The Secret to Finding Your Ideal Workplace | Marion Campan | TED

翻译人员: Yaoxiang Yu 校对人员: suya f.

Imagine this.

想象一下。

You've been applying to a ton of jobs for months,

几个月来，你一直在申请大量的工作，

and now finally,

最终，

you're getting not just one, but two job offers.

你得到的不仅仅是一份工作机会， 而是两份工作机会。

Congratulations!

恭喜你！

It's time to celebrate.

该庆祝一下了。

It's great news, right?

这是个好消息，对吧？

But after the celebration comes the time where you can ask yourself,

但是在庆祝活动之后， 你可以问问自己，

how is it that you're going to choose between those two job offers?

你将如何在这两个工作 机会之间做出选择？

Some people are going to tell you, "Just go for the salary,

有人会告诉你， “去拿工资就行，

The higher the better," right?

越高越好”，对吧？

Others are going to tell you, "No, go for the title, the position.

其他人会告诉你： “不，去追求头衔，去追求职位。

The higher the better."

越高越好。”

And others are going to tell you, "Look for the mission,

其他人会告诉你， “追求任务，

the kind of projects that you're going to be working on.

你要做的那种项目。

The more experience, the better."

经验越多越好。”

Well, I suggest that you look at a completely different criteria.

好吧，我建议你看一个完全不同的标准。

I suggest that you choose your next job based on the company culture.

我建议你根据公司文化选择下一份工作。

My name is Marion.

我叫马里昂。

Or better said, my name is Marion,

或更确切地说，我叫马里昂。 （法语读音）

and I am passionate about corporate cultures.

我对企业文化充满热情。

When I say my name, people can guess that I am French,

当我说出我的名字时， 人们可以猜出我是法国人，

and they usually want to guess further.

他们通常想进一步猜测。

Where in France is she from?

她来自法国哪里？

And there is a city that comes to their mind,

他们脑海中浮现出一座城市，

the capital of love, Paris.

爱情之都巴黎。

But I have to disappoint you.

但我必须让你失望。

As beautiful as Paris is,

尽管巴黎很漂亮，

I come from an even better place, even more beautiful.

但我来自一个更好的地方，甚至更漂亮。

So I don't come from Paris, I come from Tahiti.

我并非来自巴黎，我来自塔希提岛。

And Tahiti is this island in the middle of nowhere in the Pacific Ocean.

而塔希提岛就是这个 位于太平洋荒野中的岛屿。

And a lot of people dream of retiring there

许多人梦想着在海边手里

with a coconut in their hand by the beach.

捧着椰子在那里退休。

Well, I didn't wait for retirement.

好吧，我没等到退休。

I actually spent my childhood there.

我的童年实际上是在那里度过的。

And this is how I was, five, six years old,

这就是我，五六岁的时候，

living the best time of my life.

过着人生中最美好的时光。

And Tahiti is great, yes, for the beaches and the coconuts.

是的，塔希提岛非常适合海滩和椰子。

But the best thing in Tahiti, it's the diversity.

但是塔希提岛最好的事情是多样性。

Because, you see, Tahiti is an island with a bit of a melting-pot culture.

因为，你看，塔希提岛 是一个有点文化融合的岛屿。

So if you’re thinking about these two job positions that you have,

因此，如果你正在考虑 自己拥有的这两个工作职位，

and you're thinking about which one should you choose,

正在考虑应该选择哪一个职位，

and if you're looking at corporate culture,

如果你正在研究企业文化，

you might find it hard to know from the outside

你可能会发现在外界

what it's going to be like to work in that company.

很难知道在那家公司工作会是什么样子。

Most people think that it is impossible to know beforehand

大多数人认为，在你工作之前， 不可能事先知道公司文化会

what a company culture is going to be like before you work there, right?

是什么样子，对吧？

How are you going to know before you go to Japan

去日本之前，你怎么知道日本的文化

what the culture in Japan is really like?

到底是什么样子？

Well, I disagree with this, and in my sharing today,

好吧，我不同意这一点，

I would like to share with you two different ways

在我今天的分享中， 我想和大家分享两种不同的方法，

for you to figure out

让你们事先弄清楚公司文化会

what a company culture is going to be like beforehand,

是什么样子，

because that's going to avoid you signing a contract

因为这样可以避免你们

that you're going to regret down the line.

签订一份会后悔的合同。

I think most people don’t follow those two tips that I’m going to share,

我认为大多数人没有遵循 我要分享的这两个技巧

and the numbers show.

从数字可以看出来。

Gallup has run a study on the state of workplace worldwide,

盖洛普对全球工作场所的状况进行了研究

and I've pulled the numbers for East Asia,

我抽取了东亚的数据，

and the numbers are dreadful.

这些数字太可怕了。

Overall, there is only 17 percent of people

总体而言，只有 17％ 的人

who are engaged in their work.

投入于工作。

That means about 80 are not.

这意味着大约 80% 的人并非如此。

When people are not engaged,

当人们不投入时，

then they tend to want to leave and go somewhere else.

他们往往想离开并去其他地方。

More than half of them want to quit.

他们中有一半以上想离职。

And if they can't quit,

而且，如果他们

because maybe the marketplace is not that great,

因为市场可能不太好而无法离职，

what happens is people are starting to be quiet quitting.

那么发生的情况是人们开始默默地离职。

That means they're coming to work,

这意味着他们去工作，

but really they do the bare minimum not to get fired.

但实际上，他们尽最少 的努力以不被解雇。

For employees and employers, this is dreadful numbers,

对于雇员和雇主来说， 这是一个可怕的数字，

and I'd like to take those numbers and bring them to reality.

我想把这些数字变为现实。

What does that look like, really?

那到底是什么样子？

And I'll give you an example of a coaching client

我举一个几年前一位教练委托人

a couple of years ago who is a lawyer,

是律师的例子，

let's call her Junita.

我们称她为朱尼塔（Junita）。

And Junita is an awesome lawyer.

朱尼塔（Junita） 是一位了不起的律师。

She's really great at what she does,

她真的很擅长自己的工作，

but she didn't want to end up in a law firm,

但她不想进入律师事务所，

she found it a bit boring.

她觉得有点无聊。

She wanted something more exciting and fancy.

她想要更刺激和更花哨的东西。

So she ended up in a startup.

因此，她最终进入了一家创业公司。

But after a few months, she just realized this is not the right fit here.

但是几个月后， 她才意识到这不适合这里。

You see, Junita really, really likes things done well.

你看，朱尼塔真的很喜欢做得好的事情。

She likes to take her time and double check.

她喜欢花时间仔细检查。

But she’s surrounded with entrepreneurs and startuppers,

但是她身边有企业家和创业者，

people who want to go fast and break things.

他们想快速发展，打破局面。

So there were a lot of tensions between her and the rest of the team.

因此，她和团队其他成员 之间存在很多紧张关系。

So very quickly, after a few months, she just burnt out.

很快，几个月后，她就精疲力尽了。

Professionally, she was questioning herself.

从职业上讲，她是在质疑自己。

As a lawyer, she was questioning herself.

作为律师，她在质疑自己。

As an individual, she was questioning herself.

作为个人，她在质疑自己。

"Why is it that I can't fit in here?"

“为什么我无法适应这里？”

So we worked together, and she moved to a more traditional workplace culture,

因此，我们一起工作， 她转向了更传统的工作场所文化，

where she saw that people were behaving a little bit more like her

在那里她发现人们的行为更与她相像

and shared her work ethics.

并与她有相同的职业道德。

That's where she really thrived in her job.

那是她在工作中真正蓬勃发展的地方。

And this is what I wish to every single one of you,

这就是我对你们每个人的期望，

is to experience a place,

就是体验一个，

an environment that brings not the worst, but the best out of you.

一个能带给你最好的，而非最坏的环境。

So basically that you don't look like her.

所以基本上你们看起来不像她。

So how are you going to do that?

那你打算怎么做呢？

Know that a place is going to be good for you.

了解一个地方会对你有好处。

Basically, you're asking me,

基本上，你是在问我，

how can I do to know that a thing is going to be good

在我亲自体验某件事之前，

before I experience it myself?

我该怎么做才能知道它会变好？

Well, I think you're doing this on a daily basis.

好吧，我认为你每天都在做这件事。

For instance, have you ever checked for a restaurant's rankings

例如，你去饭店之前有没有

and comments before you go?

查过它的排名和评论？

You're checking,

你会查看，

you're trying to see what it's going to be like.

你想看看会是什么样子。

Or maybe if you're doing groceries and you're looking for, I don't know,

或者，也许如果你在做杂货 而正在寻找牛油果，因为你想

avocados because you want to do a guacamole,

做牛油果酱，那么你打算

how are you going to select the right avocado for yourself?

如何为自己选择合适的牛油果？

It's the same.

这是一样的。

So I would like to compare company cultures to avocados.

因此，我想将公司文化 与牛油果进行比较。

If you have ten avocados,

如果你有十个牛油果，

how do you know which one is the right one?

你怎么知道哪一个是最好的？

You're probably going to take one and put some pressure on the skin,

你可能会拿一个 然后对其表皮施加一些压力，

and you might feel that there is resistance,

然后你可能会觉得有阻力，

maybe too much or too little,

可能太大或太小，

and that's how you're going to judge.

这就是你要判断的方式。

So today, what I would like to share with you are two tools.

因此，今天， 我想与大家分享的是两个工具。

The first one for you to assess if a culture,

你首先要评估一种文化，

a company is going to be the right fit for you,

一家公司是否适合你，

the first tool for you is to observe.

第一个工具是观察。

Observe, observe, observe.

观察、观察、观察。

What do you observe?

你观察到了什么？

Well, you observe the entire recruitment process.

你可以观察整个招聘过程。

Because what happens in the recruitment process

因为招聘过程中发生的事情

is companies are trying to show you their best side.

是公司正在努力 向你展示自己最好的一面。

They really want to attract you.

他们真的想吸引你。

They want to get you, they're seducing you.

他们想抓住你，他们在引诱你。

So if there is some things that you don't like there,

因此如果那里有一些 你不喜欢的东西，

you're probably not going to like afterwards either.

以后你可能也不会喜欢。

Let me give you an example.

让我给你举个例子。

If a company takes weeks to answer your emails

如果一家公司花费几周时间 来回复你的电子邮件，

or even book an interview with you,

甚至预约你的面试，

well, that kind of culture is probably a bit slower

那么这种文化可能

than what you would expect.

比你预期的要慢一些。

If that dynamism is what you're looking for

如果你正在寻找这样的活力，

and you like structures and companies

并且你喜欢更注重流程的结构和公司

that are more process-oriented, that's the right culture.

那就是正确的文化。

But if you're looking for a very entertaining, dynamic,

但是，如果你正在寻找一个非常有趣、

energetic workplace, that’s probably too slow.

充满活力的工作场所，那可能太慢了。

You might want to look for a company

你可能需要寻找一家

that responds in a matter of days or even hours.

在几天甚至几小时内做出回应的公司。

Another example would be if you have three people interviewing you

另一个例子是， 如果你有三个人在面试你，

and only one speaks and the other two are silent,

只有一个人说话， 另外两个人保持沉沉默，

and you figure the one that is speaking is the boss,

你发觉说话的人是老板，

that culture is very hierarchical.

那么这种文化是非常阶级式的。

And that's fine,

没关系，

because it's not good or bad, it's not right or wrong, it just is.

因为这不是好事也不是坏事， 不论对错，它就是这样。

And you need to know whether you like that kind of culture

你需要知道

and that fits you,

你是否喜欢那种适合自己的文化，

or if you want a company culture that really is more flat

或者你是否想要一种真正更加平淡、

and allows you to speak up and challenge the status quo.

可以让你自由表达 和挑战现状的公司文化。

That's probably not the right kind of culture for you.

那可能不是适合你的文化。

So the first thing you can do is observe, observe, observe.

因此，你可以做的第一件事 就是观察、观察、观察。

The second thing you can do is to ask questions.

你可以做的第二件事是提问。

And so asking questions is really cool

提问真的很酷，

because that's when you have the avocado in your hand

因为那是你手里拿着鳄梨

and you're putting pressure there.

并在那里施加压力的时候。

You know when they're asking you in an interview,

你知道他们在面试中问你的时候，

"Hey we finished all the questions.

“嘿，我们回答完了所有的问题。

Do you have any questions?"

你有任何问题吗？”

Hell yeah, you have questions.

你有问题要问。

You should have questions.

你应该有问题要问。

And I'm going to give you three questions that are going to up your game

我要问你三个问题，

when it comes to interviewing.

这些问题将使你的面试更加精彩。

This question starts with the first question,

从第一个问题开始

which focuses on the future potential that you have in that company.

重点是你在那家公司的未来潜力。

And it's a bit in-your-face,

这有点直言不讳，

but the question is "What kind of people get promoted here?"

但问题是 “什么样的人 在这里获得提拔？”

If they tell you, "Well, nobody got promoted in the last year."

如果他们告诉你，“嗯， 去年没有人获得提拔。”

You know you probably don't have a big future in that company.

你知道你在那家公司可能没有 广阔的未来。

But if they say, “Oh, Alexei got promoted last month.”

但是如果他们说：“哦， 阿列克谢上个月被提拔了。”

"Interesting.

“有意思。

Alexei sounds like a really cool person.

阿列克谢听起来像个很酷的人。

Tell me more about him."

告诉我更多关于他的信息。”

There, you're asking follow-up questions to discover more.

在那里，你在 问后续问题以了解更多信息。

"Well, why is it that he was selected as the one being promoted?"

“好吧，为什么他被选为提拔者？”

And then you listen to what they're telling you.

然后你听听他们在告诉你的话。

If they say, "Well, you know, he was the boss's best friend,

如果他们说：“嗯，你知道， 他是老板最好的朋友，

so he got promoted."

所以他得到了提拔。”

Well, unless you're very close to the boss,

好吧，除非你离老板很近，否则

you probably don't want to join that company.

你可能不想进那家公司。

But maybe they're going to say other things like,

但也许他们还会说其他话，比如

“You know, Alexei is technically the best out of us.

“你知道，从技术上讲， 阿列克谢是我们当中干得最好的。

For instance, the best engineer in the team.

例如，团队中最好的工程师。

So we promoted him.”

所以我们提拔了他。”

Great.

太棒了。

This company culture is about meritocracy.

这种公司文化是关于精英管理的。

So if you're really good at your job, you're going to get promoted.

因此，如果你真的很擅长工作， 你就会获得晋升。

If they say, "Well, Alex got promoted because he's been the longest here,

如果他们说：“阿列克谢之所以获提拔， 是因为他在公司待的时间最长，

he's the longest in the company."

他是公司里待得最久的。”

Alright, this company values loyalty, longevity, tenure in the company.

好吧，这家公司重视忠诚度、 长时间、和在公司的任期。

What is it that you like?

你喜欢什么？

So for me, the best answer to this question,

因此，对我来说，

if I would apply for a job, would be,

如果我要申请工作， 这个问题的最佳答案是

“Alexei got promoted because he’s the best at his job,”

“阿列克谢之所以获得提拔， 是因为他在工作中表现最好”，

so he has the skill.

所以他有技能。

"He also is the best of us, we all look up to him."

“他也是我们当中最好的， 我们都仰望他。”

What that means is that he is a team player probably,

这意味着他可能是一个团队合作者，

and he represents the culture best and we promote that.

他最能代表这种文化， 我们提倡这种文化。

And finally we're promoting him because he has the potential

最后我们要提拔他，

to be a great manager.

因为他有可能成为一名优秀的经理。

For me, these are green flags.

对我来说，这些都是安全信号。

So that's the first question to see if you have the potential

因此，这是第一个问题， 看看你是否有潜力

to grow in this company and stay long-term.

在这家公司成长并长期留下来。

The second question is very simple but also tells a lot.

第二个问题非常简单， 但也能说明很多问题。

And that question is "What are your core values?"

问题是“你的核心价值观是什么？”

I'm going to give you the red flags straight away.

我会马上告诉你危险信号。

The red flag would be

危险信号是

"Core values?

“核心价值观？

What are you talking about? What is that?"

你在说什么？那是什么？”

That's a company that has no idea about corporate culture.

那是一家对企业文化一无所知的公司。

If they say, "Yeah, we have core values,

如果他们说：“是的，我们有核心价值观，

but I don't remember what they are, sorry."

但我想不起来了，对不起。”

Red flag.

危险。

Or if they say, "Yeah, yeah, we have a core value.

或者，如果他们说： “是的，我们有核心价值观。

Our core value is excellence."

我们的核心价值观是卓越。”

Then you need to follow up with a question again.

然后，你需要再次提出一个问题。

"Great, excellence is a core value.

“非常好，卓越是核心价值观。

Tell me about it.

跟我讲讲这个价值观。

When was the last time that you have seen excellence around here?"

你最后一次在这里 看到卓越表现是什么时候？”

And a red flag is, "I don't know."

而一个危险信号是，“我不知道。”

A green flag would be someone telling you, "Yeah,

安全信号是有人告诉你：

Just last week we provided the best project so far with the team.

“就在上周，我们向团队提供了 迄今为止最好的项目。

And we're all really proud of what we have produced."

我们都为自己生产的 产品感到非常自豪。”

OK, keep asking because then you know what the company culture is like.

好吧，继续问，因为这样你就会知道 公司文化是什么样子了。

So that's the second question.

所以这是第二个问题。

And the third question is also tricky,

第三个问题也很棘手，

but it's reminding you that there is no company culture that is perfect.

但它提醒你，没有完美的公司文化。

And from time to time, you will have conflicts,

而且，你们会不时发生冲突，

discussions that are a bit tough to have.

讨论有点难以进行。

And what you want to know with this last question

对于最后一个问题，你想知道的是，

is how are the people in this company going to deal with these challenges?

这家公司的员工将如何应对这些挑战？

How do people deal with one another?

人们如何相处？

That last question is,

最后一个问题是

"Tell me,

“告诉我，你最后一次

when was the last time that you received feedback here?"

在这里收到反馈是什么时候？”

Again, a red flag would be "Never."

再一次，危险信号是 “从没有”。

Well, that's not good.

那不太好。

If the company says, or the interviewer says,

如果公司说，或者面试官说：

"Well, I receive feedback once a year in a performance review."

“我每年在绩效评估中收到一次反馈。”

That's probably not enough.

这可能还不够。

But if they say "We're providing and receiving feedback very regularly,

但是，如果他们说： “我们非常定期地提供和接收反馈，

almost daily,

几乎每天都在提供

because we care about the growth of the people here,

和接收反馈，

and we trust that our colleagues can take feedback

因为我们关心这里的人的成长 ， 我们相信我们的同事能够接受反馈，

and that we're good enough to deliver it to them."

并且我们有足够的能力 向他们提供反馈。”

Whoa, that's a green flag right there.

哇，是安全信号。

OK, so we've seen the three different questions.

好的，我们已经看到了三个不同的问题。

The first question is: “What kind of people get promoted here?”

第一个问题是：“什么样的人 在这里获得提拔？”

The second question is:

第二个问题是：

“What are your core values?”

“你的核心价值观是什么？”

And the third question is:

第三个问题是：

"When was the last time that you got feedback here?"

“你最后一次 在这里得到反馈是什么时候？”

Now these questions are really important

现在这些问题真的很重要，

because you're kind of grilling your interviewer.

因为你是在问面试官。

And your interviewer could be a very junior interviewer,

而且你的面试官可能是 从一个非常初级的面试官，

up to the CEO of the company.

到公司的首席执行官。

That will tell you a lot as well of what the company culture is like.

这也将告诉你很多公司文化是什么样子。

But so at some point, you will have to realize that, yes,

但是，在某个时候， 你必须意识到，是的，

the interview is important because it helps them select you

面试很重要，因为它可以帮助他们选择你

as a future employee.

作为未来的员工。

But it’s also helping you select them as a future employer.

但这也可以帮助你 选择他们作为未来的雇主。

So the balance is reversed here.

因此，这里的平衡恰恰相反。

And what you need to bear in mind is

而你需要记住的是，这不仅是

the idea that it's not only about them here

关于他们，你会发现更多的

and you discovering more about what the core value

核心价值观、

and what the company is like,

公司的样貌、

but also about you as a professional.

还包括你作为专业人士的身份。

And you need to be very clear about what you want

而且你需要非常清楚自己想要什么

and what you expect from a company.

以及对公司的期望。

So be very clear and define: What should work look like?

所以要非常清楚并定义： 工作应该是什么样子？

What should work feel like?

工作应该是什么感觉？

and what should work be like?

那工作应该是什么样子？

If you define this for yourself;

如果你自己定义这个问题；

if you observe, observe, observe;

如果你观察、观察、观察；

and if you ask the three questions that I have shared with you,

如果你问我与你分享的三个问题，

I trust that you will be able to choose between those two job offers

我相信你将能够在这 两个工作机会之间做出选择，

and decide which company you would like to join.

并决定你想进入哪家公司。

And I also believe that you will be able to choose for yourself

而且我也相信，你将能够为自己

the most outstanding workplace culture.

选择最杰出的职场文化。

Thank you.

谢谢。