Coya Paz Brownrigg: The haunting truth of ghost stories | TED

Transcriber:

翻译人员: Yutong Chen 校对人员: Yuwei Wu

十五年前， 我正在做我的毕业研究

题目是关于加州淘金潮期间

墨西哥和拉丁美州的私刑处决

我发现要找到证明我观点的 证据非常地困难

Fifteen years ago, I was doing my graduate research

on the lynching of Mexicans and Latin Americans

我不知道你有多了解私刑处决

in gold rush California.

从定义上来说，

And I was having a very hard time

私刑处决是没有官方记录的公开死刑

finding the evidence I needed to make my claim.

I don't know how much you know about lynching,

严格来说，这些死刑 并不是由法律判决的

but they are, by definition,

并且当地的城镇和社区经常会 否认这些死刑曾经发生过

public executions that happen off the official record.

这都让获取证据更加困难

These deaths aren't technically sanctioned by the state,

但尽管官方记载中 拒绝承认这种暴力行为，

and often, towns and communities would deny they even happened,

which made it harder to prove that they did.

当地的传说却能作为一种替代档案，

Still, even when the official record refused an act of violence,

就像一种记录历史的不同方式。

关于某人被杀然后化身为鬼魂 笼罩村庄的鬼故事就是一个重要的线索，

local lore often served as an alternative archive,

a different way of recording history.

是一个看清当地更深层历史的信号。

A ghost story about someone being killed and coming back to haunt the town

一般来说，如果当地的传说是一个 关于被吊死或谋杀或被处以私刑的鬼

was an important arrow,

a sign to look more deeply into the history of a place.

回魂到了镇上的故事，

Very often, if local legend featured a story about a ghost

那么我们只要翻找当地的 档案、报纸、信件、日记，

就会了解到这个事情， 或者其他类似的事件

who had been hung, murdered or lynched,

and came back to haunt the town,

是真实发生的。

digging through the archive, newspapers, letters, diaries,

所以鬼故事是当地保存这段 暴力历史的一种方式，

would reveal that the event, or something like it,

并将这个故事历代传递下去。

had actually happened.

So the ghost story was one way

that communities were holding the violent history of a place,

我也并不知道是不是真的有鬼 现在还笼罩着这些地方，

passing down the story from generation to generation.

但是肯定笼罩了他们的历史。

Now, I don't know if an actual ghost was haunting any of these places,

这差不多就是我的立场：

是不是真的有鬼并不重要。

but their history certainly was.

鬼故事本身，

And this is pretty much my stance on it.

以及我们或多或少会相信 鬼故事的真实性的这个事实

It doesn't matter whether or not a ghost is real.

是很重要的， 并且我们需要重点关注它。

The ghost story is,

and the fact that we maybe, kind of, sort of believe a ghost might be real

当然，我并不是唯一这么认为的人。

有一个专门的跨学科研究领域， 叫做“幽灵研究”

is significant, and we should pay attention to it.

I'm not the only one who thinks this, by the way.

这证明了很多学者也有类似的想法。

There is a whole field of interdisciplinary research

这种想法对我来说依然是革命性的，

called “spectrality studies,”

而且并不仅仅是在我的研究中。

which is proof that academics will think of anything.

在我的一生中，我都怕鬼。

Still, this idea was transformative for me,

我甚至不想听到任何鬼故事，

and not just in my research.

因为我不想有一丝丝可能 去承认鬼是存在的。

For most of my life, I was terrified of ghosts.

为什么呢？

I didn’t even want to hear a ghost story,

在流行文化中，

鬼被描写成刻薄、 复仇、毁灭性的力量。

because I didn't want to entertain the possibility that a ghost might exist.

在最坏的情况下，他们是可怕的。

And why not?

In popular culture,

在最好的情况下， 他们是让人不安的。

ghosts are portrayed as mean, vengeful, destructive forces.

这些意料之外的不速之客 不惜代价地索取你的情感关注。

They’re terrifying at worst

and unsettling at best.

我们被教导了要害怕死亡 和死人。

Unexpected presences who show up and demand your emotional attention,

at any cost.

但是当我开始不再害怕鬼

We are taught to be afraid of dying and death,

却开始害怕鬼故事的时候，

我发现我与世界的关系都不一样了。

and the dead.

But when I stopped worrying about ghosts

除了是一个历史学家， 我还是一名编剧。

and started worrying about ghost stories,

大概五年之前，

I found myself in a new relationship with the world around me.

我非常荣幸和芝加哥的 自由街剧院合作

In addition to being a historian,

制作了一部名为 “100个鬼故事“的舞台剧。

I'm also a performance maker,

and about five years ago,

I had the great honor of working with Free Street Theater in Chicago

为了制作这部剧，

我们采访了成百上千的芝加哥人， 问他们是否碰到过鬼。

to create a performance called "100 Hauntings."

我们对于我称之为 “普通”的鬼故事十分好奇

To make this performance,

we asked hundreds and hundreds of Chicagoans

不是那种出现在都市传说中的鬼故事

if they'd ever encountered a ghost.

或者是那种城市闹鬼之旅

We were interested in what I call ordinary ghost stories,

而是那种人们刚刚签完购房合同

so, not the kinds of ghosts who show up in urban legends

却在新房浴室中发现了鬼。

or on a city's ghost tour,

继续我的研究，

but the kind of ghost people say they've just found in the bathroom,

我们对鬼能告诉我们什么关于 芝加哥隐藏历史的事情很感兴趣，

right after signing the lease on a new apartment.

但是我们对整个 恐怖故事题材也很感兴趣。

Following my research,

we were interested in what these ghosts might tell us

它不像其他的故事形式，

about Chicago's hidden history,

恐怖故事让我们抱作一团、 靠在一起，兴奋地想象着

but we were also interested in the ghost story as a form.

Like no other kind of storytelling,

这些非常可怕， 非常毛骨悚然的事是否是真的，

ghost stories ask us to gather around, lean in and thrill at the possibility

但同时你明知道这种事情 是不会发生的，对吧？

that some very scary, very chilling thing actually happened,

我发现几乎所有人都有一个鬼故事。

while at the same time being sure, so sure, that it didn't, right?

即使是那些声称不信鬼的人 也会有一个“鬼故事”

Right?

I have found that almost everyone has a ghost story.

通常他们都相信会有 一个合理的解释，

Even people who say they don't believe in ghosts usually have a "Well ..." story

尽管他们并不确定这个解释是什么。

这种不确定性就留下了不安，

about something they're sure has a rational explanation,

留下了一种他们难以解释的感觉。

even if they're not quite sure what it is.

而这就是我为什么喜欢鬼故事——

And this not knowing has left them unsettled,

因为鬼故事总能 直接刺激到你的感觉。

with a feeling they can't quite explain.

而在鬼故事的有趣和刺激下 是复杂的关系，

And this is what I love about ghost stories --

和人生，和死亡， 人和人之间的关系。

how so often, they get right to feeling.

Underneath the fun and chill of it are complex relationships

每当有人告诉我一个鬼故事的时候，

with life, with death, and with each other.

我都会问他们两个问题。

第一，

你觉得这个鬼想要什么？

And whenever anyone tells me a ghost story,

第二，因为绝大部分人 对鬼是否真的存在而感到矛盾

I ask them two questions.

First:

我会问，你想从鬼身上得到什么？

"What do you think this ghost wanted?"

And second, because most people are ambivalent

第一个问题很容易回答。

about whether or not the ghost actually exists,

我发现每个鬼都可以分成三类之一，

I ask, "What is it that you want from the ghost?"

他们所想要的其实都差不多——

The first question is pretty easy to answer.

得到认同。

I have found that most ghosts fall into one of three categories,

我一开始学习的就是第一种鬼。

and what they all want is pretty much the same --

他们是暴怒回魂鬼--

to be acknowledged.

那些经历了可怕死亡的鬼魂，

The first type of ghost is the kind I started studying.

他们要让我们这些生者记住。

“这就是牺牲在你们 巨大不公正下的冤魂”

These are the furious returned --

ghosts who have met a terrible end,

这些鬼魂大多数是被谋杀的，

但也有死于像工厂着火 和狱中的离奇死亡的。

and they want us, the living, to remember it.

These are your victims of a great injustice.

我来举个例子。

Murders, most often,

有一次，在我们的 《一百个鬼故事》舞台剧中

but also things like factory fires and mysterious deaths in jail.

一个男人跟我们讲了他还是青少年时

I'll give you an example.

闯入城市西北角的一个 废弃的精神病院的故事。

Once, in a story circle for our show "100 Hauntings,"

a man told us a story about going as a teenager

虽然我们没有听说过这个精神病院，

to break into an abandoned mental hospital on the northwest side of the city.

而且平心而论

他的故事就像是你听过的任何一个 “青少年闯入精神病院”的故事——

Now, we’d never heard of this mental hospital,

会动的神秘轮椅， 门突然关上，诡异的笑声。

and honestly

it sounded like any "teenagers breaking into a mental hospital" story

但请记住，

you've ever heard --

这些故事可能是重要的线索，

a wheelchair mysteriously following them, doors slamming shut,

所以我们跟进了。

果然，多个市政记录显示

creepy laughter.

城市的西北角曾经有一个 贫穷的农场和救济院，

But remember,

these kinds of stories can be important arrows,

so we followed up.

And sure enough, multiple city records

后来成为了美国最大的 监禁精神病院之一。

show that there was a poor farm and almshouse

在这个病院里有过很多人，

on the northwest side of the city,

大多数是穷人和移民，

which later became one of the largest carceral mental hospitals

被强行监禁了几十年。

in the United States.

It was the kind of place where people,

最后在这里死去。

mostly poor people and immigrants,

这些人通常被埋在后院 没有标记的坟墓里。

were locked up for decades, often against their will.

根据芝加哥论坛报的报道

It was also the kind of place where, when they died,

这些地方的后院里有超过 三万八千个无主坟墓。

they were usually buried in the back, in an unmarked grave.

虽然这是芝加哥历史中 非常重要的一部分

The Chicago Tribune reports

that as many as 38,000 unmarked graves are in the back.

但我想这并不广为人知。

许多住在这里的人 完全不知道这件事。

Now,

this is a really significant piece of Chicago history,

但鬼故事提醒了我们要记住。

but I'd argue it's not well-known.

Most people who live here don't know anything about it.

第二种鬼故事可能是最普遍的。

But the ghost story asks us to remember.

我们称之为“别来烦我”鬼。

这是那种只希望我们活人滚开的鬼。

The second kind of ghost story is probably the most common.

We'll call them the leave-me-alone ghost.

通常来说，这种遇鬼经验 就像遇到负面能量

This is the kind of ghost who just wants us the living to get out.

或者在房子一些地方的 诡异、不欢迎气氛，

Usually, people experience this as bad energy

人们总会想象这是房子以前的住客

正在对新来的住客表示不满。

or a creepy, unwelcome feeling in some parts of the house,

这一类故事让我觉得有趣的是

and people usually imagine that this is a former resident

它们经常能在“适当”的地点发生，

who's not happy that new people have moved in.

比如经过城市化改建的街区

What's interesting to me about this kind of ghost story

或者“建立在神圣的墓地上”的地方。

is that you find it most often in appropriated spaces --

我想提醒大家的是

think gentrifying neighborhoods

or the old "built on a sacred burial ground" trope.

鬼魂是不是真的并不重要。

鬼故事一定是真的。

可能那里真的有一个鬼 想把我们赶出去，

And here's where I want to remind you that it doesn't matter

whether or not the ghost is real.

又或者其实是 我们的潜意识里有一个声音

The ghost story is.

在争论着我们是否有权力呆在这里，

So maybe there really is a ghost who’s trying to push us out,

我们是否真的属于这里。

or maybe there’s some part of our unconscious

对，我们现在住在这， 但这是我们应得的吗？

that's grappling with whether or not we have a right to be here,

之前在这的人身上都发生了什么？

whether or not we really belong.

Sure, we live here now, but should we?

第三种鬼是我最喜欢的。

我管他们叫“常伴左右”鬼。

What happened to the people who came before?

他们是你们亲爱的爷爷奶奶，

是个还在走廊里 上上下下地拍球的小孩，

The third kind of ghost is my favorite.

是个每天准时上班的电梯操作员。

I'll call them "are still with us."

These are your beloved grandparents,

the child still playing with a ball up and down a hallway,

有时候， 这些鬼魂是陌生人。

他们不是我们曾经认识的人，

the elevator operator still showing up to work.

但他们并没有打扰到我们， 或者对我们有任何伤害--

Sometimes, these ghosts are strangers to us.

他们只是待在这儿。

They're not people we used to know,

举个例子。

很多人相信我的剧院所在的 那栋楼在闹鬼。

but they're not bothering us or meaning us any harm --

they're just kind of there.

我没有亲身体验过，

I'll give you an example.

但我已经数不清有多少人说看到过 一个只有半个身子的人坐在大堂里。

Many people believe that the building where my theater is located

is haunted.

I've not experienced this myself,

他不和我们互动，也不会打扰我们。

but I can't tell you how many people have described seeing exactly half a man

他只是坐在那儿。

虽然，有时候这些鬼魂 会更活跃一些。

sitting in our lobby.

He doesn't interact with us or disturb us in any way.

我听过很多人说

他们的孩子有一个“假想的好友”

He's just there.

Sometimes, though, these ghosts are more active.

突然之间他们的孩子学会了下象棋，

I've heard many stories from people

又或者突然开始 用一个完全不同的语言唱歌。

who thought that their child had an imaginary friend

然后这些故事变得感人了起来。

until suddenly, their child knew how to play chess,

or was singing songs in a totally different language.

通常，人们都相信这是一个 已故的家庭成员

回到人间来照顾他们。

And here's where these stories get really emotional.

Often, people are convinced that this is some family member

一位女士曾和我说过 有一天她的丈夫来看她了

returned, sent to watch over them.

那天正好是她十分伤心， 痛苦不止的时候。

One woman told me a story about her husband coming to visit

另一位女士告诉我

她的浴室里有一个总是 开开关关的水龙头

on a day when she was so sad, she didn't know what else to do but cry.

她坚信那是她的姐姐，因为开关水龙头 曾是姐姐生前最爱的恶作剧。

Another woman told me she was sure

that a faucet turning on and off in her bathroom

我热爱这些故事，

was her sister, because it was so like the pranks her sister used to play

因为他们反映了 我们有多么想要陪伴，

不仅仅是和活着的人，

when she was alive.

还包括去世的人。

I love these kinds of stories,

because they show us how much we want to connect,

向人们询问他们的鬼故事 可以让我感到又惊悚又快乐，

但这也会导向十分隐秘的问题。

not just with the living,

but with the dead.

Asking people for their ghost stories can be bone-chilling fun,

我们怎么看待死亡？

我们害怕什么？

but it also gets at really intimate questions.

我们最爱的人， 我们渴望他们回到人间的人，是谁？

How do we feel about death?

我们希望如何被记住？

What are we afraid of?

什么是我们希望能够改变的？

Who did we love so much that we want them, desperately, to return?

是什么，是谁，在纠缠着我们？

How do we want to be remembered?

What do we wish we could change?

不管恐怖电影和篝火传说 让我们相信了什么，

What and who is haunting us?

大部分鬼故事揭开了 我们深切的渴望：

Despite what horror movies and campfire tales would have us believe,

渴望冒险，渴望意义，

渴望陪伴，渴望超越。

most ghost stories reveal a deep longing:

渴望不被忘记，

a longing for adventure, for meaning,

以及渴望不忘记。

for connection, for a beyond.

我们正生活在一个极度困难的时期。

A longing not to be forgotten,

人与人之间被政治割裂，

and a longing not to forget.

而全球疫情的事实意味着大多数人

We're living in a time that feels exceptionally hard.

无法陪伴在我们最爱的人身边， 去最爱的地方。

We're divided from one another by politics,

很多人在哀悼英年早逝的人们，

and the reality of a global pandemic means that many of us

我们被悲伤围绕着。

have been away from the people and places we love the most.

不幸的是，们总是 非常不善于应对失去

So many of us are mourning untimely deaths,

and grief is all around us.

不善于谈论死亡，

不善于谈论我们的历史 如何延续到了现在。

Unfortunately, I don't think we're always very good at grappling with loss

鬼故事是恐怖的，

or talking about death,

脆弱也是恐怖的，不确定性也是。

or talking about the way that our history is still living in the present.

Ghost stories can be scary,

所以以后

当你在尝试寻找一个联系的方式

but so is being vulnerable, so is any unknown.

而你不知道怎么做的时候， 请试试这样：

请别人给你讲一个鬼故事。

So the next time

you're trying to figure out a way to connect

这一定能开启一段对话。

and you’re not sure what to do, let me offer this.

当然，他们可能会嘲笑你，

他们也可能会离开你。

Try asking someone for a ghost story.

但他们也可能真的会给你讲个故事

It's sure to start a conversation.

一个让你的脖子上汗毛直立的故事。

Yeah, maybe they'll laugh at you,

或者是一个让你哭泣的感人故事。

maybe they'll turn it back on you.

Maybe they'll tell you a story

that makes the hair on the back of your neck stand on end.

又或许，如果你非常幸运的话，

他们会给你讲一个 让你开始思考的故事

Maybe they'll tell you a story that makes you cry.

还有什么是我不知道的？

关于一个地方，关于一段历史，

And maybe, if you're really lucky,

关于一个民族，

they'll tell you a story that makes you wonder

关于彼此，

还有关于你自己。

what else you don't know,

不要忘了问他们，

about a place, about a history,

about a people,

“鬼魂想要什么？”

about each other

还有更重要的是，

and about yourself.

“你想从鬼魂那里得到什么？”

Don't forget to ask,

"What did the ghost want?

And more important,

"What do you want from the ghost?"