Yinchun Rui

I'm Chetan Bhatt

我是 Chetan Bhatt，

and when I give my name, I'm often asked, "Where are you from?"

每次我介绍自己名字的时候， 总会有人问我从哪里来。

And I normally say London.

我一般都说是伦敦。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

But of course, I know what they're really asking,

不过当然了，我知道 他们真正想问的是什么，

so I say something like,

所以我就会说，

"Well, my grandparents and my mum were born in India,

我的祖父母和我母亲 是在印度出生的，

my dad and I were born in Kenya,

我爸爸和我在肯尼亚出生，

and I was brought up in London.

我是在伦敦长大的。

And then they've got me mapped.

然后他们就会给我 脑补一张地图出来，

"Ah, you're a Kenyan Asian. I've worked with one of those."

“哦，你是肯尼亚裔亚洲人。 我跟你们那里的人工作过。”

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And from my name they probably assume that I'm a Hindu.

从我的名字来看， 他们可能猜测我是北印度人，

And this sort of fixes me for them.

从而让他们对我 形成了一些固有的印象。

But what about the Christians

但是那些基督徒呢？

and the Muslims and the atheists

还有跟我一起长大的

that I grew up with?

穆斯林以及无神论者？

Or the socialists and the liberals,

又或是那些社会主义 与自由派人士呢？

even the occasional Tory?

甚至偶尔会遇到的保守派党？

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Indeed, all kinds of women and men --

确实，所有的男人和女人们——

vegetable sellers, factory workers, cooks, car mechanics --

菜贩， 工人，厨师， 汽修人员——

living in my working class area,

住在我所在的工薪阶层区域，

in some profoundly important way,

都有着自己非常重要的存在意义，

they are also a part of me

他们同时也是我的一部分，

and are here with me.

并一直与我同在。

Maybe that's why I find it hard to respond to questions about identity

也许这就是为什么 我觉得回答关于自己身份

and about origin.

或是出身的问题很难。

And it's not just a sort of teenage refusal to be labeled.

这并不仅仅是出于类似青春期的 叛逆心理，拒绝别人给自己贴标签，

It's about our own most identities,

而是关于对我们自己来说 最重要的身份，

the ones that we put our hands up to,

那些我们会听到后举手认同的，

the ones that we cheer for,

我们欢呼庆祝的，

the ones that we fight for,

我们为之而战的，

the ones that we love or hate.

那些我们爱或痛恨的。

And it's about how we apprehend ourselves

这是关于我们如何看待自己

as well as others.

以及看待别人。

And it's about identities we just assume that we have

这同时也关系着 那些我们潜意识里

without thinking too much about them.

所认同的那些身份。

But our responses to questions of identity and origin

但是我们对自己身份和出身的反应

have substantial social and political importance.

却有着重大的社会与政治意义。

We see the wars, the rages of identity going on all around us.

我们见识过战争， 那些由身份产生的愤怒。

We see violent religious, national and ethnic disputes.

我们见识过暴力的宗教信仰， 国家和种族之间的对抗。

And often the conflict is based on old stories of identity

通常矛盾往往来源于 关于身份，归属

and belonging

和来源的

and origins.

古老传说。

And these identities are based on myths,

且这些身份认知 是建立在一些迷思上的，

typically about ancient, primordial origins.

一般是古老的， 原始的起源。

And these could be about Adam and Eve

这些可能是关于 亚当和夏娃的故事，

or about the supremacy of a caste or gender

关于种姓制度的权威， 关于性别，

or about the vitality of a supposed race

关于某一个种族的生命力，

or about the past glories of an empire or civilization

关于过去某个王朝 或是人类文明的辉煌，

or about a piece of land

也可能是关于受某些

that some imagined deity has gifted.

想象出来的神明 恩赐的一片土地。

Now, people say

现在人们可能会说，

that origin stories and identity myths make us feel secure.

这些关于身份的起源故事 与迷思给予了我们安全感。

What's wrong with that?

这样说又有什么错呢？

They give us a sense of belonging.

它们让我们有了归属感。

Identity is your cultural clothing,

身份是我们的文化外衣，

and it can make you feel warm and fuzzy inside.

让你内心感到温暖又舒适。

But does it really?

但真的是这样吗?

Do we really need identity myths to feel safe?

我们真的需要这些传说 来给自己安全感吗？

Because I see religious, national, ethnic disputes

因为在我看来，宗教， 国家以及种族间的斗争

as adding to human misery.

反而给人类带来了不幸。

Can I dare you

你敢不敢去

to refuse every origin myth

大胆否认每一个组成你身份的

that claims you?

迷思？

What if we reject every single primordial origin myth

如果我们拒绝任何一个 有关我们身份的起源迷思，

and develop a deeper sense of personhood,

并且获得对人格品质 更深的理解呢？

one responsible to humanity as a whole

这种理解对全人类，

rather than to a particular tribe,

而不只是对一个种族负责；

a radically different idea of humanity

一个对于人性完全不同的理解，

that exposes how origin myths mystify,

揭露了起源迷思如何神秘化，

disguise global power,

揭露了伪装的全球力量，

rapacious exploitation,

贪婪的剥削，

poverty, the worldwide oppression of women and girls,

贫穷，以及全球范围内 对女人和儿童的压迫，

and of course massive, accelerating inequalities?

当然还有大规模， 在极速加剧的的不平等现象。

Now, origin myths are closely linked to tradition,

在当代，起源迷思通常 跟传统是紧密相连的，

and the word tradition points to something old

“传统”二字通常指的是老旧的东西，

and permanent, almost natural,

并且是永恒的，几乎是自然存在的，

and people assume tradition is just history,

人们认为传统仅仅是历史，

simply the past condensed into a nice story.

只是把过去 浓缩成了一个动人的故事。

But let's not confuse tradition with history.

但是我们不应该将历史和传统混淆。

The two are often in severe conflict.

这两者经常水火不容。

Origin stories are usually recently created fictions of ancient belonging,

起源的传说通常是为了解释古代 种族间的归属关系而虚构出来的，

and they're absurd

它们很荒唐，

given the complexity of humanity

在人性如此复杂的世界里，

and our vastly interconnected, even if very unequal world.

我们彼此间都有千丝万缕的联系， 即使是在不平等的社会里。

And today we see claims to tradition

然而在今天， 我们见到了那些声称是传统

that claim to be ancient

并且古老的传说，

changing rapidly in front of our eyes.

正在迅速的变化着。

I was brought up in the 1970s near Wembley

我是在 70 年代的 Wembley 地区，一个有着

with Asian, English, Caribbean, Irish families living in our street,

亚洲，英国，加勒比和爱尔兰等家庭的 多元文化背景环境里长大的。

and the neo-Nazi National Front was massive then

那时候新纳粹阵营非常兴盛，

with regular marches and attacks on us

时不时的针对并攻击我们， 这对我们形成了

and a permanent threat

一个长久的威胁，

and often a frequent reality of violence against us

我们时常在街上，在家中

on the streets, in our homes,

受到新纳粹

typically by neo-Nazis and other racists.

以及其他种族主义者的暴力对待。

And I remember during a general election a leaflet came through our letter box

我记得有一次大选， 一个宣传册出现在了我们的信箱里，

with a picture of the National Front candidate for our area.

上面有一张本地全国候选人的照片。

And the picture

那张照片上的人

was of our next-door neighbor.

正是我们的邻居。

He threatened to shoot me once when I played in the garden as a kid,

我小时候在公园里玩耍时， 他曾经威胁要拿枪打我，

and many weekends, shaven-headed National Front activists

连着好几个周末， 一些剃了头的政选积极分子

arrived at his house

会来到他家，

and emerged with scores of placards

拿着一堆宣传画报，

screaming that they wanted us to go back home.

喊着让我们滚回家去。

But today he's one of my mum's best mates.

但是今天，他却是 我妈妈最好的朋友之一。

He's a very lovely, gentle and kind man,

他是个很可亲，很绅士， 并且很善良的人，

and at some point in his political journey out of fascism

在他某一段 法西斯主义的政治生涯中。

he embraced a broader idea of humanity.

他接受了对人性更高层面的理解。

There was a Hindu family that we got to know well --

曾经有一个北印度家庭 跟我们相交甚好，

and you have to understand that life in our street

我得说，在我们那条街上的生活

was a little bit like the setting for an Asian soap opera.

有点像亚洲的肥皂剧场景。

每个人都知道别人的隐私，

Everyone knew everyone else's business,

even if they didn't want it to be known by anyone at all.

即使他们并不想被别人知道。

但是在这件事上你是没有选择的。

You really had no choice in this matter.

But in this family, there was a quiet little boy

但是在这个家庭里， 有一个安静的小男孩，

who went to the same school as I did,

我们俩去的同一所学校，

and after I left school, I didn't hear much more about him,

我离开学校后， 就没再听说过 关于他的什么消息了，

except that he'd gone off to India.

除了他离开去了印度。

Now around 2000,

在 2000 年左右,

I remember seeing this short book.

我记得看到了一本薄薄的册子。

The book was unusual

那本书很不同寻常，

because it was written by a British supporter of Al Qaeda,

因为作者是一个英国籍的 基地组织成员，

and in it the author calls for attacks in Britain.

在书里面，作者在召唤 对英国实施恐怖袭击。

This is in 1999,

那本书写于 1999 年，

so 9/11 and the invasion of Iraq was still in the future,

那时 911 事件 与伊拉克入侵还没有发生，

and he helped scout New York bombing targets.

他参与了帮助招募 纽约的炸弹袭击者。

He taught others how to make a dirty bomb to use on the London Underground,

他教别人如何在伦敦地铁里 安装放射性炸弹，

and he plotted a massive bombing campaign in London's shopping areas.

还谋划了一次 在伦敦购物区的大规模爆炸。

He's a very high-risk security prisoner in the UK

他是英国最危险的犯人之一，

and one of the most important Al Qaeda figures to be arrested in Britain.

也是英国最想逮捕的 基地组织的首脑成员之一。

The author of that book

那本书的作者，

was the very same quiet little boy

正是当年那个一言不发， 跟我在同一所学校

who went to my school.

读书的小男孩。

So a Hindu boy from Britain

所以一个来自 大不列颠的北印度男孩，

became an Al Qaeda fighter

变成了一个基地组织分子，

and a most-wanted international terrorist,

一个全球范围内通缉的罪犯，

and he rejected what people would call his Hindu or Indian or British identity,

他拒绝了人们给他的 北印度或英国人身份，

and he became someone else.

变成了另一个人。

He refused to be who he was.

他拒绝做本来的自己，

He recreated himself,

并创造了一个新的自己，

and this kind of journey is very common

这其实对于很多后来参与了

for young men and women

基地组织或伊斯兰国，

who become involved in Al Qaeda or Islamic State

或者其他跨国武装组织的 青年男女来说，

or other transnational armed groups.

是很正常的事情。

Al Qaeda's media spokesman is a white American

基地组织的发言人是一个美国白人，

from a Jewish and Catholic mixed background,

拥有犹太和天主教混合的家庭背景，

and neither he nor the boy from my school

他和跟我一同上学的那个男孩

were from Muslim backgrounds.

都没有穆斯林背景。

There's no point in asking them where are they from.

所以问他们从哪里来并没有意义，

A more important question is where they're going.

更重要的问题应该是 他们选择要到哪里去。

And I would also put it to you

我也想让你们明白，

that exactly the same journey occurs for those young men and women

同样的历程也在许许多多

who were brought up in Muslim family backgrounds.

拥有穆斯林背景的 青年们身上重演着。

Most of those who join Al Qaeda

大部分来自世界各地，

and other Salafi jihadi groups from Europe, Asia, North America,

甚至中东地区的加入了基地组织

even in many cases the Middle East

以及萨拉非圣战的青年，

are those who have comprehensively rejected their backgrounds

都彻底拒绝了他们自己本来的身份，

to become, in essence, new people.

重新变成了另一个人。

They spend an enormous amount of time attacking their parents' backgrounds

他们不顾一切地攻击 父母的身份背景，

as profane, impure, blasphemous,

称它们是粗俗的，不纯净的， 以及亵渎神灵的，

the wrong type of Islam,

是一种错误的伊斯兰信仰，

and their vision instead

而他们的视角则是一种

is a fantastical view of cosmic apocalypse.

以宇宙毁灭为根基的荒诞理念。

It's a born again vision.

那是一种重生的信念。

Discard your past, your society, your family and friends

摒弃你的过去，你成长的社会， 你的家庭与朋友，

since they're all impure.

因为他们都是不纯洁的。

Instead, become someone else,

反之，去变成另一个人

your true self,

你真正的，

your authentic self.

真实的自我。

Now, this isn't about a return to the past.

但这可不是关于回到过去，

It's about using a forgery of the past

而是用过去作为一个虚假的理由，

to envision an appalling future which begins today at year zero.

去开创一个恐怖的新世纪。

This is why over 80 percent of the victims of Al Qaeda and Islamic State

这就是为什么超过 80% 的 基地组织和伊斯兰国受害者

are people from Muslim backgrounds.

都拥有穆斯林背景。

The first act by Salafi jihadi groups when they take over an area

通常，萨拉非圣战组织 占领一个新地区时，

is to destroy existing Muslim institutions

做的第一件事就是 摧毁现有的穆斯林机构。

including mosques, shrines, preachers, practices.

包括寺庙，神龛， 传教士及各种宗教仪式。

Their main purpose is to control and punish people internally,

他们的主要目的是从内部 控制以及惩罚人们，

to dictate the spaces that women may go,

决定女人该去的地方，

their clothing, family relations,

衣着，家庭关系，

beliefs, even the minute detail of how one prays.

信仰，甚至诸如一个人 应该怎样祈祷这样的细节。

And you get the impression in the news

媒体给你们的印象可能是

that they are after us in the West,

他们只是冲着我们西方国家来，

but they are actually mainly after people from other Muslim backgrounds.

但他们的主要目标其实是 拥有其他穆斯林背景的人们。

In their view, no other Muslim can ever be pure enough,

在他们眼里，没有其他的穆斯林 是和他们一样纯洁的，

so ordinary beliefs and practices that have existed for centuries

所以那些已经存在 并运行了几百年的信仰

are attacked as impure

被那些从伯明翰或伦敦来的

by teenagers from Birmingham or London

对历史一窍不通的

who know nothing

青少年们肆意攻击，

about the histories that they so joyously obliterate.

称之为不纯洁。

Now here, their claim to tradition is at war with history,

现在，他们所谓的传统 与历史产生了冲突，

but they're nevertheless very certain about their purity

但他们仍然坚信自己是纯洁的，

and about the impurity of others.

他人都是不纯洁的，

Purity,

纯洁，

certainty,

确定性，

the return to authentic tradition,

回归到正规传统，

the quest for these can lead to lethal visions

以及对这些观点的探索

of perfect societies and perfected people.

都是对于建设完美社会的 致命性的看法。

This is what the main Hindu fundamentalist organization in India

这是印度境内主要的 北印度原教旨主义

looks like today at its mass rally.

组织的群众集会。

Maybe it reminds you of the 1930s in Italy or Germany,

这可能让你想到了 30 年代的德国或者意大利，

and the movement's roots are indeed in fascism.

这些运动的根源 的确是法西斯主义。

It was a member of the same Hindu fundamentalist movement

这正是枪杀了甘地的同一个

who shot dead Mahatma Gandhi.

北印度原教旨主义运动的成员。

Hindu fundamentalists today view this murderer as a national hero,

现今的北印度原教旨主义分子们 依然把这个杀手视为国家英雄,

and they want to put up statues of him throughout India.

并想在印度为他树立雕塑。

They've been involved for decades

几十年来，他们不断参与

in large-scale mass violence against minorities.

针对少数派的大规模暴力运动。

They ban books, art, films.

他们禁止了书籍，艺术，电影，

They attack romantic couples on Valentine's Day,

还袭击了庆祝情人节的情侣们，

Christians on Christmas Day.

庆祝圣诞节的基督徒们。

They don't like others talking critically

他们不喜欢别人批评

about what they see as their ancient culture

他们眼中自己古老的文化，

or using its images

或者使用相关的图片，

or caricaturing it

或者把它画成漫画，

or drawing cartoons about it.

做成动画。

But the people making the strongest possible claims

但是那些对古老的， 永恒的北印度宗教

about ancient, timeless Hindu religion

立场最坚定的人

are dressed in brown shorts and white shirts

是那些穿着棕色短裤 和白色衬衫的人，

while claiming, oddly,

尽管他们很奇怪的声称自己

to be the original Aryan race,

为最古老的雅利安种族，

just like the violent Salafi jihadis

跟那些同样表明自己

who make their claims about their primordial religion

古老出身的残暴的 萨拉非组织成员几乎如出一辙，

while dressed in black military uniforms

只不过他们是身着黑色军服，

and wearing balaclavas.

并蒙着头罩的。

These people are manufacturing pure, pristine identities of conviction

这些人捏造着他们纯洁的， 质朴的身份谎言

and of certainty.

以及确定性。

Fundamentalists see religion and culture as their sole property, a property.

原教旨教徒把宗教与文化 视为他们自己的一种“财产”。

But religions and cultures are processes.

但是宗教与文化是一种过程，

They're not things. They're impermanent. They're messy. They're impure.

它们不是物件，不是一成不变的； 它们是混乱的，不纯洁的。

Look at any religion and you'll see disputes and arguments

你会发现，其实任何宗教

going all the way down.

都充满了争辩与矛盾。

Any criticism of religion in any form

关于宗教的任何形式的批评

has to therefore be

都应该是

part of the expansive sense of humanity

我们所敬仰的 更广义的人性定义的

we should aspire to.

一部分。

I respect your right to have and to express your religion

我尊重你拥有自己的宗教和文化，

or your culture or your opinion,

以及表达它们的权利，

but I don't necessarily have to respect the content.

但是我不一定非要尊重其中的内容。

I might like some of it.

我也许会喜欢某一部分，

I might like how an old church looks, for example,

我可能会觉得 一座古老的教堂很好看，

but this isn't the same thing.

但这不是一回事。

Similarly, I have a human right

同样，我也有表达自己观点的权利，

to say something that you may find offensive,

尽管我的观点可能会冒犯到你，

but you do not have a human right not to be offended.

但是你并没有不被冒犯的权利。

In a genuine democracy, we're constantly offended

在真正的民主中， 我们一直都在被冒犯着，

since people express different views all the time.

因为人民无时无刻 都在表达着不同的观点。

They also change their views,

他们也会改变自己的观点，

so their views are impermanent.

所以他们的观点是一直在变化的。

You cannot fix someone's political views

你无法改正一个人基于他们的

based on their religious or national or cultural background.

宗教，国家或文化背景 所产生的政治观点。

Now, these points about religious purity

这些关于宗教纯正性的观点

also apply to nationalism and to racism.

也同样适用于民族主义和种族歧视。

I'm always puzzled

我一直很费解，

to have pride in your national or ethnic identity,

为什么要为你的国家 或种族的身份骄傲，

pride in the accident of birth from a warm and cozy womb,

为你从一个温暖舒适的母体里 生出来这件事骄傲，

belief in your superiority because of the accident of birth.

相信因为由出生而带来的优越感。

These people have very firm ideas

这些人很坚定的相信

about what belongs and what doesn't belong

在他们所想象出来的 舒适的种族文化里，

inside the cozy national cultures that they imagine.

什么是属于这里的， 什么是不属于的。

And I'm going to caricature a bit here, but only a little bit.

我在这里要稍微讽刺的比喻下，

I want you to imagine the supporter of some Little Englander

我想让你想象下 一些英国本土主义以及

or British nationalist political party,

英国民族主义的支持者，

and he's sitting at home

他坐在家里

and he's screaming about foreigners

叫嚷着要赶走 那些入侵他们国家的

invading his country

外籍人士，

while watching Fox News,

与此同时还看着福克斯新闻，

an American cable channel

一个由澳洲人掌管的

owned by an Australian

美国有限电视频道，

on his South Korean television set

在他从韩国购买的电视机上播放着，

which was bought by his Spanish credit card

电视机是用他的 西班牙信用卡购买的，

which is paid off monthly by his high-street British bank

每月由在英国繁华商业街上的 银行所支付，

which has its headquarters in Hong Kong.

而银行的总部位于香港。

He supports a British football team owned by a Russian.

他支持一只由俄罗斯掌管的 英国足球队。

His favorite brand of fish and chips

他最喜欢的鱼和薯条品牌

is owned by a Swedish venture capitalist firm.

由一家瑞典资本风险家公司经营。

The church he sometimes goes to

他有时会去的教堂的信条

has its creed decided in meetings in Ghana.

是在加纳举行的会议中建立的。

His Union Jack underpants

他印有英国国旗花纹的内裤

were made in India.

是在印度制作的。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And --

还有——

(Applause)

（掌声）

Thank you.

谢谢。

And they're laundered regularly

然后那条内裤是在干洗店里 由一位漂亮的波兰女士

by a very nice Polish lady.

定期清洗的。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

There is no pure ethnicity, national culture,

所以根本没有纯洁的 种族或国家文化之说，

and the ethical choices we have today

我们今天能够做出的道德选择范畴

are far wider than being forced to choose

已远远超出了我们被迫在

between racist right and religious right visions,

对文化所持有的种族右翼主义 和宗教右翼的，悲观的观点之间

dismal visions of culture.

所做出的选择。

Now, culture isn't just about language, food, clothing and music,

在今天，文化早已不单单是 关于语言，食物，衣服和音乐，

but gender relations, ancient monuments,

也包含性别关系，以及古老的遗迹，

a heritage of sacred texts.

即神圣文字的遗产。

But culture can also be what has been decided to be culture

但是文化也可以被那些

by those who have a political stake

善于把文化打造成

in pounding culture into the shape of a prison.

一所无形监狱的政客们所定义。

Big political identity claims are elite bids for power.

关于政治身份的主张 都是精英们积攒权力的筹码。

They're not answers to social or economic or political injustices.

它们并不是社会经济 以及政治不平等问题的答案，

They often obscure them.

反而会混淆视听。

And what about the large number of people across the globe

那么全世界那么多

who can't point to a monument from their past,

没有伟大历史遗迹，

who don't possess a sacred written text,

没有神圣文字遗产，

who can't hark back

无法倾听

to the past glories of a civilization or empire?

文明社会以及古老王国 往昔辉煌的人们呢？

Are these people less a part of humanity?

难道他们在人类种族中 就低人一等吗?

What about you,

正在聆听这段演讲的

now, listening to this?

各位呢？

What about you and your identity,

你们有着什么样的身份认知？

because you stitch your experiences and your thoughts into a continuous person

因为你用你的经验和思想 编织成了一个完整的，

moving forward in time.

在时间中前行的个人。

And this is what you are when you say,

当你说“我” 或“本人“的时候，

"I," "am," or "me."

这就是你自己的身份。

But this also includes all of your hopes and dreams,

但这也包涵了你所有的梦想和希望，

all of the you's that could have been,

所有你本来能变成的一切，

and it includes all the other people

也包括了所有其他人

and the things that are in the biography of who you are.

以及在你个人历程中的所有事情。

They, the others,

他们，其他人，

are also a part of you,

也是你的一部分，

moving forward with you.

跟你一同前进。

Your authentic self, if such a thing exists,

你真实的自我， 如果这个东西存在的话，

is a complex, messy and uncertain self,

其实是一个复杂， 混乱和不确定的自我，

and that is a very good thing.

但是这是一件很好的事。

Why not value those impurities and uncertainties?

为什么不珍惜那些 所谓的不纯洁和不确定呢?

Maybe clinging to pure identities is a sign of immaturity,

也许固执地坚守着纯洁的身份 是一种不成熟的标志，

and ethnic, nationalist and religious traditions are bad for you.

那些关于种族，民族以及 信仰的传统对你是有害的。

Why not be skeptical about every primordial origin claim

为什么不尝试去质疑那些 为你创作好的

made on your behalf?

古老的起源传说呢？

Why not reject the identity myths that call on you to belong,

为什么不尝试拒绝那些政客， 以及那些所谓的

that politicians and community leaders,

社区领导者强加在你身上的，

so-called community leaders,

召唤你去归属的

place on you?

身份传说呢？

If we don't need origin stories and fixed identities,

如果我们不需要起源传说 以及固定的身份，

we can challenge ourselves to think creatively

我们就可以挑战自己 并创造性地思考

about each other and our future.

彼此的未来。

And here culture always takes care of itself.

然而文化一直就知道 自己怎样照顾自己。

I'm not worried about culture.

我并不担心文化。

Cultures are creative, dynamic processes,

文化是有创意性的，有活力的过程，

not imposed laws and boundaries.

并不是强制的法律和界限。

This is Abu al-Walid Muhammad ibn Ahmad ibn Rushd,

这是 Abu al-Walid Muhammad ibn Ahmad ibn Rushd,

a very senior Muslim judge and thinker in Cordoba in the 12th century,

12 世纪科多巴一位 高级穆斯林法官和思想领袖，

and his writings were considered deeply blasphemous, heretical and evil.

他的作品被认为是亵渎神灵的， 异教的，以及邪恶的。

Long after he died,

他死后很久，

followers of his work were ruthlessly hunted down,

追随他的支持者们几个世纪以来

banished and killed over several centuries

一直被中世纪最强大的一个宗教集团

by the most powerful religious institution of the medieval period.

无情的追捕，驱逐甚至杀害。

That institution was the Roman Catholic Church.

这个集团便是罗马天主教会。

Why?

为什么？

Because ibn Rushd said that something true in religion

因为 ibn Rushd 说过， 宗教中的一些真相

may conflict with something

可能会跟理智告诉你

that your reason finds to be true on earth,

什么是真实的产生矛盾，

but the latter is still true.

但后者依然是真实的。

There are two distinct worlds of truth,

存在两个完全不同的真理的世界，

one based on our reason and evidence, and one that is divine,

一种是基于你的理智和证据， 另一个是基于神灵。

and the state, political power, social law are in the realm of reason.

国家，政治力量， 社会法律是在理智范畴之内的，

Religious life is a different realm.

而宗教生活则属于另一个领域，

They should be kept separated.

它们应该彼此分隔开。

Social and political life should be governed by our reason,

社会和政治生活应该是 被我们的理智所引导的，

not by religion.

而不是宗教。

And you can see why the church was upset by his writings,

这样你就明白为什么 教会对他的文字感到不安，

as indeed were some Muslims during his lifetime,

就像他在世时的一些穆斯林一样，

because he gives us a strong statement of secularism

因为他传达给了我们 很强烈的世俗理念，

of a kind which is normal in Europe today.

这种理念在当代的欧洲 其实已经比较正常了。

Now, history plays many tricks on us.

现在历史开始捉弄我们，

It undermines our fixed truths

它破坏了一成不变的真理，

and what we believe to be our culture and their culture.

以及我们所相信的 自己和他人的文化。

Ibn Rushd, someone who happens to be a Muslim,

ibn Rushd, 一个正好身为穆斯林的人，

is considered one of the key influences

被认为是世俗论

in the introduction and spread of secularism in Europe.

进入并在欧洲传播的关键人物。

So against religious, nationalist and racial purists of all kinds,

那么，你愿意与所有的宗教主义者， 民族主义者，以及种族纯结论者对立，

can you make his story a part of your own,

把这段历史也变成你自己的故事吗？

not because he happened to be a Muslim,

不是因为他刚好是一个穆斯林，

not because he happened to be an Arab,

也不是因为他刚好是一个阿拉伯人，

but because he was a human being

而是因为他是

with some very good ideas

一个用很棒的想法

that shook his world

动摇了他的世界，

and ours.

以及我们所有人的世界的人。

Thank you.

谢谢大家。

(Applause)

（鼓掌）