How we need to remake the internet | Jaron Lanier

430,004 views ・ 2018-05-03

TED


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翻译人员: psjmz mz 校对人员: Frank Wang
00:12
Back in the 1980s, actually, I gave my first talk at TED,
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回到 1980 年代, 那是我首次在 TED 演讲,
00:16
and I brought some of the very, very first public demonstrations
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也是我首次在 TED 现场公开演示了
00:21
of virtual reality ever to the TED stage.
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虚拟现实。
00:26
And at that time, we knew that we were facing a knife-edge future
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在那时,我们知道 我们正面对着一个险恶的未来,
00:33
where the technology we needed,
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我们所需的技术,
00:38
the technology we loved,
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我们热爱的技术
00:40
could also be our undoing.
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可能会毁灭我们。
00:43
We knew that if we thought of our technology
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我们知道如果我们把技术
00:47
as a means to ever more power,
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当作一种获取更多力量的手段,
00:50
if it was just a power trip, we'd eventually destroy ourselves.
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如果我们只把技术当作追逐力量的武器, 我们将不可避免地毁掉自己。
00:54
That's what happens
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当我们追逐权力
00:55
when you're on a power trip and nothing else.
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而不是其他东西时,这无疑将会发生。
00:59
So the idealism
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所以那个时候
01:02
of digital culture back then
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的数字文化主义
01:07
was all about starting with that recognition of the possible darkness
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往往是首先承认潜在的负面影响,
01:12
and trying to imagine a way to transcend it
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再想办法用美好和创意
01:15
with beauty and creativity.
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去超越它。
01:19
I always used to end my early TED Talks with a rather horrifying line, which is,
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我过去总爱用令人毛骨悚然 的语气结束 TED 演讲,
01:26
"We have a challenge.
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“我们正面临一场挑战。
01:30
We have to create a culture around technology
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我们得围绕科技去构建一种
01:34
that is so beautiful, so meaningful,
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美丽,充满意义的文化,
01:38
so deep, so endlessly creative,
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如此深刻,富有创造力,
01:40
so filled with infinite potential
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拥有无限潜力的文化,
01:44
that it draws us away from committing mass suicide."
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去把我们从实施大规模 的自杀中解救出来。”
01:48
So we talked about extinction as being one and the same
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我们谈的灭绝与创造一种充满诱惑,
01:54
as the need to create an alluring, infinitely creative future.
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无限创意的未来是同一个事情。
01:59
And I still believe that that alternative of creativity
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我仍然相信将创造力作为
02:05
as an alternative to death
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死亡的另一个选项
02:07
is very real and true,
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是非常真实和确凿的事情,
02:09
maybe the most true thing there is.
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可能世间存在的最真实的事情。
02:11
In the case of virtual reality --
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在虚拟现实的例子中,
02:13
well, the way I used to talk about it
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我过去谈到它的看法是,
02:16
is that it would be something like
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它就如
02:18
what happened when people discovered language.
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人类发现语言一样,
02:21
With language came new adventures, new depth, new meaning,
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语言带来了新的冒险, 新的深度,新的意义,
02:26
new ways to connect, new ways to coordinate,
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新的连接方式,新的协调方式,
02:28
new ways to imagine, new ways to raise children,
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新的想象方式,新的抚养孩子的方式,
02:32
and I imagined, with virtual reality, we'd have this new thing
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我想象中的虚拟现实,这种新的东西
02:36
that would be like a conversation
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就像一场对话,
02:38
but also like waking-state intentional dreaming.
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亦如半睡半醒的有意识的梦境。
02:41
We called it post-symbolic communication,
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我们称之为“后符号交流”,
02:44
because it would be like just directly making the thing you experienced
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因为这就像可以直接做 你所经历的事情一样,
02:49
instead of indirectly making symbols to refer to things.
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而无需间接创造符号去指代事物。
02:53
It was a beautiful vision, and it's one I still believe in,
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它是个美丽的图景,我至今仍然认为
02:57
and yet, haunting that beautiful vision
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萦绕在美丽图景的背后
03:01
was the dark side of how it could also turn out.
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是它可能导致的黑暗一面。
03:04
And I suppose I could mention
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我想我可以提一下
03:09
from one of the very earliest computer scientists,
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一位非常早期的计算机科学家,
03:12
whose name was Norbert Wiener,
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诺伯特·维纳。
03:14
and he wrote a book back in the '50s, from before I was even born,
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他在我出生之前 的 50 年代写过一本书,
03:18
called "The Human Use of Human Beings."
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书名叫《人有人的用处》。
03:21
And in the book, he described the potential
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在书中,他描绘了
03:25
to create a computer system that would be gathering data from people
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创造电脑系统来收集人类数据
03:32
and providing feedback to those people in real time
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并实时向人提供反馈,
03:35
in order to put them kind of partially, statistically, in a Skinner box,
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从而可以把他们放在 如同统计学里的斯金纳箱,
03:40
in a behaviorist system,
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一个行为系统中,
03:43
and he has this amazing line where he says,
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他写下了这样的神来一笔,
03:45
one could imagine, as a thought experiment --
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我们可以想象,作为一个思维实验——
03:48
and I'm paraphrasing, this isn't a quote --
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这不是原话,我只是复述一下——
03:51
one could imagine a global computer system
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我们可以想象一个全球的电脑系统,
03:54
where everybody has devices on them all the time,
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人人时刻带着这个设备,
03:57
and the devices are giving them feedback based on what they did,
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这个设备根据用户 的操作实时给以回馈,
04:00
and the whole population
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全部人的
04:02
is subject to a degree of behavior modification.
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行为都会得到一定程度的修正。
04:05
And such a society would be insane,
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这样社会将是疯狂的,
04:09
could not survive, could not face its problems.
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无法生存,无法面对它的问题。
04:12
And then he says, but this is only a thought experiment,
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随后他说,但这只是一个思想实验,
04:15
and such a future is technologically infeasible.
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这样的未来在技术上是不可行的。
04:18
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
04:19
And yet, of course, it's what we have created,
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显然,我们已经构建了一个
04:22
and it's what we must undo if we are to survive.
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如果我们要生存, 就必须撤销的社会。
04:27
So --
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那么……
04:28
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
04:32
I believe that we made a very particular mistake,
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我认为我们在很早以前
04:38
and it happened early on,
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犯下了一个非常特别的错误,
04:40
and by understanding the mistake we made,
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要弥补这个错误,
04:42
we can undo it.
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我们就得先理解这个错误。
04:44
It happened in the '90s,
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这始于 90 年代,
04:47
and going into the turn of the century,
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然后进入世纪之交,
04:50
and here's what happened.
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事情是这样发生的。
04:53
Early digital culture,
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早期的数字文化,
04:54
and indeed, digital culture to this day,
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事实上,直至今天的数字文化,
04:59
had a sense of, I would say, lefty, socialist mission about it,
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都有一种,像左派,社会主义的使命。
05:05
that unlike other things that have been done,
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跟其他事物不同的是,
05:08
like the invention of books,
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比如书籍的发明,
05:09
everything on the internet must be purely public,
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互联网的一切都是公开的,
05:13
must be available for free,
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必须可以免费获取,
05:15
because if even one person cannot afford it,
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因为一旦有一个人无法获得这种服务,
05:18
then that would create this terrible inequity.
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就会制造可怕的不平等。
05:21
Now of course, there's other ways to deal with that.
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当然,也有其他的处理方法。
05:24
If books cost money, you can have public libraries.
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如果书籍需要花钱, 你可以去公共图书馆。
05:27
And so forth.
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诸如此类。
05:28
But we were thinking, no, no, no, this is an exception.
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但我们在想的是,不不不, 这完全是特例。
05:31
This must be pure public commons, that's what we want.
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这必须是纯粹的公共公有物。
05:35
And so that spirit lives on.
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所以这种精神永流传,
05:38
You can experience it in designs like the Wikipedia, for instance,
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你可以在像维基百科这样 的设计中体验到,
05:42
many others.
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以及许多其他东西。
05:43
But at the same time,
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但同时,
05:45
we also believed, with equal fervor,
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我们也怀着同样的热情,
05:48
in this other thing that was completely incompatible,
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相信另一件完全不相容的事情,
05:52
which is we loved our tech entrepreneurs.
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那就是追捧我们的科技企业家。
05:55
We loved Steve Jobs; we loved this Nietzschean myth
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我们喜欢乔布斯,我们喜欢尼采的神话,
05:59
of the techie who could dent the universe.
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即技术专家可以影响宇宙。
06:03
Right?
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对吧?
06:04
And that mythical power still has a hold on us, as well.
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这种神秘的力量仍然对我们有影响。
06:10
So you have these two different passions,
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所以你有两种不同的激情,
06:14
for making everything free
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支持一切免费,
06:16
and for the almost supernatural power of the tech entrepreneur.
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并且崇拜科技企业家 近乎超自然的力量。
06:21
How do you celebrate entrepreneurship when everything's free?
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当一切都是免费的时候, 你如何庆祝企业家精神?
06:26
Well, there was only one solution back then,
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那时候只有一个解决方案,
06:29
which was the advertising model.
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那就是广告模式。
06:31
And so therefore, Google was born free, with ads,
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所以 Google 是免费的,但自带广告。
06:35
Facebook was born free, with ads.
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Facebook 也是免费的,也自带广告。
06:39
Now in the beginning, it was cute,
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一开始,它挺可爱的,
06:43
like with the very earliest Google.
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就像非常早期的 Google。
06:45
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
06:46
The ads really were kind of ads.
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广告确实就是广告,
06:49
They would be, like, your local dentist or something.
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比如当地的牙医之类的。
06:51
But there's thing called Moore's law
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但还有个叫摩尔定理的东西,
06:53
that makes the computers more and more efficient and cheaper.
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可以让计算机越来越强大和便宜。
06:57
Their algorithms get better.
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他们的算法越来越好。
06:58
We actually have universities where people study them,
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大学里面,很多人在研究算法,
07:01
and they get better and better.
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它们变得越来越好,
07:03
And the customers and other entities who use these systems
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使用这些系统的客户和其他公司
07:07
just got more and more experienced and got cleverer and cleverer.
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也变得越来越有经验,越来越聪明。
07:11
And what started out as advertising
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这一开始是广告的东西
07:14
really can't be called advertising anymore.
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真的不能再称之为广告了。
07:16
It turned into behavior modification,
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它变成了行为修正器,
07:19
just as Norbert Wiener had worried it might.
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就如诺伯特·维纳所担忧的。
07:24
And so I can't call these things social networks anymore.
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所以我不能再称这些为社交网络,
07:28
I call them behavior modification empires.
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我叫它们为行为修正帝国。
07:32
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
07:34
And I refuse to vilify the individuals.
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我不想诋毁那些优秀的个人,
07:39
I have dear friends at these companies,
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我在这些公司有好朋友,
07:41
sold a company to Google, even though I think it's one of these empires.
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把公司卖给了谷歌,尽管 我认为它是这些帝国中的一个。
07:46
I don't think this is a matter of bad people who've done a bad thing.
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我不认为这是坏人做坏事的问题,
07:51
I think this is a matter of a globally tragic,
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我觉得这只是一个全球性的悲剧,
07:55
astoundingly ridiculous mistake,
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可笑的错误,
08:00
rather than a wave of evil.
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而非一波邪恶的浪潮。
08:04
Let me give you just another layer of detail
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我再给你们讲一讲 关于这个特别的错误
08:07
into how this particular mistake functions.
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是如何作用的。
08:11
So with behaviorism,
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用行为主义的理论讲,
08:14
you give the creature, whether it's a rat or a dog or a person,
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你给生物——不管这个生物 是老鼠,狗还是人——
08:19
little treats and sometimes little punishments
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一个小的奖赏,或者一个小的惩罚,
08:22
as feedback to what they do.
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作为他们动作的反馈。
08:24
So if you have an animal in a cage, it might be candy and electric shocks.
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如果你在笼里养了一只动物, 这个奖惩可能是糖果或电击。
08:30
But if you have a smartphone,
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但如果你拥有一台智能手机,
08:33
it's not those things, it's symbolic punishment and reward.
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奖惩就不是这些实物,而是象征性的。
08:40
Pavlov, one of the early behaviorists,
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巴甫洛夫,一位早期的行为学家,
08:42
demonstrated the famous principle.
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阐述了这条知名的原则。
08:45
You could train a dog to salivate just with the bell, just with the symbol.
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用铃声,用一种符号 就足以让一只狗流口水。
08:49
So on social networks,
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所以在社交网络上面,
08:51
social punishment and social reward function as the punishment and reward.
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社交奖惩的作用就如同 现实中的奖惩一般。
08:56
And we all know the feeling of these things.
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我们都知道这些东西 带给我们的感觉,
08:58
You get this little thrill --
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你会有点小兴奋——
08:59
"Somebody liked my stuff and it's being repeated."
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“有人喜欢我的东西,它又被重复了。”
09:02
Or the punishment: "Oh my God, they don't like me,
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或者是惩罚:“天呀!他们不喜欢我,
09:04
maybe somebody else is more popular, oh my God."
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也许其他人更受欢迎,老天!”
09:06
So you have those two very common feelings,
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所以你有这两种非常普遍的感受,
09:09
and they're doled out in such a way that you get caught in this loop.
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它们以这样的方式 让你困在这个循环中。
09:12
As has been publicly acknowledged by many of the founders of the system,
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类似系统的许多创始人已经公开承认
09:16
everybody knew this is what was going on.
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每个人都知道这是怎么回事。
09:19
But here's the thing:
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但问题是,
09:21
traditionally, in the academic study of the methods of behaviorism,
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传统上,在行为主义方法 的学术研究中
09:26
there have been comparisons of positive and negative stimuli.
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有积极和消极刺激的对比。
09:32
In this setting, a commercial setting,
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在这个商业设定中,
09:34
there's a new kind of difference
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则出现了新的差异,
09:36
that has kind of evaded the academic world for a while,
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这种差异远离学术世界 已经有一阵子了,
09:39
and that difference is that whether positive stimuli
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这个差异在于,在不同的环境中,
09:43
are more effective than negative ones in different circumstances,
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无论积极刺激是否 比消极刺激更加有效,
09:46
the negative ones are cheaper.
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消极刺激往往成本都更加低廉。
09:48
They're the bargain stimuli.
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这是讨价还价的刺激。
09:50
So what I mean by that is it's much easier
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所以我的意思是,失去信任
09:56
to lose trust than to build trust.
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总比构建信任要更加容易。
09:59
It takes a long time to build love.
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需要很长的时间才能构建爱情,
10:02
It takes a short time to ruin love.
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但却只需要短短的时间 就足以毁掉爱情。
10:05
Now the customers of these behavior modification empires
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这些行为修正帝国的客户
10:10
are on a very fast loop.
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处于非常快速的循环中,
10:11
They're almost like high-frequency traders.
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他们就像高频交易员
10:13
They're getting feedbacks from their spends
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不断从用户的消费中获得反馈,
10:15
or whatever their activities are if they're not spending,
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不是消费就是其他别的活动,
10:18
and they see what's working, and then they do more of that.
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他们一旦发现凑效的方式, 就去做更多这样的事情。
10:21
And so they're getting the quick feedback,
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他们可以得到快速反馈,
10:23
which means they're responding more to the negative emotions,
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这就意味着他们会对 更多的负面情绪做出反应,
10:26
because those are the ones that rise faster, right?
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因为负面情绪来得更加快速。
10:30
And so therefore, even well-intentioned players
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因此,即便是善意的商家,
10:34
who think all they're doing is advertising toothpaste
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认为他们做的只是牙膏广告,
10:37
end up advancing the cause of the negative people,
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也最终诱发了消极人群的增加,
10:40
the negative emotions, the cranks,
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那些负面情绪,比如恶作剧,
10:42
the paranoids,
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偏执,
10:44
the cynics, the nihilists.
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愤世嫉俗,虚无主义,
10:47
Those are the ones who get amplified by the system.
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都是容易被系统放大的负面情绪。
10:50
And you can't pay one of these companies to make the world suddenly nice
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而且你还无法通过给这些公司付钱 让他们突然把世界变好,
10:56
and improve democracy
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提升民主,
10:57
nearly as easily as you can pay to ruin those things.
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无法跟你付钱毁掉这些东西那样容易。
11:01
And so this is the dilemma we've gotten ourselves into.
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所以这就是我们所陷入的困境。
11:05
The alternative is to turn back the clock, with great difficulty,
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替代方案是拨转时钟, 克服极大的困难,
11:11
and remake that decision.
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重做决定。
11:13
Remaking it would mean two things.
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重做决定意味着两件事情。
11:18
It would mean first that many people, those who could afford to,
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这首先意味着很多人, 那些可以承担得起的,
11:21
would actually pay for these things.
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可能最终要为这些东西买单。
11:24
You'd pay for search, you'd pay for social networking.
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你为搜索买单,你为社交网络买单。
11:28
How would you pay? Maybe with a subscription fee,
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你如何买单?也许是通过 订阅付费的方式,
11:32
maybe with micro-payments as you use them.
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也许是微支付,
11:34
There's a lot of options.
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有很多选择。
11:36
If some of you are recoiling, and you're thinking,
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假如你们有些人心存抗拒,想的是,
11:39
"Oh my God, I would never pay for these things.
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“老天,我才不会为这些东西买单!
11:41
How could you ever get anyone to pay?"
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你怎么能做到让别人付钱呢?”
11:43
I want to remind you of something that just happened.
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我想要提醒大家刚刚发生的事情。
11:46
Around this same time
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在 Google 和 Facebook
11:48
that companies like Google and Facebook were formulating their free idea,
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形成免费观念的同时,
11:54
a lot of cyber culture also believed that in the future,
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很多网络文化也相信在未来,
11:59
televisions and movies would be created in the same way,
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电视和电影也会以类似维基百科
12:02
kind of like the Wikipedia.
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那样的方式创作。
12:04
But then, companies like Netflix, Amazon, HBO,
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但同时,诸如 Netflix, Amazon,HBO 那样的公司则说
12:09
said, "Actually, you know, subscribe. We'll give you give you great TV."
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“订阅吧,我们会给你 精彩的电视节目!”
12:13
And it worked!
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这还挺有效的!
12:14
We now are in this period called "peak TV," right?
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我们现在所处的时代叫 “顶峰电视”时代,对吧?
12:18
So sometimes when you pay for stuff, things get better.
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所以有时候,当你为此付费了, 事情就变得更好了。
12:22
We can imagine a hypothetical --
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我们可以想象一种假设——
12:25
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
12:29
We can imagine a hypothetical world of "peak social media."
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我们可以想象一个 假设的“顶峰社交媒体”世界。
12:33
What would that be like?
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它会是什么样子?
12:34
It would mean when you get on, you can get really useful,
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这意味着当你登陆后, 你可以得到真正有用的
12:37
authoritative medical advice instead of cranks.
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权威医疗建议,而非社交狂躁
12:41
It could mean when you want to get factual information,
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这可能意味着,当你想要真实信息时,
12:44
there's not a bunch of weird, paranoid conspiracy theories.
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就不会有一堆奇怪的, 偏执的阴谋论冒出来。
12:47
We can imagine this wonderful other possibility.
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我们可以想象其他美妙的可能。
12:52
Ah.
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啊!
12:53
I dream of it. I believe it's possible.
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这是我的梦想,我相信这是可能的。
12:55
I'm certain it's possible.
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我确信这是可能的。
12:58
And I'm certain that the companies, the Googles and the Facebooks,
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我确定 Google 和 Facebook 这类公司
13:03
would actually do better in this world.
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在这个世界上可以做得更好。
13:05
I don't believe we need to punish Silicon Valley.
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我不认为我们需要惩罚硅谷。
13:09
We just need to remake the decision.
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我们只需要重新做决定。
13:12
Of the big tech companies,
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在大型科技公司中。
13:14
it's really only two that depend on behavior modification and spying
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确实只有两家公司 以行为修正和信息监视
13:20
as their business plan.
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作为商业计划。
13:21
It's Google and Facebook.
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他们就是 Google 和 Facebook。
13:23
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
13:24
And I love you guys.
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我爱各位。
13:26
Really, I do. Like, the people are fantastic.
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这是实话,他们都很棒。
13:30
I want to point out, if I may,
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请允许我这么说,
13:33
if you look at Google,
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如果你观察一下 Google,
13:34
they can propagate cost centers endlessly with all of these companies,
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他们可以无止境地向 这些公司分摊成本中心,
13:39
but they cannot propagate profit centers.
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但他们无法分摊利润中心。
13:41
They cannot diversify, because they're hooked.
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他们无法多元化,因为他们醉心于此。
13:45
They're hooked on this model, just like their own users.
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他们沉迷于这种模式, 跟他们的用户一样,
13:47
They're in the same trap as their users,
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他们跟用户处在同样的陷阱。
13:50
and you can't run a big corporation that way.
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你不能以那种方式运营一家大公司。
13:52
So this is ultimately totally in the benefit of the shareholders
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所以这最终完全是为了股东
13:56
and other stakeholders of these companies.
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以及公司其他利益相关者的利益。
13:58
It's a win-win solution.
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这是双赢的方案,
14:01
It'll just take some time to figure it out.
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只是需要花点时间想出解决方法。
14:03
A lot of details to work out,
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很多细节问题需要解决,
14:05
totally doable.
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这是完全可行的。
14:07
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
14:10
I don't believe our species can survive unless we fix this.
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我不相信我们的物种可以生存下去, 除非我们修正这点。
14:14
We cannot have a society
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我们不应该活在这样一个社会,
14:16
in which, if two people wish to communicate,
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如果两个人想要沟通,
14:19
the only way that can happen is if it's financed by a third person
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唯一方式就是需要被想操纵他们
14:22
who wishes to manipulate them.
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的第三个人赞助。
14:25
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
14:35
(Applause ends)
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(掌声渐消)
14:36
In the meantime, if the companies won't change,
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与此同时,如果公司不改变,
14:39
delete your accounts, OK?
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就注销你的账号,好吗?
14:41
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
14:42
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
14:43
That's enough for now.
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我要说的就这些。
14:45
Thank you so much.
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谢谢诸位。
14:46
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
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