Why Joy Is a State of Mind | Angélique Kidjo | TED

翻译人员: Yanyan Hong 校对人员: Iris Li

Femi Oke: I have a theory that Africans have this hotline to joy.

费米·奥凯（Femi Oke）： 我想非洲人民有保持快乐的秘诀。

安格丽克·基乔（Angélique Kidjo）： 噢，确实如此。

Angélique Kidjo: Oh yeah.

FO: We greet each other, we welcome each other.

费：我们互相问候，互相欢迎。

There's, within us as a continent,

整个非洲大陆的人们心里

there is great joy.

都充满着巨大的快乐。

AK: Absolutely.

安：确实如此。

It's a state of mind for us.

这是我们的一种心态。

It's either laugh or die.

除了开心度过每一天，

We don't have the choice.

我们没有别的选择。

And that's where the proverbs come from,

这正是我们一些谚语的由来，

that's where all those mimic, sometime --

也是我们为何善于模仿——

can be an insult,

有时这些模仿会显得很唐突，

or going, "Get out of here.

亦或者别人会说，“别闹了，

You're making a fool of yourself."

你在丢人现眼。”

Our body, we have signs.

在我们体内有一些信号。

And we look at each other

而我们会观察彼此，

and the situation ...

观察事情……

it might be a dire situation,

有时在面对糟糕的局面，

and then we start laughing and go,

我们会大笑，而后打趣地说，

"Somebody make a huge mistake.

“有人犯了一个大错哦，

And you are in a ditch,

阴沟里翻船了，

You can't even get yourself out."

你彻底玩完啦！”

And we laugh and we're happy at the same time.

我们开怀大笑，同时变得开心起来。

That's why I say it's a state of mind.

这就是我说的心态。

FO: I have seen people watch you perform, and they’re in the audience,

费：我有看过你的表演， 台下的观众

they are mesmerized, they are smiling,

都对你神魂颠倒，面带微笑，

they are joyful.

他们都很开心。

Do you have an awareness of what you are doing to your audience?

你有注意到你对观众产生的影响吗？

AK: No, I don't have any awareness

安：没有，我没有特别在意。

because for me, every concert is a start over.

因为对我来说， 每一场演唱会都是全新的开始。

I never take any public for granted

我从不认为有观众是理所当然的，

because you never know what the concert is going to be.

因为你永远也不知道这场演唱会 会变成什么样。

You can have plan in your head,

你可以在脑子里拟定一个计划，

you can have your set list and everything.

你可以记个笔记或者其他的什么。

It’s just to help you, it’s just like,

但是这只能起到辅助作用，

a parameter that you put in there to be able to perform.

这些只是协助你表演。

But what happens after that is out of your hands.

但如果事情没按计划走怎么办？

That's the power of music.

那就是音乐的力量。

When I'm holding my microphone,

当我拿到麦克风时，

for me, stage is my sanctuary.

对我来说，舞台就是我的避风港。

FO: I was looking up some of the comments people write

费：这里有一些观众的评论，

when they watched you online on YouTube.

都是看你 YouTube 直播的观众留下的。

Now, normally I wouldn't do this, but this is fine.

通常我是不会看这些的， 但是这些评论还不错，

This is not scary.

不是太糟糕。

"Pure love for Mama Angelique.

“纯洁的爱献给妈妈安格丽克，

A beautiful ball of energy."

她是颗美丽的能量球。”

AK: (Laughs)

安：（笑声）

FO: You know what you're doing.

费： 你知道你在做什么。

AK: Well, being on stage for me is the most important thing.

安：我最重要的事就是上台表演，

I hate to be in studio,

我讨厌去录音室。

but I've had to learn throughout the years

但这些年我知道了

that I need to be in the studio to be able to perform,

我必须去录音才能有机会表演，

to be on stage.

有机会上台。

And that energy that we're talking about, the public give it to me.

而我们所谈论的大众带给我的能量，

I can't keep it.

我不能都全盘保留。

If I keep it, I will explode.

如果我全部接受了，我就会爆炸。

I mean, just face it.

想想看吧，

And I can't sleep, like, when I finish a concert,

我都不能睡觉， 当我结束了一场演唱会

it takes me like four hours for me to dwindle down

我得花四小时消化这些能量，

and to be able to sleep.

然后才能入睡。

It’s terrible, because I’m wired up.

这太糟了，因为站在舞台上， 我就像被激活了一样。

I don't need no drugs, I don't drink coffee.

我不吃药，也不喝咖啡。

I don't drink alcohol, I don't take anything, I don't need it.

也不喝酒，我什么也没吃，根本不需要。

The music is my drug.

音乐就是我的灵丹妙药。

So therefore, when I'm onstage,

因此，我上台表演，

I'm just trying to convey the happiness,

我都尝试给大家传播幸福，

the joy

快乐，

and the strength that we have as human beings

这些东西是让我们人类

to prevail in every circumstance.

在任何情况下都 能战胜一切的力量源泉。

Because music has shown me,

因为音乐告诉我，

when I'm facing the public,

当我在面对观众时，

I see people from around the world,

我会看见来自世界各地

all different skin tones

不同肤色

and probably all people that speak different languages,

说着不同语言的人们，

that makes you humble.

这让我变得谦虚起来。

FO: And you've gone so beyond what would be expected of somebody

费：你已经超越了大家

with your profile as a musician.

对音乐家的期望。

You are not just a musician, you're not just an artist.

你不仅仅是音乐家、艺术家，

You are also an educator.

你还是教育家。

AK: Education is everything.

安：教育至关重要。

And when I started this journey with my foundation Batonga,

当我创立 Batonga 基金会时，

one thing I have in mind is what my father always used to say.

我脑海里总盘旋着我父亲说过的话。

An educated person is a peacemaker.

受过教育的人才能维护和平。

And it's true,

确实如此，

because when you are educated

因为你接受教育后，

and understand the connectivity,

就会明白人与人之间的联系。

everything in the world we live in is connected, even us.

世界上的万事万物都是相关联的， 人类也是如此。

And if there's one thing we learned during the pandemic,

在疫情期间我们知道了

it's that we cannot live alone.

人是不能脱离集体生活的。

Lockdown or not, it becomes a point where we need others

无论是否处在封控时期， 教育都成为了一个契机：

to be able to celebrate our own humanity.

我们需要其他人， 这样才能体现我们的人性。

From the moment I started going to school, it triggered something in me.

当我开始上学时， 我的潜力就被激发了。

Not only the curiosity, but I was thirsty of learning.

我的好奇心和求知欲都被激发了。

What can I learn every day?

我每天都能学到什么？

And I would come home and I ask questions.

我会回到家并问家人问题。

And I'm lucky enough to have 10 brothers and sisters

幸运的是，我有十个比我大的兄弟姐妹

that come before.

来解答我的问题。

Some of them have been there.

他们中的有些人之前 也有过同样的疑问。

So if I ask questions, somebody's always going to answer me.

所以只要我提出问题， 就会有人回答我的问题。

And then I get to high school

当我上了高中以后，

and I start seeing a different side of education.

我开始透过另一个角度看教育。

Because when I finished primary school,

因为当我初中毕业时，

most of my girlfriends, we made plan.

我的大多数女性朋友和我， 都会开始计划，

When we get to high school, we're going to do this and that.

上了高中以后我们要做的事。

Some of them disappeared from the radar.

他们中的一些人就开始渐渐失去联系了。

And I’d be asking the question: “Why aren’t they here?”

我就会问： “为什么她们不上高中？”

Then, my girlfriend in the same street where I grew up,

接着，跟我住在同一个街道的闺蜜，

right across my house,

她就住在我家对面，

never make it to high --

她就没上高中。

And I'm like, "Dad, what is going on?"

我问道，”爸爸，发生了什么？”

And then he went and found out that she got married.

后来他发现原来她结婚了。

And I was --

然后我，

It was a day that I'm like,

我那天就一直在想，

"Is it worth living, if at that age you're going to marry somebody

“如果在那个年纪，你要在我不知道

without me knowing what was going on?"

发生了什么的情况下嫁给某人， 这还值得活下去吗？”

So to start my foundation, secondary school,

所以我创立基金会的初衷是，

is to allow those young girls to buy time.

初中是给这些年轻女孩 争取更多时间的机会。

To have a future, to decide the future they want to have

让她们争取自己想要的未来，

instead of being married young

而不是早早地就结婚，

and end up dying on a delivering bed.

然后死在分娩床上。

So for me, education not only

所以对我来说，教育

allowed us to understand the complexity of this world,

不仅让我们明白了世界的复杂性，

it also unleashed the power

它同样释放了我们的力量：

that we have to understand when we stand in front of injustice,

我们必须站在公正的角度，

our rights,

正视我们的权利，

what is right and what is wrong.

明辨是非。

And when it comes to women,

当谈到女性，

especially in the continent of Africa,

尤其是非洲大陆的女性时，

I start realizing that the vision of my father for women

我开始意识到我父亲对女性的视角

is totally different from the vision of the father of my friends.

与我朋友父亲的视角完全不同。

Because when I go to their home,

因为当我去朋友家做客时，

I couldn't speak because it was not allowed.

不经允许我是不能说话的。

You have to be given permission to speak.

你必须经过许可才能说话。

While in my house, you have something in your mind,

但在我家，你脑袋里想什么，

go right ahead.

你就说什么。

Somebody's going to answer you.

总有人会回答你。

And I start seeing the differences, and I said,

因此我开始发现这些不同，

“How can we break this cycle

”我们如何才能打破这种循环，

of always women have to be the ones that get quiet

即女人必须保持沉默，

and men speak up even when they say nonsense.

男人即使胡说八道也要大声说话。”

FO: The Batonga Foundation, it creates opportunities for women and girls.

费：Batonga 基金会 为所有女性提供了机会，

It creates a future for them.

也为她们开拓了未来。

It sounds easy, though, to say that:

为所有女性提供机会，

creates opportunities for women and girls, easy.

听起来很简单，说起来也很简单。

But it's not.

但实际上很难。

Can you give us an example of your advocacy work

你能给我们举一个你在基金会中的例子吗？

that has been difficult

虽然这个事业很困难，

but you've worked through it

但你已经克服了困难，

and you've seen success and happiness the other side?

看到了胜利和幸福曙光的例子？

AK: The hardest thing ...

安：最困难的是……

when I started was not being able to get the girl to speak.

我刚开始的时候， 都不能让那些女孩开口说话。

It was breaking my heart.

真的叫我很伤心。

"What is your name?"

我问“你们都叫什么名字?”

There's no answer, they look at you like.

没人回答我，就沉默地看着你。

And I’m like, “Why?

我就又问：“为什么不说话？

Why? Tell me what you need.

为什么？告诉我你们需要什么。

I'm here to help.

我是来这儿帮助你们的。

I'm not going to tell you what to do."

我不是来指导你们要做什么的。”

From the day they realize

那天起她们就明白了，

and have confidence

也相信了，

that I'm not here to judge their choices,

我不是来这质疑她们的选择的。

some of them were already mothers.

她们中的有些人已经是孩子的妈妈了。

And you have a lot of pride

当你和弱势群体交谈时，

when you're talking to underprivileged people.

你会感到非常自豪。

Because I decided from the get-go

因为我一开始就打算着手于

to walk the dirt road where no one wants to go

无人问津的弱势群体，

because that's where you have fewer opportunities.

因为那些人们更缺乏机会。

And I was not going to let those girls be marginalized and left in limbo.

我不会放任这些女孩随波逐流， 被社会边缘化。

So from the moment they start speaking,

所以当她们开始讲话，

to me,

和我交谈，

is the moment I start seeing how we can move forward together.

我就能看到将来 我们会怎样一起携手共进。

So we start doing,

当我们开始援助别人的时候，

as an organization, we needed data, right?

需要数据，对吧？

Because I've done it ten years,

因为我已经连续十年

sending people to high school, they end up in university,

送女性上高中、大学，

all that kind of stuff.

做了很多诸如此类的事情。

But I wanted to understand why

但我还是想明白

and the reason of the drop out of the girls.

为什么这些女生要辍学？

So through that, we find out many different reasons.

关于这点，我们收到了各种各样的原因。

One of the reasons of the drop out is that in primary school,

其中一个辍学原因是，

the teachers were not good enough,

小学的老师不够好，

so they didn’t have the tools to succeed in secondary school.

导致她们到了初中之后 缺乏一个坚实的基础。

And there's so much ammunition you can go through

很多事实都显示，

when you appear to be a stupid person

你好像有点笨，

and you're not stupid, you just don't have the tools.

但其实你不笨， 你只是没有得到良好的教育，

Then you drop out.

然后你就辍学了。

Pregnancy, of course, and family poverty.

还有人因为怀孕、家庭贫困等原因辍学了。

And one thing that came out of that data collection

在数据收集过程中， 关键因素就浮出水面了。

is all of the girls say, “We need a safe space.

所有的女孩其实都在说， “我们需要一个更安全的环境。

We need a place where we can talk to one another

我们需要一个能自由交谈，

and we can work together and support one another."

一起共事、互相支持的环境。”

I said, "It's done."

我说，“那就这么办。”

So we start creating the girl club

于是我们就开始创立女生俱乐部，

and built a curriculum based on their need.

并根据她们的需要开设课程。

And they ask to be taught how to prevent rape.

她们还要求学习应对强奸的方法。

How can they run away?

她们怎么逃跑？

How can they do things?

要做什么？

So we come up with simple thing.

所以我们就从简单的教起，

Don't go out when it's getting dark.

不要在天黑以后出门。

When you're walking and you have a shadow behind you

当你觉得后面有人跟着你，

and you feel uncomfortable, don't start,

你觉得不舒服，

don't try to be courageous.

不要莽撞行事，

Don't try to be daring.

不要觉得自己很勇敢。

Run away.

你就逃跑。

And we prepared the village.

我们还告诉所有的村民，

If a girl comes to your house,

如果有一个女孩跑到你的房子里，

keep her there until the family member can come

那就是外面有危险，

because there's a danger in the street.

让她待到家人来接她。

So we start the whole thing like that.

我们进行了一系列诸如此类的教育。

What is going on today

我真的为现在取得的

that I’m really proud of

成果而骄傲，

is that those young girls

上课的很多年轻女孩，

are becoming entrepreneurs and creating jobs.

都成了企业家， 开始为别人提供工作了。

They are in total control of what they do with their money.

她们完全财政自由，

They decided they're going to save money.

还决定要存钱。

It's not me.

不是存钱给我，

For the children not to go through this again.

而是为了让儿童不再经受这样的苦难。

What they want is to break the cycle of poverty.

她们想要打破贫困的循环。

The next step that I'm taking

下一步我将前往

is to go to the northern part of my country, Benin.

我的祖国贝宁的北部地区。

The girls in Benin, at eight years old,

有些贝宁的女孩年仅八岁，

are sent to the man that's going to marry them home,

就被送去将来要嫁去的人家里，

they become maids,

成为佣人，

until they have --

直到生命的尽头。

And I want to break that cycle.

所以我想要打破这个枷锁，

I've been working hard.

我为此已经做了很大的努力，

I’ve been asking for help with this for so long.

也为此长时间四方求助。

We're going to start there with local organizations.

在那儿， 我们将与当地组织合作开展工作。

We don't bring anybody from outside.

我们不会让外部人士参与进来，

We work with the people that know the needs.

我们是跟了解群众需求的人士一起合作。

We work with the village,

我们和村民、

the head of the villages, the mothers.

村长，还有母亲们合作。

We want people to see for themselves the progress we are making

我们希望他们亲眼见证取得的进展，

and for them, to allow them to listen to the kids

而且这也让他们倾听

that they never do.

从未认真倾听过的孩子们的声音。

FO: What is the difference

费：改变一代人的生活

between the pleasure you get from changing a generation's life

所获得的快乐，与大型表演中

to the pleasure of being on stage at a major event, performing,

观众欢呼声带给你的快乐

and the crowd is going wild?

对你来说有什么区别？

What's the difference between that kind of joy?

这两种快乐有什么区别？

AK: They are two totally different joys.

安：这是截然不同的两种快乐。

The joy of seeing these girls

那种看到女孩们

being articulate today,

能言善辩、

talking truth to power to the head of villages

挑战权威，向村长说出实情，

telling them, "No one is touching us anymore.

告诉她们 “从今往后，没人会随便碰我们了。

No one have the right to touch my boob, no."

也没人有权随便摸我们的胸了。”

And they're adamant.

她们对此坚信不疑。

I mean, the joy at taking that is that finally,

这种喜悦是来自

you can speak up with no danger.

我们终于能安心落意，无所畏惧的

With no fear.

公开表态。

I mean, empowering people to that point

能赋予人们这样的权利

makes me more humble.

让我变得更加谦虚。

I don't even know, sometimes I'm like,

我甚至有时都不清楚，

"Where is the hole that I can drive in and then disappear,

“我该从哪着手，然后放手

and let them be."

任由她们发展?”

But they won't let me go.

但她们从不叫我放手。

They say, "We want you to come and see us,

他们会说， “我们想让你来这里看我们，

and then we learn from you."

然后我们再从你身上学别的东西。”

But I learn more from those girls than I can ever learn from anybody.

但我从那些女孩身上学到的 比从任何人身上学到的都多。

The joy of being onstage is different,

在舞台上的喜悦与此截然不同。

it's planting seeds worldwide

它能让全世界的人们

for people to see their capacity,

都看到自己的能力，

what they are capable of.

以及自己能做到什么。

How many times after concert people will come to me and say,

好多次我演唱会后， 都会有人来问我，

"Angelique, how can we help?"

“安格丽克，我们能帮你什么忙吗？”

And I'm like, "How can you help?

我就会说，“你觉得你能帮什么忙？

Come on.

拜托。

Your neighbors.

你可以先帮你的邻居啊。

Start looking at them.

先看看他们是不是需要你帮忙。

You can volunteer your time for homework,

你也可以帮下忙， 先把你的功课做了。

there's so much you can do in your own country.

你的国家也有很多需要你的帮助。

Don't think that Africa is just the country where we need help.

不要想着非洲国家只会寻求他人的帮助，

We don't need help.

我们不需要别人帮我们。

We need collaboration."

我们需要的是非洲大陆团结一心。”

FO: Did you warm up your voice today?

费：今天你有没有开嗓呢？

AK: Yes, I did.

安：我有。

FO: What do you sing to yourself to cheer yourself up?

费：你想鼓舞自己的时候会唱什么呢？

What do you sing and is like,

有没有那种你一唱就觉得，

"Oh, that was better than Prozac."

“啊，这比百忧解还管用。”

AK: (Singing)

安：（唱歌）

(Laughs)

（笑声）

We can sit here for days.

我们可以坐在这唱好几天。

FO: So glad you warmed up.

费：你开了嗓真是太好了。

When you see your Grammys lined up,

当你看到自己排成行的格莱美奖

and they're all shiny and extraordinary,

闪闪发光，魅力非凡，

I'm not even going to name how many, because every time I do,

我甚至都不想说到底有多少， 因为每次我一说

you get more and then this chat will date,

你就会得到更多，刷新记录，

so the many, multiple Grammys that you have won,

你赢了那么多格莱美奖，

when you look at them,

你会不会看着它们，

Do you, "Whoo!"

你会不会小小的庆幸一下？

(Laughs)

（笑声）

Does it feel good?

感觉是不是很好？

AK: It feels good.

安：感觉是很好，

And at the same time, as I said before,

但就像我之前说的那样，

it is a responsibility.

这也是一种责任。

I mean, my work,

就像我说的，我的作品，

I've been nominated first time at the Grammys, it was in 1993, '94.

第一次获得格莱美奖提名是 1993，1994年。

And the first Grammy I won was 2007.

然后 2007 年， 我第一次赢了格莱美奖。

And I said to people,

我对大家说，

don't take Grammy for granted.

不要想着格莱美奖就是全部了。

It's not about how many likes you have,

你获得多少喜爱并不重要，

it's what you have to say.

重要的是你为何事发声，

What you are bringing to the table.

你为大家带来了什么。

How you are impacting the world

你怎么影响世界，

and how you are changing the music business as it is.

你让音乐行业发生了怎样的改变。

And for me,

对我而言，

that responsibility is always at the core of everything I do.

我做的一切都是出于这种责任感。

When I'm setting myself to write new songs,

当我开始写新歌时，

I don't think about Grammys.

我没有想我会得格莱美奖。

All I think about,

我能想到的，

how this song would help people.

是这首歌会怎样帮助到大家。

What impact is it going to have?

它会有怎样的影响。

FO: I know you plan.

费：我知道你有计划。

I know you have ideas about what you want to do next.

我知道你想好下一步要做什么了。

For many artists, it would be, you know,

要知道，对于其他很多艺人来说，

how do you want to spend your sunset years?

他们计划的是如何安享晚年。

But you have extraordinary longevity in your family.

但你的家庭成员非常长寿。

So you have another half a lifetime still to go.

这就意味着你还有 大半辈子的时间才到你的晚年。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

We are going to be going to 100-year-old Angélique Kidjo concert.

我们会参加你的 100 岁演唱会。

And you're still going to be, "Let's go."

那时你还会说，“让我们嗨起来吧。”

AK: Yeah, I'll be running around.

安：对，我还会跑来跑去。

FO: So it feels kind of weird to talk about legacy.

费：所以这时候就 讲给后人留下的遗产有点奇怪。

But what do you want people who follow your work,

但是你希望那些关注你的事业、

admire your work, see joy in your work,

钦佩你的事业、 从你的事业中得到快乐的人，

what do you want them to take away from it?

你希望他们从中获得什么？

AK: Well, what I want people to take away from my work

安：我想要他们从中找到

is their own worth, people's worth.

自己的价值，人的价值。

We have too many people that think that they are worth nothing.

很多人都会认为自己一无是处，

And that hurts me.

这让我很伤心。

And when you give birth to a child,

而且当我生了小孩，

when a human being is coming out of your body,

当一个活生生的人 从你身体里孕育出来，

everything changes.

一切都会变得不一样。

Priorities,

你的优先事项、

what matters,

重要事项都会改变，

you learn to go to the core of things.

你就会参透事物的核心。

What I want people to remember is that

我想要人们知道

you can fall beneath the Earth.

你可能会跌入尘埃，

But you always can rise.

但你永远都能爬起来。

Does not matter how hard it is.

无论多么困难，

Get up, and live your life.

你都要站起来，继续生活下去。

You know it, and that's how we roll.

要知道这就是我们生活的方式。

FO: I love you.

费：我好爱你。

AK: Me too.

安：我也是。

Since the first time I met, it was a love story.

从第一次遇见你，我们就坠入了“爱河”。

(Laughter)

（笑声）