Emily Nagoski and Amelia Nagoski: The cure for burnout (hint: it isn't self-care) | TED

Transcriber:

譯者: Lilian Chiu 審譯者: Helen Chang

〔如何處理不舒服的感受〕

[How to Deal with Difficult Feelings]

Cloe Shasha Brooks: Hello, TED community.

克洛伊：哈囉，TED 社群。

You are watching a TED Interview series

你正在收看 TED 的訪談系列

called "How to Deal with Difficult Feelings."

《如何處理不舒服的感受》。

I'm your host, Cloe Shasha Brooks, and a curator at TED.

我是主持人克洛伊·沙夏·布魯克斯， 也是 TED 的策展人。

Today, we'll be focusing specifically on burnout,

今天的焦點會明確放在倦怠，

both personal and professional,

包括個人面與專業面，

with the help of two experts,

也會邀請兩位專家協助：

Dr. Emily Nagoski and Dr. Amelia Nagoski.

艾蜜莉·納戈斯基博士 與艾梅莉亞·納戈斯基博士。

They are identical twin sisters

她們是同卵雙胞胎姊妹，

and the coauthors of a book about burnout,

共同寫了一本關於倦怠的書，

for everyone who is overwhelmed and exhausted by all they have to do,

寫給被所有必須要做的事 壓到喘不過氣、累壞了，

who is nevertheless worried that they're not doing enough.

且還覺得自己做得不夠的人。

Let's dive right in.

咱們開始吧。你們共同寫了一本書

You coauthored a book called "Burnout: The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle."

《倦怠：解鎖壓力循環的秘密》。

And the inspiration for this book was actually based on

這本書的靈感來源其實是根據

a personal experience that you had with burnout, Amelia.

艾梅莉亞個人的倦怠經歷，

Can you tell us more about that experience?

你能跟我們多談談那次經驗歷嗎？

艾梅莉亞：最早始於

Amelia Nagoski: Well, it began with me going to school

我在唸書的時候，我在攻讀 音樂藝術的指揮博士學位。

while I was getting my doctorate in musical arts in conducting.

我最後被送醫，而我會有腹痛，

I ended up in the hospital, and I had abdominal pain,

which they diagnosed as stress induced,

診斷是由壓力引起，

told me to go home and relax.

他們叫我回家放鬆。

And in fact, I had no idea what to do.

其實我不知道該怎麼辦。幸運的是，

But luckily, I have a sister who has a PhD in health behavior.

我姐姐有健康行為的博士學位。

So when I'm in the hospital, just in pain, laying there,

所以，當我痛苦地躺在醫院裡，

not even really understanding how I got there or why.

甚至無法理解我是怎麼會 變成這樣，或為什麼。

And I honestly didn't even believe

且老實說我甚至不相信

that stress could cause physiological symptoms.

壓力會造成生理症狀。

And Emily said, "How did you not know that?"

而艾蜜莉說：「妳怎麼會不知道？」

I'm a conductor and a singer.

我是指揮家和歌手。

I have learned in my musical training to express my feelings with my body,

我在音樂的訓練中一直在學習

如何用身體來表達我的感受，

to use my body as a vehicle for expressing emotion.

把身體當作表達情緒的工具。

And it occurred to me

接著，我想到，

that if it was true that I didn't just have those feelings onstage --

如果實情是我不只在台上 才有那些感受——

I had them all the time, my whole life --

我一生一直都有那些感受——

and if that was true, wow, that was a lot of feelings.

如果真是如此，

哇，那是好多的感受啊。

So I didn't even want to believe this was true.

所以我甚至不願意相信這是真的。

But once Emily brought me a huge stack of peer-reviewed science,

但等到艾蜜莉帶給我一大疊 同儕評鑑過的科學論文，

I couldn't deny anymore, yes, stress manifests in the body

我無法再否認了，是的， 壓力會在身體上顯現出來，

and can turn into symptoms of illness.

且可能會讓症狀變成疾病。

CSB: So, OK, well, let's start with some definitions.

克洛伊：好，咱們先從定義開始。

What are the three components of burnout?

倦怠的三項組成元素是什麼？

Emily Nagoski: So, according to the original technical definition

艾蜜莉：根據原始的技術定義，

from Herbert Freudenberger in the 1970s,

佛洛依頓伯格於 七○年代提出的定義，

burnout, which originally was inclusive only of the workplace

倦怠原本是只會發生在職場的，

but has expanded now,

現在已經擴展了，

involves depersonalization,

它會涉及自我感喪失（人格解體），

where you separate yourself emotionally from your work

也就是你把情緒抽離你的工作，

instead of investing yourself and feeling like it's meaningful;

而不是投入自己， 覺得工作很有意義；

decreased sense of accomplishment,

成就感下降，也就是 你持續更努力工作，

where you just keep working harder and harder for less and less sense

卻越來越不覺得你所做的事

that what you are doing is making any difference;

能造成任何不同；

and emotional exhaustion.

還有情緒耗竭。

And while everyone experiences all three of these factors,

雖然大家都會經歷到這三項因素，

over the 40 years since this original formulation,

在這原始構想被提出 之後的四十年間，

it turns out that, broadly speaking,

結果發現，廣義來說，

for men, burnout tends to manifest as depersonalization in particular.

對男性而言，

倦怠特別會以自我感 喪失的形式出現。

And for women, burnout tends to manifest as emotional exhaustion.

至於女性，倦怠比較會以

情緒耗竭的形式出現。

So anyone can experience burnout,

每個人都可能會倦怠，

But your specific way of experiencing it is probably going to be different,

但每個人明確體驗到的方式 可能都有所不同。

depending on who you are.

因人而異。

AN: And the factors that lead to burnout are not just professional ones.

艾梅莉亞：導致倦怠的因素 不只是職業上的因素。

They are parenting and social activism

還包括養育孩子、社會運動，

and anything where you need to care and invest,

以及所有其他你需要 關心、投入的事情，

where there are ongoing demands

這些事情會有源源不絕的需求，

that are unmeetable expectations

有無法滿足的期望 和永無止境的需求。

and unceasing demands.

That is the formula, no matter what context it's in, for burnout.

不論在什麼情境下， 這就是倦怠的公式。

CSB: Your work is around the stress cycle and how we can complete it.

克洛伊：你的研究主題是 壓力循環以及如何完成它。

可以跟我們談談嗎？

So, will you talk a little bit about that?

EN: Oh, yes! This is my favorite part.

艾蜜莉：好！我最愛這部分。

So, the main thing people need to begin with

所以，大家一開始需要知道的重點

is that there is a difference between your stressors,

就是這兩者的差別：你的壓力源，

the things that cause your stress,

造成你壓力的事物， 也就是艾梅莉亞剛才談的——

which is what Amelia was talking about --

the unmeetable goals and expectations,

無法滿足的目標和期望，

your family issues and money ...

你的家庭問題和金錢…… 那些是你的壓力源。

Those are your stressors.

And then there's your stress,

另外還有你的壓力，

which is the physiological thing that happens in your body

是在你體內發生的生理現象，

in response to any perceived threat.

是在感受到威脅之後產生的反應。

And it's largely the same no matter what the threat is.

不論威脅是什麼，它大致上都相同。

And evolutionarily,

演化上來說，

we know the threat response as being the fight, flight, freeze response

我們知道對威脅的反應是

「戰鬥、逃跑、不動」反應，

intended to help us run away from a lion.

目的是要協助我們逃離獅子。

So when you're being chased by a lion across the savanna of Africa,

所以，如果你在 非洲大草原上被獅子追，

你要怎麼辦？

what do you do?

You run, right?

你會跑，對吧？

So you use all this energy that happens in your body,

你會用上你體內的所有能量，

all this adrenaline and cortisol,

所有的腎上腺素和皮質醇，

every body system has been activated

體內所有的系統都啟動了，

to help with this escape from the perceived threat --

來協助你逃離你感受到的威脅——

your digestion and your immune system and your hormones.

你的消化系統、免疫系統、荷爾蒙，

Everything is focused on this one goal, including your cognition.

連同你的認知在內， 一切都為同一個目標努力。

Your problem-solving is focused just on this one problem,

你的解決問題能力全都 專注在這一個問題上，

and it will not let go, because your life is at stake.

且絕不放手，因為這是生死關頭。

But you manage to get back to your village,

但，你想辦法回到了村子， 獅子也放棄了，

and the lion gives up,

and you jump up and down and shout,

你跳上跳下，大聲喊叫，

and people come and listen to you tell the story,

大家跑來聽你說故事，彼此擁抱，

and you hug each other,

and the sun seems to shine brighter.

陽光也似乎更耀眼了。

And that is the complete stress response cycle:

那就是完整的壓力反應循環：

it has a beginning, when you perceive the threat;

它有開端，也就是你感受到威脅；

a middle, where you do something with your body;

有中段，也就是 你用你的身體來行動；

and an end, where your body receives the signal

然後是結尾，也就是 你的身體接收到訊號，

that it has escaped from this potential threat,

告訴你你已經逃離了這可能的威脅，

and your body is now a safe place for you to be.

你的身體現在也到了安全的地方。

Alas, we live in a world

唉！在我們生活的世界，

where the behaviors that deal with our stressors

處理我們壓力源的行為

are no longer the behaviors that deal with the stress in our bodies.

已經不再是處理 我們體內壓力的行為了。

我們幾乎不會被獅子追了。

We are almost never chased by lions.

Instead, our stressors are "The," capital T, capital F, "Future,"

我們的壓力源反而是

大寫的「未來」，或我們的孩子。

or our children,

or a commute is, like, the classic example.

或者通勤，這是個經典的例子。

When people have commutes,

當人必須要通勤時，

it's one of the most stressful parts of their lives,

那是他們生活中 最有壓力的其中一部分，

and your body activates

而你的身體會啟動

the same adrenaline and cortisol and digestion and immune system,

同樣那些腎上腺素、皮質醇、

消化系統、免疫系統，

and you finally get home, right?

你最終回到家，對吧？

你已經處理掉了你的壓力源。

You have dealt with your stressor.

Do you suddenly jump up and down

你還會突然跳上跳下， 很感謝自己能活著，

and feel grateful to be alive,

and the sun seems to shine brighter?

覺得太陽變得更耀眼了嗎？

No, because you've dealt with the stressor,

不會，因為你處理掉了壓力源，

but that does not mean that you've dealt with the stress itself.

但那並不表示

你已經處理掉了壓力本身。

This is excellent news, because it means that you don't have to wait

這是很棒的消息，因為那就表示

你不用等你的壓力源消失，

for your stressor to be gone before you can begin to feel better,

你就可以開始感覺好多了， 因為你可以處理壓力，

because you can deal with the stress while the stressor still exists.

而讓壓力源繼續存在。

Good thing, because most of our stressors are what are called "chronic stressors,"

這很好，因為我們的壓力源多半是

所謂的「慢性壓力源」， 它們每天都在那裡，

that are there day after day, week after week, year after year.

每週、每年都在那裡。

And I hope people are like, "OK, so how do I complete the stress response cycle?"

我希望大家會說：「好，那我要 如何完成這個壓力反應循環？」

And we have a list of, like, a dozen concrete, specific, evidence-based ways

我們有張清單，

上面有十多種具體、明確、 以證據為基礎的方法，

to help people deal with the stress response cycle.

來協助大家處理壓力反應循環。

But just taking the example of a commute:

但，就用通勤為例：

you get out of your car or you get off the bus,

你下了你的車，下了公車，

你的肩膀高聳到像你的耳環，

and your shoulders are trying to be your earrings,

and you're grumpy and cranky

你還很暴躁不安，滿腦子想著

and still thinking about the jerk who did I don't know what.

剛才做某件事的渾球。

And what you do is jumping jacks in your driveway,

你要做的

就是在你的車道上做開合跳，

或者繞著街區走一圈散散步，

or you go for a long walk around the block

or you just tense every muscle in your body,

或者你只要緊繃 你身體上所有的肌肉，

站在你家門外，

standing outside your apartment door,

holding your breath, tense, tense, tense for a slow count of 10.

摒住呼吸，緊繃，緊繃， 緊繃，慢慢數到十。

Even just that little bit of using your body

就算只是像那樣 稍稍用一下你的身體，

is what communicates to your body

就能和你的身體溝通，

that your body is now a safe place for you to be.

表明你的身體已經在安全的地方了。

You have to separate dealing with the stress

你得區分開處理壓力

from dealing with the thing that caused the stress.

和處理造成壓力的事物。

AN: And this need to deal with the stress

艾梅莉亞：要把處理壓力的流程

in a separate process from dealing with the things that cause your stress

和處理造成壓力的事物 分開，這就是為什麼

is why the doctor is telling me to relax

醫生叫我要放鬆

was not going to be an effective means of recovering from burnout.

並不是能從倦怠恢復的有效方式。

I had to deal with the stress in my body.

我必須要處理我體內的壓力。

And if, let's say, you get out of your car,

假設，你下了你的車，

and instead of doing jumping jacks, you just say,

你沒做開合跳，只是說： 「好，我現在要放鬆了。

"OK, I'm going to relax now. Relax now. You, relax!"

現在放鬆。你給我放鬆！」

Not effective, right?

沒有效，對吧？

You've relaxed, but you haven't changed your body's physiological state

你已經放鬆了，但你

還沒有把你身體的生理狀態 改成安全時的狀態。

into one of safety.

CSB: Totally.

克洛伊：沒錯。

And our first question from the audience.

來自觀眾的第一個問題。

OK, from Facebook, someone asks,

來自臉書，有人問：

"How do you know whether what you're experiencing is burnout

「你要怎麼知道你所經歷的 是倦怠還是其他狀況？」

or something else?”

EN: Yeah, ask a medical professional for sure.

艾蜜莉：肯定要諮詢醫療專業人士。

還有，

And there's a lot of overlap between burnout and lots of other experiences,

倦怠和許多其他狀況 也會有相當程度的重疊，

including depression and anxiety and grief

包括憂鬱、焦慮、悲傷、

and rage and repressed rage -- we've all got it.

憤怒、壓抑的憤怒——我們都有。

So our layperson's definition of burnout is, as you said,

所以，我們對倦怠的 門外漢定義就是，

如你所言，覺得

that feeling of being overwhelmed

被所有必須要做的事 壓到喘不過氣、累壞了，

and exhausted by everything you have to do,

while still worrying that you're not doing enough.

同時還擔心你做的不夠。

CSB: Mm hmm.

EN: If you feel like you are struggling even to get out of bed

克洛伊：嗯。 艾蜜莉：若你得要很掙扎

才能爬起床，把基本的事情做完，

and get the basics done,

that goes beyond burnout.

那就超過倦怠了。

Burnout is where you can show up for work,

倦怠是你仍然可以去工作，

but you spend your whole day fantasizing about being at a different job.

但你會花整天的時間

幻想可以做不同的工作。

AN: It's important to know that "burnout" is not a medical diagnosis,

艾梅莉亞：很重要的是要知道

「倦怠」不是一種醫療診斷， 不是一種心理疾病。

it's not a mental illness.

It's a condition related to overwhelming stress.

它是一種和過度壓力相關的狀況。

So it's not like it puts you in this different state

並不是說它會讓你進入 不同的狀態，讓你被困住，

where you're going to be trapped,

and you have to have 13 years of therapy and whatever.

你還得做十三年的治療之類的。

It just means that you need to be completing your stress response cycles.

它只表示，你得完成 你的壓力反應循環。

克洛伊：我想，對許多人而言， 能談工作倦怠是相當重要的，

CSB: Work burnout is just such an important thing to talk about,

I think, for so many,

and I'm curious if we can focus on that for a moment.

我們是否能花點時間來談談這一點。

Like, what are some of the earliest warning signs of professional burnout?

比如，職業倦怠的早期 警示徵兆有哪些？

AN: Let's say there's two kinds of people.

艾梅莉亞：假設有兩種人， 有艾蜜莉型的，

There's Emily people,

who are aware of what's going on in their bodies at all times.

他們時時刻刻都能意識到 自己身體的狀況。

And if they have signs of burnout,

如果他們有倦怠的徵兆，

they notice it just right away because that's how they do.

他們馬上就會注意到， 因為他們就是這樣的。

And then there's people like me,

還有像我這種人，

who never know what their body is experiencing.

從來就不知道自己的身體 感受到了什麼。

I didn't notice I was burning out until I was literally in the emergency room.

我都沒注意到我倦怠了， 直到我真的進了急診間。

But one of the things that causes burnout

但會造成倦怠的其中一個因素， 就是我們沒有能力發現

is our inability to recognize the hard stuff welling up inside us.

我們內在湧出的難受感。

And the solution is to be able to turn toward the difficult feelings

解決方案就是要能夠

轉向難受的感覺，

with kindness and compassion and say,

且要帶著仁心和同理心，說：

"Oh, I feel stressed. I feel unreasonably angry right now. I'm so cranky.

「喔，我覺得壓力好大。 我現在氣過頭了。

I wonder why that is,"

我好暴躁。不知道是怎麼了。」

and instead of just trying to, like, tell yourself to relax,

你要做的不是叫自己放鬆，

ask that feeling, "Why are you there? What do you need from me?

而是要問那種感覺：

「你為什麼在這裡？ 我需要做什麼？要改變什麼？」

What has to change?"

EN: One of the primary barriers to listening to your body

艾蜜莉：傾聽身體時的 主要障礙之一，是恐懼，

is a fear of the uncomfortable feelings that are happening in your body.

害怕你體內那些不舒服的感覺。

One of the things I say over and over, we say it over and over in "Burnout,"

我不斷在說，我們在《倦怠》裡 不斷在說的其中一件事，

就是：感覺是隧道。

is that feelings are tunnels.

you have to go through the darkness to get to the light at the end, right?

你得要穿過黑暗，

才能來到盡頭的光，對吧？

Feelings are tunnels. Stress is a tunnel.

感覺是隧道。壓力是隧道。 你得努力穿過它。

You've got to work all the way through it.

不是說壓力對你不好，

Not that the stress is bad for you,

不好的是被卡在中間，

it's getting stuck in the middle that is bad for you,

never having an opportunity to take your body through the cycle.

完全沒有機會帶你的身體走完循環。

One of the reasons why people don't do that

大家不會這麼做的理由之一， 是因為他們害怕，

is because they feel afraid

of their uncomfortable internal experiences.

怕他們內在不舒服的感受。

When I first started learning this stuff explicitly --

當我初次開始明確了解 這些感受時——

we grew up in a family where uncomfortable feelings were not allowed,

我們成長的家庭不允許 有不舒服的感覺，

and the idea that feelings were tunnels,

至於感覺是隧道的這個想法，

I was just like, "I don't think that's true.

我會說：「我不認為如此。我很確定

I'm pretty sure that uncomfortable feelings are caves with bats and rats

不舒服的感覺是洞穴，

裡面有蝙蝠、老鼠、

and snakes and a river of poison.

蛇，和一條毒河。

And if I begin to experience my uncomfortable feelings,

如果我開始感受到不舒服的感覺，

I will be trapped forever in the dark with the rats and the bats."

我就會永遠和老鼠及蝙蝠 一起困在黑暗中。」

I began a practice of noticing when my body was experiencing a sensation,

我開始練習去注意 我身體出現的感受，

allowing it to be and allowing it to move all the way through.

允許它存在，也允許它一路通過。

And as I practiced that with gentle emotions,

我先針對比較溫的情緒來練習，

I began to be able to practice it with more and more intense emotions,

我漸漸開始可以 用在更強烈的情緒上，

both positive and negative, intense emotions.

包括正面和負面的強烈情緒。

So that now when I'm confronted with big, difficult stuff,

所以，現在，當我面臨重大的困難，

I trust that my body will go all the way through the feelings

我相信我的身體能

一路通過這些感覺，

without me being trapped in the dark with predators.

不會讓我被困在黑暗中，

和捕食性動物作伴。

AN: And I started doing it 20 years after Emily did, but it's never too late,

艾梅莉亞：我比艾蜜莉 晚了二十年才開始做，

但永遠不嫌晚，

you can always recover.

我們一向都能復元。

CSB: Let's bring up another audience question.

克洛伊：再來看一個觀眾的問題。

"How can you talk to your manager or supervisor

「你要如何和你的經理或主管說

about the fact that you're experiencing burnout and get real support?"

你在倦怠期，還能 得到真正的支持？」

這個問題來自臉書。

A question from Facebook.

EN: If you're in a workplace

艾蜜莉：如果你在職場上 覺得你無法對你的老闆說：

where you don't feel like you can say to your boss,

"My mammalian body is having mammalian needs,

「我的哺乳類身體 現在有哺乳類的需求，

and I need to adjust my work situation

我需要調整我的工作處境，

to accommodate the fact that I live in a monkey suit,"

以接受我活在一件 表演戲服裡的事實。

know that we consult all the time with gigantic corporations

我希望你知道，我們 常常和大型企業做諮詢，

that are making active efforts

它們會主動投入心力，想辦法去認可

to incorporate acknowledging people's emotional and physical needs,

大家在情緒上和身體上的需求。

checking in at every meeting, saying, "Where are you at?",

每場會議都會確認： 「你狀況如何？」

asking people to become aware of and more clear in expressing

讓大家能意識到

並更清楚地表達他們的感受，

how they feel

並推動經理應該準備好處理

and promoting the idea that managers should be ready to cope

when their supervisee comes in and has a bunch of feelings

他們旗下的員工帶著 一大堆感受來找他們，

that they need to process and move through.

需要協助走過這些感受。

So it exists. People are working on it. I feel optimistic.

這是存在的。有人致力於此。

我抱持樂觀。

And I also know that there's a lot of workplaces

我也知道有許多工作場所

that are trapped in this sort of, like, industrial,

被困在這種

工業式、超級族長制、

super patriarchal, rabidly individualistic mindset,

極度利己主義的心態中，

where you just need to protect yourself against the toxic culture

此時你只能保護自己，

別被有害的文化影響，

by creating a bubble of love at home,

做法就是在家創造愛的泡泡，

where everyone in your household cares for your well-being

在泡泡裡，你家中的 每個人都在乎你的幸福，

as much as you care for theirs.

你也同等在乎他們的幸福。

CSB: How can people who feel truly stuck

克洛伊：覺得真的卡住的那些人

take a first step towards wellness?

踏出邁向健康的第一步？ 還有，你怎麼定義健康？

And how do you define wellness, too?

AN: We define wellness as:

艾梅莉亞：我們把健康 定義為可以自由地

the freedom to oscillate through all the cycles of being human

在身為人類的所有循環中游移不定，

from effort to rest, from autonomy to connection ...

從努力到休息，從自主到連結……

And we always say that the cure for burnout is not self-care,

我們總會說，倦怠的解藥 並不是自我照護，

cannot be self-care.

不可能是自我關心。

How can you be expected to "self-care" your way out of burnout?

你怎麼能期望

靠自我關心脫離你的倦怠？不可能。

You can't.

What you need is a bubble of love around you,

你需要的是被愛的泡泡包圍。

people who care about your well-being as much as you care about theirs,

和你互相關心彼此幸福的人，

who will turn toward you and say, "You need a break.

他們會轉向你並說： 「你需要休息一下。

I'm going to help you with this. I'm going to step in in that way,"

這件事我會幫你。 我會用那種方式介入。」

或甚至就只是給你十五分鐘，讓你能

or even just give you 15 minutes

for you to yell about whatever the problems you feel at that moment

大聲吼出你當下感受到的問題，

and just be on your side and go, "Yeah!

站在你這一邊，說：「是啊！

I can't believe that happened to you! I'm so on your side," for 15 minutes.

我不敢相信你會遇到這種事！ 我完全站在你這邊」

只要這樣十五分鐘的支持，

Just that can give you enough of a release

就能讓你有足夠的釋放， 感覺好些，可以再踏出一步。

to feel a little bit better to take one more step.

The cure for burnout is not self-care.

倦怠的解藥不是自我關心。

It is all of us caring for each other.

是所有人互相關心彼此。 一個人做不到。我們需要彼此。

We can't do it alone. We need each other.

EN: Making that happen in real life is, of course, easier said than done.

艾蜜莉：當然，在現實中， 這是說來容易做起來難。

And one of the things that is my little reminder to myself

我會用一種方式提醒我自己，

is that when I feel like I need more grit,

當我覺得我需要更多膽量時，

what I actually need is more help.

我其實需要的是更多協助。

And when I look at Amelia's life, and I think,

對艾梅莉亞的生活，我覺得： 「她需要更有紀律，

"She needs more discipline,

她需要更堅持，她需要更努力。」

she needs more perseverance, she needs to work harder,"

what she actually needs is more kindness.

她其實需要的是更多仁慈。

That's the baseline culture change that’s going to end burnout forever.

那是底線，

如果要讓倦怠永遠消失， 最少要從文化做改變。

AN: And usually the next question people ask us is,

艾梅莉亞：通常，大家接著會問：

「我人生中沒有這樣的人。

"I don't have anyone like that in my life.

我是領導的人， 所有的事情都是我在做。」

I am the leader, I am the one who's doing all of the things."

And the solution for that is probably closer than you think.

解決方案可能比你想像的還要更近。

I mean, I grew up in a household where feelings were, like, not allowed

在我成長的家庭中， 感覺是不被允許的，

我們一生都不親密。

and we were not close our whole lives.

And then we started reading the research

接著，我們開始讀研究，研究指出，

that said that connection and sharing support was the way out of burnout.

連結和分享支持是脫離倦怠的方式。

And we started trying,

我們就開始嘗試，

and we, like, broke down this 30-year barrier of, you know,

而我們打破了這三十年的障礙，

societal and family pressure not to, like, feel our feelings around each other.

過去，社會和家庭的壓力不允許我們

去感受對彼此的感覺。

And it turns out that if you feel like you're isolated,

結果發現，如果你覺得你被孤立了，

there's probably someone on the other side of that wall, it turns out,

可能在某人在牆的另一邊，

who wants just as much as you to connect with someone else.

也和你一樣想要和某人連結。

And we've been isolated

我們會被孤立，是因為別人告訴我們

because we've been told that it's stronger to be independent.

獨立才會比較強。

It's not true.

不是這樣的。

We're going to be healthier and stronger when we work together.

當我們同心協力時， 我們會更健康、更強壯。

There's probably someone already waiting

可能已經有人在等著，

who also wants the kind of relationship that you are desiring.

也想要你渴望的那種關係。

CSB: I think that's just so nice to hear, too, in the pandemic,

克洛伊：能聽到這點真好， 在疫情中我們都覺得很孤立，

when we're all feeling so isolated.

還有最後一個來自觀眾的問題，

We have one final question we'd like to bring up from the audience,

that we'll have to keep brief.

我們得盡量精簡。 咱們來看看吧。好。

So let's bring that up.

OK. "What can you do about burnout

「如果你是老師， 生活中就滿是壓力源，

if you are a teacher, where every day is filled with stressors?

能怎麼處理倦怠？

AN: I taught school for five years. That's how long I made it.

艾梅莉亞：我在學校教了五年。 我就只做了那麼久。

I burned out after four years and then I pushed through one more year.

我在四年之後就倦怠了，接著我

又撐了一年。

If you have any possible means of reducing the everyday stressors

如果你有可能有辦法

透過參與行政決策的方式 來減少日常的壓力源，

by getting involved in administrative decisions,

that's great, but that's almost never the case.

那很棒，但通常都不是這種情況。

The thing, number one, is to complete the stress response cycle.

第一件事，是要完成壓力反應循環。

You can exercise if that works for you.

如果對你行得通，你可以運動。

A good night's sleep will do it.

好好睡一覺也行。

How do I get a good night's sleep when I have to get up at 5am?

我早上五點要起床， 怎麼好好睡？你得早點上床，

You have to go to bed earlier,

那就表示你全家都要 允許你早點上床。

and that means your whole family has to give you permission

to go to bed earlier.

你珍視他們的睡眠， 他們也得同樣珍視你的。

They have to cherish your sleep the way you cherish theirs.

You can use your imagination

你可以用你的想像力，

and imagine yourself pummeling all of the stressors into the ground.

想像你自己把所有的壓力源打趴。

And you recover from that,

你能復元，是因為 你的想像力無法分辨

because your imagination doesn't know the difference

between pummeling the stressors in your imagination

在想像中把壓力源打趴 和在現實中打趴有什麼差別。

versus pummeling them in real life.

And you surround yourself with a bubble of love,

且你要讓自己的身邊 圍繞著愛的泡泡，

即，其他支持你的老師， 能告訴你：「是的，

other teachers who can support you and tell you, "Yes, you deserve care.

你應該被照顧。你是個珍貴、

You are a valuable, educated, wonderful human being.

有學識、美好的人。

You are not just, you know, Darth Vader dealing with these kids.

你不是黑武士在處理這些孩子。

You are a valuable person who deserves resources, who deserves care,

你是個珍貴的人，應該要得到資源，

應該要被關心，

who deserves love, who deserves freedom to oscillate."

應該要被愛，應該 要有擺動的自由。」

CSB: Thank you both so much for joining us together

克洛伊：謝謝兩位一起來參加，

and for teaching us about burnout and the stress cycle.

帶給我們倦怠和壓力循環的 知識。非常有啟發性。

This has been really illuminating. So, thanks for your time.

謝謝你們的時間。

EN: Thank you so much. AN: Thanks.

艾蜜莉：非常謝謝。 艾梅莉亞：謝謝。