Shonda Rhimes and Cyndi Stivers: The future of storytelling | TED

Translator: Adrià Ormazábal Muñoz Reviewer: Noelia Vidal

Cyndi Stivers: So, future of storytelling.

Cyndi Stivers: El futur de la narració.

Before we do the future,

Abans de fer el futur,

let's talk about what is never going to change about storytelling.

parlem del que no canviarà mai a la narració.

Shonda Rhimes: What's never going to change.

Shonda Rhimes: El que no canviarà mai.

Obviously, I think good stories are never going to change,

Òbviament, crec que una bona història no canviarà mai,

the need for people to gather together and exchange their stories

la necessitat de les persones de reunir-se i intercanviar històries

and to talk about the things that feel universal,

i parlar sobre les coses que consideren universals,

the idea that we all feel a compelling need to watch stories,

la idea de la necessitat que tots sentim de mirar històries,

to tell stories, to share stories --

de contar-les, de compartir-les

sort of the gathering around the campfire

com una mena de reunió al voltant del foc

to discuss the things that tell each one of us

per debatre les coses que ens diuen

that we are not alone in the world.

que no estem sols al món.

Those things to me are never going to change.

Per a mi, aquestes coses no canviaran mai.

That essence of storytelling is never going to change.

Aquesta essència de la narració no canviarà mai.

CS: OK. In preparation for this conversation,

CS: Per preparar aquesta conversa,

I checked in with Susan Lyne,

he parlat amb la Susan Lyne,

who was running ABC Entertainment

qui estava al càrrec d'ABC Entertainment

when you were working on "Grey's Anatomy" --

quan tu treballaves a "Anatomía de Grey"...

SR: Yes.

SR: Sí.

CS: And she said that there was this indelible memory she had

CS: I em va dir que tenia un record inesborrable

of your casting process,

del teu càsting,

where without discussing it with any of the executives,

quan sense haver-ho tractat amb cap dels executius,

you got people coming in to read for your scripts,

rebies gent per llegir els teus guions,

and every one of them was the full range of humanity,

i cada persona era diferent a l'anterior,

you did not type anyone in any way,

i no les classificaves de cap manera,

and that it was completely surprising.

i això era totalment sorprenent.

So she said, in addition to retraining the studio executives,

Així, a més d'educar els executius de l'estudi, va dir

you also, she feels,

que tu també, segons ella,

and I think this is -- I agree,

i crec que es així,

retrained the expectations of the American TV audience.

vas transformar les expectatives de la tele-audiència americana.

So what else does the audience not yet realize that it needs?

Què més hi ha que l'audiència encara no s'ha adonat que necessita?

SR: What else does it not yet realize?

SR: Què és el que encara no veu?

Well, I mean, I don't think we're anywhere near there yet.

Vull dir, no crec que estiguem en aquesta fase encara.

I mean, we're still in a place

Vull dir, encara estem en un lloc

in which we're far, far behind what looks like the real world in actuality.

distant, llunyà del que sembla el món real.

I wasn't bringing in a bunch of actors

Jo no portava un grup d'actors

who looked very different from one another

ben diferents els uns dels altres

simply because I was trying to make a point,

només per destacar res concret

and I wasn't trying to do anything special.

i no intentava fer res d'especial.

It never occurred to me that that was new, different or weird.

Mai vaig pensar que allò era nou, diferent o estrany.

I just brought in actors because I thought they were interesting

Només portava actors perquè em semblaven interessants

and to me, the idea that it was completely surprising to everybody --

i crec que aquesta idea sorprenia a tothom -

I didn't know that for a while.

Al principi no ho sabia.

I just thought: these are the actors I want to see play these parts.

Només pensava: aquests són els actors que vull en aquestes escenes.

I want to see what they look like if they read.

Vull veure com són quan llegeixen.

We'll see what happens.

Veurem què passa.

So I think the interesting thing that happens is

Trobo interessant que

that when you look at the world through another lens,

quan mires el món d'una altra manera

when you're not the person normally in charge of things,

quan no ets la persona que acostuma a ser al càrrec de les coses,

it just comes out a different way.

les coses acaben sent diferents.

CS: So you now have this big machine that you run,

CS: Ara tens aquesta gran empresa que dirigeixes,

as a titan -- as you know, last year when she gave her talk --

com un tità - com sabeu, de l'any passat quan donà la xerrada -

she's a titan.

ella és un tità.

So what do you think is going to happen as we go on?

Què penses que passarà mirant endavant?

There's a huge amount of money involved in producing these shows.

Hi ha grans quantitats de diners invertits en la producció dels programes.

While the tools of making stories have gone and gotten greatly democratized,

Mentre que les eines per crear històries s'han popularitzat bastant,

there's still this large distribution:

hi continua havent aquesta gran distribució:

people who rent networks, who rent the audience to advertisers

les persones que lloguen les xarxes, que lloguen l'audiència als patrocinadors

and make it all pay.

i fan que tot rendeixi.

How do you see the business model changing now that anyone can be a storyteller?

Com canvia el model de negoci ara que qualsevol pot ser narrador?

SR: I think it's changing every day.

SR: Crec que això canvia cada dia.

I mean, the rapid, rapid change that's happening is amazing.

És a dir, el ràpid canvi que està tenint lloc és impressionant

And I feel -- the panic is palpable,

I sento que el pànic és palpable,

and I don't mean that in a bad way.

però no en el mal sentit.

I think it's kind of exciting.

Penso que això és excitant.

The idea that there's sort of an equalizer happening,

La idea de que es produeix una mena d'equalització,

that sort of means that anybody can make something, is wonderful.

que ve a dir que tothom pot crear alguna cosa, és meravellós.

I think there's some scary in the idea that you can't find the good work now.

Crec que hi ha quelcom alarmant en la idea que ara no es pot trobar la bona feina.

There's so much work out there.

Hi ha tanta cosa...

I think there's something like 417 dramas on television right now

Crec que actualment hi ha al voltant de 417 drames a la televisió

at any given time in any given place,

a qualsevol hora i a qualsevol lloc,

but you can't find them.

però no els pots trobar.

You can't find the good ones.

No pots trobar els bons.

So there's a lot of bad stuff out there because everybody can make something.

Per això, hi ha molt material dolent ja que tothom pot crear alguna cosa.

It's like if everybody painted a painting.

És com si tothom pintés un quadre.

You know, there's not that many good painters.

No hi ha tants pintors bons.

But finding the good stories, the good shows,

Però trobar bones històries i bons programes

is harder and harder and harder.

és cada cop més i més difícil.

Because if you have one tiny show over here on AMC

Ja que si tens un petit programa a l'AMC

and one tiny show over here over there,

i un altre petit programa aquí i allà,

finding where they are becomes much harder.

trobar on són esdevé molt més complicat.

So I think that ferreting out the gems

Crec que descobrir les autèntiques joies

and finding out who made the great webisode and who made this,

i trobar qui féu el gran episodi online i qui féu això

it's -- I mean, think about the poor critics

és -- pensa en els pobres crítics

who now are spending 24 hours a day

que dediquen les 24 hores diàries,

trapped in their homes watching everything.

atrapats a casa seva, mirant-ho tot.

It's not an easy job right now.

No és una feina fàcil ara mateix.

So the distribution engines are getting more and more vast,

Els motors de distribució es tornen cada cop més immensos,

but finding the good programming for everybody in the audience

però trobar una programació adient per a tots els espectadors

is getting harder.

és cada cop més difícil.

And unlike the news,

I, a diferència de les notícies,

where everything's getting winnowed down to just who you are,

on tot es redueix a qui ets tu,

television seems to be getting --

sembla que la televisió,

and by television I mean anything you can watch, television shows on --

i quan dic televisió em refereixo a allò que pots veure com els tele-programes,

seems to be getting wider and wider and wider.

s'estigui ampliant cada cop més.

And so anybody's making stories,

Tothom està creant històries,

and the geniuses are sometimes hidden.

i els genis sovint estan amagats.

But it's going to be harder to find,

Però són cada cop més difícils de trobar,

and at some point that will collapse.

i arribarà un punt que s'ensorrarà.

People keep talking about peak TV.

Es parla del punt àlgid de la TV.

I don't know when that's going to happen.

No sé quan hi arribarem.

I think at some point it'll collapse a little bit

Penso que en algun moment es començarà a ensorrar

and we'll, sort of, come back together.

i d'alguna manera ho refarem.

I don't know if it will be network television.

Potser no seran les cadenes de televisió.

I don't know if that model is sustainable.

No sé si és un model sostenible.

CS: What about the model

CS: Què en penses sobre el model

that Amazon and Netflix are throwing a lot of money around right now.

en què Amazon i Netflix estan invertint molts diners actualment?

SR: That is true.

SR: És veritat.

I think it's an interesting model.

Crec que és un model interessant.

I think there's something exciting about it.

Crec que té un punt excitant.

For content creators, I think there's something exciting about it.

Per als creadors de contingut, crec que hi ha quelcom fascinant.

For the world, I think there's something exciting about it.

Per al món, crec que també té un punt excitant.

The idea that there are programs now

El fet de que ara hi ha programes

that can be in multiple languages with characters from all over the world

que poden ser en diverses llengües amb personatges d'arreu del món

that are appealing and come out for everybody at the same time

que són atractius i que representen a tothom alhora

is exciting.

és fascinant.

I mean, I think the international sense that television can now take on

Crec que el sentit internacional que la televisió pot adquirir ara

makes sense to me,

té sentit per a mi,

that programming can now take on.

que la programació pot prendre ara.

Television so much is made for, like -- here's our American audience.

En gran part la televisió està feta per l'audiència americana.

We make these shows,

Fem aquests programes,

and then they shove them out into the world

i després es venen per tot el món

and hope for the best,

sense pensar-hi massa,

as opposed to really thinking about the fact that America is not it.

a diferència de pensar que Amèrica no ho és tot.

I mean, we love ourselves and everything, but it's not i.

Vull dir, que ens estimem i tal, però no ho som tot.

And we should be taking into account the fact

I hauríem de considerar que

that there are all of these other places in the world

hi ha altres llocs al món

that we should be interested in while we're telling stories.

que ens haurien d'interessar mentre contem històries.

It makes the world smaller.

Això empetiteix el món.

I don't know.

No ho sé.

I think it pushes forward the idea that the world is a universal place,

Crec que treu a la llum la idea de que el món és universal,

and our stories become universal things.

i les històries esdevenen universals.

We stop being other.

Deixem de ser l'altre.

CS: You've pioneered, as far as I can see,

CS: Pel que veig, també has promogut

interesting ways to launch new shows, too.

formes curioses de llençar programes nous.

I mean, when you launched "Scandal" in 2012,

Per exemple, quan vas estrenar "Scandal" al 2012,

there was this amazing groundswell of support on Twitter

hi va haver una extraordinària onada de suport a Twitter

the likes of which nobody had seen before.

com no s'havia vist abans.

Do you have any other tricks up your sleeve

Guardes algun altre truc a la màniga

when you launch your next one?

per les teves futures estrenes?

What do you think will happen in that regard?

Què creus que passarà en aquest sentit?

SR: We do have some interesting ideas.

SR: Tenim algunes propostes interessants.

We have a show called "Still Star-Crossed" coming out this summer.

Tenim un programa, "Still Star-Crossed", que s'estrena a l'estiu.

We have some interesting ideas for that.

Tenim vàries idees curioses.

I'm not sure if we're going to be able to do them in time.

No estic segura de si les podrem complir a temps.

I thought they were fun.

Creia que eren divertides

But the idea that we would live-tweet our show

La idea de piular el programa en directe

was really just us thinking that would be fun.

ens va semblar que seria divertit.

We didn't realize that the critics would start to live-tweet along with us.

No vam preveure que els crítics començarien a interactuar amb nosaltres.

But the fans -- getting people to be a part of it,

Però els fans, integrar la gent al programa,

making it more of a campfire --

com si fos el foc de camp,

you know, when you're all on Twitter together

quan estem tots junts a Twitter

and you're all talking together,

i parlem tots alhora,

it is more of a shared experience,

és més una experiència compartida,

and finding other ways to make that possible

i trobar altres maneres per fer-la possible

and finding other ways to make people feel engaged

i trobar formes per comprometre a les persones

is important.

és important.

CS: So when you have all those different people making stories

CS: Quan hi ha tantes persones creant històries

and only some of them are going to break through

i només algunes prosperen

and get that audience somehow,

i arriben a enganxar a l'audiència,

how do you think storytellers will get paid?

com creus que cobraran als narradors?

SR: I actually have been struggling with this concept as well.

SR: Francament, tinc problemes amb aquest concepte.

Is it going to be a subscriber model?

Serà un format de subscripció?

Are people going to say, like, I'm going to watch this particular person's shows,

Dirà la gent, "veuré el programa d'aquest,"

and that's how we're going to do it?

i és així com ho farem?

CS: I think we should buy a passport to Shondaland. Right?

CS: Hauríem de comprar un passaport a Shondaland, oi?

SR: I don't know about that, but yeah. That's a lot more work for me.

SR: No ho sé, potser sí. És una feinada per a mi.

I do think that there are going to be different ways,

Crec que hi haurà diverses maneres d'atreure a l'audiència,

but I don't know necessarily.

però no ho sé ben bé.

I mean, I'll be honest and say a lot of content creators

Honestament, molts creadors de contingut

are not necessarily interested in being distributors,

no estan interessats en ser distribuïdors,

mainly because what I dream of doing

sobretot perquè el que somio fer

is creating content.

és crear contingut.

I really love to create content.

M'encanta crear contingut.

I want to get paid for it

Vull cobrar per això

and I want to get paid the money that I deserve to get paid for it,

i vull cobrar el salari que em mereixo,

and there's a hard part in finding that.

i és bastant complicat trobar-lo.

But I also want it to be made possible

Però també vull que sigui possible

for, you know, the people who work with me,

per la gent que treballa amb mi,

the people who work for me,

els que treballen per a mi,

everybody to sort of get paid in a way, and they're all making a living.

que tothom acabi cobrant, i pugui guanyar-se la vida.

How it gets distributed is getting harder and harder.

La forma com es distribueix el contingut es complica cada cop més.

CS: How about the many new tools,

CS: I què passa amb les moltes eines noves,

you know, VR, AR ...

com ara: RV, RA...

I find it fascinating that you can't really binge-watch,

Trobo fascinant que puguis veure tota una sèries de cop,

you can't fast-forward in those things.

que puguis tirar endavant en aquestes coses.

What do you see as the future of those for storytelling?

Com veus el futur de RV i RA per la narració?

SR: I spent a lot of time in the past year

SR: L'any passat vaig dedicar molt temps

just exploring those,

a explorar això,

getting lots of demonstrations and paying attention.

en moltes demostracions i parant atenció.

I find them fascinating,

Ho trobo fascinant,

mainly because I think that --

principalment perquè crec que...

I think most people think of them for gaming,

opino que la majoria les veu com a eines pel joc,

I think most people think of them for things like action,

Penso que la gent les concep per l'acció,

and I think that there is a sense of intimacy

i crec que hi ha una sensació d'intimitat

that is very present in those things,

que hi és molt present,

the idea that -- picture this,

la idea de que, imagina't,

you can sit there and have a conversation with Fitz,

et pots sentar i conversar amb en Fitz,

or at least sit there while Fitz talks to you,

o al menys sentar-te i escoltar mentre et parla,

President Fitzgerald Grant III,

el president Fitzgerald Grant III,

while he talks to you

mentre ell t'explica

about why he's making a choice that he makes,

per què pren les decisions que pren,

and it's a very heartfelt moment.

i és un moment molt sincer.

And instead of you watching a television screen,

I en comptes de mirar la pantalla de la televisió,

you're sitting there next to him, and he's having this conversation.

estàs sentada al seu costat, i esteu conversant.

Now, you fall in love with the man

Ara, t'enamores de l'home

while he's doing it from a television screen.

mentre ell et parla des d'una pantalla.

Imagine sitting next to him,

Imagina't seure al seu costat

or being with a character like Huck who's about to execute somebody.

o estar amb un personatge com Huck, qui està a punt d'executar a algú.

And instead of having a scene

I en comptes de fer una escena

where, you know, he's talking to another character very rapidly,

on ell està parlant amb un altre personatge molt de pressa,

he goes into a closet and turns to you and tells you, you know,

es fica en un armari i es gira cap a tu i et diu

what's going to happen and why he's afraid and nervous.

el que passarà i per què està espantat i nerviós.

It's a little more like theater, and I'm not sure it would work,

És una mena de teatre, i no estic segura de si això funcionaria,

but I'm fascinating by the concept of something like that

estic fascinada per aquest concepte teatral

and what that would mean for an audience.

i pel significat que tindria pel públic.

And to get to play with those ideas would be interesting,

I jugar amb aquestes idees seria interessant,

and I think, you know, for my audience, the people who watch my shows,

i penso en les persones que miren els meus programes, el meu públic,

which is, you know, women 12 to 75,

el qual comprèn dones de 12 a 75 anys,

there's something interesting in there for them.

als programes hi ha quelcom interessant per elles.

CS: And how about the input of the audience?

CS: I què n'opines sobre l'input de l'audiència?

How interested are you in the things

Com d'interessada estàs

where the audience can actually go up to a certain point

en que l'audiència pugui arribar fins a un cert punt

and then decide, oh wait, I'm going to choose my own adventure.

i després decidir, "espera, escolliré la meva pròpia aventura."

I'm going to run off with Fitz or I'm going to run off with --

Fugiré amb en Fitz o fugiré amb...

SR: Les històries de "escull la teva aventura".

SR: Oh, the choose- your-own-adventure stories.

I have a hard time with those,

No m'acaben d'agradar,

and not necessarily because I want to be in control of everything,

i no necessàriament perquè ho vulgui controlar tot,

but because when I'm watching television or I'm watching a movie,

sino perquè quan veig la televisió o una pel·lícula,

I know for a fact that a story is not as good

tinc la certesa de que una història no és tan bona com

when I have control over exactly what's going to happen

quan controlo exactament el què passarà

to somebody else's character.

al personatge d'algú altre.

You know, if I could tell you exactly what I wanted to happen to Walter White,

Si et pogués dir què m'agradaria que li passés a Walter White,

that's great, but the story is not the same, and it's not as powerful.

seria increïble, però la història ni seria la mateixa ni seria tan potent.

You know, if I'm in charge of how "The Sopranos" ends,

Si m'encarrego de com acaba "Els Soprano",

then that's lovely and I have an ending that's nice and satisfying,

seria preciós, tindria un final bonic i satisfactori,

però ni la història seria igual ni tindria el mateix impacte emotiu.

but it's not the same story and it's not the same emotional impact.

CS: I can't stop imagining what that might be.

CS: No puc parar d'imaginar-me com seria això.

Sorry, you're losing me for a minute.

Disculpa, he perdut l'oremus.

SR: But what's wonderful is I don't get to imagine it,

SR: El que és preciós és que no arribo a imaginar-m'ho

because Vince has his own ending,

ja que Vince té un final propi,

and it makes it really powerful to know that somebody else has told.

i és realment poderós saber que algú altre l'ha imaginat.

You know, if you could decide that, you know,

Si pogués decidir això,

a la pel·lícula "Jaws" el tauró guanya, per exemple

in "Jaws," the shark wins or something,

it doesn't do what it needs to do for you.

no fa el que tu vols que faci.

The story is the story that is told,

La història és la que és,

and you can walk away angry and you can walk away debating

i pots marxar enfadat o discutint,

and you can walk away arguing,

i pots marxar barallant-te,

but that's why it works.

però és per això que funciona.

That is why it's art.

Per això és art.

Otherwise, it's just a game,

Contràriament, seria tan sols un joc,

and games can be art, but in a very different way.

i els jocs també poden ser art, però d'una forma diferent.

CS: Gamers who actually sell the right to sit there

CS: Els jugadors que vènen el dret

and comment on what's happening,

a comentar el què està passant,

to me that's more community than storytelling.

els considero més comunitat que narradors.

SR: And that is its own form of campfire.

SR: És una altra versió del foc de camp.

I don't discount that as a form of storytelling,

No ho descarto com a forma de narració,

but it is a group form, I suppose.

però suposo que és una forma d'agrupació.

CS: All right, what about the super-super --

CS: Molt bé, què en penses sobre el súper-súper

the fact that everything's getting shorter, shorter, shorter.

el fet que tot s'escurça cada cop més.

And, you know, Snapchat now has something it calls shows

I ara Snapchat disposa d'una eina que anomena "programes"

that are one minute long.

que duren un minut.

SR: It's interesting.

SR: És interessant.

Part of me thinks it sounds like commercials.

Una part de mi pensa que semblen anuncis.

I mean, it does -- like, sponsored by.

Vull dir, que estan patrocinats per algú.

But part of me also gets it completely.

Però una altra part de mi ho entén a la perfecció.

There's something really wonderful about it.

Hi ha quelcom meravellós en tot això.

If you think about a world

Si penses en un món

in which most people are watching television on their phones,

on la majoria de la gent veu la televisió als mòbils,

si penses en un lloc com l'Índia,

if you think about a place like India,

on la majoria de la informació arriba

where most of the input is coming in

and that's where most of the product is coming in,

i és on la majoria del producte arriba,

shorter makes sense.

més brevetat té sentit.

If you can charge people more for shorter periods of content,

Si pots cobrar més per un contingut més breu,

some distributor has figured out a way to make a lot more money.

algun distribuidor haurà esbrinat una forma de fer molts diners.

If you're making content,

Si estàs creant contingut,

it costs less money to make it and put it out there.

costa menys de fer i publicar.

And, by the way,

I, per cert,

if you're 14 and have a short attention span, like my daughter,

si tens 14 anys i perds l'atenció fàcilment, com la meva filla,

that's what you want to see, that's what you want to make,

això és el què vols veure, el què vols fer,

that's how it works.

així és com funciona.

And if you do it right and it actually feels like narrative,

I si ho fas bé i el que fas sembla narració,

people will hang on for it no matter what you do.

la gent s'hi enganxarà facis el que facis.

CS: I'm glad you raised your daughters,

CS: M'alegro que hagis criar les teves filles,

because I am wondering how are they going to consume entertainment,

perquè, em pregunto com consumiran l'entreteniment

and also not just entertainment,

i no només això,

but news, too.

sinó també les notícies.

When they're not -- I mean, the algorithmic robot overlords

Quan no són, vull dir, els "déus dels algoritmes"

are going to feed them what they've already done.

els oferiran el que ja han fet.

How do you think we will correct for that and make people well-rounded citizens?

Com creus que ho corregirem i farem dels ciutadans gent responsable?

SR: Well, me and how I correct for it

SR: Bé, la forma com ho corregeixo

is completely different than how somebody else might do it.

és completament diferent de com ho faria algú altre.

CS: Feel free to speculate.

CS: Endavant, imagina-ho.

SR: I really don't know how we're going to do it in the future.

SR: No sé com corregirem aquests errors al futur.

I mean, my poor children have been the subject of all of my experiments.

Amb les meves pobres filles he fet tots els meus experiments.

We're still doing what I call "Amish summers"

Encara fem el que jo anomeno "Estiu Amish"

where I turn off all electronics

quan apago tots els aparells

and pack away all their computers and stuff

i guardo tots els ordinadors

and watch them scream for a while until they settle down

i veig com criden durant una estona fins que es calmen

into, like, an electronic-free summer.

entrant a una mena "d'estiu lliure d'electrònica."

But honestly, it's a very hard world

Però honestament, estem parlant d'un món molt dur

in which now, as grown-ups,

en el qual ara, com a persones adultes,

we're so interested in watching our own thing,

estem tan tancats a la nostra pròpia bombolla personal,

and we don't even know that we're being fed, sometimes,

que ni sabem que a vegades se'ns ofereixen

just our own opinions.

només les nostres pròpies opinions.

You know, the way it's working now,

Tal i com funciona el món ara,

you're watching a feed,

estàs mirant continguts,

and the feeds are being corrected

que estan sent manipulats

so that you're only getting your own opinions

perquè només rebis les teves opinions

and you're feeling more and more right about yourself.

i et sentis cada cop millor amb tu mateix.

So how do you really start to discern?

I com comences a distingir el input?

It's getting a little bit disturbing.

S'està tornant una mica inquietant.

So maybe it'll overcorrect, maybe it'll all explode,

És probable que es sobrecorregeixi, que esclati,

or maybe we'll all just become --

o potser tots esdevindrem,

I hate to be negative about it,

odio ser negativa sobre això,

but maybe we'll all just become more idiotic.

però probablement esdevinguem més estúpids.

(Cyndi laughs)

(Cyndi riu)

CS: Yeah, can you picture any corrective that you could do

CS: Sí, pots imaginar-te algun correctiu que es podria fer

with scripted, fictional work?

amb un treball guionat i fictici?

SR: I think a lot about the fact that television has the power

SR: Penso molt en el fet de que la televisió té la capacitat

to educate people in a powerful way,

per educar a la gent poderosament,

and when you're watching television --

i quan estàs veient la televisió,

for instance, they do studies about medical shows.

per exemple, s'hi fan estudis sobre els programes mèdics.

I think it's 87 percent, 87 percent of people

Crec que hi ha un 87%, un 87% de la gent

get most of their knowledge about medicine and medical facts

que obté la majoria del seu coneixement sobre la medicina

from medical shows,

dels programes mèdics,

much more so than they do from their doctors,

obtenen més d'aquests que dels seus metges,

than from articles.

més que dels articles.

So we work really hard to be accurate, and every time we make a mistake,

Així que treballem molt per ser precisos, i cada cop que ens equivoquem,

I feel really guilty, like we're going to do something bad,

em sento realment culpable, com si féssim quelcom dolent.

but we also give a lot of good medical information.

però també oferim molta informació mèdica valuosa.

There are so many other ways to give information on those shows.

Hi ha tantes formes de donar informació en aquests programes.

People are being entertained

Les persones s'entretenen

and maybe they don't want to read the news,

i potser no volen llegir els diaris,

but there are a lot of ways to give fair information out on those shows,

però hi ha moltes formes d'oferir dades justes en aquests programes,

not in some creepy, like, we're going to control people's minds way,

no d'una forma horripilant, com si anéssim a controlar la ment humana

but in a way that's sort of very interesting and intelligent

però d'una forma més interessant i intel·ligent

and not about pushing one side's version or the other,

i no només oferir una versió sesgada,

like, giving out the truth.

sinó que dir la veritat.

It would be strange, though,

Seria estrany,

if television drama was how we were giving the news.

que els drama de la televisió fossin la forma d'oferir les notícies.

CS: It would be strange,

CS: Seria estrany

but I gather a lot of what you've written as fiction

però he d'entendre que la majoria del que ha escrit com a ficció

has become prediction this season?

ha esdevingut predicció aquesta temporada?

SR: You know, "Scandal" has been very disturbing for that reason.

Sap, "Scandal" ha sigut inquietant per aquest motiu.

We have this show that's about politics gone mad,

Tenim aquest programa sobre la política embogida

and basically the way we've always told the show --

i bàsicament la forma en què hem dut el programa,

you know, everybody pays attention to the papers.

tothom presta atenció als diaris.

We read everything. We talk about everything.

Ho llegim tot. Parlem sobre tot.

We have lots of friends in Washington.

Tenim molts amics a Washington.

And we'd always sort of done our show as a speculation.

I sempre hem tractat el programa com una mena d'especulació.

We'd sit in the room and think,

Sèiem al despatx i pensàvem,

what would happen if the wheels came off the bus

i si les rodes sortissin disparades de l'autobús

and everything went crazy?

i tot es tornès un caos?

And that was always great,

I això sempre era genial,

except now it felt like the wheels were coming off the bus

excepte que ara és com si les rodes sortissin de l'autobús

and things were actually going crazy,

i les coses fossin realment bojes,

so the things that we were speculating were really coming true.

així que les coses amb les que especulàvem es tornaven reals.

I mean, our season this year

La temporada d'aquest any

was going to end with the Russians controlling the American election,

havia d'acabar amb els russos controlant les eleccions americanes,

and we'd written it, we'd planned for it,

i això ho havíem escrit i planejat,

it was all there,

tot era allà,

and then the Russians were suspected of being involved in the American election

i després els russos eren sospitosos d'involucrar-se a les eleccions americanes

and we suddenly had to change what we were going to do for our season.

i de sobte vam haver de canviar el guió per la nostra temporada.

I walked in and I was like,

Arribo i començo,

"That scene where our mystery woman starts speaking Russian?

"I l'escena on aquella dona misteriosa comença a parlar rus?

We have to fix that and figure out what we're going to do."

Ho hem d'arreglar i decidir què fer."

That just comes from extrapolating

Això prové de l'extrapolació del

out from what we thought was going to happen,

que havíem pensat que passaria,

or what we thought was crazy.

o del que vèiem com una bogeria.

CS: That's great.

CS: Fantàstic.

So where else in US or elsewhere in the world do you look?

On més als EUA o altres parts del món busques aquestes tècniques narratives?

Who is doing interesting storytelling right now?

Qui fa narracions interessants avui en dia?

SR: I don't know, there's a lot of interesting stuff out there.

No ho sé, hi ha molt de material interessant.

Obviously British television is always amazing

Evidentment la televisió britànica és sempre fascinant

and always does interesting things.

i sempre fa coses interessants.

I don't get to watch a lot of TV,

No veig massa televisió,

mainly because I'm busy working.

sobretot perquè estic ocupada treballant.

And I pretty much try not to watch very much television at all,

I de debò intento no mirar la televisió gaire estona,

even American television, until I'm done with a season,

ni la televisió americana, fins que acabo una temporada,

because things start to creep into my head otherwise.

ja que sinó les coses se'm fiquen al cap

I start to wonder, like,

Em començo a preguntar...

why can't our characters wear crowns and talk about being on a throne?

per què els personatges no poden portar corones i parlar sobre un tro?

It gets crazy.

Es una bogeria.

So I try not to watch much until the seasons are over.

Per això, intento no mirar massa televisió fins que s'acaben les temporades.

But I do think that there's a lot of interesting European television out there.

Però penso que hi ha molta televisió europea interessant.

I was at the International Emmys

Vaig estar als International Emmys

and looking around and seeing the stuff that they were showing,

i estava veient els programes que projectaven,

and I was kind of fascinated.

i em vaig quedar sorpresa.

There's some stuff I want to watch and check out.

Hi ha alguns programes que vull veure i comprovar.

CS: Can you imagine --

CS: Es pot imaginar,

I know that you don't spend a lot of time thinking about tech stuff,

sé que no acostuma a pensar molt en els aspectes tecnològics,

but you know how a few years ago we had someone here at TED

però ja sap que ara fa uns quants anys vam rebre a algú a TED

talking about seeing,

que parlava de "veure",

wearing Google Glass and seeing your TV shows essentially in your eye?

mirant els teus programes televisius a través dels Google Glass?

Do you ever fantasize when, you know --

Algun cop t'has imaginat...

the little girl who sat on the pantry floor

la nena petita que seia al terra del rebost

in your parents' house,

a casa dels seus pares,

did you ever imagine any other medium?

algun cop t'has imaginat un altre mitjà?

Or would you now?

Ho faries ara?

SR: Any other medium.

SR: Qualsevol altre mitjà.

For storytelling, other than books?

Per narració, que no siguin llibres?

I mean, I grew up wanting to be Toni Morrison, so no.

Vull dir, he crescut volent ser Toni Morrison, així que no.

I mean, I didn't even imagine television.

Ni tan sols m'havia imaginat la televisió.

So the idea that there could be some bigger world,

Així que la idea de que hi pogués haver un món més gran,

some more magical way of making things ---

una altra forma més màgica de fer les coses...

I'm always excited when new technology comes out

Sempre m'excito quan apareix la nova tecnologia

and I'm always the first one to want to try it.

i sempre sóc la primera que la vol provar.

The possibilities feel endless and exciting right now,

Ara mateix les possibilitats semblen il·limitades i excitants,

which is what excites me.

el qual em fascina.

We're in this sort of Wild West period, to me, it feels like,

Ens trobem en aquesta mena de període d'Oest Salvatge, i és com

because nobody knows what we're going to settle on.

si ningú sapigués on ens instal·larem.

You can put stories anywhere right now

Ara mateix pots ubicar històries on sigui

and that's cool to me,

i això és guay,

and it feels like once we figure out how to get the technology

i sembla com si quan esbrinem com unir la tecnologia

and the creativity of storytelling to meet,

i la creativitat de la narració,

the possibilities are endless.

les possibilitats són infinites

CS: And also the technology has enabled the thing I briefly flew by earlier,

CS: A més, la tecnologia ha fet possible la idea que comentava anteriorment,

binge-viewing, which is a recent phenomenon,

"afartar-te a sèries", que és un fenomen recent,

since you've been doing shows, right?

des que fas programes, oi?

And how do you think does that change the storytelling process at all?

I com creus que això canvia el procés de la narració?

You always had a bible for the whole season beforehand, right?

Abans, sempre tenies una biblia per tota la temporada, veritat?

SR: No, I just always knew where we were going to end.

SR: No, simplement sempre sabia on acabaríem.

So for me,

Així, per a mi,

the only way I can really comment on that

l'única cosa que jo puc dir

is that I have a show that's been going on for 14 seasons

és que tinc un programa amb 14 temporades a les espatlles,

and so there are the people who have been watching it for 14 seasons,

hi ha gent que l'està veient des de fa 14 temporades,

and then there are the 12-year-old girls I'd encounter in the grocery store

i després hi ha nenes de 12 anys que em trobo a les botigues

who had watched 297 episodes in three weeks.

que han vist 297 episodis en tres setmanes.

Seriously, and that's a very different experience for them,

I la veritat, és una experiència molt diferent per a elles,

because they've been inside of something

ja que ho han viscut

really intensely for a very short period of time

molt intensament durant un període de temps molt curt

in a very intense way,

d'una forma molt intensa,

and to them the story has a completely different arc

i per a elles la història te un desenvolupament ben diferent

and a completely different meaning

i un significat totalment diferent

because it never had any breaks.

perquè no hi ha hagut cap pausa.

CS: It's like visiting a country and then leaving it. It's a strange --

CS: És com visitar un país i després deixar-lo. És estrany

SR: It's like reading an amazing novel and then putting it down.

SR: És com llegir una novel·la increïble i després deixar-la.

I think that is the beauty of the experience.

Crec que en això consisteix la bellesa de l'experiència.

You don't necessarily have to watch something for 14 seasons.

No necessàriament has de veure una sèrie durant 14 temporades.

It's not necessarily the way everything's supposed to be.

No tot ha de ser així necessàriament.

CS: Is there any topic that you don't think we should touch?

CS: Hi ha algun tema que consideres que no s'hauria de tractar?

SR: I don't think I think of story that way.

SR: Crec que no. Veig la història així.

I think of story in terms of character and what characters would do

Veig la història com a personatges i el que aquests poden fer

and what characters need to do in order to make them move forward,

i el que els personatges han de fer per fer avançar les històries,

so I'm never really thinking of story in terms of just plot,

així, mai penso en les històries només com a trama.

and when writers come into my writer's room and pitch me plot,

i quan els escriptors venen al meu despatx amb una trama,

I say, "You're not speaking English."

jo els hi dic "Vosaltres no parleu l'anglès."

Like, that's the thing I say.

És el que els dic.

We're not speaking English. I need to hear what's real.

No parlem l'anglès. Necessito sentir què és real.

And so I don't think of it that way.

No ho penso d'aquesta forma.

I don't know if there's a way to think there's something I wouldn't do

No sé si hi ha una forma de pensar que hi ha alguna cosa que no faria

because that feels like I'm plucking pieces of plot off a wall or something.

ja que és com si arranqués trossos de trama de la paret.

CS: That's great. To what extent do you think you will use --

CS: Increïble. Fins a quin punt creu que usarà...

You know, you recently went on the board of Planned Parenthood

recentment ha entrat a la junta de "Planned Parenthood"

and got involved in the Hillary Clinton campaign.

i s'ha involucrat en la campanya de Hillary Clinton.

To what extent do you think you will use your storytelling

Fins a quin punt creu que utilitzarà la seva narració

in the real world

al món real

to effect change?

per efectuar un canvi?

SR: Well, you know, there's --

SR: Bé, ja sap, hi ha...

That's an intense subject to me,

és un assumpte intens per a mi,

because I feel like the lack of narrative

ja que trobo que la manca de capacitat narrativa

that a lot of people have is difficult.

que molta gent té és problemàtica.

You know, like, there's a lot of organizations

És com si hi hagués moltes organitzacions que

that don't have a positive narrative that they've created for themselves

no ofereixen una narració positiva que han creat ells mateixos

that would help them.

que els ajudaria.

There's a lot of campaigns

Hi ha moltes campanyes

that could be helped with a better narrative.

que els aniria bé una millor narrativa.

The Democrats could do a lot

Els demòcrates podrien fer molt

with a very strong narrative for themselves.

amb una narrativa més sòlida.

There's a lot of different things that could happen

Podrien passar moltes coses diferents

in terms of using storytelling voice,

en relació a l'ús de la veu narrativa,

and I don't mean that in a fiction way,

i no ho dir en el context de la ficció,

I mean that in a same way that any speechwriter would mean it.

Ho vull dir com ho faria qualsevol redactor de discursos.

And I see that,

I ho veig,

but I don't necessarily know that that's, like, my job to do that.

però no necessàriament veig que aquesta sigui la meva feina.

CS: All right.

CS: Molt bé.

Please help me thank Shonda. SR: Thank you.

Si us plau, un aplaudiment per Shonda. SR: Moltes gràcies.

(Applause)

(Aplaudiments)