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譯者: Lilian Chiu
審譯者: SF Huang
00:04
As a young woman, I've had
some pretty cool opportunities.
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我這個年輕女性遇到過
一些挺酷的機會。
00:07
One that I'm most proud of
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其中我最驕傲的
00:09
is having my art displayed
at the DMA before I turned 17.
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就是還不到十七歲,達拉斯藝術中心
就展出了我的藝術品。
00:13
When I was in the auditorium
with all the other young artists
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當我和其他年輕藝術家一起
在禮堂接受成就表揚時,
00:16
being honored for our achievements,
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00:18
I couldn't think
of how proud I was of myself.
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我其實無法去想對自己有多自豪。
00:20
All I could think about
was the velvet upholstery of the chairs
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我滿腦子想的
都是椅子的襯墊觸碰到
我手腳的後側。
00:23
touching the back of my arms and legs.
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00:26
For me, the sensation
of touching velvet is unbearable.
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觸碰到絲絨的感覺讓我無法忍受。
00:31
You may be thinking,
"I don't like certain textures either,"
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各位可能在想:
「我也不喜歡某些材質。」
00:35
but there's more to this story
you need to know.
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但各位要知道,故事不只這樣。
00:37
I’m Kate Kahle.
I’m 20 years old, and I’m autistic.
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我是凱特‧凱爾,
今年二十歲,有自閉症。
00:44
When I was a freshman in high school,
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我剛進入高中時,
00:46
my family noticed that I was having
difficulty connecting with my peers.
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我的家人注意到我很難跟同儕連結。
00:50
I had also developed severe anxiety,
and it showed up in unexpected ways.
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我也出現嚴重的焦慮,
且以意想不到的方式來呈現。
00:56
I had always had
autistic traits and struggles,
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我一直都有自閉症的特徵和障礙,
00:59
but I just thought I was weird.
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但我只以為我很怪。
01:01
My parents took me in for an evaluation
where we learned I was autistic.
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我父母帶我去做評估,
因而發現我有自閉症。
01:04
We were all shocked
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我們都很震驚,因為,
01:06
because I'm not what people
would typically think of
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我沒有一般認知中自閉症的樣子。
01:09
as an autistic person.
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01:12
Autism is diagnosed
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診斷出自閉症指的是
01:14
when social expectations
for neurotypical behavior
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社會期待一般人 (神經典型者)
應有的行為表現
01:17
begin to outweigh the person's ability
to perform those behaviors.
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對自閉症者來說,
不在他們能力可達成的範圍。
01:21
Autism spectrum disorder, or ASD,
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自閉症類群障礙(ASD)
01:24
is a lifelong developmental disability
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是種終生的發展障礙,
01:27
that can cause deficits in communication,
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可能會造成溝通、
01:30
social interaction, emotional awareness,
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社交互動和情緒意識上的障礙、
01:33
and it can cause sensory issues
among other symptoms.
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也可能會造成感官問題及其他症狀。
01:37
The reason it's lifelong is that autism
is not a disease and it can't be cured.
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自閉症是終生的,因為
它不是疾病所以無法治癒。
01:41
It's a neurodivergency,
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它是種神經多樣性,也就是說,
01:43
which means that the autistic brain
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自閉症的大腦和神經典型的
(一般人) 大腦運作方式不同。
01:45
works differently
than the neurotypical brain.
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01:50
No one is sure
why some people have autism.
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沒有人知道為什麼有人會有自閉症。
01:53
One of the criteria for diagnosis
is that symptoms must be present
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診斷的標準之一
是症狀必須要是從出生
或幼兒期就出現了。
01:56
from birth or early childhood,
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01:59
which means that it's not caused
by poor diet, bad parenting,
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意即,它的成因不是不良飲食、
不良教養、疫苗
02:04
vaccinations, and it's not contagious.
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且它不會傳染。
02:06
Evidence has shown that autism
can be passed down genetically,
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證據顯示,
自閉症可以透過基因傳給
孩子,意即可能是家族遺傳。
02:09
which means it may run in families.
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02:13
I found that a lot of neurotypical people,
and even some autistic people,
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我發現,很多一般人,
甚至一些自閉症患者,
02:17
struggle with the concept
of the autism spectrum.
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很難接受「自閉症類群」的概念。
02:20
This is partially because
I think it's poorly named,
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我認為,部分是因為名字取得不好,
02:23
but also partly because
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還有一個原因是
02:24
the way that experts and researchers
think about autism
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隨著專家和研究者做更多研究,
02:27
is changing all the time
as they do more research.
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他們對自閉症的看法也不斷在改變。
02:30
In the past, autism had three categories:
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在過去,自閉症分為三類:
輕度、中度、重度。
02:33
mild, moderate and severe.
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02:35
Later, it was thought of
more as a continuum like this,
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後來則認為自閉症的程度
是連續的光譜,
02:38
from high-functioning to low-functioning,
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從高功能到低功能,
02:40
with high-functioning
also being called Asperger's syndrome.
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高功能自閉症被稱為
亞斯伯格症候群。
02:43
You may think that as long as a person
experiences the same symptoms,
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各位可能會認為,
只要病人症狀都相同,
02:47
what you call their disorder
doesn't matter.
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怎麼稱呼他們的疾病都沒關係。
02:49
Here's why I don't prefer
the term "Asperger's syndrome."
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我不喜歡亞斯伯格症候群
這個詞的原因如下:
02:53
Hans Asperger was a medical doctor
and early researcher on autistic kids
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漢斯‧亞斯伯格是醫生及早期
研究自閉症兒童的研究者,
02:57
who he called "autistic psychopaths."
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他稱這些兒童「自閉症精神病患」。
02:59
He believed in eugenics,
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他相信優生學,
03:01
and he sent many of the kids
that he worked with
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他將許多他處理的孩子交給
03:03
to the Third Reich's child euthanasia
and sterilization programs.
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第三帝國的兒童安樂死及絕育計畫。
雖然不是納粹的主要目標,
03:07
While not the Nazis' main targets,
autistic people were considered a threat
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自閉症患者被認為會威脅到
03:10
to the Third Reich goal
of a genetically pure society.
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第三帝國所追求的:
基因純正的社會。
03:14
When people use the term
"Asperger's syndrome,"
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使用「亞斯伯格症候群」這個詞,
03:16
they're unknowingly reinforcing the idea
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無意間就是在強化「自閉症
患者對社會沒價值」的想法。
03:18
that autistic people
have no value to society.
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03:21
This is why I prefer my disorder
be referred to as autism spectrum disorder
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這就是為什麼我偏好我的狀況
被稱為自閉症類群障礙
03:25
or autism instead of Asperger's syndrome.
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或自閉症,而不是亞斯伯格症候群。
現在,自閉症類群
被認為是這個樣子的。
03:31
Nowadays the spectrum
is thought of more like this.
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03:33
This shows some of the struggles
that autistic people can have
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圖上可以看到自閉症患者
可能遇到的一些障礙,
03:36
and the varying degrees
to which each person can struggle
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以及每個人
03:39
with those particular issues.
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為這些問題所苦的程度。
03:43
Autism can have many symptoms
and may vary widely from person to person.
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自閉症的症狀相當多,
每個人的狀況也都很不同。
03:49
Some symptoms you might think of
when you think of autism
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提到自閉症時大家會想到的
一些症狀包括不敢眼神接觸、
03:51
are struggling to make eye contact,
poor communication,
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溝通不良、
感官問題,
03:55
sensory issues and obsessing
over special interests.
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以及沉迷在特殊的興趣中。
03:59
But there are also a lot of other symptoms
you might never have thought of before,
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但也有許多各位可能
從來沒有想過到的症狀,
比如情緒高漲、
04:03
like heightened emotions,
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04:04
making too much eye contact
or high affective empathy.
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眼神接觸過多或高情感同理心。
04:08
A lot of these less commonly
thought of symptoms
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這些比較少被想到的症狀,多半
出現在女性自閉症者身上。
04:10
are more common
in women and girls with autism.
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04:14
Here you can see a spectrum
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這張圖
04:15
that I filled out
to reflect my experiences.
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是我把我自身的經驗
填寫在這個類群光譜上。
04:18
As you can see,
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各位可以看見,
04:20
I have lots of sensory issues
with textures and sounds,
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我有許多和材質及聲音
相關的感官問題,
04:24
I focus a lot on my special interests,
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我很專注在我的特殊興趣上,
04:26
and I have high affective empathy
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且我的情感同理心很強,
讓我很容易和他人溝通。
04:27
which allows me to easily
communicate with others.
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04:30
After the initial shock of my diagnosis,
it began to make a lot of sense.
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在初次被診斷給震驚之後,
一切都開始變得合理了。
04:35
I finally realized why I had struggled
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我終於了解為什麼我很難
察覺他人的負面情緒,比如
當他們悲傷或受挫的時候。
04:37
to pick up on other people's
negative emotions,
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04:39
like when they're sad or frustrated.
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在我人生的前十五年,
我的關係都一直受到其影響。
04:41
This affected my relationships
for the first 15 years of my life.
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04:45
I'm very grateful for my diagnosis
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我很感謝我被診斷出來,因為
那讓我能了解和接受我自己。
04:47
because it allowed me
to understand and accept myself,
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04:50
and I was very lucky to get it.
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我很幸運能被診斷出來。
04:52
For every four boys diagnosed with autism,
only one girl is diagnosed.
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每四位男孩被診斷出自閉症,
才會有一位女孩被診斷出來。
04:56
Studies that have followed
children since birth show
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從出生就在追蹤兒童的研究發現,
04:59
that the natural ratio of males to females
with autism is closer to three to one.
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自閉症者中男女的
自然比率接近三比一。
05:04
The discrepancy
between this diagnostic rate
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診斷出的自閉症者和實際的自閉症者
05:06
and the actual rate of autism
between males and females
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在男女比例上不一致,
05:09
is likely due to the way
autism has been defined and studied
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成因可能是自閉症
被定義和研究的方式
05:12
and the tests used to diagnose it.
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以及用來診斷的測驗方式。
05:14
The tests used to diagnose autism
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用來診斷自閉症用的測驗仍立基在
05:16
are still based on studies
done on white autistic boys,
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對白種男孩自閉症者的研究上,
05:20
which likely leads to lower
and misdiagnosis in women.
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可能會導致女性自閉症者
不易被診斷出來或被誤診。
05:24
I would like to add that this is not only
an issue for women, but also minorities.
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我要補充,不只女性
會遇到這個問題,
弱勢族群也會。
05:29
White children are 19 percent more likely
than Black children
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就被診斷出自閉症的
機率來說,白人兒童
05:32
and 65 percent more likely than Hispanic
children to receive an autism diagnosis.
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比黑人兒童多 19%,
比西班牙裔兒童多 65%。
05:37
Males who outwardly display
mild symptoms of autism
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同樣都是展現出輕微
自閉症症狀的患者,
05:41
are diagnosed on average two years earlier
than women who display similar symptoms.
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男性平均會比女性
早兩年被診斷出來。
05:46
This might be because
female special interests
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這有可能是因為,一般來說,
05:48
are generally more socially accepted
than male special interests.
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女性的特殊興趣比男性的
更容易被社會接受。
05:52
When nonautistic people think
about autism special interest,
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談到自閉症者的特殊興趣,
非自閉症者通常會想到的
05:55
the thing that usually
comes to mind is trains.
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是火車。
05:58
I've never had any interest in trains.
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我從來沒有對火車感興趣過。
06:00
When I was a kid,
my special interest was in insects.
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在小時候,
我的特殊興趣是昆蟲。
06:04
The people in my life saw this
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我身邊的人認為那只是
對科學投入的健康興趣,
06:06
as just a healthy interest
in the sciences,
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從來沒有人把它視為自閉症的特徵。
06:08
and it was never really flagged
as an autistic trait.
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06:11
While my special interests
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雖然我的特殊興趣是一項
通常會被忽視的自閉症特徵,
06:13
were an autistic trait
that was largely ignored,
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06:15
my other autistic traits were hidden
because I was skilled at masking them.
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我的其他自閉症特徵
都不為人知,因為
我很擅長偽裝它們。
06:20
Masking is a behavior
by which autistic people try to camouflage
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偽裝這種行為指的是:
自閉症者試圖掩飾,
讓自己看起來沒有自閉症。
06:24
and seem like they're not autistic.
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06:26
Hearing this for the first time,
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初次聽到這種事時,
06:28
neurotypical people might think
that autistic people are insecure
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一般人可能會認為
自閉症者沒有安全感,
06:31
or manipulative
for trying to hide our symptoms.
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或為了要隱藏我們的症狀
而很會去操弄人。
06:34
This isn't true.
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不是這樣的。
06:35
The real reason
an autistic person would mask
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自閉症者會偽裝的真正原因
06:38
is because of a natural human desire
to fit in, connect with others
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是出於很自然的人類慾望,
想融入、與人連結,
06:44
and achieve social
and professional success.
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並在社交上及職業上都能有所成。
06:48
Masking behaviors can include
forcing eye contact,
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偽裝的行為包括
強迫眼神交會、
06:52
mimicking others’ behaviors,
expressions and gestures
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模仿他人的行為、表達和手勢,
06:55
and even memorizing scripts
for small talk and common conversations.
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甚至為了閒聊和日常對話去背誦劇本。
07:00
Some people are more skilled
at masking than others.
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有些人比別人更擅長偽裝。
07:03
I'm really good at masking
and people tell me that all the time,
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大家常告訴我我很擅長偽裝,
不論他們自己是否有意識到。
07:06
whether they know it or not.
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07:07
When someone says to me
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當有人告訴我,若我不說,
他們就不會知道我有自閉症,
07:08
that they never would have known
I was autistic if I hadn't told them,
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或我看來不像有自閉症,
07:12
or even that I don't seem autistic,
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他們在告訴我的
其實就是我很會偽裝。
07:14
what they're really telling me
is that I'm good at masking.
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07:16
A lot of people see this
as a really positive thing.
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很多人認為偽裝是好事。
偽裝能讓我過著「正常」的生活。
07:19
It's something that allows
me to live a "normal" life.
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07:22
And while it's true
that some things can be easier
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的確有些事在別人看不出你有
自閉症的情況下會比較容易,
07:24
when people can't tell you're autistic,
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07:26
it's impossible for a person with ASD
to not be heavily affected by it.
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但有自閉症類群障礙的人
不可能不被它影響。
07:30
Autism is a part of us.
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自閉症是我們的一部分。
07:32
It colors the way we think,
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它讓我們一生中思考、和他人互動,
07:34
interact with others
and see the world throughout our life.
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及看世界的方式變得更多采多姿。
07:37
This isn't something
that can be turned off with masking.
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這並不是可以用偽裝來關掉的東西。
07:39
It simply gets pushed down
to a level below that
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它只是被硬是壓低到
別人看不見的地方而已。
07:42
at which other people can see it.
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07:44
This pushing down of our true self
takes a lot of work.
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把真正的自我這樣壓低
是很費心力的事。
試想一下:
07:47
Think about this.
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07:49
When you're having
a conversation with somebody,
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當你正在和某人交談時,
07:51
you're doing a lot of things at once.
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你會同時做許多事。
07:53
You have the correct posture
and the right distance away from them.
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你有正確的姿勢,
和對方保持對的距離,
07:57
You're using the right facial expressions.
You're modulating your tone.
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你用適當的表情,
你會控制你的語調,
08:01
You might be gesturing.
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你可能會用手勢,
08:03
You're making the right amount
of eye contact.
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你做適量的眼神接觸,
08:06
You're not not looking them in the eyes,
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你不是不看對方的眼睛,
但不會看到讓他們感到發毛。
08:08
but you're not looking them
in the eyes so much that it's creepy.
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(笑聲)
08:11
(Laughter)
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08:12
And you're predicting
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你還要預測對方接下來
會說什麼、做什麼。
08:13
what the other person
is going to say and do next.
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08:16
For neurotypical people,
all of these things come naturally.
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對一般人 (神經典型者) 來說,
上述這些都很自然。
08:19
You guys don't even
have to think about them.
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各位甚至不用想就能做到。
08:21
But for me, I have to think
about all those things at once.
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但我卻得同時思考所有上述這些。
08:24
Over the years, I've learned
how to juggle all of these things,
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這些年來,
我學會了如何玩弄這些,
08:28
but it's a Herculean task,
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但真的超困難,
08:29
and for some its complexity
makes it impossible.
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對某些人而言,
是複雜到不可能辦到。
08:33
The difficulty of masking can often lead
to secondary mental health challenges.
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偽裝的困難度可能會導致
次發性的心理健康問題。
08:39
Depression can stem from working so hard
and still not being accepted,
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很努力卻仍然不被接受
可能會造成憂鬱,
08:43
while anxiety can come from the stress
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焦慮的成因則可能是壓力,
因為動不動就得要偽裝,
08:45
of having to mask
for a good portion of the day,
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08:47
every single day,
for a good portion of your life,
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且大半人生的每天都得如此,
或者是被歧視和排斥的風險。
08:50
or risk being discriminated
against and ostracized.
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08:53
These secondary mental health challenges
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尤其是女性更可能會有
這些次發性的心理健康問題。
08:55
are of particular issue
for women and girls.
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08:57
34 percent of women with autism
have depression,
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34% 的女性自閉症者有憂鬱症,
09:01
and 36 percent have anxiety.
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36% 有焦慮症。
09:03
While these secondary
mental health challenges are a big issue,
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雖然這些次發性的
心理健康問題很大條,
09:06
the biggest problem
masking causes for autistic people
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偽裝帶給自閉症者最大的麻煩
09:09
is late and misdiagnoses.
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是延誤和錯誤診斷。
09:11
If someone is really good at masking,
they may never be diagnosed at all.
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很會偽裝的人可能
永遠不會被診斷出來。
09:15
Men and children are the group
seen to be least skilled at masking,
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男性和兒童被認為
是最不擅長偽裝的族群,
09:18
and they're also the groups diagnosed
with autism spectrum disorder most often.
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而他們也是最常被診斷出
自閉症類群障礙的族群。
09:23
Case studies show that women
are more skilled at masking,
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案例研究發現,女性比較擅長偽裝,
09:25
and this is likely a huge factor
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這可能是造成她們延誤
和錯誤診斷的重要因素之一。
09:27
that contributes
to their late and misdiagnoses.
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09:30
The earlier a person
is diagnosed with autism,
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越早被診斷出自閉症,
09:33
the earlier they can receive
specialized care and treatment
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就能越早接受專門的照護和治療,
對生活的每個面向幾乎都有幫助。
09:35
that can help them
in almost every aspect of their life.
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09:38
Care for autistic people
gets better all the time
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隨著研究越做越多,自閉症
患者的照護也在不斷改善,
09:41
as more research is done,
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09:42
but unfortunately,
it's rare to find a therapist
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但,不幸的是,
很難少會有治療師
09:46
or other people who assist autistic people
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或其他協助自閉症患者的人,
09:48
that recognize the extra challenges
that come with being a woman.
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能夠知道女性患者還有額外的難處。
09:51
When you struggle socially as a female,
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若你是在社交有困難的女性,
09:53
learning to succeed socially
as a male just isn't enough.
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學習男性在社交上
成功的方式是不夠的。
09:57
Womanhood is a unique and challenging
experience all its own.
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光是身為成年女性這件事本身
就是獨特又有挑戰的經歷了。
10:01
The rules of female friendship,
how to talk about romance, menstruation
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女性友誼的規則、如何談論戀情、
月經,甚至如何自保
免受性侵犯的侵害,
10:05
and even how to stay safe
from sexual predators
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10:07
are all obstacles that autistic women face
but do not receive support for.
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都是女性自閉症患者要面對
卻得不到支持的障礙。
10:11
While it's tempting in our society
to say that gender is something small,
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在我們的社會中,很容易
會認為性別是微不足道的、
10:17
obsolete or insignificant,
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過時的或不重要的,
10:18
the truth is gender does matter.
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事實卻是,不同性別還是有差。
10:21
And when it comes to autism,
it matters a lot.
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在自閉症方面,則是差很大。
10:24
The difference comes in
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差別在於
10:26
with the vast disconnect between
the lived experiences of men and women.
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男性和女性在生活經歷上
有很大的脫節。
10:30
All autistic people are born autistic,
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自閉症者出生就有自閉症,
10:32
but from birth, girls are thrust
into a more socially rigorous environment
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但從出生起,
女孩會被推到在社交面上
比較嚴格的環境中,
10:36
that increases the pressure to mask
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那會增加偽裝的壓力,
10:38
and the challenges
an autistic person faces daily.
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及自閉症者日常中所面臨到的困難。
10:42
For any autistic person,
but especially women and girls,
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針對任何自閉症者,特別是女性,
10:45
the part of their autism you can see
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大家能看到的自閉症部分,
並非當事人實際上所經歷的。
10:47
is not what that person
is actually experiencing.
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10:51
It's impossible for someone
with a limited outside perspective
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觀點受限的外部人其實無法
10:54
to label someone else's autism,
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給自閉症貼上標籤,
不論那標籤是「輕度」、
10:56
be that label "mild," "moderate,"
"Asperger's," "high-functioning,"
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「中度」、「亞斯伯格症候群」、
11:00
or any other label.
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「高功能」或任何其他標籤。
11:02
You can see me up here
right now talking to you
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各位看到我站在這裡對大家
講話,會試著給我貼標籤,
11:04
and try to label me to differentiate me
in your mind from another autistic person
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在各位腦中將我和各位曾經
見過的自閉症患者來做區分,
11:08
you may have met,
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比如與在購物中心發生
感官崩潰的某個小男孩不一樣。
11:09
such as maybe a little boy
having a sensory meltdown in the mall.
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11:14
You can try to label me in your mind
to differentiate us,
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各位可以在腦中給我
貼標籤,來區分我們,
11:16
but the feelings
that we're having on the inside
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但我們內在的感受可能
比各位所想的還要相似。
11:19
are probably more similar
than you would think.
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我只是在經過數年的壓力
和練習之後學會偽裝它們。
11:21
I've just learned to mask them
after years of pressure and practice.
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11:26
This is partially because
what society expects of a grown woman
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有部分原因是因為
社會對成年女性的期望
11:29
is different than what they expect
from a little boy,
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和對小男孩的期望不同,
11:31
which is reasonable.
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這是合理的。
但社會對小女孩的期望
會比小男孩更多。
11:33
But society also expects more
of a little girl than a little boy.
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11:37
From a young age, girls are expected
to have higher emotional intelligence
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從很小的時候,女孩就被
期望能有較高的情商,
11:40
and care more about
their peers' emotions than boys.
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且比男孩更會關心同儕的情緒。
11:43
This is reinforced in almost
every aspect of their life,
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這些期望被強加在她們
人生的幾乎每個面向上,
11:46
from TV shows and toys to the words
and actions of family and teachers.
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從電視節目和玩具,到家人
和老師的言語和行為。
11:51
Women are better at masking
because society expects more from us,
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女性比較擅長偽裝,因為
社會對我們的期望較多,
11:54
and it doesn't make
as many allowances for us.
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給我們的容忍度較低。
11:57
Sometimes society will make exceptions
for the social deficits of autistic men
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有時,社會願意為男性自閉症者的
社交障礙來破例,
12:01
in exchange for
the knowledge and perspective
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用以交換他們能帶來的知識和觀點。
12:04
they can bring to the table.
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12:05
But it won't do the same thing
for autistic women.
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但社會不會為了女性自閉症者這麼做。
12:07
I want you to walk away
from this auditorium
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我希望各位等下離席之後,
12:10
knowing that autism is not a disease,
and it doesn’t need to be cured.
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要能記住,自閉症不是
疾病且不需要被治癒。
12:14
It's just a different way
some brains can work.
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只是有些人的大腦
用不同的方式運作。
12:17
If you want to help autistic people,
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如果你想協助自閉症者,
12:19
you can support organizations
like Autistics for Autistics,
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可以支持一些組織,如
Autistics for Autistics、
12:22
Autistic Self Advocacy Network
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自閉症自我倡導網,
12:23
and Autistic Women and Nonbinary Network
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和自閉症女性及非二元性別者網,
12:26
that support autistic self-love
and acceptance,
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它們都支持自閉症的自愛和接納,
12:28
as opposed to organizations
that spread fear about autism.
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不像一些組織會散播對自閉症的恐懼。
12:32
You should also identify yourself
as an autistic advocate
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你也應該向你生活中的人
表明你是自閉症倡導者,
12:35
to people in your life.
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12:36
Be understanding and allow friends
and family to unmask with you.
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寬容一點,讓朋友及家人
在你面前卸下偽裝。
12:40
This is also a call to action
for the psychology community
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這也是在號召心理學圈採取行動,
12:43
to conduct more research
on autism in women,
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對女性的自閉症做更多研究,
12:45
people of color and other minorities.
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還有有色人種及其他弱勢族群。
12:49
Most of all, I want you to know
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最重要的是,我希望各位知道
每位自閉症者都不一樣。
12:50
that every person
with autism is different.
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12:52
I got up here today
to share my perspective
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今天我能站在這裡分享
我的觀點,是因為我不像多數人
12:54
because I'm not what a lot of people
would think of as an autistic person.
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認為的自閉症患者。
12:58
But that doesn't mean
that every woman with autism
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但那並不表示每位女性自閉症者
13:00
will have the same or even
a similar experience to mine.
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都會有和我一樣或相似的經歷。
13:03
My autism journey
is just one out of thousands
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除了我以外,還有數千人的
自閉症旅程能夠提供洞見,
13:06
that can provide insight
into the way autistic people think,
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說明自閉症者如何思考、
13:10
interact with our society
and see the world.
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如何和社會互動和如何看待世界。
13:12
Thank you.
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謝謝。
13:14
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
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