Where Does Your Sense of Self Come From? A Scientific Look | Anil Ananthaswamy | TED

翻译人员: Yip Yan Yeung 校对人员: sylvia feng

About a decade ago,

大约十年以前，

I met someone who had experienced a few episodes of schizophrenia.

我遇到了一个 发作过好几次精神分裂症的人。

They had felt that their sense of self,

他/她感觉自己的自我感，

of what it feels like to be them,

即感觉自己是什么，

changing somewhat.

发生了一些变化。

The boundaries of their body began to feel a bit nebulous.

他/她身体的边界 逐渐变得有些模糊。

Even their psychological self felt a bit porous at times.

他/她心理上的自我 也时常感到千疮百孔。

They were experiencing what could be called an altered sense of self.

他/她正在经历的 正是“自我意识改变”的过程。

Over the years, I met many such brave and insightful people

多年以来，我遇到过 许多勇敢又有想法的人，

who shared what it's like to live with their altered selves.

他们与我分享了 和“自我的变体”共存的经历。

And by "altered," I mean "different,"

我说的“变体”，指的是“不同”，

not "deficient,"

而不是“有缺陷”，

while acknowledging that coping with altered selves

虽然我承认 与自我的变体和谐相处

can be a struggle at times.

肯定有些煎熬。

So speaking with them,

通过与他们交流，

and with theologians, philosophers, neuroscientists,

与神学家、哲学家、 神经科学家交流，

I came to understand that this self that each one of us takes oneself to be

我逐渐意识到 我们认知中的那个“自己”

is not as real as it seems.

没有看起来那么真实。

The self is a slippery subject.

“自我”是个难以捉摸的东西。

We all intuitively know what it means.

我们感觉都知道它是什么意思。

It’s there when we wake up.

我们起床时，它在那儿。

It disappears when we fall asleep.

我们睡觉时，它消失了。

It reappears in our dreams.

它会在我们的梦中再次出现。

It's what makes us who we are.

它让我们成为了我们自己。

It seems solid, unchanging, permanent.

感觉它坚实、稳定、永久。

And yet, we can examine aspects of the self

我们可以检验自我中 对我们来说比较真实的地方，

that seem real to us,

and ask, “Just how real are they?”

问一问：“有多真实呢？”

Take, for instance, the question "Who am I?"

比如这个问题：“我是谁？”

The most likely answer you will get or give to such a question

你很有可能会以一个故事的形式

will be in the form of a story.

回答或解决这个问题。

We tell others -- and indeed, ourselves -- stories about who we are.

我们告诉别人——其实是我们自己—— 关于“我是谁”的故事。

We take our stories to be sacrosanct.

我们会觉得 自己的故事是神圣的。

We are our stories.

我们就是我们的故事。

But a condition that most of us, sadly, will be familiar with --

但是不幸的是，有一种 我们都十分熟悉的疾病——

Alzheimer's disease --

阿尔茨海默病（老年痴呆）——

tells us something quite different.

讲述了不一样的故事。

Alzheimer's begins by affecting short-term memory.

阿尔茨海默病始于 对短期记忆的影响。

Think about what that does to someone's story.

想象一下这会 如何影响一个人的故事。

In order for our stories to form, to grow,

要产生、延续我们的故事，

something that just happens to us has to first enter short-term memory,

刚发生在我们身上的事 首先会进入短期记忆，

and then, get incorporated

再融入长期情节记忆。

into what's called long-term episodic memory.

It has to become an episode in our narrative.

它会成为我们故事中的一个情节。

But what if the experience doesn't even enter short-term memory?

但如果这个经历根本 没有进入短期记忆会怎么样？

That's exactly what Alzheimer's does.

这正是阿尔茨海默病的症状。

In the beginning,

病情早期，

Alzheimer's impairs the formation of short-term memory.

阿尔茨海默病 会破坏短期记忆的形成。

It impairs the growth of the narrative.

它会阻碍剧情的发展。

It's as if our stories begin stalling upon the onset of the disease.

就像一患病 我们的故事就停滞不前了。

Eventually, Alzheimer's eats away at all the long-term memories.

最终，阿尔茨海默病 会蚕食所有的长期记忆。

So if you were to meet someone with mid-stage Alzheimer's,

如果你见到了一位 阿尔茨海默中期患者，

they will likely be able to tell you stories about who they are.

他们有可能还能 给你讲讲他们是谁的故事。

But if you know their real stories,

但是如果你了解他们真实的故事，

you'll be able to tell that they sometimes scramble up their narrative,

你就能看出他们有时 在胡说八道他们的故事，

that they sometimes mix up the sequence of episodes from their lives.

有时会搞混人生片段的顺序。

It's as if they are recalling their own stories

就像他们在以一种不太准确的方式 回忆自己的故事。

in ways that are not quite accurate.

It's important, at this stage,

这个阶段重要的是

to realize that there is still a person experiencing that scrambled narrative.

我们得意识到有这么一个人 还在亲身经历这个乱七八糟的故事。

Sadly, Alzheimer's goes on to destroy one's narrative,

不幸的是，阿尔茨海默病 还会继续摧毁这个故事，

and so much more.

愈演愈烈。

And towards the end,

到了晚期，

it's unclear whether there is still someone experiencing something,

已经分不清那个人 还在不在经历这一切了，

because the person cannot communicate verbally anymore.

因为他/她已经无法进行言语交流。

And yet,

但是，

Alzheimer's tells us that these stories that we take ourselves to be,

阿尔茨海默病告诉了我们， 这些讲述我们自我认知的故事，

what philosophers call the “narrative self,”

哲学家称之为“叙事自我”，

these are spun by the brain and body.

它们是由大脑和身体运作的。

They are constructions.

它们是一种“建筑”。

Sometimes, the constructions are disrupted, even destroyed.

这些建筑有时被扰乱， 甚至被破坏。

And while that is horrific for the person experiencing it,

虽然对经历这些的患者本人 和看护人来说，这是件可怕的事，

and for their caregivers,

it is nonetheless a window

但是，这也能让我们借此

onto the constructed nature of our narrative self.

对叙事自我的构筑特质 稍作了解。

And when the construction goes wrong,

如果这个建筑出了故障，

we perceive our own stories in ways that are not quite real.

我们就会对我们的故事 产生不太真实的认知。

From the narrative self, let's talk about our body.

说完叙事自我， 我们来说说我们的身体。

Let's take a very basic aspect of our bodily self.

我们来谈一谈身体自我 最基本的方面。

This feeling we all have,

我们都会有这种感觉，

that we are owners of our body and body parts,

觉得我们是我们身体和部位的主人，

that our bodies and body parts belong to us.

觉得我们的身体和部位都属于我们。

It seems such a strange thing to think that it could even be otherwise.

如果不这么觉得就太奇怪了。

If I were to ask you, "Does your hand belong to you?"

如果我问你： “你的手属于你吗？”

you're going to say, "Of course it does. What a foolish question."

你会说：“当然，这问题也太傻了。”

But not everyone would agree.

但并不是人人都这么觉得。

Early on in my research,

在我的研究初期，

a neuropsychologist alerted me to a condition called xenomelia,

一位神经心理学家 让我突然注意到了

一种叫做“身体完整性认同障碍症” （xenomelia）的疾病，

or foreign limb syndrome.

或称“外肢综合征”。

You may have heard of something called phantom limb syndrome,

你可能会听说过“幻肢综合征”，

in which people who have had an amputation

接受过截肢的人

feel the presence of that limb, sometimes.

有时会感觉到那块肢体的存在。

Xenomelia is somewhat of an opposite condition,

身体完整性认同障碍症 大概是这种情况的反面，

where people feel like some part of their body --

患者感觉身体的某个部位，

usually the extremities, their hands or legs --

通常是四肢，即手或脚，

don't belong to them.

不属于他们自己。

So this neuropsychologist talked of phantom limb syndrome

这位神经心理学家 将幻肢综合征类比为

as animation without incarnation.

没有具象的动画。

So the limb is gone, it's not incarnate anymore,

没有了这块肢体， 它就失去了实体的形态，

but it's animated in your mind.

但是在你的脑海里， 它还是动态的。

And he talked of xenomelia as incarnation without animation.

他将身体完整性认同障碍症 类比为没有动画的具象。

So the limb is present, healthy even, incarnate,

肢体在那儿，健康， 看得见摸得着，

and yet, in your own mind, it feels like it doesn't belong to you.

但是在你的脑海里， 感觉它不是你的。

So in xenomelia,

身体完整性认同障碍症 患者的大脑和身体

the brain and bodily processes

that give rise to our sense of ownership of our body parts,

造成我们对身体部位的拥有感

they're misfiring, so to speak,

可以说是哑火了，

and the consequences can be serious.

后果很严重。

People with xenomelia will sometimes take extreme measures

身体完整性认同障碍症患者 有时会采取极端措施，

to get rid of, to amputate their foreign-seeming body parts.

除掉、切掉他们感觉 不属于自己的身体部位。

From the perspective of the self, though,

尽管如此，从自我的角度，

xenomelia is telling us something very profound.

身体完整性认同障碍症 还是给我们透露了一些重要的信息。

It's telling us that something as basic

它告诉我们，就算是

as the sense of ownership of our own body parts

我们自己身体部位的拥有感 这么基本的东西

is a construction.

都是一种“建筑”。

And sometimes, the construction goes wrong,

有些时候，建筑跑偏了，

and we perceive our own bodies in ways that are not quite real.

我们就会对自己的身体 产生不太真实的认知。

Let's take another aspect of our bodily self.

我们来看身体自我的另一方面，

It's called the sense of agency.

即“主导感” （sense of agency）。

So when I do something like pick up a cup,

当我做一些动作， 如拿起一个杯子时，

I have this implicit feeling that I am the agent of that action,

我会默认我就是这个动作的主导人，

that I have willed that action into existence.

是我主动实施了这个行为。

That feeling is the sense of agency.

这种感觉就是“主导感”。

But someone with schizophrenia may not have that feeling, always.

但是精神分裂症患者 就不会一直拥有这种感觉。

Someone with schizophrenia

精神分裂症患者

might do something and not feel like they are the agent of that action.

做了某些事，但不觉得 自己是这个行为的主导人。

So schizophrenia tells us

精神分裂症告诉我们，

that it is possible to be someone who does something

有可能你确实是做了某件事的人，

but doesn't have an accompanying sense of agency.

但你没有随之而来的主导感。

So just like the narrative self and the sense of ownership of body parts,

就如同叙事自我和 身体部位的拥有感，

the sense of agency is also a construction,

主导感也是一种“建筑”，

and it, too, can fail.

它也有可能会倒塌。

So you can see where this is going.

你可以看出我叙述的逻辑。

Let me take one more example to drive home this point.

我想再举一个例子解释这一点。

Let's talk of what it feels to be a body here and now.

我们来谈谈作为此时此刻 在这里的一副身体是什么感觉。

Not the feeling of being a story,

不是以故事的形式，

but the feeling of being a body in the present moment.

而是当下作为一副身体的感觉。

Psychologists estimate

心理学家估计

that about five percent of the general population

大约有 5% 的人口

will, at some point in their lives, have an out-of-body experience.

在人生的某个节点 会有灵魂出窍的体验。

Let's assume that all of us right now are having an in-body experience.

假设大家现在灵魂都在体内。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

But what that means is having this feeling of being in a body,

我指的是 你有在这个身体里的感觉，

being anchored to a body,

和这副身体相连，

occupying a certain volume of space

占据了一定的空间，

and looking at the world from behind our eyes.

透过我们的双眼 观察这个世界。

But if you are having an out-of-body experience,

但如果你灵魂出窍了，

you could possibly be feeling that you're up near the ceiling,

你就会感觉飞上了天花板，

looking down at your own body sitting in the chair below.

俯视你自己的身体 坐在椅子上。

People do report such experiences,

确实有人说他们有过这样的经历，

and mild versions of this have been replicated in labs.

这种经历的轻量级版本 已经在实验室中复刻出来了。

But if you think, like I do,

但是如果你像我这么想，

that out-of-body experiences are the outcome of brain processes

灵魂出窍只是 大脑程序出故障的结果，

that are misfiring,

then it stands to reason that the experience of being in-body,

那就可以理解 在身体之中的感觉、

of being embodied,

有肉体的实感

is itself a construction,

本身也是一个“建筑”，

and that, too, can come apart.

它也会分崩离析。

So what are these experiences of altered selves telling us?

这些自我的变体 告诉了我们什么？

They're telling us

它们告诉我们

that just about everything we take to be real

我们以为我们自己身上 真实的一切——

about ourselves --

"real" in the sense that we think we are always experiencing

“真实”在于我们以为围绕 我们的身体、我们的故事

undeniable truths about our bodies, our stories --

发生的都是毋庸置疑的事实——

well, that's just not the case.

但不是这么回事。

So when theologians and philosophers tell us that the self is an illusion,

虽然神学家和哲学家 告诉我们自我只是幻想，

this is partly what they mean.

但这只是对他们的片面解读。

You may have realized by now that there still remains the question

你可能已经发现 还剩一个问题没有回答，

of who or what is doing the experiencing,

是谁或什么在经历这一切，

even in the case of altered selves.

自我的变体也有这个问题。

This experiencing “I” in the question “Who am I?”

在“我是谁”这个问题里， 这个亲历者“我”

is at the heart of the debate about the self.

是“自我”的争议核心。

This experiencing “I” doesn’t go away

如果只是自我的 一层或多层被扰乱了，

if one or a few aspects of the self are disrupted.

这个亲历者“我”还会在那儿。

But what if all of the aspects of the self that comprise us

但如果组成我们自我的所有层面

都被扰乱了，会怎么样？

were to be disrupted?

Would the experiencing “I” disappear?

亲历者“我”会消失吗？

We don't have a satisfactory answer to that question, yet.

我们就此问题还没有一个 令人满意的答案。

It’s possible that the experiencing “I” is also an illusion,

有可能亲历者“我”也是个幻想，

in the sense of being a construction,

也是个“建筑”，

a construction without a constructor.

一个没有建设者的建筑。

That debate, however, is somewhat unresolved.

但是这个争议依旧没有定论。

Despite such doubts, I, personally -- whatever I am --

虽然我心存怀疑， 但是我个人——无论我是什么——

think that the self has no reality outside of the brain and body.

觉得在大脑和身体之外， 自我是不现实的。

I think that the experiencing “I” will not persist after the body is gone.

我认为，身体消逝之后， 亲历者“我”就不存在了。

So what does one make of such knowledge?

那知道了这点， 会有一些什么结论呢？

Well, firstly, these ideas will feel liberating to some

首先，这些想法 会让一些人摆脱束缚，

and might sit heavily upon others.

也可能会让一些人压力倍增。

Regardless, I think we can all attend to the stories that we think we are.

但是无论如何，我认为我们 可以关注我们对自己的认知故事。

Our feelings and emotions are modulated by our stories,

我们的故事调节着 我们的感受和情感，

and in turn, our feelings and emotions become part of our stories.

反过来，我们的感受和情感 也会融入我们的故事。

And our stories, our narratives, are not just cognitive --

而我们的故事，我们的情节 不只是认知上的，

they live in our bodies,

它们也会在我们的身体里上演，

and our bodies structure and shape our stories.

我们的身体组织、 塑造了我们的故事。

So knowing all this,

知道了以上这几点，

recognizing the constructive nature of it all,

知道了自我的构筑特质，

maybe we can hold on less tightly to our stories.

也许我们就可以不要这么 牢牢掌控我们的故事了。

Maybe we can learn to let go.

也许我们可以学着放手。

But that's easier said than done,

但是说起来容易做起来难，

because the thing that is doing the letting go

因为去放手的东西

is also the thing that has to be let go of.

就是要被放手的东西。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Maybe we can just marvel at the efforts of people over millennia,

也许我们只需惊叹于 人们在过去千年里付出的努力，

from the Buddha sitting under the Bodhi tree

有坐在菩提树下的释迦牟尼，

to the modern philosopher and neuroscientist

也有现代的哲学家和神经学家，

who has asked themselves the question "Who am I?"

他们都在问自己 “我是谁”这个问题。

But most of all,

但是最重要的是，

I think we owe a debt to those amongst us

我觉得我们都该感谢那些

who bravely bear witness to our altered selves --

勇敢证实其他自我的人，

whether we do so voluntarily,

无论他们是自愿的，

like monks and nuns do when they meditate,

比如僧侣、修女冥想时所做，

or whether it's brought upon us by biology and circumstance.

还是由生理或环境带来的。

There is something remarkably robust

建立整个自我感的过程中

about the processes that give rise to the totality of our sense of self.

有非常坚实的部分。

But there's something frighteningly fragile about them too.

但也有非常脆弱的部分。

They can crack.

它会破裂。

And any one of us, at any time in our lives,

我们每个人， 在人生的每个阶段，

may have to confront such cracks.

都有可能会面临这样的破裂。

And that knowledge, I believe, should make us empathetic

我相信了解了这一点， 能让我们对那些

towards those of us dealing with altered selves.

正在经历其他自我的人 更感同身受。

But I also believe that altered selves

我也相信，自我的变体

should not be seen as the outcome of deficits,

不该被视为缺陷造成的后果，

or as the outcome of a lack of attributes considered normal.

不该被视为缺少某些被认为是 “正常”的特质而产生的后果。

They are different ways of being,

它们只是存在的不同形式，

and it's the willingness of some of us to confront the self's constructed nature

正是因为有些人 愿意面对自我的构筑特质，

that is helping make sense of the self for all of us.

我们所有人才能更加理解自我。

Thank you.

谢谢。

(Applause)

（掌声）

Thank you.

谢谢。