What Happens to People's Donated Eggs and Sperm After They Die? | Ellen Trachman | TED

翻译人员: Yip Yan Yeung 校对人员: Yanyan Hong

Before his death in California in 1991,

在威廉·凯恩（William Kane） 于 1997 年逝世于加州之前，

a man named William Kane wrote a letter to the children from his first marriage

他给他第一段婚姻所生的孩子和

and to his fiancee, Deborah.

他的未婚妻黛博拉（Deborah） 写了一封信。

It read,

信上写道：

"I address this to my children because although I have only two of you,

我想把这件事告诉我的孩子， 因为虽然我只有你们两个孩子，

Everett and Katie,

埃弗雷特（Everett） 和凯蒂（Katie），

it may be that Deborah decides, as I hope she will,

但是很有可能黛博拉会决定， 我也希望她会这么做，

to have a child by me after my death.

在我死后生一个我的孩子。

I have been assiduously generating sperm samples for that eventuality.

我一直在努力 为这个可能性准备精子样本。

If she does, then this letter is for my posthumous offspring as well,

如果她真的这样做了，那么 这封信也是写给我死后出生的孩子，

with the thought that I have loved you in my dreams,

我想说，我在我的梦里爱着你，

even though I never got to see you born.”

虽然我没有机会见证你的出生。

What happened after William Kane's death

威廉·凯恩死后，

was a lawsuit that would forever change the law.

随之而来的是一场 彻底改变了法律的官司。

His ex-wife and adult children argued

他的前妻和已成年的子女声称

that Deborah should not be allowed to use the sperm samples.

黛博拉无权使用这些精子样本。

They should be destroyed.

这些样本应该被销毁，

And a trial court agreed with them.

初审法院同意了这个说法。

But Deborah appealed,

但是黛博拉上诉了，

and a California appellate court agreed with her,

加州上诉法庭赞成了她的上诉，

finding that William Kane, and all of us,

认为威廉·凯恩以及我们所有人

have the right to use our DNA after our death,

都有在我们死后 使用我们自己 DNA 的权利，

even to have children.

甚至可以用来生孩子。

I am sure everyone in this room has let their loved ones know

我相信在座的各位 已经让你们的爱人知道了，

if they can use their DNA to have a kid after they die, right?

你们死后他们可以 用你的 DNA 生个孩子，对吧？

OK, probably not yet.

好吧，可能还没有。

But what happens if we don't tell anyone?

如果我们谁都没告诉，会怎样呢？

If we don't write it down?

如果我们没有把它记录下来呢？

And what happens when a couple creates embryos together for use down the road,

如果一对夫妇为了以后的婚姻 一起制造了胚胎，

then divorces

然后离婚了，

or eggs and sperm are mixed up

或者搞混了精子和卵子，

or an embryo transferred to the wrong woman?

或者胚胎送入了 一个错误的女人腹中，会怎样呢？

Because all of these things have happened.

这些事都发生过。

Thanks to advances in technology,

多亏了科技的进步，

there are more ways to try to have a baby.

人们可以有多种方式 去尝试生一个孩子，

But the law has lagged behind.

但是法律落后于科技。

And because the law hasn't kept up with the technology,

由于法律没有跟着科技进步，

it's hurting people:

它会伤害人们，

Families trying to conceive,

这些人可能是备孕的家庭、

donors and surrogates trying to help them

想要帮助他们的捐赠人和代孕人，

and the children born into these wild situations.

和在这种意外情况中出生的孩子。

And one day it could affect you or your loved ones.

有朝一日它会影响到你和你的爱人。

I'm an attorney,

我是一个律师，

probably not surprising by my knowledge of eggs,

你可能不会惊讶于我懂这些卵子、

sperm and the law.

精子和法律的事。

I started my career in the investment management group

初入职场，我就职于 一家大型国际企业的

of a large international firm, forming hedge funds.

投资管理组，发起对冲基金。

At parties, when asked what I did for a living,

在派对上被人们问起 我是做什么的时候，

my answer was generally followed by glances around the room

在我回答完之后， 人们都会环视四周

for someone more interesting to talk to.

寻找更有趣的人聊天。

But that time I was surrounded by people thinking about having babies.

但是有一次， 派对上都是想要有孩子的人。

From my housemates, who were a gay couple,

比如我的室友—— 一对同性伴侣，

to my sister and her husband struggling with infertility.

和苦于不孕的我的姐妹和姐夫。

And I learned about assisted reproductive technology law.

然后我了解了 辅助生育技术的相关法律。

I had the chance to read through an egg donation agreement,

我有机会阅读了一份捐卵协议，

and it blew my mind.

让我大吃一惊。

So many questions I had never thought of.

有这么多我未曾想过的问题。

What if an egg donor goes through a single retrieval procedure

如果捐卵者提取了一次卵子，

and has 20 eggs retrieved?

但是提取出了 20 颗卵子会怎么样？

Not a crazy number.

并不是一个夸张的数字。

Could those eggs be donated to 20 different families?

这些卵子可以被捐给 20 个不同的家庭吗？

Could each of those families have a child genetically related to her?

每一个家庭可以有一个 与她有血缘关系的孩子吗？

What about disclosure and future contact?

要不要告诉她或者 让他们之后有联系呢？

Would she know the children?

她会认识她的孩子吗？

Would the children know each other?

这些孩子会不会互相认识呢？

I was fascinated.

我沉迷其中。

Way more interesting than hedge funds.

比对冲基金有趣多了。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

But the law in this area will leave your head spinning.

但是这个领域的法律 会让你头晕目眩。

Even the definition of what is an embryo

就连“胚胎”的定义

is inconsistent and contradictory from state to state.

在州与州之间都是不一致、 互相矛盾的。

In Louisiana, an embryo is defined as a juridical person.

在路易斯安那州，“胚胎”被定义为 一个法律意义上的人。

What's that?

什么意思？

Even the lawyers aren't really sure what a juridical person is.

连律师都不确定 “法律意义上的人”是什么。

But we do know that it means that embryos,

但是我们知道这意味着

stored in tanks at -321 degrees Fahrenheit,

存在零下 321 华氏度的 储存箱里的胚胎

have the right to sue people.

有了起诉他人的权利。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

And don't think they won't do it.

别以为它们不会这么做。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

Last year, celebrity actress Sofia Vergara of "Modern Family" fame

去年，出演了《摩登家庭》和 我最爱的《蓝精灵》的著名女演员

and my favorite, "Smurfs," was sued by her embryos.

索菲娅·维加拉（Sofia Vergara） 被她的胚胎起诉了。

She had gone through fertility treatment with her ex-fiancé, Nick Loeb,

她与她的前未婚夫 在他们还是情侣的时候

when they were a couple.

接受了生育治疗。

They had two remaining embryos from their IVF process

他们在体外受精之后， 在洛杉矶一家诊所里

stored in a clinic in Los Angeles.

存下了剩余的两个胚胎。

The consent forms they signed were clear:

他们签署的知情同意书非常清晰：

neither could use the embryos without the other’s consent.

在没有另一人的同意下， 任意一人不得使用胚胎。

At this point, Vergara had moved on,

这时候，维加拉开始了一段新感情，

married the actor from "Magic Mike," Joe Manganiello.

与《魔力麦克》演员 乔·曼根尼罗（Joe Manganiello）结婚了。

She did not want those embryos being used.

她不希望这些胚胎会被使用。

Loeb, on the other hand,

另一方面，罗布（Loeb）

was doing everything in his power to win rights to the embryos.

想方设法地想获取胚胎的权利。

After losing in California court,

他在加州法庭败诉了，

he formed a trust for the embryos in Louisiana.

然后在路易斯安那州 为胚胎成立了信托。

He even named the embryos Emma and Isabella,

他甚至给胚胎起名为 艾玛（Emma）和伊莎贝拉（Isabella），

and had them file a lawsuit against Vergara,

由她们起诉维加拉，

demanding that they be brought to birth.

要求她们应该出生。

(Audience murmurs)

（观众嘀咕）

Ultimately, the lawsuit was dismissed for lack of jurisdiction,

最终，这个诉讼 由于缺乏司法管辖权被驳回，

meaning Louisiana wasn't the right place to hear the case.

意思是路易斯安那州 不应该是受理这个案件的地方。

The embryos were in Los Angeles, California.

胚胎在加州洛杉矶。

Neither Loeb nor Vergara lived in Louisiana.

罗布或者维加拉 都不住在路易斯安那州。

But given Louisiana's definition of embryos as people,

但是路易斯安那州 将胚胎定义为人，

it would have been fascinating, and concerning,

如果法院受理了这个案件，

if the court had been able to rule on the case.

就会更引人入胜、受人瞩目。

Of course, these were celebrities.

当然，这些人是名人。

So we got to read about their case in the news.

所以我们会在新闻上 看到他们的案件。

But it could happen to anyone who's gone through IVF.

但是这会发生在每一个 接受过体外受精的人身上。

By contrast to the idea that embryos are people,

与将胚胎定义为人相反，

other laws and judges treat embryos as property.

有的法律和法官将胚胎当作财产。

In Texas, a probate judge was forced to determine

在德州，有一位 遗嘱检验法官被迫在

the legal properties of 11 embryos when a couple was murdered,

一对夫妇被谋杀后确认 11 个胚胎是否属于合法财产，

leaving behind their embryos and their two-year-old son.

这对夫妇留下了 这些胚胎和 2 岁大的儿子。

The judge determined that embryos have value

法官认为这些胚胎有价值，

and therefore were property

所以它们是财产，

and should go to the couple's heir,

应该由夫妇的继承人——

the two-year-old,

2 岁的孩子继承，

to determine what to do with them when he turned 18.

在他 18 岁的时候决定 如何处理它们。

That's a heavy responsibility for an 18-year-old.

对于一个 18 岁的人来说， 这是很重的责任。

Does he transfer them to a surrogate and raise his genetic siblings?

他应该把它们交给代孕人， 以血缘上的兄弟姐妹抚养它吗？

Does he donate them to others?

还是应该把它们捐给别人？

Does he forget about them entirely?

还是完全把它们抛诸脑后？

Not likely that his parents were thinking about these questions

他的父母在创造这些胚胎的时候，

when they formed those embryos.

不太可能会想到这些问题。

Aside from struggling for the definitions of eggs,

除了纠结于卵子、

sperm, embryos and who can use them,

精子、胚胎和使用者的定义，

the law especially struggles when there are mix-ups in the lab.

法律还纠结于 实验室里搞混的情况。

In 2018,

2018 年，

a woman in New York, pregnant with twins,

纽约一个怀了双胞胎的女士

was surprised at her ultrasound appointment

在超声检查时， 她的产科医生恭喜她

when her obstetrician congratulated her on having two boys.

怀了两个男孩，她非常惊喜。

You see, she had gone through IVF in California

注意一下，她在加州 接受了体外受精，

and there, her embryos had been tested

她的胚胎接受了检查，

and shown to be two female embryos.

显示是两个女性胚胎。

She called the clinic, but they said,

她打电话给诊所，但是他们说：

"Don't worry about it, ultrasounds are frequently inaccurate.

“别担心，超声检查总是不太准确。

You're having two girls."

你怀的是两个女孩。”

But she gave birth to two boys.

但是她生了两个男孩。

And they didn't look like her or her husband.

而且他们长得不太像 她或者她丈夫。

They did genetic testing.

他们做了基因检测。

She was not genetically related, nor was her husband.

孩子和她没有血缘关系， 和她丈夫也没有血缘关系。

In fact, the twins weren't even related to each other.

实际上这两个孩子之间 也没有关系。

(Audience gasps and laughs)

（观众吸气声、笑声）

Across the country,

一个加州的女士

a woman in California got a call from her fertility clinic.

接到了生育诊所 横跨了整个国家打来的电话。

It had been about nine months

这是在她接受了一次失败的

since she'd gone through a failed embryo transfer.

胚胎移植大约九个月之后。

She thought she was being asked to come in for routine testing,

她以为他们是来 要求她接受例行检查的，

but was met with a roomful of doctors, lawyers,

但是却受到了一屋子医生、律师、

mental health professionals that told her there'd been a mistake.

心理健康专家的迎接， 他们告诉她这是个失误。

Her embryo had been transferred to another patient,

她的胚胎被移植给了另一个患者，

and her genetic son had been born in New York.

她基因上的儿子 出生在了纽约。

One of the twins.

是双胞胎中的其中一个。

A judge in New York determined that the birth parents

纽约的一个法官认为生身父母

were not the legal parents to the children.

不是孩子的法定父母。

Instead,

相反，

the woman in California and her husband were legal parents to one of the twins,

加州的那位女士和她的丈夫才是 双胞胎的其中一个孩子的法定父母，

and another couple entirely were legal parents to the other twin

另一对夫妇完全就是 另一个孩子的法定父母，

because they were the genetic parents.

因为他们就是孩子 基因层面上的父母。

But a similar thing happened in Italy with the exact opposite result.

但是意大利发生了同样的事， 却有截然相反的结果。

There, two embryos were transferred to the wrong patient

在意大利，两个胚胎 被移植给了错误的患者，

and a judge determined

法官认定

that the birth parents were the legal parents to the children

生身父母就是孩子的法定父母，

and the genetic parents had no legal rights at all

基因上的父母对于 他们自己基因上的孩子

to their own genetic children.

并没有任何法定权利，

It's time for the law to change.

法律是时候改变了。

Here in Colorado,

在这里，科罗拉多州，

our lone egg and sperm donation statute has the language

我们的单亲捐精捐卵法令注明了

"a wife with her husband's consent."

“获得丈夫同意的妻子”。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

It's a little offensive to us liberated women,

这对我们自由女性来说有点冒犯，

but also doesn't include single parents by choice

而且也没有给单亲人士或者

or LGBTQ parents.

LGBTQ人士一个选择。

It also doesn't include those who donate their embryos

也没有包含那些捐赠胚胎

or those who receive embryos to have a child.

或者接受胚胎生育的人。

What can we do besides advocating for better laws?

除了提倡要有更健全的法律之外， 我们还能做些什么呢？

We can think carefully about our own reproductive material.

我们可以仔细考虑 我们自己的生殖原料，即精子和卵子。

Every adult knows that they should have a will,

每个成年人都知道要立一个遗嘱，

even if they haven't done it yet.

即便还没有立。

A will lets those we leave behind know what to do with our assets

遗嘱让留下的人 知道如何处理我们的财产

and our possessions.

和所有物。

But most wills don't include an invaluable asset,

但是大多数遗嘱都不会包含 一个宝贵的财产，

our reproductive material.

就是我们的生殖原料。

And that leaves loved ones confused and facing inconsistent laws.

这会让我们的所爱之人迷茫， 让他们面临不一致的法律。

For instance, in 2019,

比如在 2019 年，

a West Point cadet named Peter Zhu was in a tragic ski accident.

一位名叫彼得·朱（Peter Zhu）的 西点军校学员遭遇了惨烈的滑雪事故。

His family begged the hospital and then a judge

他的家人恳求医院，恳求法官

to let them retrieve his sperm.

让他们提取他的精子。

They explained to the judge

他们向法官解释，

that their son had always wanted to have children,

他们的儿子一直想要有孩子，

and moreover, it was of vital cultural importance to them

而且延续香火对他们

to continue their family line.

有着至关重要的文化意义。

The judge was persuaded.

法官被说服了。

He issued the order to allow the son's sperm to be retrieved

他批准了一条指令， 允许提取他们儿子的精子，

and later used for conception purposes.

为后续生育所用。

But here in Colorado, the law is not the same.

但是在这里，科罗拉多州， 法律不是这样。

In the last few years,

在过去的几年里，

at least twice it's happened

发生了至少两次，

where a man was taken to the hospital before his death

一位男士在死前被送往医院，

and the request by a spouse to have his sperm retrieved was denied

配偶要求提取精子却遭到拒绝，

because he didn't have a consent on file with the hospital.

因为医院没有他的同意书存档。

But in another case where a man died suddenly

但是有另一个例子， 一个人突然去世，

and was taken to the coroner,

被送去验尸，

his spouse's request to have his sperm retrieved was granted

他的配偶要求提取精子， 却得到了批准，

because the coroner is not subject to the same policies and procedures

因为验尸官不受到医院同样的条例

as a hospital.

和手续约束。

So if you think you might allow someone

所以如果你想让人

to have a child with your DNA after your death,

在你死后生一个有你 DNA 的孩子，

or you don't want them to,

或者你不想这么做，

tell them.

告诉他们吧。

Write it down, grab a napkin, put it on a napkin, send a text.

写下来，拿一张纸， 写在餐巾纸上，发条短信。

No matter how strange that text may look.

别管这条短信看起来有多奇怪。

(Laughter)

（笑声）

It happens more often than you think.

这发生得比你想象得更频繁。

We think more carefully about organ donation,

我们在捐赠器官时 会考虑得更仔细，

but this is just as important.

但是这也同样重要。

I bet you didn't think you need to include this in your will.

我猜你没想过 要把这些写进你的遗嘱。

The world has changed.

世界变了。

The technology is here, and it will only keep advancing.

科技就在眼前， 而且会不断进步。

And this isn't the only area where technology is outpacing the law.

这不是科技超过法律唯一的领域。

We need to challenge ourselves to think carefully

我们需要挑战自己，仔细思考

about what these innovations mean to ourselves,

这些创新对我们自己意味着什么，

to our families, to our children

对我们的家人、孩子、

and to future children,

未来的孩子意味着什么，

whether they're genetically related to us or not.

无论他们与我们有没有血缘关系。

Thank you.

谢谢。

(Applause)

（掌声）